PTS Update 18 - Feedback Thread for Templar Balance

akray21 · April 2018

I rolled a Templar for healing and tanking capabilities... he might as well be dead...

Nifty2g · April 2018

Sustain on a Templar is a complete nightmare. Consider looking through their skill cost or giving some more reduced cost passives @ZOS_GinaBruno @ZOS_Wrobel

Minno · April 2018

akray21 wrote: »

I rolled a Templar for healing and tanking capabilities... he might as well be dead...

He died the minute zos nerfed our defenses post-jesus beam.

What underused abilities do you want to see adjusted to make tanking/healing better for you?

Ron_Burgundy_79 · April 2018

I just want the old blazing spear cc. I'll deal with all the other bugs we have for pvp.

dodgehopper_ESO · April 2018

Minno wrote: »

tinythinker wrote: »

Minno wrote: »

- eclipse (fix synergy with hard cc or add root cc)
I like how unique this ability is, but it's execution sucks. It grants cc immunity, but has no follow up mechanic. Total dark should be changed to allow all Templars to use it (Stam, hybrid, mag) and grant minor defense buff/debuff regardless of cc immunity. Unstable core is fine, but needs a root to justify throwing it out more than an actual CC (the DMG is fine as is).

- blazing spear (has no extra resorces and mechanically is clunky compared to wall of elements)
Also weird, gives resorces but harder to land than WOE which is easier to animation cancel. It should grant an AOE DMG at Templar to punish players that get close. If restoring aura gets the shards resource return then both of these morphs could get a defensive buff or be separated to give both mag/Stam morphs.

Minno wrote: »

My idea would still be giving you the chance to throw a spear at a location. But the change is that you'll gain the chance to send out blazing light to burn enemies around you as you cast the spear. This way enemies are punished for coming closer to you, and double punished if the Templar decides to throw the shards in his location to protect his house.

Then you'll have 2 chances to proc burning light; dot DMG that persists in the area, and an AOE DMG similar to how streak initial hit works for sorcs.

I am a broken record for adding a stun to anyone who tries to use a gap closer while affected by Unstable Core, but a root would also work.

The Blazing Spear idea is nice as it works for both PvP and PvE.

I think root works the best for unstable core (maybe because I'm biased UC lover lol):
- gives you a secondary way to burn stamina further justifying the cc immunity.
- root will work with jabs and justify not being able to add in stuns at a reliable pace
- adds to both defense and offense in one ability while also being unique

Solves the pain point of weird cc immunity not giving anything defensive, UC DMG burst gives offensive windows, and solves issues where Templars have a tough time with lining up burst because everything is spread out over multiple GCDs.

I agree with this. NPC's root you when they fire this skill. When players fire uc it is treated like a cc but it operates nothing like a cc. I am in 100% agreement with this suggestion particularly since Templar badly needs a proper cc and lack of cc is a big reason that Templars perform less well as Tanks despite having tanky passives/skills/design intent and structure.

dodgehopper_ESO · April 2018

tinythinker wrote: »

WeyounTM wrote: »

Everyone seems to agree that Argonians have the best racial passives by a countrymile for a healer....but why do they need to have it? So that everyone in BGs and cyrodiil can whine about "breathplars" and bring their salt to the forums? And hence Magplars will get the nerfhammer for years to come?

Argonians had deep bottom of the crap pile of passives for years. When they got some healing and resource buffs, no one cared except those who had stuck with lizards for a long time. No one was screaming about Argonians being OP. Some even said the Altmer might be a bit better since they have all-around better magicka stats which would be great for both damage and heals. Better heals and sustain is a niche, just like huge shields and high damage is a niche.

Somewhat related, but not focused on Argonian Templars using Breath of Life, is the functioning of the nerf/buff cycle.

My perspective is that:

1. Skill lines, racial passives, and set effects/bonuses are so numerous, varied, and modular there will always be an outlier for some niches that are particularly good or particularly bad.

2. Each time a skill line is introduced or changed, or a set is introduced or changed, the configuration shifts. Sometimes a little, sometimes a lot. Something that was great is now just OK. Something that was good is now awesome. Something that was bad is now terrible. Breton passives were "pretty good", then "sort of OK", then "in need of a buff", then "a bit better", etc., as the way combat works, sets available, and so on shifted (defense versus offense focus, generous sustain vs scarce sustain, etc.). Same for other races, such as when Redguards got their built-in stamina sustain nerfed.

