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PTS Update 18 - Feedback Thread for Sorcerer Balance
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ToRelax✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Why not put the unblock able CC on the first explosion of curse? That way it lines up will with burst, but can still be stopped because you will see the telegraph first, so can prepare for the burst.
It would be even more powerful. With the cc on Cage, you can still anticipate it happening about the time Curse goes off or slightly prior to it. If Curse does it, you essentially give Sorcs another slot on their bars as well as higher burst damage because their cc is now once again bound to a high damage skill.DAGON - ALTADOON - CHIM - GHARTOK
The Covenant is broken. The Enemy has won...
Elo'dryel - Sorc - AR 50 - Hopesfire - EP EU1 -
Kilandros✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/410203/pts-patch-notes-v4-0-2/p1Decreased the damage done by all Light Attacks by approximately 20%.
This did not affect Overload LAs btw, in case anyone was wondering.
Pre-patch: 16 351 dmg
After: 16 351 dmg
This could just be a bug. You did also claim that 3-second Power Lash heal was a "feature" when everyone told you it was bugged. Funny you didn't have anything to say when it got fixed.Invictus
Kilandros - Dragonknight / Grand Overlord
Deimos - Templar / Grand Warlord
Sias - Sorcerer / PrefectZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »Short answer is DKs likely won't be seeing a ton of changes before we go live; this class is still quite powerful (as it should be being a tank), even after some of the adjustments we've made to other classes and abilities.
DK IS NOT JUST A TANK CLASS. #PLAYTHEWAYYOUWANT2 -
DDuke✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/410203/pts-patch-notes-v4-0-2/p1Decreased the damage done by all Light Attacks by approximately 20%.
This did not affect Overload LAs btw, in case anyone was wondering.
Pre-patch: 16 351 dmg
After: 16 351 dmg
This could just be a bug. You did also claim that 3-second Power Lash heal was a "feature" when everyone told you it was bugged. Funny you didn't have anything to say when it got fixed.
I don't know how you construe my post to mean anything, I'm simply saying Overload LA wasn't affected by the change in latest patch to inform & save people testing time - I'm not going to comment on whether that's a bug or not, or if it's a good or a bad thing.
Power Lash losing its longer heal duration was regrettable, and I'm quite sure I wrote that publicly somewhere (not that I'm required to or anything).
I did say something else too: I said mDK would still do great after the patch, and that turned out to be 100% accurate (even when they don't get a free kill on dodge rollers anymore).
In the same vein, sorcs are doing great vs dodge rollers on Live, they don't need buttons that guarantee free kills.4 -
Aedaryl✭✭✭✭✭
✭It's funny how people here come with
1 false number saying sorc is op
2 take as target the non meta already weak build to say sorc is op
3 ignore entirely the meta and where are the sorcs issues.
Sorc struggle agaisnt anything that's tanky, meaning almost everything.
RIP sorc vs :
- Anything stam with sword and board with high mitigation + vigor + rally + class healing related skill + lingering potion. Yeah, you will never kill a meta stamsorc, stamdk, stamwarden, tankyplar & tankyblade with a (runecage) sorc.
Because they will take low damage on the burst (40% with meteor) and because sorc have no pressure and no defile, meaning the stam healing machine will out heal you between burst.
Sorc vs tanky magplar or tanky dk also have BIG trouble because the dk/tp can always cast a 100% guaranted undefiled critical heal.
Sorc is the best potatoes killer because potatoes have low mitigation, low hp, low healing. The more you bring your gank build, medium without impreg/fortified brass build, the more sorc will be effective.4 -
Aedaryl✭✭✭✭✭
✭Rune cage is OP vs builds that use damage shields and vs the squishiest builds.
Meaning VS :
-Magsorc
-Magnb
- Rollerblade
- Anything dukke build related since he choose to be squichy for damage
- anything medium armor without fortified brass or impreg.
Guess what : expect shield user, sorc is already good killing theze builds.
As sorc, we want to be competitive VS High mitigation sword and board healing machine. And the damage on rune cage will not kill them, but will kill the already easiest food.
We want something VS tanky dps, that's mean pressure. By adding a strong dot (or defile ?).Edited by Aedaryl on May 1, 2018 1:28PM2 -
ak_pvp✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/410203/pts-patch-notes-v4-0-2/p1Decreased the damage done by all Light Attacks by approximately 20%.
This did not affect Overload LAs btw, in case anyone was wondering.
Pre-patch: 16 351 dmg
After: 16 351 dmg
This could just be a bug. You did also claim that 3-second Power Lash heal was a "feature" when everyone told you it was bugged. Funny you didn't have anything to say when it got fixed.
I don't know how you construe my post to mean anything, I'm simply saying Overload LA wasn't affected by the change in latest patch to inform & save people testing time - I'm not going to comment on whether that's a bug or not, or if it's a good or a bad thing.
Power Lash losing its longer heal duration was regrettable, and I'm quite sure I wrote that publicly somewhere (not that I'm required to or anything).
