KaiDynasty wrote: »

ZOS said the heal must be used when it was needed. When the flat value is 8k (buffed by major mending), in cyro is 4k, at full health, when you are at 50% of health (and you have 27k of health) this means you can 33% of 13500 = 4450 health (not buffed by major mending, 5700 buffed).
5700 + 4000 = 9k health at 50% of life, so 13 500 + 9 = 22500 health, this is a good buff IMO, considering you are at 50% of life, out of execute range and without major vitality active and the 12% healing received extra from draconic power passives, so.. using the math it doesn't seem bad, a crit can go for 13500 at 50% of life (27k max health), i don't understand the complains, it is a reliable heal right now, and to say the true i prefer this then a heal that could troll me if i got ganked..

Even if we find it to be too weak, it can just be balanced now. The skill at least fits what we want to do.

Stalwart385 wrote: »

KaiDynasty wrote: »

ZOS said the heal must be used when it was needed. When the flat value is 8k (buffed by major mending), in cyro is 4k, at full health, when you are at 50% of health (and you have 27k of health) this means you can 33% of 13500 = 4450 health (not buffed by major mending, 5700 buffed).
5700 + 4000 = 9k health at 50% of life, so 13 500 + 9 = 22500 health, this is a good buff IMO, considering you are at 50% of life, out of execute range and without major vitality active and the 12% healing received extra from draconic power passives, so.. using the math it doesn't seem bad, a crit can go for 13500 at 50% of life (27k max health), i don't understand the complains, it is a reliable heal right now, and to say the true i prefer this then a heal that could troll me if i got ganked..

Even if we find it to be too weak, it can just be balanced now. The skill at least fits what we want to do.

Exactly. They can tweak the base heal to adjust.

None of our other heals have been nerfed; we are still going to have to juggle healing sources a bit but I think this will be quite manageable.

Veg wrote: »

Stalwart385 wrote: »

KaiDynasty wrote: »

ZOS said the heal must be used when it was needed. When the flat value is 8k (buffed by major mending), in cyro is 4k, at full health, when you are at 50% of health (and you have 27k of health) this means you can 33% of 13500 = 4450 health (not buffed by major mending, 5700 buffed).
5700 + 4000 = 9k health at 50% of life, so 13 500 + 9 = 22500 health, this is a good buff IMO, considering you are at 50% of life, out of execute range and without major vitality active and the 12% healing received extra from draconic power passives, so.. using the math it doesn't seem bad, a crit can go for 13500 at 50% of life (27k max health), i don't understand the complains, it is a reliable heal right now, and to say the true i prefer this then a heal that could troll me if i got ganked..

Even if we find it to be too weak, it can just be balanced now. The skill at least fits what we want to do.

It heals for up to 33% of the base value not your missing health.

Yeap I got that.

Stalwart385 wrote: »

I managed to get two similar setups in Cyrodil between live and PTS.

Health: 26.4k Live - 26.4k PTS
Magicka: 35.8k - 36.5k
Spell Damage: 1998 - 1921
Both have 30 in healing done, 20 in healing received and 5-1-1 heavy.
No buffs, same skills on bar and all passives.

On live, at 30% health I healed for 4.6k. On PTS, my base heal was 4.8k. That should hit around 6k at 30% health.

those stats are really low. what sets?

i use 5 trainee 5 kag 2 valk on live

Health: 31k
Magic: 39k
Stamina: 18k

Spell damage: 3.2k buffed
Magic regen: 1100

My dragon blood heals for around 8k when used properly. I got pretty much the same results on the pts. Just less health.

I really hope this cDB works out to be a strong heal. Personally, I'm 100% okay with not having an execute. But if we don't have an execute, I'd like us to be the class that has an anti-execute. Hopefully, cDB can be that.

Veg wrote: »

Stalwart385 wrote: »

KaiDynasty wrote: »

ZOS said the heal must be used when it was needed. When the flat value is 8k (buffed by major mending), in cyro is 4k, at full health, when you are at 50% of health (and you have 27k of health) this means you can 33% of 13500 = 4450 health (not buffed by major mending, 5700 buffed).
5700 + 4000 = 9k health at 50% of life, so 13 500 + 9 = 22500 health, this is a good buff IMO, considering you are at 50% of life, out of execute range and without major vitality active and the 12% healing received extra from draconic power passives, so.. using the math it doesn't seem bad, a crit can go for 13500 at 50% of life (27k max health), i don't understand the complains, it is a reliable heal right now, and to say the true i prefer this then a heal that could troll me if i got ganked..

