The Gold Road Chapter – which includes the Scribing system – and Update 42 is now available to test on the PTS! You can read the latest patch notes here: https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/656454/
Would you play ESO if it was World PvP orientated
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Nosmeeprocketnub19_ESO wrote: »AlienDiplomat wrote: »smeeprocketnub19_ESO wrote: »Also, there's no mental problems with someone just because they are a "griefer" (you guys throw the name around like it is going out of style) it's just a different playstyle.
Actually, there is:
Online trolls really ARE horrible people: Researchers find they are narcissistic, machiavellian, psychopathic and sadistic
Science has confirmed that the "troll" personality type is diseased, and prone to violent, sadistic, sociopathic behavior in real life. I don't think anyone would honestly disagree at this point they are horrible people.
But that isn't even what this is really about, and no one is suggesting that everyone who enjoys legit PVP are trolls. This is about CHOICE.
Like I said, if they make an open world PVP PHASE I would be all for it. Flag yourself for PVP and the only people you see in the world, and the only people that see YOU in the world, are other people that CHOSE to flag for PVP.
The problem with making everything open PVP without such a choice and phasing system is that most people by far, as evidenced by this poll, do NOT want to have to deal with people killing them while they try and play THEIR style.
You might like to say that most PVP players are noble and professional, and would never go around griefing people (camping their corpse, spam-killing quest givers, etc.), however history and experience in countless other games should inform you that is what inevitably DOES happen when this minority within the PVP crowd gets bored.
Like I said before, I am not paying money to waste my time being fodder for that disturbed personality demographic who need to be able to inflict something on others specifically because they know they don't want it.
Not to mention the lack of challenge, as most PVE players don't want to waste their time theory crafting the latest FOTM meta game and slotting all the appropriate gear (impenetrable, etc.) just to be competitive in an asppect of the game they do not enjoy, gimping themselves for the PVE content they do in the process.
A real PVP professional would not even want this, unless it was phased and by choice as I suggest, as their sense of honor and fair play would not advocate attacking defenseless civilians.
So really, if not purely for the ability to grief other players as I have indicated above and for the reasons I have illustrated, it sounds like those advocating forced world PVP just want easy targets to shoot fish in a barrel for those leet player kill points.
No thanks.
It's kind of hard to gauge someone's psychological health from forum posts. Regardless of if a few researchers find that. Kind of like how whatever diet supplement you saw on tv last was proven, by researchers, to help you lose weight. (Protip: it won't)
1) did you just say pvp has a lack of skill compared to pve? lol I'm sure it's much harder to button mash against a repetitive mechanic. BTW I can do pve and pvp no problem, I have no idea what you think you have to do additionally for pvp. It's not like there isn't a ton of skillpoints available.
2) I never said pvp'rs were all noble. Why would you need to be noble? I certainly don't play with any sense of honor. That doesn't mean I'm going to corpse camp, etc even if it were possible. Most people won't. There are always going to be crappy people. That's also part of playing an MMO.
3) the problem with phasing that you are not getting is that the risk has to be ever present. Otherwise, why go to the pvp zone when you are questing, instead of just when you want to fight? So with phasing like that, no one actually does quests or goes about their business in the pvp phase. Whereas, you don't need other people to do stuff in a pve phase. Which is probably why you aren't seeing the problem.
Lastly, you have once again fallen into the carebear thinking that all pvp'rs are griefers that just want to ruin your fun. No, people that want world pvp just want the risk of being killed and to be able to kill people at any time. It is exciting. We like a challenge and danger.
What I don't understand is, if you don't like those things, why not play Candy Crush or Farmville?
I'm getting more than a little tired because I do not with to do PvP I am somehow less.
Have a PvP server...totally for it. But because I do not choose to spend my time like this does not make me less. I am not a "carebear" any more than a PvPer is an arsehat. I do not like candy crush or farmville. I like a decent PvE experience and because I disagree says nothing about me as a person. You don't know me, what I may have experienced in my life, how I play or why. Remember every time you point a finger then three is pointing back at you.
Debate and disagree but get off your high horse and stop making moral judgements about a freaking video game.5 -
Elencha✭✭✭NoWow, this thread got hostile quickly.
Honestly, I don't think anyone really thinks that everyone who likes PvP automatically wants to harass people. And I don't think anyone really thinks that everyone who doesn't want to automatically wants everything customized to their needs. Perhaps I am overly optimistic.
I do think that PvE, by it's very nature, is non-disruptive to the experience of other players, annoying pets not withstanding. The annoying pets are, as they say, the cost of doing business.
