have you properly tested or just making assumptions?

Nikkor wrote: »

3 seconds.

it will be no more op than vicious death.

Run it with vd

Xael wrote: »

Erondil wrote: »

Ep1kMalware wrote: »

Erondil wrote: »

Ep1kMalware wrote: »

How is this OP? I wouldn't trade this for my vicious ophidian I might run it on a trials healer maybe. Onlu looks good for burning down adds wi]ith aoe dmg. could be good in trials where some ADDS have millions of health.

Read my OP again I said in organised group PvP,in PvE I know its situationnal

I read your OP, it's even more situational in pvp. It MIGHT be *decent* if you're grinding in sewers and get jumped. but the 3 measly seconds only apply after a kill. whoopie doo!

In organised raid PvP its not situationnal at all... its OP with a very high uptime for almostevery outnumbered fight. Ofc for solo/pugging its situationnal.

Please address my post and tell me how it's OP.
Please explain to me how much damage you have before you have the buff. If there are no jewelry pieces you will not have a lot of damage 5 slotting this set. I already showed how much Weapon Damage you can get minus Class passives, FG passives, and Assault passives.

Currently my Stam Sorc has over 6k Weapon Damage when buffed without FG and Assault passives. This set is not even close to providing the damage I get on any of my stamina characters. You didn't test it, you are just looking at a tool tip and making a knee jerk reaction without even considering what you have to give up just to slot 5 pieces. Moreover it's not even confirmed there is jewelry yet, data mining has never been reliable.

They could make the buff 60 minutes long and give it a 10k proximity, it wouldn't make it any more op. Until we see jewelry and a proper delve with damage stacking you are crying wolf.

Did you just prove that you have no clue about how the game works or did you intend to sound absurd? 25% raw damage on everything is way more than 25% more weapon damage (its like ~50% weapon damage I think) Lets assume with this set slotted you lose at max 650 weapon damage, 650 is 25% of 2600 which is low, heck even if you lose 1000 compared to your 6k wep dmg setup its nowhere close to a dps loss and yet you talk about it as if it needed a buff. Do you get 3k weapon damage from another 5p set I wasnt aware of? This set would be op in any situation if it wasnt the way to procc it and the short duration, the bonus itself is just insane damage buff and heck having it permanently would be worth 8 pieces easy. Now of course the conditions to have it up make it balanced in *most* situations but when you are in an organised PvP group of 6-24 I can say from experience that there is more than 1 dead/3sec when you need damage. So yes in such a group its out of control (unless nearby means 5 meters true)
I dont claim to do science in this thread, but please next time do some maths once really quick before writing a post were you sound so arrogant. Thanks.

Erondil wrote: »

Xael wrote: »

Erondil wrote: »

Ep1kMalware wrote: »

Erondil wrote: »

Ep1kMalware wrote: »

How is this OP? I wouldn't trade this for my vicious ophidian I might run it on a trials healer maybe. Onlu looks good for burning down adds wi]ith aoe dmg. could be good in trials where some ADDS have millions of health.

Read my OP again I said in organised group PvP,in PvE I know its situationnal

I read your OP, it's even more situational in pvp. It MIGHT be *decent* if you're grinding in sewers and get jumped. but the 3 measly seconds only apply after a kill. whoopie doo!

In organised raid PvP its not situationnal at all... its OP with a very high uptime for almostevery outnumbered fight. Ofc for solo/pugging its situationnal.

Please address my post and tell me how it's OP.
Please explain to me how much damage you have before you have the buff. If there are no jewelry pieces you will not have a lot of damage 5 slotting this set. I already showed how much Weapon Damage you can get minus Class passives, FG passives, and Assault passives.

Currently my Stam Sorc has over 6k Weapon Damage when buffed without FG and Assault passives. This set is not even close to providing the damage I get on any of my stamina characters. You didn't test it, you are just looking at a tool tip and making a knee jerk reaction without even considering what you have to give up just to slot 5 pieces. Moreover it's not even confirmed there is jewelry yet, data mining has never been reliable.

They could make the buff 60 minutes long and give it a 10k proximity, it wouldn't make it any more op. Until we see jewelry and a proper delve with damage stacking you are crying wolf.

