So, I'm imagining how I might spend my time as a PvE Healer after this patch. Let's see... Say I am a Templar Healer, and I want to keep full uptime of the following skills (numbers in brackets denote the skill duration):

Extended Ritual (24sec)
Elemental Drain (24sec)
Ring of Preservation (20sec)
Mutagen (20sec)
Channeled Focus (20sec)
Illustrious Healing (12sec)
Combat Prayer (8sec)
Elemental Blockade (8sec)

Let's further assume that we want to reach half the group with Mutagen, i.e., we need to keep 3 instances of Mutagen up. (Let's leave aside the weird way in which Mutagen is reapplied to the group. Let's also leave aside the question if I can or cannot sustain the Ring of Preservation.) If I want to keep all of these things up over, say, 2 minutes, then I would need the following number of casts:

5 Extended Ritual
5 Elemental Drain
6 Ring of Preservation
6*3=18 Mutagen
6 Channeled Focus
10 Illustrious Healing
15 Combat Prayer
15 Elemental Blockade

That's a total of 80 skill casts. In 2 minutes, however, I should be able to make some ~105-110 skill casts quite easily. So... What exactly do I do the rest of the time?

Sure, I have two more skill slots, which could be, e.g., Orbs and BoL. But for what follows, say I am actually the group Healer of a reasonably nicely stacked group (it's not always the case ofc, but there are also many situations where it happens) - would I really want to use BoL that often? Probably not. So let's say I don't use BoL (maybe I still have it equipped for emergencies, maybe I have it swapped out for Inner Light, who knows). On the other hand, with the changes to Orbs, it will actually suffice to throw 1 Orb every 20 seconds, so 6 Orbs over the course of 2 minutes (I mean, if my group is stacked, and if everybody can activate the synergy, then it would be enough to throw just 1 Orb on synergy cooldown, i.e., every 20 sec.) Finally, let's throw in ~2 War Horn casts. Quick computation... yeah, 88 skill casst in 2 minutes to keep everything going on cooldown. (Do yourself a favor and don't think about the numbers when you swap out Elemental Blockade for Blood Altar.)

Which leaves some 17-22 casts over 2 minutes where I have absolutely nothing to do! Which means, you are all missing the biggest problem of this patch: ZOS, you really need to allow us to use /danceredguard, /kowtow, /bored, /facepalm,... without interruption mid-fight, otherwise - what the heck are we going to do with all the free time?!

More seriously then in the last paragraph: Of course you might throw in some Heavy Attacks (you might not need this; though maybe you will acutally aim for higher Max Magicka / Spell Damage now in order to compensate the healing nerfs as good as possible and sacrifice your sustain on the way -> Illustrious Healing), maybe there is more than one target to drain (maybe not) and in reality you might recast some abilities a bit earlier, in particular Combat Prayer as it is now the only remaining way to squeeze out a bit more healing in emergency situations (which is kind of stupid by itself if you think about it) - but come on ZOS, be honest with us, no way you have actually thought through what you are planning to implement here!

EDIT: Apparently I missed the changes to Regeneration in my considerations. This skill will be so super useless now... Leaving aside the marginal impact on group HPS, since you can't target the skill to specific players, and since (up to this day) the recasting of Regeneration will not even always give a new HoT to not yet affected players, but instead sometimes only refresh an already existent HoT prior to the end of its duration, it can't even be used as a utility skill in any meaningful way. Unbelievable...

rsantijw13 wrote: »

How about you fix guild banking so i dont spend 2+hours a day depositing or withdrawing? I am not kidding about the amount of time. Thats roughly what it takes for me to deposit and with draw the 2000 or so every day. Wheres that fix? Wheres that quality of life. For me combat can take a back seat to that since when thats fixed I actually would have more time for it.

Separate thing. Requires a total rewrite of a database application. Different developers. Different technical skills.

If the makers of MMO RPGs (Massive Multi-Player Online Role-Playing Games) aren’t quite the worst database application developers in the world, they’re at least on the short list for consideration.
...
Elder Scrolls Online ... on the whole is a great game, but ... may have the most database screw-ups of all.

https://www.dbms2.com/2014/04/16/the-worst-database-developers-in-the-world/

ZOS_BrianWheeler wrote: »

Heyo gang!

We wanted to quickly provide some additional context for many of the combat changes in this update so that everyone has a better idea of our goals.

In Update 23 our main focus was to ensure there was an ultimate point of reference for abilities to properly match up against one another in their respective categories. This provides us with a solid baseline, where all abilities fit within a set of standards/power levels and allows future balancing passes to be much easier and timely.

We're aware that some content has been designed around old functionality of abilities that existed beyond our standards and might need some sort of compromise in regards to how you engage with it and/or how we balance it. This is something we will be watching closely, however we are not averse to the idea that players might need to adjust their current builds such as running more defensive Ultimates rather than offensive ones, or running more survival enhancing sets, rather than pure damage or buff oriented ones. Please also remember that we've introduced some new abilities to help offset the loss of things such as Healing Springs stacking, with abilities like Ring of Preservation, or the large increase to Cleansing Ritual.

