Rapid gear decay

Kyosji · April 2014

Sandhya wrote: »

@Kyosji‌
I am calling BS on that one. It was not the initial argument of this thread, rather an escape bogus argument people introduced when they got faced with the fact that they were actually getting beat by the game.

In my guild and between literally every single player I have met in the game, not a single player suffers from this 'bug' you speak of.

So, again, I am taking the risk of eternal internet-shame by saying that this is total and utter nonsense and people have seen fast gear decay because they grinded their way to 50 or kept dying.

From the responses, it seems that the internet has indeed shamed you.

As many people have stated, this is something rather recent, and in my example, I was given a sword and shield freshly made off the iron. I was only given it in the chance I needed to use the first tier taunt with sword/shield. In that time, I never used it once in the hour or 2 I was sitting there waiting. I didn't notice that the shield actually degraded until I actually swapped to my shield to get ready to attack. That's when I noticed and informed my friend that made it.

I have had many instances where I've noticed heavy degrade from minimal to no actual combat, and it all seems to have started within the week. And from the general statements on the forums, it seems I'm not the only one to notice.

Yusuf · April 2014

In the beginning the tutorial-popup only says your gear dacays when you die and that's fine but when u survive the battle?o.O If they do it this way they should at least let you repair it by yourself, for example at the craftingstation: use 1 or 2 iron ingots to repair your cuirass

Malediktus · April 2014

Gear decay is depending on your exp gain and on dieing.

UrQuan · April 2014

Sandhya wrote: »

In my guild and between literally every single player I have met in the game, not a single player suffers from this 'bug' you speak of.

"I haven't experienced this bug, therefore it doesn't exist, even though lots of people are reporting it, and some have even taken the time to test decay rates to prove it."

Yeah, and I'll bet the bank bug didn't exist either. Heck, I know plenty of people who didn't experience that one either, therefore it must not have happened to anyone.

Asava · April 2014

Malediktus wrote: »

Gear decay is depending on your exp gain and on dieing.

Then us Vets should never have a repair bill unless we die since mobs are only worth 42 VP a piece.

We need gold sinks in game, that's understandable. But having a 1500-3000g repair bill in VR every 2 hours is ridiculous. Mobs only pay out 5g a piece if no one else hits them. Loot sells for 36g a piece on average. If I load up my bag with 70 items or so that gives me around 2500g if everything is worth 36g. Then probably another 500g from mobs. My repair bill will eclipse my gold intake within a couple of hours. Right now I have a 100 slot bp and 110 slot bank and the 17k starter horse. Right now I only have around 40k gold and I haven't even started crafting yet, which is another gold sink unto itself. VR mobs need to give more gold and or looted items need to be worth more.

Ashtaris · April 2014

I just ran into the situation where I looked at my armor and every piece was down to a 0 armor rating, and I don't think I was doing anything out of the ordinary from what I was doing previously. The cost of having everything repaired would have been over 1K in gold. For someone who only has 8K of Gold to begin with, I wasn't going to pay that kind of price, that's for sure. However, I did have plenty of ingots stored away to just make some new armor, and usually at a better armor rating that I can find from drops. It's just a pain in the rear to construct and enchant every piece

It would be nice if you could enchant it at the same time it was being constructed if you had the Glyphs.

Anyway, I think everyone would like to know if the current armor damage rating was by design or a bug. But since this is my first MMO of this type to be involved with, I have nothing to compare.

zeuseason · April 2014

I refuse to repair, I just replace. If my stuff's broken and I don't have any replacements, oh well. Repair costs are sicko.

bluntobjnub18_ESO · April 2014

I'd like to know if your gear level versus your level / mob level has any effect or scaling on repair loss. I've had an instance last Saturday of dying 10+ times in volenfell @ level 34 on the 3 guardians, while wearing at level gear and having a less than 1k repair bill for an entire night of dungeon running. So I'm confused at the actual mechanics at work.

Sandhya · April 2014

Asava wrote: »

Malediktus wrote: »

Gear decay is depending on your exp gain and on dieing.

Then us Vets should never have a repair bill unless we die since mobs are only worth 42 VP a piece.

