Once Again; BRP Resto and DW both need to be nerfed.
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Derra✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Moonsorrow wrote: »2. Once there is nothing left to use to survive said "clapping", the "inferior" people will demand your offensive damage be heavily nerfed and in that process also making pvp AND pve suffer of said nerfs/cost changes.
3. You realize after nerfs that it takes exactly the same amount of time now with your nerfed offensive skills to do "clapping" on the "inferior" people than before you started all of this.
But isn´t the point that the devs when looking at pvp make the concious decision to not let this happen?
People have been sugarcoated by easy to use defensive mechanics way too long. They need to be brought to the mindset when entering pvp that they will eventually die to other players - and that this is an ok thing to happen. That´s why they enter a pvp zone in the first place.
Not dying as a main goal for the player is an antithesis of pvp and people need to be taught that again. This goes for smallscale "roxxors" aswell as the "trashcans".
Building to live instead of to kill is not building for pvp. It´s carebear mentality - no matter who does it.
Mechanics should not endorse not dying. They should make it prohibitively difficult over extended periods of time.Edited by Derra on November 15, 2019 2:14PM<Noricum>
I live. I die. I live again.
Derra - DC - Sorc - AvA 50
Derrah - EP - Sorc - AvA 505 -
Moonsorrow✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Moonsorrow wrote: »Moonsorrow wrote: »Moonsorrow wrote: »Moonsorrow wrote: »Moonsorrow wrote: »JumpmanLane wrote: »Dude, its the same 5-6 people complaining about these sets over and over and over, all from the same discord chat, and it's getting old. I can see how they would be annoying in Cyrodil, and I get the frustration, but you can't have every single set that gives someone an advantage nerfed. It just starts a whole new chain reaction that ends with yet another post to nerf yet another set, and nothing ever changes. People will ALWAYS find something to crutch on, no matter how much you take away. The only thing you can do to equalize things is to just give everyone nothing but sticks and see how much faster one person can wave theirs at the other.
In the interest of working with the nerflings however, since they always seem to eventually get their way in this game, what if the staff skill got changed to only affect another player, rather than potentially the one who cast it? That way, it would require a pocket healer to receive the buff, which could be easily killed before killing the dd, since pocket healer wouldn't have the benefit of the buff. This would allow it to still be used in PvE where it's not "hurting" anyone's gameplay.
Actually the entire crux of small scale players want both of these nerfed. I would not expect a zerg healer to understand.The post isn't even about 1% of all available sets yet people start to yell at OP how he wants to remove every single thing from the game.
Everyone trying to defend brp dw and resto at this point should just be brushed off with "ok boomer"
There's no point listing the arguments again for people who can't grasp that 30% more healing/ less damage taken on demand with no cooldown is unbalanced
Major Vitality? For how long. Geeze Brp is really just good in a duel. In open world GUARDS would get the rapid regen I popped off it.
Look add some damage to those crappy high mitigation/ high sustain builds ya running. You can’t kill nobody because YOU built that way!
I am everyday waiting for that moment when they realize that chain reaction these nerfs cause and have been for a while now. The game does not change into their favor or what they imagine it will be if these 2 sets get destroyed. It just leads to demanding the next sets nerfed and nothing changes except others demanded the skills they use nerfed since no way to defend more than 1 second. ZOS wants people to enjoy pvp, it their calculations that enjoyment should take longer than 1 second i`d guess even without knowing full details. But them making ganking harder and harder tells about that.
Its almost comical they do not understand it. Can any of you who want these (and many other things) nerfed honestly answer and describe what would happen if your wish came true? How would the people using these now react and adapt? I know that deep down you know the answer.
Or.. some might have had a dream or illusion that this would turn pvp into balanced paradise where you can kill "inferior" players in a second. I can tell you, people would adapt..
The people with now 25-26k hp with 1 damage set and special weapons would just go like 30-40k hp on Pariah, Plague Doctor; Blood Spawn, Troll King, Malubeth, neeerff soRc, Engine Guardian neeerff, Nerf Reactive, and other tanky ways to use more hp/regen as buffer to not die instead of Major Protection, shielding proc sets.. so then go demand them nerfed next, huh? "Yes yes NeeeEEEeRf!"
Should it be just better to stop this chain reaction already..? Does the nerf demands stop when pvp combat result is always just decided by numbers or who gets to hit first because everyone is allowed to only wear paper armor?
And i know personally these items have their uses yes and are strong. But, again - you are wrong if you think taking these out will change the game into something you vision it to become. You know you would be here to make similar posts soon just about something else, on and on. If still cannot accept that fact, you know its about ego then.
I wish a good weekend for everyone though since its like almost friday here, have fun whatever you all are doing! Good discussions ladies and gentlemen!
What a good idea to list sets like Trollking and pariah which are both overtuned aswell and have been all the time.
First of all the change of yeeting brp resto /DW would remove 2 sets which are on a power level that not a single set alone can reach, not even 2 sets come close not even talking about the opportunity costs that are required to run sets worth of 7 pieces on both bars.
The weapons offer the best defence out there with little to no opportunity cost.
People going 35-40k health +pariah will still not survive as long and in order to do so they give up huge amounts of sustain and damage.
Inferior players deserve to be crushed every single time till they actually learn to play and not have sets keep them alive or get kills for them.
They are inferior
Well to be honest, personally i`ve not had any troubles on killing anyone using BRP Resto/DW, so i guess that more just tells about you and your buddies having inferiority issues? Tip: Have you tried CC and having damage on your build?
Oh well, see you on Cyrodiil again - will try to remember doing /shovel emote or something the next time ending your inferior gameplay.
The stubborness on this topic is too strong so time for this witch to fly away from it with her vBRP broom.
Maybe i`ll go touch someone with Vamp Drain, the bane of ESO. Oohlala...
I doubt i have ever seen you in game but keep up your baiting because you're too stubborn to call out your training wheels.
Also 10/10 reply to the topic as you have yet to add anything constructive.
My forum name obviously is not same as ingame @.
There is no baiting in trying to defend the health of this game for everyone. I actually like to see everyone having fun, be it at pvp or pve. I actually starting to think you believe your vision would make the game better.. but do not see the consequences it has.
Imagine the skills, sets and mechanics of ESO as a game of chess against a good opponent. If you go on offensive with your Knights and take out couple of Pawns (defensive sets), be ready to lose your Knights (offensive sets and/or damage skills nerfed).
Dont think i can say it in a more simple and constructive way anymore.
I guess people are more prone to spread animosity when they hide in anonymity.
You fail to see how a game that offers absolutely no incentive to get better doesn't get boring with time?
Even comparing it with chess is laughable, the chess equivalent to brp weapons would be that a toddler can draw with Magnus just by throwing the board away and then say he could do the same.
There aren't any sets neither a single 2pc or a 5pc set which come close to brp weapons.
Other defensive 5pc sets like swift offer 1/3rd of the mitigation major protection does.
Pariah at best adds 13k resistances which means ~20% damage mitigation when ignoring all other things.
Same with major vitality there is nothing that could compete and there is no opportunity cost for running them.
I run 2 offensive sets+bloodspawn+ brp Dw with no drawback at all.
Anyone not running brp weapons on specs who benefit form them is playing an inferior build.
Animosity? Oh please.. you and the op were the ones calling people "inferior" who use "training wheels" sets/skills.
And now you say you are using the same "training wheel" and thus.. being one of the "inferior" people? But since "inferior people" live longer than they should with those sets (that you use), your whole point here is to.. nerf yourself?
Okay..
If was not this lazy, i`d attach the picture of a cat putting its paw on top your hand saying it is time to stop posting now. Because asking to nerf yourself and after that everyone else (pve also) with offensive nerfs, maybe its better to think this through again?
So you still haven't manned up...
I'm not going to hinder myself that much by not running brp weapons in a patch where everyone else is running them. But i will do everything to get them removed from the game so inferior people get the clapping they deserve.
Hope i won`t be "manning up" ever if that includes loss of basic logics since it seems hard for you to admit that:
1. After this you will go after the next thing that makes someone survive your "clapping" for more than.. how many seconds it was they are allowed to live?
2. Once there is nothing left to use to survive said "clapping", the "inferior" people will demand your offensive damage be heavily nerfed and in that process also making pvp AND pve suffer of said nerfs/cost changes.
3. You realize after nerfs that it takes exactly the same amount of time now with your nerfed offensive skills to do "clapping" on the "inferior" people than before you started all of this.
So again i ask.. why? Is it really that hard to admit possibly being wrong or that cannot see consequences for longer time than 1 patch?
People often blame ZOS when they do some changes and go all "well, you did not think this through did you?" and "Why you never listen?" ..well how about thinking this through thoroughly yourself?
But tell you what. Lets make a deal, i`ll accept nerfs to these 2 things if you and your mateys after it stop there and not go after just more and more things.. but i know you will. Nothing is ever enough until both pvp and pve community just dies out and only group at empty Cyrodiil is your crew wheeling around on your ram.
Do you think the people who you call "inferior" play this game to be your AP farm? If they die in 1 second repeatedly they either leave or go in mass to demand nerfs to the things that kill them that fast, and nerfs happen fast when big enough mass demands them. How can you just not admit this would happen?
So, you would end up demolishing offensive skills/sets many of us like in that process - why would i and others have to suffer that just because you and your buddies have problems killing someone fast enough to your standards?
I have a better deal, you tell me your @name, I'll go for a duel with you.
