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How many time will you wipe before leaving a PUG?
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munster1404✭✭✭✭I aint scared of that repair bill (no limit)Wipes are nothing. Rinse and repeat until it's time to move on and do something else.0 -
Mureel✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭I aint scared of that repair bill (no limit)
Of your genuinely asking
Public User Group
No, it's Pick Up Group, originally.2 -
DenMoria✭✭✭✭✭
✭Other (please elaborate)I can relate to that! Sounds my average Saturday night out with friends.
Of your genuinely asking
Public User Group
No, it's Pick Up Group, originally.
1 -
antihero727✭✭✭✭✭Just say no to pugsVeldrn-AD Magica Sorc
Bizarro Veldrn-AD Stam Sorc
Antiherro-AD Stam DK
Antihero-AD Magplar
Aww Crit-AD Magblade
AD Since PC beta
On A lag free vacation
for the near and far future0 -
MEBengalsFan2001✭✭✭✭✭ThriceDepends upon your definition of PUG. I know some consider PUG using the quing system and other consider it using chat to join or create a group for a dungeon. Either way, m number of wipes in any MMO is dependent upon how bad things are. If the boss is burning down quickly and the group is ignoring mechanics, than I will give it no more than 3x; sometimes mechanics can be ignore with the right groups. If the group is ignoring mechanics and the boss is not dying quick enough, than I will leave immediately. If the group is doing mechanics and the boss is burning down in a reasonable time I will once again give it 3x. So on average 3 attempts. With guildies and friends I usually stick around until we agree to leave.0
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JinMori✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Other (please elaborate)Everyone needs to learn. F it. It's a game. Who cares?
Tanked VSC last night for 5 hours! One competent (actually awesome, but rezzing all the time and other f-ery, meant group of about 30k, of which he was doing most, if not all!) dps, inexperienced dps and healer (I was doing 30% heals as tank), and yet, we got it.
If you care about people - taking the time is what you do.
I understand that some people have limited time, because of real life etc- but some people are just in a hurry to be toxic toward the next person.
I don't want to die IRL having been that person in game.
'Not like this...'
It's a game where you are playing with other people, and if you waste those people time because you didn't bother to check the basics, then expect some backlash, what is more toxic a natural reaction to substandard performance that is wasting everyone's time, and making the experience less fun, or someone that expects to be carried through the dungeon just because?
People always think about the "fun" of the casual, usually used in place of bad player, which is not necessarily true, and never think of the fun of the player who actually wanna get things done, and that would like that the people who decide to play that content at least knew the basics, when have we started accepting mediocrity as the standard?
If you wanna be a bad player and still do end game content, at least have the decency to either learn the basics, or just play a single player game, so the only one losing will be you.
I don't really get what;s the fun in spending 5 hours into a dungeon wasting time and money for NOTHING, what do you get out of it? The satisfaction of teaching to people who clearly don't give much of a ...?
OH, but you need time to learn this and that,.... you can learn that on easier content, you can learn combat on normal, and then go to vet when you are better, the truth is that you wanna get boosted by much better players.
I think you mean TEACH. Because I'm the teacher in the above scenario and I was glad to oblige.
Toxic exit is over there ->
No, if you read the comment i made before i said that i was willing to put it up if the group was at least decent, but i won;'t teach to players who don;t give a single f.
But you can take the moral highground, even though in the end you are just being used, don;t teach to people who don't care.
Toxic exit, don;t make me laugh, i refuse to accept mediocrity, and i refuse to teach to people who don;t care.
Time is precious, and i prefer spending it with people who care, rather then people who don't and are just using you as a way to get to then end while not putting any effort, but go on, waste your time.
What is wrong with you? Like really what happened to you, or didn't, that makes you think this kind of outlook and behaviour is okay?
Really, I am sorry for whatever happened/didn't happen, to make you such an angry person.
Great argument there dude.
What makes you think that telling people how they should behave as adult is ok? You can believe whatever you want, it can be wrong or right, consequences will occur.
Emotional appeal is not an argument.
What is wrong with you, translated: i don;t have an actual argument, so i;'m gonna say there is something wrong with you, can;t bother making an actual argument, cant even bother to read all the argument, just take some pieces out of it.Edited by JinMori on June 14, 2018 4:09PM0 -
kimaeril✭✭✭Other (please elaborate)It depends. Sometimes I've given it a couple times and others alot more. If we're close each time we wipe then I'll stick around but if after a couple of wipes we're not even close I'll leave. I always let the group know I'm going to leave. I usually let them know I'll give it one more try but then I'm done if we wipe again.0 -
Rain_Greyraven✭✭✭✭✭I love my Guild and never pug problem solved."Civilized men are more discourteous than savages because they know they can be impolite without having their skulls split, as a general thing.”