We need gold sinks in game, that's understandable. But having a 1500-3000g repair bill in VR every 2 hours is ridiculous. Mobs only pay out 5g a piece if no one else hits them. Loot sells for 36g a piece on average. If I load up my bag with 70 items or so that gives me around 2500g if everything is worth 36g. Then probably another 500g from mobs. My repair bill will eclipse my gold intake within a couple of hours. Right now I have a 100 slot bp and 110 slot bank and the 17k starter horse. Right now I only have around 40k gold and I haven't even started crafting yet, which is another gold sink unto itself. VR mobs need to give more gold and or looted items need to be worth more.

You see - I have this kind of expense as well and have always treated it as normal. XP gain and dying causes decay. Mobs in VR still give (hidden) XP when they get killed, and it does not scale along with the VP you get for given mob. This is part of the reason why VR content is harder. When I start dying, I see my net gold dropping down as well. When I play well and tackle a *** of content without dying, I win a bit. Is this wrong? I like it. It forces me to consider my actions and not faceroll Tamriel.

Maybe I am wrong, and if so I do apologize for the strong wording of my first post in this thread. But the silly thing is, I do recognize the repair bills, I have not noticed the difference between beta repairs/post launch repairs at all but it is also easy to misread them for being 'over the top'. That is just highly subjective and that is what I was mostly referring to as well. On these forums many 'varying experiences' are submitted and treated by people as 'bugs' even though they might not be, or are just systems that work in a different way. But, again - maybe there is truly some decay bug and I am indeed wrong - in that case I'll be the first to admit it.

Edit: I really like the suggestion a few posts higher, about using ingots to reduce the repair bill! I do think it should never allow us to completely replace it, but it should give a discount of 20% or so.

UrQuan · April 2014

Sandhya wrote: »

On these forums many 'varying experiences' are submitted and treated by people as 'bugs' even though they might not be, or are just systems that work in a different way. But, again - maybe there is truly some decay bug and I am indeed wrong - in that case I'll be the first to admit it.

Go back and re-read the thread. In particular re-read the part where 2 guys quested together for the same amount of time at the same level, wearing the same level gear starting from 100%, and ended up with massively different decay and repairs (and the guy with the way way way lower bill was the one taking far more damage). You are indeed wrong and there is definitely a bug.

Cernow · April 2014

Sandhya wrote: »

I really like the suggestion a few posts higher, about using ingots to reduce the repair bill! I do think it should never allow us to completely replace it, but it should give a discount of 20% or so.

Yep, agreed. This seems like a good solution. It makes total sense to allow suitably trained players to repair their own gear and rewards them for investing in these crafts. Blacksmiths (Heavy), Clothiers (Light and Medium) and Woodworkers (Shields) should all get this ability.

I think this measure should be combined with the Sturdy trait reducing damage from all sources, not just death.

These two things would go a fair way to easing the problem. That said, I still think they need to tone down the rate of decay as it is too rapid, whether by design or due to a bug.

b101uk · April 2014

Thought I would do an empirical test,

I repaired my character at 7:45pm BTS, I ran from the vendor some 300m outside the town and stood still bar for once every 15mins running to the vendor and back to where I was standing in order to asses if there was any decay, in 1h:21mins (9:06pm BST) there was precisely zero decay either by armour number, gold value or ANY other means of attributing cost.

Next I took a wayshrine to Redfur Trading post, where I again checked with a vendor to see IF there was any decay, again there was precisely zero decay by ANY measure.

I next ran and sprinted by road from Redfur Trading post to Haven blacksmiths on foot, I started at 9:13pm BST and arrived in Haven blacksmiths at 9:23pm BST, on the way to Haven I stopped at two traveling merchants, again there was zero decay, likewise Steelclaws at Haven blacksmiths also confirmed zero decay by any attributable measure, likewise since starting the test my VP were unchanged.

Next I headed cross-country simulating a crafting run for martials (collected lots) with an element of exploring passing through many places with enemy’s which were creped past deliberately, so I wasn’t fully hidden neither detected, eventually ending up back at Redfur Trading post 10:08pm BST, upon arrival I went to Astewen the mystics store and yet again there was zero decay either by armour number, gold value or ANY other means of attributing cost.

