MaxwellCrystal wrote: »@Attackopsn
You really can't compare and AoE ability that does laughbly low damage in PvP to a single target ability that's just wrong. The passive may make it sound like it does work but why do you rarely see DKs utilizing this ultimate in PvP? It's because it has no use especially if my target can simply do one dodge roll to get out of it. Your best bet is to compare take flight against incap which incap does amazingly better as its super low cost and provides all those benefits which is BS.
Lava_Croft wrote: »I guess it's just a coincidence that every single 'real' Nightblade, namely one that has played a Nightblade since the release of ESO, seems to agree that Incapacitating Strike in its current form on the PTS is overpowered.
This includes people who have been playing a Stamina Nightblade since March 2014.
well your wrong i dont and have played nighblades since early access
as an aside its really interesting that aside from this thread in all others you have claimed to be playing a sorc or magblade
There are ppl stating sorc shields on live are too weak aswell.
cant wait to hit one with a cc just before his shields expire so many are gonna have to l2p now there is a viable counter play that doesnt involve a dodgy set that nerfs your build
Just reduces build variety and nerfs any non cookie-cutter build more than those already tripplestacking. You´ll still need shieldbreaker but atleast that´s now a vailed and needed option against stamina and magica alike.
not really with the gcd by the time a triple stacker has cast the klast one the first will now be half expired. if they continue to try and keep all three up they arent doing any damage so its gonna be a double or single shield and thats where a timley cc with burst helps.
on a mag blade the obvious choice is to whittle there stamThe_Outsider wrote: »Data from PTS (too lazy for screenshot):
Fully Buffed: Major Brutality + Relentless Focus
3.8k Weapon Damage
32k Stamina
Incap tooltip: 17k
so in pvp 8.5k then sounds reasonable
After having tested with templates on pts: I don´t think the dmg is a real issue. The stun on an instant non avoidable (unless you were already dodging/blocking) high dmg ability is.
Incap + relentless focus on pts puts any burst my sorc can put out to shame. The problem being that if you eat that incap the assassins scourge will hit you 100% (sorc burst gives the target a timer with curse and frags are easily dodged even in melee).
Admittedly only had a short time playing with that - still i think it´s the most potent burst skill combination currently in the game.
I´m not sure if i would adjust anything but if - it would be the stun on incap not the dmg (i´d replace it with a snare or short root).
Re: stun on incap.
NB's have fear. Fear is
1, unblockable
2, not breaking on subsequent damage
3, a *** to break out of, virtually guaranteeing next hit won't be blocked/rolled.
Why on earth would anyone NOT use fear on a CC-vulnerable opponent before hitting him with an ultimate is beyond me. Stun on incap is a total non-factor, IMHO.
Seriously this ability is extremely overpowered. It is making stamina nightblade over the top again. Does way too much damage.Oh and worst of all it is the lowest costing ulti in the game. I'm fine with the knock down change but come on with this damage change. What were you thinking zos?
Y'all have fun with this argument. Instead of it being about a single ability it has turned into a class balance war. I'm sure nothing will get changed and people will complain about it (to include those defending it). Enjoy your arguing folksI appreciate some of the feedback.
Re: stun on incap.
NB's have fear. Fear is
1, unblockable
2, not breaking on subsequent damage
3, a *** to break out of, virtually guaranteeing next hit won't be blocked/rolled.
Why on earth would anyone NOT use fear on a CC-vulnerable opponent before hitting him with an ultimate is beyond me. Stun on incap is a total non-factor, IMHO.
zos could take the stun away and I wouldn't notice, but then that means they need to replace the stun with something else. hmmm
Band Camp statements: To state "But this one time I saw X doing X... so that justifies X" Refers to the Band camp statement.
Coined by Maxwell
MaxwellCrystal wrote: »@Sharee
Take flight has an AoE property but it does high damage on single targets that's why the comparison to incap strike is better than a useless ultimate (in PvP that is) being compared to an OP ultimate like Incap strike.
It can be used 28m away and be dodged from that far away too; I mean you can literally side step the ability and it misses so no lol that doesn't make it better. I should also mention it's obvious to dodge I mean I literally have to CC someone while incap is literally instant and hard to see. It can hit 6 targets without being affected by the cap but you'll rarely hit over 10k damage but compare that to incap strike and the benefits it provides; seriously it's pretty damn good for NBs.
