You know, I've been playing as if stamina doesn't regen while holding your shield up since they announced it and it feels kinda like dark souls, I like it actually. In Dark Souls you'll deplete your stam fast if you don't drop your shield in between blocking hits, the same thing will happen here. So you just have to manage when your shield is up and when it's down to regen stam.
The only thing that may need adjusted is how much stam regen tanks need to get, and maybe stam regen numbers might need to come up depending on what they find out on the PTR, so that dropping your blocking stance lets your stam refill pretty quickly.
So does this mean tanking in the future will need to be magicka based offense with stamina reserved only for blocks?
Hastings88 wrote: »Why does everything get changed to suit pvp why cant we have different settings it ruins dungeons and vet dungeons are hard you need good tanks and healers or your dps gets stomped on
Sallington wrote: »Anything useful that players are wanting added into the game all fall under the category of "Yer ruinin my 'mersion!"
Contraptions wrote: »
Making tanks more important will hopefully move this game away from the current "burn everything down before they can do their mechanics' kind of gameplay, which is really boring imo.
Hastings88 wrote: »Why does everything get changed to suit pvp why cant we have different settings it ruins dungeons and vet dungeons are hard you need good tanks and healers or your dps gets stomped on
its intrestng that you assume that the current playstyle of tanks in PvE was ZOS´ playstyle goal ... (have in mind that every other defense requires an active player while tanking requires just some duct tape and a automouse tool taunting the boss infront of the char every 14 sec)
Sallington wrote: »Anything useful that players are wanting added into the game all fall under the category of "Yer ruinin my 'mersion!"
well the difference is that a dd can make you fail even a vet dungeon if hes played only rudimantary, a tank beeing played that way is absolutly viable (done so a few times when beeing "simultanious" the group tank(on my laptop) and a DD)
Personofsecrets wrote: »well the difference is that a dd can make you fail even a vet dungeon if hes played only rudimantary, a tank beeing played that way is absolutly viable (done so a few times when beeing "simultanious" the group tank(on my laptop) and a DD)
Now let's bring up the stories of good tanks who carried their team members to a victory when a "just hold block" tank wouldn't have.
Basing an extreme change to the game on the bare minimum of what is viable is grasping at straws. We all know that someone who is "just holding block" isn't doing what they should be doing.
That sorcerer I mentioned hadn't weaved a day in their life. Not through any vet dungeons and not even through hard mode trials that they were brought to. Sorcerers or the DPS roll shouldn't be changed because of how board that type of player must get when constantly using crushing shock and spell symmetry over and over.
Does players who want to do the bare minimum justify a massive change to the game? No.
Does just doing the same thing over and over justify a massive change to the game? No. It is often an incorrect way of viewing what players are really doing.
Sallington wrote: »Anything useful that players are wanting added into the game all fall under the category of "Yer ruinin my 'mersion!"
well the difference is that a dd can make you fail even a vet dungeon if hes played only rudimantary, a tank beeing played that way is absolutly viable (done so a few times when beeing "simultanious" the group tank(on my laptop) and a DD)
Now let's bring up the stories of good tanks who carried their team members to a victory when a "just hold block" tank wouldn't have.
Basing an extreme change to the game on the bare minimum of what is viable is grasping at straws. We all know that someone who is "just holding block" isn't doing what they should be doing.
That sorcerer I mentioned hadn't weaved a day in their life. Not through any vet dungeons and not even through hard mode trials that they were brought to. Sorcerers or the DPS roll shouldn't be changed because of how board that type of player must get when constantly using crushing shock and spell symmetry over and over.
Does players who want to do the bare minimum justify a massive change to the game? No.
Does just doing the same thing over and over justify a massive change to the game? No. It is often an incorrect way of viewing what players are really doing.
Personofsecrets wrote: »well the difference is that a dd can make you fail even a vet dungeon if hes played only rudimantary, a tank beeing played that way is absolutly viable (done so a few times when beeing "simultanious" the group tank(on my laptop) and a DD)
Now let's bring up the stories of good tanks who carried their team members to a victory when a "just hold block" tank wouldn't have.
Basing an extreme change to the game on the bare minimum of what is viable is grasping at straws. We all know that someone who is "just holding block" isn't doing what they should be doing.
That sorcerer I mentioned hadn't weaved a day in their life. Not through any vet dungeons and not even through hard mode trials that they were brought to. Sorcerers or the DPS roll shouldn't be changed because of how board that type of player must get when constantly using crushing shock and spell symmetry over and over.
Does players who want to do the bare minimum justify a massive change to the game? No.
Does just doing the same thing over and over justify a massive change to the game? No. It is often an incorrect way of viewing what players are really doing.
i´m not disagreeing, but blocking is the only defensive option that does not require the slightest thinking by the user, wich is obviously not part of the active gameplay ZOS aimed for - so the statement this change is based purely on PvP issues is BS as it obviously infringes with the goal of the combat system.
Right, and a player who is doing all those things can't be holding block all the time, which means removal of stamina regen while blocking isn't going to affect them much.dodgehopper_ESO wrote: »Personofsecrets wrote: »well the difference is that a dd can make you fail even a vet dungeon if hes played only rudimantary, a tank beeing played that way is absolutly viable (done so a few times when beeing "simultanious" the group tank(on my laptop) and a DD)
Now let's bring up the stories of good tanks who carried their team members to a victory when a "just hold block" tank wouldn't have.
Basing an extreme change to the game on the bare minimum of what is viable is grasping at straws. We all know that someone who is "just holding block" isn't doing what they should be doing.
That sorcerer I mentioned hadn't weaved a day in their life. Not through any vet dungeons and not even through hard mode trials that they were brought to. Sorcerers or the DPS roll shouldn't be changed because of how board that type of player must get when constantly using crushing shock and spell symmetry over and over.
