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DW and weapon enchantment proc
miahus
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I recently started using DW and I don't understand how weapon enchants work on it. I tried searching for answers with but couldn't find any. I noticed my offhand's enchantment charge runs out before my main does. I have two daggers main is legendary with a legendary weapon damage enchantment, off hand is epic with an epic poisoned damage enchantment. Could it be that the quality plays a role in how fast the charge drain ? Could someone explain how enchantments proc when using skills like surprise attack, flurry, rending slashes? do both enchants proc on heavy attacks...etc. Thanks in advance.
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Capsaica✭✭✭I found this thread for some discussion around enchantments on weapons. I might be helpful:
https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/218444/weapon-enchantment-proc
Does your off-hand weapon have the infused trait, by any chance? That decreases the enchantment cooldown by 40%, which means that the enchantment can proc more frequently.
Another possibility is that if you're off-hand is a master's or maelstrom weapon, it may be draining faster because of that. I have found that Master's weapons (and I would assume Maelstrom as well) drain charges tremendously fast. I have heard that is because the enchantments on these weapons proc every time that the associated weapon skill is used, but I haven't tested it. I am sure someone has though and can either confirm or correct me.0 -
SirAndy✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭I have two gold daggers that are exactly the same except the enchant on them.
My off-hand one drains *much* faster than the main hand.
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miahus✭✭I found this thread for some discussion around enchantments on weapons. I might be helpful:
https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/218444/weapon-enchantment-proc
Does your off-hand weapon have the infused trait, by any chance? That decreases the enchantment cooldown by 40%, which means that the enchantment can proc more frequently.
Another possibility is that if you're off-hand is a master's or maelstrom weapon, it may be draining faster because of that. I have found that Master's weapons (and I would assume Maelstrom as well) drain charges tremendously fast. I have heard that is because the enchantments on these weapons proc every time that the associated weapon skill is used, but I haven't tested it. I am sure someone has though and can either confirm or correct me.
Thanks for your reply. I am using two sharpened leki's daggers. I read something interesting in the link you provided.
"For Dual Wield weapon abilities, only the Main Hand weapon enchant is used. As weapon abilities cannot proc the Glyph of Rage, placing it on the Main Hand is essentially a wasted enchantment."
I assume glyph of rage is the old name of glyph of weapon damage. What he said must be the reason its charge lasts much longer than the poison charge. Very interesting indeed, now I am wondering whether weapon power enchant is useless on dw at all since non of the abilities can proc it....maybe a crusher enchant would be better?
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Dagoth_Rac✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭I recently started using DW and I don't understand how weapon enchants work on it. I tried searching for answers with but couldn't find any. I noticed my offhand's enchantment charge runs out before my main does. I have two daggers main is legendary with a legendary weapon damage enchantment, off hand is epic with an epic poisoned damage enchantment. Could it be that the quality plays a role in how fast the charge drain ? Could someone explain how enchantments proc when using skills like surprise attack, flurry, rending slashes? do both enchants proc on heavy attacks...etc. Thanks in advance.
Weapon damage enchant lasts 5 seconds and has a 10 second cooldown. Poison damage enchant is instant and has a 4 second cooldown. The difference in cooldown lets the poison enchant proc more often and thus the enchant charges run out faster.3 -
SirAndy✭✭✭✭✭
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I have weapon damage on my main hand and it *does* proc ...I assume glyph of rage is the old name of glyph of weapon damage. What he said must be the reason its charge lasts much longer than the poison charge. Very interesting indeed, now I am wondering whether weapon power enchant is useless on dw at all since non of the abilities can proc it....maybe a crusher enchant would be better?
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Cryptical✭✭✭✭✭
✭I dual wield. It's my understanding that weapon glyphs have a proc chance on light / heavy attacks and weapon abilities only.
Not sure if the quality affects the number of charges a weapon glyph has. Probably does, and that skews what you're seeing.