3. This Teetering Jenga Tower of Futile Folly is so wibbly wobbly that the devs apparently can't always make the best theoretical adjustments because of the huge amount of overall rebalancing and reanimations required, so they go for the safest pieces that get them as close as possible to their goals. Some pieces are apparently wedged into the puzzle in a way that makes them particularly hard to adjust so they rarely if ever get touched.

4. The things that are added/change the most and therefore tend to often cause new shifts are gear sets, with new adjusted skill lines second and others last. Racial changes and major base game-play overhauls are less frequent and are usually in response to cumulative changes over longer periods of time.

5. Buffs seems to be more focused on average players and low-use skills/sets/races, whereas nerfs seemed to be based on what top performers in PvE and PvP can accomplish. Yet those buffs can sometimes be exploited by top performers and the nerfs sometimes hurt average players, so the safest bets are bland, milquetoast adjustements that err on the nerf side of the force.

6. Players appear to like to blame classes the most when other player perform better than them in PvE or PvP, sets second, and everything else last. But if there is some build that they don't like that is tied to racial passives, they will focus on the race first. Whatever they see as the main cause becomes not just a situational circumstance lifting some niches and lowering others, but as something inherently broken for that class, set, race, etc. So even if whatever it is gets nerfed, the perception remains it is OP or always at risk of easily becoming OP (see Dragonknights after VampDKs at launch, see Templars after they got Radiant Destruction on top of healing Sweeps, see Magicka Nightblades when they had insane sustain, see Magicka Sorcerers at every phase of the game's development since launch, etc.). Those perceptions linger for years. And they apparently can drive new, unnecessary rounds of nerfs (Breath of Life, anyone?).

7. So Nerfs happen to a class, race, or set -- then other changes shift alignment again, so that some niches/metas are lifted up, others drop down. But buffs to the once nerfed "OP" class, race, or set are much slower to come once they fall from the graces of the overall alignment (see Templars being a magicka battery in late beta then having waaaay too expensive skills for a long time after launch even though their sustain had been nerfed). The pattern: Fast to hit corrective nerfs, slow to come recovery buffs. Plus some seemingly inexplicable nerfs and buffs tossed in thanks to the Jenga Tower.

8. Watch #6 and #7 cycle over and over due to #1 through #5. See the stereotypes form and quick judgments fly. Feel the salt flow.

This is how I see tend to see "balance" in the game from patch notes and player arguments discussions.

If some clearly identifiable element (class, race, set) is broadly overperforming across more than one configuration/alignment shift, I say nerf it.

If it is "this race, type of set, and class in this specific content under a specific alignment" is perceived as over-performing, then be cautious in what you ask to be nerfed and how hard, because it may take a very long time to ever buff it back up again.

I agree with a lot you say here. This is also why I really believe they need to rethink how racial passives work. Races are really far too important to a build at end game in my view and there have been sweeping race changes on many occasions that have rewritten what a race is good at. I do not think a player should have to pay to re-race a character they've grown attached to in order to stay top performance. Its a bad choice we have to make and it should never be made. I would also like to add that re-race tokens promote a toxic behavior on the part of the devs (whether they do it or not) to actually purposefully upend a race's balance or design in order to get a quick influx of cash. Its bad bad bad.

Minno · April 2018

dodgehopper_ESO wrote: »

tinythinker wrote: »

WeyounTM wrote: »

Everyone seems to agree that Argonians have the best racial passives by a countrymile for a healer....but why do they need to have it? So that everyone in BGs and cyrodiil can whine about "breathplars" and bring their salt to the forums? And hence Magplars will get the nerfhammer for years to come?

Argonians had deep bottom of the crap pile of passives for years. When they got some healing and resource buffs, no one cared except those who had stuck with lizards for a long time. No one was screaming about Argonians being OP. Some even said the Altmer might be a bit better since they have all-around better magicka stats which would be great for both damage and heals. Better heals and sustain is a niche, just like huge shields and high damage is a niche.

Somewhat related, but not focused on Argonian Templars using Breath of Life, is the functioning of the nerf/buff cycle.

My perspective is that:

1. Skill lines, racial passives, and set effects/bonuses are so numerous, varied, and modular there will always be an outlier for some niches that are particularly good or particularly bad.