Even if we find it to be too weak, it can just be balanced now. The skill at least fits what we want to do.

It heals for up to 33% of the base value not your missing health.

Coagulating Blood (Dragon Blood morph):
This morph now heals for a flat value (scaling with Spell Damage and Max Magicka), with that heal being increased by up to 33% based on your missing health.

It should heal for the base value + 33% of the missing health, so or it is bugged, of youo didn't read the correct effect of the skill..

KaiDynasty wrote: »

Veg wrote: »

Stalwart385 wrote: »

KaiDynasty wrote: »

ZOS said the heal must be used when it was needed. When the flat value is 8k (buffed by major mending), in cyro is 4k, at full health, when you are at 50% of health (and you have 27k of health) this means you can 33% of 13500 = 4450 health (not buffed by major mending, 5700 buffed).
5700 + 4000 = 9k health at 50% of life, so 13 500 + 9 = 22500 health, this is a good buff IMO, considering you are at 50% of life, out of execute range and without major vitality active and the 12% healing received extra from draconic power passives, so.. using the math it doesn't seem bad, a crit can go for 13500 at 50% of life (27k max health), i don't understand the complains, it is a reliable heal right now, and to say the true i prefer this then a heal that could troll me if i got ganked..

Even if we find it to be too weak, it can just be balanced now. The skill at least fits what we want to do.

It heals for up to 33% of the base value not your missing health.

Coagulating Blood (Dragon Blood morph):
This morph now heals for a flat value (scaling with Spell Damage and Max Magicka), with that heal being increased by up to 33% based on your missing health.

It should heal for the base value + 33% of the missing health, so or it is bugged, of youo didn't read the correct effect of the skill..

It heals from base value to base value times 1.33. Your missing health % determines how much. So at 50% health you get the base value times 1.165 (if it's linear). At 0% health you would get base value times 1.33. At 100% health you just get base value.

Adenoma wrote: »

I really hope this cDB works out to be a strong heal. Personally, I'm 100% okay with not having an execute. But if we don't have an execute, I'd like us to be the class that has an anti-execute. Hopefully, cDB can be that.

I can understand why people dont feel the need for an execute. I've been playing mDK strictly for pvp since the beta and i REALLY want an execute. And by execute I mean burst damage.

I'm familiar with all the current viable kill mechanics and mDK's dont have one. Meteor to fossilize doesn't cut it anymore. its not reliable. Any viable kill mechanic can be attempted 3+ times per minute or is a guaranteed kill no matter the situation ( i only know of 1 of theses).

With F-leap doing fire damage we are VERY close to having a viable kill mechanic. The only problem is that we have nothing to use with F-leap.

Kill mechanics are combinations of multiple burst damaging abilities. Not just one burst damage ultimate and then back to normal damage. The goal is to get enough damage in a small enough time frame to stop your opponent from healing through it. Of course this doesn't mean we should be able to drop their health from max to zero at any given time.

All we need at this point is very minor offensive buffs. Like I and others suggested before; Replace the shield from F-leap with an offensive buff. Could be a DoT or even increase the damage of your next attack. But give it something. That or make power lash to more damage and heal for less. Example: power lash deals 100% more damage but doesn't heal you.

Veg wrote: »

Adenoma wrote: »

I really hope this cDB works out to be a strong heal. Personally, I'm 100% okay with not having an execute. But if we don't have an execute, I'd like us to be the class that has an anti-execute. Hopefully, cDB can be that.

I can understand why people dont feel the need for an execute. I've been playing mDK strictly for pvp since the beta and i REALLY want an execute. And by execute I mean burst damage.

I'm familiar with all the current viable kill mechanics and mDK's dont have one. Meteor to fossilize doesn't cut it anymore. its not reliable. Any viable kill mechanic can be attempted 3+ times per minute or is a guaranteed kill no matter the situation ( i only know of 1 of theses).

With F-leap doing fire damage we are VERY close to having a viable kill mechanic. The only problem is that we have nothing to use with F-leap.