Did you just prove that you have no clue about how the game works or did you intend to sound absurd? 25% raw damage on everything is way more than 25% more weapon damage (its like ~50% weapon damage I think) Lets assume with this set slotted you lose at max 650 weapon damage, 650 is 25% of 2600 which is low, heck even if you lose 1000 compared to your 6k wep dmg setup its nowhere close to a dps loss and yet you talk about it as if it needed a buff. Do you get 3k weapon damage from another 5p set I wasnt aware of? This set would be op in any situation if it wasnt the way to procc it and the short duration, the bonus itself is just insane damage buff and heck having it permanently would be worth 8 pieces easy. Now of course the conditions to have it up make it balanced in *most* situations but when you are in an organised PvP group of 6-24 I can say from experience that there is more than 1 dead/3sec when you need damage. So yes in such a group its out of control (unless nearby means 5 meters true)
I dont claim to do science in this thread, but please next time do some maths once really quick before writing a post were you sound so arrogant. Thanks.

so the situation you describe it being op in is an organized pvp raid group right? " Now of course the conditions to have it up make it balanced in *most* situations but when you are in an organised PvP group..."

Here is the thing. An organized pvp group is already going to roll stomp outnumbered players or pugs. As you stated, "... 6-24 I can say from experience that there is more than 1 dead/3sec when you need damage. " if this is true coupled with the fact stated in the previous paragraph, then how is this set op? if the only situation in which you describe it as being op is the same situation in which the other players were already getting torn up with the same outcome, then why is it any different? does it not bring it back to a situational set that only truly benefits in situational fights? wouldn't it be easier for those players in organized groups to run sets that they will truly benefit from or not even change what they have?

im not sure about your math because frankly im too lazy. However, the premise on which your math rests is fundamentally flawed. A set can not be op if the outcome for the one situation in which it has a constant up time is the same. In the end it does not provide any greater benefit than sets people currently wear at best. At worst the down time outside of the fights you mentioned will simply make it a situational gimic that will thrive best with gankers or talented 1vx players.

Ep1kMalware wrote: »

im not sure about your math because frankly im too lazy. However, the premise on which your math rests is fundamentally flawed.

Selfish statement made in blind ignorance + education and common sense = flaming everyone in defense of being put in place.

think I nailed it.

Not sure how my statement was selfish nor made in blind ignorance. One, it is merely an objective determination. Two, i think my argument stands for itself on my lack of ignorance. I used objective and logical reasoning to come to a conclusion that proves your argument false.

I really dont even understand what you are trying to accomplish by quoting a sentence out of what i wrote and writing something about it. nor do i understand how your comment contributes to the discussion. If you wan to have a logical debate/discussion, then I am game. Howevre, dont come at me with your nonsense statements.

Edited: I realize now you may not have been directing negativity in my direction but the other pwrson. I did not look at the names closely enough and thought you were the person I originally commented to. I apologize if this is true and making that preaumption. For that I apologize. However, if that is not the case above still stands for the most part

Ep1kMalware wrote: »

bowmanz607 wrote: »

Ep1kMalware wrote: »

im not sure about your math because frankly im too lazy. However, the premise on which your math rests is fundamentally flawed.

Selfish statement made in blind ignorance + education and common sense = flaming everyone in defense of being put in place.

think I nailed it.

Not sure how my statement was selfish nor made in blind ignorance. One, it is merely an objective determination. Two, i think my argument stands for itself on my lack of ignorance. I used objective and logical reasoning to come to a conclusion that proves your argument false.

I really dont even understand what you are trying to accomplish by quoting a sentence out of what i wrote and writing something about it. nor do i understand how your comment contributes to the discussion. If you wan to have a logical debate/discussion, then I am game. Howevre, dont come at me with your nonsense statements. Your ignorance is showing.

Your argument proved ,my comment to a scientific law now lol/ it's selfish because you want nerfs without knowledge of how it works/functions in ANY environment. Others tried logical discussion and you flamed them for it. Your argument CANNOT stand as it has no legs in which to do so.

You must be a special snowflake nightblade upset that other classes will get a nonskill buff that you think only you should have. If it's so OP then where's your argument to remove reaper's mark from the game?

I think we are fighting for the same team here. I don't think it should be nerfed. Heck I haven't tested it yet. I was proving the other guy/gal that wanted it nerfed because of one situation they belive it can be op in.

My argument is based on the other posters fundamental premise on which he based his argument. My comments were not an attack at the players math which is why I stated I did not look at math. It was aimed at the underlying argument the poster was making regarding the flawed logic.

Aoe trash fights are going to be fun with that on...

Xael wrote: »

Erondil wrote: »

Xael wrote: »

Erondil wrote: »

Ep1kMalware wrote: »

Erondil wrote: »

Ep1kMalware wrote: »

How is this OP? I wouldn't trade this for my vicious ophidian I might run it on a trials healer maybe. Onlu looks good for burning down adds wi]ith aoe dmg. could be good in trials where some ADDS have millions of health.