2. Each time a skill line is introduced or changed, or a set is introduced or changed, the configuration shifts. Sometimes a little, sometimes a lot. Something that was great is now just OK. Something that was good is now awesome. Something that was bad is now terrible. Breton passives were "pretty good", then "sort of OK", then "in need of a buff", then "a bit better", etc., as the way combat works, sets available, and so on shifted (defense versus offense focus, generous sustain vs scarce sustain, etc.). Same for other races, such as when Redguards got their built-in stamina sustain nerfed.

3. This Teetering Jenga Tower of Futile Folly is so wibbly wobbly that the devs apparently can't always make the best theoretical adjustments because of the huge amount of overall rebalancing and reanimations required, so they go for the safest pieces that get them as close as possible to their goals. Some pieces are apparently wedged into the puzzle in a way that makes them particularly hard to adjust so they rarely if ever get touched.

4. The things that are added/change the most and therefore tend to often cause new shifts are gear sets, with new adjusted skill lines second and others last. Racial changes and major base game-play overhauls are less frequent and are usually in response to cumulative changes over longer periods of time.

5. Buffs seems to be more focused on average players and low-use skills/sets/races, whereas nerfs seemed to be based on what top performers in PvE and PvP can accomplish. Yet those buffs can sometimes be exploited by top performers and the nerfs sometimes hurt average players, so the safest bets are bland, milquetoast adjustements that err on the nerf side of the force.

6. Players appear to like to blame classes the most when other player perform better than them in PvE or PvP, sets second, and everything else last. But if there is some build that they don't like that is tied to racial passives, they will focus on the race first. Whatever they see as the main cause becomes not just a situational circumstance lifting some niches and lowering others, but as something inherently broken for that class, set, race, etc. So even if whatever it is gets nerfed, the perception remains it is OP or always at risk of easily becoming OP (see Dragonknights after VampDKs at launch, see Templars after they got Radiant Destruction on top of healing Sweeps, see Magicka Nightblades when they had insane sustain, see Magicka Sorcerers at every phase of the game's development since launch, etc.). Those perceptions linger for years. And they apparently can drive new, unnecessary rounds of nerfs (Breath of Life, anyone?).

7. So Nerfs happen to a class, race, or set -- then other changes shift alignment again, so that some niches/metas are lifted up, others drop down. But buffs to the once nerfed "OP" class, race, or set are much slower to come once they fall from the graces of the overall alignment (see Templars being a magicka battery in late beta then having waaaay too expensive skills for a long time after launch even though their sustain had been nerfed). The pattern: Fast to hit corrective nerfs, slow to come recovery buffs. Plus some seemingly inexplicable nerfs and buffs tossed in thanks to the Jenga Tower.

8. Watch #6 and #7 cycle over and over due to #1 through #5. See the stereotypes form and quick judgments fly. Feel the salt flow.

This is how I see tend to see "balance" in the game from patch notes and player arguments discussions.

If some clearly identifiable element (class, race, set) is broadly overperforming across more than one configuration/alignment shift, I say nerf it.

If it is "this race, type of set, and class in this specific content under a specific alignment" is perceived as over-performing, then be cautious in what you ask to be nerfed and how hard, because it may take a very long time to ever buff it back up again.

I agree with a lot you say here. This is also why I really believe they need to rethink how racial passives work. Races are really far too important to a build at end game in my view and there have been sweeping race changes on many occasions that have rewritten what a race is good at. I do not think a player should have to pay to re-race a character they've grown attached to in order to stay top performance. Its a bad choice we have to make and it should never be made. I would also like to add that re-race tokens promote a toxic behavior on the part of the devs (whether they do it or not) to actually purposefully upend a race's balance or design in order to get a quick influx of cash. Its bad bad bad.

I don't mind race passives. I think those are good to help strengthen the RP and min/max of builds.

For example, Bretons might not have the DMG of other races, they make up for it with cheaper costs and spell resists.

In one build they could suck compared to dark elf/high elf, but flipside as Templars/DKs the extra spell resists let's you look at sets/CP that give you DMG reduction for physical DMG. Those builds, if you add high/dark elf have less resists (in some cases I noticed over 8k or 12% DMG mitigation).

Basically I think RSO needs the race passives to add a dimension to the game. Granted some are worse than others, but that's a result of changing the game but not changing the race passives fast enough. Example, crit healing won't have crit DMG modifiers anymore so the cats of Skyrim have less stamina healing than redguard now.

