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Greed, greeed, greed
-
Destruent✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Just slap the word elitist into a sentence with a problem you have and come to forums and rage about it.....
Oh malestrom arena is too hard, only 1% can do it! WHY ESO SO ELITIST?
Oh X X X content so hard, WHY ESO SO ELITIST?
Oh crafting takes too long, you need to have no life to level it, WHY SO ELITIST?
Oh v16s dont invite me to their helm farm run cos im v1, WHY SO ELITIST?
Oh CP ranks should be hidden if not elitists will never invite me to their group! WHY SO ELITIST?
Well you get the idea...
l2p
hm...oh wait...evil elitist!!!
Noobplar1 -
SlayerTheDragon✭✭✭✭✭The Casuals issue really gets me. So, I am a bad person because I have a life outside of a game?
Seriously, if you are spending more that 1 1/2 hours a day playing a game you need to step back. GET A LIFE.¤═══¤ People don't like it when you talk to them with your weapon drawn ¤═══¤2 -
Lysette✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Well, as Matt Firor said in an interview a few weeks ago, they HAVE game data that shows everything every player is doing in-game... which means they KNOW how many have completed what content and how many have failed and how many of those players eventually left the game, etc. So it seems to me they would be making these decisions about changes based upon that game data, and if it is clear that an overwhelming MAJORITY of players are unable to finish specific content, then it explains why they would make changes to make the content easier.
what that data does not show how ever is the reason they left or if they would have left anyway or how many will unsub or leave if nerfs like these are to become par for the course
And why do you think that would matter?- This is as well a form of balancing - less no-lifers, less 1337-players, but more casuals and average players, which can do the content - this is a form of balancing the player base by removing both, the unsuccessful (by making them more successful) and the 1337, who are no benefit for the community, but toxicate it. It would be no loss for the community and the game in a whole, if those would just leave for good.0 -
Destruent✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Well, as Matt Firor said in an interview a few weeks ago, they HAVE game data that shows everything every player is doing in-game... which means they KNOW how many have completed what content and how many have failed and how many of those players eventually left the game, etc. So it seems to me they would be making these decisions about changes based upon that game data, and if it is clear that an overwhelming MAJORITY of players are unable to finish specific content, then it explains why they would make changes to make the content easier.
what that data does not show how ever is the reason they left or if they would have left anyway or how many will unsub or leave if nerfs like these are to become par for the course
And why do you think that would matter?- This is as well a form of balancing - less no-lifers, less 1337-players, but more casuals and average players, which can do the content - this is a form of balancing the player base by removing both, the unsuccessful (by making them more successful) and the 1337, who are no benefit for the community, but toxicate it. It would be no loss for the community and the game in a whole, if those would just leave for good.
Pls stop with this sh**.
There are lots of good players who help new/inexperienced players with guides here on the forums/TF/youtube or help them ingame. There's nothing toxic with this, but it's toxic to call them so!Noobplar0 -
Lysette✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Well, as Matt Firor said in an interview a few weeks ago, they HAVE game data that shows everything every player is doing in-game... which means they KNOW how many have completed what content and how many have failed and how many of those players eventually left the game, etc. So it seems to me they would be making these decisions about changes based upon that game data, and if it is clear that an overwhelming MAJORITY of players are unable to finish specific content, then it explains why they would make changes to make the content easier.
what that data does not show how ever is the reason they left or if they would have left anyway or how many will unsub or leave if nerfs like these are to become par for the course
And why do you think that would matter?- This is as well a form of balancing - less no-lifers, less 1337-players, but more casuals and average players, which can do the content - this is a form of balancing the player base by removing both, the unsuccessful (by making them more successful) and the 1337, who are no benefit for the community, but toxicate it. It would be no loss for the community and the game in a whole, if those would just leave for good.
Pls stop with this sh**.
There are lots of good players who help new/inexperienced players with guides here on the forums/TF/youtube or help them ingame. There's nothing toxic with this, but it's toxic to call them so!
i don't think that it is helpful in a roleplaying game, to teach them how to neglect the content, but rush through it and give them the illusion of an end game, which this game obviously does not offer. This is not helpful. You guys feel that uncomfortable with the game, because you chase an illusion of a game, which this one clearly is not and is not meant to be. You neglect what Mr. Firor says and think it is PR, while he is just telling you, in which direction this game is heading. You expect something, what is not the goal of this game. And so you experience frustration and with that you toxicate the rest of the community.Edited by Lysette on May 6, 2016 12:00PM2 -
Destruent✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Well, as Matt Firor said in an interview a few weeks ago, they HAVE game data that shows everything every player is doing in-game... which means they KNOW how many have completed what content and how many have failed and how many of those players eventually left the game, etc. So it seems to me they would be making these decisions about changes based upon that game data, and if it is clear that an overwhelming MAJORITY of players are unable to finish specific content, then it explains why they would make changes to make the content easier.
what that data does not show how ever is the reason they left or if they would have left anyway or how many will unsub or leave if nerfs like these are to become par for the course
And why do you think that would matter?- This is as well a form of balancing - less no-lifers, less 1337-players, but more casuals and average players, which can do the content - this is a form of balancing the player base by removing both, the unsuccessful (by making them more successful) and the 1337, who are no benefit for the community, but toxicate it. It would be no loss for the community and the game in a whole, if those would just leave for good.
Pls stop with this sh**.
There are lots of good players who help new/inexperienced players with guides here on the forums/TF/youtube or help them ingame. There's nothing toxic with this, but it's toxic to call them so!
i don't think that it is helpful in a roleplaying game, to teach them how to not use the content, but rush through it and give them the illusion of an end game, which this game obviously does not offer. This is not helpful.
Sure...providing helpfull information for those who want to do harder content is toxic. Better remove everyone from the game who's able to press 5 buttons in a usefull order.
What's this content you are speaking of? vMoL? Trialsets? questing? fishing? there are guides for all this available. This is all a part of TESO, maybe you don't enjoy parts of this, but maybe someone else do. And so those also have a place in this game. You just think your way to play the game is the only real one. But this isn't the case. The only toxic one is you with this opinion. Let everyone play the game like he wants to. Noone should be forced to play the game in a way he don't enjoy.
You like hard content Do it.
Like easy dungeons? do them
You enjoy fishing? here you go
roleplaying? no problem, the game offers this for you
pvping? go to cyro
or anything else you imagine
nothing is better or worse in general and everyone should be able to choose the playstyle he wants. Don't take away any of this possibilities or call someone toxic bc he supports another playstyle.