Read my OP again I said in organised group PvP,in PvE I know its situationnal

I read your OP, it's even more situational in pvp. It MIGHT be *decent* if you're grinding in sewers and get jumped. but the 3 measly seconds only apply after a kill. whoopie doo!

In organised raid PvP its not situationnal at all... its OP with a very high uptime for almostevery outnumbered fight. Ofc for solo/pugging its situationnal.

Please address my post and tell me how it's OP.
Please explain to me how much damage you have before you have the buff. If there are no jewelry pieces you will not have a lot of damage 5 slotting this set. I already showed how much Weapon Damage you can get minus Class passives, FG passives, and Assault passives.

Currently my Stam Sorc has over 6k Weapon Damage when buffed without FG and Assault passives. This set is not even close to providing the damage I get on any of my stamina characters. You didn't test it, you are just looking at a tool tip and making a knee jerk reaction without even considering what you have to give up just to slot 5 pieces. Moreover it's not even confirmed there is jewelry yet, data mining has never been reliable.

They could make the buff 60 minutes long and give it a 10k proximity, it wouldn't make it any more op. Until we see jewelry and a proper delve with damage stacking you are crying wolf.

Did you just prove that you have no clue about how the game works or did you intend to sound absurd? 25% raw damage on everything is way more than 25% more weapon damage (its like ~50% weapon damage I think) Lets assume with this set slotted you lose at max 650 weapon damage, 650 is 25% of 2600 which is low, heck even if you lose 1000 compared to your 6k wep dmg setup its nowhere close to a dps loss and yet you talk about it as if it needed a buff. Do you get 3k weapon damage from another 5p set I wasnt aware of? This set would be op in any situation if it wasnt the way to procc it and the short duration, the bonus itself is just insane damage buff and heck having it permanently would be worth 8 pieces easy. Now of course the conditions to have it up make it balanced in *most* situations but when you are in an organised PvP group of 6-24 I can say from experience that there is more than 1 dead/3sec when you need damage. So yes in such a group its out of control (unless nearby means 5 meters true)
I dont claim to do science in this thread, but please next time do some maths once really quick before writing a post were you sound so arrogant. Thanks.

You read a tooltip and became the town crier, literally asking for change based off pretended insight. You have not even tested it yet. You did claim to do science, do I need to quote you again? Please stop with the double speak.
You gloss over my point regarding a weapon damage build and misapply an analogy as if we are talking about the same thing. We are not. You act like Major Berserk is something new. It's not. Nightblades have had Major Berserk and Minor Berserk for quite some time and it's far from gamebreaking. Keeping Major Berserk up on characters that already have average damage is far from overpowered. I don't care how organized your group is, you are a zerg. Zergs already run down players particularly solo and smallscale players. Nothing changes. You already make a false statement about being able to get 1 kill every 2 seconds with your zerg, if that's the case how does Major Berserk even matter at this point? It's moot.

Until jewelry is found for this set, it's not worth using over Clever Alchemist. That said, you are not going to see gamebreaking damage from stamina builds in Cyrodiil running this set as their only 5 piece. I don't care if the buff is permanent, 25% added to average damage just makes you slightly above average. It will pale in comparison to any raw damage stacking build.

You have not tested anything.
Yet you ask for a nerf before seeing whether the set works

• as intended
• as expected
• at all

This is foolish.

Please quote where I said I'm doing science, cant wait for it. Or go check a dictionnary the word "parallelism" (not sure its the exact english grammar tho) wiser solution.
I read a tooltip and deduct thanks to my daily experience that this tooltip means something op for the kind of group I play in, sure its not as reliable as a proper test (not possible until patch goes live, and they barely change anything if its live) but its the best you can get as it concerns a situation I experience everyday. Please tell me how nightblade got major berserk with 70% uptime? By only recasting one single target non dmg skill so you can barely dps when its up and need to give up a slot... with this set you can just keep spinning and you get it automatically not even on killing blows, see the difference? When I run in a raid its usually from 6 to 12 and fighting agaisnt as many as possible, we often end a fight with 100+ targets hits on ftc although there is npc etc (we dont attack smallscale groups) please keep on assuming wrong stuff, youre making fool of yourself more and more. When you have 10 ppl agaisnt 50, yes you gonna have 1 ennemy dead every 2 second usually avg (when you are pushing and dmging somewhere ofc not when moving etc) but thanks to ress etc it doesnt mean at all that the fight is won lol. Again you are asking me to test instead of basing my deductions on what I experience and the tooltip but youre doing even worse... you are assuming stuff you probably never experienced and about people you dont know and make it sound like its completely obvious. Funny.
The second part of your comment makes you look even more foolish to anybody who knows a bit about theorycrafting. Keep in mind your damage output isnt only dependent of weapon damage but also of max stamina and crit and cp, thats why no set is close dps wise to major berserk with a 70% uptime (and from experience unless the radius is 5 meter, true, it will be the case for the kind of group/raid/zerg/whatever you want I play with)
The last part of your comment is the only one I agree with, but its imo irrelevant. Yes I assumed the set would work as intended, I'm sorry, but its supposed to by default, and if its not they will eventually fix it which would lead to the same problem.

