What skills will break a Tank's taunt?

Ir0nB34r · July 2017

Occasionally when I run dungeons I notice that one of the other players are doing something that breaks my taunt on an enemy. I keep a close eye on the debuff icons on the boss so I know when to taunt and sometimes I will see the taunt disappear and start chasing the player that broke it.

Someone else suggested that they are probably using an ice staff since I guess it has the ability to taunt as well, but only a few of them were.

Mettaricana · July 2017

Anyone elses taunt will steal a tanks taunt frost heavies inner fore and morphs if someone else in party tosses in one of those its gonna get ugly

Lightspeedflashb14_ESO · July 2017

There are bosses that break taunt or are taunt immue, could you remember when seen taunt get lost?

Failing that, there are only few ways to taunt in the game, see here for more info, http://en.uesp.net/wiki/Online:Taunt

Vapirko · July 2017

Taunts are also just a bit odd sometimes and that includes the buff trackers especially if you're using an addon which can imperfect. That combined with bosses that do break taunt could make it seem like the player broke it. But yes ice staves do have a taunt. Also, I'm sure you know this but I'm just throwing it out there, it is possible to overtaunt I believe.

AhPook_Is_Here · July 2017

Ir0nB34r wrote: »

Occasionally when I run dungeons I notice that one of the other players are doing something that breaks my taunt on an enemy. I keep a close eye on the debuff icons on the boss so I know when to taunt and sometimes I will see the taunt disappear and start chasing the player that broke it.

Someone else suggested that they are probably using an ice staff since I guess it has the ability to taunt as well, but only a few of them were.

Some bosses drop agro after using a specific ability unique to each of them, some bosses have no agro at all, like droda.

On the other hand some players decide to use a taunt as part of their damage rotation, usually the S&B taunt. These players are pretty bad, and usually don't realize you are already putting major breech and fracture on the target. I did a pug once with a full heavy, s&b DK who insisted he was dps, though you could tell his damage was awful. I don't mind them taking agro if they want it, just don't take it back from them. The problem gets serious once you taunt it back, it will get about 45 seconds of taunt immunity after your taunt wears off if the dps taunts the target again during that time, netting it about 30 seconds of going after whatever it wants to go after, usually the healer or the dps that is actually doing damage. Of course on bosses with large frontal cones you can't have anyone turning the boss, like firemaw as an example.

If you see someone using a s&b or an ice staff and peeling agro off you, have a talk with them about it, or kick them if you are lazy, but you are going to want to deal with it, or you are just going to get a head-ache.

Tasear · July 2017

Not retaunting in time, makes it seem like that especially with pets in a group. Pets on a boss is a sign of a bad tank.

wolfxspice · July 2017

the synergy for inner fire used to break it, but as far as im aware they fixed it. sometimes it feels like combat pets can break it early, but im not 100% on that.

Dubhliam · July 2017

As already mentioned, some bossed lose aggro as a part of their mechanic (like the Behemoth in RoM) while some don't even have aggro in the first place.

Only three things can aggro: Puncture, Inner Fire and Ice staff HA.
Other than that some sets have special 5th bonus that taunts, but if DDs are using those, you might aswell kick them instantly and put them on your blocklist.

There are often returning players that don't know about the Ice Staff change, so that is the most likely reason.

Royaji · July 2017

Another possible reason:

Pretty much every boss has an attack/mechanic that ignores taunt. For example the-one-shot-lich-skull in Banished Cells or the spinning attack of centurion in Darkshade Caverns. After this attack the boss should return back to you unless your taunt ran out.

code65536 · July 2017

Once you have taunt on an enemy, you will lose it only under one of these three scenarios:

Your taunt expiring on its own because you did not refresh it.
Someone else applies a taunt with one of these four taunt abilities in the game:
- Puncture
- Inner Fire
- Ice Staff heavy
- Tormentor set
Enemies that shed taunt; these are very uncommon, and there are only a handful of enemies in the entire game that have this problem.
- Fungal Grotto II: Spawn of Mephala
- Arx Corininum: Sellistrix
- Ruins of Mazzatun: Xal-Nur and Sludge-Slingers (this will be changed in Update 15)
- Halls of Fabrication: Templar Tactical Facsimiles
- Note: These are just the enemies that prematurely shed taunt. This does not include enemies that are outright untauntable (e.g., Drodda and Planar Inhibitor) or the many enemy abilities whose targeting ignores taunt but does not cause a loss of taunt/aggro.

