It's time to revert the listing time back to 30 days.

Ilumia · August 3

Yes, revert us to 30 days

TybaltKaine wrote: »

Adjust to the change and move on.

I have. My eso+ expired, I didn't want to resub, and I've left for now.
I'm just sad about it contributing to worsening my eso experience.

EdjeSwift · August 3

Rishikesa108 wrote: »

My only answer: if you live in a big city full of smog, you can't go and breathe directly from the exhaust pipe of a bus and say that the air was already polluted, so it makes no difference. Start breathing where there is less smog!

So your answer is to leave my city? Unless you don't understand how smog works, it's pervasive and everywhere, the only way to "start breathing where there is less smog!" is to leave my home, so you're advocating that the answer is to leave the game?

Don't you feel affected by the 14 days of listing?

Nope, it's had absolutely 0 impact on me or my playstyle. I haven't needed to buy anything this year from guild traders.

Know that your way of playing, although respectable, is different from that of others, equally respectable, who enjoy playing with trading. Everyone here has the right to have fun, and the 14 days of listing do not help with this purpose.

It's an adjustment, they happen all the time. Tentacle is getting adjusted in U43, people can adapt or move on. Major adjustments happened in U35, people chose to move on or adjusted. Necromancers are constantly adjusted. This is going to be much the same, the dust will settle and some people will adjust others will move on. Just because trading hasn't been adjusted in a while doesn't mean it's completely immune from the everchanging and evolving choices of the game.

Dax_Draconis · August 4

No, keep us at 14 days

Loving the market correction. I was finally able to afford some style pages that previously were more expensive than what I was willing to pay. Now they are mine.

Sepultura_13 · August 4

I didn't vote because there was no option for those of us who used to be in "trading" guilds but were crapped on by the "helpful, friendly" guild-mates in said guilds.

I'm glad to see that their bait-and-switch rules are finally "biting" them where it hurts...and it ain't in their cankles!

TaSheen · August 4

Sepultura_13 wrote: »

I didn't vote because there was no option for those of us who used to be in "trading" guilds but were crapped on by the "helpful, friendly" guild-mates in said guilds.

I'm glad to see that their bait-and-switch rules are finally "biting" them where it hurts...and it ain't in their cankles!

"Cankles" - now there's a word I haven't heard in MANY years....

DreamyLu · August 4

No, keep us at 14 days

Makes no difference to me, as I reset my listings every day.

For me personally, there are enough other issues to be fixed that have priority over this.

LadyLethalla · August 4

Yes, revert us to 30 days

Rkindaleft wrote: »

[snip]

I will never understand this.

[edited to remove quote]

Aurielle · August 4

I didn’t vote because I honestly don’t care, but I will say this: if your item hasn’t sold in 15 days, it likely will not sell in 30 days. Before the change, I simply disregarded any item listed for longer than a week as “too expensive,” and I suspect many others are the same. If my stuff doesn’t sell within a few days of listing, then I know I’ve priced it too high or listed something that isn’t in demand.

redlink1979 · August 4

Yes, revert us to 30 days

Selling prices aren't a issue to me (they never were because I've always tried to sell items below the average selling price to keep my inventory healthy) but the micro management involved on inventory has doubled. Not fun specially if you haven't a lot of time to play on a daily basis.

JiubLeRepenti · August 4

Yes, revert us to 30 days

Dax_Draconis wrote: »

Loving the market correction. I was finally able to afford some style pages that previously were more expensive than what I was willing to pay. Now they are mine.

I don't think it's the main cause of prices lowering. Or, at least, it's not the only one.

Last Jubilee was very long and litterally crushed materials prices, and motif pages aswell.

A few years ago Worm Cult chest cost over 1M PO. Now I don't even put them on sales.

Also, the fact that we didn't get new meta sets with Gold Road (from what I've seen) didn't help either. For PvE content you can still run vDSR/vCR sets that are the best you can get for healing and DPS. Which means people don't have to craft new sets. Which means they don't need to buy materials. Which means it lowers their prices.