I think how you use them also impacts whether they proc evenly or unevenly. It looks to me like a single light attack swings the main (right) hand, and another immediate light attack then swings the off (left) hand. But I think if you do a light attack that swings the main hand and then do some other things, then weave in a light attack it swings the main hand again. So if you only ever weave in a single light attack periodically, it nearly always swings the right hand and the left hand weapon hardly ever gets used. This means it matters which glyph is put where, it would suck to accidentally put an important absorb resource glyph on the side that gets rarely used.Xbox NA0 -
miahus✭✭I have two gold daggers that are exactly the same except the enchant on them.
My off-hand one drains *much* faster than the main hand.
what's the enchant on them?I dual wield. It's my understanding that weapon glyphs have a proc chance on light / heavy attacks and weapon abilities only.
Not sure if the quality affects the number of charges a weapon glyph has. Probably does, and that skews what you're seeing.
I think how you use them also impacts whether they proc evenly or unevenly. It looks to me like a single light attack swings the main (right) hand, and another immediate light attack then swings the off (left) hand. But I think if you do a light attack that swings the main hand and then do some other things, then weave in a light attack it swings the main hand again. So if you only ever weave in a single light attack periodically, it nearly always swings the right hand and the left hand weapon hardly ever gets used. This means it matters which glyph is put where, it would suck to accidentally put an important absorb resource glyph on the side that gets rarely used.
I have a weapon damage enchant on my main, and always weave with surprise attack, yet my off hand runs out of charges way before my main. Above, someone linked a discussion on dw and how weapon skills never proc weapon damage enchant. That could be the reason why its charges don't drain as fast. Still doesn't explain why my offhand's charges run out faster though. Do weapon skills use offhand enchant? I am lost here.
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SirAndy✭✭✭✭✭
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Weapon Damage on the main hand and Crushing on the offhand
Both proc but the offhand drains much faster ...
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miahus✭✭
Weapon Damage on the main hand and Crushing on the offhand
Both proc but the offhand drains much faster ...
you might want to rethink having a weapon damage enchant on your main IF what @DeanTheCat said is still true in 2016.0 -
undefeatdgaul✭✭✭
Weapon Damage on the main hand and Crushing on the offhand
Both proc but the offhand drains much faster ...
you might want to rethink having a weapon damage enchant on your main IF what @DeanTheCat said is still true in 2016.
...and what would that be?
Edited by undefeatdgaul on September 23, 2016 6:31PM0 -
DeanTheCat✭✭✭✭✭undefeatdgaul wrote: »
Weapon Damage on the main hand and Crushing on the offhand
Both proc but the offhand drains much faster ...
you might want to rethink having a weapon damage enchant on your main IF what @DeanTheCat said is still true in 2016.
...and what would that be?
Weapon Damage enchantment cannot proc off weapon abilities, light/heavy attacks only. Weapon abilities only factor in the main hand enchant for procs. Which means that if you use any weapon abilities, put the +weapon damage enchantment in the off hand. No other enchantment has this extra condition.
Edit: Forgot to mention, the cooldown on that glyph got changed to 10sec a while ago. Do factor that in your considerations.Edited by DeanTheCat on September 24, 2016 8:02AMDean the Cat
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This one hails from far Singapore, excuse this one for his high pings. He also apologizes for any formatting/spelling errors, as he tends to answer using a mobile device.
Insanity is the price of Knowledge. Herma-Mora and Sheogorath, this one bows before thee.
This one does not advocate for any class to be nerfed. There are far deeper underlying issues then a simple "Class Imbalance". The Champion System is the problem. Not classes.
Please read this before creating yet another nerf thread.
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miahus✭✭DeanTheCat wrote: »undefeatdgaul wrote: »
Weapon Damage on the main hand and Crushing on the offhand
Both proc but the offhand drains much faster ...
you might want to rethink having a weapon damage enchant on your main IF what @DeanTheCat said is still true in 2016.
...and what would that be?
Weapon Damage enchantment cannot proc off weapon abilities, light/heavy attacks only. Weapon abilities only factor in the main hand enchant for procs. Which means that if you use any weapon abilities, put the +weapon damage enchantment in the off hand. No other enchantment has this extra condition.
Edit: Forgot to mention, the cooldown on that glyph got changed to 10sec a while ago. Do factor that in your considerations.