I did say something else too: I said mDK would still do great after the patch, and that turned out to be 100% accurate (even when they don't get a free kill on dodge rollers anymore).
In the same vein, sorcs are doing great vs dodge rollers on Live, they don't need buttons that guarantee free kills.
If you died because of power whip, an ability with a highly telegraphed setup that takes 3 gcds to hit, and could be stopped by rolling the first whip, not being ccd, outranging, cloaking, purging the root.
It was an l2p issue.
Also DK, the class without a reliable finisher and the most class defining nerfs took yet another nerf, its far from good, but its not bottom tier anymore because other classes suck a bit too, and the DK players are almost all long tims class mains going against FOTMs.
Eh whatever. The NB bias is high. Sorc shouldn't have an unblocked CC and a hard hitting ult but NB can keep fear and incap. (both skills I have no issue with)MagDK main. PC/EU @AK-ESO
Best houseknight EU.2 -
Aedaryl✭✭✭✭✭
✭https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/410203/pts-patch-notes-v4-0-2/p1Decreased the damage done by all Light Attacks by approximately 20%.
This did not affect Overload LAs btw, in case anyone was wondering.
Pre-patch: 16 351 dmg
After: 16 351 dmg
This could just be a bug. You did also claim that 3-second Power Lash heal was a "feature" when everyone told you it was bugged. Funny you didn't have anything to say when it got fixed.
I don't know how you construe my post to mean anything, I'm simply saying Overload LA wasn't affected by the change in latest patch to inform & save people testing time - I'm not going to comment on whether that's a bug or not, or if it's a good or a bad thing.
Power Lash losing its longer heal duration was regrettable, and I'm quite sure I wrote that publicly somewhere (not that I'm required to or anything).
I did say something else too: I said mDK would still do great after the patch, and that turned out to be 100% accurate (even when they don't get a free kill on dodge rollers anymore).
In the same vein, sorcs are doing great vs dodge rollers on Live, they don't need buttons that guarantee free kills.
If you died because of power whip, an ability with a highly telegraphed setup that takes 3 gcds to hit, and could be stopped by rolling the first whip, not being ccd, outranging, cloaking, purging the root.
It was an l2p issue.
Also DK, the class without a reliable finisher and the most class defining nerfs took yet another nerf, its far from good, but its not bottom tier anymore because other classes suck a bit too, and the DK players are almost all long tims class mains going against FOTMs.
Eh whatever. The NB bias is high. Sorc shouldn't have an unblocked CC and a hard hitting ult but NB can keep fear and incap. (both skills I have no issue with)
Can we please stay on the sorc topic in this SORCERER FEEDBACK thread ?5 -
Feanor✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭I‘m going to wait for 4.0.3., if there aren’t substantial changes, I don’t know what to say.Main characters: Feanor the Believer - AD Altmer mSorc - AR 50 - Flawless Conqueror (PC EU)Idril Arnanor - AD Altmer mSorc - CP 217 - Stormproof (PC NA)Other characters:Necrophilius Killgood - DC Imperial NecromancerFearscales - AD Argonian Templar - Stormproof (healer)Draco Imperialis - AD Imperial DK (tank)Cabed Naearamarth - AD Dunmer mDKValirion Willowthorne - AD Bosmer stamBladeTuruna - AD Altmer magBladeKheled Zaram - AD Redguard stamDKKibil Nala - AD Redguard stamSorc - StormproofYavanna Kémentárí - AD Breton magWardenAzog gro-Ghâsh - EP Orc stamWardenVidar Drakenblød - DC Nord mDKMarquis de Peyrac - DC Breton mSorc - StormproofRawlith Khaj'ra - AD Khajiit stamWardenTu'waccah - AD Redguard StamplarAll chars 50 @ CP 1900+. Playing and enjoying PvP with RdK mostly on PC EU.2 -
Maulkin✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Rune cage is OP vs builds that use damage shields and vs the squishiest builds.
Meaning VS :
-Magsorc
-Magnb
- Rollerblade
- Anything dukke build related since he choose to be squichy for damage
- anything medium armor without fortified brass or impreg.
Guess what : expect shield user, sorc is already good killing theze builds.
As sorc, we want to be competitive VS High mitigation sword and board healing machine. And the damage on rune cage will not kill them, but will kill the already easiest food.
We want something VS tanky dps, that's mean pressure. By adding a strong dot (or defile ?).
Mmm strongly disagree. MagSorc on live, is not good at killing MagSorcs. The fact that both Sorcs double-stack Hardened with Harness and that the burst rotation is highly, highly telegraphed means that Sorcs of similar level will almost always have a stalemate.
If I meet another MagSorc on the current Live build, I can tell from the first 5-6" if it's going a to be a quick fight due to a huge difference in skill/experience/CP/build or if it's going to be a 15 minute fight that I might as well just walk away from.