PvP, on the other hand, can be either disruptive on non-disruptive depending on its implementation and use. I don't think it's out of line to request the exclusion of PvP to only those who want to participate. I understand that at least some feel that doing so means they won't feel as in danger if they are in a specific PvP instance.This can of course be avoided by a simple opt-in option in the open world which defaults to off. Sure, more annoying graphical interruptions, but again, the cost of doing business.
I'm withholding judgement on the justice system until I actually see the implementation, but I can see that going bad ways if done certain ways. (I almost said correctly, but my way isn't necessarily the right way. :P )0 -
Gix✭✭✭✭"No"
"Yes - no looting"
"Yes - looting"
The fact that these are the only possibilities that are listed show how short-sighted some people can be.
The problem isn't whenever or not there could be world PvP. It's "Why" and "How" that matters. Would/Could I play ESO if there's world PvP? Yes. But most likely not in the way you have it in your head.
WoW's world PvP (as an example) is one of many ways to structure PvP regardless of looting corpses.
I can't vote because the question is incomplete. Besides, the crime/justice system is a form of world PvP in itself and, by god, I will contribute. I will steal the !@#$ out of every town!1 -
RDMyers65b14_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭NoIt needs to be left as it is. I rarely go to Cyrodil because of the ones who won't leave me alone when all I am doing is trying to get skyshards. I will not be participating in the Justice System because I hate PVP. It disrupts my RP. And yes, there are some of us RPers who are also PVEers.6 -
AH93✭✭✭Yes, but only if my gear/pocessions could not be looted on deathIf it was optional and not forced, say you could flag yourself for PvP anywhere in the world, then yes.
But no to lootable corpses, I will never play a game that has that system in.0 -
Kewljag_66_ESO✭✭✭✭✭I am happy with the current system. Cyrodiil is big enough and have everything. Seiges, zergs, group vs group, skirmishes, 1v1s and ambush play. As well as all types of PVE that can have PVP mixed in. There are towns with quests, random quest givers, Anchors, dungeons. And the zone is huge. Some people complain its too big4
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ZOS_AlanGadmin
At QuakeCon, Paul Sage discussed the work being done on the in-development justice system, including the possibility of hunting down players who have a bounty. Only players who have chosen to participate in the activity of thievery will have a bounty on them, and be attackable, and only if you are a guard.Too bad the justice system is coming and there's noting any of you can do to stop it.
Hehehehe. HEHEHEHEHHEHEHE.
While certain activities may open you up to PvP outside of Cyrodiil, we are not considering world PvP.Forum Rules | Promoting Constructive Discussion | Code of Conduct | Terms of Service | Help Site
I’ve moved to a new position and I am no longer active on this forum. For assistance, please check the resources linked above29 -
Delith✭✭✭✭Yes, but only if my gear/pocessions could be looted on death
At QuakeCon, Paul Sage discussed the work being done on the in-development justice system, including the possibility of hunting down players who have a bounty. Only players who have chosen to participate in the activity of thievery will have a bounty on them, and be attackable, and only if you are a guard.Too bad the justice system is coming and there's noting any of you can do to stop it.
Hehehehe. HEHEHEHEHHEHEHE.
While certain activities may open you up to PvP outside of Cyrodiil, we are not considering world PvP.
In that case, congratulations on dooming your game to a future of mediocrity, and enjoy having your subs wash away when the rest of it's competitors drop over the next year or so.
You'd have to go pretty far to doom an Elder Scrolls game, but you guys seem more than competent at making that happen.29 -
AH93✭✭✭Yes, but only if my gear/pocessions could not be looted on death"The game isn't exactly how I want it to be, therefore it's doomed to fail".
Comedy gold.16 -
Delith✭✭✭✭Yes, but only if my gear/pocessions could be looted on death"The game isn't exactly how I want it to be, therefore it's doomed to fail".
Comedy gold.
How about "the game is doing next to nothing to try and fit the same theme as it's single player counterparts, besides lifting the lore of the world and plastering it onto an uninspired linear trudge through a thinly veiled gear grind, completely disregarding the freedom and choice inherent in the single player variants, just for the sake of "earning" an MMO label?"
Because that's more accurate.10 -
Elencha✭✭✭NoThanks for the response on that, @ZOS_AlanG, but if I could request a tad bit of clarification, I would appreciate it. Will looting any lootable container be thievery, or only certain containers (since technically none of it is actually the players stuff so all looting is stealing)? And will this only be if you are actually seen stealing or anytime at all that you steal regardless of who else is present?1
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timidobserver✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭
At QuakeCon, Paul Sage discussed the work being done on the in-development justice system, including the possibility of hunting down players who have a bounty. Only players who have chosen to participate in the activity of thievery will have a bounty on them, and be attackable, and only if you are a guard.Too bad the justice system is coming and there's noting any of you can do to stop it.