I don't like pvp that much, but i don't want eso to just delete cyro/pvp at all. the same with easy dungeons, roleplaying and so on. It doesn't matter if I have fun with this content as long as someone enjoys it. Not everyone has to play the game like i do it!
edi: They also want players to explore their new dungeons and mechanics and to find ways to deal with their hardes opponents in there. How are we supposed to deal with vMoL for example if we don't push us/our characters to the limit?Edited by Destruent on May 6, 2016 12:04PMNoobplar1 -
Volkodav✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭I dont think they should nerf those places being spoken about.I mean,I'll never be able to conquer them,but that isnt the point.For those who excel at the hardest content,they should have that elite gear.Not those of us who arent into learning the mechanics and gaining the proper skills to work those dungeons and trials.
If we want that gear,we should have to work hard for it as it isnt normal gear,is it.
I dont believe in any entitlement crap.Not for either side of the issue.
If you play on NA - just send a message and you will conquer these places soon. You might need to change your build a little here and there, but you will complete these dungeons. I can guarantee that.
Send a message to who?
0 -
Lysette✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Well, as Matt Firor said in an interview a few weeks ago, they HAVE game data that shows everything every player is doing in-game... which means they KNOW how many have completed what content and how many have failed and how many of those players eventually left the game, etc. So it seems to me they would be making these decisions about changes based upon that game data, and if it is clear that an overwhelming MAJORITY of players are unable to finish specific content, then it explains why they would make changes to make the content easier.
what that data does not show how ever is the reason they left or if they would have left anyway or how many will unsub or leave if nerfs like these are to become par for the course
And why do you think that would matter?- This is as well a form of balancing - less no-lifers, less 1337-players, but more casuals and average players, which can do the content - this is a form of balancing the player base by removing both, the unsuccessful (by making them more successful) and the 1337, who are no benefit for the community, but toxicate it. It would be no loss for the community and the game in a whole, if those would just leave for good.
Pls stop with this sh**.
There are lots of good players who help new/inexperienced players with guides here on the forums/TF/youtube or help them ingame. There's nothing toxic with this, but it's toxic to call them so!
i don't think that it is helpful in a roleplaying game, to teach them how to not use the content, but rush through it and give them the illusion of an end game, which this game obviously does not offer. This is not helpful.
Sure...providing helpfull information for those who want to do harder content is toxic. Better remove everyone from the game who's able to press 5 buttons in a usefull order.
What's this content you are speaking of? vMoL? Trialsets? questing? fishing? there are guides for all this available. This is all a part of TESO, maybe you don't enjoy parts of this, but maybe someone else do. And so those also have a place in this game. You just think your way to play the game is the only real one. But this isn't the case. The only toxic one is you with this opinion. Let everyone play the game like he wants to. Noone should be forced to play the game in a way he don't enjoy.
You like hard content Do it.
Like easy dungeons? do them
You enjoy fishing? here you go
roleplaying? no problem, the game offers this for you
pvping? go to cyro
or anything else you imagine
nothing is better or worse in general and everyone should be able to choose the playstyle he wants. Don't take away any of this possibilities or call someone toxic bc he supports another playstyle.
I don't like pvp that much, but i don't want eso to just delete cyro/pvp at all. the same with easy dungeons, roleplaying and so on. It doesn't matter if I have fun with this content as long as someone enjoys it. Not everyone has to play the game like i do it!
edi: They also want players to explore their new dungeons and mechanics and to find ways to deal with their hardes opponents in there. How are we supposed to deal with vMoL for example if we don't push us/our characters to the limit?
The content is what the game title is implying - The Elder Scrolls: Tamriel unlimited - it is about the provinces of Tamriel and the story-driven content. Certainly pvp is a story-driven content in a way as well and those wanting to do this content, should be able to do it - not all will be able to, who want to do it - but ZOS is of the opinion that too less who want to do it, are able to, due to too high difficulty of the content - and so they make it slightly less difficult - but still challenging for most. If a few do not see that as challenging, well bad luck for them, because the game is made for many, not for a few, who do not fit into this scheme. The game world will never be catered for them, because they are just a few - it will be catered to the masses.Edited by Lysette on May 6, 2016 12:09PM0 -
Destruent✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Well, as Matt Firor said in an interview a few weeks ago, they HAVE game data that shows everything every player is doing in-game... which means they KNOW how many have completed what content and how many have failed and how many of those players eventually left the game, etc. So it seems to me they would be making these decisions about changes based upon that game data, and if it is clear that an overwhelming MAJORITY of players are unable to finish specific content, then it explains why they would make changes to make the content easier.
what that data does not show how ever is the reason they left or if they would have left anyway or how many will unsub or leave if nerfs like these are to become par for the course
And why do you think that would matter?- This is as well a form of balancing - less no-lifers, less 1337-players, but more casuals and average players, which can do the content - this is a form of balancing the player base by removing both, the unsuccessful (by making them more successful) and the 1337, who are no benefit for the community, but toxicate it. It would be no loss for the community and the game in a whole, if those would just leave for good.
Pls stop with this sh**.
There are lots of good players who help new/inexperienced players with guides here on the forums/TF/youtube or help them ingame. There's nothing toxic with this, but it's toxic to call them so!
i don't think that it is helpful in a roleplaying game, to teach them how to not use the content, but rush through it and give them the illusion of an end game, which this game obviously does not offer. This is not helpful.
Sure...providing helpfull information for those who want to do harder content is toxic. Better remove everyone from the game who's able to press 5 buttons in a usefull order.
What's this content you are speaking of? vMoL? Trialsets? questing? fishing? there are guides for all this available. This is all a part of TESO, maybe you don't enjoy parts of this, but maybe someone else do. And so those also have a place in this game. You just think your way to play the game is the only real one. But this isn't the case. The only toxic one is you with this opinion. Let everyone play the game like he wants to. Noone should be forced to play the game in a way he don't enjoy.
You like hard content Do it.
Like easy dungeons? do them
You enjoy fishing? here you go
roleplaying? no problem, the game offers this for you
pvping? go to cyro
or anything else you imagine
nothing is better or worse in general and everyone should be able to choose the playstyle he wants. Don't take away any of this possibilities or call someone toxic bc he supports another playstyle.
I don't like pvp that much, but i don't want eso to just delete cyro/pvp at all. the same with easy dungeons, roleplaying and so on. It doesn't matter if I have fun with this content as long as someone enjoys it. Not everyone has to play the game like i do it!
edi: They also want players to explore their new dungeons and mechanics and to find ways to deal with their hardes opponents in there. How are we supposed to deal with vMoL for example if we don't push us/our characters to the limit?