So what this skill changes, is that it makes it possible to burst shield-stackers whereas you couldn't really do that before. Not sure if that helps against heavy builds.Edited by Maulkin on May 1, 2018 2:40PMEU | PC | AD3 -
pieratsos✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Frag+LA+Curse is around 17-18k damage, you can currently barely survive Frag+LA after Curse goes off on Live (get hit by Flame Reach=dead) on a regular 20k health build. Add an unavoidable 5-6k Cage to that & you'll have to add another 5-6k to your health pool. Increased damage from those light attacks adds another 1-2k you need to add compared to previous patch. So 28k health to survive a sorcerer - that's the health pool of a meta tank build. Of course if you want to survive Meteor as well, you'll need 30k+ health. Currently you can't spare a single enchant on a high dmg build, unless you only want to kill low CP players with your burst.
[/list]
Well technically 20k health builds are not regular and they havent been for a very long time. Hence the tank meta. If 20k health were the regular builds then sorcs would never stop being OP af cause they can one shot anyone with 20k health whether you have rune cage whether you dont.
20k health isnt an issue against sorcs. Its an issue against all classes. Even DKs with the least amount of burst are running around with 20k+ leap tooltips. 20k health is simply too squishy. 20k health build are niche builds not regular builds (with the exception of no CP and even in there 20k hp is still too low). I mean i wish we could go back to people actually dying and not everyone having 30k+ hp but it is what it is.0 -
Subversus✭✭✭✭✭
✭Schattenfluegel wrote: »It’s funny how “sorc mains” claim sorc is fine on the pts. They either haven’t been there or are simply not good enough to make a statement like that. Not that I’ve seen any of you on the pts lol.
Rune cage is not fine. It offers 0 counter play whatsoever. It needs to be changed, one way or another.
And an invisible NB Gank dont? Without Addons...
NB Hanks haven’t been a thing for a while now. Highest gank you can get is with magblade and that can’t even touch tankier opponents. Survive the gank on a sorc by simply putting on a shield and wipe the floor with the ganker like he was a broom.0 -
DDuke✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭Frag+LA+Curse is around 17-18k damage, you can currently barely survive Frag+LA after Curse goes off on Live (get hit by Flame Reach=dead) on a regular 20k health build. Add an unavoidable 5-6k Cage to that & you'll have to add another 5-6k to your health pool. Increased damage from those light attacks adds another 1-2k you need to add compared to previous patch. So 28k health to survive a sorcerer - that's the health pool of a meta tank build. Of course if you want to survive Meteor as well, you'll need 30k+ health. Currently you can't spare a single enchant on a high dmg build, unless you only want to kill low CP players with your burst.
[/list]
Well technically 20k health builds are not regular and they havent been for a very long time. Hence the tank meta. If 20k health were the regular builds then sorcs would never stop being OP af cause they can one shot anyone with 20k health whether you have rune cage whether you dont.
20k health isnt an issue against sorcs. Its an issue against all classes. Even DKs with the least amount of burst are running around with 20k+ leap tooltips. 20k health is simply too squishy. 20k health build are niche builds not regular builds (with the exception of no CP and even in there 20k hp is still too low). I mean i wish we could go back to people actually dying and not everyone having 30k+ hp but it is what it is.
Well, the average health pool of rollerblades (most popular build in Cyro) is between 18-23k health & they don't really have any issues surviving, hence why they're so popular.
Sure there's many close calls, but it's usually not quite enough to burst down a optimally built dodgeroller from 100% unless you also land a proc like Caluurion with the undodgeable dmg.
With the extra 5-6k dmg from Rune Cage it is enough damage, guaranteed (since that's practically the same as landing a Caluurion proc).
This means all of those builds that are barely surviving sorc burst on Live will have to get 5-6k more health to compensate just for the Rune Cage (light attacks dealing more dmg & 1-2 being guaranteed to land during Cage CC is another matter).0 -
ak_pvp✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/410203/pts-patch-notes-v4-0-2/p1Decreased the damage done by all Light Attacks by approximately 20%.
This did not affect Overload LAs btw, in case anyone was wondering.
Pre-patch: 16 351 dmg
After: 16 351 dmg
This could just be a bug. You did also claim that 3-second Power Lash heal was a "feature" when everyone told you it was bugged. Funny you didn't have anything to say when it got fixed.
I don't know how you construe my post to mean anything, I'm simply saying Overload LA wasn't affected by the change in latest patch to inform & save people testing time - I'm not going to comment on whether that's a bug or not, or if it's a good or a bad thing.
Power Lash losing its longer heal duration was regrettable, and I'm quite sure I wrote that publicly somewhere (not that I'm required to or anything).
I did say something else too: I said mDK would still do great after the patch, and that turned out to be 100% accurate (even when they don't get a free kill on dodge rollers anymore).
In the same vein, sorcs are doing great vs dodge rollers on Live, they don't need buttons that guarantee free kills.
If you died because of power whip, an ability with a highly telegraphed setup that takes 3 gcds to hit, and could be stopped by rolling the first whip, not being ccd, outranging, cloaking, purging the root.
It was an l2p issue.
Also DK, the class without a reliable finisher and the most class defining nerfs took yet another nerf, its far from good, but its not bottom tier anymore because other classes suck a bit too, and the DK players are almost all long tims class mains going against FOTMs.
