You should add a maelstrom bow to your endgame gear setup. Alternatively you can try the marksman set, which is quite good for pvp.

I have played a character that used a bow on both bars for pvp and pve. I ended up switching to bow and dw or bow and t0wo handed because double bow is under powered. There are several reasons why this build under performs.

• In pvp, gap closers will keep you from kiting effectively. In many fights there is no point to range because the enemy can engage you at will.
• Melee weapons do consistently more damage, which is understandable given the advantage of being at range. However, you can't stay at range easily because of gap closers. This makes the bow under perform.
• The cast time of snipe, our main spammable dps skill, makes it hard to use effectively in combat, especially at close range. The flip side of this is when ganking, you can have multiple snipe attacks in the air before the enemy is hit by the first one.

That said, the bow does have a lot going for it. Bow is great for ganking/burst dps from stealth. Poison injection is an amazing dot and execute. Bow is really useful when defending keeps because of the superior range. The root effect of bombard is crazy good in both pve and pvp. Use that at the breach of a keep and, with a little help from oils/siege, you can effectively defend the keep. With a maelstrom bow arrow barrage does a lot of damage. Snipe does great damage and has the best range of any power in the game. Even magnum and draining shot can be useful - so few people slot it that you will catch an enemy player off guard when you hit them with it to disengage/kite. There is a lot to like in this skill line.

It would be nice if the bow had a buff skill that granted major brutality, similar to two handed or dual weild. It would also be nice if the skill like was strong enough to allow players to go bow primary for all aspects of game play. But the bow is currently in a pretty good place as a range and utility weapon.

psychotic13 wrote: »

I've been looking for some archer builds to learn from but I can't really find anything on up to date builds? And I don't really see that many people using a bow. I mainly pvp so that's the area I'm looking for.

I currently have started leveling a khajiit, and would like to primarily use a bow, have about 350CP and I'm thinking for endgame:

x5 Hundings rage
x3 agility (all WD robust)
X1 Bloodspawn
x1 Molag Kena

Is this a viable choice? Or is marksman a better option?

Appreciate any information given, and bar setups and builds shared

Considering the bolded portion, I recommend 5 Marksman and 5 Sheer Venom. Of course, to get Sheer Venom you'd have to do a ton of vIP farming. Otherwise 5 Marksman + 5 Hundings -or- 5 Marksman + 5 Night Mother's.

Also, as someone recommended above, a vMA bow would really help to supplement your build. There isn't really a better option out there right now.

psychotic13 wrote: »

You say 5 hundings and 5 marksmen. But won't 3agility 1bloodspawn and 1 kena be better than that?

Marksman gives you the stamina recovery that Blood Spawn would, and it gives you the WD that Kena would. So the real question is whether or not the 129 WD and ~900 stamina (from agility) is worth more or less than 8% bow damage to players. The answer varies with how exclusively you use your bow. An 8% damage increase is worth more than 129 WD and stamina, but not if you spend too much time on your 2H bar. If all you do is use bow abilities, then yeah it's better than kena+bs+agility. At least I'm pretty sure. It might be worth running the numbers to double-check me, if you want.

Well I meant 3agility kena and Bloodspawn over Hundings rage? Agility and kena is more WD than Hundings? Then you get recovery from the Bloodspawn and I think it's 1400 stam from agility over the 957 from Hundings? Just losing out on the crit.

So X5 marksman, agility kena and Bloodspawn would be best? (With maelstrom bow in the future)

Yeah Hundings was my first idea, but from what I've gathered marksman is better if you're using the bow more, and that's how intend to play. So I'm thinking 5marksman agility kena and Bloodspawn may be the best option.

I should have great sustain too right? Regen from Bloodspawn , X2 regen from marksman and the 5% lower cost too.

I haven't even tried doing the vIP yet, and yeah I'm a nb so can get the crit from assassination abilitys, precise and I'm khajiit so there's an extra bit too.

Thanks for all the feedback guys, how do your bars stand on a bow build?

Autolycus wrote: »

You mentioned you tested it, and I'm curious as to the result. How did you test it? The reason I ask is because a Blood Spawn test might not be the most reliable method of measuring your performance against a player. You'd ideally have another player be a meat shield for you for a few attempts to get a better idea. Just food for thought, not a criticism. I'm sure your tests were well-conducted.

I'm on console so the tests were really rudimentary and not well conducted. I basically spent an afternoon in pvp swapping between the sets and noting the numbers I put up with the new combat text. I faced some of the same opponents a few times, but I was more focused on playing than on doing any kind of rigorous test. I also had the marksman set in purple (gold bow) whereas my other set is all gold (except the agility jewelry, obviously). So it was a pretty weak sauce test.

