[*] How do you feel about the distribution of rewards during this event zone?

Lots of slog for not many rewards - at least not only doing trash mobs & dailies & getting curated containers from faction leaders:

Trash mobs don't seem to have any rewards? If rewards include perks you can get from killing certain mob 'bosses' - well I killed one in the Parched district & got heavy attack sustain resource perk that was severely underwhelming.

If you're including curated item sets that you can get as a reward - as someone who has collected everything I really want to except most trial gear - it was not what I'd consider a reward.

If including treasure chests - they don't have anything in them that makes it worth the time opening them.

Perhaps the higher tier level bosses give better rewards?

I don't care about the achievements except in as much as they unlock merchant furniture etc & I will probably grind as much as is needed to unlock antiquity leads & furnishings. Beyond that I would only spend more time in NM if uncollected curated normal trial gear is a reward - seems to be indicated by several sources but not sure what you have to do to get that to drop.

[*] How have you found the difficulty of the Night Market? Please provide any additional context to the difficulty ratings below.

[*] Difficult - as a solo player just for mobs it's similar to level 3 IA, or solo Bastian Nymics, a hard dlc vet dungeon or possibly vet MA or VH (but I haven't done them for so long I 'm not 100% sure.

I tried several different builds & made a pure dk & subclassed sorc that I was satisfied with but they required specialised builds (full resistances, good sustain, good strong heals etc) & careful attention to mechanics. I also used some sets that came from DLC dungeons & the Shattered Paths Signet - which is a catch 22 because you have to get the leads for that to drop in NM first to be able to use it & it may not go live as it is now on the PTS. Did try Ring of Pale Order but it seemed ineffective, maybe velothir or sea serpent might work better.

I did unlock the tempest caller on my sorc build which did help & I imagine having one of these (assuming you can only have one at a time?) would make NM as 'easy' as IA arc 3 is if you have the right verses but IA also gives you visions.

If grouped with other people I guess it would make things easier comparable to having 4 competent players in a dlc vet dungeon.

[*]Did you play Night Market solo, with a random group, or an organized group (friends/guild members)?
Solo

[*]How did you enjoy the Event Zone? As this is a new event type, we would like to get any positives and negatives.

As killing the mobs requires careful attention & time & I couldn't kill brazen etc being solo it was a little repetitive & boring even trying to various dailies.

Doing the sidequest that unlocked tempest caller was fun & one I knew how to do based on previous experience (Graven Deep?)

[*] Did you try the different activities? If so, did you like them? Please let us know whatever you think worked and what missed the mark.

The quests to find things were annoying when the compass & quest icons & minimap (votans) kept directing me to where I thought I needed to go but then I would just keep going around in circles while having to avoid, run or deal with the trash mobs - particularly the fatal potion daily(?)

Would have liked to have done the rolling boulder puzzle but have no clue what you're supposed to do. The races seem okay except again you have to avoid mob trash or kill it so I didn't bother doing them while trying to figure where you have to go - maybe light beacon trails like in the psijic questline would help.

[*] How do you like the new Patrons?

Love the Glittering Goad dialogue & aesthetic which I joined - others seemed good.

[*] Did anything not function to your expectations?
Re: the sand barriers on the doors, I didn't know where to get the Windglass or Splinters, can't remember if I obtained the splinters or just used the ones given in the container/s to a full experienced template character.
Similar with gaining favour- I knew you got it from killing certain enemies but I wasn't sure who exactly & getting it from one particular trash mob didn't mean getting it from an identical trash mob again so it seemed random.

[*] Do you have any other general feedback?

Having either a tutorial or extended tooltip/object information (like when first picking favor 'this is favor, you can kill this particular enemy to gain favor or only certain types x y amount of times per day' etc.

I didn't check the help menu to see if all this kind of info about the NM is in there or not will do so when I go back in there again.

If it's not then many things about NM are confusing or guesswork or learn by accident as you go but that's slow & frustrating.

Sure the players & community will learn this & post guides online but given the NM is limited & will change every time, having to wait for everyone else or learn it slowly isn't great.