Do you know how crusher enchantment work ? is it similar to weapon damage or other damage enchants (poison, disease, shock...etc) I want to know before I waste another kuta. I honestly feel now that weapon damage enchant is a waste on DW, whether on main or off hand.
Edited by miahus on September 24, 2016 8:48AM0 -
DeanTheCat✭✭✭✭✭DeanTheCat wrote: »undefeatdgaul wrote: »
Weapon Damage on the main hand and Crushing on the offhand
Both proc but the offhand drains much faster ...
you might want to rethink having a weapon damage enchant on your main IF what @DeanTheCat said is still true in 2016.
...and what would that be?
Weapon Damage enchantment cannot proc off weapon abilities, light/heavy attacks only. Weapon abilities only factor in the main hand enchant for procs. Which means that if you use any weapon abilities, put the +weapon damage enchantment in the off hand. No other enchantment has this extra condition.
Edit: Forgot to mention, the cooldown on that glyph got changed to 10sec a while ago. Do factor that in your considerations.
Do you know how crusher enchantment work ? is it similar to weapon damage or other damage enchants (poison, disease, shock...etc) I want to know before I waste another kuta. I honestly feel now that weapon damage enchant is a waste on DW, whether on main or off hand.
@miahus
Crusher Enchantments are more in-line with standard damage enchantments in the nature that they can proc off Weapon Abilities. They have a 5 second cooldown with a 5 second uptime, so you can have potentially permanent uptime on said enchant. The value of a crusher enchantment is relative to the amount of armour that a target has. The heavier the armour of the target, the more value a crusher enchantment gives. In general though, the 1k odd resist that is reduced by the crusher enchantment is worth round 2% extra damage (2.5% on mobs).
To answer your question in the OP about heavy attacks, heavy attacks activate both enchantments at the same time in one attack, with the mainhand enchant activating first followed by the offhand enchantment. The damage order is roughly this:
1) Heavy Attack - Mainhand Stike
2) Mainhand Enchant
3) Off-Hand Enchant
4) Heavy Attack (Dual Wield) - Offhand Strike (50% of the damage of the mainhand)Dean the Cat
Somewhat Insane Puddicat
EU-PC Megaserver; Ebonheart Pact, Alliance Rank 34
This one hails from far Singapore, excuse this one for his high pings. He also apologizes for any formatting/spelling errors, as he tends to answer using a mobile device.
Insanity is the price of Knowledge. Herma-Mora and Sheogorath, this one bows before thee.
This one does not advocate for any class to be nerfed. There are far deeper underlying issues then a simple "Class Imbalance". The Champion System is the problem. Not classes.
Please read this before creating yet another nerf thread.
My guides:0 -
miahus✭✭DeanTheCat wrote: »DeanTheCat wrote: »undefeatdgaul wrote: »
Weapon Damage on the main hand and Crushing on the offhand
Both proc but the offhand drains much faster ...
you might want to rethink having a weapon damage enchant on your main IF what @DeanTheCat said is still true in 2016.
...and what would that be?
Weapon Damage enchantment cannot proc off weapon abilities, light/heavy attacks only. Weapon abilities only factor in the main hand enchant for procs. Which means that if you use any weapon abilities, put the +weapon damage enchantment in the off hand. No other enchantment has this extra condition.
Edit: Forgot to mention, the cooldown on that glyph got changed to 10sec a while ago. Do factor that in your considerations.
Do you know how crusher enchantment work ? is it similar to weapon damage or other damage enchants (poison, disease, shock...etc) I want to know before I waste another kuta. I honestly feel now that weapon damage enchant is a waste on DW, whether on main or off hand.
@miahus
Crusher Enchantments are more in-line with standard damage enchantments in the nature that they can proc off Weapon Abilities. They have a 5 second cooldown with a 5 second uptime, so you can have potentially permanent uptime on said enchant. The value of a crusher enchantment is relative to the amount of armour that a target has. The heavier the armour of the target, the more value a crusher enchantment gives. In general though, the 1k odd resist that is reduced by the crusher enchantment is worth round 2% extra damage (2.5% on mobs).