― Robert E. Howard
So you want to be a game developer? Here is the best way to go about it.0 -
DenMoria✭✭✭✭✭
✭Other (please elaborate)You have a guild? I gave up on mine long ago. All they wanted was money. Wait... that was the Banking Clan in Star Wars. I stand corrected. GO GUILDS!Rain_Greyraven wrote: »I love my Guild and never pug problem solved.
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neverwalk✭✭✭✭TwiceDepends on cp on them, i'm maxed out = 1040, low or no cp gets me chased by boss and i ain't the tank0 -
Marginis✭✭✭✭✭Other (please elaborate)Depends on how they're wiping. Because the game is just being unfair even though they're trying their hardest? I'll give them time. Because they're idiots who are bad and refuse to try not being bad? I'm gone after the first wipe.@Marginis on PC, Senpai Fluffy on Xbox, Founder of Magicka. Also known as Kha'jiri, The Night Mother, Ma'iq, Jane Shepard, Damia, Kintyra, Zoor Do Kest, You, and a few others.0 -
Argruna✭✭✭Other (please elaborate)It depends on the group. I zoned into Scalecaller. Was about to say 'new to this dungeon' when the other 3 stated the same thing. Went oop and then saw the convo go that 'yeah, when I told the last group I was new, they kicked me'; 'I've never been able to do this one because people leave at the beginning.' So I stayed and ate that repair bill because hell, that's the way to do it. Learn, test, poke and figure it out. We completed it.
My breaking points on having me leave a group is impatient tanks. Not the smooth ones, the ones that can pull mob after mob at a reasonable pace but still allow a little breathing room between bosses. Naw I'm talking the ones that have to pull the entire room before the boss into the boss room and suddenly is screaming at us about a wipe because, ya, there were adds in the boss room too so instead of dealing with maybe a few the DD and healers are dealing with all of it on top of a boss. Fake healers, basically the ones that queue as heals but are just people wanting to avoid queue times and expect someone else to heal. And lastly, auto attacking DD. You have skills, freaking use them.1 -
AlnilamE✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭I aint scared of that repair bill (no limit)It depends on the group. I zoned into Scalecaller. Was about to say 'new to this dungeon' when the other 3 stated the same thing. Went oop and then saw the convo go that 'yeah, when I told the last group I was new, they kicked me'; 'I've never been able to do this one because people leave at the beginning.' So I stayed and ate that repair bill because hell, that's the way to do it. Learn, test, poke and figure it out. We completed it.
My breaking points on having me leave a group is impatient tanks. Not the smooth ones, the ones that can pull mob after mob at a reasonable pace but still allow a little breathing room between bosses. Naw I'm talking the ones that have to pull the entire room before the boss into the boss room and suddenly is screaming at us about a wipe because, ya, there were adds in the boss room too so instead of dealing with maybe a few the DD and healers are dealing with all of it on top of a boss. Fake healers, basically the ones that queue as heals but are just people wanting to avoid queue times and expect someone else to heal. And lastly, auto attacking DD. You have skills, freaking use them.
I recently did Scalecaller and Fang Lair with my guild and we were all there for the first time. I think there's a lot of value in going into a situation not knowing what to expect and figuring it out as a group. It's part of the adventure.The Moot Councillor1 -
Ley✭✭✭✭✭
✭Other (please elaborate)Depends on the group, the dungeon, my mood, and how much time I have.
I've been in groups were after 15+ wipes we kept pushing until we completed it. I've been in groups where after 1 wipe I decided I had had enough and quit.
In general, I really do not enjoy group PvE content, so I tend to stay away from it.Leylith - MagSorc | Leyloth - StamPlar | Leynerd - MagPlar | Leylit - StamBlade | Ley Eviticus - StamDK | Leydor - MagDen | Leylum - StamSorc | Leylux - MagBlade0 -
Mureel✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭I aint scared of that repair bill (no limit)I don't disagree with you, but, honestly, you just told a new player to go and watch 1,000 hours of gameplay and research the heck out the game and the mechanics, etc., etc., etc. How is that playing the game? Why? When did playing a game become a research project? Where's the fun in that? I can use the example of Deltia's builds. Love 'em, but, when we get to the part where you "need" or "require" this equipment or that equipment and this level or that is when I get bored. I don't want to be them, I want to be me.
Is it possible that people want to learn, but want to learn by doing? I didn't learn to use software programs or do accounting or compliance work by reading and reading and reading and watching videos. I just did it and learned how. The same thing for doing plumbing and building a bookshelf and putting together that dern IKEA table I bought. Just do it. Some people don't learn by watching others and reading and researching. They just want to play, and being told they're losers and can't do anything right is a bit discouraging.And how, pray tell, do you learn the basics if no-one will tell you what they are and keep changing them every 10 seconds on the whims of those who love to say LTP? While I agree that you probably shouldn't be doing end-game content without knowing the basics, how did you get to end-game without knowing the basics in the first place.
It seems like the contingent of "Play like I tell you to play or get out" and "You are only acceptable if you do it exactly the way we tell you to do it" and the "NO, you are not allowed to play the way you want to, you MUST play the way we tell you to or your out" contingent is going strong.