In short, if you are not letting your taunt expire and you're not tanking one of the special enemies, you should never lose taunt unless someone else overrides your taunt with a taunt of their own. Doing lots of damage or anything else that's not a taunt should not steal aggro.

paulsimonps · July 2017

Vapirko wrote: »

Taunts are also just a bit odd sometimes and that includes the buff trackers especially if you're using an addon which can imperfect. That combined with bosses that do break taunt could make it seem like the player broke it. But yes ice staves do have a taunt. Also, I'm sure you know this but I'm just throwing it out there, it is possible to overtaunt I believe.

They removed overtaunting a long time ago, you can't overtaunt if its only you, but if someone else taunts after you do and you try to retaunt, that will cause taunt immunity.

code65536 wrote: »

Once you have taunt on an enemy, you will lose it only under one of these three scenarios:
Your taunt expiring on its own because you did not refresh it.

Someone else applies a taunt with one of these four taunt abilities in the game:
Puncture

Inner Fire

Ice Staff heavy

Tormentor set

Enemies that shed taunt; these are very uncommon, and there are only a handful of enemies in the entire game that have this problem.
Fungal Grotto II: Spawn of Mephala

Arx Corininum: Sellistrix

Ruins of Mazzatun: Xal-Nur and Sludge-Slingers (this will be changed in Update 15)

Halls of Fabrication: Templar Tactical Facsimiles

Note: These are just the enemies that prematurely shed taunt. This does not include enemies that are outright untauntable (e.g., Drodda and Planar Inhibitor) or the many enemy abilities whose targeting ignores taunt but does not cause a loss of taunt/aggro.

In short, if you are not letting your taunt expire and you're not tanking one of the special enemies, you should never lose taunt unless someone else overrides your taunt with a taunt of their own. Doing lots of damage or anything else that's not a taunt should not steal aggro.

Spider boss in Fungal Grotto 2, the mage with the 3 big spiders, those 3 spiders are also taunt immune, ish. They will taunt at the start but will lose it for a long period, but if you keep taunting them they will go back to you for a brief period before choosing their next target.

Xelrick · July 2017

I tell people who use an Ice staff to not put points into that first passive, as it where the taunt is added to the heavy attack. I did this on my Warden build.

Commonly pets do take aggro, when taunt is lost/purged. Which many trials groups request no pets. Though if you a good tank may have multiple taunts ready to keep taunt up.

Peekachu99 · July 2017

Vapirko wrote: »

Taunts are also just a bit odd sometimes and that includes the buff trackers especially if you're using an addon which can imperfect. That combined with bosses that do break taunt could make it seem like the player broke it. But yes ice staves do have a taunt. Also, I'm sure you know this but I'm just throwing it out there, it is possible to overtaunt I believe.

Overtaunt was patched out some time ago. Can spam it all you want now.

code65536 · July 2017

Xelrick wrote: »

Commonly pets do take aggro, when taunt is lost/purged. Which many trials groups request no pets. Though if you a good tank may have multiple taunts ready to keep taunt up.

This is false. Pets have absolutely zero interference with tank aggro.

The reason pets are disallowed on certain boss fights is due to fight mechanics and have nothing to do with taunt. For example, pets receive Star Fall damage on the Warrior, which deprives melee DPS of safe positions. Pets cause Chain Lightning on The Mage. Pets steal Igneous on Assembly General. Pets can stun adds on the Twins preventing the tanks from chaining them in. Etc.

Xelrick · July 2017

code65536 wrote: »

Xelrick wrote: »

Commonly pets do take aggro, when taunt is lost/purged. Which many trials groups request no pets. Though if you a good tank may have multiple taunts ready to keep taunt up.

This is false. Pets have absolutely zero interference with tank aggro.

The reason pets are disallowed on certain boss fights is due to fight mechanics and have nothing to do with taunt. For example, pets receive Star Fall damage on the Warrior, which deprives melee DPS of safe positions. Pets cause Chain Lightning on The Mage. Pets steal Igneous on Assembly General. Pets can stun adds on the Twins preventing the tanks from chaining them in. Etc.

I did say when taunt is lost/purge should said expires because numerous times we had it where the boss chased the pets moment taunt expires. Which beginner tanks may not be aware of and accuse pet taking taunt... Though this was worse when you couldn't see the debuff.

