Smmokkee wrote: »

Derra wrote: »

MagDK using 5x powerlash in a row will not be good for pvp.

Omg right!

I think the powerlash move is just bad. Magdks are gonna be even nastier in pvp. Lol.

Crowd control immunity should not last 7 seconds either. If its 3 seconds to cast again after a ability was interrupted it should be 3 seconds of uninterruptible abilities. 7 seconds?? Thats like a complete fight reset for stam sorcs.

I personally think the healing on dark deal/conversion should be reduced but otherwise the interrupt changes go in the right direction.
Interruptable skills are currently absolutely undesireable/unusable and this changes will put them in a better spot.

Derra wrote: »

DosPanchos wrote: »

Derra wrote: »

MagDK using 5x powerlash in a row will not be good for pvp.

I believe the notes say power lash stuns enemy players which ends off balance...

I´ve tested it on the pts.

I petrify whip powerlash x5

There is no cooldown on off balance and the effect is not consumed when the target is cc immune. Whip sets a stunned or rooted enemy off balance - which means it will 100% guarantee off balance with petrify (you can avoid talons with preemptive dodge).

Just nasty.

These changes to combat are horrible.

Adding a 7 second immunity to interrupts is completely out of hand:
All cast abilities have high damage like Snipe, Dark Flare, crystal explosion, Beam.
Or they offer abilities which were always critical in what they do and where only balanced with the reason that you could interrupt every single cast of the enemy like dark deal.

The high burst abilities need to be interrupteable they already deal absurd burst damage and when you can't even interrupt them anymore the stam and health drain for outnumbered people goes up as they have to block or dodge the skills which means you go up from eating 0 damage because your interrupts where on point. Now you have to dodge which means the cost penalty wrecks your stamina or you block it waste another huge amount of stam and still eat damage + secondary effects


Uninterruptable Dark Deal Sorcs have infinite sustain and especially Stamsorcs would be way too strong.
They already have less counterplay to Dark Deal as individuals of the main interrupts in the game is ignored by the way too powerful BoL.


There should never be a 7 second interrupt immunity this has to be changed

Block cost increase is not balance. It's hate against PvE.

Savos_Saren wrote: »

usmcjdking wrote: »

Powerlash and offbalance is utterly broken on PTS @ZOS_GinaBruno

I am having a hard time landing a regular whip between the infinite power lashes. On a stamina dragonknight I might add.

@usmcjdking

Are you achieving multiple power lashes on a player or on a test dummy?

If you’re testing on a dummy- try dueling someone to see if it works and if breakfree will grant them an immunity to offbalance.

It works on players too, I tested it.

usmcjdking wrote: »

Joy_Division wrote: »

usmcjdking wrote: »

The only gap closer of the bunch that you could argue against nerfing is the WW gap closer.

WW is in such bad shape that any nerf in it's direction makes it even less usable than it currently is.

Templar Focus Charge is both bad and buggy.

@Joy_Division

I haven't noticed anything spectacularily bad about toppling charge but then again I don't play much magplar. It seems to work like any other gap closer with maybe a few more Z axis restrictions.

If the opponent does not move, it sometimes overshoots the target making following up unnecessarily awkward.

That's, of course, when the ability actually closes the gap between the templar and the target, which is always an adventure in-itself.

Skill was designed specifically as an interrupt and a mans for templars to set opponents off-balance. Not that good players use channeled abilities in the first place, but next patch even bad ones will be immune to interrupts after they get free CC immunity from using Eclipse. The skill is so bad, I'm actually envious of DK chains.

https://onedrive.live.com/?authkey=!ABjrX_-CXyfbZYc&cid=5E4F84D7C44DDB09&id=5E4F84D7C44DDB09!701&parId=5E4F84D7C44DDB09!177&o=OneUpFix t

2H weapons have gotten very bland in PVE. They were always trailing way behind dual wield in single target dps and still continue that trend, but when Morrowind was released they had big AOE damage and finally started pulling their weight in crowded dungeons.