I don't want to waste my time with someone who isn't even confident enough for take responsibility for his claims in game
That sweet moment when you see the one you have a debate with ripping their shirt off and running towards you in anger when they have no intellectual arguments to support their opinion.
Calm down lil buddy and take your chill pill with the strawberry yoghurt your mommy bought.
Also, its her "claims" and i am pretty sure you know me in game or knew, pvp community.. it is not that big and there is not that many solo & small scale "grils" that been a ballgroup healer before that for years. I`ll leave it at that. And hey, i`m a kind person but i like to trigger those who cannot see what some changes do in the long run. Love this game too much and so many friends left already, i was away for a bit too.. but here i am trying to defend the game with sharp fingernails.
So do not take things personally.
5 -
BohnT2✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Moonsorrow wrote: »Moonsorrow wrote: »Moonsorrow wrote: »Moonsorrow wrote: »Moonsorrow wrote: »Moonsorrow wrote: »JumpmanLane wrote: »Dude, its the same 5-6 people complaining about these sets over and over and over, all from the same discord chat, and it's getting old. I can see how they would be annoying in Cyrodil, and I get the frustration, but you can't have every single set that gives someone an advantage nerfed. It just starts a whole new chain reaction that ends with yet another post to nerf yet another set, and nothing ever changes. People will ALWAYS find something to crutch on, no matter how much you take away. The only thing you can do to equalize things is to just give everyone nothing but sticks and see how much faster one person can wave theirs at the other.
In the interest of working with the nerflings however, since they always seem to eventually get their way in this game, what if the staff skill got changed to only affect another player, rather than potentially the one who cast it? That way, it would require a pocket healer to receive the buff, which could be easily killed before killing the dd, since pocket healer wouldn't have the benefit of the buff. This would allow it to still be used in PvE where it's not "hurting" anyone's gameplay.
Actually the entire crux of small scale players want both of these nerfed. I would not expect a zerg healer to understand.The post isn't even about 1% of all available sets yet people start to yell at OP how he wants to remove every single thing from the game.
Everyone trying to defend brp dw and resto at this point should just be brushed off with "ok boomer"
There's no point listing the arguments again for people who can't grasp that 30% more healing/ less damage taken on demand with no cooldown is unbalanced
Major Vitality? For how long. Geeze Brp is really just good in a duel. In open world GUARDS would get the rapid regen I popped off it.
Look add some damage to those crappy high mitigation/ high sustain builds ya running. You can’t kill nobody because YOU built that way!
I am everyday waiting for that moment when they realize that chain reaction these nerfs cause and have been for a while now. The game does not change into their favor or what they imagine it will be if these 2 sets get destroyed. It just leads to demanding the next sets nerfed and nothing changes except others demanded the skills they use nerfed since no way to defend more than 1 second. ZOS wants people to enjoy pvp, it their calculations that enjoyment should take longer than 1 second i`d guess even without knowing full details. But them making ganking harder and harder tells about that.
Its almost comical they do not understand it. Can any of you who want these (and many other things) nerfed honestly answer and describe what would happen if your wish came true? How would the people using these now react and adapt? I know that deep down you know the answer.
Or.. some might have had a dream or illusion that this would turn pvp into balanced paradise where you can kill "inferior" players in a second. I can tell you, people would adapt..
The people with now 25-26k hp with 1 damage set and special weapons would just go like 30-40k hp on Pariah, Plague Doctor; Blood Spawn, Troll King, Malubeth, neeerff soRc, Engine Guardian neeerff, Nerf Reactive, and other tanky ways to use more hp/regen as buffer to not die instead of Major Protection, shielding proc sets.. so then go demand them nerfed next, huh? "Yes yes NeeeEEEeRf!"
Should it be just better to stop this chain reaction already..? Does the nerf demands stop when pvp combat result is always just decided by numbers or who gets to hit first because everyone is allowed to only wear paper armor?
And i know personally these items have their uses yes and are strong. But, again - you are wrong if you think taking these out will change the game into something you vision it to become. You know you would be here to make similar posts soon just about something else, on and on. If still cannot accept that fact, you know its about ego then.
I wish a good weekend for everyone though since its like almost friday here, have fun whatever you all are doing! Good discussions ladies and gentlemen!
What a good idea to list sets like Trollking and pariah which are both overtuned aswell and have been all the time.
First of all the change of yeeting brp resto /DW would remove 2 sets which are on a power level that not a single set alone can reach, not even 2 sets come close not even talking about the opportunity costs that are required to run sets worth of 7 pieces on both bars.
The weapons offer the best defence out there with little to no opportunity cost.
People going 35-40k health +pariah will still not survive as long and in order to do so they give up huge amounts of sustain and damage.
Inferior players deserve to be crushed every single time till they actually learn to play and not have sets keep them alive or get kills for them.
They are inferior
Well to be honest, personally i`ve not had any troubles on killing anyone using BRP Resto/DW, so i guess that more just tells about you and your buddies having inferiority issues? Tip: Have you tried CC and having damage on your build?
Oh well, see you on Cyrodiil again - will try to remember doing /shovel emote or something the next time ending your inferior gameplay.
The stubborness on this topic is too strong so time for this witch to fly away from it with her vBRP broom.
Maybe i`ll go touch someone with Vamp Drain, the bane of ESO. Oohlala...
I doubt i have ever seen you in game but keep up your baiting because you're too stubborn to call out your training wheels.
Also 10/10 reply to the topic as you have yet to add anything constructive.
My forum name obviously is not same as ingame @.
There is no baiting in trying to defend the health of this game for everyone. I actually like to see everyone having fun, be it at pvp or pve. I actually starting to think you believe your vision would make the game better.. but do not see the consequences it has.
Imagine the skills, sets and mechanics of ESO as a game of chess against a good opponent. If you go on offensive with your Knights and take out couple of Pawns (defensive sets), be ready to lose your Knights (offensive sets and/or damage skills nerfed).
Dont think i can say it in a more simple and constructive way anymore.
I guess people are more prone to spread animosity when they hide in anonymity.
You fail to see how a game that offers absolutely no incentive to get better doesn't get boring with time?
Even comparing it with chess is laughable, the chess equivalent to brp weapons would be that a toddler can draw with Magnus just by throwing the board away and then say he could do the same.
There aren't any sets neither a single 2pc or a 5pc set which come close to brp weapons.
Other defensive 5pc sets like swift offer 1/3rd of the mitigation major protection does.
Pariah at best adds 13k resistances which means ~20% damage mitigation when ignoring all other things.
Same with major vitality there is nothing that could compete and there is no opportunity cost for running them.
I run 2 offensive sets+bloodspawn+ brp Dw with no drawback at all.
Anyone not running brp weapons on specs who benefit form them is playing an inferior build.
Animosity? Oh please.. you and the op were the ones calling people "inferior" who use "training wheels" sets/skills.
And now you say you are using the same "training wheel" and thus.. being one of the "inferior" people? But since "inferior people" live longer than they should with those sets (that you use), your whole point here is to.. nerf yourself?
Okay..
If was not this lazy, i`d attach the picture of a cat putting its paw on top your hand saying it is time to stop posting now. Because asking to nerf yourself and after that everyone else (pve also) with offensive nerfs, maybe its better to think this through again?
So you still haven't manned up...
I'm not going to hinder myself that much by not running brp weapons in a patch where everyone else is running them. But i will do everything to get them removed from the game so inferior people get the clapping they deserve.
Hope i won`t be "manning up" ever if that includes loss of basic logics since it seems hard for you to admit that:
1. After this you will go after the next thing that makes someone survive your "clapping" for more than.. how many seconds it was they are allowed to live?
2. Once there is nothing left to use to survive said "clapping", the "inferior" people will demand your offensive damage be heavily nerfed and in that process also making pvp AND pve suffer of said nerfs/cost changes.
3. You realize after nerfs that it takes exactly the same amount of time now with your nerfed offensive skills to do "clapping" on the "inferior" people than before you started all of this.
So again i ask.. why? Is it really that hard to admit possibly being wrong or that cannot see consequences for longer time than 1 patch?
People often blame ZOS when they do some changes and go all "well, you did not think this through did you?" and "Why you never listen?" ..well how about thinking this through thoroughly yourself?
But tell you what. Lets make a deal, i`ll accept nerfs to these 2 things if you and your mateys after it stop there and not go after just more and more things.. but i know you will. Nothing is ever enough until both pvp and pve community just dies out and only group at empty Cyrodiil is your crew wheeling around on your ram.
Do you think the people who you call "inferior" play this game to be your AP farm? If they die in 1 second repeatedly they either leave or go in mass to demand nerfs to the things that kill them that fast, and nerfs happen fast when big enough mass demands them. How can you just not admit this would happen?
So, you would end up demolishing offensive skills/sets many of us like in that process - why would i and others have to suffer that just because you and your buddies have problems killing someone fast enough to your standards?
I have a better deal, you tell me your @name, I'll go for a duel with you.
I don't want to waste my time with someone who isn't even confident enough for take responsibility for his claims in game
That sweet moment when you see the one you have a debate with ripping their shirt off and running towards you in anger when they have no intellectual arguments to support their opinion.
Calm down lil buddy and take your chill pill with the strawberry yoghurt your mommy bought.
Also, its her "claims" and i am pretty sure you know me in game or knew, pvp community.. it is not that big and there is not that many solo & small scale "grils" that been a ballgroup healer before that for years. I`ll leave it at that. And hey, i`m a kind person but i like to trigger those who cannot see what some changes do in the long run. Love this game too much and so many friends left already, i was away for a bit too.. but here i am trying to defend the game with sharp fingernails.