I didn't entirely get the point behind favor either except it unlocks the ability to buy things from your faction's merchant & counts towards faction favor count/leaderboards & acheivements?

Also I chose the Glittering Goad faction on my first character that went into the NM but I keep getting a popup saying I have to join a faction on subsequent characters & to go to the curator for that quest but the curator doesn't have the quest for me - I thought faction choice was account wide, unless I can choose all three just on the PTS to test them out or it's a bug?

• Each district doorway within the Starlit Plaza now has an icon indicated in the map.
• Small Incandescent Pods that appear in the central arena now persist longer and are easier to see.
• Decreased the health of the Opulent Arid Varlet, Opulent Knightshade, Opulent Web Eater, and Flameshapers.
• Announcements for the appearance of essences now remain on screen for slightly longer.

Thank you for making these adjustments based on our feedback!

• Reduced the damage of the Unmitigated Burning Essence, Unmitigated Spidersilk Essence, and Unmitigated Pitch Essence.

I assume this just means that the damage ticks ramp up a little slower to give people a little more time to react?

I'm hoping to have a chance to test some of these adjustments later tonight.

Edit/Update: I love the new outlines for the dropped pods, and the boss health levels seem much better now. The change to the Unmitigated damage seems pretty subtle and honestly didn't "feel" very different, but I think it's just fine where it is.

How do you feel about the distribution of rewards during this event zone?
I did miss the Red Ball for the Rank Points at first. I Would really appreciated if you just get them after killing the Mobs. Other then that i did not really get any Rewards as i was only killing Trash, as nobody was around to do Bosses. But the Merchants Inventory Looks very promising.

How have you found the difficulty of the Night Market? Please provide any additional context to the difficulty ratings below.
I would say of These 4 Option i would choose well balanced but with a *. I found the Difficulty very inconsistent with the Trashgroups, some where Pretty easy, others though (but not too though). Maybe you Guys could work to balance them a bit. For Bosses and Events i can only talk About Videos that i saw and them looked really good.

Did you play Night Market solo, with a random group, or an organized group (friends/guild members)?
I was there solo and to some unholy Time when nobody else was there.

How did you enjoy the Event Zone? As this is a new event type, we would like to get any positives and negatives.
I found it really positive that there is finally something worth having good solo Builds. I really appreciated the Difficulty. The only negative Thing i have so far is that i dont like that it goes away after one Season. I dont like FOMO and would appreciate if new Content stays in the Game. Maybe in the second Itterration it can stay in the Game. I found the F5 UI confusing as i could not match the Bosses there to the Bosses on the Map and i did not yet find out where to find them. The Show on Map Button did not help either at it did not highligth anything. I found it also not cear tat i have o farm the Relic, this should be displayed in there oehow besides he Text. There are surely some Improvements to be made there.

Did you try the different activities? If so, did you like them? Please let us know whatever you think worked and what missed the mark.
I did try the Trash and the Race. I watched Videos About the other Things. I found it really Refreshing to see the Range of Activities.

How do you like the new Patrons?
I found all of them had something that stands out and all the Factions are unique.

Did anything not function to your expectations?
As i said i missed the Favor Ball at first. It was really unintuitive to have to activate it so i didnt get any Favor at first.

Do you have any other general feedback?
I find it weird that this Feature will drop so late within the Season and then only stay so short. I mean ist fine for the first Iterration but i hope we get more Time within the Market when it Returns and can hopefully Keep the Market and not loose it the next Season again.

I'm gonna repeat my opinion in this thread: the rewards for this content doesn't make sense.

If Night Market is meant to be difficult, group content, how do you reward this segment of the playerbase? Most people who chase cosmetics and housing are not that hardcore and probably uninterested in Night Market. The players who enjoy difficulty challenges, yes, some of them do housing, cosmetics, and titles, no doubt, but what else is there? Is there any kind of social recognition or prestige from completing this content?