The content is what the game title is implying - The Elder Scrolls: Tamriel unlimited - it is about the provinces of Tamriel and the story-driven content. Certainly pvp is a story-driven content in a way as well and those wanting to do this content, should be able to do it - not all will be able to, who want to do it - but ZOS is of the opinion that too less who want to do it, are able to, due to too high difficulty of the content - and so they make it slightly less difficult - but still challenging for most. If a few do not see that as challenging, well bad luck for them, because the game is made for many, not for a few, who do not fit into this scheme. The game world will never be catered for them, because they are just a few - it will be catered to the masses.
Sure, and helping those who want to beat the hardest content is toxic bc the so called hard content will be easier. Now I got it Noobplar0 -
Lysette✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Well, as Matt Firor said in an interview a few weeks ago, they HAVE game data that shows everything every player is doing in-game... which means they KNOW how many have completed what content and how many have failed and how many of those players eventually left the game, etc. So it seems to me they would be making these decisions about changes based upon that game data, and if it is clear that an overwhelming MAJORITY of players are unable to finish specific content, then it explains why they would make changes to make the content easier.
what that data does not show how ever is the reason they left or if they would have left anyway or how many will unsub or leave if nerfs like these are to become par for the course
And why do you think that would matter?- This is as well a form of balancing - less no-lifers, less 1337-players, but more casuals and average players, which can do the content - this is a form of balancing the player base by removing both, the unsuccessful (by making them more successful) and the 1337, who are no benefit for the community, but toxicate it. It would be no loss for the community and the game in a whole, if those would just leave for good.
Pls stop with this sh**.
There are lots of good players who help new/inexperienced players with guides here on the forums/TF/youtube or help them ingame. There's nothing toxic with this, but it's toxic to call them so!
i don't think that it is helpful in a roleplaying game, to teach them how to not use the content, but rush through it and give them the illusion of an end game, which this game obviously does not offer. This is not helpful.
Sure...providing helpfull information for those who want to do harder content is toxic. Better remove everyone from the game who's able to press 5 buttons in a usefull order.
What's this content you are speaking of? vMoL? Trialsets? questing? fishing? there are guides for all this available. This is all a part of TESO, maybe you don't enjoy parts of this, but maybe someone else do. And so those also have a place in this game. You just think your way to play the game is the only real one. But this isn't the case. The only toxic one is you with this opinion. Let everyone play the game like he wants to. Noone should be forced to play the game in a way he don't enjoy.
You like hard content Do it.
Like easy dungeons? do them
You enjoy fishing? here you go
roleplaying? no problem, the game offers this for you
pvping? go to cyro
or anything else you imagine
nothing is better or worse in general and everyone should be able to choose the playstyle he wants. Don't take away any of this possibilities or call someone toxic bc he supports another playstyle.
I don't like pvp that much, but i don't want eso to just delete cyro/pvp at all. the same with easy dungeons, roleplaying and so on. It doesn't matter if I have fun with this content as long as someone enjoys it. Not everyone has to play the game like i do it!
edi: They also want players to explore their new dungeons and mechanics and to find ways to deal with their hardes opponents in there. How are we supposed to deal with vMoL for example if we don't push us/our characters to the limit?
The content is what the game title is implying - The Elder Scrolls: Tamriel unlimited - it is about the provinces of Tamriel and the story-driven content. Certainly pvp is a story-driven content in a way as well and those wanting to do this content, should be able to do it - not all will be able to, who want to do it - but ZOS is of the opinion that too less who want to do it, are able to, due to too high difficulty of the content - and so they make it slightly less difficult - but still challenging for most. If a few do not see that as challenging, well bad luck for them, because the game is made for many, not for a few, who do not fit into this scheme. The game world will never be catered for them, because they are just a few - it will be catered to the masses.
Sure, and helping those who want to beat the hardest content is toxic bc the so called hard content will be easier. Now I got it
It is wrong to teach them, that end game is the main thing in this game - while the game offers nearly no end game content. This game is not about end game content - that is why Mr. Firor does not like to use the term MMO, because people assume with this word, that end game content would be there and the main goal - whereas it is just not.1 -
Destruent✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Well, as Matt Firor said in an interview a few weeks ago, they HAVE game data that shows everything every player is doing in-game... which means they KNOW how many have completed what content and how many have failed and how many of those players eventually left the game, etc. So it seems to me they would be making these decisions about changes based upon that game data, and if it is clear that an overwhelming MAJORITY of players are unable to finish specific content, then it explains why they would make changes to make the content easier.
what that data does not show how ever is the reason they left or if they would have left anyway or how many will unsub or leave if nerfs like these are to become par for the course
And why do you think that would matter?- This is as well a form of balancing - less no-lifers, less 1337-players, but more casuals and average players, which can do the content - this is a form of balancing the player base by removing both, the unsuccessful (by making them more successful) and the 1337, who are no benefit for the community, but toxicate it. It would be no loss for the community and the game in a whole, if those would just leave for good.
Pls stop with this sh**.
There are lots of good players who help new/inexperienced players with guides here on the forums/TF/youtube or help them ingame. There's nothing toxic with this, but it's toxic to call them so!
i don't think that it is helpful in a roleplaying game, to teach them how to not use the content, but rush through it and give them the illusion of an end game, which this game obviously does not offer. This is not helpful.
Sure...providing helpfull information for those who want to do harder content is toxic. Better remove everyone from the game who's able to press 5 buttons in a usefull order.
What's this content you are speaking of? vMoL? Trialsets? questing? fishing? there are guides for all this available. This is all a part of TESO, maybe you don't enjoy parts of this, but maybe someone else do. And so those also have a place in this game. You just think your way to play the game is the only real one. But this isn't the case. The only toxic one is you with this opinion. Let everyone play the game like he wants to. Noone should be forced to play the game in a way he don't enjoy.
You like hard content Do it.
Like easy dungeons? do them
You enjoy fishing? here you go
roleplaying? no problem, the game offers this for you
pvping? go to cyro
or anything else you imagine
nothing is better or worse in general and everyone should be able to choose the playstyle he wants. Don't take away any of this possibilities or call someone toxic bc he supports another playstyle.
I don't like pvp that much, but i don't want eso to just delete cyro/pvp at all. the same with easy dungeons, roleplaying and so on. It doesn't matter if I have fun with this content as long as someone enjoys it. Not everyone has to play the game like i do it!
edi: They also want players to explore their new dungeons and mechanics and to find ways to deal with their hardes opponents in there. How are we supposed to deal with vMoL for example if we don't push us/our characters to the limit?
The content is what the game title is implying - The Elder Scrolls: Tamriel unlimited - it is about the provinces of Tamriel and the story-driven content. Certainly pvp is a story-driven content in a way as well and those wanting to do this content, should be able to do it - not all will be able to, who want to do it - but ZOS is of the opinion that too less who want to do it, are able to, due to too high difficulty of the content - and so they make it slightly less difficult - but still challenging for most. If a few do not see that as challenging, well bad luck for them, because the game is made for many, not for a few, who do not fit into this scheme. The game world will never be catered for them, because they are just a few - it will be catered to the masses.