So do not take things personally.
Oh so someone from Prootch, huehuehuehue and you dare to write anything on the forums1 -
hakan✭✭✭✭✭Moonsorrow wrote: »2. Once there is nothing left to use to survive said "clapping", the "inferior" people will demand your offensive damage be heavily nerfed and in that process also making pvp AND pve suffer of said nerfs/cost changes.
3. You realize after nerfs that it takes exactly the same amount of time now with your nerfed offensive skills to do "clapping" on the "inferior" people than before you started all of this.
Building to live instead of to kill is not building for pvp. It´s carebear mentality - no matter who does it.
What? Thats one of the most dumb *** ive ever heard of. anyway.
since there are couple of threads about this, ill actually try this weapons. The thing that i dont understand is, back bar-cloak- return to front bar takes 3secs already, hoe is it that powerful? Do they constantly spam and do nothing else?
For stave i guess it is worse. To get that mending passive working you also need to heal which takes up the entire 3 second window compared to maj prot which is instant dmg reduction.
5 -
Luckylancer✭✭✭✭✭Heals are over tuned because of prior patches but this nerfling is on the hunt to nerf whats good left in this game.1 -
SenpaiNFT✭✭✭✭DaNnYtHePcFrEaK wrote: »Like title says. They both make it possible for players of severely inferior skill level to survive MUCH longer then they are supposed to. Major Vitality uptime cannot be that consistent from any other source in the game, and the same goes with Major Protection especially with the (rightful) Pirate and Steadfast nerfs.
It honestly baffles me how these two obviously over-performing weapons have still been untouched. Every good player understands they are over-performing and you can do perfectly fine without them, but with them you become virtually unkillable. Furthermore, with the buffs to healing, Lokestiiz HM has become much easier to heal, to the point where BRP resto is absolutely not needed anymore to successfully heal cages. There is no legitimate reason for these to not get nerfed ZOS.
So people who are PROGRESSING lokk HM have to suffer because some dude uses it in pvp and you can't kill him?
Finally someone understands.2 -
Korah_Eaglecry✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭Apparently you shouldn't be able to use buffs if you are "lower skill".
Apparently you should just take your death and thank the OP if you are "lower skill".
Lower skill being anyone the OP faces off against in PvP.Penniless Sellsword CompanyCaptain Paramount - Jorrhaq VhentKorith Eaglecry * Enrerion Aedihle * Laerinel Rhaev * Caius Berilius * Seylina Ithvala * H'Vak the GrimjawlTenarei Rhaev * Dazsh Ro Khar * Yynril Rothvani * Bathes-In-Coin * Anaelle Faerniil * Azjani Ma'LesAban Shahid Bakr * Kheshna gra-Gharbuk * Gallisten Bondurant * Etain Maquier * Atsu Kalame * Faulpia SeverinusWhat is better, to be born good, or to overcome your evil nature through great effort? - Paarthurnax6 -
MartiniDaniels✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Facts:
1. BRP weapons were added in U20.
2. Average tankiness sharply increased in U24.
Conclusion - BRP weapons are reason for increased tankiness 1 year after their appearance
/s
/facepalm
Another facts:
1. Dots&onslaught&dizzy were buffed to OP level in U23. Fear became available to everyone. Healing was buffed to match all this;
2. To survive dots&onslaught&fear spam, people started using very tanky builds which still have enough offensive power due to dots&onslaught&dizzy being OP;
3. Dots&onslaught&dizzy were severely nerfed in U24. Healing was untouched, but turn evil still here, people still run same tanky builds they are used too in U23 to survive long enough during glitchy barely cc-breakable fear...
4. Tanks can't kill tanks anymore. Conclusion - play smart and invest more in damage??? Use mechanical acuity, use balorgh instead of bloodspawn, use counterattacks?? No! Nerf everything masses use, so we can quietly theorycraft another broken OP meta builds and enjoy them sitting in resource towers, one shotting solo randoms with group bursts coordinated in voice. Inferior randoms dared to use proactive defense and mobile builds, this is unacceptable, nerf, nerf, nerf!
4 -
Moonsorrow✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Moonsorrow wrote: »Moonsorrow wrote: »Moonsorrow wrote: »Moonsorrow wrote: »Moonsorrow wrote: »Moonsorrow wrote: »JumpmanLane wrote: »Dude, its the same 5-6 people complaining about these sets over and over and over, all from the same discord chat, and it's getting old. I can see how they would be annoying in Cyrodil, and I get the frustration, but you can't have every single set that gives someone an advantage nerfed. It just starts a whole new chain reaction that ends with yet another post to nerf yet another set, and nothing ever changes. People will ALWAYS find something to crutch on, no matter how much you take away. The only thing you can do to equalize things is to just give everyone nothing but sticks and see how much faster one person can wave theirs at the other.
In the interest of working with the nerflings however, since they always seem to eventually get their way in this game, what if the staff skill got changed to only affect another player, rather than potentially the one who cast it? That way, it would require a pocket healer to receive the buff, which could be easily killed before killing the dd, since pocket healer wouldn't have the benefit of the buff. This would allow it to still be used in PvE where it's not "hurting" anyone's gameplay.
Actually the entire crux of small scale players want both of these nerfed. I would not expect a zerg healer to understand.The post isn't even about 1% of all available sets yet people start to yell at OP how he wants to remove every single thing from the game.
Everyone trying to defend brp dw and resto at this point should just be brushed off with "ok boomer"
There's no point listing the arguments again for people who can't grasp that 30% more healing/ less damage taken on demand with no cooldown is unbalanced
Major Vitality? For how long. Geeze Brp is really just good in a duel. In open world GUARDS would get the rapid regen I popped off it.
Look add some damage to those crappy high mitigation/ high sustain builds ya running. You can’t kill nobody because YOU built that way!
I am everyday waiting for that moment when they realize that chain reaction these nerfs cause and have been for a while now. The game does not change into their favor or what they imagine it will be if these 2 sets get destroyed. It just leads to demanding the next sets nerfed and nothing changes except others demanded the skills they use nerfed since no way to defend more than 1 second. ZOS wants people to enjoy pvp, it their calculations that enjoyment should take longer than 1 second i`d guess even without knowing full details. But them making ganking harder and harder tells about that.
Its almost comical they do not understand it. Can any of you who want these (and many other things) nerfed honestly answer and describe what would happen if your wish came true? How would the people using these now react and adapt? I know that deep down you know the answer.
Or.. some might have had a dream or illusion that this would turn pvp into balanced paradise where you can kill "inferior" players in a second. I can tell you, people would adapt..
The people with now 25-26k hp with 1 damage set and special weapons would just go like 30-40k hp on Pariah, Plague Doctor; Blood Spawn, Troll King, Malubeth, neeerff soRc, Engine Guardian neeerff, Nerf Reactive, and other tanky ways to use more hp/regen as buffer to not die instead of Major Protection, shielding proc sets.. so then go demand them nerfed next, huh? "Yes yes NeeeEEEeRf!"
Should it be just better to stop this chain reaction already..? Does the nerf demands stop when pvp combat result is always just decided by numbers or who gets to hit first because everyone is allowed to only wear paper armor?
And i know personally these items have their uses yes and are strong. But, again - you are wrong if you think taking these out will change the game into something you vision it to become. You know you would be here to make similar posts soon just about something else, on and on. If still cannot accept that fact, you know its about ego then.
I wish a good weekend for everyone though since its like almost friday here, have fun whatever you all are doing! Good discussions ladies and gentlemen!
What a good idea to list sets like Trollking and pariah which are both overtuned aswell and have been all the time.
First of all the change of yeeting brp resto /DW would remove 2 sets which are on a power level that not a single set alone can reach, not even 2 sets come close not even talking about the opportunity costs that are required to run sets worth of 7 pieces on both bars.
The weapons offer the best defence out there with little to no opportunity cost.
People going 35-40k health +pariah will still not survive as long and in order to do so they give up huge amounts of sustain and damage.
Inferior players deserve to be crushed every single time till they actually learn to play and not have sets keep them alive or get kills for them.
They are inferior
Well to be honest, personally i`ve not had any troubles on killing anyone using BRP Resto/DW, so i guess that more just tells about you and your buddies having inferiority issues? Tip: Have you tried CC and having damage on your build?
Oh well, see you on Cyrodiil again - will try to remember doing /shovel emote or something the next time ending your inferior gameplay.
The stubborness on this topic is too strong so time for this witch to fly away from it with her vBRP broom.
Maybe i`ll go touch someone with Vamp Drain, the bane of ESO. Oohlala...
I doubt i have ever seen you in game but keep up your baiting because you're too stubborn to call out your training wheels.
Also 10/10 reply to the topic as you have yet to add anything constructive.
My forum name obviously is not same as ingame @.
There is no baiting in trying to defend the health of this game for everyone. I actually like to see everyone having fun, be it at pvp or pve. I actually starting to think you believe your vision would make the game better.. but do not see the consequences it has.
Imagine the skills, sets and mechanics of ESO as a game of chess against a good opponent. If you go on offensive with your Knights and take out couple of Pawns (defensive sets), be ready to lose your Knights (offensive sets and/or damage skills nerfed).
Dont think i can say it in a more simple and constructive way anymore.
I guess people are more prone to spread animosity when they hide in anonymity.
You fail to see how a game that offers absolutely no incentive to get better doesn't get boring with time?
Even comparing it with chess is laughable, the chess equivalent to brp weapons would be that a toddler can draw with Magnus just by throwing the board away and then say he could do the same.