Also how is it not better.
Take Flight AoE ability that CCs upon impact
Can be used 28m away (41 in PvP with passives)
125 Ulti Cost
Passives restore resources upon use
Incap Strike
Stuns target for 6 seconds
Increases damage against hit targets by 20%
Major defile applied upon hit
Passive increases crit damage by 2191 (Rank 2)
So let me ask you which is better again? I'd take Incap strike over a take flight that can dodge players might I also add with the changes the incap strike will knock down enemies when used against them at any health threshold. Yup that's balance.
Re: stun on incap.
NB's have fear. Fear is
1, unblockable
2, not breaking on subsequent damage
3, a *** to break out of, virtually guaranteeing next hit won't be blocked/rolled.
Why on earth would anyone NOT use fear on a CC-vulnerable opponent before hitting him with an ultimate is beyond me. Stun on incap is a total non-factor, IMHO.
Because if you hit them with fear => incap the next hit is most likely to be dodged.
If you directly attack them with incap => assassins scourge they get hit for a 20% buffed scourge that is absolutely not avoidable.
Strider_Roshin wrote: »
The_Outsider wrote: »Data from PTS (too lazy for screenshot):
Fully Buffed: Major Brutality + Relentless Focus
3.8k Weapon Damage
32k Stamina
Incap tooltip: 17k
MaxwellCrystal wrote: »Incap Strike
Stuns target for 6 seconds
Increases damage against hit targets by 20%
Major defile applied upon hit
Passive increases crit damage by 2191 (Rank 2)
So let me ask you which is better again? I'd take Incap strike over a take flight that can dodge players might I also add with the changes the incap strike will knock down enemies when used against them at any health threshold. Yup that's balance.
Re: stun on incap.
NB's have fear. Fear is
1, unblockable
2, not breaking on subsequent damage
3, a *** to break out of, virtually guaranteeing next hit won't be blocked/rolled.
Why on earth would anyone NOT use fear on a CC-vulnerable opponent before hitting him with an ultimate is beyond me. Stun on incap is a total non-factor, IMHO.
Because if you hit them with fear => incap the next hit is most likely to be dodged.
If you directly attack them with incap => assassins scourge they get hit for a 20% buffed scourge that is absolutely not avoidable.
Re: stun on incap.
NB's have fear. Fear is
1, unblockable
2, not breaking on subsequent damage
3, a *** to break out of, virtually guaranteeing next hit won't be blocked/rolled.
Why on earth would anyone NOT use fear on a CC-vulnerable opponent before hitting him with an ultimate is beyond me. Stun on incap is a total non-factor, IMHO.
Because if you hit them with fear => incap the next hit is most likely to be dodged.
And without the fear your next hit is likely to get blocked.
I'm playing a heavy armor magicka DK. When i have a glass cannon NB wailing on me, i simply cannot afford to drop block - their damage output is insane with just surprise attack weave spam, heavy armor or not. I have to block through their initial burst, and only drop block to regen stamina while the enemy is CC-ed in one way or another.If you directly attack them with incap => assassins scourge they get hit for a 20% buffed scourge that is absolutely not avoidable.
If he directly attacks me with that, then he wasted his ult to scratch the paint off my shield and the scourge is likely to get reflected back into his face.
Seriously this ability is extremely overpowered. It is making stamina nightblade over the top again. Does way too much damage.Oh and worst of all it is the lowest costing ulti in the game. I'm fine with the knock down change but come on with this damage change. What were you thinking zos?
Y'all have fun with this argument. Instead of it being about a single ability it has turned into a class balance war. I'm sure nothing will get changed and people will complain about it (to include those defending it). Enjoy your arguing folksI appreciate some of the feedback.
Their combat designer is to nooby to know something about balance. Im playing as magicka NB and I am perplexed now. I dont want to respec to stamina or play as another class but this changes is crazy OP
mr_wazzabi wrote: »Strider_Roshin wrote: »
Ultimate gain!!!!
Just make inc strike and soul harvest equal to each other but inc strike scale off mighty!
leepalmer95 wrote: »Re: stun on incap.
NB's have fear. Fear is
1, unblockable
2, not breaking on subsequent damage
3, a *** to break out of, virtually guaranteeing next hit won't be blocked/rolled.