Sure, and helping those who want to beat the hardest content is toxic bc the so called hard content will be easier. Now I got it
It is wrong to teach them, that end game is the main thing in this game - while the game offers nearly no end game content. This game is not about end game content - that is why Mr. Firor does not like to use the term MMO, because people assume with this word, that end game content would be there and the main goal - whereas it is just not.
We don't say this is the only real endgame for everyone and you have to play that way, too. But people who choose to play that way can find some helpful information in this guides. I also enjoy the quests, fishing and exploring in this game. But i also enjoy playing in a well organized group to push our performance to the limits. Whats wrong with it? That's our way of playing the game and there are lot's of people doing the same. Calling us toxic bc we play another part of the game and help others to do so too is kind of weird.Noobplar1 -
Lysette✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Well, as Matt Firor said in an interview a few weeks ago, they HAVE game data that shows everything every player is doing in-game... which means they KNOW how many have completed what content and how many have failed and how many of those players eventually left the game, etc. So it seems to me they would be making these decisions about changes based upon that game data, and if it is clear that an overwhelming MAJORITY of players are unable to finish specific content, then it explains why they would make changes to make the content easier.
what that data does not show how ever is the reason they left or if they would have left anyway or how many will unsub or leave if nerfs like these are to become par for the course
And why do you think that would matter?- This is as well a form of balancing - less no-lifers, less 1337-players, but more casuals and average players, which can do the content - this is a form of balancing the player base by removing both, the unsuccessful (by making them more successful) and the 1337, who are no benefit for the community, but toxicate it. It would be no loss for the community and the game in a whole, if those would just leave for good.
Pls stop with this sh**.
There are lots of good players who help new/inexperienced players with guides here on the forums/TF/youtube or help them ingame. There's nothing toxic with this, but it's toxic to call them so!
i don't think that it is helpful in a roleplaying game, to teach them how to not use the content, but rush through it and give them the illusion of an end game, which this game obviously does not offer. This is not helpful.
Sure...providing helpfull information for those who want to do harder content is toxic. Better remove everyone from the game who's able to press 5 buttons in a usefull order.
What's this content you are speaking of? vMoL? Trialsets? questing? fishing? there are guides for all this available. This is all a part of TESO, maybe you don't enjoy parts of this, but maybe someone else do. And so those also have a place in this game. You just think your way to play the game is the only real one. But this isn't the case. The only toxic one is you with this opinion. Let everyone play the game like he wants to. Noone should be forced to play the game in a way he don't enjoy.
You like hard content Do it.
Like easy dungeons? do them
You enjoy fishing? here you go
roleplaying? no problem, the game offers this for you
pvping? go to cyro
or anything else you imagine
nothing is better or worse in general and everyone should be able to choose the playstyle he wants. Don't take away any of this possibilities or call someone toxic bc he supports another playstyle.
I don't like pvp that much, but i don't want eso to just delete cyro/pvp at all. the same with easy dungeons, roleplaying and so on. It doesn't matter if I have fun with this content as long as someone enjoys it. Not everyone has to play the game like i do it!
edi: They also want players to explore their new dungeons and mechanics and to find ways to deal with their hardes opponents in there. How are we supposed to deal with vMoL for example if we don't push us/our characters to the limit?
The content is what the game title is implying - The Elder Scrolls: Tamriel unlimited - it is about the provinces of Tamriel and the story-driven content. Certainly pvp is a story-driven content in a way as well and those wanting to do this content, should be able to do it - not all will be able to, who want to do it - but ZOS is of the opinion that too less who want to do it, are able to, due to too high difficulty of the content - and so they make it slightly less difficult - but still challenging for most. If a few do not see that as challenging, well bad luck for them, because the game is made for many, not for a few, who do not fit into this scheme. The game world will never be catered for them, because they are just a few - it will be catered to the masses.
Sure, and helping those who want to beat the hardest content is toxic bc the so called hard content will be easier. Now I got it
It is wrong to teach them, that end game is the main thing in this game - while the game offers nearly no end game content. This game is not about end game content - that is why Mr. Firor does not like to use the term MMO, because people assume with this word, that end game content would be there and the main goal - whereas it is just not.
We don't say this is the only real endgame for everyone and you have to play that way, too. But people who choose to play that way can find some helpful information in this guides. I also enjoy the quests, fishing and exploring in this game. But i also enjoy playing in a well organized group to push our performance to the limits. Whats wrong with it? That's our way of playing the game and there are lot's of people doing the same. Calling us toxic bc we play another part of the game and help others to do so too is kind of weird.
I think there is nothing wrong with it, if you enjoy doing it - the thing is just getting toxic, when debates like this are sprawling up and there is hate towards casuals - the word used in a very insulting way - and average players, just because they cannot do "faceroll easy cakewalk content" - and this is insulting too to put it this way. So the game is slightly adjusted in difficulty, that more can do the content - there is nothing wrong with this, it is pleasing more players than it is not.Edited by Lysette on May 6, 2016 12:26PM0 -
STEVIL✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭FWIW I am in favor of...
There being some content that is so tough maybe 90-95% wont ever finish it successfully.
There being light versio of that content that maybe gets doen to 50%.
The vet level and non-vet lvl trials could be an example.
I am AGAINST there being locked behind that content rewards that are measurably superiot to that gained thru other content. Vanity awards, leaderbosrds etc sure but since there is a competition version of the game for those that want it, having a mechanical advantage acquirable by the "best" runs contrary to a competitive game, imo.
For consideration, many competitive games (chess, football, track, poker) are basically "scratch" systems with little to no handicapping to balance competitors. They may use rankings for pairing but the games are not themselves adjusted.
Other games can be played scratch or handicapped so as to provide balanced competition (golf, go, bowling, etc etc.) In these cases a lesser player may ge given an advantage to allow for a more competitive matchup.
An mmo putting advantageous gear behind a locked "quality challenge" and then also allowing that advantaged gear to enter the competitive environment is going the opposite way, pushing less competitive challenges by adding "better stuff" to "better players."
That methodology creates a pressure that builds against the continual attraction of new players to that competitive arena, imx.
YmmvProudly skooma free while talks-when-drunk is in mandatory public housing.
YFMV Your Fun May Vary.
First Law of Nerf-o-Dynamics
"The good way I used to get good kills *with good skill* was good but the way others kill me now is bad."1 -
jamesharv2005ub17_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭You guys keep acting like this is something players wanted. ZOS never once said players were behind this change because they complained about difficulty. They said they have numbers they want (or probably need) to meet on content they design. If the content isnt meeting those numbers something is wrong and it needs to be addressed. In this case they decided to reduce the difficulty of those two dungeons and revamp the rest of IC.