Personally, I play how I want to play and if you don't like it, fig-off. Don't need you, don't want you. Not chasing achievements, trophies or leaderboards. Just doesn't matter.Everyone needs to learn. F it. It's a game. Who cares?
Tanked VSC last night for 5 hours! One competent (actually awesome, but rezzing all the time and other f-ery, meant group of about 30k, of which he was doing most, if not all!) dps, inexperienced dps and healer (I was doing 30% heals as tank), and yet, we got it.
If you care about people - taking the time is what you do.
I understand that some people have limited time, because of real life etc- but some people are just in a hurry to be toxic toward the next person.
I don't want to die IRL having been that person in game.
'Not like this...'
It's a game where you are playing with other people, and if you waste those people time because you didn't bother to check the basics, then expect some backlash, what is more toxic a natural reaction to substandard performance that is wasting everyone's time, and making the experience less fun, or someone that expects to be carried through the dungeon just because?
People always think about the "fun" of the casual, usually used in place of bad player, which is not necessarily true, and never think of the fun of the player who actually wanna get things done, and that would like that the people who decide to play that content at least knew the basics, when have we started accepting mediocrity as the standard?
If you wanna be a bad player and still do end game content, at least have the decency to either learn the basics, or just play a single player game, so the only one losing will be you.
I don't really get what;s the fun in spending 5 hours into a dungeon wasting time and money for NOTHING, what do you get out of it? The satisfaction of teaching to people who clearly don't give much of a ...?
OH, but you need time to learn this and that,.... you can learn that on easier content, you can learn combat on normal, and then go to vet when you are better, the truth is that you wanna get boosted by much better players.
And you would be completely wrong, i just care if you can do the content, i don;t give much of a f if you are not meta, what i want is for you to do the things you are required to, i will pick up some slack, but i won;t carry people who are just bad.
And you can learn to play in plenty of ways,m you don;t need to do vet content to learn, also, there is something called the internet, years ago you would have been justified when there wasn't any information, but now, there is just no excuse.
If you care you will do it, if you care, you will be willing to spend some time watching and learning the basics, and by the way, it's nowhere near the amount you suggested, it;s more like a few hours at most, and also, no, i did not say that, i never said that you need to learn absolutely everything i said the basics, not everything, just don;t be dead weight if you truly care, you will become better, but if you don;t, there is no point teaching you.
See, this is another problem i have with people, why do you have to take things out of context? even when we only slightly disagree on some things? Basics is basics, i never said , you need to know about EVERYTHING, you need to be pro mlg, otherwise i won;t be teaching you, guys, you need to listen, to what the other person is actually saying, not what you think he's saying.
Perhaps people would be more open to what you have to say if your posts weren't riddled with insults, disdain and your own assumptions that people are 'using' you.
Your posts just give me the creeps to be honest. It's hard to see the forest for the poo.1 -
Merlin13KAGL✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭Other (please elaborate)Depends on a number of factors- How long has the group been there? Is fatigue setting in?
- Is frustration leading to more mistakes?
- Is the group doing everything right but just having an off day?
- Is it something out of your control (Bugged / ZoS'd)
- Is there genuine progress being made?
- Are your party members open to suggestion and constructive criticism?
- Realistically, does your group have what it takes (DPS checks, gear, heals, suvivability, awareness?)
A lot of these things come with experience, and require a group composition with an open mind. There's another way to try just about everything. There is also the point where you know it's an impossibility for any of a number of factors.
I've gotten clears with 'impossible' groups. I've run into brick walls along side certified badasses.
Knowing when you've reached that point to stop can be as important as knowing when to push on.
As a general rule, I'll stay as long as I can if a clear is within sight, offering every bit of wisdom and ingenuity I can. But I'm also not afraid to call it, nor am I afraid to say why.
You usually know everything you need to know by the first trash pull, by the first boss, definitely.
Edited by Merlin13KAGL on June 14, 2018 6:22PMJust because you don't like the way something is doesn't necessarily make it wrong...
Earn it.
IRL'ing for a while for assorted reasons, in forum, and in game.I am neither warm, nor fuzzy...
Probably has checkbox on Customer Service profile that say High Aggro, 99% immunity to BS1 -
Strider__Roshin✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭Other (please elaborate)I don't pug what I can't solo. If it's a dlc dungeon I'm bringing friends and we're getting it done.0 -
JinMori✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Other (please elaborate)I don't disagree with you, but, honestly, you just told a new player to go and watch 1,000 hours of gameplay and research the heck out the game and the mechanics, etc., etc., etc. How is that playing the game? Why? When did playing a game become a research project? Where's the fun in that? I can use the example of Deltia's builds. Love 'em, but, when we get to the part where you "need" or "require" this equipment or that equipment and this level or that is when I get bored. I don't want to be them, I want to be me.