Hehehehe. HEHEHEHEHHEHEHE.
While certain activities may open you up to PvP outside of Cyrodiil, we are not considering world PvP.
@ZOS_AlanG
Quick question. Can you be a thief and a guard? For example, if caught stealing would a guard be fired or banned ftom being a guard?Edited by timidobserver on July 24, 2014 5:24PMV16 Uriel Stormblessed EP Magicka Templar(main)
V16 Derelict Vagabond EP Stamina DK
V16 Redacted Ep Stam Sorc
V16 Insolent EP Magicka Sorc(retired)
V16 Jed I Nyte EP Stamina NB(retired)1 -
smeeprocketnub19_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭Wow, this thread got hostile quickly.
Honestly, I don't think anyone really thinks that everyone who likes PvP automatically wants to harass people. And I don't think anyone really thinks that everyone who doesn't want to automatically wants everything customized to their needs. Perhaps I am overly optimistic.
I do think that PvE, by it's very nature, is non-disruptive to the experience of other players, annoying pets not withstanding. The annoying pets are, as they say, the cost of doing business.
PvP, on the other hand, can be either disruptive on non-disruptive depending on its implementation and use. I don't think it's out of line to request the exclusion of PvP to only those who want to participate. I understand that at least some feel that doing so means they won't feel as in danger if they are in a specific PvP instance.This can of course be avoided by a simple opt-in option in the open world which defaults to off. Sure, more annoying graphical interruptions, but again, the cost of doing business.
I'm withholding judgement on the justice system until I actually see the implementation, but I can see that going bad ways if done certain ways. (I almost said correctly, but my way isn't necessarily the right way. :P )
well if I can get called a sociopath, pardon me if I return the psychological analysiskassandratheclericb14_ESO wrote: »smeeprocketnub19_ESO wrote: »Ninnghizhidda wrote: »In modern "MMO gaming" there seems to be some trend, fortunately only expressed by a small, yet very vocal, minority, towards inflicting the maximum amount of grief, discomfort and harassment to other "fellow" players, and advocating to make this the norm.
Fortunately it isn't happening and it is never going to happen, certainly not in a first-class AAA title that caters for hundreds of thousands if not millions of players. Those who need a self-ego boost through their "awesome" pixels can do so in specified areas or servers provided for this purpose, and be thankful for it too.
The rest of the players, who happen to be the majority, can then mind their business and spend their time for their fun and entertainment without having to deal with some "unstable" person hell-bent to spend their own miserable life trying to infect others with that misery. Especially, in a game like ESO where we actually pay for our entertainment.
So, in short, stay in your secluded area / server, which is specifically provided for you, and is actually carefully made and regularly updated, do your thing, have your fun, and let all the others have theirs too.
Considering how packed cyrodiil gets, I'm not convinced carebears are entirely in the majority, or if they are it is by a narrow margin.
These griefers you speak of, yes they are in the minority. But not every pvp is a griefer, so it seems you missed some people in your post.
Also, there's no mental problems with someone just because they are a "griefer" (you guys throw the name around like it is going out of style) it's just a different playstyle. People have spoken here, carebears, that didn't care if they had a positive effect on the game or not, there are people like that in pvp AND pve.
Also, when they "Regularly" update cyrodiil, let me know. It seems like 3/4s of their fixes are always to pve. Heck, they even made it easier because apparently you guys can't even handle a challenge in your chosen part of the game.
I am so very hurt that you think us cowards and unable to handle challenges in life in video games....
I just looked back at this. Could you bold the part where I said you were a coward? It's simply not there. I assumed you were responding to someone else but it's clear you are making things up to get points with your bros.Dear Sister, I do not spread rumors, I create them.5 -
yarnevk✭✭✭NoOnly players who have chosen to participate in the activity of thievery will have a bounty on them, and be attackable, and only if you are a guard.
Turning the entire profession of provisioning into a PVP gankfest, because paying of bounties and getting your stuff taken is pointless, since you need the stuff to advance your profession. Please say that provisioners will be able to continue as things are now, and that this form of PVP will be truly opt-in rather than forced choice. Sneaking and getting caught is not opt-in, it is what provisioners will have to do because the majority of provisioner loot is found in cities with NPCs and PCs everywhere witnessing their 'thievery'. The entire provisioning mechanic will need to be redesigned because it was designed from the beginning that you have to take stuff from NPC storage.