As always, we will be monitoring feedback about all the balance changes during this PTS cycle, however we wanted to let everyone know that in a future PTS patch, the synergy from Orbs will not cause the Orb to vanish and can be activated multiple times by anyone not on synergy cool down.

Your goal should be fixing performance only, whats the point intrying to balance a game thats unplayable in the first place. (Console)

You dropped dps by a big margin and you also want us to drop offensive sets and ultimates which will drop dps even further? Casual players have troubles beating content already because a lack of dps, and defensive sets won't help against one shot mechanics. I'm worried the game is being balanced for the top 1% of players.

Not a fan of of the combat changes, I'm a fan of sorc changes and all that but ZOS i thought wrobel was the problem... Seems to be it's everybody there that doesn't engage with the community and allowing us to decide for our combat balance. Idk why combat patch notes are always under NDA, what's secretive and regulating about it? Dont u want more exposure , better for both of us.

More exposure to ideas filtered on combat ideas would mean better results as we carefully review and think them over.

BennyButton wrote: »

@ZOS_BrianWheeler it's day 2 - all raid groups are getting ready to run 10 stamcros with vigor and 2 tanks. How are you going to fix this?

Remove the AoE morph for Vigor, easy as that.

BennyButton wrote: »

Seraphayel wrote: »

BennyButton wrote: »

@ZOS_BrianWheeler it's day 2 - all raid groups are getting ready to run 10 stamcros with vigor and 2 tanks. How are you going to fix this?

Remove the AoE morph for Vigor, easy as that.

Y i k e s...

that aoe morph doesn't matter lol, vigor still can heal for 30k+ on the solo heal morph, that's more healing than a healer not using a templar can do.

Then adjust Vigor altogether, the buffs to it weren’t necessary at all. Don’t make it a bigger problem as it is when only one skill is causing the issue.

I really don't like the changes to healing,
how are sorcs or dks suppost to keep the group alive.
You can't heal 12ppl by spamming your bird or by putting down a super small, super expensive and ineffective aoe.

Why don't you fix the importent buggs and don't make problem which don't exists, WHY!!!

THX ZENI

I'm happy with this patch 👌 why are there so many haters in this game without testing and theorycrafting 🤔 I'm happy because this game is far from death with this mutch effort they put on the game for 5 years 👍 hope they continue until they have a new elders scrolls online game 👏

So if u hate en put negative things on this forum why do you play this game?

BennyButton wrote: »

bulcke10 wrote: »

I'm happy with this patch 👌 why are there so many haters in this game without testing and theorycrafting 🤔 I'm happy because this game is far from death with this mutch effort they put on the game for 5 years 👍 hope they continue until they have a new elders scrolls online game 👏

So if u hate en put negative things on this forum why do you play this game?

this looks really balanced

Nice 👍 there are players who will cry about this.. But they can use it also... 👏 So for me no problem and I still like the game

Are we really surprised this is what happens to PvE when they hire the Lead PvP Designer as the new Combat lead? PvE gets shafted, again. Like always.

This patch makes me sad because 2019 had seen a return of progression Trials guilds for the first time in a long time. Morrowind really killed progression raiding and it took almost 2 years to make a comeback. But this patch feels like Morrowind redux, where progression raiding is gonna take a serious blow. Blanket DPS nerfs, blanket sustain nerfs, blanket healing nerfs. Top groups will quickly adjust but a large body of players, people who are not casual but not hardcore (maybe something like "midcore"), will be hurt the most and get hung out to dry.

BennyButton wrote: »

kylewwefan wrote: »

bulcke10 wrote: »

BennyButton wrote: »

bulcke10 wrote: »

I'm happy with this patch 👌 why are there so many haters in this game without testing and theorycrafting 🤔 I'm happy because this game is far from death with this mutch effort they put on the game for 5 years 👍 hope they continue until they have a new elders scrolls online game 👏

So if u hate en put negative things on this forum why do you play this game?

this looks really balanced

Nice 👍 there are players who will cry about this.. But they can use it also... 👏 So for me no problem and I still like the game

Wow! Is that for real? It looks like a monstrous heal! Wtf are people complaining about? The Stam healer is gonna be ***! Throw out some blood alter, maybe an orb...you can only do one now anyways...can they convert that to one of those highest stat scaling thingy’s? Would I wear Sentinel or bogdans? Stamina necromancer healer is gonna be so good. Just wait and see. Stam Warden healer probably second best healer. Maybe bring a templar for off heals?

stam healing should not be a thing.

Why should the healer role be limited to Magicka? As a dedicated healer I am happy that ZOS finally adds the option for (balanced) Stamina healing builds, it’s long overdue.

bulcke10 wrote: »

BennyButton wrote: »

bulcke10 wrote: »

I'm happy with this patch 👌 why are there so many haters in this game without testing and theorycrafting 🤔 I'm happy because this game is far from death with this mutch effort they put on the game for 5 years 👍 hope they continue until they have a new elders scrolls online game 👏

So if u hate en put negative things on this forum why do you play this game?

this looks really balanced

Nice 👍 there are players who will cry about this.. But they can use it also... 👏 So for me no problem and I still like the game

Then why are you here, whining about people "crying"? Go back to PTS and enjoy it, if it's so good as you say.

Leave this board for people that actually cares for the game and wants to provide contructive feedback to it.