Strider_Roshin wrote: »

pieratsos wrote: »

Strider_Roshin wrote: »

pieratsos wrote: »

Strider_Roshin wrote: »

NightbladeMechanics wrote: »

Strider_Roshin wrote: »

The only thing that should be changed about Incap is the stun. Other than that the cost was fine. Also if any of the 2 morphs should get a cost increase it's soul harvest since the ult regen for magBlades is by far superior to Stamblades.

I personally find the cost increase for Death Stroke in general to be uncalled for. Both morphs should stay at 50.

?

Do you understand the point of passives? It's to make things different. Why bother having ult gen at all if we just increase the cost of ults for classes with high ult gen?

Beats me, ask the developers that. I'm not the one that suggested we increase the cost.

But you agreed that its OP and it needs a nerf. Would you mind explaining us why? or is it because incap got nerfed and u feel bad so nerfing soul harvest too will just make u feel better?

By agree, do you mean pick one out of two of the horribly bias poll options? Neither is OP. Soul harvest is the better morph though. I'd gladly take that as the stamina morph over Incap.

Yeah obviously soul harvest is the better morph. Its the one that everyone complains about.

Everyone complains about it because the majority of the player base is magicka, and Magicka players seem to have a high correlation with whining. Quite frankly, if they'd gave Strife a stam morph, the magicka community would be crying OP about that too. For instance, no one cried about Dawnbreaker until it scaled off of mighty. Like I said, magicka players love to whine. All they need is an excuse.

Dawnbreaker was more OP as magicka than it is as stam. Everyone knew it, but there were other more OP things at the time that had attention.

Also you're completely missing the point of the post you replied to. He was being sarcastic. No one complains about Soul Harvest, ever. Nice broad generalizations though.

Strider_Roshin wrote: »

NightbladeMechanics wrote: »

Strider_Roshin wrote: »

pieratsos wrote: »

Strider_Roshin wrote: »

pieratsos wrote: »

Strider_Roshin wrote: »

NightbladeMechanics wrote: »

Strider_Roshin wrote: »

The only thing that should be changed about Incap is the stun. Other than that the cost was fine. Also if any of the 2 morphs should get a cost increase it's soul harvest since the ult regen for magBlades is by far superior to Stamblades.

I personally find the cost increase for Death Stroke in general to be uncalled for. Both morphs should stay at 50.

?

Do you understand the point of passives? It's to make things different. Why bother having ult gen at all if we just increase the cost of ults for classes with high ult gen?

Beats me, ask the developers that. I'm not the one that suggested we increase the cost.

But you agreed that its OP and it needs a nerf. Would you mind explaining us why? or is it because incap got nerfed and u feel bad so nerfing soul harvest too will just make u feel better?

By agree, do you mean pick one out of two of the horribly bias poll options? Neither is OP. Soul harvest is the better morph though. I'd gladly take that as the stamina morph over Incap.

Yeah obviously soul harvest is the better morph. Its the one that everyone complains about.

Everyone complains about it because the majority of the player base is magicka, and Magicka players seem to have a high correlation with whining. Quite frankly, if they'd gave Strife a stam morph, the magicka community would be crying OP about that too. For instance, no one cried about Dawnbreaker until it scaled off of mighty. Like I said, magicka players love to whine. All they need is an excuse.

Dawnbreaker was more OP as magicka than it is as stam. Everyone knew it, but there were other more OP things at the time that had attention.

Also you're completely missing the point of the post you replied to. He was being sarcastic. No one complains about Soul Harvest, ever. Nice broad generalizations though.

And yet it didn't get a cost increase until stam used it because the magicka community whined about it.

Stam players don't use Soul Harvest, ever. Soul Harvest is not receiving a nerf because it is op. It's collateral damage to another lazy change by ZOS.

And any rational player recognizes that Incap is op. Not sure where you're getting an impression otherwise.

Strider_Roshin wrote: »

NightbladeMechanics wrote: »

Strider_Roshin wrote: »

NightbladeMechanics wrote: »

Strider_Roshin wrote: »

pieratsos wrote: »

Strider_Roshin wrote: »

pieratsos wrote: »

Strider_Roshin wrote: »

NightbladeMechanics wrote: »

Strider_Roshin wrote: »

The only thing that should be changed about Incap is the stun. Other than that the cost was fine. Also if any of the 2 morphs should get a cost increase it's soul harvest since the ult regen for magBlades is by far superior to Stamblades.

I personally find the cost increase for Death Stroke in general to be uncalled for. Both morphs should stay at 50.

?

Do you understand the point of passives? It's to make things different. Why bother having ult gen at all if we just increase the cost of ults for classes with high ult gen?

Beats me, ask the developers that. I'm not the one that suggested we increase the cost.

But you agreed that its OP and it needs a nerf. Would you mind explaining us why? or is it because incap got nerfed and u feel bad so nerfing soul harvest too will just make u feel better?

By agree, do you mean pick one out of two of the horribly bias poll options? Neither is OP. Soul harvest is the better morph though. I'd gladly take that as the stamina morph over Incap.