I agree on the other reasons as well for not using pets in trials.

zaria · July 2017

Xelrick wrote: »

code65536 wrote: »

Xelrick wrote: »

Commonly pets do take aggro, when taunt is lost/purged. Which many trials groups request no pets. Though if you a good tank may have multiple taunts ready to keep taunt up.

This is false. Pets have absolutely zero interference with tank aggro.

The reason pets are disallowed on certain boss fights is due to fight mechanics and have nothing to do with taunt. For example, pets receive Star Fall damage on the Warrior, which deprives melee DPS of safe positions. Pets cause Chain Lightning on The Mage. Pets steal Igneous on Assembly General. Pets can stun adds on the Twins preventing the tanks from chaining them in. Etc.

I did say when taunt is lost/purge should said expires because numerous times we had it where the boss chased the pets moment taunt expires. Which beginner tanks may not be aware of and accuse pet taking taunt... Though this was worse when you couldn't see the debuff.

I agree on the other reasons as well for not using pets in trials.

Only pet with an taunt is the clanfear who have no place in group dungeons unless you solo them, and after homestead it only hold agro if sorcerer is the only one doing damage to enemy. Else I assume scamp can take agro if tank don't taunt.

Regarding pets in trials, does this apply for the warden betty nech to?

Mazbt · July 2017

Some bosses you need to reapply taunt after they do a mechanic since they drop aggro.

KeiruNicrom · July 2017

2 or more taunts from different people will cause Taunt Immunity on the target for either 15 sec or the duration of the first taunt. Not sure which.

There are 4 ways to apply taunt. Puncture(s&b first skill), inner fire(undaunted third skill), ice staff heavy attack with the passive(not sure the name), and using a charge skill with Tormentor set 5 piece equipped(affected skills are the s&b gap closer, 2h gap closer, and templar gap closer)

SirCritical · July 2017

The other issue is - while it's offtopic here - when using the Frozen Gate on mobs, who are in melee fight with a pet, won't be teleported to the caster warden. This makes the pulling effort meaningless.

Strider_Roshin · July 2017

3 or 4 casts of Equilibrium + a Ravage Health potion will disengage a Tank's taunt.

Alpheu5 · July 2017

code65536 wrote: »

Once you have taunt on an enemy, you will lose it only under one of these three scenarios:
Your taunt expiring on its own because you did not refresh it.

Someone else applies a taunt with one of these four taunt abilities in the game:
Puncture

Inner Fire

Ice Staff heavy

Tormentor set

Enemies that shed taunt; these are very uncommon, and there are only a handful of enemies in the entire game that have this problem.
Fungal Grotto II: Spawn of Mephala

Arx Corininum: Sellistrix

Ruins of Mazzatun: Xal-Nur and Sludge-Slingers (this will be changed in Update 15)

Halls of Fabrication: Templar Tactical Facsimiles

Note: These are just the enemies that prematurely shed taunt. This does not include enemies that are outright untauntable (e.g., Drodda and Planar Inhibitor) or the many enemy abilities whose targeting ignores taunt but does not cause a loss of taunt/aggro.

In short, if you are not letting your taunt expire and you're not tanking one of the special enemies, you should never lose taunt unless someone else overrides your taunt with a taunt of their own. Doing lots of damage or anything else that's not a taunt should not steal aggro.

Sellistrix straight up ignores all efforts of taunting. I can spam Puncture and frost staff heavies all I want, she keeps on changing agro. It's gotten to the point where I've had to tell groups that all I can do is debuff her and buff them, and to be ready to dodge roll out of the AoE.

paulsimonps · July 2017

SirCritical wrote: »

The other issue is - while it's offtopic here - when using the Frozen Gate on mobs, who are in melee fight with a pet, won't be teleported to the caster warden. This makes the pulling effort meaningless.

Its cause something like the scamp cause CC immunity. Which is why some groups for example prohibits the use of scamps in the Maw of Lorkhaj Twin fight. One stray hit from the Scamp is enough to cause the immunity.

paulsimonps · July 2017

Alpheu5 wrote: »

code65536 wrote: »

Once you have taunt on an enemy, you will lose it only under one of these three scenarios:
Your taunt expiring on its own because you did not refresh it.