Eh whatever. The NB bias is high. Sorc shouldn't have an unblocked CC and a hard hitting ult but NB can keep fear and incap. (both skills I have no issue with)
Can we please stay on the sorc topic in this SORCERER FEEDBACK thread ?
Its less the feedback I am on about, more a character assessment. DDuke likes nerfing things that hurt NB. I still vote curse gets the CC. Because then it has to be timed and is telegraphed, so can be prepared for if necessary, is different to petrify, saves a slot and mag, and works similar to the the old curse, fury, frag stun in landing.MagDK main. PC/EU @AK-ESO
Best houseknight EU.1 -
DDuke✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/410203/pts-patch-notes-v4-0-2/p1Decreased the damage done by all Light Attacks by approximately 20%.
This did not affect Overload LAs btw, in case anyone was wondering.
Pre-patch: 16 351 dmg
After: 16 351 dmg
This could just be a bug. You did also claim that 3-second Power Lash heal was a "feature" when everyone told you it was bugged. Funny you didn't have anything to say when it got fixed.
I don't know how you construe my post to mean anything, I'm simply saying Overload LA wasn't affected by the change in latest patch to inform & save people testing time - I'm not going to comment on whether that's a bug or not, or if it's a good or a bad thing.
Power Lash losing its longer heal duration was regrettable, and I'm quite sure I wrote that publicly somewhere (not that I'm required to or anything).
I did say something else too: I said mDK would still do great after the patch, and that turned out to be 100% accurate (even when they don't get a free kill on dodge rollers anymore).
In the same vein, sorcs are doing great vs dodge rollers on Live, they don't need buttons that guarantee free kills.
If you died because of power whip, an ability with a highly telegraphed setup that takes 3 gcds to hit, and could be stopped by rolling the first whip, not being ccd, outranging, cloaking, purging the root.
It was an l2p issue.
Also DK, the class without a reliable finisher and the most class defining nerfs took yet another nerf, its far from good, but its not bottom tier anymore because other classes suck a bit too, and the DK players are almost all long tims class mains going against FOTMs.
Eh whatever. The NB bias is high. Sorc shouldn't have an unblocked CC and a hard hitting ult but NB can keep fear and incap. (both skills I have no issue with)
Can we please stay on the sorc topic in this SORCERER FEEDBACK thread ?
Its less the feedback I am on about, more a character assessment. DDuke likes nerfing things that hurt NB. I still vote curse gets the CC. Because then it has to be timed and is telegraphed, so can be prepared for if necessary, is different to petrify, saves a slot and mag, and works similar to the the old curse, fury, frag stun in landing.
I don't nerf things, Zenimax does.
And last I remember the change to Power Lash was under "bug fixes". Also, last I remember no dodge roll build could live past 20 seconds vs my mDK & I fought some of the best players EU has to offer on my mDK to confirm that.
I even asked people claiming the opposite (including you, if I recall correctly) to log on to their stamina characters and give it a shot, because all my calculations & past experiences pointed at survival on a dodge roll build vs a high dmg mDK with undodgeable Power Lash being impossible.
Of course, as suspected, it was easier for people to defend broken mechanics & dispute facts on the forums than actually prove their point in game.
And what do you know, mDK is still doing perfectly fine after that change: still capable of killing dodge rollers (not just nightblades) without being completely broken against them, still capable of 1v1 against anyone, still capable of 1vX against anyone, still has good grp synergy, good dmg if built for that & good tankiness if built for that.
The very first fight in Cyrodiil I had on my mDK logging in after Dragon Bones was a 1v8, which I won.
Obviously, in order to fully understand how strong mDK was vs medium armor builds, you would've had to play an actual strong mDK build - which you clearly didn't.
Conclusion: I don't think I'm the one with "l2p issues" here.
So please leave your "character assessments" at home please & stay on topic (feedback on Sorcerer, not DK).2 -
Aedaryl✭✭✭✭✭
✭Rune cage is OP vs builds that use damage shields and vs the squishiest builds.
Meaning VS :
-Magsorc
-Magnb
- Rollerblade
- Anything dukke build related since he choose to be squichy for damage
- anything medium armor without fortified brass or impreg.
Guess what : expect shield user, sorc is already good killing theze builds.
As sorc, we want to be competitive VS High mitigation sword and board healing machine. And the damage on rune cage will not kill them, but will kill the already easiest food.
We want something VS tanky dps, that's mean pressure. By adding a strong dot (or defile ?).
Mmm strongly disagree. MagSorc on live, is not good at killing MagSorcs. The fact that both Sorcs double-stack Hardened with Harness and that the burst rotation is highly, highly telegraphed means that Sorcs of similar level will almost always have a stalemate.
If I meet another MagSorc on the current Live build, I can tell from the first 5-6" if it's going a to be a quick fight due to a huge difference in skill/experience/CP/build or if it's going to be a 15 minute fight that I might as well just walk away from.