There aren't any sets neither a single 2pc or a 5pc set which come close to brp weapons.
Other defensive 5pc sets like swift offer 1/3rd of the mitigation major protection does.
Pariah at best adds 13k resistances which means ~20% damage mitigation when ignoring all other things.
Same with major vitality there is nothing that could compete and there is no opportunity cost for running them.
I run 2 offensive sets+bloodspawn+ brp Dw with no drawback at all.
Anyone not running brp weapons on specs who benefit form them is playing an inferior build.
Animosity? Oh please.. you and the op were the ones calling people "inferior" who use "training wheels" sets/skills.
And now you say you are using the same "training wheel" and thus.. being one of the "inferior" people? But since "inferior people" live longer than they should with those sets (that you use), your whole point here is to.. nerf yourself?
Okay..
If was not this lazy, i`d attach the picture of a cat putting its paw on top your hand saying it is time to stop posting now. Because asking to nerf yourself and after that everyone else (pve also) with offensive nerfs, maybe its better to think this through again?
So you still haven't manned up...
I'm not going to hinder myself that much by not running brp weapons in a patch where everyone else is running them. But i will do everything to get them removed from the game so inferior people get the clapping they deserve.
Hope i won`t be "manning up" ever if that includes loss of basic logics since it seems hard for you to admit that:
1. After this you will go after the next thing that makes someone survive your "clapping" for more than.. how many seconds it was they are allowed to live?
2. Once there is nothing left to use to survive said "clapping", the "inferior" people will demand your offensive damage be heavily nerfed and in that process also making pvp AND pve suffer of said nerfs/cost changes.
3. You realize after nerfs that it takes exactly the same amount of time now with your nerfed offensive skills to do "clapping" on the "inferior" people than before you started all of this.
So again i ask.. why? Is it really that hard to admit possibly being wrong or that cannot see consequences for longer time than 1 patch?
People often blame ZOS when they do some changes and go all "well, you did not think this through did you?" and "Why you never listen?" ..well how about thinking this through thoroughly yourself?
But tell you what. Lets make a deal, i`ll accept nerfs to these 2 things if you and your mateys after it stop there and not go after just more and more things.. but i know you will. Nothing is ever enough until both pvp and pve community just dies out and only group at empty Cyrodiil is your crew wheeling around on your ram.
Do you think the people who you call "inferior" play this game to be your AP farm? If they die in 1 second repeatedly they either leave or go in mass to demand nerfs to the things that kill them that fast, and nerfs happen fast when big enough mass demands them. How can you just not admit this would happen?
So, you would end up demolishing offensive skills/sets many of us like in that process - why would i and others have to suffer that just because you and your buddies have problems killing someone fast enough to your standards?
I have a better deal, you tell me your @name, I'll go for a duel with you.
I don't want to waste my time with someone who isn't even confident enough for take responsibility for his claims in game
That sweet moment when you see the one you have a debate with ripping their shirt off and running towards you in anger when they have no intellectual arguments to support their opinion.
Calm down lil buddy and take your chill pill with the strawberry yoghurt your mommy bought.
Also, its her "claims" and i am pretty sure you know me in game or knew, pvp community.. it is not that big and there is not that many solo & small scale "grils" that been a ballgroup healer before that for years. I`ll leave it at that. And hey, i`m a kind person but i like to trigger those who cannot see what some changes do in the long run. Love this game too much and so many friends left already, i was away for a bit too.. but here i am trying to defend the game with sharp fingernails.
So do not take things personally.
Oh so someone from Prootch, huehuehuehue and you dare to write anything on the forums
Wrong guess.
Played on a group that did all 3 alliances. But it got old, some dear friends left, the usual story.. I never personally anyways liked the switching many times a week, but there was fun and cool people.
Nowadays sticking to 1 alliance always (unless it gets too dominant and not enough good fights at the times i play so i then switch after campaigns end to the underdog what comes to population on my hours of playing).
But, no need to derail this into me, still waiting for that logical answer to the facts i said.
You know it will happen exactly like i said, heavy nerfs to defensive options will lead to heavy nerfs to offensive options, but instead of just admitting it you chose the "meet me at the parking lot near the trailer park after school so i`ll beat yo up huehuehue".
If one sees 2 people having a difference in opinion and argument about it and then eventually with nothing to back up their claims the other gets aggressive and tries to force their view as the truth with a fight.. you know who won the argument and who got their ego hurt. Just saying.
No need to go caveman rage though, we all play this game together and i`d atleast assume that you know i am thinking for the best to this game, so even if we do not agree on this thing.. no need to start any forum propaganda on me thank you. I have very sharp tongue and fingernails if you wanna go there, be warned.
Awesome friday to you and everyone else too!
5 -
Qbiken✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭MartiniDaniels wrote: »Facts:
1. BRP weapons were added in U20.
2. Average tankiness sharply increased in U24.
Conclusion - BRP weapons are reason for increased tankiness 1 year after their appearance
/s
/facepalm
Another facts:
1. Dots&onslaught&dizzy were buffed to OP level in U23. Fear became available to everyone. Healing was buffed to match all this;
2. To survive dots&onslaught&fear spam, people started using very tanky builds which still have enough offensive power due to dots&onslaught&dizzy being OP;
3. Dots&onslaught&dizzy were severely nerfed in U24. Healing was untouched, but turn evil still here, people still run same tanky builds they are used too in U23 to survive long enough during glitchy barely cc-breakable fear...
4. Tanks can't kill tanks anymore. Conclusion - play smart and invest more in damage??? Use mechanical acuity, use balorgh instead of bloodspawn, use counterattacks?? No! Nerf everything masses use, so we can quietly theorycraft another broken OP meta builds and enjoy them sitting in resource towers, one shotting solo randoms with group bursts coordinated in voice. Inferior randoms dared to use proactive defense and mobile builds, this is unacceptable, nerf, nerf, nerf!
Did you miss all the feedback that was given in U20 regarding how BRP DW and Resto was extremely overperforming??? + The average tankiness increased long before U20.......
I want them nerfed/reworked because I think powerful buffs (you can't neglect that major protection and vitality are very powerful buffs) should be brought through class abilities/ultimate, and not some easy obtainable gear. It removes class uniqueness and the initiative to bring a wide variety to different types of content.
You want major protection for you and/or your group? Bring a warden that can use permafrost in the right situations, aka more tacticallyusage (instead of having easy access whenever you want with brp dw).
You need major vitality to outheal damage? Then bring a nightblade or two that can use Soul Siphon at the right moments (compared to having easy access whenever).
These are just examples, but my point is that powerful buffs and debuffs should be attached to class abilites/ultimates that needs to be used more tactically (the more powerful buff/debuff, the lower uptime), instead of items/gear that everyone easily can get.4 -
BohnT2✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Moonsorrow wrote: »Moonsorrow wrote: »Moonsorrow wrote: »Moonsorrow wrote: »Moonsorrow wrote: »Moonsorrow wrote: »Moonsorrow wrote: »JumpmanLane wrote: »Dude, its the same 5-6 people complaining about these sets over and over and over, all from the same discord chat, and it's getting old. I can see how they would be annoying in Cyrodil, and I get the frustration, but you can't have every single set that gives someone an advantage nerfed. It just starts a whole new chain reaction that ends with yet another post to nerf yet another set, and nothing ever changes. People will ALWAYS find something to crutch on, no matter how much you take away. The only thing you can do to equalize things is to just give everyone nothing but sticks and see how much faster one person can wave theirs at the other.
In the interest of working with the nerflings however, since they always seem to eventually get their way in this game, what if the staff skill got changed to only affect another player, rather than potentially the one who cast it? That way, it would require a pocket healer to receive the buff, which could be easily killed before killing the dd, since pocket healer wouldn't have the benefit of the buff. This would allow it to still be used in PvE where it's not "hurting" anyone's gameplay.
Actually the entire crux of small scale players want both of these nerfed. I would not expect a zerg healer to understand.The post isn't even about 1% of all available sets yet people start to yell at OP how he wants to remove every single thing from the game.
Everyone trying to defend brp dw and resto at this point should just be brushed off with "ok boomer"
There's no point listing the arguments again for people who can't grasp that 30% more healing/ less damage taken on demand with no cooldown is unbalanced
Major Vitality? For how long. Geeze Brp is really just good in a duel. In open world GUARDS would get the rapid regen I popped off it.
Look add some damage to those crappy high mitigation/ high sustain builds ya running. You can’t kill nobody because YOU built that way!
I am everyday waiting for that moment when they realize that chain reaction these nerfs cause and have been for a while now. The game does not change into their favor or what they imagine it will be if these 2 sets get destroyed. It just leads to demanding the next sets nerfed and nothing changes except others demanded the skills they use nerfed since no way to defend more than 1 second. ZOS wants people to enjoy pvp, it their calculations that enjoyment should take longer than 1 second i`d guess even without knowing full details. But them making ganking harder and harder tells about that.
Its almost comical they do not understand it. Can any of you who want these (and many other things) nerfed honestly answer and describe what would happen if your wish came true? How would the people using these now react and adapt? I know that deep down you know the answer.
Or.. some might have had a dream or illusion that this would turn pvp into balanced paradise where you can kill "inferior" players in a second. I can tell you, people would adapt..
The people with now 25-26k hp with 1 damage set and special weapons would just go like 30-40k hp on Pariah, Plague Doctor; Blood Spawn, Troll King, Malubeth, neeerff soRc, Engine Guardian neeerff, Nerf Reactive, and other tanky ways to use more hp/regen as buffer to not die instead of Major Protection, shielding proc sets.. so then go demand them nerfed next, huh? "Yes yes NeeeEEEeRf!"