Someone else applies a taunt with one of these four taunt abilities in the game:
Puncture

Inner Fire

Ice Staff heavy

Tormentor set

Enemies that shed taunt; these are very uncommon, and there are only a handful of enemies in the entire game that have this problem.
Fungal Grotto II: Spawn of Mephala

Arx Corininum: Sellistrix

Ruins of Mazzatun: Xal-Nur and Sludge-Slingers (this will be changed in Update 15)

Halls of Fabrication: Templar Tactical Facsimiles

Note: These are just the enemies that prematurely shed taunt. This does not include enemies that are outright untauntable (e.g., Drodda and Planar Inhibitor) or the many enemy abilities whose targeting ignores taunt but does not cause a loss of taunt/aggro.

In short, if you are not letting your taunt expire and you're not tanking one of the special enemies, you should never lose taunt unless someone else overrides your taunt with a taunt of their own. Doing lots of damage or anything else that's not a taunt should not steal aggro.

Sellistrix straight up ignores all efforts of taunting. I can spam Puncture and frost staff heavies all I want, she keeps on changing agro. It's gotten to the point where I've had to tell groups that all I can do is debuff her and buff them, and to be ready to dodge roll out of the AoE.

I would suggest still taunting her. Cause you really want her in the water, and DPS's and Healers have a hard time surviving themselves in the water. So having them on the part of land she can't AoE and you standing in the water making her come back to you everytime makes the fight go SOOOOO much faster. And for those that don't know, she doesn't have the damage shield when she is in the water but when she is in the water the water becomes charged with lightning making it do AoEDoT damage.

Alpheu5 · July 2017

paulsimonps wrote: »

Alpheu5 wrote: »

code65536 wrote: »

Once you have taunt on an enemy, you will lose it only under one of these three scenarios:
Your taunt expiring on its own because you did not refresh it.

Someone else applies a taunt with one of these four taunt abilities in the game:
Puncture

Inner Fire

Ice Staff heavy

Tormentor set

Enemies that shed taunt; these are very uncommon, and there are only a handful of enemies in the entire game that have this problem.
Fungal Grotto II: Spawn of Mephala

Arx Corininum: Sellistrix

Ruins of Mazzatun: Xal-Nur and Sludge-Slingers (this will be changed in Update 15)

Halls of Fabrication: Templar Tactical Facsimiles

Note: These are just the enemies that prematurely shed taunt. This does not include enemies that are outright untauntable (e.g., Drodda and Planar Inhibitor) or the many enemy abilities whose targeting ignores taunt but does not cause a loss of taunt/aggro.

In short, if you are not letting your taunt expire and you're not tanking one of the special enemies, you should never lose taunt unless someone else overrides your taunt with a taunt of their own. Doing lots of damage or anything else that's not a taunt should not steal aggro.

Sellistrix straight up ignores all efforts of taunting. I can spam Puncture and frost staff heavies all I want, she keeps on changing agro. It's gotten to the point where I've had to tell groups that all I can do is debuff her and buff them, and to be ready to dodge roll out of the AoE.

I would suggest still taunting her. Cause you really want her in the water, and DPS's and Healers have a hard time surviving themselves in the water. So having them on the part of land she can't AoE and you standing in the water making her come back to you everytime makes the fight go SOOOOO much faster. And for those that don't know, she doesn't have the damage shield when she is in the water but when she is in the water the water becomes charged with lightning making it do AoEDoT damage.

That's the thing. Taunts don't work at all. I'd be just as well off shouting profanities from where the scroll sits. More often than not, as soon as I lose the initial taunt and the DPSs get hit with the first tick of the AoE, everybody starts skittering about like roaches exposed to the light. Not having the control to keep her in that small space means that the less experienced folks end up dragging her onto the land and making the fight miserable. It's such an easy fight other than that broken mechanic.

paulsimonps · July 2017

Alpheu5 wrote: »

paulsimonps wrote: »

Alpheu5 wrote: »

code65536 wrote: »

Once you have taunt on an enemy, you will lose it only under one of these three scenarios:
Your taunt expiring on its own because you did not refresh it.