Why you ask? Because they spent a LOT of money on IC and hardly anyone is enjoying it. This change didnt come at the request of players. It came at the request of someone up top at ZOS who wants more bang for their buck out of the IC expansion. IC was a disaster. Everyone knows this. While yes I know a select few enjoy it the majority didnt bother buying it or subbing to get it.
So change had to be made. This wasnt because people wanted to do these dungeons but didnt want to bother learning how. Its because ZOS says IC is not meeting the goals they set for it.2 -
Haquor✭✭✭✭✭KoshkaMurka wrote: »No, this is not a thread about developers. Its about the playerbase, some of its vocal part.
There's many topics about nerfing vICP and vWGT dungeons and there's plenty of people saying that "if only 10% of the playerbase can finish X, then X shoudl be nerfed so every player can finish it".
But from this point of view, why those 10% cant have 0,000001% (or so) of the content. I've never seen raiders begging Zos to convert everything in the game to raids and pvpers begging to disable all pve. Why casualssome of the casuals are so entitled? I mean, I dont have anything against people who are not interested in minmaxing etc, to each their own. But why do they deny others the right to play how they want (=at least with minimal challenge)? Can someone explain this? Are they really that greedy and arrogant or they just dont understand how mmos work?
Cause seriously, this "communist" approach is so toxic for the game.
Dont apply all your cp.
You are welcome.0 -
Lysette✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭jamesharv2005ub17_ESO wrote: »You guys keep acting like this is something players wanted. ZOS never once said players were behind this change because they complained about difficulty. They said they have numbers they want (or probably need) to meet on content they design. If the content isnt meeting those numbers something is wrong and it needs to be addressed. In this case they decided to reduce the difficulty of those two dungeons and revamp the rest of IC.
Why you ask? Because they spent a LOT of money on IC and hardly anyone is enjoying it. This change didnt come at the request of players. It came at the request of someone up top at ZOS who wants more bang for their buck out of the IC expansion. IC was a disaster. Everyone knows this. While yes I know a select few enjoy it the majority didnt bother buying it or subbing to get it.
So change had to be made. This wasnt because people wanted to do these dungeons but didnt want to bother learning how. Its because ZOS says IC is not meeting the goals they set for it.
Exactly - this is a business decision.
Same goes basically for Craglorn - they will revamp it, because it is not meeting their expectations.Edited by Lysette on May 6, 2016 12:35PM1 -
Volkodav✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭jamesharv2005ub17_ESO wrote: »You guys keep acting like this is something players wanted. ZOS never once said players were behind this change because they complained about difficulty. They said they have numbers they want (or probably need) to meet on content they design. If the content isnt meeting those numbers something is wrong and it needs to be addressed. In this case they decided to reduce the difficulty of those two dungeons and revamp the rest of IC.
Why you ask? Because they spent a LOT of money on IC and hardly anyone is enjoying it. This change didnt come at the request of players. It came at the request of someone up top at ZOS who wants more bang for their buck out of the IC expansion. IC was a disaster. Everyone knows this. While yes I know a select few enjoy it the majority didnt bother buying it or subbing to get it.
So change had to be made. This wasnt because people wanted to do these dungeons but didnt want to bother learning how. Its because ZOS says IC is not meeting the goals they set for it.
I agree wholeheartedly with this.
VERY well said.0 -
Destruent✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭KoshkaMurka wrote: »No, this is not a thread about developers. Its about the playerbase, some of its vocal part.
There's many topics about nerfing vICP and vWGT dungeons and there's plenty of people saying that "if only 10% of the playerbase can finish X, then X shoudl be nerfed so every player can finish it".
But from this point of view, why those 10% cant have 0,000001% (or so) of the content. I've never seen raiders begging Zos to convert everything in the game to raids and pvpers begging to disable all pve. Why casualssome of the casuals are so entitled? I mean, I dont have anything against people who are not interested in minmaxing etc, to each their own. But why do they deny others the right to play how they want (=at least with minimal challenge)? Can someone explain this? Are they really that greedy and arrogant or they just dont understand how mmos work?
Cause seriously, this "communist" approach is so toxic for the game.
Dont apply all your cp.
You are welcome.
l2p, get CP, get gear etc.
you are welcome.
I think there is nothing wrong with it, if you enjoy doing it - the thing is just getting toxic, when debates like this are sprawling up and there is hate towards casuals - the word used in a very insulting way - and average players, just because they cannot do "faceroll easy cakewalk content" - and this is insulting too to put it this way. So the game is slightly adjusted in difficulty, that more can do the content - there is nothing wrong with this, it is pleasing more players than it is not.
This hate against "casual" is nothing better than the hate against the so called "elitist". Both side just want to play the game and have fun. If one side thinks there is something wrong with the game, they will complain.
Only toxic thing imo is to say, one side doesn't deserve any part of the game, bc the other side wants all of it..
Noobplar1 -
jamesharv2005ub17_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭jamesharv2005ub17_ESO wrote: »You guys keep acting like this is something players wanted. ZOS never once said players were behind this change because they complained about difficulty. They said they have numbers they want (or probably need) to meet on content they design. If the content isnt meeting those numbers something is wrong and it needs to be addressed. In this case they decided to reduce the difficulty of those two dungeons and revamp the rest of IC.
Why you ask? Because they spent a LOT of money on IC and hardly anyone is enjoying it. This change didnt come at the request of players. It came at the request of someone up top at ZOS who wants more bang for their buck out of the IC expansion. IC was a disaster. Everyone knows this. While yes I know a select few enjoy it the majority didnt bother buying it or subbing to get it.
So change had to be made. This wasnt because people wanted to do these dungeons but didnt want to bother learning how. Its because ZOS says IC is not meeting the goals they set for it.
Exactly - this is a business decision.
Same goes basically for Craglorn - they will revamp it, because it is not meeting their expectations.
Ive been playing since launch Ive never done even one quest in craglorn. Its the most annoying area Ive ever played in a MMO. All the quests are long (very long) and with phasing its very difficult to find a group on the same part as you. If you arent on the same "phase" you cant help anyone with it. So you end up stuck.1 -
code65536✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Meh. Before you guys waste more keystrokes on this topic, I'd suggest that you actually hop into vWGT/vICP on the PTS.