Kill mechanics are combinations of multiple burst damaging abilities. Not just one burst damage ultimate and then back to normal damage. The goal is to get enough damage in a small enough time frame to stop your opponent from healing through it. Of course this doesn't mean we should be able to drop their health from max to zero at any given time.

All we need at this point is very minor offensive buffs. Like I and others suggested before; Replace the shield from F-leap with an offensive buff. Could be a DoT or even increase the damage of your next attack. But give it something. That or make power lash to more damage and heal for less. Example: power lash deals 100% more damage but doesn't heal you.

Embers tick + Breath tick + Inhale delay + Talons + Lash + Meteor is good damage combo in a short time frame. Just takes an entire bar to do. You really want a cc in there also.

Stalwart385 wrote: »

Veg wrote: »

Adenoma wrote: »

I really hope this cDB works out to be a strong heal. Personally, I'm 100% okay with not having an execute. But if we don't have an execute, I'd like us to be the class that has an anti-execute. Hopefully, cDB can be that.

I can understand why people dont feel the need for an execute. I've been playing mDK strictly for pvp since the beta and i REALLY want an execute. And by execute I mean burst damage.

I'm familiar with all the current viable kill mechanics and mDK's dont have one. Meteor to fossilize doesn't cut it anymore. its not reliable. Any viable kill mechanic can be attempted 3+ times per minute or is a guaranteed kill no matter the situation ( i only know of 1 of theses).

With F-leap doing fire damage we are VERY close to having a viable kill mechanic. The only problem is that we have nothing to use with F-leap.

Kill mechanics are combinations of multiple burst damaging abilities. Not just one burst damage ultimate and then back to normal damage. The goal is to get enough damage in a small enough time frame to stop your opponent from healing through it. Of course this doesn't mean we should be able to drop their health from max to zero at any given time.

All we need at this point is very minor offensive buffs. Like I and others suggested before; Replace the shield from F-leap with an offensive buff. Could be a DoT or even increase the damage of your next attack. But give it something. That or make power lash to more damage and heal for less. Example: power lash deals 100% more damage but doesn't heal you.

Embers tick + Breath tick + Inhale delay + Talons + Lash + Meteor is good damage combo in a short time frame. Just takes an entire bar to do. You really want a cc in there also.

there are a few good combos in theory. In actuality none of them work. I've tried everything. try it yourself if you think it works. In any fight against other skilled players there is nothing i can do to kill them. I can damage them. i can get them to 10% health. But i cannot finish them off.

Also, timing all those dots and hitting meteor is really impossible. Thats a complete theory kill mechanic. It sounds about as good as Valkin Skoria + Flames of oblivion + burning embers + engulfing flames + burning talons + meteor + powerlash in 1 second when reality it is Meteor + powerlash and everything else ticking 1-5 seconds later and your target healing through it.

Like i said, minor offensive buff and were good to go.

Proof: https://youtu.be/fesoLusrnBU?t=8m18s

Stalwart385 wrote: »

Veg wrote: »

Stalwart385 wrote: »

Veg wrote: »

Adenoma wrote: »

I really hope this cDB works out to be a strong heal. Personally, I'm 100% okay with not having an execute. But if we don't have an execute, I'd like us to be the class that has an anti-execute. Hopefully, cDB can be that.

I can understand why people dont feel the need for an execute. I've been playing mDK strictly for pvp since the beta and i REALLY want an execute. And by execute I mean burst damage.

I'm familiar with all the current viable kill mechanics and mDK's dont have one. Meteor to fossilize doesn't cut it anymore. its not reliable. Any viable kill mechanic can be attempted 3+ times per minute or is a guaranteed kill no matter the situation ( i only know of 1 of theses).

With F-leap doing fire damage we are VERY close to having a viable kill mechanic. The only problem is that we have nothing to use with F-leap.

Kill mechanics are combinations of multiple burst damaging abilities. Not just one burst damage ultimate and then back to normal damage. The goal is to get enough damage in a small enough time frame to stop your opponent from healing through it. Of course this doesn't mean we should be able to drop their health from max to zero at any given time.

All we need at this point is very minor offensive buffs. Like I and others suggested before; Replace the shield from F-leap with an offensive buff. Could be a DoT or even increase the damage of your next attack. But give it something. That or make power lash to more damage and heal for less. Example: power lash deals 100% more damage but doesn't heal you.