Minno · April 2018

dodgehopper_ESO wrote: »

Minno wrote: »

tinythinker wrote: »

Minno wrote: »

- eclipse (fix synergy with hard cc or add root cc)
I like how unique this ability is, but it's execution sucks. It grants cc immunity, but has no follow up mechanic. Total dark should be changed to allow all Templars to use it (Stam, hybrid, mag) and grant minor defense buff/debuff regardless of cc immunity. Unstable core is fine, but needs a root to justify throwing it out more than an actual CC (the DMG is fine as is).

- blazing spear (has no extra resorces and mechanically is clunky compared to wall of elements)
Also weird, gives resorces but harder to land than WOE which is easier to animation cancel. It should grant an AOE DMG at Templar to punish players that get close. If restoring aura gets the shards resource return then both of these morphs could get a defensive buff or be separated to give both mag/Stam morphs.

Minno wrote: »

My idea would still be giving you the chance to throw a spear at a location. But the change is that you'll gain the chance to send out blazing light to burn enemies around you as you cast the spear. This way enemies are punished for coming closer to you, and double punished if the Templar decides to throw the shards in his location to protect his house.

Then you'll have 2 chances to proc burning light; dot DMG that persists in the area, and an AOE DMG similar to how streak initial hit works for sorcs.

I am a broken record for adding a stun to anyone who tries to use a gap closer while affected by Unstable Core, but a root would also work.

The Blazing Spear idea is nice as it works for both PvP and PvE.

I think root works the best for unstable core (maybe because I'm biased UC lover lol):
- gives you a secondary way to burn stamina further justifying the cc immunity.
- root will work with jabs and justify not being able to add in stuns at a reliable pace
- adds to both defense and offense in one ability while also being unique

Solves the pain point of weird cc immunity not giving anything defensive, UC DMG burst gives offensive windows, and solves issues where Templars have a tough time with lining up burst because everything is spread out over multiple GCDs.

I agree with this. NPC's root you when they fire this skill. When players fire uc it is treated like a cc but it operates nothing like a cc. I am in 100% agreement with this suggestion particularly since Templar badly needs a proper cc and lack of cc is a big reason that Templars perform less well as Tanks despite having tanky passives/skills/design intent and structure.

And to be clear, the root with be independent from the cc immunity but require the root immunity from dodge roll or forward momentum.

LeifErickson · April 2018

dodgehopper_ESO wrote: »

LeifErickson wrote: »

Spear Wall: increases the amount of damage you can block from melee attacks by 15% while you have an Aedric Spear ability slotted.

This passive is part of the Aedric Spear skill line. All of the skills in this skill line are offensive skills (except sun shield which is only good on super niche builds), yet this passive is a defensive passive. Very few magplars use sword and board on the same bar as puncturing sweeps since you can't block while channeling. Most magplars also slot most of their offensive skills on the same bar and their defensive skills (turtle bar) on another bar that might have sword and board. None of the Aeridc Spear skills either make sense or are good enough to run on a defensive bar while at the same time are slotted on offensive bars where the Spear Wall passive will give them no benefit.

What I would like to see changed is to move this passive to a different skill line where it can actually be utilized on a block bar instead of an offensive/channel bar. The Restoring Light skill line would be the best host for this as most templars run skills from this skill line on a defensive/block bar. Master Ritualist could then be swapped with Spear Wall as that passive has no synergy with any of the skills in that skill line.

Sorry if this was already mentioned.

I don't think it would be much to ask to simply have this passive apply without slotting a single thing.

Even better. Not sure why I didn't think of that.

Darrett · April 2018

akray21 wrote: »

I rolled a Templar for healing and tanking capabilities... he might as well be dead...

To me, those are two possible roles that should be assigned to the Templar, with the possible secondary of buffing.

They should assign preferred roles to each class. Let all classes fulfill any role they want, with their preferred roles providing secondary benefit. That differentiates classes by making a Templar DPS and damage class with secondary heals, for instance, which other classes shouldn’t be able to provide as well or as efficiently.

The idea that every class should be able to do things as well as every other class needs to go away.

joaaocaampos · April 2018

Some changes I'd like to see:

Channeled Focus (Rune Focus morph)

Create a rune of celestial protection, which defends you while you stand within it and for up to [x] seconds after leaving it.
The rune grants you Major Resolve and Major Ward, increasing Physical Resistance and Spell Resistance by [x]. You also recover Magicka and Stamina every [x] seconds.

Spear Wall (Aedric Spear Passive)

Increases the amount of damage you can block against melee attacks by [x%].