Next and for the sake of knowledge I used the “/stuck” command while in Redfur Trading post and selected the nearest wayshrine, to assess the cost/decay attributable to using the “/stuck” command, this amounted to just 47g, with all armour items receiving ~2% damage or in monetary terms 3g or 4g each except the belt which lost 10% amounting to 26g,

Conclusion, there is NO decay based on time, standing still, walking, running, distance covered on roads or cross-country, being in proximity of enemy’s (hidden), being in proximity of enemy’s fighting other players IF you remain undetected, from harvesting crafting supply’s, killing low level animals like deer which pose no threat to you, from just standing up or crouching down.

So I would suggest that people who claim to be having a bug causing armour decay from purportedly in any of the above situations should do some of the above tests to see IF they are getting decay or purely just imagining it or just embellishing the truth.

starkerealm · April 2014

Cernow wrote: »

Sandhya wrote: »

I really like the suggestion a few posts higher, about using ingots to reduce the repair bill! I do think it should never allow us to completely replace it, but it should give a discount of 20% or so.

Yep, agreed. This seems like a good solution. It makes total sense to allow suitably trained players to repair their own gear and rewards them for investing in these crafts. Blacksmiths (Heavy), Clothiers (Light and Medium) and Woodworkers (Shields) should all get this ability.

I think this measure should be combined with the Sturdy trait reducing damage from all sources, not just death.

These two things would go a fair way to easing the problem. That said, I still think they need to tone down the rate of decay as it is too rapid, whether by design or due to a bug.

The issue with this is that scraps are way way rarer than ore, raw wood, and plants. So it would be more punishing to medium armor crafters, comparatively.

starkerealm · April 2014

b101uk wrote: »

So I would suggest that people who claim to be having a bug causing armour decay from purportedly in any of the above situations should do some of the above tests to see IF they are getting decay or purely just imagining it or just embellishing the truth.

I'm not seeing decay outside of combat, and I've been using durameter to track it. Getting into combat, even without taking damage, does cause decay however.

We also have reports, in this thread, of gear degrading in town, so either they're lying to mess with you, or they're experiencing another version of this.

starkerealm · April 2014

Malediktus wrote: »

Gear decay is depending on your exp gain and on dieing.

I'm actually not seeing damage occurring from turning in quests and picking locks. Both activities provide a substantial amount of xp, so, it's possible that's happening to some players, but it isn't happening to me. I am seeing gear degrade rapidly from outgoing damage, however.

Sinoby · April 2014

Mostly repair costs seem fine to me if I get a lucky run with several set items and blues dropping during the run. If I can sell this item I even receive a profit (considering repair costs).
What I really don't like is that I feel penalised for playing the game efficiently - I don't die and with my friend we wipe groups of mobs pretty fast, we get decent amount of loot, but I have to sell it to cover repair costs. Looking gear durability for death is totally fine, but current rate of in combat decay punishes people, that enjoy fighting (I do it for the sake of fighting )

starkerealm · April 2014

Sandhya wrote: »

- Decay has not been altered since launch. Gear decays as fast as it did on day 1. But 'the masses' discovered the zergtrain AoE grind to hit level 50 only shortly after launch, and started abusing it, and got faced with decay days or weeks after launch. This would explain more people seeing it more frequently as time progressed.

Except the rate of decay changed radically with the 4/20 patch for some players.

starkerealm · April 2014

Cherryblossom wrote: »

Still would love to hear from Zenimax on this, is this actually working as intended or is there a bug which is causing some to get these crazy decay rates.
@ZOS_JessicaFolsom‌ @ZOS_GinaBruno‌ @ZOS_MichelleA‌ hopefully one of you will read this and pass it on to the appropriate person to investigate. Because currently we believe this is a big issue. If this is intended then so be it, but we would like an answer.

I am so *** pissed right now, it's not even funny. They'll weigh in on that stupid ass "my journal is kinda bjorked, and say they'll look into it", but we're just left to our own devices, because... what? Forcing us to grind helps the game? Because getting gold out of the system anywhere improves the economy? Because we weren't supposed to be equipping gear? What? I'm getting a real feeling they just don't care, which isn't doing much for my willingness to continue supporting the game.

Mephane · April 2014

An anecdote from today: Was doing PvP in Cyrodiil, capturing keeps etc., started with 100% intact equipment. On the way between battles was a ruin with precisely three mobs guarding an item that gives a quest, so I went in, took the three mobs out and grabbed the quest, then went on to continue PvPing.