Is it possible that people want to learn, but want to learn by doing? I didn't learn to use software programs or do accounting or compliance work by reading and reading and reading and watching videos. I just did it and learned how. The same thing for doing plumbing and building a bookshelf and putting together that dern IKEA table I bought. Just do it. Some people don't learn by watching others and reading and researching. They just want to play, and being told they're losers and can't do anything right is a bit discouraging.And how, pray tell, do you learn the basics if no-one will tell you what they are and keep changing them every 10 seconds on the whims of those who love to say LTP? While I agree that you probably shouldn't be doing end-game content without knowing the basics, how did you get to end-game without knowing the basics in the first place.
It seems like the contingent of "Play like I tell you to play or get out" and "You are only acceptable if you do it exactly the way we tell you to do it" and the "NO, you are not allowed to play the way you want to, you MUST play the way we tell you to or your out" contingent is going strong.
Personally, I play how I want to play and if you don't like it, fig-off. Don't need you, don't want you. Not chasing achievements, trophies or leaderboards. Just doesn't matter.Everyone needs to learn. F it. It's a game. Who cares?
Tanked VSC last night for 5 hours! One competent (actually awesome, but rezzing all the time and other f-ery, meant group of about 30k, of which he was doing most, if not all!) dps, inexperienced dps and healer (I was doing 30% heals as tank), and yet, we got it.
If you care about people - taking the time is what you do.
I understand that some people have limited time, because of real life etc- but some people are just in a hurry to be toxic toward the next person.
I don't want to die IRL having been that person in game.
'Not like this...'
It's a game where you are playing with other people, and if you waste those people time because you didn't bother to check the basics, then expect some backlash, what is more toxic a natural reaction to substandard performance that is wasting everyone's time, and making the experience less fun, or someone that expects to be carried through the dungeon just because?
People always think about the "fun" of the casual, usually used in place of bad player, which is not necessarily true, and never think of the fun of the player who actually wanna get things done, and that would like that the people who decide to play that content at least knew the basics, when have we started accepting mediocrity as the standard?
If you wanna be a bad player and still do end game content, at least have the decency to either learn the basics, or just play a single player game, so the only one losing will be you.
I don't really get what;s the fun in spending 5 hours into a dungeon wasting time and money for NOTHING, what do you get out of it? The satisfaction of teaching to people who clearly don't give much of a ...?
OH, but you need time to learn this and that,.... you can learn that on easier content, you can learn combat on normal, and then go to vet when you are better, the truth is that you wanna get boosted by much better players.
And you would be completely wrong, i just care if you can do the content, i don;t give much of a f if you are not meta, what i want is for you to do the things you are required to, i will pick up some slack, but i won;t carry people who are just bad.
And you can learn to play in plenty of ways,m you don;t need to do vet content to learn, also, there is something called the internet, years ago you would have been justified when there wasn't any information, but now, there is just no excuse.
If you care you will do it, if you care, you will be willing to spend some time watching and learning the basics, and by the way, it's nowhere near the amount you suggested, it;s more like a few hours at most, and also, no, i did not say that, i never said that you need to learn absolutely everything i said the basics, not everything, just don;t be dead weight if you truly care, you will become better, but if you don;t, there is no point teaching you.
See, this is another problem i have with people, why do you have to take things out of context? even when we only slightly disagree on some things? Basics is basics, i never said , you need to know about EVERYTHING, you need to be pro mlg, otherwise i won;t be teaching you, guys, you need to listen, to what the other person is actually saying, not what you think he's saying.
Perhaps people would be more open to what you have to say if your posts weren't riddled with insults, disdain and your own assumptions that people are 'using' you.
Your posts just give me the creeps to be honest. It's hard to see the forest for the poo.
Insults? when did i ever say something that is actually offensive? i did not tell anyone to f off, or things like that, and honestly even then it's not that offensive, i would just brush it off, maybe the problem is that you are too easily offended and find offense in everything? ever thought about that?
Give me the creeps, Jesus Christ... Dude, if you get creeped out by some slightly harsh words there is no way you can live in the real world with other people, there will always be something that offends you, but honestly, there is no point spending time with you, you are a waste of time, and the only argument you made was an appeal to emotions, so i'm done with you.Edited by JinMori on June 14, 2018 9:12PM1 -
Mureel✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭I aint scared of that repair bill (no limit)I don't disagree with you, but, honestly, you just told a new player to go and watch 1,000 hours of gameplay and research the heck out the game and the mechanics, etc., etc., etc. How is that playing the game? Why? When did playing a game become a research project? Where's the fun in that? I can use the example of Deltia's builds. Love 'em, but, when we get to the part where you "need" or "require" this equipment or that equipment and this level or that is when I get bored. I don't want to be them, I want to be me.