Embers tick + Breath tick + Inhale delay + Talons + Lash + Meteor is good damage combo in a short time frame. Just takes an entire bar to do. You really want a cc in there also.

there are a few good combos in theory. In actuality none of them work. I've tried everything. try it yourself if you think it works. In any fight against other skilled players there is nothing i can do to kill them. I can damage them. i can get them to 10% health. But i cannot finish them off.

Also, timing all those dots and hitting meteor is really impossible. Thats a complete theory kill mechanic. It sounds about as good as Valkin Skoria + Flames of oblivion + burning embers + engulfing flames + burning talons + meteor + powerlash in 1 second when reality it is Meteor + powerlash and everything else ticking 1-5 seconds later and your target healing through it.

Like i said, minor offensive buff and were good to go.

Proof: https://youtu.be/fesoLusrnBU?t=8m18s

It takes 2 gcd for the majority of the damage plus meteor being slow. They get two or three chances to heal. Which is why I said a cc somewhere would be nice. Never said it was perfect. Haven't pvp'ed on mDK in a while but that's how I used to get burst out of it. I've seen others use similar setup on DK more recently.

well, typically is meteor to fossilize. thats the only guaranteed ultimate hit. Its just not viable because of meteor costing 200 ult and mDKs not having some other form of burst damage. It works on the 99% that dont know how to break free so it makes for nice videos but in actual fights its useless.

For the new CDB, I feel like the base heal needs to be increased, as with battle spirit the heal is practically like live with crit capability. While better, is not quite enough. If the 33% increase is effected by battle spirit (which would appear likely), it will feel like a tiny heal even at low health. Or if you changed the heal increase based to 100% increase based on missing health. 50% increase in pvp on a 4-5k non crit heal (reduced by battle spirit) is not OP.

IxSTALKERxI wrote: »

Here is a rough tooltip comparison to help put things in perspective.

3794 Breath of Life Small heal
4908 dragon blood (without 33% buff)
5314 Blessing of restoration
6527 dragon blood (with 33% buff)
7587 Breath of Life Big heal

Dragon blood is around 6% cheaper than BOL to put that in perspective also.

Hopefully my math is correct haha.


#Magicka DK is back!

On my non-heal spec'd templars, I can non-crit BoLs for 15k in Cyro and been on the receiving end of some 17k+ ones. Napkin math suggests dragon blood will top out in the 10k range. I don't think templars are on the verge of being obsolete (altho that shards nerf... smh).

KaiDynasty wrote: »

KaiDynasty wrote: »

ZOS said the heal must be used when it was needed. When the flat value is 8k (buffed by major mending), in cyro is 4k, at full health, when you are at 50% of health (and you have 27k of health) this means you can 33% of 13500 = 4450 health (not buffed by major mending, 5700 buffed).
5700 + 4000 = 9k health at 50% of life, so 13 500 + 9 = 22500 health, this is a good buff IMO, considering you are at 50% of life, out of execute range and without major vitality active and the 12% healing received extra from draconic power passives, so.. using the math it doesn't seem bad, a crit can go for 13500 at 50% of life (27k max health), i don't understand the complains, it is a reliable heal right now, and to say the true i prefer this then a heal that could troll me if i got ganked..

I forgot to apply battle spirit on the 33% missing health, this mean that the real value is 4000 (flat value) + 2900 (33% of 13500, assuming you have 27k of health and you are at 50% at the moment when you use cgd). Total = 7k of heal at 50% of life, having a 27k of max health, from 13,500/27000 you will be able to heal to 20,500/27000.
Theorically you can reach this value without:
- crit
- buff of 12% of dk passive
- buff by major vitality
It need some tests on pts, but it seem to be reliable now, not broken, not underground. Sorry for the re-repost

You keep doing all of these calculations but they are irrelevant because you've misread the tooltip for the skill:

This morph now heals for a flat value (scaling with Spell Damage and Max Magicka), with that heal being increased by up to 33% based on your missing health.

I've bolded the important part.

This means that the calculation will be base heal multiplied by up to 1.33. So, for example, if the tooltip reads 10k, you should be looking at around 13,333k heal when coag is at it's max scaling. (I'm not factoring battlespirit).

In other words, the amount of max health you have is totally and completely irrelevant to the healing values.

[nvm]