ESO has never really been big on rewarding people for effort. The challenge of completing difficult content is supposed to be an intrinsic reward. I'm talking trifecta titles, progression, etc. The memories you make with your group. Stuff like that.

Then we have this Night Market which, lore-wise, is completely different. There's a faction that sounds like Gilded Gold and their purpose is to get rich. Ok, would instrinsically motivated players want to join a bunch of extrinsically motivated NPCs? Otherwise, you can group with any faction and just run the trials and content like normal.

Why do factions exist? Is there a story? What is the narrative tension? What's the final goal of these factions? You're essentially asking us to join a fantasy gang. There's a long initiation ritual of grinding resources and key unlocks, which, I'm not gonna call it hazing, because this is just a game... but yea. Where is the community service? What are we doing to help our community? We're just grinding faction points, mount unlocks, and goodies? Is there any cooperative, dramatic, or competitive element at all?

That's why I'm not participating in Night Market, because frankly I don't care about the rewards (skill scrolls, useless monster sets, trial gear I already have) or the titles. What would pique my interest would be things like:

1) Universal auction house. Everyone in the winning faction can put up items for sale. An account-wide faction lock would make sense.

2) Extra drop % of rare, tradable polymorphs/mounts/whatever, like vAS+2, if your faction is losing(?). So losing doesn't feel that bad. Losing team gets like 1% drop chance of a cool thing, middle team 2%, winning team 0%. Gives an incentive to grind and not give up.

3) The underdog faction(s) would unlock a bonus to faction point gain and keep the winning faction on their toes.

bobsontpm wrote: »

- I have not been given any rewards yet. I cannot finish anything alone, due to the facts below.
- Waaaaaay too difficult. Random small groups of enemies wipe me in seconds if I'm not paying attention. This should be
- I just went to see how it looks, solo. I'm not a great player, but I had a build, which took me through almost all of content alone, and it is struggling on the random groups, not mention bosses. I cannot imagine more casual players going there and doing anything. Even in a group. The only option of respawning at the wayshrine does not help either. Maybe if there is a lot of players at once, then we will see it going, but now, it is unplayable and un-enjoyable.
- It's very nice aestetically, I like fargrave, and I think it is a right move to put more content there. All other things are just negative: too much and too big groups. You cannot run around in stealth like in cyro, doing minimal quests, like finding people or putting items. You just can't. And for some reason, if you get spotted, even cloak from night blade does not work (it gets removed just after the cast). It's super annoying. I understand trying to rise the difficulty, but this is unacceptable. This takes away the whole "play as you want" thing from ESO.
- It's hard to try anything, when you have a myrriad of things trying to kill you in seconds in the meantime. One wrong step and you enrage a group, who will hunt you until you are dead. Trying to run? You will trigger 4 more such groups.
- what are the NEW Patrons (?) Are those the 3 questgivers? Or the patrons in ToT? :P
- as stated above, almost everything is not working. I haven't had fun time.
- please rething this... It's terrible and frustrating in the current form. Not to mention it induces a big FOMO, because of the amount of things inside the market and not being able to enjoy them and the possibility of your faction loosing - and loosing potential rewards (so you choose in the beginning, and you cannot change; also, I still don't know what the winning faction gives you).

In the current state, the Night Market, in my opinion, will be even worse than the experience with Writhing Wall. A lot of people will be disappointed with their choice of faction in the beginning, after missing rewards. A lot of people will bounce off the difficulty. A lot of people with OCD will be discouraged by the gatekeeping. The limited time of availability of the event is against "play like (and when) you want".

Not a huge fan of the direction where it is going.

EDIT:
- Tried Hexos Ward + Two Hander Cleave with shielding option + master weapon (cleave) + oakensoul + trainee (to fill 3 slots), it allows me to clear some mob groups solo. Some groups (esp. with "miniboses" still spam too much DPS, especially AoE). You cannot just spam shields and heals and survive. Not gonna work. I cannot imagine, how someone with a slightly worse reflex can handle all this...
- any small mistake = instant kill.
- Grouped with 2 other players, no tank. We got buldozed by any of the bosses (one shoot attacks that you cannot block or dodge, if DD (you get knocked over nevertheless if you follow the mechs or not))
- Quest markers are pure trash, given the number of mobs you need to deal with, when searching for things.
- spend more than an hour, got 95 reputation. You need at least 1000 to purchase anything. This is TERRIBLE experience.