This "nerf", as it turns out, is barely noticeable. Hooray!Nightfighters ― PC/NA and PC/EU
Dungeons and Trials:Personal best scores:- Dragonstar Arena: 46817 (NA)
- Maelstrom Arena: 600526 (NA)
- Blackrose Prison: 99274 (EU) (Unchained)
- Maw of Lorkhaj: 165227 (EU)
- Halls of Fabrication: 220708 (NA) (Tick-Tock Tormentor #1, #2, #3, #4, #5, #6, #7, #8, #9, #10, #11, #12)
- Asylum Sanctorium: 114957 (NA) (Immortal Redeemer #1, #2, #3, #4, #5, #6, #7, #8, #9, #10)
- Cloudrest: 131256 (NA) (Gryphon Heart #1, #2, #3, #4, #5, #6, #7)
- Sunspire: 250866 (EU) (Godslayer #1, #2, #3, #4, #5, #6, #7)
- Kyne's Aegis: 235841 (EU) (Dawnbringer #1, #2, #3, #4, #5, #6, #7, #8)
Dungeon trifectas:- Mountain God and Leave No Bone Unbroken
- Apex Predator and Pure Lunacy
- Depths Defier and Relentless Raider
- Defanged the Devourer and Nature's Wrath
- In Defiance of Death and No Rest for the Wicked
- Bane of Thorns and True Genius
- Ardent Bibliophile and Subterranean Smasher
- Battlespire's Best and Bastion Breaker
- Zero Regrets and Land, Air, and Sea Supremacy
- Fist of Tava and Invader's Bane
- Curator's Champion (Valinna) and Temporal Tempest
- Unshakeable Fervor and Lighting the Embers
Extended Journal Add-Ons: Item Set Browser ― Loot Log ― Character Knowledge ― Collectibles Tracker ― RaidificatorPC/Console Add-Ons: Combat Alerts ― Group Buff PanelsOther Add-Ons: Deconstruction Junk Marker ― Purge Tracker ― Asylum Status Panel ― Smart Looter ― Improved Companion Rapport Information0 -
Lysette✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭KoshkaMurka wrote: »No, this is not a thread about developers. Its about the playerbase, some of its vocal part.
There's many topics about nerfing vICP and vWGT dungeons and there's plenty of people saying that "if only 10% of the playerbase can finish X, then X shoudl be nerfed so every player can finish it".
But from this point of view, why those 10% cant have 0,000001% (or so) of the content. I've never seen raiders begging Zos to convert everything in the game to raids and pvpers begging to disable all pve. Why casualssome of the casuals are so entitled? I mean, I dont have anything against people who are not interested in minmaxing etc, to each their own. But why do they deny others the right to play how they want (=at least with minimal challenge)? Can someone explain this? Are they really that greedy and arrogant or they just dont understand how mmos work?
Cause seriously, this "communist" approach is so toxic for the game.
Dont apply all your cp.
You are welcome.
l2p, get CP, get gear etc.
you are welcome.
I think there is nothing wrong with it, if you enjoy doing it - the thing is just getting toxic, when debates like this are sprawling up and there is hate towards casuals - the word used in a very insulting way - and average players, just because they cannot do "faceroll easy cakewalk content" - and this is insulting too to put it this way. So the game is slightly adjusted in difficulty, that more can do the content - there is nothing wrong with this, it is pleasing more players than it is not.
This hate against "casual" is nothing better than the hate against the so called "elitist". Both side just want to play the game and have fun. If one side thinks there is something wrong with the game, they will complain.
Only toxic thing imo is to say, one side doesn't deserve any part of the game, bc the other side wants all of it..
That is not what I am saying, I do not say, they do not deserve it - I say, they are in the wrong game, if they expect to get it HERE. They deserve their challenges, but to expect them HERE is waste of time. This game is not made to be challenging for end game players, but it is a story-driven role playing game, with some difficulty, but not with top-end difficulty which just a few players could enjoy - or hardly any, because this is not the goal of the game.Edited by Lysette on May 6, 2016 12:43PM0 -
Destruent✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭jamesharv2005ub17_ESO wrote: »jamesharv2005ub17_ESO wrote: »You guys keep acting like this is something players wanted. ZOS never once said players were behind this change because they complained about difficulty. They said they have numbers they want (or probably need) to meet on content they design. If the content isnt meeting those numbers something is wrong and it needs to be addressed. In this case they decided to reduce the difficulty of those two dungeons and revamp the rest of IC.
Why you ask? Because they spent a LOT of money on IC and hardly anyone is enjoying it. This change didnt come at the request of players. It came at the request of someone up top at ZOS who wants more bang for their buck out of the IC expansion. IC was a disaster. Everyone knows this. While yes I know a select few enjoy it the majority didnt bother buying it or subbing to get it.
So change had to be made. This wasnt because people wanted to do these dungeons but didnt want to bother learning how. Its because ZOS says IC is not meeting the goals they set for it.
Exactly - this is a business decision.
Same goes basically for Craglorn - they will revamp it, because it is not meeting their expectations.
Ive been playing since launch Ive never done even one quest in craglorn. Its the most annoying area Ive ever played in a MMO. All the quests are long (very long) and with phasing its very difficult to find a group on the same part as you. If you arent on the same "phase" you cant help anyone with it. So you end up stuck.
They changed this a long time ago. You only need 4 people to do some of them. They don't even need the quest.Noobplar0 -
Lysette✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭jamesharv2005ub17_ESO wrote: »jamesharv2005ub17_ESO wrote: »You guys keep acting like this is something players wanted. ZOS never once said players were behind this change because they complained about difficulty. They said they have numbers they want (or probably need) to meet on content they design. If the content isnt meeting those numbers something is wrong and it needs to be addressed. In this case they decided to reduce the difficulty of those two dungeons and revamp the rest of IC.
Why you ask? Because they spent a LOT of money on IC and hardly anyone is enjoying it. This change didnt come at the request of players. It came at the request of someone up top at ZOS who wants more bang for their buck out of the IC expansion. IC was a disaster. Everyone knows this. While yes I know a select few enjoy it the majority didnt bother buying it or subbing to get it.
So change had to be made. This wasnt because people wanted to do these dungeons but didnt want to bother learning how. Its because ZOS says IC is not meeting the goals they set for it.
Exactly - this is a business decision.
Same goes basically for Craglorn - they will revamp it, because it is not meeting their expectations.
Ive been playing since launch Ive never done even one quest in craglorn. Its the most annoying area Ive ever played in a MMO. All the quests are long (very long) and with phasing its very difficult to find a group on the same part as you. If you arent on the same "phase" you cant help anyone with it. So you end up stuck.
Yes, ZOS will be addressing this, they said that in PAX Q&A.0 -
jamesharv2005ub17_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭KoshkaMurka wrote: »No, this is not a thread about developers. Its about the playerbase, some of its vocal part.