But a global depression of the game economy is not a good news. If items were costing a lot a few months ago, it was also easy to make ALOT of money. Doing crafting dailies on 20 characters, I was earning 600-700k in a day before U42.

If the game economy is broken, it mays discourage a little bit more old players to stay. Personally I've left the Shining Coins guild for this reason, because the selling prices were cut in half. And doing chrafting dailies was my main motivation to stay on the game so...

ZOS_Icy · August 4

Greetings,

We have recently removed some unnecessary back and forth from this thread. This is a reminder to keep the discussion civil and constructive. Please keep our Community Rules in mind moving forward.

Thank you for your understanding.

LikiLoki · August 4

Yes, revert us to 30 days

"if your item hasn’t sold in 15 days, it likely will not sell in 30 days" - This expression is only suitable for simple goods such as raw materials. But rare and valuable items such as furniture should be auctioned for a long time.

xclassgaming · August 4

Yes, revert us to 30 days

yes, pls change it back to 30 days asap

AnduinTryggva · August 4

People are upset because they compare nowaday prices with prices some time ago. But it does not matter as long as everything is going down. What matters is purchasing power. Not the number. If you sell for half the money but everything costs half the money you payed before you still can buy exactly the same amount.
Of course this period of transition from a market with high numbers to a market with lower numbers is not so easy.

However I observe since about two or three weeks that prices are stabilizing for items that I survey. From that I think that we approach the new stability point. And in six months this discussion is no longer led and forgotten.

LPapirius · August 4

Yes, revert us to 30 days

EdjeSwift wrote: »

hiyde wrote: »

Do I think the listings change was the prime factor in this? Absolutely not. But it is absolutely being pointed to as part of the reason long-time traders are departing/taking a break right now.

So clearly the numbers the OP posted don't correlate with the premise, but since we're actually discussing the effects of the listing change, I ask you a few questions.

What about the listing changes made the long term traders go?
Was it the repeat listing?
The loss of gold due to relisting?
Needing to do more work?

Followed up by:
Even if the listing changes were to go back to 30 days how would this change anything?
Would things that weren't selling miraculous start selling?

Or is it possible that some of them chose to quit rather than adapt?

I've chosen to quit relisting any items anymore. It's simply not worth it anymore. The gold you get out of anything is too little to justify the effort to list it. And don't even think about listing anything like an atherial cypher or a specialty armor style that is worth 1-4 million gold. Something rare and expensive will never sell in this market and you'll just lose your listing fees over and over and over and over again, even if you list at less than 50% of it's value three months ago.

LPapirius · August 4

Yes, revert us to 30 days

Bithabus wrote: »

If it doesn't sell in a few days then it's overpriced.

Not true. People just aren't buying anything these days.

LaintalAy · August 4

No, keep us at 14 days

edited

MasterSpatula · August 4

Yes, revert us to 30 days

AnduinTryggva wrote: »

People are upset because they compare nowaday prices with prices some time ago. But it does not matter as long as everything is going down. What matters is purchasing power. Not the number. If you sell for half the money but everything costs half the money you payed before you still can buy exactly the same amount.
Of course this period of transition from a market with high numbers to a market with lower numbers is not so easy.

However I observe since about two or three weeks that prices are stabilizing for items that I survey. From that I think that we approach the new stability point. And in six months this discussion is no longer led and forgotten.

As a ten-year player, the stuff I actually need/want to buy is all pretty new and uncommon and is holding its value just fine, while the stuff I sell in order to afford the stuff I want to buy has dropped precipitously. While materials may have dropped by around 60%, motifs have dropped by as much as 90.

So no, I most assuredly do not have the same purchasing power.

vsrs_au · August 4

Ilumia wrote: »

TybaltKaine wrote: »

Adjust to the change and move on.

I have. My eso+ expired, I didn't want to resub, and I've left for now.
I'm just sad about it contributing to worsening my eso experience.

Same here. I haven't logged on for a few weeks now, and I'll also be canceling my ESO+ subscription. This is just one of the changes making the game worse, so I've moved on to better games. I may return, but I certainly have no interest in ESO lately.