Please reconsider making this in two instances: one normal (let's say IA level 2 or craglorn) - for people willing to enjoy the stroy and relax a little bit after work, not sweat every inch of the zone. Then do the one vet (with current difficulty).

Also, consider letting this Night Marked be available all the time, just reset the faction every 2-3 months, like cyrodil. This will by much more faithful to original motto of ESO.

Thank you for bringing some sanity to this. I did finally set up a build that does somewhat decent, but of course it also uses Hexos Ward + Beam. I won't be able to bring any of my other characters to this, only my cheese beam dude.

Having two difficulties I feel is a good idea, because I get that this is taking place of dungeons and that crew needs something this year, but this is NOT dungeon difficulty, it's cracked.

Sadly I've since given up, the hardcores and the popular youtubers have spoken, we're not allowed to enjoy this content, we're not welcome.

Rkindaleft wrote: »

Sorry, but you can enjoy this content fine and you're welcome, as long as you're willing to make adjustments to your build and playstyle - which you did, you found a setup that suited the content better.

If your not willing to do so, then group up, and if you're not willing to do that, then accept this content isn't designed for you and the way you play the game, and that's perfectly fine.

So much of ESO outside of Trial HM has been dumbed down to appeal to the casual crowd of the game. It makes sense, considering they're the largest portion of ESO's player base, but it's okay to have challenging content outside of Trial/Dungeon HM, and there's always a section of solo players trying to nerf down anything challenging to their level just because they refuse to play the content the way ZOS intended - ZOS intended to make the content challenging, and want the content challenging, as I've already stated in this thread.

I understand needs of this specific part of the population. But I believe there should ba a choice. Casual folk will not "git gud" overnight. Or you cannot force "git gud" a one-armed veteran or a person who has havey sight loss (I have meet such people playing ESO). This is why One Tamriel meant so much when it was introduced. I also sometimes find the lack of overland difficulty annoying, but I prefer an option to chose.

But from my experience, the casual crowd is like 80-90% of server population Or am I wrong? Probably devs have more data on that. And they are here because this is the only ES game out there since n-th iteration of Skyrim. Gatekeeping them from content is in my opinion not a great move :P

I still think devs should consider making different instances: one for solo/companion (e.g. veteshran, MA difficulty, let it be even veteran), so that people not having time to organise groups can have the chance to experience this. Even without extra rewards. And then the other with the current difficulty.

My experience with this system is bad, because doing quests in big/random groups does not work (the prominent example is the Group Dungeons, where everybody not interested in lore/quests just runs towards next boss destroying any chance to enjoy quests for others).

Going back to the Night Market itself:
- I have tried going solo with sorcerer (lazy sorc build, HA-based), with tank Isobel. As long as Isobel stayed alive, I was able to tackle some random groups. Sadly, Isobel goes down in about 5 second. Please consider making adjustments to companions, so they don't go that quick. I think IA have this kind of mechanism, that allow better experience when going semi-alone (i.e. with not so bright NPC companion that has problems with avoiding AoEs).
- I find it difficult to do anything, as there is hardly anyone there. At most I found three players in the instance, so we could more or less tackle some challenges together. Other times there was no one there. It seems that a zerg rush with 36 players should easily outpace any problems... I think Trial group would be also ok there. But I hope the limit of only 12 people getting loot is accounted for to 36 in NM?
- I think all the systems and fighting is too skewed towards the long range characters. It's a lot easier to manage the AoEs, and avoiding enemies. The melee characters will be screwed (as in IA).