Should it be just better to stop this chain reaction already..? Does the nerf demands stop when pvp combat result is always just decided by numbers or who gets to hit first because everyone is allowed to only wear paper armor?
And i know personally these items have their uses yes and are strong. But, again - you are wrong if you think taking these out will change the game into something you vision it to become. You know you would be here to make similar posts soon just about something else, on and on. If still cannot accept that fact, you know its about ego then.
I wish a good weekend for everyone though since its like almost friday here, have fun whatever you all are doing! Good discussions ladies and gentlemen!
What a good idea to list sets like Trollking and pariah which are both overtuned aswell and have been all the time.
First of all the change of yeeting brp resto /DW would remove 2 sets which are on a power level that not a single set alone can reach, not even 2 sets come close not even talking about the opportunity costs that are required to run sets worth of 7 pieces on both bars.
The weapons offer the best defence out there with little to no opportunity cost.
People going 35-40k health +pariah will still not survive as long and in order to do so they give up huge amounts of sustain and damage.
Inferior players deserve to be crushed every single time till they actually learn to play and not have sets keep them alive or get kills for them.
They are inferior
Well to be honest, personally i`ve not had any troubles on killing anyone using BRP Resto/DW, so i guess that more just tells about you and your buddies having inferiority issues? Tip: Have you tried CC and having damage on your build?
Oh well, see you on Cyrodiil again - will try to remember doing /shovel emote or something the next time ending your inferior gameplay.
The stubborness on this topic is too strong so time for this witch to fly away from it with her vBRP broom.
Maybe i`ll go touch someone with Vamp Drain, the bane of ESO. Oohlala...
I doubt i have ever seen you in game but keep up your baiting because you're too stubborn to call out your training wheels.
Also 10/10 reply to the topic as you have yet to add anything constructive.
My forum name obviously is not same as ingame @.
There is no baiting in trying to defend the health of this game for everyone. I actually like to see everyone having fun, be it at pvp or pve. I actually starting to think you believe your vision would make the game better.. but do not see the consequences it has.
Imagine the skills, sets and mechanics of ESO as a game of chess against a good opponent. If you go on offensive with your Knights and take out couple of Pawns (defensive sets), be ready to lose your Knights (offensive sets and/or damage skills nerfed).
Dont think i can say it in a more simple and constructive way anymore.
I guess people are more prone to spread animosity when they hide in anonymity.
You fail to see how a game that offers absolutely no incentive to get better doesn't get boring with time?
Even comparing it with chess is laughable, the chess equivalent to brp weapons would be that a toddler can draw with Magnus just by throwing the board away and then say he could do the same.
There aren't any sets neither a single 2pc or a 5pc set which come close to brp weapons.
Other defensive 5pc sets like swift offer 1/3rd of the mitigation major protection does.
Pariah at best adds 13k resistances which means ~20% damage mitigation when ignoring all other things.
Same with major vitality there is nothing that could compete and there is no opportunity cost for running them.
I run 2 offensive sets+bloodspawn+ brp Dw with no drawback at all.
Anyone not running brp weapons on specs who benefit form them is playing an inferior build.
Animosity? Oh please.. you and the op were the ones calling people "inferior" who use "training wheels" sets/skills.
And now you say you are using the same "training wheel" and thus.. being one of the "inferior" people? But since "inferior people" live longer than they should with those sets (that you use), your whole point here is to.. nerf yourself?
Okay..
If was not this lazy, i`d attach the picture of a cat putting its paw on top your hand saying it is time to stop posting now. Because asking to nerf yourself and after that everyone else (pve also) with offensive nerfs, maybe its better to think this through again?
So you still haven't manned up...
I'm not going to hinder myself that much by not running brp weapons in a patch where everyone else is running them. But i will do everything to get them removed from the game so inferior people get the clapping they deserve.
Hope i won`t be "manning up" ever if that includes loss of basic logics since it seems hard for you to admit that:
1. After this you will go after the next thing that makes someone survive your "clapping" for more than.. how many seconds it was they are allowed to live?
2. Once there is nothing left to use to survive said "clapping", the "inferior" people will demand your offensive damage be heavily nerfed and in that process also making pvp AND pve suffer of said nerfs/cost changes.
3. You realize after nerfs that it takes exactly the same amount of time now with your nerfed offensive skills to do "clapping" on the "inferior" people than before you started all of this.
So again i ask.. why? Is it really that hard to admit possibly being wrong or that cannot see consequences for longer time than 1 patch?
People often blame ZOS when they do some changes and go all "well, you did not think this through did you?" and "Why you never listen?" ..well how about thinking this through thoroughly yourself?
But tell you what. Lets make a deal, i`ll accept nerfs to these 2 things if you and your mateys after it stop there and not go after just more and more things.. but i know you will. Nothing is ever enough until both pvp and pve community just dies out and only group at empty Cyrodiil is your crew wheeling around on your ram.
Do you think the people who you call "inferior" play this game to be your AP farm? If they die in 1 second repeatedly they either leave or go in mass to demand nerfs to the things that kill them that fast, and nerfs happen fast when big enough mass demands them. How can you just not admit this would happen?
So, you would end up demolishing offensive skills/sets many of us like in that process - why would i and others have to suffer that just because you and your buddies have problems killing someone fast enough to your standards?
I have a better deal, you tell me your @name, I'll go for a duel with you.
I don't want to waste my time with someone who isn't even confident enough for take responsibility for his claims in game
That sweet moment when you see the one you have a debate with ripping their shirt off and running towards you in anger when they have no intellectual arguments to support their opinion.
Calm down lil buddy and take your chill pill with the strawberry yoghurt your mommy bought.
Also, its her "claims" and i am pretty sure you know me in game or knew, pvp community.. it is not that big and there is not that many solo & small scale "grils" that been a ballgroup healer before that for years. I`ll leave it at that. And hey, i`m a kind person but i like to trigger those who cannot see what some changes do in the long run. Love this game too much and so many friends left already, i was away for a bit too.. but here i am trying to defend the game with sharp fingernails.
So do not take things personally.
Oh so someone from Prootch, huehuehuehue and you dare to write anything on the forums
Wrong guess.
Played on a group that did all 3 alliances. But it got old, some dear friends left, the usual story.. I never personally anyways liked the switching many times a week, but there was fun and cool people.
Nowadays sticking to 1 alliance always (unless it gets too dominant and not enough good fights at the times i play so i then switch after campaigns end to the underdog what comes to population on my hours of playing).
But, no need to derail this into me, still waiting for that logical answer to the facts i said.
You know it will happen exactly like i said, heavy nerfs to defensive options will lead to heavy nerfs to offensive options, but instead of just admitting it you chose the "meet me at the parking lot near the trailer park after school so i`ll beat yo up huehuehue".
If one sees 2 people having a difference in opinion and argument about it and then eventually with nothing to back up their claims the other gets aggressive and tries to force their view as the truth with a fight.. you know who won the argument and who got their ego hurt. Just saying.
No need to go caveman rage though, we all play this game together and i`d atleast assume that you know i am thinking for the best to this game, so even if we do not agree on this thing.. no need to start any forum propaganda on me thank you. I have very sharp tongue and fingernails if you wanna go there, be warned.
Awesome friday to you and everyone else too!
So that leaves maybe UF, ZS.
You ever played with Miruku?0 -
MartiniDaniels✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭MartiniDaniels wrote: »Facts:
1. BRP weapons were added in U20.
2. Average tankiness sharply increased in U24.
Conclusion - BRP weapons are reason for increased tankiness 1 year after their appearance
/s
/facepalm
Another facts:
1. Dots&onslaught&dizzy were buffed to OP level in U23. Fear became available to everyone. Healing was buffed to match all this;
2. To survive dots&onslaught&fear spam, people started using very tanky builds which still have enough offensive power due to dots&onslaught&dizzy being OP;
3. Dots&onslaught&dizzy were severely nerfed in U24. Healing was untouched, but turn evil still here, people still run same tanky builds they are used too in U23 to survive long enough during glitchy barely cc-breakable fear...
4. Tanks can't kill tanks anymore. Conclusion - play smart and invest more in damage??? Use mechanical acuity, use balorgh instead of bloodspawn, use counterattacks?? No! Nerf everything masses use, so we can quietly theorycraft another broken OP meta builds and enjoy them sitting in resource towers, one shotting solo randoms with group bursts coordinated in voice. Inferior randoms dared to use proactive defense and mobile builds, this is unacceptable, nerf, nerf, nerf!
Did you miss all the feedback that was given in U20 regarding how BRP DW and Resto was extremely overperforming??? + The average tankiness increased long before U20.......
I want them nerfed/reworked because I think powerful buffs (you can't neglect that major protection and vitality are very powerful buffs) should be brought through class abilities/ultimate, and not some easy obtainable gear. It removes class uniqueness and the initiative to bring a wide variety to different types of content.
You want major protection for you and/or your group? Bring a warden that can use permafrost in the right situations, aka more tacticallyusage (instead of having easy access whenever you want with brp dw).
You need major vitality to outheal damage? Then bring a nightblade or two that can use Soul Siphon at the right moments (compared to having easy access whenever).
These are just examples, but my point is that powerful buffs and debuffs should be attached to class abilites/ultimates that needs to be used more tactically (the more powerful buff/debuff, the lower uptime), instead of items/gear that everyone easily can get.