These past two updates pretty much killed that off, the sharpened nerf affected 2H more than dual wield and then the forceful passive was cut in half. Now dual wield does everything better again, how about making 2H less lame by bringing back the big AOE damage from light and heavy attack weaving?

the difference between a no shieldplay glyph setup and a shieldplay glyph setup is too small now.
with this small difference shieldplay glyphs are not worth it.
buff shieldplay glyphs, so it does make a notable difference if you use them or not.
a 400% block cost increase is too much, going from 88 to 336.
try to test it with 200, and go from there.

Grabmoore wrote: »

Moglijuana wrote: »

jasonthorpeb14_ESO wrote: »

DosPanchos wrote: »

Derra wrote: »

MagDK using 5x powerlash in a row will not be good for pvp.

I believe the notes say power lash stuns enemy players which ends off balance...

You can set them off balance AFTER they have CC immunity making it get x4 free power lashes, I tested and confirmed it works.

While that sounds awesome...it probably needs to be looked at. Last thing everyone would want in pvp is a bunch of newb MDK's getting a bunch of free damage + heals throughout the entirety of a fight. Maybe increase the GCD of power lash so you can only get 2 off?

Please think objectivly. MagDKs might be dead in PvE due to upcoming off balance changes. Your suggestion puts the nail in the coffin. The game should not be balanced around the minority that is PvP.

I don't have a solution, but CD to Whip is not the answer.

They made these off balance changes for PvE in the first place...so uh... Regardless, a bunch of free power lashes in PvE seems broken too. Giving a small window to use as many power lashes seems fine for now, it just depends on how long a target stays off balance. If it is too long, than every single MagDD will switch to magDK which will just end up getting the class gutted all over again. Put it this way...I have a 14k Power Lash tooltip (on a PvP build mind you)...do you REALLY think it would be fair if I can get 4 off in a row leading to another stun to get another 4 off? Yea that's broken...even in PvE that would be broken.

Dragath wrote: »

the difference between a no shieldplay glyph setup and a shieldplay glyph setup is too small now.
with this small difference shieldplay glyphs are not worth it.
buff shieldplay glyphs, so it does make a notable difference if you use them or not.
a 400% block cost increase is too much, going from 88 to 336.
try to test it with 200, and go from there.

Some more numbers (75 into shadowguard, fortress passive, absorb magic slotted)

Live - 4 Sturdy, 3 Shieldplay - 250
PTS - 4 Sturdy, 3 Shieldplay - 420

Live - 7 Sturdy, 3 Shieldplay - 126
PTS - 7 Sturdy, 3 Shieldplay - 360
PTS - 7 Sturdy, 2 Shieldplay - 425

Something to note, dropping a shieldplay enchant also increases the cost of bash by 304. Not insignificant on certain fights.

FWIW: I run the 250 setup now and it is completely acceptable. full 7 sturdy + 3 shieldplay is still a stretch on PTS. But dropping 1 shield play while full sturdy, would be able to boost magicka recovery a fair amount, which could possibly counter it with more helping hands action -- oin a DK of course, warden tanks aren't looking any good this patch, when they were getting so close to viable for vet trials.

BohnT wrote: »

These changes to combat are horrible.

Adding a 7 second immunity to interrupts is completely out of hand:
All cast abilities have high damage like Snipe, Dark Flare, crystal explosion, Beam.
Or they offer abilities which were always critical in what they do and where only balanced with the reason that you could interrupt every single cast of the enemy like dark deal.

The high burst abilities need to be interrupteable they already deal absurd burst damage and when you can't even interrupt them anymore the stam and health drain for outnumbered people goes up as they have to block or dodge the skills which means you go up from eating 0 damage because your interrupts where on point. Now you have to dodge which means the cost penalty wrecks your stamina or you block it waste another huge amount of stam and still eat damage + secondary effects


Uninterruptable Dark Deal Sorcs have infinite sustain and especially Stamsorcs would be way too strong.
They already have less counterplay to Dark Deal as individuals of the main interrupts in the game is ignored by the way too powerful BoL.


There should never be a 7 second interrupt immunity this has to be changed

Can you explain what ability you feel exactly needs to be always interruptable?

I can´t really think of anything apart from dark deal on stamsorc (conversion on mag does not heal enough and is easily outdmged).