We know that PvP does not cause armor to decay at all (so glad about that), and castle guards count as PvP, so I really only ever fought those three mobs. When I eventually went back to town, two items had lost one, one item had lost two gold of its displayed "value". I.e. four points of armor decay. That cost me around 3-4 gold each item, i.e. even a multiple of what the item lost in value. And that is for merely fighting three mobs.

I still say they should remove armor decay from all sources but death, or at least drastically reduce it (i.e. by a factor of 10). We should not be punished for simply playing.

starkerealm · April 2014

Mephane wrote: »

An anecdote from today: Was doing PvP in Cyrodiil, capturing keeps etc., started with 100% intact equipment. On the way between battles was a ruin with precisely three mobs guarding an item that gives a quest, so I went in, took the three mobs out and grabbed the quest, then went on to continue PvPing.

We know that PvP does not cause armor to decay at all (so glad about that), and castle guards count as PvP, so I really only ever fought those three mobs. When I eventually went back to town, two items had lost one, one item had lost two gold of its displayed "value". I.e. four points of armor decay. That cost me around 3-4 gold each item, i.e. even a multiple of what the item lost in value. And that is for merely fighting three mobs.

I still say they should remove armor decay from all sources but death, or at least drastically reduce it (i.e. by a factor of 10). We should not be punished for simply playing.

I got gear decay from a slaughterfish death in Cyrodill back in beta... so, it would seem, there's always been a few ways to suffer decay there.

At a guess, I'd say that something was implemented to scale armor decay rates, and it has gotten completely knocked out of whack for some players. Given that it seems to affect entire accounts, and given that the 4/20 patch was supposed to fix the bank bug, I have the weird suspicion that they're somehow related.

EDIT: I'd say it could have something to do with a Cyrodill fix... and bouncing between other players not dealing damage and the environment dealing it, but I haven't PvPed since the beta weekends.

OFC_it · April 2014

In the last day or so I get a report of damaged equipment ALL the time now. In town, crafting food, anytime, anywhere. It sucks! I have a inventory full of 0 rated armor. Make it stop!

Majic · April 2014

Without speculating as to the specific cause, the amount of armor decay seems high to me in general.

If they reduced it to about 1/4 of what it is now for all causes, I think that would be about right.

YMMV.

Cernow · April 2014

Was just on my Level 10 Templar, equipped in a mix of green level 9 and 10 drops and one white level 8 crafted. Fully repaired. One Dolmen, one death (I tanked and took one for the team right at the end). 73g repair bill, from approx 10 minutes of playing at level 10. Punished for playing. Makes you want to avoid combat, avoid tanking and avoid taking any risks. In a combat-oriented game this is beyond stupid. Next time I either go naked with a bow or I stay away.

stefaan.de.wasch1b16_ESO · April 2014

Though gear repairs are high, very high even, I must say that my stash of gold is slowly adding up.

I do not sell the drops I get, I disassemble them then craft stuff with the materials I get and sell the stuff I craft... Am I turning into Bill Gates or Smaugh... no... but my gold is slowly growing...

I would ofcourse not say no if they were to lower the repair bills

starkerealm · April 2014

stefaan.de.wasch1b16_ESO wrote: »

Though gear repairs are high, very high even, I must say that my stash of gold is slowly adding up.

I do not sell the drops I get, I disassemble them then craft stuff with the materials I get and sell the stuff I craft... Am I turning into Bill Gates or Smaugh... no... but my gold is slowly growing...

I would ofcourse not say no if they were to lower the repair bills

The metric seems to be, does 2-3 hours of gameplay completely slag your gear. If it doesn't, then you're probably not affected. If two hours does slag it then you're probably affected. Before the changes, I could go for a couple hours and end up with a pricy but manageable bill. Now, if I go for half an hour, I'll see an even higher bill than before. I'd be less inclined to say it's a bug if not for @traigusb14_ESO2‌ 's post, I'll quote it in case you missed it.

traigusb14_ESO2 wrote: »

This is definitely not universal. As I have been posting, I'm not affected by this.

Went out with a friend tonight (who has said his repair costs are bad) and did everything together for 1.5 hours, same quests, same mobs etc. I was tanking so I actually got hit more (Temp vs. his Sorc). We mostly did Eastmarch quests, though we did one run through the Halls of the Dead in town for a quick bag full of loot. No deaths for either of us

My repair costs 713.
His repair costs 3262 (and his pants were broken).