So what this skill changes, is that it makes it possible to burst shield-stackers whereas you couldn't really do that before. Not sure if that helps against heavy builds.
god, I wanted to" except" meaning sorc have trouble with shield but NOT with the other things in the list.
Subversus probably say the new rune cage is OP because he mostly play magNB, and magsorc, and the buff VS theze classes is significant and probably too strong.
Double the damage of rune cage and make it a dot over 8s. Fair. Fine. 2k tooltip dot per second is good but not OP.Edited by Aedaryl on May 1, 2018 3:54PM1 -
Murador178✭✭✭✭Rune cage is OP vs builds that use damage shields and vs the squishiest builds.
Meaning VS :
-Magsorc
-Magnb
- Rollerblade
- Anything dukke build related since he choose to be squichy for damage
- anything medium armor without fortified brass or impreg.
Guess what : expect shield user, sorc is already good killing theze builds.
As sorc, we want to be competitive VS High mitigation sword and board healing machine. And the damage on rune cage will not kill them, but will kill the already easiest food.
We want something VS tanky dps, that's mean pressure. By adding a strong dot (or defile ?).
Mmm strongly disagree. MagSorc on live, is not good at killing MagSorcs. The fact that both Sorcs double-stack Hardened with Harness and that the burst rotation is highly, highly telegraphed means that Sorcs of similar level will almost always have a stalemate.
If I meet another MagSorc on the current Live build, I can tell from the first 5-6" if it's going a to be a quick fight due to a huge difference in skill/experience/CP/build or if it's going to be a 15 minute fight that I might as well just walk away from.
So what this skill changes, is that it makes it possible to burst shield-stackers whereas you couldn't really do that before. Not sure if that helps against heavy builds.
god, I wanted to" except" meaning sorc have trouble with shield but NOT with the other things in the list.
Subversus probably say the new rune cage is OP because he mostly play magNB, and magsorc, and the buff VS theze classes is significant and probably too strong.
Double the damage of rune cage and make it a dot over 8s. Fair. Fine. 2k tooltip dot per second is good but not OP.
The runecage is for sure not especially strong vs mNBs
. It mainly is death sentence for roll focused chars. And a very strong CC vs anything else. Magicka nightblade will still be very strong. Imo stamina chars will have far more problems dealing with mSorcs.
@Aedaryl i saw u zero times on the pts the last weeks: my mSorc lost very few duels vs any stam chars(and I also fought legion fury stam sorcs, and alot bleedblades) - if algined u can 1shot 28k hp full resist chars with a meteor combo atm --> the new damage on staff attacks helps the damage of sorcs alot --> Imo that part is a great change, so runecage should give the damage as dot dmg - so its still a great spell.Edited by Murador178 on May 1, 2018 4:49PM0 -
Aedaryl✭✭✭✭✭
✭Murador178 wrote: »Rune cage is OP vs builds that use damage shields and vs the squishiest builds.
Meaning VS :
-Magsorc
-Magnb
- Rollerblade
- Anything dukke build related since he choose to be squichy for damage
- anything medium armor without fortified brass or impreg.
Guess what : expect shield user, sorc is already good killing theze builds.
As sorc, we want to be competitive VS High mitigation sword and board healing machine. And the damage on rune cage will not kill them, but will kill the already easiest food.
We want something VS tanky dps, that's mean pressure. By adding a strong dot (or defile ?).
Mmm strongly disagree. MagSorc on live, is not good at killing MagSorcs. The fact that both Sorcs double-stack Hardened with Harness and that the burst rotation is highly, highly telegraphed means that Sorcs of similar level will almost always have a stalemate.
If I meet another MagSorc on the current Live build, I can tell from the first 5-6" if it's going a to be a quick fight due to a huge difference in skill/experience/CP/build or if it's going to be a 15 minute fight that I might as well just walk away from.
So what this skill changes, is that it makes it possible to burst shield-stackers whereas you couldn't really do that before. Not sure if that helps against heavy builds.
god, I wanted to" except" meaning sorc have trouble with shield but NOT with the other things in the list.
Subversus probably say the new rune cage is OP because he mostly play magNB, and magsorc, and the buff VS theze classes is significant and probably too strong.
Double the damage of rune cage and make it a dot over 8s. Fair. Fine. 2k tooltip dot per second is good but not OP.
The runecage is for sure not especially strong vs mNBs . It mainly is death sentence for roll focused chars. And a very strong CC vs anything else. Magicka nightblade will still be very strong. Imo stamina chars will have far more problems dealing with mSorcs.
@Aedaryl i saw u zero times on the pts the last weeks: my mSorc lost very few duels vs any stam chars(and I also fought legion fury stam sorcs, and alot bleedblades) - if algined u can 1shot 28k hp full resist chars with a meteor combo atm --> the new damage on staff attacks helps the damage of sorcs alot --> Imo that part is a great change, so runecage should give the damage as dot dmg - so its still a great spell.
I just log out, and with 45k magicka and 2.7k spell damage u can't one shot a 28k hp full resist character. Don't lie please.
If the ennemy is just capped and u have 10k penetration and using minor force, on a all crit combo (Rune cage, frag, meteor, curse) you can deal around 20k.