Balanced Warrior (Aedric Spear Passive)

Increases Weapon Damage and Stamina Recovery by [x%], and Spell Resistance by [x].

Brutusmax1mus · April 2018

For tanking, id like to see stamina returned based on how much damage was absorbed in the other bs morph.

Or maybe, while blocking with the shield active, your shield gains your active mitigation. This would be similar to a quick dragon's blood after a large hit, only not a reactive response to maintaining hp.

I'd like to see all of the ultimates revisited. Nova is so bad now withthe dk and nb changes. My jaw dropped seeing them leave our ultimates so awful. Generally, templars do not use class ultimates. It's dumb and needs a change.

Id like to see a dark flare change. Losing empower will wreck what ever this skill had going for it in pve and pvp. The defile is something at least in pvp, i personally like barrage better with willl be great with my lightning staff weaves.

Minno · April 2018

joaaocaampos wrote: »

Some changes I'd like to see:

Channeled Focus (Rune Focus morph)
Create a rune of celestial protection, which defends you while you stand within it and for up to [x] seconds after leaving it.

The rune grants you Major Resolve and Major Ward, increasing Physical Resistance and Spell Resistance by [x]. You also recover Magicka and Stamina every [x] seconds.

Spear Wall (Aedric Spear Passive)
Increases the amount of damage you can block against melee attacks by [x%].

Balanced Warrior (Aedric Spear Passive)
Increases Weapon Damage and Stamina Recovery by [x%], and Spell Resistance by [x].

I'm down for that. I could use extra stamina recovery for my magplar

tinythinker · April 2018

Saw someone mention Spear Wall. I think I once suggested it offer a chance to reflect some small percent of damage back while blocking in addition to it's existing bonus. Not sure that would be so great now.

Solariken · April 2018

Minno wrote: »

tinythinker wrote: »

Minno wrote: »

- eclipse (fix synergy with hard cc or add root cc)
I like how unique this ability is, but it's execution sucks. It grants cc immunity, but has no follow up mechanic. Total dark should be changed to allow all Templars to use it (Stam, hybrid, mag) and grant minor defense buff/debuff regardless of cc immunity. Unstable core is fine, but needs a root to justify throwing it out more than an actual CC (the DMG is fine as is).

- blazing spear (has no extra resorces and mechanically is clunky compared to wall of elements)
Also weird, gives resorces but harder to land than WOE which is easier to animation cancel. It should grant an AOE DMG at Templar to punish players that get close. If restoring aura gets the shards resource return then both of these morphs could get a defensive buff or be separated to give both mag/Stam morphs.

Minno wrote: »

My idea would still be giving you the chance to throw a spear at a location. But the change is that you'll gain the chance to send out blazing light to burn enemies around you as you cast the spear. This way enemies are punished for coming closer to you, and double punished if the Templar decides to throw the shards in his location to protect his house.

Then you'll have 2 chances to proc burning light; dot DMG that persists in the area, and an AOE DMG similar to how streak initial hit works for sorcs.

I am a broken record for adding a stun to anyone who tries to use a gap closer while affected by Unstable Core, but a root would also work.

The Blazing Spear idea is nice as it works for both PvP and PvE.

I think root works the best for unstable core (maybe because I'm biased UC lover lol):
- gives you a secondary way to burn stamina further justifying the cc immunity.
- root will work with jabs and justify not being able to add in stuns at a reliable pace
- adds to both defense and offense in one ability while also being unique

Solves the pain point of weird cc immunity not giving anything defensive, UC DMG burst gives offensive windows, and solves issues where Templars have a tough time with lining up burst because everything is spread out over multiple GCDs.

I have to naysay the root primarily because I don't want to be on the receiving end of that but also because it then becomes too analogous to Fossilize or Crippling Grasp.

Instead I still think we could use an Eternal Hunt-like root/dmg on both morphs of Rune Focus.

And for Eclipse I would rather just remove the CC interaction completely and reduce the proc dmg/heal a bit to compensate. I want a reliable dmg/utility skill that doesn't muck up my burst/CC combos.

Skander · April 2018

joaaocaampos wrote: »

Some changes I'd like to see:

Channeled Focus (Rune Focus morph)
Create a rune of celestial protection, which defends you while you stand within it and for up to [x] seconds after leaving it.

The rune grants you Major Resolve and Major Ward, increasing Physical Resistance and Spell Resistance by [x]. You also recover Magicka and Stamina every [x] seconds.