To ZOS/Devs: please please reconsider including the SOLO mode (or maybe consider keeping NM always on, but in alternating mode: for the event, when we have competition - the current hardcore difficulty, and then after event ends, a normal let's say craglorn-like solo/small group experience or even normal zone with the optional new challenge difficulties). This is just my solo-casual-adventurer plea. I think a lot of players will be grateful for that. Again, I do not have data, but I believe most of the players checking the PTS are not the majority of players, and this group contain rather those more combat-meta-oriented

Varana wrote: »

I sometimes really don't understand this.
This is essentially the group content for this year. It is very weirdly designed as group content because all difficulty levels are condensed into one, but still.
People don't usually complain that they can't go into vet DLC dungeons or trials and solo them. There is an ocean of easy content in ESO, and this is a tiny section of the game (and even of this year's stuff). Why should this be made boring as well?

Because it's timed and not in a group finder? And a trial already exists within it?
People aren't asking for the bosses or trial/dungeon to be easy. They're asking the mundane nothing enemies to be sensible so we can at least do the little lame daily missions without being terrorized endlessly by pointlessly crazy trash enemies that do nothing but gatekeep the average player from even exploring the new zone.

Soarora wrote: »

You can do most of the dailies solo. I don’t have a proper solo build and I found just running around/through/going invisible by the trash enemies worked just fine. Some deaths but there’s nothing to lose by dying, especially if the oasis is right by where you need to go anyway.

This.

From my own testing (as an average player here) on the PTS, the trash packs are fine to solo and extremely easy to avoid or escape, even on one of the most "accessible" builds in the game (Pure class, no trial gear, no scribing, heavy attack + pets "OakenSorc") with the build posted a few pages back for literally anyone to copy if they want.

As an average player here (need to re-iterate this because this "average player struggling/being gatekept" strawman nonsense is getting tiresome), I for one am super glad ZOS is finally sticking to their guns on keeping this content where it's at from a difficulty perspective. The content is engaging without being overwhelming and can easily be skipped by running past the enemies to the next quest location. Such content helps truly average players maintain/improve their overall skills in the game just by playing it (even just playing it casually and not sweaty like a vet HM trial). I've been wanting more of such content for years now, that is a step up from the trivial content such as overland, quests, etc. but not the giant leap that is vet hard mode, tri-fectas, etc. There's only so many times a player can run the solo arenas or normal/vet (nonHM) dungeons before those too become boring/trivial due to far too many repetitions. ESO has needed so much more of this type of content over the years, not only for end-game players, but to help the average player grow and maintain their skills as they just casually play the content.

I don't have a lot of time to test right now, and many, many excellent detailed posts have already been made which are spot on, so I'm going to highlight a few comments that I feel are important and haven't gotten enough attention, and add just one point of my own.

CyberDiva wrote: »

Negative: Factions are account-wide. I want to test all three factions and see what the true differences are. I cannot do that if it is account-wide. Also, it would be nice to be able to play different characters in different factions, like you do with your character Alliances.

So, I read the response which explained that the faction lock is intended to help make the content re-playable when it returns. This is not a good solution for re-playability. ESO and Tamriel needs consistency across its game world to have an intuitive and immersive experience. In ESO right now, all of my characters can choose different factions in the Alliance War. They also all have a different reputation with each companion! It makes zero sense from a game perspective to have something like this lock across all characters.

If the content is fun and rewarding, people will play it again when it comes back. If the content isn't fun and rewarding, they won't play it a second time just to try another faction. Not to mention the fact that not everyone plays all the time, and some people may miss the first iteration and only get to play it the second time. Unless you are 100% sure this will become a permanent fixture on the roadmap forever, such that it is an absolute certainty that everyone will have a chance to try them all at some point, don't gatekeep access to trying different factions in this manner.

code65536 wrote: »

The Night Market is ostensibly a group zone, so why is it so group-unfriendly? Some quests are not shareable. Quest progress is not shared with the group. Why were basic details like that overlooked for group content?

Please, please pay attention to this! Frankly, this should be fixed across all quests across the entire game. It is extremely aggravating that quest progress is not always shared with a group. When scribing came out, it was so annoying when dispelling the wards were individual to the player, even while grouped, in that quest series. But especially for this, with something where the target audience is a grouped audience, this absolutely should be fixed.