Is it possible that people want to learn, but want to learn by doing? I didn't learn to use software programs or do accounting or compliance work by reading and reading and reading and watching videos. I just did it and learned how. The same thing for doing plumbing and building a bookshelf and putting together that dern IKEA table I bought. Just do it. Some people don't learn by watching others and reading and researching. They just want to play, and being told they're losers and can't do anything right is a bit discouraging.And how, pray tell, do you learn the basics if no-one will tell you what they are and keep changing them every 10 seconds on the whims of those who love to say LTP? While I agree that you probably shouldn't be doing end-game content without knowing the basics, how did you get to end-game without knowing the basics in the first place.
It seems like the contingent of "Play like I tell you to play or get out" and "You are only acceptable if you do it exactly the way we tell you to do it" and the "NO, you are not allowed to play the way you want to, you MUST play the way we tell you to or your out" contingent is going strong.
Personally, I play how I want to play and if you don't like it, fig-off. Don't need you, don't want you. Not chasing achievements, trophies or leaderboards. Just doesn't matter.Everyone needs to learn. F it. It's a game. Who cares?
Tanked VSC last night for 5 hours! One competent (actually awesome, but rezzing all the time and other f-ery, meant group of about 30k, of which he was doing most, if not all!) dps, inexperienced dps and healer (I was doing 30% heals as tank), and yet, we got it.
If you care about people - taking the time is what you do.
I understand that some people have limited time, because of real life etc- but some people are just in a hurry to be toxic toward the next person.
I don't want to die IRL having been that person in game.
'Not like this...'
It's a game where you are playing with other people, and if you waste those people time because you didn't bother to check the basics, then expect some backlash, what is more toxic a natural reaction to substandard performance that is wasting everyone's time, and making the experience less fun, or someone that expects to be carried through the dungeon just because?
People always think about the "fun" of the casual, usually used in place of bad player, which is not necessarily true, and never think of the fun of the player who actually wanna get things done, and that would like that the people who decide to play that content at least knew the basics, when have we started accepting mediocrity as the standard?
If you wanna be a bad player and still do end game content, at least have the decency to either learn the basics, or just play a single player game, so the only one losing will be you.
I don't really get what;s the fun in spending 5 hours into a dungeon wasting time and money for NOTHING, what do you get out of it? The satisfaction of teaching to people who clearly don't give much of a ...?
OH, but you need time to learn this and that,.... you can learn that on easier content, you can learn combat on normal, and then go to vet when you are better, the truth is that you wanna get boosted by much better players.
And you would be completely wrong, i just care if you can do the content, i don;t give much of a f if you are not meta, what i want is for you to do the things you are required to, i will pick up some slack, but i won;t carry people who are just bad.
And you can learn to play in plenty of ways,m you don;t need to do vet content to learn, also, there is something called the internet, years ago you would have been justified when there wasn't any information, but now, there is just no excuse.
If you care you will do it, if you care, you will be willing to spend some time watching and learning the basics, and by the way, it's nowhere near the amount you suggested, it;s more like a few hours at most, and also, no, i did not say that, i never said that you need to learn absolutely everything i said the basics, not everything, just don;t be dead weight if you truly care, you will become better, but if you don;t, there is no point teaching you.
See, this is another problem i have with people, why do you have to take things out of context? even when we only slightly disagree on some things? Basics is basics, i never said , you need to know about EVERYTHING, you need to be pro mlg, otherwise i won;t be teaching you, guys, you need to listen, to what the other person is actually saying, not what you think he's saying.
Perhaps people would be more open to what you have to say if your posts weren't riddled with insults, disdain and your own assumptions that people are 'using' you.
Your posts just give me the creeps to be honest. It's hard to see the forest for the poo.
Insults? when did i ever say something that is actually offensive? i did not tell anyone to f off, or things like that, and honestly even then it's not that offensive, i would just brush it off, maybe the problem is that you are too easily offended and find offense in everything? ever thought about that?
Give me the creeps, Jesus Christ... Dude, if you get creeped out by some slightly harsh words there is no way you can live in the real world with other people, there will always be something that offends you, but honestly, there is no point spending time with you, you are a waste of time, and the only argument you made was an appeal to emotions, so i'm done with you.
Yes you did.
Not a dude, fam.
Look at yourself and ask yourself what's wrong with this picture?
You come off like a screaming baby with leprosy. It needs handling, but no one wants to handle it.
lol I am honorably discharged US Navy, Crypto, EOD, Diver, War Veteran.
What is it exactly, you think *I* can't handle?
You're abrasive and rude over a game.
Please save it.2 -
DenMoria✭✭✭✭✭
✭Other (please elaborate)A "screaming baby with leprosy"? eek!I don't disagree with you, but, honestly, you just told a new player to go and watch 1,000 hours of gameplay and research the heck out the game and the mechanics, etc., etc., etc. How is that playing the game? Why? When did playing a game become a research project? Where's the fun in that? I can use the example of Deltia's builds. Love 'em, but, when we get to the part where you "need" or "require" this equipment or that equipment and this level or that is when I get bored. I don't want to be them, I want to be me.