Spear Wall (Aedric Spear Passive)
Increases the amount of damage you can block against melee attacks by [x%].

Balanced Warrior (Aedric Spear Passive)
Increases Weapon Damage and Stamina Recovery by [x%], and Spell Resistance by [x].

This is so op i can't even describe it with words

BohnT · April 2018

Skander wrote: »

joaaocaampos wrote: »

Some changes I'd like to see:

Channeled Focus (Rune Focus morph)
Create a rune of celestial protection, which defends you while you stand within it and for up to [x] seconds after leaving it.

The rune grants you Major Resolve and Major Ward, increasing Physical Resistance and Spell Resistance by [x]. You also recover Magicka and Stamina every [x] seconds.

Spear Wall (Aedric Spear Passive)
Increases the amount of damage you can block against melee attacks by [x%].

Balanced Warrior (Aedric Spear Passive)
Increases Weapon Damage and Stamina Recovery by [x%], and Spell Resistance by [x].

This is so op i can't even describe it with words

It's not. Stamplar sustain is the worst in game with only 1 passive 4% cost reduction and no other in combat way to gain resources.
There is no reason why stamplar has to have such bad sustain.

FrancisCrawford · April 2018

Minno wrote: »

technohic wrote: »

Cinbri wrote: »

Can any NA Templars test jabs damage with their friends with exact setups on live and on pts. If damage higher - cp scaling was fixed, if not...

I’d be willing to be on either end on my Stamplar that’s been untouched but it will be Friday evening at the earliest. I have PC issues and won’t have all replacement parts until then. Part of the reason my characters are untouched. Probably best if someone could test before then.

What time you want to test Friday? I can do this quickly during the day (EST zone).

I might be available for that on Friday. Ping me then if you still need a partner.

templesus · April 2018

@ZOS_GinaBruno I'd like to see the ability to use repentance on engine guardian and other monster sets come back. As it stands currently, stamplar sees major sustain issues, and the revival of this will allow for better sustain, whilst not doing anything gamebreaking at the same time. Perhaps increase the amount of stamina it restores and get rid of the health as well to get it on the level of the magickasteal morph?

Minno · April 2018

Solariken wrote: »

Minno wrote: »

tinythinker wrote: »

Minno wrote: »

- eclipse (fix synergy with hard cc or add root cc)
I like how unique this ability is, but it's execution sucks. It grants cc immunity, but has no follow up mechanic. Total dark should be changed to allow all Templars to use it (Stam, hybrid, mag) and grant minor defense buff/debuff regardless of cc immunity. Unstable core is fine, but needs a root to justify throwing it out more than an actual CC (the DMG is fine as is).

- blazing spear (has no extra resorces and mechanically is clunky compared to wall of elements)
Also weird, gives resorces but harder to land than WOE which is easier to animation cancel. It should grant an AOE DMG at Templar to punish players that get close. If restoring aura gets the shards resource return then both of these morphs could get a defensive buff or be separated to give both mag/Stam morphs.

Minno wrote: »

My idea would still be giving you the chance to throw a spear at a location. But the change is that you'll gain the chance to send out blazing light to burn enemies around you as you cast the spear. This way enemies are punished for coming closer to you, and double punished if the Templar decides to throw the shards in his location to protect his house.

Then you'll have 2 chances to proc burning light; dot DMG that persists in the area, and an AOE DMG similar to how streak initial hit works for sorcs.

I am a broken record for adding a stun to anyone who tries to use a gap closer while affected by Unstable Core, but a root would also work.

The Blazing Spear idea is nice as it works for both PvP and PvE.

I think root works the best for unstable core (maybe because I'm biased UC lover lol):
- gives you a secondary way to burn stamina further justifying the cc immunity.
- root will work with jabs and justify not being able to add in stuns at a reliable pace
- adds to both defense and offense in one ability while also being unique

Solves the pain point of weird cc immunity not giving anything defensive, UC DMG burst gives offensive windows, and solves issues where Templars have a tough time with lining up burst because everything is spread out over multiple GCDs.

I have to naysay the root primarily because I don't want to be on the receiving end of that but also because it then becomes too analogous to Fossilize or Crippling Grasp.

Instead I still think we could use an Eternal Hunt-like root/dmg on both morphs of Rune Focus.

And for Eclipse I would rather just remove the CC interaction completely and reduce the proc dmg/heal a bit to compensate. I want a reliable dmg/utility skill that doesn't muck up my burst/CC combos.