BretonMage · August 5

No, keep us at 14 days

I think it's healthier for the game overall if prices were kept on the more affordable side.

However, the real issue I feel is for the niche items like furnishings or furnishing plans which may not always be in demand. And it's not fair to expect sellers to lower prices below the cost to make these furnishings.

When I tried to sell some furnishings before the change, I set the listing price to significantly below the cost for the materials, and even then, they took a few weeks to sell.

AnduinTryggva · August 5

MasterSpatula wrote: »

AnduinTryggva wrote: »

People are upset because they compare nowaday prices with prices some time ago. But it does not matter as long as everything is going down. What matters is purchasing power. Not the number. If you sell for half the money but everything costs half the money you payed before you still can buy exactly the same amount.
Of course this period of transition from a market with high numbers to a market with lower numbers is not so easy.

However I observe since about two or three weeks that prices are stabilizing for items that I survey. From that I think that we approach the new stability point. And in six months this discussion is no longer led and forgotten.

As a ten-year player, the stuff I actually need/want to buy is all pretty new and uncommon and is holding its value just fine, while the stuff I sell in order to afford the stuff I want to buy has dropped precipitously. While materials may have dropped by around 60%, motifs have dropped by as much as 90.

So no, I most assuredly do not have the same purchasing power.

These items will go down eventually. It is naturally that in a transition time to lower prices ppl tend to be reluctant to go down with their prices for items that formerly went for high prices. They will eventually adapt to the new conditions. They just need some more time to realize the new realities.

PDarkBHood · August 5

No, keep us at 14 days

BretonMage wrote: »

I think it's healthier for the game overall if prices were kept on the more affordable side.

And it's not fair to expect sellers to lower prices below the cost to make these furnishings.

Super glad for the market correction, but prices on some products are still too high. Lower them.

Also, let the market place dictate the prices (metaphorically) eg the average player/consumer.

I have little sympathy for you multi-millionaires/billionaires who were allowed to establish the former eco-system. You managed to keep the average player out of the market system with those extremely high prices. I hope the top 1-5% of you have left the game, we are far far better without you. I hope the bottom falls out of gold, there are way too many player buying gold for crowns/money, and this is a great way to solve this on ZOS's end.

And a reminder, it is only a game; yeah, but what a game!! Let's get back to playing ESO, instead of whining about it.

Highwayman · August 5

AnduinTryggva wrote: »

MasterSpatula wrote: »

AnduinTryggva wrote: »

People are upset because they compare nowaday prices with prices some time ago. But it does not matter as long as everything is going down. What matters is purchasing power. Not the number. If you sell for half the money but everything costs half the money you payed before you still can buy exactly the same amount.
Of course this period of transition from a market with high numbers to a market with lower numbers is not so easy.

However I observe since about two or three weeks that prices are stabilizing for items that I survey. From that I think that we approach the new stability point. And in six months this discussion is no longer led and forgotten.

As a ten-year player, the stuff I actually need/want to buy is all pretty new and uncommon and is holding its value just fine, while the stuff I sell in order to afford the stuff I want to buy has dropped precipitously. While materials may have dropped by around 60%, motifs have dropped by as much as 90.

So no, I most assuredly do not have the same purchasing power.

These items will go down eventually. It is naturally that in a transition time to lower prices ppl tend to be reluctant to go down with their prices for items that formerly went for high prices. They will eventually adapt to the new conditions. They just need some more time to realize the new realities.

It's the sunk cost fallacy in the very most literal sense.

You are right, we are seeing exactly what we expect to see in a deflationary economy. People spending less, saving more. Prices going down except necessities and ultra rare items.

What is holding up correction is the guild trader bidding system. It was built to keep prices unnaturally high to maximize the gold sink. Guild trader prices need to come down to lower the deflationary pressure on the economy. However, it is in each guild's individual interest to keep it high to maintain their usual trader(s) so it is correcting very slowly. The natural result of this is choking out the weaker guilds who can't maintain their bidding . It is going to correct one way or another.