Is it possible that people want to learn, but want to learn by doing? I didn't learn to use software programs or do accounting or compliance work by reading and reading and reading and watching videos. I just did it and learned how. The same thing for doing plumbing and building a bookshelf and putting together that dern IKEA table I bought. Just do it. Some people don't learn by watching others and reading and researching. They just want to play, and being told they're losers and can't do anything right is a bit discouraging.And how, pray tell, do you learn the basics if no-one will tell you what they are and keep changing them every 10 seconds on the whims of those who love to say LTP? While I agree that you probably shouldn't be doing end-game content without knowing the basics, how did you get to end-game without knowing the basics in the first place.
It seems like the contingent of "Play like I tell you to play or get out" and "You are only acceptable if you do it exactly the way we tell you to do it" and the "NO, you are not allowed to play the way you want to, you MUST play the way we tell you to or your out" contingent is going strong.
Personally, I play how I want to play and if you don't like it, fig-off. Don't need you, don't want you. Not chasing achievements, trophies or leaderboards. Just doesn't matter.Everyone needs to learn. F it. It's a game. Who cares?
Tanked VSC last night for 5 hours! One competent (actually awesome, but rezzing all the time and other f-ery, meant group of about 30k, of which he was doing most, if not all!) dps, inexperienced dps and healer (I was doing 30% heals as tank), and yet, we got it.
If you care about people - taking the time is what you do.
I understand that some people have limited time, because of real life etc- but some people are just in a hurry to be toxic toward the next person.
I don't want to die IRL having been that person in game.
'Not like this...'
It's a game where you are playing with other people, and if you waste those people time because you didn't bother to check the basics, then expect some backlash, what is more toxic a natural reaction to substandard performance that is wasting everyone's time, and making the experience less fun, or someone that expects to be carried through the dungeon just because?
People always think about the "fun" of the casual, usually used in place of bad player, which is not necessarily true, and never think of the fun of the player who actually wanna get things done, and that would like that the people who decide to play that content at least knew the basics, when have we started accepting mediocrity as the standard?
If you wanna be a bad player and still do end game content, at least have the decency to either learn the basics, or just play a single player game, so the only one losing will be you.
I don't really get what;s the fun in spending 5 hours into a dungeon wasting time and money for NOTHING, what do you get out of it? The satisfaction of teaching to people who clearly don't give much of a ...?
OH, but you need time to learn this and that,.... you can learn that on easier content, you can learn combat on normal, and then go to vet when you are better, the truth is that you wanna get boosted by much better players.
And you would be completely wrong, i just care if you can do the content, i don;t give much of a f if you are not meta, what i want is for you to do the things you are required to, i will pick up some slack, but i won;t carry people who are just bad.
And you can learn to play in plenty of ways,m you don;t need to do vet content to learn, also, there is something called the internet, years ago you would have been justified when there wasn't any information, but now, there is just no excuse.
If you care you will do it, if you care, you will be willing to spend some time watching and learning the basics, and by the way, it's nowhere near the amount you suggested, it;s more like a few hours at most, and also, no, i did not say that, i never said that you need to learn absolutely everything i said the basics, not everything, just don;t be dead weight if you truly care, you will become better, but if you don;t, there is no point teaching you.
See, this is another problem i have with people, why do you have to take things out of context? even when we only slightly disagree on some things? Basics is basics, i never said , you need to know about EVERYTHING, you need to be pro mlg, otherwise i won;t be teaching you, guys, you need to listen, to what the other person is actually saying, not what you think he's saying.
Perhaps people would be more open to what you have to say if your posts weren't riddled with insults, disdain and your own assumptions that people are 'using' you.
Your posts just give me the creeps to be honest. It's hard to see the forest for the poo.
Insults? when did i ever say something that is actually offensive? i did not tell anyone to f off, or things like that, and honestly even then it's not that offensive, i would just brush it off, maybe the problem is that you are too easily offended and find offense in everything? ever thought about that?
Give me the creeps, Jesus Christ... Dude, if you get creeped out by some slightly harsh words there is no way you can live in the real world with other people, there will always be something that offends you, but honestly, there is no point spending time with you, you are a waste of time, and the only argument you made was an appeal to emotions, so i'm done with you.
Yes you did.
Not a dude, fam.
Look at yourself and ask yourself what's wrong with this picture?
You come off like a screaming baby with leprosy. It needs handling, but no one wants to handle it.
lol I am honorably discharged US Navy, Crypto, EOD, Diver, War Veteran.
What is it exactly, you think *I* can't handle?
You're abrasive and rude over a game.
Please save it.
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DenMoria✭✭✭✭✭
✭Other (please elaborate)I don't disagree with you, but, honestly, you just told a new player to go and watch 1,000 hours of gameplay and research the heck out the game and the mechanics, etc., etc., etc. How is that playing the game? Why? When did playing a game become a research project? Where's the fun in that? I can use the example of Deltia's builds. Love 'em, but, when we get to the part where you "need" or "require" this equipment or that equipment and this level or that is when I get bored. I don't want to be them, I want to be me.