Fot that you need to be extremely lucky, and it's still not a one shot.Edited by Aedaryl on May 1, 2018 5:40PM0 -
Waffennacht✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Meta sorc will have tons o pressure.
Meta sorc will have tons o burst
Meta sorc:
monster set: Zaan or Skoria or Craw
Full set options: Caluurion, Sload, or Winterborn
Meta sorc A:
Wrath, Curse, Imbue, Hardened Ward, Pulse/Reach Ult Meteor/Atro/dbos
Surge, Streak/Boundless, Dampen/Absorb, Healing Ward, Cage Ult: Panacea
Cal, Sload, Skoria
Meta sorc B
Wrath, Curse, Blockade, H ward, Reach ult Meteor
Surge, Streak, Healing Ward, Dampen, Cage ult panacea
(Frost staff) Caluurion/Sload, Winterborn, Zaan
Meta Sorc C
Overload build (work in progress?)
Imo1 -
Minalan✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭Murador178 wrote: »Rune cage is OP vs builds that use damage shields and vs the squishiest builds.
Meaning VS :
-Magsorc
-Magnb
- Rollerblade
- Anything dukke build related since he choose to be squichy for damage
- anything medium armor without fortified brass or impreg.
Guess what : expect shield user, sorc is already good killing theze builds.
As sorc, we want to be competitive VS High mitigation sword and board healing machine. And the damage on rune cage will not kill them, but will kill the already easiest food.
We want something VS tanky dps, that's mean pressure. By adding a strong dot (or defile ?).
Mmm strongly disagree. MagSorc on live, is not good at killing MagSorcs. The fact that both Sorcs double-stack Hardened with Harness and that the burst rotation is highly, highly telegraphed means that Sorcs of similar level will almost always have a stalemate.
If I meet another MagSorc on the current Live build, I can tell from the first 5-6" if it's going a to be a quick fight due to a huge difference in skill/experience/CP/build or if it's going to be a 15 minute fight that I might as well just walk away from.
So what this skill changes, is that it makes it possible to burst shield-stackers whereas you couldn't really do that before. Not sure if that helps against heavy builds.
god, I wanted to" except" meaning sorc have trouble with shield but NOT with the other things in the list.
Subversus probably say the new rune cage is OP because he mostly play magNB, and magsorc, and the buff VS theze classes is significant and probably too strong.
Double the damage of rune cage and make it a dot over 8s. Fair. Fine. 2k tooltip dot per second is good but not OP.
The runecage is for sure not especially strong vs mNBs . It mainly is death sentence for roll focused chars. And a very strong CC vs anything else. Magicka nightblade will still be very strong. Imo stamina chars will have far more problems dealing with mSorcs.
@Aedaryl i saw u zero times on the pts the last weeks: my mSorc lost very few duels vs any stam chars(and I also fought legion fury stam sorcs, and alot bleedblades) - if algined u can 1shot 28k hp full resist chars with a meteor combo atm --> the new damage on staff attacks helps the damage of sorcs alot --> Imo that part is a great change, so runecage should give the damage as dot dmg - so its still a great spell.
I just log out, and with 45k magicka and 2.7k spell damage u can't one shot a 28k hp full resist character. Don't lie please.
If the ennemy is just capped and u have 10k penetration and using minor force, on a all crit combo (Rune cage, frag, meteor, curse) you can deal around 20k.
Fot that you need to be extremely lucky, and it's still not a one shot.
Wait wait, what is meteor hitting for now without the empower?
I still think cage damage is a bit overblown. I’ve never seen it do more than 3-4K or so.
Maybe was because the target had actual crit resistance on their spec instead of well fitted everything, but it wasn’t THAT bad. If they have vigor running it shouldn’t be significant.
Nobody wearing medium impreg is going to die from this.Edited by Minalan on May 1, 2018 6:09PM0 -
Feanor✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭
Disappointed in balance. I don’t want cheese. No matter which class has it.Main characters: Feanor the Believer - AD Altmer mSorc - AR 50 - Flawless Conqueror (PC EU)Idril Arnanor - AD Altmer mSorc - CP 217 - Stormproof (PC NA)Other characters:Necrophilius Killgood - DC Imperial NecromancerFearscales - AD Argonian Templar - Stormproof (healer)Draco Imperialis - AD Imperial DK (tank)Cabed Naearamarth - AD Dunmer mDKValirion Willowthorne - AD Bosmer stamBladeTuruna - AD Altmer magBladeKheled Zaram - AD Redguard stamDKKibil Nala - AD Redguard stamSorc - StormproofYavanna Kémentárí - AD Breton magWardenAzog gro-Ghâsh - EP Orc stamWardenVidar Drakenblød - DC Nord mDKMarquis de Peyrac - DC Breton mSorc - StormproofRawlith Khaj'ra - AD Khajiit stamWardenTu'waccah - AD Redguard StamplarAll chars 50 @ CP 1900+. Playing and enjoying PvP with RdK mostly on PC EU.2 -
Derra✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Waffennacht wrote: »Meta sorc will have tons o pressure.