Both wearing crafted greens/whites/blues. Both level 35.

This makes me really think it's a bug of some sort.

EDIT: If you're extremely lucky with your drops, and get a lot of ornate stuff, it can almost balance this out, and push you over the threshold for making money, if you're playing from a very specific questing/stealth style. But... you're relying on getting a very specific drop trait in large quantities.

stefaan.de.wasch1b16_ESO · April 2014

Hmmm... could it be material based ? I mean, light armor taking more repairs then heavy armor ? I play a heavy armoured Templar myself...

Would be good if people could post their armor with their posts so we could figure out if it's that...

AlliN · April 2014

At the moment I'm just crafting "casual armor set" for questing, that costs nothing at all, I buy basic enchants on it, and just deconstruct it when it's 0%ed. I don't repair my quest gear, only "battle set" ones, that I wear for difficult bosses etc.

Seems logical, and works. But yes, I agree repair price are ridiculously high.

Especially with idiots in general chat selling stacks of materials below vendor prices. Stupid people and economy don't mix very well, sure you can exploit on them a bit, but they bring the house down overall. If the prices of materials woudl be higher, no one would have cash shortage for respecs and repairs.

starkerealm · April 2014

stefaan.de.wasch1b16_ESO wrote: »

Hmmm... could it be material based ? I mean, light armor taking more repairs then heavy armor ? I play a heavy armoured Templar myself...

Would be good if people could post their armor with their posts so we could figure out if it's that...

All I can offer is my experience with medium armor. It seems to mesh with people using light and heavy, intermittently. And my girlfriend ran into this on her heavy and medium characters. It's not conclusive, but from the mix of players experience thing, I don't think so. I've also seen this on both dual wielding and bow characters.

stefaan.de.wasch1b16_ESO · April 2014

I rely mostly on my shield to get me through... Well I usualy open up with a Snipe from a bow to draw the mobs to me, then I switch to shield... It could be that blocking attacks stops your armor from getting damaged... (the damage being primarily on your shield and not on all of your armor pieces instead)

If so, that would indeed put people that aren't going 1 handed / shield at a serious disadvantage.

Tomorrow, I'll try playing with my bow only and see if my repair bills go up... /film at 11

ashenb14_ESO · April 2014

Sandhya wrote: »

PUBLIC SERVICE ANNOUNCEMENT

High repair bills are part of this game. The balance is different. This is NOT a game where fighting every pack of mobs you can see will net you a positive outcome. It is also NOT a game open to mass farming. Sure you can do it - but it has a price that is almost as high as what you gain from it. "I wonder why that would be the case..."

so your staff?

interesting your name dosnt appear to be colored as staff names are, you should have them fix that....though i think they should fire you rather then fix it since you are clearly trolling the community on a real issue many of us find quite upsetting.

Because this is a game where you need to choose your fights.

really, i should suffer decay when i dont even get hit, let alone die? really?

what is the world full of some kind of gas or something that decays our gear just because?

- Gear decay

not in my testing its not, testing light/mid/heavy light took the least damage per kill, heavy the most, also cost on repairs are higher for heavy...(why cant i as a near master smith repair my own heavy armor again?)

from my testing killing 3 wolves 1 hit each, heavy took 2% on each part per kill, mid i took at most 1% per kill, light, 6 kills took 1%, same wolves waiting on spawning, changing gear same toon, all crafted for my level.

really funny you act as if you are staff and tell people how to play and that they are "Doing it wrong" but clearly you didnt read the damn thread....since i got buddies who dont have repair bills even close to mind when they get hit far more often then i do.....same gear( i crafted all our sets....)

- Decay has not been altered

any source for that? you dont seem to be staff as your names not colored like staff names.....not a good idea to pretend to be staff, that tends to be a bannable offense in most games/forums.

- Gear decay as it is now is intended

so you work for ZOS and can respond with athority that nobody is bugged and that everybody must play with your play style or they need to "L2P" ?

Going out of town and into the world to quest or adventure has a price.

really, my gear should take damage when i 1 hit something with shard so i can farm a node? really?

really? hows that fun?

explain how i should loose 2% armor from 1 hitting something, please, explain that.

run naked

um....how about no

Is it really that difficult???

is it really that difficult to make the game so its really "play as you want" rather then a horrible drag because your unable to get ahead thanks to insane gear costs.