I also believe we already may be seeing an attempt at a monetary adjustment in the next patch to try and get it inflationary again. I think the scribing script vending price is meant as a form of "helicopter money". It seems oddly high at 999, but hey, lets not make it 1000 so it looks smaller. It does double duty encouraging farming of daily dungeons. More importantly, it targets the group most likely to spend it in the short term, players that just spent money on the new chapter. It would be pretty telling if the economy goes inflationary again and they immediately say, "oopsie, we made these a little too high, lowering to x gold".

CatoUnchained · August 5

Yes, revert us to 30 days

The 14 listing limitation is an abomination. It discourages people from engaging in trading. It hurts the market/economy. And it even discourages people from logging on for fear of 20-30 expired item messages in their mail.

This 14 day listing limitation is a bad idea in every way you look at it.

AnduinTryggva · August 5

Highwayman wrote: »

It's the sunk cost fallacy in the very most literal sense.

That sunk cost fallacy does not really hit the nail imho as the vast majority of the high price items were not acquired through buying by ingame gold where this fallacy would apply but through great luck of farming.

This fallacy applies only to those "free riders" that hopped on high prices when buying lower price from sellers who were either out for a quick sale or unaware of the market price.

I think those who cry about the falling prices are simply imagining what they would have earned with the old prices while in most cases they got their items for free with just spending time and having some luck.

The high bidding prices for trading spots were a direct result from the insane inflation we have seen. It is obvious that this price will be slower to react to the new realities as the coffers of the rich guys need to be emptied first. But eventually they will get down.

I do expect some continued hickups in the market until we really have a new stabilized one.

Eventually we will get there and signs are that we are approaching this new stability point.

Of course I don't know how the prices for scripts will play in. Let's see how this evolves.

katanagirl1 · August 5

PDarkBHood wrote: »

BretonMage wrote: »

I think it's healthier for the game overall if prices were kept on the more affordable side.

And it's not fair to expect sellers to lower prices below the cost to make these furnishings.

Super glad for the market correction, but prices on some products are still too high. Lower them.

Also, let the market place dictate the prices (metaphorically) eg the average player/consumer.

I have little sympathy for you multi-millionaires/billionaires who were allowed to establish the former eco-system. You managed to keep the average player out of the market system with those extremely high prices. I hope the top 1-5% of you have left the game, we are far far better without you. I hope the bottom falls out of gold, there are way too many player buying gold for crowns/money, and this is a great way to solve this on ZOS's end.

And a reminder, it is only a game; yeah, but what a game!! Let's get back to playing ESO, instead of whining about it.

I’m not sure why there is this class warfare in ESO. It’s not like real life where you might be born into a rich family and acquire instant wealth.

We all start out with 0 gold and earn it somehow.

The truth about market correction will be fewer things to buy because lots of time spent farming things of high value which have to sell for low value will not continue. So it’s bad for everyone if you’re looking for rare drops.

MidniteOwl1913 · August 5

Yes, revert us to 30 days

katanagirl1 wrote: »

PDarkBHood wrote: »

BretonMage wrote: »

I think it's healthier for the game overall if prices were kept on the more affordable side.

And it's not fair to expect sellers to lower prices below the cost to make these furnishings.

Super glad for the market correction, but prices on some products are still too high. Lower them.

Also, let the market place dictate the prices (metaphorically) eg the average player/consumer.

I have little sympathy for you multi-millionaires/billionaires who were allowed to establish the former eco-system. You managed to keep the average player out of the market system with those extremely high prices. I hope the top 1-5% of you have left the game, we are far far better without you. I hope the bottom falls out of gold, there are way too many player buying gold for crowns/money, and this is a great way to solve this on ZOS's end.

And a reminder, it is only a game; yeah, but what a game!! Let's get back to playing ESO, instead of whining about it.

I’m not sure why there is this class warfare in ESO. It’s not like real life where you might be born into a rich family and acquire instant wealth.

We all start out with 0 gold and earn it somehow.