Only way I see to do it is to save the guard PVP for NPC murderers. There should be no PVP for thievery, which should only have a PVE risk of going to prison or paying a fine just like ES history, but thievery itself should only be missions for the thieves guild and not foisted upon cooks.
Edited by yarnevk on July 24, 2014 5:40PM6 -
Phinix1✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Nosmeeprocketnub19_ESO wrote: »well if I can get called a sociopath, pardon me if I return the psychological analysis
Do me a favor and show me where anyone called you a sociopath.
From what I read, people went out of their way to say they did NOT think there was ANYTHING wrong with people that enjoy PVP. I know I certainly did; I even put the statement in bold so it couldn't be misinterpreted on purpose as license to preemptively retaliate.
What people HAVE said, and which I agree with, is that people who want to force non-optional world PVP on others specifically for the purpose of ganking, corpse camping, quest NPC chain-killing, and general griefing DO have some psychological "issues" to work out, not to mention being incredibly selfish.
But no one ever said ALL people who PVP are like that. Simply that it would be encouraging this behavior by those that are. It only takes a few rotten apples.
But the point is moot. A ZOS rep has already confirmed they will NOT be doing this. While I am gladdened to hear it, I am in no way surprised. It would have been an incredibly stupid idea.Edited by Phinix1 on July 24, 2014 5:43PM10 -
Elencha✭✭✭No@smeeprocketnub19_ESO, I hear you. Someone calls you a name, it's only natural to want to hit back. But shouldn't you be working on that quilt? I'm like half done my section already.
@yarnevk, this is my concern as well, not that I'm a provisioner. I actually love sneaking, it's kinda my thing, particularly in Elder Scrolls games, so I don't mind it, but I imagine some would find it cumbersome.0 -
ZOS_AlanGadminHey guys, this thread is starting to drift off topic with unrelated discussion of the justice system. It's perfectly fine to discuss how this relates to world pvp, but other issues should be taken to separate thread (or an entirely new one, if there are no active threads on the specific topic you want to discuss).
We'll certainly discuss the system in more detail was work progresses.Forum Rules | Promoting Constructive Discussion | Code of Conduct | Terms of Service | Help Site
I’ve moved to a new position and I am no longer active on this forum. For assistance, please check the resources linked above0 -
GnatB✭✭✭✭NoOf course not, open world PvP just leads to stupid gankfests like in UO. Game had promise, but open world PvP killed it. (though I've heard they eventually did some kind of PvP free servers/areas)Achievements Suck3
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smeeprocketnub19_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭Of course not, open world PvP just leads to stupid gankfests like in UO. Game had promise, but open world PvP killed it. (though I've heard they eventually did some kind of PvP free servers/areas)
80% of the point of UO was world pvp. How did the game have promise to you if gutted like that?Dear Sister, I do not spread rumors, I create them.5 -
Gix✭✭✭✭
Oh yeah, because having world PvP is such a game-defining feature for an Elder Scrolls game."The game isn't exactly how I want it to be, therefore it's doomed to fail".
Comedy gold.
How about "the game is doing next to nothing to try and fit the same theme as it's single player counterparts, besides lifting the lore of the world and plastering it onto an uninspired linear trudge through a thinly veiled gear grind, completely disregarding the freedom and choice inherent in the single player variants, just for the sake of "earning" an MMO label?"
Because that's more accurate.
Besides, who said that it had to take anything (aside from lore) from its single-player variant? You? You know what a spin-off is, right? There's a reason it's not called "The Elder Scrolls XI: Online".7 -
GnatB✭✭✭✭Nosmeeprocketnub19_ESO wrote: »Of course not, open world PvP just leads to stupid gankfests like in UO. Game had promise, but open world PvP killed it. (though I've heard they eventually did some kind of PvP free servers/areas)
80% of the point of UO was world pvp. How did the game have promise to you if gutted like that?
Easy, I started playing early before it became practically a PvP only gankfest, and before they screwed up the noteriety system to *really* allow it. i.e. it had promise before release when the press was all about the craftskills and such and for the first couple months or so before the gankers started their fun.
Achievements Suck1 -
Zorrashi✭✭✭✭✭No
At QuakeCon, Paul Sage discussed the work being done on the in-development justice system, including the possibility of hunting down players who have a bounty. Only players who have chosen to participate in the activity of thievery will have a bounty on them, and be attackable, and only if you are a guard.Too bad the justice system is coming and there's noting any of you can do to stop it.