There's many topics about nerfing vICP and vWGT dungeons and there's plenty of people saying that "if only 10% of the playerbase can finish X, then X shoudl be nerfed so every player can finish it".
But from this point of view, why those 10% cant have 0,000001% (or so) of the content. I've never seen raiders begging Zos to convert everything in the game to raids and pvpers begging to disable all pve. Why casualssome of the casuals are so entitled? I mean, I dont have anything against people who are not interested in minmaxing etc, to each their own. But why do they deny others the right to play how they want (=at least with minimal challenge)? Can someone explain this? Are they really that greedy and arrogant or they just dont understand how mmos work?
Cause seriously, this "communist" approach is so toxic for the game.
Dont apply all your cp.
You are welcome.
l2p, get CP, get gear etc.
you are welcome.
I think there is nothing wrong with it, if you enjoy doing it - the thing is just getting toxic, when debates like this are sprawling up and there is hate towards casuals - the word used in a very insulting way - and average players, just because they cannot do "faceroll easy cakewalk content" - and this is insulting too to put it this way. So the game is slightly adjusted in difficulty, that more can do the content - there is nothing wrong with this, it is pleasing more players than it is not.
This hate against "casual" is nothing better than the hate against the so called "elitist". Both side just want to play the game and have fun. If one side thinks there is something wrong with the game, they will complain.
Only toxic thing imo is to say, one side doesn't deserve any part of the game, bc the other side wants all of it..
That is not what I am saying, I do not say, they do not deserve it - I say, they are in the wrong game, if they expect to get it HERE. They deserve their challenges, but to expect them HERE is waste of time. This game is not made to be challenging for end game players, but it is a story-driven role playing game, with some difficulty, but not with top-end difficulty which just a few players could enjoy - or hardly any, because this is not the goal of the game.
The new trial is very very difficult on vet. Only a handful of guilds have even been able to complete it. There is challenge I just dont think thats what they actually want. Otherwise they would be trying to beat the new trial.1 -
jamesharv2005ub17_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭jamesharv2005ub17_ESO wrote: »jamesharv2005ub17_ESO wrote: »You guys keep acting like this is something players wanted. ZOS never once said players were behind this change because they complained about difficulty. They said they have numbers they want (or probably need) to meet on content they design. If the content isnt meeting those numbers something is wrong and it needs to be addressed. In this case they decided to reduce the difficulty of those two dungeons and revamp the rest of IC.
Why you ask? Because they spent a LOT of money on IC and hardly anyone is enjoying it. This change didnt come at the request of players. It came at the request of someone up top at ZOS who wants more bang for their buck out of the IC expansion. IC was a disaster. Everyone knows this. While yes I know a select few enjoy it the majority didnt bother buying it or subbing to get it.
So change had to be made. This wasnt because people wanted to do these dungeons but didnt want to bother learning how. Its because ZOS says IC is not meeting the goals they set for it.
Exactly - this is a business decision.
Same goes basically for Craglorn - they will revamp it, because it is not meeting their expectations.
Ive been playing since launch Ive never done even one quest in craglorn. Its the most annoying area Ive ever played in a MMO. All the quests are long (very long) and with phasing its very difficult to find a group on the same part as you. If you arent on the same "phase" you cant help anyone with it. So you end up stuck.
They changed this a long time ago. You only need 4 people to do some of them. They don't even need the quest.
Well like I said when it came out I was not happy with it. Never went back. The whole zone needs a revamp to bring it into line with the rest of the zones. At the time I can understand their reasoning for making it group centered. At the time there really was no end game to speak of. Now thats all changed and I think they should redesign it to make it more solo/casual friendly.1 -
Destruent✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭KoshkaMurka wrote: »No, this is not a thread about developers. Its about the playerbase, some of its vocal part.
There's many topics about nerfing vICP and vWGT dungeons and there's plenty of people saying that "if only 10% of the playerbase can finish X, then X shoudl be nerfed so every player can finish it".
But from this point of view, why those 10% cant have 0,000001% (or so) of the content. I've never seen raiders begging Zos to convert everything in the game to raids and pvpers begging to disable all pve. Why casualssome of the casuals are so entitled? I mean, I dont have anything against people who are not interested in minmaxing etc, to each their own. But why do they deny others the right to play how they want (=at least with minimal challenge)? Can someone explain this? Are they really that greedy and arrogant or they just dont understand how mmos work?
Cause seriously, this "communist" approach is so toxic for the game.
Dont apply all your cp.
You are welcome.
l2p, get CP, get gear etc.
you are welcome.
I think there is nothing wrong with it, if you enjoy doing it - the thing is just getting toxic, when debates like this are sprawling up and there is hate towards casuals - the word used in a very insulting way - and average players, just because they cannot do "faceroll easy cakewalk content" - and this is insulting too to put it this way. So the game is slightly adjusted in difficulty, that more can do the content - there is nothing wrong with this, it is pleasing more players than it is not.
This hate against "casual" is nothing better than the hate against the so called "elitist". Both side just want to play the game and have fun. If one side thinks there is something wrong with the game, they will complain.
Only toxic thing imo is to say, one side doesn't deserve any part of the game, bc the other side wants all of it..
That is not what I am saying, I do not say, they do not deserve it - I say, they are in the wrong game, if they expect to get it HERE. They deserve their challenges, but to expect them HERE is waste of time. This game is not made to be challenging for end game players, but it is a story-driven role playing game, with some difficulty, but not with top-end difficulty which just a few players could enjoy - or hardly any, because this is not the goal of the game.
Then it's not "unlimited" but limited to this playstyle...Noobplar0 -
Shunravi✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭jamesharv2005ub17_ESO wrote: »jamesharv2005ub17_ESO wrote: »jamesharv2005ub17_ESO wrote: »You guys keep acting like this is something players wanted. ZOS never once said players were behind this change because they complained about difficulty. They said they have numbers they want (or probably need) to meet on content they design. If the content isnt meeting those numbers something is wrong and it needs to be addressed. In this case they decided to reduce the difficulty of those two dungeons and revamp the rest of IC.
Why you ask? Because they spent a LOT of money on IC and hardly anyone is enjoying it. This change didnt come at the request of players. It came at the request of someone up top at ZOS who wants more bang for their buck out of the IC expansion. IC was a disaster. Everyone knows this. While yes I know a select few enjoy it the majority didnt bother buying it or subbing to get it.
So change had to be made. This wasnt because people wanted to do these dungeons but didnt want to bother learning how. Its because ZOS says IC is not meeting the goals they set for it.
Exactly - this is a business decision.
Same goes basically for Craglorn - they will revamp it, because it is not meeting their expectations.