Your posts actually have me interested enough in this to revisit it tonight to test again.

psychotic13 wrote: »

Which ultimate do you suggest for archer builds? I don't really think I have a good choice of ranged ultimates apart from meteor which is flame/ice damage which isn't optimal. I guess I'll end up using the disease version of death stroke which will be a good ultimate, but I'd rather a ranged one.

Also I read something and people were suggesting to use radiant mage light for the out of combat empowerment so your first stealth snipe do a lot of damage.

Right now, the best option for your off-bar ultimate is meteor. It's not ideal since you can't buff it with your CP, but it still does a large amount of damage and suits your ranged setup.

Empowering your opening snipe can be quite useful, provided you actually need to. With high enough stam and weapon damage it's unnecessary, especially with Sheer Venom. I don't empower snipes, but that doesn't make it a bad strategy. I've seen a lot of people suggest it, and I consider it a valid option. Something to keep in mind is that it's virtually a wasted spot once the fight begins. Depending on what you give up to slot it, you could be foregoing a great deal of passive or active utility and/or damage. It's best suited for gank builds that really plan on doing nothing but ganking.

Edit: I re-read my post and felt like it sounded kind of elitist. I just wanted to make it clear that the empower strategy is viable and there's nothing wrong with doing it. Personal preference and validity aren't the same thing; I might not like using it, but that doesn't make it bad

@psychotic13

You might want to consider Werewolf on your off bar as well. Though this means that you will not have a ranged ultimate, WW allows you to stack your Two-handed bar with nothing but buffs, and you can rely on the powerful WW Form to serve as a "3rd bar" dedicated towards melee combat. It isn't that hard to build up the ultimate needed as an archer, and since both ultimates are melee range, by the time you are forced into melee, your transformation would be ready to use.

Another thing to note is that Thaumaturge also boosts the initial hit of Poison Arrow, which means that investment into Thaumaturge will pay off if you intend to use Poison Arrow a lot. Though the ability is technically a DoT, you sometimes have to spam it instead of Snipe due to lag causing your channels to not fire, or if you are facing an opponent who is firing Crushing Shock or Venom Arrow at you. Investment into Thaumaturge will bring the damage of the initial hit to be comparable to something like Force Shock.

Bow heavy attacks also do a lot of damage, comparable to a Snipe; in addition to being free and restoring resources. If your opponent gives you the time to go for a fully charged heavy attack, go for it. Most seasoned veterans of the Alliance War instinctively Dodge Snipes due to the sound it makes. Almost nobody however dodges a bow heavy due to it being silent and nearly invisible.

Shield Breaker and Marksmen is a deadly combo for a Bow Primary Build. Just saying.

@psychotic13

WW is not an "Overlol" type 3rd bar per se, when you transform into a Werewolf, you trade all your current skills and weapons for an powered up form that is highly resistant to damage. You keep all your Armour and Set bonuses, as well as getting a huge boost to Armour, Maximum Stamina, Weapon Damage and Movement Speed. In this form, you gain 5 powerful abilities, which more then makes up for the loss of your traditional abilities by their sheer power.

Pounce is a gapcloser that stuns, which may include AoE damage as a morph option.

Hircine's Blessing is a heal that can be morphed to amp your damage further, or morphed into a heal over time.

Roar is an AoE fear, which has more effects the the base Nightblade fear, as it also off-balances targets in addition to fearing them. The off-balance persists even after they CC-Break, and the morphs provide either Major Brutality or a chain reaction CC-effect.

Piercing Howl is a heavy hitter with a 10m range that can be spammed over and over due to it's instant cast. The damage that this ability does is on par with an empowered Wrecking Blow, and it also knockdowns targets for 3 seconds. You can morph it to cause +30% damage to feared enemies, allowing you to hit them for over 17k damage in a single howl.

Finally, Claws is an AoE DoT that applies a disease damage DoT to all enemies in a cone. Disease damage by it's very nature provides Minor Defile, and the morphs allow the Claws to either heal you for half the damage caused, or apply Major Defile to enemies affected, further gutting their healing.

All in all, the Werewolf is an extremely potent form that can easily wreck targets it faces. Though once you do transform into a Werewolf, expect the enemy to focus fire you, as a Werewolf if left unchecked is capable of wrecking entire parties.

I'm currently running:

5 pcs Marksman
3 pcs Agility
2 pcs Leki
1 pc Kena

on my Stamblade. All Divines with Warrior Mundus

On my Bow bar I have:

Shadowy Disguise (100% Crit)
Magnum Shot
Venom Arrow (Interrupt)
Bombard (AoE)
Focused Aim (Gank)

CP:

Steed: 30 Resistant
Lady: 75 Hardy, 48 Elemental Defender
Tower: 30 Warlord
Lover: 100 Mooncalf, 22 Arcanist
Shadow: 10 Tumbling
Atronach: 30 Bow Expert
Ritual: 100 Mighty, 17 Precise Strikes, 15 Piercing

With the next update, I'm planning on going 5 pcs Marksman and 5 pc Vicecanon of Venom and switching my Bow morphs to Draining Shot (Magnum Shot atm) and Lethal Arrow (instead of Focused Aim). I'm keeping Venom Arrow for the interrupt.