Someone else applies a taunt with one of these four taunt abilities in the game:
Puncture

Inner Fire

Ice Staff heavy

Tormentor set

Enemies that shed taunt; these are very uncommon, and there are only a handful of enemies in the entire game that have this problem.
Fungal Grotto II: Spawn of Mephala

Arx Corininum: Sellistrix

Ruins of Mazzatun: Xal-Nur and Sludge-Slingers (this will be changed in Update 15)

Halls of Fabrication: Templar Tactical Facsimiles

Note: These are just the enemies that prematurely shed taunt. This does not include enemies that are outright untauntable (e.g., Drodda and Planar Inhibitor) or the many enemy abilities whose targeting ignores taunt but does not cause a loss of taunt/aggro.

In short, if you are not letting your taunt expire and you're not tanking one of the special enemies, you should never lose taunt unless someone else overrides your taunt with a taunt of their own. Doing lots of damage or anything else that's not a taunt should not steal aggro.

Sellistrix straight up ignores all efforts of taunting. I can spam Puncture and frost staff heavies all I want, she keeps on changing agro. It's gotten to the point where I've had to tell groups that all I can do is debuff her and buff them, and to be ready to dodge roll out of the AoE.

I would suggest still taunting her. Cause you really want her in the water, and DPS's and Healers have a hard time surviving themselves in the water. So having them on the part of land she can't AoE and you standing in the water making her come back to you everytime makes the fight go SOOOOO much faster. And for those that don't know, she doesn't have the damage shield when she is in the water but when she is in the water the water becomes charged with lightning making it do AoEDoT damage.

That's the thing. Taunts don't work at all. I'd be just as well off shouting profanities from where the scroll sits. More often than not, as soon as I lose the initial taunt and the DPSs get hit with the first tick of the AoE, everybody starts skittering about like roaches exposed to the light. Not having the control to keep her in that small space means that the less experienced folks end up dragging her onto the land and making the fight miserable. It's such an easy fight other than that broken mechanic.

She does come back to you if you keep taunting her. I do it all the time, and if you tell people where to stand and to not run away before hand you are good. Immediately to the left of where she stands there is a little bit of land that never gets the AoE. Tell them to stand there, right at the edge of the water and you are golden.

code65536 · July 2017

Alpheu5 wrote: »

code65536 wrote: »

Once you have taunt on an enemy, you will lose it only under one of these three scenarios:
Your taunt expiring on its own because you did not refresh it.

Someone else applies a taunt with one of these four taunt abilities in the game:
Puncture

Inner Fire

Ice Staff heavy

Tormentor set

Enemies that shed taunt; these are very uncommon, and there are only a handful of enemies in the entire game that have this problem.
Fungal Grotto II: Spawn of Mephala

Arx Corininum: Sellistrix

Ruins of Mazzatun: Xal-Nur and Sludge-Slingers (this will be changed in Update 15)

Halls of Fabrication: Templar Tactical Facsimiles

Note: These are just the enemies that prematurely shed taunt. This does not include enemies that are outright untauntable (e.g., Drodda and Planar Inhibitor) or the many enemy abilities whose targeting ignores taunt but does not cause a loss of taunt/aggro.

In short, if you are not letting your taunt expire and you're not tanking one of the special enemies, you should never lose taunt unless someone else overrides your taunt with a taunt of their own. Doing lots of damage or anything else that's not a taunt should not steal aggro.

Sellistrix straight up ignores all efforts of taunting. I can spam Puncture and frost staff heavies all I want, she keeps on changing agro. It's gotten to the point where I've had to tell groups that all I can do is debuff her and buff them, and to be ready to dodge roll out of the AoE.

When she sheds her taunt, it's done in a way where the game applies a phantom taunt to her, which exposes you to the overtaunt mechanic if you try to taunt her back. You can reduce the risk of overtaunt on your end by ensuring that you have 3s or less on your taunt timer before you refresh your taunt.

Although overtaunt (Taunt Immunity) is no longer an issue when one person is taunting, it is an issue when two people apply taunt to the same target. Taunt Immunity is applied after three taunts are applied by two different players, if the first two taunts are shorter than 12s apart. The third taunt will be successful, but Immunity will be applied which prevents the fourth taunt from working.

For example, this is a typical error that happens on Rakkhat in vMoL:

1st taunt: OT taunts Hulk when it spawns
2nd taunt: OT retaunts Hulk after 8s (after half of the 15s taunt timer expires)
3rd taunt: MT takes Hulk away from OT, and the Hulk gains Taunt Immunity
4th taunt: OT tries to taunt Hulk back from MT after pad transition, but find that it takes an extra Pierce or two before the Hulk goes to the OT, because the duration of the Taunt Immunity is slightly longer than the typical duration of a pad transition plus Hulk smash

If, instead, OT watches the taunt timer and retaunts the Hulk after 12s (3s or less remaining on the taunt timer; the Untaunted addon is very useful here), then when the MT takes the Hulk off of the OT, there is no Immunity applied, and the OT will have zero issues taking the Hulk back from the MT.