Yeah obviously soul harvest is the better morph. Its the one that everyone complains about.

Everyone complains about it because the majority of the player base is magicka, and Magicka players seem to have a high correlation with whining. Quite frankly, if they'd gave Strife a stam morph, the magicka community would be crying OP about that too. For instance, no one cried about Dawnbreaker until it scaled off of mighty. Like I said, magicka players love to whine. All they need is an excuse.

Dawnbreaker was more OP as magicka than it is as stam. Everyone knew it, but there were other more OP things at the time that had attention.

Also you're completely missing the point of the post you replied to. He was being sarcastic. No one complains about Soul Harvest, ever. Nice broad generalizations though.

And yet it didn't get a cost increase until stam used it because the magicka community whined about it.

Stam players don't use Soul Harvest, ever. Soul Harvest is not receiving a nerf because it is op. It's collateral damage to another lazy change by ZOS.

And any rational player recognizes that Incap is op. Not sure where you're getting an impression otherwise.

The cost increase I was referring to was Dawnbreaker. Also any rational player realizes that Incap was fine. The only thing I would've changed was to get rid of the stun.

Thought you were talking about Incap.

Dawnbreaker was originally made stam as a nerf to magicka classes' damage with it, fyi. That wasn't a free gift to stam by ZOS' good graces. That was a nerf to magicka.

Everyone accepted that it was op for magicka then, just as it was (is?) op for stam now.

My opinion on Incap is that the stun should be reverted to the old mechanic where you had to be lower % health to cc the opponent, then slightly reduce the damage since stam can stack more damage and procs than magicka. But that's just an opinion. Regardless of how we think it should be fixed, it's commonly accepted that the skill is overperforming on live. That cc is buggy as hell now, the damage is high, and the cost is low. ZOS chose to hit the cost with the nerf hammer. Still that's beside the point of this thread, so I'm not sure why so many stamblades are bringing it up. This thread is about Soul Harvest being caught in the crossfire.

Strider_Roshin wrote: »

thankyourat wrote: »

Strider_Roshin wrote: »

pieratsos wrote: »

Strider_Roshin wrote: »

pieratsos wrote: »

Strider_Roshin wrote: »

NightbladeMechanics wrote: »

Strider_Roshin wrote: »

The only thing that should be changed about Incap is the stun. Other than that the cost was fine. Also if any of the 2 morphs should get a cost increase it's soul harvest since the ult regen for magBlades is by far superior to Stamblades.

I personally find the cost increase for Death Stroke in general to be uncalled for. Both morphs should stay at 50.

?

Do you understand the point of passives? It's to make things different. Why bother having ult gen at all if we just increase the cost of ults for classes with high ult gen?

Beats me, ask the developers that. I'm not the one that suggested we increase the cost.

But you agreed that its OP and it needs a nerf. Would you mind explaining us why? or is it because incap got nerfed and u feel bad so nerfing soul harvest too will just make u feel better?

By agree, do you mean pick one out of two of the horribly bias poll options? Neither is OP. Soul harvest is the better morph though. I'd gladly take that as the stamina morph over Incap.

Yeah obviously soul harvest is the better morph. Its the one that everyone complains about.

Everyone complains about it because the majority of the player base is magicka, and Magicka players seem to have a high correlation with whining. Quite frankly, if they'd gave Strife a stam morph, the magicka community would be crying OP about that too. For instance, no one cried about Dawnbreaker until it scaled off of mighty. Like I said, magicka players love to whine. All they need is an excuse.

That's because stamina builds hit twice as hard in general. so once they start scaling ultimates with mighty it got ridiculous. Before ultimates got changed to physical damage they didn't hit nearly as hard. My stamblade and my magblade both used soul harvest before the change to incap and they both did the same damage in PvP if not my stamblade hit a little harder with soul harvest, that's with 100 points into magic damage CP on my magblade and none on my stamblade. Once ultimates start scaling in dark brotherhood you started seeing 15k incaps and 11k dawnbreakers in PvP. And people should complain that damage is way too high

That's because back when stamblades used soul harvest 3k weapon damage was considered to be incredibly high as well as 30k stamina. Now people can reach numbers such as 4500 WD, and 40k max stam with 18k penetration and they believe the culprit is Incap. I especially like it when people get hit by an Incap from stealth, and blame incap rather than stealth damage.

If there's one thing that's clear, it's that the majority of the ESO community is clueless, and ZOS should really stop listening to them, and instead have their own private testers to assess Burst, sustain, resource management, and survivability among all classes, weapons, and armor types.

Yes power creep is a problem, but survivability and sustain have increased alongside damage. Most abilities are still balanced relative to those. However, a few abilities stick out as dealing too much damage even in the current context of the game.

I also agree that stealth damage is an issue and ZOS needs to recruit trusted players to provide feedback. That is difficult for ZOS to do, though.

I disagree, however, that universal power creep is the only culprit here. I and many others believe that some abilities stick out above the crowd.

I still would have chosen to revert the change to Incap's stun before nerfing its damage or cost, though.