Ive been playing since launch Ive never done even one quest in craglorn. Its the most annoying area Ive ever played in a MMO. All the quests are long (very long) and with phasing its very difficult to find a group on the same part as you. If you arent on the same "phase" you cant help anyone with it. So you end up stuck.
They changed this a long time ago. You only need 4 people to do some of them. They don't even need the quest.
Well like I said when it came out I was not happy with it. Never went back. The whole zone needs a revamp to bring it into line with the rest of the zones. At the time I can understand their reasoning for making it group centered. At the time there really was no end game to speak of. Now thats all changed and I think they should redesign it to make it more solo/casual friendly.
But they did revamp it. It didn't help.This one has an eloquent and well thought out response to tha... Ooh sweetroll!0 -
jamesharv2005ub17_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭jamesharv2005ub17_ESO wrote: »jamesharv2005ub17_ESO wrote: »jamesharv2005ub17_ESO wrote: »You guys keep acting like this is something players wanted. ZOS never once said players were behind this change because they complained about difficulty. They said they have numbers they want (or probably need) to meet on content they design. If the content isnt meeting those numbers something is wrong and it needs to be addressed. In this case they decided to reduce the difficulty of those two dungeons and revamp the rest of IC.
Why you ask? Because they spent a LOT of money on IC and hardly anyone is enjoying it. This change didnt come at the request of players. It came at the request of someone up top at ZOS who wants more bang for their buck out of the IC expansion. IC was a disaster. Everyone knows this. While yes I know a select few enjoy it the majority didnt bother buying it or subbing to get it.
So change had to be made. This wasnt because people wanted to do these dungeons but didnt want to bother learning how. Its because ZOS says IC is not meeting the goals they set for it.
Exactly - this is a business decision.
Same goes basically for Craglorn - they will revamp it, because it is not meeting their expectations.
Ive been playing since launch Ive never done even one quest in craglorn. Its the most annoying area Ive ever played in a MMO. All the quests are long (very long) and with phasing its very difficult to find a group on the same part as you. If you arent on the same "phase" you cant help anyone with it. So you end up stuck.
They changed this a long time ago. You only need 4 people to do some of them. They don't even need the quest.
Well like I said when it came out I was not happy with it. Never went back. The whole zone needs a revamp to bring it into line with the rest of the zones. At the time I can understand their reasoning for making it group centered. At the time there really was no end game to speak of. Now thats all changed and I think they should redesign it to make it more solo/casual friendly.
But they did revamp it. It didn't help.
Right because it still requires a group to even kill the trash mobs. If it was more like orsinium for example it would be a lot more popular.1 -
Shunravi✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭jamesharv2005ub17_ESO wrote: »jamesharv2005ub17_ESO wrote: »jamesharv2005ub17_ESO wrote: »jamesharv2005ub17_ESO wrote: »You guys keep acting like this is something players wanted. ZOS never once said players were behind this change because they complained about difficulty. They said they have numbers they want (or probably need) to meet on content they design. If the content isnt meeting those numbers something is wrong and it needs to be addressed. In this case they decided to reduce the difficulty of those two dungeons and revamp the rest of IC.
Why you ask? Because they spent a LOT of money on IC and hardly anyone is enjoying it. This change didnt come at the request of players. It came at the request of someone up top at ZOS who wants more bang for their buck out of the IC expansion. IC was a disaster. Everyone knows this. While yes I know a select few enjoy it the majority didnt bother buying it or subbing to get it.
So change had to be made. This wasnt because people wanted to do these dungeons but didnt want to bother learning how. Its because ZOS says IC is not meeting the goals they set for it.
Exactly - this is a business decision.
Same goes basically for Craglorn - they will revamp it, because it is not meeting their expectations.
Ive been playing since launch Ive never done even one quest in craglorn. Its the most annoying area Ive ever played in a MMO. All the quests are long (very long) and with phasing its very difficult to find a group on the same part as you. If you arent on the same "phase" you cant help anyone with it. So you end up stuck.
They changed this a long time ago. You only need 4 people to do some of them. They don't even need the quest.
Well like I said when it came out I was not happy with it. Never went back. The whole zone needs a revamp to bring it into line with the rest of the zones. At the time I can understand their reasoning for making it group centered. At the time there really was no end game to speak of. Now thats all changed and I think they should redesign it to make it more solo/casual friendly.
But they did revamp it. It didn't help.
Right because it still requires a group to even kill the trash mobs. If it was more like orsinium for example it would be a lot more popular.
Which trash mobs now?This one has an eloquent and well thought out response to tha... Ooh sweetroll!0 -
Lysette✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭KoshkaMurka wrote: »No, this is not a thread about developers. Its about the playerbase, some of its vocal part.
There's many topics about nerfing vICP and vWGT dungeons and there's plenty of people saying that "if only 10% of the playerbase can finish X, then X shoudl be nerfed so every player can finish it".
But from this point of view, why those 10% cant have 0,000001% (or so) of the content. I've never seen raiders begging Zos to convert everything in the game to raids and pvpers begging to disable all pve. Why casualssome of the casuals are so entitled? I mean, I dont have anything against people who are not interested in minmaxing etc, to each their own. But why do they deny others the right to play how they want (=at least with minimal challenge)? Can someone explain this? Are they really that greedy and arrogant or they just dont understand how mmos work?
Cause seriously, this "communist" approach is so toxic for the game.
Dont apply all your cp.
You are welcome.
l2p, get CP, get gear etc.
you are welcome.
I think there is nothing wrong with it, if you enjoy doing it - the thing is just getting toxic, when debates like this are sprawling up and there is hate towards casuals - the word used in a very insulting way - and average players, just because they cannot do "faceroll easy cakewalk content" - and this is insulting too to put it this way. So the game is slightly adjusted in difficulty, that more can do the content - there is nothing wrong with this, it is pleasing more players than it is not.
This hate against "casual" is nothing better than the hate against the so called "elitist". Both side just want to play the game and have fun. If one side thinks there is something wrong with the game, they will complain.
Only toxic thing imo is to say, one side doesn't deserve any part of the game, bc the other side wants all of it..
That is not what I am saying, I do not say, they do not deserve it - I say, they are in the wrong game, if they expect to get it HERE. They deserve their challenges, but to expect them HERE is waste of time. This game is not made to be challenging for end game players, but it is a story-driven role playing game, with some difficulty, but not with top-end difficulty which just a few players could enjoy - or hardly any, because this is not the goal of the game.
Then it's not "unlimited" but limited to this playstyle...
it is exactly what Mr. Firor says - an expansive online Elder Scrolls RPG - it is meant to be soloable or to be played in a group, if one wants to do it that way. But because this game comes out of a single-player series, it is made to be soloable, with an option to experience "Elder Scrolls with friends". This was and is still the goal of the game - experience Tamriel with friends.0