In the case of Sellistrix, when she sheds taunt, it does so by the game applying a phantom taunt to her. So pretend that you're the OT in vMoL, and she's the Hulk. If you refresh your taunt too early, then when she's "taunted" away, it applies Immunity to her and you need to wait for that Immunity to disappear before your taunt works again (you can see the duration of the Taunt Immunity buff on an enemy if you have a buff tracker that tracks buffs on a target).

BTW, I think Taunt Immunity is an idiotic BS mechanic and that Sellistrix shedding taunt in the way she does is doubly idiotic because it can trigger this BS Taunt Immunity.

(Hey, @ZOS_Finn -- Why in bloody blazes is Taunt Immunity a thing and what the hell do you expect Console players without taunt timers to do on Rakkhat?)

Alpheu5 · July 2017

code65536 wrote: »

Alpheu5 wrote: »

code65536 wrote: »

Once you have taunt on an enemy, you will lose it only under one of these three scenarios:
Your taunt expiring on its own because you did not refresh it.

Someone else applies a taunt with one of these four taunt abilities in the game:
Puncture

Inner Fire

Ice Staff heavy

Tormentor set

Enemies that shed taunt; these are very uncommon, and there are only a handful of enemies in the entire game that have this problem.
Fungal Grotto II: Spawn of Mephala

Arx Corininum: Sellistrix

Ruins of Mazzatun: Xal-Nur and Sludge-Slingers (this will be changed in Update 15)

Halls of Fabrication: Templar Tactical Facsimiles

Note: These are just the enemies that prematurely shed taunt. This does not include enemies that are outright untauntable (e.g., Drodda and Planar Inhibitor) or the many enemy abilities whose targeting ignores taunt but does not cause a loss of taunt/aggro.

In short, if you are not letting your taunt expire and you're not tanking one of the special enemies, you should never lose taunt unless someone else overrides your taunt with a taunt of their own. Doing lots of damage or anything else that's not a taunt should not steal aggro.

Sellistrix straight up ignores all efforts of taunting. I can spam Puncture and frost staff heavies all I want, she keeps on changing agro. It's gotten to the point where I've had to tell groups that all I can do is debuff her and buff them, and to be ready to dodge roll out of the AoE.

When she sheds her taunt, it's done in a way where the game applies a phantom taunt to her, which exposes you to the overtaunt mechanic if you try to taunt her back. You can reduce the risk of overtaunt on your end by ensuring that you have 3s or less on your taunt timer before you refresh your taunt.

Although overtaunt (Taunt Immunity) is no longer an issue when one person is taunting, it is an issue when two people apply taunt to the same target. Taunt Immunity is applied after three taunts are applied by two different players, if the first two taunts are shorter than 12s apart. The third taunt will be successful, but Immunity will be applied which prevents the fourth taunt from working.

For example, this is a typical error that happens on Rakkhat in vMoL:
1st taunt: OT taunts Hulk when it spawns

2nd taunt: OT retaunts Hulk after 8s (after half of the 15s taunt timer expires)

3rd taunt: MT takes Hulk away from OT, and the Hulk gains Taunt Immunity

4th taunt: OT tries to taunt Hulk back from MT after pad transition, but find that it takes an extra Pierce or two before the Hulk goes to the OT, because the duration of the Taunt Immunity is slightly longer than the typical duration of a pad transition plus Hulk smash

If, instead, OT watches the taunt timer and retaunts the Hulk after 12s (3s or less remaining on the taunt timer; the Untaunted addon is very useful here), then when the MT takes the Hulk off of the OT, there is no Immunity applied, and the OT will have zero issues taking the Hulk back from the MT.

In the case of Sellistrix, when she sheds taunt, it does so by the game applying a phantom taunt to her. So pretend that you're the OT in vMoL, and she's the Hulk. If you refresh your taunt too early, then when she's "taunted" away, it applies Immunity to her and you need to wait for that Immunity to disappear before your taunt works again (you can see the duration of the Taunt Immunity buff on an enemy if you have a buff tracker that tracks buffs on a target).