Well, first of all we have different PVP modes and nothing prevents ZOS from creating a slightly different rulesets. If we'll take fact that BGs are smallscale territory, then rules should be balanced around 4-man groups. If we talk about Cyro, it is territory of big groups and of solo players, and fact that smallscales have troubles focusing down properly buffed single players before they roll-dodge back to LOS shouldn't be a balancing factor.
I agree that synergy of BRP sets with their abilities is over budget. But ok, let's remove them, then turn evil combos will become unmanageable. Which will lead to nerf of turn evil. Jabs&shalks are kept in check now by major evasion, only source of which is blade cloak (if you are DK in heavy armor for example)... but DW is meh after stinging slashes nerf, so if BRP DW will be removed, jabs&shalks will become OP and there will be ton of requests for nerf.
People whined on wings, and those were nerfed to be barely useful in terms of U21-U23 meta. But in U24 we again have direct damage spammable meta for ranged builds, and wings are becoming more powerful then they were before nerf, in my opinion. Because you literally clap wings, use BRP DW and majority will simply stop even trying to damage you. But not all, some still damage and even manage to pierce through. And I'm really curious how non-DK non-BRP DW melee players survive bursts of skilled glass cannon sorcs. Because those bursts are crazy powerful in U24, if such sorc will ambush me unbuffed I will die in couple of seconds. 8k frags against 30k spell resists is usual deal in recap. That's why I am running clapping wings and spamming quick cloak, just to avoid such ambush.
So problem is more complex then this 2 sets... we have majority of tanky players who can't kill each other and minority of skilled glass cannons who melt unbuffed people from huge range in couple of GCDs even without cc. I really don't envy devs right now, U25 will be very hard to balance.1 -
p00tx✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭What is seriously making me legit laugh at all of this is the seriousness behind these demands. This is an MMORPG, not an e-sport shooter. No one playing this game will ever be taken seriously in e-sports, and other gamers playing other games actually laugh at those of us who take this more seriously. No PvP streamer from this game will ever become famous outside of this community. No one needs to be strong armed into "getting better" and the game doesn't need to be stripped down to suit the desires of a VERY small handful of players who have lost sight of the whole point of this game. It's not to serve their need to make a fantasy game into some sort of pseudo competitive battlefield. Just chill, take a deep breath, and relax. It's not that serious.PC/Xbox NA
Unchained | Unstoppable | Mindmender | Swashbuckler Supreme | Planes Breaker | Dawnbringer | Godslayer | Immortal Redeemer | Gryphon Heart | Tick-tock Tormentor | Dro-m'Athra Destroyer | Stormproof | Grand Overlord | Grand Mastercrafter | Master Grappler | Tamriel Hero7 -
Rave the Histborn✭✭✭✭✭
✭
I agree and to keep it even we should make it so PVE doesn't have access to any of those either that way all of the player base is on an even base and there's no reason for me to not be able to use the gear I ran. Maybe if they could also make the gear specialized too since we're going that far so that a NB can only wear NB armor etc.
This would also get us away from posts about DPS/sustain because instead of getting free cheap resources/dmg all of those PVE players can finally lose their crutches and learn to rotate and animation cancel.
Sounds good right?0 -
NaomiHutt✭✭✭✭Instead of making threads saying this needs nerfed and that needs nerfed, try making a thread saying these all need buffed because they are currently underperforming compared to the thing you are trying to nerf.
We have had nothing but nerfs as of late, can we not have something buffed?Edited by NaomiHutt on November 15, 2019 6:09PM3 -
grannas211✭✭✭✭✭
✭People really just be attacking OP.
gamergirldk wrote: »nerf everything and lets all do unarmed combat....
Also these kinda comments are so idiotic. There’s a big difference between just nerfing to nerf and nerfing stupid ass things that were horrible ideas to begin with.0 -
Rave the Histborn✭✭✭✭✭
✭Moonsorrow wrote: »2. Once there is nothing left to use to survive said "clapping", the "inferior" people will demand your offensive damage be heavily nerfed and in that process also making pvp AND pve suffer of said nerfs/cost changes.
3. You realize after nerfs that it takes exactly the same amount of time now with your nerfed offensive skills to do "clapping" on the "inferior" people than before you started all of this.
But isn´t the point that the devs when looking at pvp make the concious decision to not let this happen?
People have been sugarcoated by easy to use defensive mechanics way too long. They need to be brought to the mindset when entering pvp that they will eventually die to other players - and that this is an ok thing to happen. That´s why they enter a pvp zone in the first place.
Not dying as a main goal for the player is an antithesis of pvp and people need to be taught that again. This goes for smallscale "roxxors" aswell as the "trashcans".
Building to live instead of to kill is not building for pvp. It´s carebear mentality - no matter who does it.
Mechanics should not endorse not dying. They should make it prohibitively difficult over extended periods of time.
100000000% agree
You can see the mentality in PVE with this patch, people with no sustain wondering why they run out of mats, people wondering why they can't just click something with a dot and instagib it. It doesn't benefit them because now that they're gone instead of changing their build slightly or play style they go straight to the forums.3 -
p00tx✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Rave the Histborn wrote: »
You can see the mentality in PVE with this patch, people with no sustain wondering why they run out of mats, people wondering why they can't just click something with a dot and instagib it. It doesn't benefit them because now that they're gone instead of changing their build slightly or play style they go straight to the forums.
We've all already changed our builds in PvE because we're not morons. It didn't make this trashcan of a patch any less ridiculous, so yeah, we did go to the forums AFTER race changing to Breton [insert other sustain race here] and rekitting healers for more sustain. Nice uninformed dig though.Moonsorrow wrote: »2. Once there is nothing left to use to survive said "clapping", the "inferior" people will demand your offensive damage be heavily nerfed and in that process also making pvp AND pve suffer of said nerfs/cost changes.
3. You realize after nerfs that it takes exactly the same amount of time now with your nerfed offensive skills to do "clapping" on the "inferior" people than before you started all of this.
But isn´t the point that the devs when looking at pvp make the concious decision to not let this happen?
People have been sugarcoated by easy to use defensive mechanics way too long. They need to be brought to the mindset when entering pvp that they will eventually die to other players - and that this is an ok thing to happen. That´s why they enter a pvp zone in the first place.
Not dying as a main goal for the player is an antithesis of pvp and people need to be taught that again. This goes for smallscale "roxxors" aswell as the "trashcans".
Building to live instead of to kill is not building for pvp. It´s carebear mentality - no matter who does it.
Mechanics should not endorse not dying. They should make it prohibitively difficult over extended periods of time.
While I 100% agree with the bolded sentiment, the majority of solutions can't be applied to this game because unfortunately PvP and PvE share the same gear and skills, and stripping defensive abilities from PvP would cause massive problems in PvE. The only solution I can see is to remove all major buffs and debuffs from PvP via battle spirit, and only make certain ones available through the Assault or Support skill lines, like Major Expedition (rapids).
I do firmly believe though that players will still crutch where they can, and will find other creative ways to build for super survival. I'm sick to death of coming up against immortal stambois in heavy armor who can still hit like trucks and move at super speed because ZOS can't properly balance specs any more than they can balance arenas (PvP/PvE), but I don't ever expect that to change, so I've just learned to walk away and find another target. It's just not that big of a deal any more.Edited by p00tx on November 15, 2019 7:03PMPC/Xbox NA
Unchained | Unstoppable | Mindmender | Swashbuckler Supreme | Planes Breaker | Dawnbringer | Godslayer | Immortal Redeemer | Gryphon Heart | Tick-tock Tormentor | Dro-m'Athra Destroyer | Stormproof | Grand Overlord | Grand Mastercrafter | Master Grappler | Tamriel Hero4 -
Moonsorrow✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Moonsorrow wrote: »2. Once there is nothing left to use to survive said "clapping", the "inferior" people will demand your offensive damage be heavily nerfed and in that process also making pvp AND pve suffer of said nerfs/cost changes.
3. You realize after nerfs that it takes exactly the same amount of time now with your nerfed offensive skills to do "clapping" on the "inferior" people than before you started all of this.
But isn´t the point that the devs when looking at pvp make the concious decision to not let this happen?
People have been sugarcoated by easy to use defensive mechanics way too long. They need to be brought to the mindset when entering pvp that they will eventually die to other players - and that this is an ok thing to happen. That´s why they enter a pvp zone in the first place.
Not dying as a main goal for the player is an antithesis of pvp and people need to be taught that again. This goes for smallscale "roxxors" aswell as the "trashcans".
Building to live instead of to kill is not building for pvp. It´s carebear mentality - no matter who does it.
Mechanics should not endorse not dying. They should make it prohibitively difficult over extended periods of time.
Concious decisions? I wish it was so..i sort of want to trust and believe on their decision making process, but part of me always reminds me of some big up and down changes that been following also the forum/reddit Cry-O-Meter trends sort of..
I am not the only one that has said the "ZOS does listen to feedback, but it is feedback you might not agree with" when some people keep asking "whats up with all the massive changes" and the "Why ZOS not listen??!" on some patch notes.
They do listen. So gotta be here also myself, posting my own opinions for my own gameplay experience and for my likeminded friends, to atleast try to get the other side of arguments in the open so there will not be even by accident some nerf post after another where seemingly everyone agrees and thus ZOS would take it as some 100% agreed feedback from players.
And Derra, with you can have a civil discussion both here and on Discord, always reasonable and if you have to make a point, it is done like a perfectly executed Frags combo. So i like your style. Someone i can talk with without having to do forum Incaps with words.