STUDLETON wrote: »

Considering this seems to be the group content we are getting in place of new dungeons, it's a little sad to not have higher difficulties and trifecta achievements. I feel that dungeons have been some of the most well crafted pieces of group content that you can always go back to, so I would hope that new dungeons would continue alongside these events, if it is within the team's capacity.

coop500 wrote: »

However I do agree that it's crazy we're not getting anymore dungeons, I'm surprised more people aren't raising hell about that. I would also be fine with the Night Market's difficulty if it wasn't timed. Currently, there are three gates to it.

Timed
Grindy
Difficult.

Content should never have all three in my opinion, and this does. If it wasn't timed, it can be hard so people can work up to it in their own time. But instead, the game is going to yoink it away for six months at a time or whatever (someone on here told me it comes back in the winter again.)

I agree with these sentiments.

ZOS_Kevin wrote: »

This is the official feedback thread for the all new Night Market Event Zone. Specific feedback that the team is looking for includes the following:

• Do you have any other general feedback?

I really honestly think some of your issues here has to do with the fact that the naming, themes, and descriptions of all of the new content is confusing, and it sets up a wide variety of conflicting expectations. I can 100% see the effort with communication but you aren't quite there yet.

Your roadmap has a "Group Event Zone" called "The Night Market," a "Battle Pass System" called "Tamriel Tomes," and earnable rewards called "The Gold Coast Bazaar."

Here are some things I expect based on your word choice that are not true:

• You are rolling out a Market and a Bazaar. Both of those terms tend to mean purchasing things. I would have assumed one of those items would have been the base for a reward system that's replacing our in-game currencies of endeavors and the daily login. But nope, for some reason, that's Tamriel Tomes, the Battle Pass System, although I'm sure some of the rewards if not many are earned through other activities besides combat. Add in a dose of extra confusion that the Crown Store is not being re-branded but ALSO will continue to exist.
• "Group Event Zone" -- I like the idea of an event aimed at players who enjoy harder content but after SO MANY YEARS of events being full of extremely easy activities to obtain tickets and rewards, the "hardest" one potentially being Midyear Mayhem since PvP Zones are not predictable, there was a certain assumption built-in by using the word "Event" that this content would be easy. Historically, events are very accessible. Events are things EVERYONE participates in over the course of a week or so, in between what else they are doing. I read the word "group" in front of it, but it didn't compute. You almost need another word for recurring content that is harder. Maybe... Group Experience Zone? Maybe Limited Time Group Zone? How about... Group Battle Zone?!? But to me, event is synonymous with "easy" from a difficulty level, in ESO-land.
  
  What about the Writhing Wall Event, you might ask? Well,imho, content that requires certain builds and roles to complete is "hard." Content that needs a bunch of people to beat, and you can't solo it, but a bunch of random people do just fine, is fun to experience but isn't "hard." You can't solo it, but that's the same as, say, a world boss. Which is open world content and is not content designed for organized groups.
• The Gold Coast is a place in Tamriel already. So I'd expect the Gold Coast Bazaar to physically be... in the Gold Coast. Not a tab in the Crown Store.
• Tomes are books. Of all the terminology, this one is the least confusing, because you do learn things from books, I guess, and we do say "stickerbook" all the time , but if I understand correctly Tamriel Tomes is the system for currency/collectibles. Something to do with banking, collecting.. oh, say, a market, maybe?... would be more intuitive. And I would have called the Battle Pass a Crown Pass (because we need to pay for it). Tamriel Vaults, where each level of Crown Pass unlocks a deeper level of the vault with more rewards?