Meta sorc will have tons o burst
Meta sorc:
monster set: Zaan or Skoria or Craw
Full set options: Caluurion, Sload, or Winterborn
Meta sorc A:
Wrath, Curse, Imbue, Hardened Ward, Pulse/Reach Ult Meteor/Atro/dbos
Surge, Streak/Boundless, Dampen/Absorb, Healing Ward, Cage Ult: Panacea
Cal, Sload, Skoria
Meta sorc B
Wrath, Curse, Blockade, H ward, Reach ult Meteor
Surge, Streak, Healing Ward, Dampen, Cage ult panacea
(Frost staff) Caluurion/Sload, Winterborn, Zaan
Meta Sorc C
Overload build (work in progress?)
Imo
All those builds are lowish magica - with the dmg increases across the board i´d not be too worried about those. They die relatively easy on pts.
People complain about necro shackle + shadowrend or necro pet setups on pts.
Still don´t believe runecage will hit live without change.<Noricum>
I live. I die. I live again.
Derra - DC - Sorc - AvA 50
Derrah - EP - Sorc - AvA 500 -
Waffennacht✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Waffennacht wrote: »Meta sorc will have tons o pressure.
Meta sorc will have tons o burst
Meta sorc:
monster set: Zaan or Skoria or Craw
Full set options: Caluurion, Sload, or Winterborn
Meta sorc A:
Wrath, Curse, Imbue, Hardened Ward, Pulse/Reach Ult Meteor/Atro/dbos
Surge, Streak/Boundless, Dampen/Absorb, Healing Ward, Cage Ult: Panacea
Cal, Sload, Skoria
Meta sorc B
Wrath, Curse, Blockade, H ward, Reach ult Meteor
Surge, Streak, Healing Ward, Dampen, Cage ult panacea
(Frost staff) Caluurion/Sload, Winterborn, Zaan
Meta Sorc C
Overload build (work in progress?)
Imo
All those builds are lowish magica - with the dmg increases across the board i´d not be too worried about those. They die relatively easy on pts.
People complain about necro shackle + shadowrend or necro pet setups on pts.
Still don´t believe runecage will hit live without change.
32k no CP to be precise. Almost 38k in CP.
But it's moot as it's only relevant for shield size and not damage.
Shield stacking + panacea + streak
Edit: @derra you say they die relatively easily, in what context are you describing? Duel? BGs? Or Open World?Edited by Waffennacht on May 1, 2018 8:47PM0 -
Subversus✭✭✭✭✭
✭Waffennacht wrote: »Meta sorc will have tons o pressure.
Meta sorc will have tons o burst
Meta sorc:
monster set: Zaan or Skoria or Craw
Full set options: Caluurion, Sload, or Winterborn
Meta sorc A:
Wrath, Curse, Imbue, Hardened Ward, Pulse/Reach Ult Meteor/Atro/dbos
Surge, Streak/Boundless, Dampen/Absorb, Healing Ward, Cage Ult: Panacea
Cal, Sload, Skoria
Meta sorc B
Wrath, Curse, Blockade, H ward, Reach ult Meteor
Surge, Streak, Healing Ward, Dampen, Cage ult panacea
(Frost staff) Caluurion/Sload, Winterborn, Zaan
Meta Sorc C
Overload build (work in progress?)
Imo
All those builds are lowish magica - with the dmg increases across the board i´d not be too worried about those. They die relatively easy on pts.
People complain about necro shackle + shadowrend or necro pet setups on pts.
Still don´t believe runecage will hit live without change.
Have you fought murador’s pet sorc with Calu and zaan?
it has more than enough damage hahahaha 2 -
Aedaryl✭✭✭✭✭
✭Waffennacht wrote: »Meta sorc will have tons o pressure.
Meta sorc will have tons o burst
Meta sorc:
monster set: Zaan or Skoria or Craw
Full set options: Caluurion, Sload, or Winterborn
Meta sorc A:
Wrath, Curse, Imbue, Hardened Ward, Pulse/Reach Ult Meteor/Atro/dbos
Surge, Streak/Boundless, Dampen/Absorb, Healing Ward, Cage Ult: Panacea
Cal, Sload, Skoria
Meta sorc B
Wrath, Curse, Blockade, H ward, Reach ult Meteor
Surge, Streak, Healing Ward, Dampen, Cage ult panacea
(Frost staff) Caluurion/Sload, Winterborn, Zaan
Meta Sorc C
Overload build (work in progress?)
Imo
All those builds are lowish magica - with the dmg increases across the board i´d not be too worried about those. They die relatively easy on pts.
People complain about necro shackle + shadowrend or necro pet setups on pts.
Still don´t believe runecage will hit live without change.
Have you fought murador’s pet sorc with Calu and zaan? it has more than enough damage hahahaha
It's not viable in openworld, no way you will sustain Calu + Zaan + Necro. No magicka sustain, no stamina sustain, let's take care of openworld build, since duel one will never be balanced.4 -
Waffennacht✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Waffennacht wrote: »Meta sorc will have tons o pressure.