Grabmoore wrote: »

Moglijuana wrote: »

Grabmoore wrote: »

Moglijuana wrote: »

jasonthorpeb14_ESO wrote: »

DosPanchos wrote: »

Derra wrote: »

MagDK using 5x powerlash in a row will not be good for pvp.

I believe the notes say power lash stuns enemy players which ends off balance...

You can set them off balance AFTER they have CC immunity making it get x4 free power lashes, I tested and confirmed it works.

While that sounds awesome...it probably needs to be looked at. Last thing everyone would want in pvp is a bunch of newb MDK's getting a bunch of free damage + heals throughout the entirety of a fight. Maybe increase the GCD of power lash so you can only get 2 off?

Please think objectivly. MagDKs might be dead in PvE due to upcoming off balance changes. Your suggestion puts the nail in the coffin. The game should not be balanced around the minority that is PvP.

I don't have a solution, but CD to Whip is not the answer.

They made these off balance changes for PvE in the first place...so uh... Regardless, a bunch of free power lashes in PvE seems broken too. Giving a small window to use as many power lashes seems fine for now, it just depends on how long a target stays off balance. If it is too long, than every single MagDD will switch to magDK which will just end up getting the class gutted all over again. Put it this way...I have a 14k Power Lash tooltip (on a PvP build mind you)...do you REALLY think it would be fair if I can get 4 off in a row leading to another stun to get another 4 off? Yea that's broken...even in PvE that would be broken.

Do you play PvE? MagDKs have the worst sustain out of all classes. Right now, the class is tolerated only by few guilds and is only viable with 80% off balance (we do hit 4+ flame leashes in a row in PvE).

If the current state of perma offbalance bosses from PTS doesn't stay, the new changes will lead to around 25% offbalance. This is a direct death wish to magdk.

You could think for a better way? Go ahead, but don't let PvP overtake all the balance decisions. It's a niche.

Someone suggested letting Power lash proc off the burning effect instead. that would be a Way, maybe. Burning could be purged at least.

I used to back when MagDK was near top DD yea. PvE turned extremely stale for me, community on console is toxic as can be and to be quite honest, I'm not a fan of the "Run through trials as fast as you can to compete".

Did you not read the in the PTS notes where they said they wanted to have heavy attacks done to maximize resource return at certain parts of boss fights (THIS WOULD BE DURING OFF BALANCE)? There is your resource solution. And it would affect everyone. If you say 80% is the current uptime of off balance...that seems way too high to begin with. That is probably the main problem as to why stam DD is so strong right now as well.

ALSO FLAME LASH USED TO BE A PVP ABILITY . But because off balance is now so prevalent and easy to upkeep, flame lash is used instead. It shouldn't be like that. Why choose an ability that stuns and heals (utility) vs an ability that is supposed to "technically" give you more dps overall? When you run in trials as a DD, healing should be your last priority. Seems like they want to capitalize on that change now.

Instead of making MDKs viable only during off balance (you say 80% right now) change them so they are viable for the whole fight and not just during off balance. Relying strictly on Flame Lash Procs and a BiS monster set seems like an extremely lame way to make MDK viable again.

And yes, I think being able to proc off burning enemies seems like a logical solution. Because you said it yourself, burning can be purged off and provides counter play in pvp.

beetleklee wrote: »

@ZOS_GinaBruno

Can we rework MagDK a bit? I think testing the Flame Lash proc on burning instead of off balance would help. MagDK has awful sustain and the nerf to off balance uptime hurts it the most because this is the only build that really relies on off balance for damage and sustain. This would also let it not overperform in PVP where DOTs/burning can be purged.

Molten Whip can't be sustained either, same with Force Pulse. It'll probably dip to being completely bottom tier for DPS if this change goes live.

It's just disheartening to have a playstyle I enjoy so much and a character I've worked hard on keep getting indirectly nerfed each update when it needs help more than anything.

Also wouldn't mind some cost reduction on skills or a buff to Eruption (it costs a ton and could do more damage.) MagDK's sustain is so bad and this is the final nail in the coffin.

This man gets it.