BTW, I think Taunt Immunity is an idiotic BS mechanic and that Sellistrix shedding taunt in the way she does is doubly idiotic because it can trigger this BS Taunt Immunity.

(Hey, @ZOS_Finn -- Why in bloody blazes is Taunt Immunity a thing and what the hell do you expect Console players without taunt timers to do on Rakkhat?)

I'll have to keep an eye out for this next time I'm in there. Oftentimes in regular 4-man dungeons there's no need to worry about the resource management, so spastic taunting to make sure I don't lose agro is pretty habitual.

paulsimonps · July 2017

code65536 wrote: »

Alpheu5 wrote: »

code65536 wrote: »

Once you have taunt on an enemy, you will lose it only under one of these three scenarios:
Your taunt expiring on its own because you did not refresh it.

Someone else applies a taunt with one of these four taunt abilities in the game:
Puncture

Inner Fire

Ice Staff heavy

Tormentor set

Enemies that shed taunt; these are very uncommon, and there are only a handful of enemies in the entire game that have this problem.
Fungal Grotto II: Spawn of Mephala

Arx Corininum: Sellistrix

Ruins of Mazzatun: Xal-Nur and Sludge-Slingers (this will be changed in Update 15)

Halls of Fabrication: Templar Tactical Facsimiles

Note: These are just the enemies that prematurely shed taunt. This does not include enemies that are outright untauntable (e.g., Drodda and Planar Inhibitor) or the many enemy abilities whose targeting ignores taunt but does not cause a loss of taunt/aggro.

In short, if you are not letting your taunt expire and you're not tanking one of the special enemies, you should never lose taunt unless someone else overrides your taunt with a taunt of their own. Doing lots of damage or anything else that's not a taunt should not steal aggro.

Sellistrix straight up ignores all efforts of taunting. I can spam Puncture and frost staff heavies all I want, she keeps on changing agro. It's gotten to the point where I've had to tell groups that all I can do is debuff her and buff them, and to be ready to dodge roll out of the AoE.

When she sheds her taunt, it's done in a way where the game applies a phantom taunt to her, which exposes you to the overtaunt mechanic if you try to taunt her back. You can reduce the risk of overtaunt on your end by ensuring that you have 3s or less on your taunt timer before you refresh your taunt.

Although overtaunt (Taunt Immunity) is no longer an issue when one person is taunting, it is an issue when two people apply taunt to the same target. Taunt Immunity is applied after three taunts are applied by two different players, if the first two taunts are shorter than 12s apart. The third taunt will be successful, but Immunity will be applied which prevents the fourth taunt from working.

For example, this is a typical error that happens on Rakkhat in vMoL:
1st taunt: OT taunts Hulk when it spawns

2nd taunt: OT retaunts Hulk after 8s (after half of the 15s taunt timer expires)

3rd taunt: MT takes Hulk away from OT, and the Hulk gains Taunt Immunity

4th taunt: OT tries to taunt Hulk back from MT after pad transition, but find that it takes an extra Pierce or two before the Hulk goes to the OT, because the duration of the Taunt Immunity is slightly longer than the typical duration of a pad transition plus Hulk smash

If, instead, OT watches the taunt timer and retaunts the Hulk after 12s (3s or less remaining on the taunt timer; the Untaunted addon is very useful here), then when the MT takes the Hulk off of the OT, there is no Immunity applied, and the OT will have zero issues taking the Hulk back from the MT.

In the case of Sellistrix, when she sheds taunt, it does so by the game applying a phantom taunt to her. So pretend that you're the OT in vMoL, and she's the Hulk. If you refresh your taunt too early, then when she's "taunted" away, it applies Immunity to her and you need to wait for that Immunity to disappear before your taunt works again (you can see the duration of the Taunt Immunity buff on an enemy if you have a buff tracker that tracks buffs on a target).

BTW, I think Taunt Immunity is an idiotic BS mechanic and that Sellistrix shedding taunt in the way she does is doubly idiotic because it can trigger this BS Taunt Immunity.

(Hey, @ZOS_Finn -- Why in bloody blazes is Taunt Immunity a thing and what the hell do you expect Console players without taunt timers to do on Rakkhat?)