Is it possible that people want to learn, but want to learn by doing? I didn't learn to use software programs or do accounting or compliance work by reading and reading and reading and watching videos. I just did it and learned how. The same thing for doing plumbing and building a bookshelf and putting together that dern IKEA table I bought. Just do it. Some people don't learn by watching others and reading and researching. They just want to play, and being told they're losers and can't do anything right is a bit discouraging.And how, pray tell, do you learn the basics if no-one will tell you what they are and keep changing them every 10 seconds on the whims of those who love to say LTP? While I agree that you probably shouldn't be doing end-game content without knowing the basics, how did you get to end-game without knowing the basics in the first place.
It seems like the contingent of "Play like I tell you to play or get out" and "You are only acceptable if you do it exactly the way we tell you to do it" and the "NO, you are not allowed to play the way you want to, you MUST play the way we tell you to or your out" contingent is going strong.
Personally, I play how I want to play and if you don't like it, fig-off. Don't need you, don't want you. Not chasing achievements, trophies or leaderboards. Just doesn't matter.Everyone needs to learn. F it. It's a game. Who cares?
Tanked VSC last night for 5 hours! One competent (actually awesome, but rezzing all the time and other f-ery, meant group of about 30k, of which he was doing most, if not all!) dps, inexperienced dps and healer (I was doing 30% heals as tank), and yet, we got it.
If you care about people - taking the time is what you do.
I understand that some people have limited time, because of real life etc- but some people are just in a hurry to be toxic toward the next person.
I don't want to die IRL having been that person in game.
'Not like this...'
It's a game where you are playing with other people, and if you waste those people time because you didn't bother to check the basics, then expect some backlash, what is more toxic a natural reaction to substandard performance that is wasting everyone's time, and making the experience less fun, or someone that expects to be carried through the dungeon just because?
People always think about the "fun" of the casual, usually used in place of bad player, which is not necessarily true, and never think of the fun of the player who actually wanna get things done, and that would like that the people who decide to play that content at least knew the basics, when have we started accepting mediocrity as the standard?
If you wanna be a bad player and still do end game content, at least have the decency to either learn the basics, or just play a single player game, so the only one losing will be you.
I don't really get what;s the fun in spending 5 hours into a dungeon wasting time and money for NOTHING, what do you get out of it? The satisfaction of teaching to people who clearly don't give much of a ...?
OH, but you need time to learn this and that,.... you can learn that on easier content, you can learn combat on normal, and then go to vet when you are better, the truth is that you wanna get boosted by much better players.
And you would be completely wrong, i just care if you can do the content, i don;t give much of a f if you are not meta, what i want is for you to do the things you are required to, i will pick up some slack, but i won;t carry people who are just bad.
And you can learn to play in plenty of ways,m you don;t need to do vet content to learn, also, there is something called the internet, years ago you would have been justified when there wasn't any information, but now, there is just no excuse.
If you care you will do it, if you care, you will be willing to spend some time watching and learning the basics, and by the way, it's nowhere near the amount you suggested, it;s more like a few hours at most, and also, no, i did not say that, i never said that you need to learn absolutely everything i said the basics, not everything, just don;t be dead weight if you truly care, you will become better, but if you don;t, there is no point teaching you.
See, this is another problem i have with people, why do you have to take things out of context? even when we only slightly disagree on some things? Basics is basics, i never said , you need to know about EVERYTHING, you need to be pro mlg, otherwise i won;t be teaching you, guys, you need to listen, to what the other person is actually saying, not what you think he's saying.
Perhaps people would be more open to what you have to say if your posts weren't riddled with insults, disdain and your own assumptions that people are 'using' you.
Your posts just give me the creeps to be honest. It's hard to see the forest for the poo.
Insults? when did i ever say something that is actually offensive? i did not tell anyone to f off, or things like that, and honestly even then it's not that offensive, i would just brush it off, maybe the problem is that you are too easily offended and find offense in everything? ever thought about that?
Give me the creeps, Jesus Christ... Dude, if you get creeped out by some slightly harsh words there is no way you can live in the real world with other people, there will always be something that offends you, but honestly, there is no point spending time with you, you are a waste of time, and the only argument you made was an appeal to emotions, so i'm done with you.
While I was certainly not insulted, the disdain is strong in you. Embrace it! Revel in it! Eventually everyone will loathe and fear you and then you job is done. 1 -
Arezius✭✭✭I aint scared of that repair bill (no limit)The thing is, when I was low level I would almost always be grouped with runners
You are totally right in your post. I have not the same experience since I started the game at launch, where people would simply learn the dungeons and not run, and now I know the dungeons by heart like many so I don't mind that much if I end up with runners. But I also noticed this bad habit when I went back to the game 6 month ago.
That's the best argument to make the base game harder, more in line with launch, or make the veteran players have no interest in normal dungeons (but then normal pugs would have to wait hours...).