Anyway, probably it's too late now, but when making new functionality, the first thing I'd do is take the new names and ask some people in your community, without any context, what they would expect that functionality to be. I really think so much of the debate here about the accessibility for the Night Market would have been avoided it was called, say.... "Limited Time Group Battle Zone: The Night Raiders." (Btw I do understand that the Night Market name is more about the lore/story but that doesn't make the name any less confusing with all of this different terminology being released at once.)

bobsontpm wrote: »

Soarora wrote: »

You can do most of the dailies solo. I don’t have a proper solo build and I found just running around/through/going invisible by the trash enemies worked just fine. Some deaths but there’s nothing to lose by dying, especially if the oasis is right by where you need to go anyway.

You can't. I have tried that in Night Market on nightblade with cloaking and stealth maxed out in everything (except darkelf instead of bosmer/khajit)

Enemies there seems to have a much bigger radius of awareness, so you get spotted easily. Then, due to sheer number of them you cannot run and hide. Either way after discovery you just get wiped in 2-3 seconds.

If I nb-clock, I stay invisible, but if I got spotted - for some reason clock don't work, it dispersals just after activation.

Not to mention some of the daily POIs are in the middle or very close to enemy packs. And of course you cannot finish activating them, as the moment the MOB attacks you you get distracted.

That is interesting because I did all of them solo on my pure Sorcerer Oakensoul heavy attack build (no streak, no sub-classing, no end-game stuff at all) and was able to easily outrun the enemies (without streak) that I could not sneak past.

There was only 1 quest point I found that was right next to a mob pack where the pack would aggro if I tried to interact with that quest item. What I did to complete that part of that specific quest was I sub-classed Earthen Heart, slotted magma shell (ultimate with massive shield) and cast that before interacting with the quest item. Finished the interaction with time to spare and was able to run away and reset the pack. An alternative for those who don't want to sub-class could be the alliance war support ultimate, Barrier, but I haven't tested that ability.

Also not sure how it's impossible to run past the packs of mobs, I was doing it all the time in a generic heavy attack build with zero specking into mobility or stealth. Sure you need to dodge roll once (maybe twice) to avoid a big hit, but it's very easy to do. The only one I've found weird trying to avoid is the roaming boss (dune ripper) that swallows you, but that has it's own unique icon that is visible on the map and as long as you don't stand in doorways or narrow corridors as it's coming towards you, it's easy to avoid it.

Cloak is different in PvE now, you don't use it like a dodge roll anymore to avoid an incoming attack (this is the most common mistake I've seen), especially one that has already been fired. I've found the best way to use it is to pre-toggle it on, move past the packs (not through the middle, but to the side so you're not running directly into the mobs) and as long as the packs don't have detection auras (bright while ring around or glowing red eye above the mob that has it), which is most packs without bosses and as long as you're not sprinting, casting or running out of mag (which cancels the cloak), it works fine.

If sustain is an issue, don't try to run the whole thing in cloak, find area's that don't have packs or have gaps with distance from the packs (and there are countless of these around the place) and rest there in crouch to recharge, then un-crouch, toggle on and move forward again.

Enemoriana wrote: »

Turtle_Bot wrote: »

From my own testing (as an average player here) on the PTS, the trash packs are fine to solo and extremely easy to avoid or escape, even on one of the most "accessible" builds in the game (Pure class, no trial gear, no scribing, heavy attack + pets "OakenSorc") with the build posted a few pages back for literally anyone to copy if they want.

Don't forget that even with same build different people will have different results - and skill is not only thing that matter.
People have different physical abilities - reaction speed and ability to see what is on flashy and flickering screen (and it IS extremely flashy and flickering during most battles).
And people have different internet connection too, and no, "get better one" option doesn't always exist. You never will get perfect rotation and highest dps if in random moments your skill doesn't work from first time. How often does your HA oakensoul sorc miss HA or shields? Mine quite often since I play with vpn (and I have to play with vpn). And with Night Market mobs even small lags can be fatal.
That's ok for vet trials, trifectas and so on! Knowing your limitations, you just don't go to such content. That's not ok for lowest tier of intended for everyone time-limited content.

Making mobs easier will change nothing for those who claims "I can easily solo them with one button", but will make Night Market available for average players playing not in primetime.