Meta sorc will have tons o burst
Meta sorc:
monster set: Zaan or Skoria or Craw
Full set options: Caluurion, Sload, or Winterborn
Meta sorc A:
Wrath, Curse, Imbue, Hardened Ward, Pulse/Reach Ult Meteor/Atro/dbos
Surge, Streak/Boundless, Dampen/Absorb, Healing Ward, Cage Ult: Panacea
Cal, Sload, Skoria
Meta sorc B
Wrath, Curse, Blockade, H ward, Reach ult Meteor
Surge, Streak, Healing Ward, Dampen, Cage ult panacea
(Frost staff) Caluurion/Sload, Winterborn, Zaan
Meta Sorc C
Overload build (work in progress?)
Imo
All those builds are lowish magica - with the dmg increases across the board i´d not be too worried about those. They die relatively easy on pts.
People complain about necro shackle + shadowrend or necro pet setups on pts.
Still don´t believe runecage will hit live without change.
Have you fought murador’s pet sorc with Calu and zaan? it has more than enough damage hahahaha
@derra was saying the defensive of the builds are low, not the damage. Which is why I wonder the context. In CP open world, insta gib is prone to happen with these builds I absolutely agree. But in a duel or BGs, I don't see it being an issueEdited by Waffennacht on May 1, 2018 8:51PM0 -
Waffennacht✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Waffennacht wrote: »Meta sorc will have tons o pressure.
Meta sorc will have tons o burst
Meta sorc:
monster set: Zaan or Skoria or Craw
Full set options: Caluurion, Sload, or Winterborn
Meta sorc A:
Wrath, Curse, Imbue, Hardened Ward, Pulse/Reach Ult Meteor/Atro/dbos
Surge, Streak/Boundless, Dampen/Absorb, Healing Ward, Cage Ult: Panacea
Cal, Sload, Skoria
Meta sorc B
Wrath, Curse, Blockade, H ward, Reach ult Meteor
Surge, Streak, Healing Ward, Dampen, Cage ult panacea
(Frost staff) Caluurion/Sload, Winterborn, Zaan
Meta Sorc C
Overload build (work in progress?)
Imo
All those builds are lowish magica - with the dmg increases across the board i´d not be too worried about those. They die relatively easy on pts.
People complain about necro shackle + shadowrend or necro pet setups on pts.
Still don´t believe runecage will hit live without change.
Have you fought murador’s pet sorc with Calu and zaan? it has more than enough damage hahahaha
It's not viable in openworld, no way you will sustain Calu + Zaan + Necro. No magicka sustain, no stamina sustain, let's take care of openworld build, since duel one will never be balanced.
About the sustain - I disagree, you sacrifice spell damage (because it's less relevant on these builds) for sustain.
2k mag regen 2k spell damage 32k mag 9k Stam is your no CP stats with these builds (hitting all the minimums)
I just use pots for Stam sustain (considering tri glyphs to buff that Stam pool tho)
With roots, snare, panacea, streak, shield stacking 2k+ Regen (not counting mag drain poisons if you want) sustain and defense - apart from being ganked, isn't an issue
Edit: and I forgot sload adds Stam tooEdited by Waffennacht on May 1, 2018 9:00PM0 -
Ragnaroek93✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭What people forget is that duel sorcs usually play with Shadowrend and this set is just ridiculous strong in a duel environment, espcially with petcurse. I tested with @Murador178 and with @Derra that the heavy attacks from Shadowrend deal almost the same damage as a Skoria proc (with petcurse), so it has almost the same burst damage as Skoria, more overall total damage than Skoria, almost perma uptime, enables Necro and gives minor maim on top of that (it's a Dota hero pet...). Good thing is that Shadowrend falls off in open world because the pet isn't controllable but in duels it's busted.I used to think that PvP was a tragedy, but now I realize, it's a comedy.2 -
Minalan✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭Waffennacht wrote: »Meta sorc will have tons o pressure.
Meta sorc will have tons o burst
Meta sorc:
monster set: Zaan or Skoria or Craw
Full set options: Caluurion, Sload, or Winterborn
Meta sorc A:
Wrath, Curse, Imbue, Hardened Ward, Pulse/Reach Ult Meteor/Atro/dbos
Surge, Streak/Boundless, Dampen/Absorb, Healing Ward, Cage Ult: Panacea
Cal, Sload, Skoria
Meta sorc B
Wrath, Curse, Blockade, H ward, Reach ult Meteor
Surge, Streak, Healing Ward, Dampen, Cage ult panacea
(Frost staff) Caluurion/Sload, Winterborn, Zaan
Meta Sorc C
Overload build (work in progress?)
Imo
All those builds are lowish magica - with the dmg increases across the board i´d not be too worried about those. They die relatively easy on pts.
People complain about necro shackle + shadowrend or necro pet setups on pts.
Still don´t believe runecage will hit live without change.
I dunno, Derra. I mean, they haven’t even fixed this yet:
3