I can see that. It's tough because you want to be mobile but we have all these ground effects that look more pretty than painful. Either way players will still complain about eclipse even though zos gave them counterplay.

Was thinking about letting something unique about eclipse (burst rotation protection) but giving it functionality outside cc immunity. Because I really don't see zos removing the cc immunity if they removed the persistent bubble morph from before Morrowind.

Aionna · April 2018

I was wondering now with the change of Healing Ritual we will have the most expensive healing skill line of all other classes? (correct me if I am wrong) I am not counting repentance because I can not use it reliably, it is quite circumstantial and it isn't really free unless you haven't killed the mob, player etc.

Won't our heals be less potent both offensively jabs etc and defensively with the changes in critical healing, putting a strain on our resources?

KwarcPL · April 2018

On Live I'm playing as Nord/DK, but for PTS I've switched to Breton/Templar. I don't know if I'm not used to this play style, but it seems that enemies, especially bosses are harder that usual. I doesn't remember when I was die fighting mainplot boss, but K'Tora killed me multiple times.

Joy_Division · April 2018

KwarcPL wrote: »

On Live I'm playing as Nord/DK, but for PTS I've switched to Breton/Templar. I don't know if I'm not used to this play style, but it seems that enemies, especially bosses are harder that usual. I doesn't remember when I was die fighting mainplot boss, but K'Tora killed me multiple times.

As much as I am tempted to make a snarky remark, what your experiencing is 90% because you are not used to the play style

Elsterchen · April 2018

Joy_Division wrote: »

KwarcPL wrote: »

On Live I'm playing as Nord/DK, but for PTS I've switched to Breton/Templar. I don't know if I'm not used to this play style, but it seems that enemies, especially bosses are harder that usual. I doesn't remember when I was die fighting mainplot boss, but K'Tora killed me multiple times.

As much as I am tempted to make a snarky remark, what your experiencing is 90% because you are not used to the play style

I actually feel the difference of mobs beeing invunerable to elements, too. Just messing around with a template char atm (PC EU) this small effect might be imagination, tho.

Source of changes: PTS patch notes:

Monsters & NPCs

Monsters are no longer vulnerable to elements.
They will not proc Explosion, Disintegration, Deep Freeze, Pestilence, or Venom due to Fire, Shock, Frost, Disease, or Poison attacks used against them.
Likewise, monsters no longer have resistance values reduced against damage dealt by these elements.
Monsters are no longer resistant to elements.
They can now proc Burning, Concussion, Chill, Diseased, or Poison due to Fire, Shock, Frost, Disease, or Poison attacks used against them.
Likewise, monsters no longer have resistance values raised against damage dealt by these elements.

Gigasax · April 2018

They should change the Focus to something like:
Recover XX Amount of Stamina/Magicka (whichever is higher) every 0.5 seconds (sticks to you the whole duration, even if u move out. But gives you the Resistance Buff only if u stand inside the Rune.
Maybe reduce the duration a bit

Brutusmax1mus · April 2018

Think time stop could be the unblockable cc we need? At least vs baddies for X videos lol?

Elsterchen · April 2018

Brutusmax1mus wrote: »

Think time stop could be the unblockable cc we need? At least vs baddies for X videos lol?

Yeah its at least interesting to try. Alas for a stamplar this won't happening I fear.

NyassaV · April 2018

Iḿ not sure if someone has said it so far but templar has a passive that gives 6% more weapon damage. Can we make that with spell damage too. It would be a small yet helpful buff

DeadlyRecluse · April 2018

Brutusmax1mus wrote: »

Think time stop could be the unblockable cc we need? At least vs baddies for X videos lol?

Nope.

One morph is channeled and pretty unusable when outnumbered, the other morph takes 3 seconds to actually take effect. Probably good for static defenses, breaches, group play, etc...but dubious in terms of giving a solo magplar a decent CC.

Solariken · April 2018

Already probably a dozen times this PTS cycle I've sat down to write plea threads for various specific Templar issues like costs, terrible passives, wonky mechanics, and other inconsistencies, but honestly I just feel defeated before I finish my first sentence. This class could be great but I just don't feel like anyone at ZOS is interested. Every pre-PTS hype gets my hopes sky-high, just for them to be smacked to the floor when PTS hits.

I don't know why I even write this comment other than I know you guys are always here to commiserate with.