What makes me go on a warpath is when i see some call others "inferior" for using some set and then they admit they are using the same set. It`s priceless in entertainment value, for sure you agree?
Also, i`ve all this time agreed on the strenght of these weapons. I have both, in several traits, all golded and in good use. Lately focused more on mag toons so been using BRP resto on Magblade and Magcro (support/synergy) only. Latest build on Magblade i took it off (went Marauder`s Haste back bar instead with Perfected Asylum inferno front, its been fun) and done well, so can live without it.
Oh and i agree on your view, i do not exactly like the 20+ people tankzergs with 30-40k hp with near zero damage that roam around almost immortal, unless can steamroll them with coordinated ball/synergy bombing. But, i also can understand that they also just wanna play with their friends, siege keeps with Siegemaster Title on.. and that they are not just our prey while we feed on them like some wolfpack.
My view on this is though that we been having things that kill really tanky people, but those things get nerfed all the time, because people wanna live a bit longer to not just feel like being farmed and.. if we nerf more defensive things, there will be then more nerfs to offensive things. Since ZOS does not want the casual people who like to "rp siege keeps with buddies" to stop playing. All those people buy Crown stuff, to look cool while playing with their big group.
So my conclusion is, better stop the cycle before it just gets worse, for us at pvp and for pve too. You know propably as i said it on Discord also, that if ESO was still with same situation what comes to combat (only QoL added) as we were in Summerset launch (only the first iteration of Sloads adjusted lol), things would be rather great. I mean, all that i did talk about it said they agreed that it was more fun then, both at pve and pvp.
So no, i am not an advocate of even more tanky meta. I just try to not get things even worse, since there is a big possibility to make wrong adjustments again and everyone will go totally nuts when reading the next big patch notes.
Hope that all explains a bit of my reasoning. True problem imo was the nerfing of dots back but leaving the strong hots like Regen and Vigor, some crazy heals numbers with all the easy buffs, even without BRP resto. And Major Defile sources are not that much available anymore to counter that. Still, burst is huge. If many of those who complain would use Synergy bombs, they would not even see much of BRP resto bubbles doing nothing, since when last time we did group, there was like 20 people dead in 3 seconds and many of them dedicated healers with BRP resto.
Where it can be sometimes problematic is the bgs 4vs4vs4 if everyone plays too carefully. So its more about just not wanting to die.
And hey, i am guilty of that too. KillCounter addon did it for me when i installed it, when i got 100+ kills and 0 deaths, i tend to try keeping a "perfect session" and always escape if risk of dying lol until its bedtime.
Edited by Moonsorrow on November 15, 2019 7:53PM3 -
SenpaiNFT✭✭✭✭What is seriously making me legit laugh at all of this is the seriousness behind these demands. This is an MMORPG, not an e-sport shooter. No one playing this game will ever be taken seriously in e-sports, and other gamers playing other games actually laugh at those of us who take this more seriously. No PvP streamer from this game will ever become famous outside of this community. No one needs to be strong armed into "getting better" and the game doesn't need to be stripped down to suit the desires of a VERY small handful of players who have lost sight of the whole point of this game. It's not to serve their need to make a fantasy game into some sort of pseudo competitive battlefield. Just chill, take a deep breath, and relax. It's not that serious.
Added absolutely nothing to the discussion of why or why not BRP weapons should be nerfed. Please refrain from posting banter in the future. Thank you.Edited by SenpaiNFT on November 15, 2019 7:56PM1 -
p00tx✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭What is seriously making me legit laugh at all of this is the seriousness behind these demands. This is an MMORPG, not an e-sport shooter. No one playing this game will ever be taken seriously in e-sports, and other gamers playing other games actually laugh at those of us who take this more seriously. No PvP streamer from this game will ever become famous outside of this community. No one needs to be strong armed into "getting better" and the game doesn't need to be stripped down to suit the desires of a VERY small handful of players who have lost sight of the whole point of this game. It's not to serve their need to make a fantasy game into some sort of pseudo competitive battlefield. Just chill, take a deep breath, and relax. It's not that serious.
Added absolutely nothing to the discussion of why or why not BRP weapons should be nerfed. Please refrain from posting banter in the future. Thank you.
I don't really think that's up to you, is it?Edited by p00tx on November 15, 2019 8:22PMPC/Xbox NA
Unchained | Unstoppable | Mindmender | Swashbuckler Supreme | Planes Breaker | Dawnbringer | Godslayer | Immortal Redeemer | Gryphon Heart | Tick-tock Tormentor | Dro-m'Athra Destroyer | Stormproof | Grand Overlord | Grand Mastercrafter | Master Grappler | Tamriel Hero7 -
SenpaiNFT✭✭✭✭What is seriously making me legit laugh at all of this is the seriousness behind these demands. This is an MMORPG, not an e-sport shooter. No one playing this game will ever be taken seriously in e-sports, and other gamers playing other games actually laugh at those of us who take this more seriously. No PvP streamer from this game will ever become famous outside of this community. No one needs to be strong armed into "getting better" and the game doesn't need to be stripped down to suit the desires of a VERY small handful of players who have lost sight of the whole point of this game. It's not to serve their need to make a fantasy game into some sort of pseudo competitive battlefield. Just chill, take a deep breath, and relax. It's not that serious.
Added absolutely nothing to the discussion of why or why not BRP weapons should be nerfed. Please refrain from posting banter in the future. Thank you.
I don't really think that's up to you, is it?
It isn’t, that’s why I said please. When people post banter that doesn’t aid to discussion it just makes us as all as conversationalists seem less intelligent. I would like to have intellectual debate here.1 -
p00tx✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭What is seriously making me legit laugh at all of this is the seriousness behind these demands. This is an MMORPG, not an e-sport shooter. No one playing this game will ever be taken seriously in e-sports, and other gamers playing other games actually laugh at those of us who take this more seriously. No PvP streamer from this game will ever become famous outside of this community. No one needs to be strong armed into "getting better" and the game doesn't need to be stripped down to suit the desires of a VERY small handful of players who have lost sight of the whole point of this game. It's not to serve their need to make a fantasy game into some sort of pseudo competitive battlefield. Just chill, take a deep breath, and relax. It's not that serious.
Added absolutely nothing to the discussion of why or why not BRP weapons should be nerfed. Please refrain from posting banter in the future. Thank you.
I don't really think that's up to you, is it?
It isn’t, that’s why I said please. When people post banter that doesn’t aid to discussion it just makes us as all as conversationalists seem less intelligent. I would like to have intellectual debate here.
You already lost the right to claim that intent when you included VERY thinly veiled insults in your comments, like calling yourself a "more skilled" player (as opposed to everyone else, while your buddy called everyone else inferior players), which you might very well be, but your blatant display of egotism makes it very difficult to take anything you say seriously. It might skate under the radar of moderation, but it doesn't escape the notice of the people whose minds you're attempting to change, and insulting your audience is by far the least effective debate method. The fact that you clearly don't think it's an insult is actually pretty disturbing.
This game is made up of a very wide variety of players with a huge range of skill level and ability. You are allegedly at the very top end of that spectrum, and yet you claim to know what is best for the entire rest of the game, even though the vast majority don't play the game in the same manner you do. Everyone else, barring your very small group of friends, is okay with the staff as it is (Take the DW. It's boring trying to keep up Blade Cloak while fighting since all it does is prolong the fight that should be a quick kill), but you continue to insist that it's bad for all of us. Instead of looking at this as a black/white (It exists or doesn't exist) issue, maybe be more creative in finding ways to make this staff less effective in PvP ONLY, and leave it as it is for PvE.Edited by p00tx on November 15, 2019 11:11PMPC/Xbox NA
Unchained | Unstoppable | Mindmender | Swashbuckler Supreme | Planes Breaker | Dawnbringer | Godslayer | Immortal Redeemer | Gryphon Heart | Tick-tock Tormentor | Dro-m'Athra Destroyer | Stormproof | Grand Overlord | Grand Mastercrafter | Master Grappler | Tamriel Hero9 -
SenpaiNFT✭✭✭✭What is seriously making me legit laugh at all of this is the seriousness behind these demands. This is an MMORPG, not an e-sport shooter. No one playing this game will ever be taken seriously in e-sports, and other gamers playing other games actually laugh at those of us who take this more seriously. No PvP streamer from this game will ever become famous outside of this community. No one needs to be strong armed into "getting better" and the game doesn't need to be stripped down to suit the desires of a VERY small handful of players who have lost sight of the whole point of this game. It's not to serve their need to make a fantasy game into some sort of pseudo competitive battlefield. Just chill, take a deep breath, and relax. It's not that serious.
Added absolutely nothing to the discussion of why or why not BRP weapons should be nerfed. Please refrain from posting banter in the future. Thank you.
I don't really think that's up to you, is it?
It isn’t, that’s why I said please. When people post banter that doesn’t aid to discussion it just makes us as all as conversationalists seem less intelligent. I would like to have intellectual debate here.
You already lost the right to claim that intent when you included VERY thinly veiled insults in your comments, like calling yourself a "more skilled" player (as opposed to everyone else, while your buddy called everyone else inferior players), which you might very well be, but your blatant display of egotism makes it very difficult to take anything you say seriously. It might skate under the radar of moderation, but it doesn't escape the notice of the people whose minds you're attempting to change, and insulting your audience is by far the least effective debate method. The fact that you clearly don't think it's an insult is actually pretty disturbing.