If you're not in a guild, learning is difficult, like doing a dungeon quest (impossible to read the quests and sometimes get the final reward...). And the only solution may be to search for a friendly pve guild.
Once again, bad players are the problem, bad when they don't choose the right role, when they run, insult, kick for no reason (I was once called a "fake healer" and kicked because I played a nightblade in a normal dungeon where nobody dropped below 75% health... (this character is my second healer, fully dedicated to it, but anyway...), and leave at the first wipes.0 -
Selthia✭✭✭FiveI'll try to hang around as long as I have time for. If it looks like the group is getting better with each attempt, probably a little longer.0 -
Aesthier✭✭✭✭✭Other (please elaborate)When it becomes obviously apparent that the current group set up does not have the DPS, Tanking or Healing that is required to complete the content.
Sometimes that shortfall may be me and I leave, sometimes that is someone else. At any rate, those are the only times I will really leave group unless the RL schedule deems otherwise.0 -
itehache✭✭✭✭ThriceI mean, if I see that the fight goes nowhere I let them know in the chat and I do leave. If I see any progress I stay, but I never left after the first wipe.0 -
starkerealm✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭I aint scared of that repair bill (no limit)If they're willing to listen and learn, I'll usually stick it around until the group as a whole decides to pack it in. If they're unwilling to listen, or get combative, then I'll usually stick around for a couple more attempts. It's not about the number of wipes for me, (I literally have thousands of grand repair kits and soul gems), it's about the attitude of the group, and how the run is going.0 -
Agenericname✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Other (please elaborate)Everyone needs to learn. F it. It's a game. Who cares?
Tanked VSC last night for 5 hours! One competent (actually awesome, but rezzing all the time and other f-ery, meant group of about 30k, of which he was doing most, if not all!) dps, inexperienced dps and healer (I was doing 30% heals as tank), and yet, we got it.
If you care about people - taking the time is what you do.
I understand that some people have limited time, because of real life etc- but some people are just in a hurry to be toxic toward the next person.
I don't want to die IRL having been that person in game.
'Not like this...'
It's a game where you are playing with other people, and if you waste those people time because you didn't bother to check the basics, then expect some backlash, what is more toxic a natural reaction to substandard performance that is wasting everyone's time, and making the experience less fun, or someone that expects to be carried through the dungeon just because?
People always think about the "fun" of the casual, usually used in place of bad player, which is not necessarily true, and never think of the fun of the player who actually wanna get things done, and that would like that the people who decide to play that content at least knew the basics, when have we started accepting mediocrity as the standard?
If you wanna be a bad player and still do end game content, at least have the decency to either learn the basics, or just play a single player game, so the only one losing will be you.
I don't really get what;s the fun in spending 5 hours into a dungeon wasting time and money for NOTHING, what do you get out of it? The satisfaction of teaching to people who clearly don't give much of a ...?
OH, but you need time to learn this and that,.... you can learn that on easier content, you can learn combat on normal, and then go to vet when you are better, the truth is that you wanna get boosted by much better players.
I think you mean TEACH. Because I'm the teacher in the above scenario and I was glad to oblige.
Toxic exit is over there ->
No, if you read the comment i made before i said that i was willing to put it up if the group was at least decent, but i won;'t teach to players who don;t give a single f.
But you can take the moral highground, even though in the end you are just being used, don;t teach to people who don't care.
Toxic exit, don;t make me laugh, i refuse to accept mediocrity, and i refuse to teach to people who don;t care.
Time is precious, and i prefer spending it with people who care, rather then people who don't and are just using you as a way to get to then end while not putting any effort, but go on, waste your time.
What is wrong with you? Like really what happened to you, or didn't, that makes you think this kind of outlook and behaviour is okay?
Really, I am sorry for whatever happened/didn't happen, to make you such an angry person.
Great argument there dude.
What makes you think that telling people how they should behave as adult is ok?
Probably the same logic as telling someone how to play a video game is okay.
If you don't want to play a video game with people who aren't up to your standards, don't. Who cares? I certainly don't owe anybody here my time and wouldn't suggest that others do.
There's a difference between me saying "that would be a waste of my time" and "you're wasting your time" within the scope of this conversation. Both convey that i see no value in something, but one projects my standards or values onto another player. It's not for me to determine whether or not someone spending 5 hours helping/carrying other players is a waste of their time or not.
I agree, time is precious. I sort in this order, if a person can't communicate without the use of ad hominem or personal insults, then I feel like we lack the communication skills to get through anything more difficult so I'm normally gone. That's a waste of my time. Everything else (within reason) is a variable. They may be lying, poor players, unprepared, etc, or they may be capable and just need a nudge. The truth will reveal itself soon enough. Without the ability to communicate, the odds of that happening are reduced.
There's nothing emotionally charged or "naive" about that.
2 -
Betsararie✭✭✭✭✭
✭You can't tell me how to play or what to do ever you cannot do it. Cannot do it.0