But that means I'm gonna have to spend some time in Maelstrom >_> for the Bow and a 2h sword

psychotic13 wrote: »

Hmm, not sure if I like the idea of the WW abilities taking up space on the bar and can only be used when in WW form, which as an archer isn't going to be a lot, again as an archer I don't want to be the main target, being a WW makes me exactly that.

Jaiden wrote: »

I been working a bow/2h build with bow being primary and it has worked out very well. I'm a bosmer NB, bow bar is Ambush, surprise attack, poison injection, camo hunter, draining shot with flawless Ult. 2h bar is cloak(crit morph), rapids, vigor, rally, relentless focus, shooting star Ult. Notice I've combined both melee and bow abilities on my bow bar. I've focused on 2h to be a buff bar. This allows seamless gameplay while shooting arrows when someone jumps you.

My gear is 5 hundings/ 5 marksman, molag kena shoulders. I don't quite remember my weapon damage on bow but I believe it's about 3800 buffed. My stam regen is like right under 2k. I have almost 33k stam, and CP's are spread into mighty, precise and the armor decrease.

I've enjoyed very good results with this build. If running with a zerg, draining shot can be replaced with bombard, and rapids can be replaced with caltrops. Also if you already have a high crit, you can put shuffle in place of camo hunter. Some people ask me why no fear on my bar? I tried this in the beginning, but with blue food my magicka was just under 10k and it was unreliable when I needed it. I found draining shot was better for the resources along with the synergy of knocking them back and I instantly Ambush/ surprise attack to them. Poison injection hits like a truck too and most people while in the fight fail to notice the 5k+ poison ticks creeping on them. And it hits while roll dodging. With the upcoming changes to draining shot popping a heal when disorient ends, this gives you another spot heal option. Hope you enjoy!

I'd prefer to have the bow bar for just range, why don't you use snipe out of curiosity?

I'm thinking of setting up my bow bar like:
1)Venom Arrow (want the interrupt as I'm used to crushing shock)
2) Lethal Arrow
3) Relentless Focus will now deal disease damage and extra stam regen
4) Shadow Image/magnum shot great for creating space and confusing the enemy
5) Cloak

Tryxus wrote: »

I'm currently running:

5 pcs Marksman
3 pcs Agility
2 pcs Leki
1 pc Kena

on my Stamblade. All Divines with Warrior Mundus

On my Bow bar I have:

Shadowy Disguise (100% Crit)
Magnum Shot
Venom Arrow (Interrupt)
Bombard (AoE)
Focused Aim (Gank)

CP:

Steed: 30 Resistant
Lady: 75 Hardy, 48 Elemental Defender
Tower: 30 Warlord
Lover: 100 Mooncalf, 22 Arcanist
Shadow: 10 Tumbling
Atronach: 30 Bow Expert
Ritual: 100 Mighty, 17 Precise Strikes, 15 Piercing

With the next update, I'm planning on going 5 pcs Marksman and 5 pc Vicecanon of Venom and switching my Bow morphs to Draining Shot (Magnum Shot atm) and Lethal Arrow (instead of Focused Aim). I'm keeping Venom Arrow for the interrupt.

But that means I'm gonna have to spend some time in Maelstrom >_> for the Bow and a 2h sword

What's your overall unbuffed stats? And what race are you?

What's the set bonuses of this 'vice canon of venom' set??

Unbuffed



Food, buffs and in stealth



Gives me Focused Aims of about 17k



Vicecanon of Venom set:



Might go for that set, but it'll depend whether or not I find a proper Maelstrom Bow

psychotic13 wrote: »

Nice, I've just looked at the updated Dreugh King Slayer set and that looks pretty good too.

2pc - weapon damage
3pc - weapon damage
4pc - crit
5pc - killing an enemy grants major expedition, it also says grants major brutality, hopefully that means passively and not when killing an opponent. This would mean I don't have to be tied to the 2h and I'd have a space on the ability bar, can anyone confirm this?

Dreugh King Slayer actually got a huge nerf when they changed the 5 piece. You have free Major Expedition every time you roll dodge with your bow out, and Perma- Major Brutality with Rally. Seems only good for a 1H/Shield + DW build that doesn't want to slot any buffs...

I run hundings 5 and marksman 5 if i use bow as main dps. I critical hit some people for 12k with out stealth bonus.