The truth about market correction will be fewer things to buy because lots of time spent farming things of high value which have to sell for low value will not continue. So it’s bad for everyone if you’re looking for rare drops.

I couldn't agree more. Really it's not the stuff, I'm selling my time. The time it takes me to dig up, chase down, or find something. Time the buyers aren't willing to spend. They are not entitled to my time for cheap.

I had been making gold mostly with cheap stuff and volume. The volume goes down. That has me thinking of switching to better stuff and charging more...

Northwold · August 6

No, keep us at 14 days

Just to give the counterpoint to those saying they'll quit the game, if prices come down I will resubscribe to ESO+ whereas at the moment I am on hiatus.

The trading system locks people in to joining a guild to be able to sell stuff. For players who won't do that, like me, they have to make their money by in-game means and those means simply have not tracked inflation. That has made buying things for eg housing from guild sellers a true chore and the game thoroughly unenjoyable. It has pushed me, at least, out of the game.

ESO has different types of players and I think sometimes people in these discussions don't realise that what they may see as bad for the game can he seen as a huge winner for other players with different play styles to theirs. (I mean, for my type of player, the whole problem would cease to exist if ZOS did *something* to stop gating the ability to sell behind guild membership, but that's a different discussion and one that has been raised many, many times elsewhere.)

AnduinTryggva · August 6

MidniteOwl1913 wrote: »

katanagirl1 wrote: »

PDarkBHood wrote: »

BretonMage wrote: »

I think it's healthier for the game overall if prices were kept on the more affordable side.

And it's not fair to expect sellers to lower prices below the cost to make these furnishings.

Super glad for the market correction, but prices on some products are still too high. Lower them.

Also, let the market place dictate the prices (metaphorically) eg the average player/consumer.

I have little sympathy for you multi-millionaires/billionaires who were allowed to establish the former eco-system. You managed to keep the average player out of the market system with those extremely high prices. I hope the top 1-5% of you have left the game, we are far far better without you. I hope the bottom falls out of gold, there are way too many player buying gold for crowns/money, and this is a great way to solve this on ZOS's end.

And a reminder, it is only a game; yeah, but what a game!! Let's get back to playing ESO, instead of whining about it.

I’m not sure why there is this class warfare in ESO. It’s not like real life where you might be born into a rich family and acquire instant wealth.

We all start out with 0 gold and earn it somehow.

The truth about market correction will be fewer things to buy because lots of time spent farming things of high value which have to sell for low value will not continue. So it’s bad for everyone if you’re looking for rare drops.

I couldn't agree more. Really it's not the stuff, I'm selling my time. The time it takes me to dig up, chase down, or find something. Time the buyers aren't willing to spend. They are not entitled to my time for cheap.

I had been making gold mostly with cheap stuff and volume. The volume goes down. That has me thinking of switching to better stuff and charging more...

Please remember that it is NOT about the number by which a price is expressed that matters but how much you can buy with a given number whatever its value.

If today you sell a rare item for 1M gold which allows you buying 10 motifs for 100 000 gold and tomorrow you sell that same item for 500 000 gold but you can still by 10 motifs for 50 000 gold you have lost NOTHING and the value of the rare item is exactly the same as before.

You really have to let go that fixation on those numbers from the previous market situation. It has no meaning.

I understand that at the moment this time of transition is not so enjoyable but it will pass and you just have to get used to the new numbers as soon as we have a stabilized market again.

pklemming · August 6

Yes, revert us to 30 days

I sell a lot of high priced items. These don't necessarily go straight away, but still do end up selling. The reduction to 15 days means I am loathe to put them up for sale. We are basically paying twice the listing fee for slower, higher priced items.

Not everyone buys 500k to 2m items in the first few days.. or even a couple of weeks, but they do sell.

Multiply this by the 30 slots we have, and the potential to lose a lot of money is real.

The trading guilds I am in are also feeling the pinch, with the reasons listed above, as well as an unwillingness to pay twice if something does not sell.

Nothing on my trader is marked under 50k. Anything under that, I give away or put in the guild bank.