To answer your question in the OP about heavy attacks, heavy attacks activate both enchantments at the same time in one attack, with the mainhand enchant activating first followed by the offhand enchantment. The damage order is roughly this:
1) Heavy Attack - Mainhand Stike
2) Mainhand Enchant
3) Off-Hand Enchant
4) Heavy Attack (Dual Wield) - Offhand Strike (50% of the damage of the mainhand)
Thanks for your detailed answer. I still have one more question. In one of your old posts explaining the damage types, you mention that disease damage has a low DoT, however when I was testing it, there was no dot at all. Was it changed? I can clearly see the damage numbers from poison DoT, but nothing at all from disease.0 -
DeanTheCat✭✭✭✭✭DeanTheCat wrote: »DeanTheCat wrote: »undefeatdgaul wrote: »
Weapon Damage on the main hand and Crushing on the offhand
Both proc but the offhand drains much faster ...
you might want to rethink having a weapon damage enchant on your main IF what @DeanTheCat said is still true in 2016.
...and what would that be?
Weapon Damage enchantment cannot proc off weapon abilities, light/heavy attacks only. Weapon abilities only factor in the main hand enchant for procs. Which means that if you use any weapon abilities, put the +weapon damage enchantment in the off hand. No other enchantment has this extra condition.
Edit: Forgot to mention, the cooldown on that glyph got changed to 10sec a while ago. Do factor that in your considerations.
Do you know how crusher enchantment work ? is it similar to weapon damage or other damage enchants (poison, disease, shock...etc) I want to know before I waste another kuta. I honestly feel now that weapon damage enchant is a waste on DW, whether on main or off hand.
@miahus
Crusher Enchantments are more in-line with standard damage enchantments in the nature that they can proc off Weapon Abilities. They have a 5 second cooldown with a 5 second uptime, so you can have potentially permanent uptime on said enchant. The value of a crusher enchantment is relative to the amount of armour that a target has. The heavier the armour of the target, the more value a crusher enchantment gives. In general though, the 1k odd resist that is reduced by the crusher enchantment is worth round 2% extra damage (2.5% on mobs).
To answer your question in the OP about heavy attacks, heavy attacks activate both enchantments at the same time in one attack, with the mainhand enchant activating first followed by the offhand enchantment. The damage order is roughly this:
1) Heavy Attack - Mainhand Stike
2) Mainhand Enchant
3) Off-Hand Enchant
4) Heavy Attack (Dual Wield) - Offhand Strike (50% of the damage of the mainhand)
Thanks for your detailed answer. I still have one more question. In one of your old posts explaining the damage types, you mention that disease damage has a low DoT, however when I was testing it, there was no dot at all. Was it changed? I can clearly see the damage numbers from poison DoT, but nothing at all from disease.
Disease DoT was removed some time ago (I forgot which patch). Still, the fact that it has minor defile still makes it one of the better enchantments for PvP combat.Dean the Cat
Somewhat Insane Puddicat
EU-PC Megaserver; Ebonheart Pact, Alliance Rank 34
This one hails from far Singapore, excuse this one for his high pings. He also apologizes for any formatting/spelling errors, as he tends to answer using a mobile device.
Insanity is the price of Knowledge. Herma-Mora and Sheogorath, this one bows before thee.
This one does not advocate for any class to be nerfed. There are far deeper underlying issues then a simple "Class Imbalance". The Champion System is the problem. Not classes.
Please read this before creating yet another nerf thread.
My guides:0 -
SirAndy✭✭✭✭✭
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Since this is for dual wield and i do weave in light/heavy attacks with my abilities, i'm not sure that would really make any difference.DeanTheCat wrote: »Weapon Damage enchantment cannot proc off weapon abilities, light/heavy attacks only. Weapon abilities only factor in the main hand enchant for procs. Which means that if you use any weapon abilities, put the +weapon damage enchantment in the off hand. No other enchantment has this extra condition.
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SublimeSparo✭✭✭✭✭Poison glyph will proc when you steel tornado, weapon damage glyph will only proc on light/heavy attacks.
I thought that poison would only proc on steel tornado if that enchantment was on main hand... maybe they changed itEdited by SublimeSparo on September 26, 2016 3:39AMPS4 EU CP900. PS4 NA CP600,
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