Hehehehe. HEHEHEHEHHEHEHE.
While certain activities may open you up to PvP outside of Cyrodiil, we are not considering world PvP.
In that case, congratulations on dooming your game to a future of mediocrity, and enjoy having your subs wash away when the rest of it's competitors drop over the next year or so.
You'd have to go pretty far to doom an Elder Scrolls game, but you guys seem more than competent at making that happen.
It is one thing to express your views, it is another thing to shove it down another's throat.
How exactly will not including open world PvP doom the game? It hasn't been in since launch, and its been doing fairly well.8 -
gonzo914Soul ShrivenNoWorldwide mandatory PvP?
Not "No" but "Hell. no!!!"
I have no desire to have my game ruled and ruined by a bunch of barely post-pubescent underachievers who have anger issues because they cannot get laid in the real world.9 -
Aenra✭✭✭✭NoEvery game, every forum, same people.
A cry for moar (TM) PvP, or even why not, a full revamp of the whole title, long as """open""" may be inclusive in the new form. As in acordance to their vision.
Fast forward it three months, and i am being general, and there they are again, new forum, new game, old topic. Even when the dev team actually is adding more (like they are here)
Give it a rest..really..
Was not meant to be a gankfesting heavan (TM), is not going to be.Pride, honour and purity5 -
theyancey✭✭✭✭✭
✭NoI think that this thread shows the absolute need for separate shards within the mega server for PvE and PvP people. We do not like each other. Our play styles are mutually exclusive. Having an INjustice System's PvP going off around me denigrates my experience. Give the griefers some place where they can kill each other off but leave the rest of us in peace.9 -
hiyde✭✭✭✭✭
✭Noseneferab16_ESO wrote: »AoC had free for all PvP, and although it did get a bit choppy now and then I'd say that it overall ADDED to the immersion.
FFA PvP in AoC did not add to my immersion. It destroyed it. Gank squads camping quest turn-in NPCs, high levels patrolling low level quest zones killing people for sport (I remember one player, who was disgruntled with the game, that made it his mission to stop lowbies from levelling, just riding around on his horse all night killing everyone he saw), people waiting for you to engage 5 quest mobs before ganking you, just to name a few things.
As a toggle option? Sure!
On a dedicated World PvP server? Absolutely!
Forced on everyone? I'd be gone in a heartbeat.
When it comes to MMOs, PvP is something I prefer to opt-in to when I feel like it. This game was not sold as World PvP and I really hope it never goes there - without an option for those who didn't sign up for that.
And no offense intended towards those that would prefer to have full out PvP everywhere. I can respect that - and I'm all for you getting it as long as I can still play the game/style I signed up for. Edited by hiyde on July 24, 2014 6:43PM@Hiyde GM/Founder - Bleakrock Barter Co (Trade Guild - PC/NA) | Blackbriar Barter Co (Trade Guild-PC/NA)6 -
isengrimb16_ESO✭✭✭✭✭No
At QuakeCon, Paul Sage discussed the work being done on the in-development justice system, including the possibility of hunting down players who have a bounty. Only players who have chosen to participate in the activity of thievery will have a bounty on them, and be attackable, and only if you are a guard.Too bad the justice system is coming and there's noting any of you can do to stop it.
Hehehehe. HEHEHEHEHHEHEHE.
While certain activities may open you up to PvP outside of Cyrodiil, we are not considering world PvP.
GOOD. As I said, as long as you guys have SAFEGUARDS against people trying to pull others into their pvp .. but what about banker/merchant windows when they flinch? And the other concerns mentioned above? Provisioning, etc. We still haven't gotten confirmation whether we can loot from the same stuff someone else is stealing from by Sneaking.
Edited by isengrimb16_ESO on July 24, 2014 6:50PM1 -
Hypertionb14_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭No
At QuakeCon, Paul Sage discussed the work being done on the in-development justice system, including the possibility of hunting down players who have a bounty. Only players who have chosen to participate in the activity of thievery will have a bounty on them, and be attackable, and only if you are a guard.Too bad the justice system is coming and there's noting any of you can do to stop it.
Hehehehe. HEHEHEHEHHEHEHE.
While certain activities may open you up to PvP outside of Cyrodiil, we are not considering world PvP.
In that case, congratulations on dooming your game to a future of mediocrity, and enjoy having your subs wash away when the rest of it's competitors drop over the next year or so.
You'd have to go pretty far to doom an Elder Scrolls game, but you guys seem more than competent at making that happen.
Go back to minecraft, at least you will still find fellow greifers in some servers.I play every class in every situation. I love them all.6