This game is made up of a very wide variety of players with a huge range of skill level and ability. You are allegedly at the very top end of that spectrum, and yet you claim to know what is best for the entire rest of the game, even though the vast majority don't play the game in the same manner you do. Everyone else, barring your very small group of friends, is okay with the staff as it is (Take the DW. It's boring trying to keep up Blade Cloak while fighting since all it does is prolong the fight that should be a quick kill), but you continue to insist that it's bad for all of us. Instead of looking at this as a black/white (It exists or doesn't exist) issue, maybe be more creative in finding ways to make this staff less effective in PvP ONLY, and leave it as it is for PvE.
But the point is it is unnecessary in PvE. I have healed vSS HM (and provided proof as such) so know FIRST HAND that the staff is not needed. Sure, it may make things easier, but then again, so did earthgore. It does not change the fact that they should still in fact be nerfed.
As for the first part of your comment, you are simply insinuating that I have such an ego that would imply I am just flat out better then everyone else. Obviously if I then had such an ego as you suggest, I would deny this and say I am simply engaging in intellectual discussion. However other people take it is how they take. But of course this is only if I have aforementioned ego.0 -
p00tx✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭What is seriously making me legit laugh at all of this is the seriousness behind these demands. This is an MMORPG, not an e-sport shooter. No one playing this game will ever be taken seriously in e-sports, and other gamers playing other games actually laugh at those of us who take this more seriously. No PvP streamer from this game will ever become famous outside of this community. No one needs to be strong armed into "getting better" and the game doesn't need to be stripped down to suit the desires of a VERY small handful of players who have lost sight of the whole point of this game. It's not to serve their need to make a fantasy game into some sort of pseudo competitive battlefield. Just chill, take a deep breath, and relax. It's not that serious.
Added absolutely nothing to the discussion of why or why not BRP weapons should be nerfed. Please refrain from posting banter in the future. Thank you.
I don't really think that's up to you, is it?
It isn’t, that’s why I said please. When people post banter that doesn’t aid to discussion it just makes us as all as conversationalists seem less intelligent. I would like to have intellectual debate here.
You already lost the right to claim that intent when you included VERY thinly veiled insults in your comments, like calling yourself a "more skilled" player (as opposed to everyone else, while your buddy called everyone else inferior players), which you might very well be, but your blatant display of egotism makes it very difficult to take anything you say seriously. It might skate under the radar of moderation, but it doesn't escape the notice of the people whose minds you're attempting to change, and insulting your audience is by far the least effective debate method. The fact that you clearly don't think it's an insult is actually pretty disturbing.
This game is made up of a very wide variety of players with a huge range of skill level and ability. You are allegedly at the very top end of that spectrum, and yet you claim to know what is best for the entire rest of the game, even though the vast majority don't play the game in the same manner you do. Everyone else, barring your very small group of friends, is okay with the staff as it is (Take the DW. It's boring trying to keep up Blade Cloak while fighting since all it does is prolong the fight that should be a quick kill), but you continue to insist that it's bad for all of us. Instead of looking at this as a black/white (It exists or doesn't exist) issue, maybe be more creative in finding ways to make this staff less effective in PvP ONLY, and leave it as it is for PvE.
But the point is it is unnecessary in PvE. I have healed vSS HM (and provided proof as such) so know FIRST HAND that the staff is not needed. Sure, it may make things easier, but then again, so did earthgore. It does not change the fact that they should still in fact be nerfed.
As for the first part of your comment, you are simply insinuating that I have such an ego that would imply I am just flat out better then everyone else. Obviously if I then had such an ego as you suggest, I would deny this and say I am simply engaging in intellectual discussion. However other people take it is how they take. But of course this is only if I have aforementioned ego.
For those of us on Console, without the help of all of the myriad add-ons, and without the help of the group healer who has their own things to take care of, it becomes necessary. You and I (and others on Console) live in different worlds in terms of capability potential due to a whole list of factors, so yes, it is very much necessary to me and to many like me.
By your logic, it should be fine to keep it, because you don't need it gone to beat someone. It just becomes easier to do so when they don't have the staff equipped, so it's fine.PC/Xbox NA
Unchained | Unstoppable | Mindmender | Swashbuckler Supreme | Planes Breaker | Dawnbringer | Godslayer | Immortal Redeemer | Gryphon Heart | Tick-tock Tormentor | Dro-m'Athra Destroyer | Stormproof | Grand Overlord | Grand Mastercrafter | Master Grappler | Tamriel Hero1 -
SenpaiNFT✭✭✭✭What is seriously making me legit laugh at all of this is the seriousness behind these demands. This is an MMORPG, not an e-sport shooter. No one playing this game will ever be taken seriously in e-sports, and other gamers playing other games actually laugh at those of us who take this more seriously. No PvP streamer from this game will ever become famous outside of this community. No one needs to be strong armed into "getting better" and the game doesn't need to be stripped down to suit the desires of a VERY small handful of players who have lost sight of the whole point of this game. It's not to serve their need to make a fantasy game into some sort of pseudo competitive battlefield. Just chill, take a deep breath, and relax. It's not that serious.
Added absolutely nothing to the discussion of why or why not BRP weapons should be nerfed. Please refrain from posting banter in the future. Thank you.
I don't really think that's up to you, is it?
It isn’t, that’s why I said please. When people post banter that doesn’t aid to discussion it just makes us as all as conversationalists seem less intelligent. I would like to have intellectual debate here.
You already lost the right to claim that intent when you included VERY thinly veiled insults in your comments, like calling yourself a "more skilled" player (as opposed to everyone else, while your buddy called everyone else inferior players), which you might very well be, but your blatant display of egotism makes it very difficult to take anything you say seriously. It might skate under the radar of moderation, but it doesn't escape the notice of the people whose minds you're attempting to change, and insulting your audience is by far the least effective debate method. The fact that you clearly don't think it's an insult is actually pretty disturbing.
This game is made up of a very wide variety of players with a huge range of skill level and ability. You are allegedly at the very top end of that spectrum, and yet you claim to know what is best for the entire rest of the game, even though the vast majority don't play the game in the same manner you do. Everyone else, barring your very small group of friends, is okay with the staff as it is (Take the DW. It's boring trying to keep up Blade Cloak while fighting since all it does is prolong the fight that should be a quick kill), but you continue to insist that it's bad for all of us. Instead of looking at this as a black/white (It exists or doesn't exist) issue, maybe be more creative in finding ways to make this staff less effective in PvP ONLY, and leave it as it is for PvE.
But the point is it is unnecessary in PvE. I have healed vSS HM (and provided proof as such) so know FIRST HAND that the staff is not needed. Sure, it may make things easier, but then again, so did earthgore. It does not change the fact that they should still in fact be nerfed.
As for the first part of your comment, you are simply insinuating that I have such an ego that would imply I am just flat out better then everyone else. Obviously if I then had such an ego as you suggest, I would deny this and say I am simply engaging in intellectual discussion. However other people take it is how they take. But of course this is only if I have aforementioned ego.
For those of us on Console, without the help of all of the myriad add-ons, and without the help of the group healer who has their own things to take care of, it becomes necessary. You and I (and others on Console) live in different worlds in terms of capability potential due to a whole list of factors, so yes, it is very much necessary to me and to many like me.
By your logic, it should be fine to keep it, because you don't need it gone to beat someone. It just becomes easier to do so when they don't have the staff equipped, so it's fine.
You realize I’m on console yes?0 -
SidraWillowsky✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭But the point is it is unnecessary in PvE. I have healed vSS HM (and provided proof as such) so know FIRST HAND that the staff is not needed. Sure, it may make things easier, but then again, so did earthgore. It does not change the fact that they should still in fact be nerfed.
As for the first part of your comment, you are simply insinuating that I have such an ego that would imply I am just flat out better then everyone else. Obviously if I then had such an ego as you suggest, I would deny this and say I am simply engaging in intellectual discussion. However other people take it is how they take. But of course this is only if I have aforementioned ego.
But stileanima came on and point-blank told you that you were getting help from the other healer when you were healing the ice cages and that it's standard practice when pushing for scores to solo heal that. You later mentioned that you've done it a lot more since then, but all we've got to go on is the video, and the video shows you getting help from the other healer.
6 -
SenpaiNFT✭✭✭✭SidraWillowsky wrote: »But the point is it is unnecessary in PvE. I have healed vSS HM (and provided proof as such) so know FIRST HAND that the staff is not needed. Sure, it may make things easier, but then again, so did earthgore. It does not change the fact that they should still in fact be nerfed.
As for the first part of your comment, you are simply insinuating that I have such an ego that would imply I am just flat out better then everyone else. Obviously if I then had such an ego as you suggest, I would deny this and say I am simply engaging in intellectual discussion. However other people take it is how they take. But of course this is only if I have aforementioned ego.
But stileanima came on and point-blank told you that you were getting help from the other healer when you were healing the ice cages and that it's standard practice when pushing for scores to solo heal that. You later mentioned that you've done it a lot more since then, but all we've got to go on is the video, and the video shows you getting help from the other healer.
Ah well I’m sure next time you heal vSS HM and try it without the resto you’ll be fine. The same way everyone was fine even though they thought they wouldn’t be after earthgore was nerfed.
Furthermore, you’ve taken that video out of context. I did not post that as justification for the resto not being needed (why would i post a video from 3 months ago, a different patch, for such) but rather it was posted in response to an insinuation someone made that I do not even PvE. I simply wanted to make it clear, I have, in fact, experienced healing HM Lokk.Edited by SenpaiNFT on November 16, 2019 1:14AM0