On something like Rakkath or other bosses with no taunt immunity mechanics like Sellistrix then the taunt immunity caused by multiple people taunting is there to make it so we can't flip the bosses agro between each other. For example, take the Mantikora, you could stand on opposite ends of the room with 2 tanks can't constantly flip agro between each other, causing him to basically spaz out in the middle of the room flipping his head back and forth as people kept taunting him. This would make the boss unable to do most of his attack on anyone and we could DPS him down that much safer. This can work on any boss really except the ones that move around on their own regardless of taunt, like the Lord Warden and Engine Guardian for example. But yea, that is the reason for the taunt immunity from over taunting mechanics. And to be fair, its a good reason. But a bit more of a detailed explanation to exact functions would be appreciates so we can do our best to prevent it in fights like Rakkath, or the start of the Twins.

cbaudersub17_ESO · July 2017

paulsimonps wrote: »

Spider boss in Fungal Grotto 2, the mage with the 3 big spiders, those 3 spiders are also taunt immune, ish. They will taunt at the start but will lose it for a long period, but if you keep taunting them they will go back to you for a brief period before choosing their next target.

In the midst of fighting, the spiders select a random player to attack. There is a visual cue for who and when this happens.

code65536 · July 2017

paulsimonps wrote: »

For example, take the Mantikora, you could stand on opposite ends of the room with 2 tanks can't constantly flip agro between each other, causing him to basically spaz out in the middle of the room flipping his head back and forth as people kept taunting him.

Hmm, yes, that would be a problem. LOL. A scenario like that had never crossed my mind. It is pretty comical, now that I picture it.

In that case, then taunt immunity should be made clearer and I think the timing triggers could be a bit more forgiving, particularly since there are fights where taunt swapping is required.

cbaudersub17_ESO · July 2017

paulsimonps wrote: »

Alpheu5 wrote: »

paulsimonps wrote: »

Alpheu5 wrote: »

code65536 wrote: »

Once you have taunt on an enemy, you will lose it only under one of these three scenarios:
Your taunt expiring on its own because you did not refresh it.

Someone else applies a taunt with one of these four taunt abilities in the game:
Puncture

Inner Fire

Ice Staff heavy

Tormentor set

Enemies that shed taunt; these are very uncommon, and there are only a handful of enemies in the entire game that have this problem.
Fungal Grotto II: Spawn of Mephala

Arx Corininum: Sellistrix

Ruins of Mazzatun: Xal-Nur and Sludge-Slingers (this will be changed in Update 15)

Halls of Fabrication: Templar Tactical Facsimiles

Note: These are just the enemies that prematurely shed taunt. This does not include enemies that are outright untauntable (e.g., Drodda and Planar Inhibitor) or the many enemy abilities whose targeting ignores taunt but does not cause a loss of taunt/aggro.

In short, if you are not letting your taunt expire and you're not tanking one of the special enemies, you should never lose taunt unless someone else overrides your taunt with a taunt of their own. Doing lots of damage or anything else that's not a taunt should not steal aggro.

Sellistrix straight up ignores all efforts of taunting. I can spam Puncture and frost staff heavies all I want, she keeps on changing agro. It's gotten to the point where I've had to tell groups that all I can do is debuff her and buff them, and to be ready to dodge roll out of the AoE.

I would suggest still taunting her. Cause you really want her in the water, and DPS's and Healers have a hard time surviving themselves in the water. So having them on the part of land she can't AoE and you standing in the water making her come back to you everytime makes the fight go SOOOOO much faster. And for those that don't know, she doesn't have the damage shield when she is in the water but when she is in the water the water becomes charged with lightning making it do AoEDoT damage.

That's the thing. Taunts don't work at all. I'd be just as well off shouting profanities from where the scroll sits. More often than not, as soon as I lose the initial taunt and the DPSs get hit with the first tick of the AoE, everybody starts skittering about like roaches exposed to the light. Not having the control to keep her in that small space means that the less experienced folks end up dragging her onto the land and making the fight miserable. It's such an easy fight other than that broken mechanic.

She does come back to you if you keep taunting her. I do it all the time, and if you tell people where to stand and to not run away before hand you are good. Immediately to the left of where she stands there is a little bit of land that never gets the AoE. Tell them to stand there, right at the edge of the water and you are golden.

On the 'special' island, she commits to a direction for an attack. The tank can simply swap sides with the others rather than try to turn her back.