Why on earth would anyone NOT use fear on a CC-vulnerable opponent before hitting him with an ultimate is beyond me. Stun on incap is a total non-factor, IMHO.
Because if you hit them with fear => incap the next hit is most likely to be dodged.
And without the fear your next hit is likely to get blocked.
I'm playing a heavy armor magicka DK. When i have a glass cannon NB wailing on me, i simply cannot afford to drop block - their damage output is insane with just surprise attack weave spam, heavy armor or not. I have to block through their initial burst, and only drop block to regen stamina while the enemy is CC-ed in one way or another.If you directly attack them with incap => assassins scourge they get hit for a 20% buffed scourge that is absolutely not avoidable.
If he directly attacks me with that, then he wasted his ult to scratch the paint off my shield and the scourge is likely to get reflected back into his face.
It's all about timing, yes when dealing with perma blockers you have to fear.
But most people aren't expecting nb's the cc you with their ult. If you get the timing right you can deal some nasty dmg with incap + relentless focus.
leepalmer95 wrote: »But most people aren't expecting nb's the cc you with their ult. If you get the timing right you can deal some nasty dmg with incap + relentless focus.
Strider_Roshin wrote: »Sugaroverdose wrote: »Dark flare is 1.3 sec interuptable cast, how it get here? Why you also didn't mention snipe which deals same damage and have less cast time?Strider_Roshin wrote: »Thanks for all the feedback! Just a heads up that we’re continuing to keep an eye on the effectiveness of this ability, and Death Stroke in general. 50 ultimate is definitely a fantastic deal for the burst potential this ability affords. We will continue to evaluate Death Stroke's strength during this testing cycle.
While you're at, make sure you evaluate the damage potential of overload, dark flare, and radiant destruction.
What's that stupid excuse that magicka sorcs, and Templars like to give? Oh yes, "but it's all we have for DPS! So it's balanced".
Btw dark flare does more damage since it empowers itself. It's like a long distance wrecking blow that debuffs. Wait a minute! Grants empowered, causes major defile? These buffs and debuffs sound strangely familiar...
Band Camp statements: To state "But this one time I saw X doing X... so that justifies X" Refers to the Band camp statement.
Coined by Maxwell
MaxwellCrystal wrote: »@Edziu
Are you trolling me or just an idiot I hope it's the first rather than the latter. I never said I had a problem with Incap strike Pre DB but even in my comment I never said anything about having a problem with it. I responded to a comment where the comparison of a low damaging AoE ability was being compared to incap a high damage single targeted ability which I gave an alternative an AoE ability that does high damage on single targets as a better example.
Incap strike is OP for the cost it has with the benefits the ultimate alone gives. So yes again I hope you are trolling me man because wow lol....
P.S 6 seconds is good enough to burst someone down especially if you get them below 75% health which with this update knocks them down regardless (If you have 75 CP in ritual you get an extra 10% damage). By the time someone breaks free and tries to heal what will you heal with?
leepalmer95 wrote: »Re: stun on incap.
NB's have fear. Fear is
1, unblockable
2, not breaking on subsequent damage
3, a *** to break out of, virtually guaranteeing next hit won't be blocked/rolled.
Why on earth would anyone NOT use fear on a CC-vulnerable opponent before hitting him with an ultimate is beyond me. Stun on incap is a total non-factor, IMHO.
Because if you hit them with fear => incap the next hit is most likely to be dodged.
And without the fear your next hit is likely to get blocked.
I'm playing a heavy armor magicka DK. When i have a glass cannon NB wailing on me, i simply cannot afford to drop block - their damage output is insane with just surprise attack weave spam, heavy armor or not. I have to block through their initial burst, and only drop block to regen stamina while the enemy is CC-ed in one way or another.If you directly attack them with incap => assassins scourge they get hit for a 20% buffed scourge that is absolutely not avoidable.
If he directly attacks me with that, then he wasted his ult to scratch the paint off my shield and the scourge is likely to get reflected back into his face.
It's all about timing, yes when dealing with perma blockers you have to fear.
But most people aren't expecting nb's the cc you with their ult. If you get the timing right you can deal some nasty dmg with incap + relentless focus.
Maybe so, but that's hardly the fault of the ult, is it.