I'd say it's about comparable to VD in a group bomb scenario; if say VD is more powerful though... Everywhere else the duration is to short to be effective

Xael wrote: »

Xsorus wrote: »

I'd say it's about comparable to VD in a group bomb scenario; if say VD is more powerful though... Everywhere else the duration is to short to be effective

VD is way better.
I am done with OP, talking to him is like trying to nail a piece of Jell-O to the wall.

Nightblades can buff minor or major berserk (8% or 25%), you can slot 4 pieces of Night's Silence (same 4pc as set discussed) and use the rest of your slots for maximizing weapon damage. All you need to do is test your damage abilities without the berserk buff and then with it. It's the closest way to see how much damage will come from this set.

I can assure you, unless this set has jewelry, it's not very strong at all.
Currently on live, most Stam builds that maximize weapon damage hit much harder than what this set offers without jewelry. OP is a confused zerg player.
The damage I put out currently on live on any of my stamina characters make this set look like garbage.

@Xsorus keep in mind the person who started this thread not only HAS NOT tested this set, he hasn't even gone as far as I have with the nightblade berserk buff with an identical set. I mean seriously, asking for a nerf when we don't even know if the set even works in the first place... moreover by a player who hasn't done one iota of testing... shameful.
Threads like these are completely ridiculous and terrible for the community and for the game.

I think VD is more powerful but I could see this set being useful for like steel tornado for example... It's an anti zerg set basically like VD but it requires more effort. I don't really think it'll be that overpowered simply cause night blades have had a 5 second version forever with no problems

Xael wrote: »

Xsorus wrote: »

I'd say it's about comparable to VD in a group bomb scenario; if say VD is more powerful though... Everywhere else the duration is to short to be effective

VD is way better.
I am done with OP, talking to him is like trying to nail a piece of Jell-O to the wall.

Nightblades can buff minor or major berserk (8% or 25%), you can slot 4 pieces of Night's Silence (same 4pc as set discussed) and use the rest of your slots for maximizing weapon damage. All you need to do is test your damage abilities without the berserk buff and then with it. It's the closest way to see how much damage will come from this set.

I can assure you, unless this set has jewelry, it's not very strong at all.
Currently on live, most Stam builds that maximize weapon damage hit much harder than what this set offers without jewelry. OP is a confused zerg player.
The damage I put out currently on live on any of my stamina characters make this set look like garbage.

@Xsorus keep in mind the person who started this thread not only HAS NOT tested this set, he hasn't even gone as far as I have with the nightblade berserk buff with an identical set. I mean seriously, asking for a nerf when we don't even know if the set even works in the first place... moreover by a player who hasn't done one iota of testing... shameful.
Threads like these are completely ridiculous and terrible for the community and for the game.

Lol k show me the maths on how you come to the conclusion that another setup give almost same dps output than major berserk with 80% uptime. Stamina nightblade cant sustain 80% uptime on major berserk with RM in the kind of group I play in, and it would require them 1 cast ever 7-8 seconds which is already ~12% dps loss, not even counting the slot loss. Nothing comparable. Already asked for your maths but seems like you dont want (or havent done)
I spend half my pvp time solo half my time in group of 6 to 12, you can call it zerg I dont care really, except that if you would google zerg you would quickly figure 6-12 very organized vs more is not zerging unless you made up your own and new definition of the word that I'm not aware of.
You keep saying I havent tested the set but you assume stuff about dps without doing the maths behind and its hahaha laughable. If we assume that this set is working as intended, there is only one thing to test as otherd pointed out its its radius. If its less than 6 peters true this thread is irrelevant. If its more then this thread perfectly has its place.

Suggestion:

• Change it to read "when you kill an enemy" instead of "when a nearby enemy dies".
• Increase the duration to 5 seconds instead of 3.