300ms+ ping here (with my VPN), and my "primetime" is literally 3-4am server time, so about as off-peak as it gets, as I explained in a post further back in this thread where I shared my build, and I have to use a VPN since my ping regularly spikes between 300 and 30kms if I don't use one to stabilize my ping, making the game completely unplayable, and for me to "get a better ping" I would literally have to move to the other side of the world (not something I can do), so my heavy attacks and shields miss all the time, yet I was still able to complete the general mob packs solo, outrun the mob packs and complete the quests on the build I posted as I have described above.

You also claim that making it easier will change nothing for skilled players, but it does change everything for those players. They lose that sense of "overcoming the challenge", or "solving the puzzle". By making the content so easy (on par with overland which is what some have been calling for), you are removing that feeling of accomplishment that skilled players get when they get challenged and still find a way to win. That is not nothing and is definitely not nothing for those players, so by calling for it to be removed, you are directly calling for those players to be excluded from the game.

The only thing I agree with is the time limitation of the Night Market being removed. I would love to see it be a permanent rotating event, with rotating rewards, that resets every month so players get to enjoy it at their own pace and also experience each faction as well.

Enemoriana wrote: »

Turtle_Bot wrote: »

You also claim that making it easier will change nothing for skilled players, but it does change everything for those players. They lose that sense of "overcoming the challenge", or "solving the puzzle". By making the content so easy (on par with overland which is what some have been calling for), you are removing that feeling of accomplishment that skilled players get when they get challenged and still find a way to win. That is not nothing and is definitely not nothing for those players, so by calling for it to be removed, you are directly calling for those players to be excluded from the game.

"Skilled players" claims mobs are easy to kill. So mobs as now it not "overcoming the challenge" already. And nobody is asking to make more challenging things like top bosses easier. They should be challenging for players with desire for hard content.
So average players can do lower part - hard-content-loving players can do top part of event.
Now there is no things average or below average player can do without crowd in area he needed (and we remember about less-than-trial-group limits, right?). Not "do only simplest things" - nothing to do at all.

Also there is no need to make them overland difficulty. Maybe I missed, of course, but didn't see anybody asking to make them so easy. Normal trial/vet dungeon difficulty will be ok. Now they are harder than at least some vet trial mobs. With much less space to act and, again, limits that on average will place less than 12 players, most of them average and below (because on live there are much more such players), to one district. Just why the hell I can solo kill mobs and survive in high-end content designed for organized 12-players group better than limited open zone mobs?

Yes, all we're asking is for random trash mobs to be reasonable. So we can do the simple dailies in peace, avoiding the bosses or grouping up for them as intended.

As it stands, the trash mobs being so hard is nothing but gatekeeping behind content that's already timegated, this isn't healthy for anyone.

Please don't make general content so hard that it frustrates casual players. You want players to enjoy all content yet you constantly are coming up with vet level hardmode type content.

Most if your community do not do the hardest most challenging content so why do this for the minority? Newer players will be put off by the difficulty.

By peoples comments on here it sounds more lije nightmare market.

Turtle_Bot wrote: »

Because this is an MMO, not Farmville or Animal Crossing.

There's also 11+ years worth of casual content (not counting player made casual content such as housing, fashion, roleplay, etc. that is near infinite in how much there is) already in the game for players who don't want a challenge and ZOS has specifically stated they are looking to add more such content in the future.

An update to this, ZOS did a livestream a few days ago and in that stream (vod can be found in the link below) they directly stated that there will be 2 story based quests this year, 1 revolving around Sheogorath, the other revolving around a potential rework or "version 2.0" of the thieves guild (details not released yet, but those were the spoilers ZOS themselves revealed during that stream). These seem to be designed (based on what was said) to be fully fleshed out quest lines/stories and they are looking into even more casual content, content involving more puzzle based mechanics rather than just pure combat or fetch quests.

https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/688896/official-discussion-thread-for-eso-dev-updates-february-2026/p1

The difficulty is just right. It needs to be a challenging zone. Most people complaining don't have knowledge of how to put builds together. You do not need a META build for this content.

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