Does players who want to do the bare minimum justify a massive change to the game? No.
Does just doing the same thing over and over justify a massive change to the game? No. It is often an incorrect way of viewing what players are really doing.
i´m not disagreeing, but blocking is the only defensive option that does not require the slightest thinking by the user, wich is obviously not part of the active gameplay ZOS aimed for - so the statement this change is based purely on PvP issues is BS as it obviously infringes with the goal of the combat system.
I just want to point something out. Tanks do more than Hold up Block. They avoid red circles that bosses drop everywhere. In fact they also try to herd the boss in such a way that those red circles don't mess up their team mates, among other things. They CC mobs and grab attention. They interrupt. One reason I enjoy tanking is that it requires a lot MORE thinking than ***-hum spamming a few dps abilities that I could easily macro on a Logitech keyboard or mouse (or really any gaming keyboard or mouse). Does that sound insulting to dps players? Yes. Its meant to make players feel a little uncomfortable about mocking a tank for using his shield, and yes it is an oversimplification about playing DPS. The truth remains that playing as a Tank is fun in large part because it is about herding the tempo of the battle to make it go smoothly for your team mates. Its insulting to sum it up as 'hold block and yay job done'.
Don't say this. This game was advertised with AvA having a large part in it and is still taken as that by many players. PvP concerns are not less valid than PvE concerns.MaximusDargus wrote: »Ive read great suggestion that said this "0 stamina regeneration while blocking" could be part of some generic PVP buff active only when you enter cyriodiil.
Especially that with next major patch all PVP buffs are going to stay in PVP and wont affect PVE.
Im getting annoyed that devs change everything on every whim and cry of PVP absorbed players. They do it only because of complaints of minority of PVP absorbed players while ignoring the majority of PVE players.
BTW, I made that suggestion and I am a 100% PvP oriented player.Completely wrong. Either you play one of these and intend to spew misinformation or you don't PvP. The permanently blocking DKs (GDB, Scales, Spiked Armor, Whip, Invasion and Banner on the bar, never change weapons) were a thing. Especially with Whip bypassing dodge, that is the most ridiculous build in all of Cyrodiil. Good thing this is now tackled.Personofsecrets wrote: »here is the thing. tanking isn't even a pvp issue. tanks deal no damage in pvp and the only other people block casting are light armor wearers. It should be obvious while light armor wearers have to block cast now.MaximusDargus wrote: »Ive read great suggestion that said this "0 stamina regeneration while blocking" could be part of some generic PVP buff active only when you enter cyriodiil.
Especially that with next major patch all PVP buffs are going to stay in PVP and wont affect PVE.
Im getting annoyed that devs change everything on every whim and cry of PVP absorbed players. They do it only because of complaints of minority of PVP absorbed players while ignoring the majority of PVE players.
I have a hard time believing that the degenerate one-shot and done builds are getting more benefits over players who actually want to have a real battle.
dodgehopper_ESO wrote: »Personofsecrets wrote: »well the difference is that a dd can make you fail even a vet dungeon if hes played only rudimantary, a tank beeing played that way is absolutly viable (done so a few times when beeing "simultanious" the group tank(on my laptop) and a DD)
Now let's bring up the stories of good tanks who carried their team members to a victory when a "just hold block" tank wouldn't have.
Basing an extreme change to the game on the bare minimum of what is viable is grasping at straws. We all know that someone who is "just holding block" isn't doing what they should be doing.
That sorcerer I mentioned hadn't weaved a day in their life. Not through any vet dungeons and not even through hard mode trials that they were brought to. Sorcerers or the DPS roll shouldn't be changed because of how board that type of player must get when constantly using crushing shock and spell symmetry over and over.
Does players who want to do the bare minimum justify a massive change to the game? No.
Does just doing the same thing over and over justify a massive change to the game? No. It is often an incorrect way of viewing what players are really doing.
i´m not disagreeing, but blocking is the only defensive option that does not require the slightest thinking by the user, wich is obviously not part of the active gameplay ZOS aimed for - so the statement this change is based purely on PvP issues is BS as it obviously infringes with the goal of the combat system.
I just want to point something out. Tanks do more than Hold up Block. They avoid red circles that bosses drop everywhere. In fact they also try to herd the boss in such a way that those red circles don't mess up their team mates, among other things. They CC mobs and grab attention. They interrupt. One reason I enjoy tanking is that it requires a lot MORE thinking than ***-hum spamming a few dps abilities that I could easily macro on a Logitech keyboard or mouse (or really any gaming keyboard or mouse). Does that sound insulting to dps players? Yes. Its meant to make players feel a little uncomfortable about mocking a tank for using his shield, and yes it is an oversimplification about playing DPS. The truth remains that playing as a Tank is fun in large part because it is about herding the tempo of the battle to make it go smoothly for your team mates. Its insulting to sum it up as 'hold block and yay job done'.
Right, and a player who is doing all those things can't be holding block all the time, which means removal of stamina regen while blocking isn't going to affect them much.dodgehopper_ESO wrote: »Personofsecrets wrote: »well the difference is that a dd can make you fail even a vet dungeon if hes played only rudimantary, a tank beeing played that way is absolutly viable (done so a few times when beeing "simultanious" the group tank(on my laptop) and a DD)
Now let's bring up the stories of good tanks who carried their team members to a victory when a "just hold block" tank wouldn't have.
Basing an extreme change to the game on the bare minimum of what is viable is grasping at straws. We all know that someone who is "just holding block" isn't doing what they should be doing.
That sorcerer I mentioned hadn't weaved a day in their life. Not through any vet dungeons and not even through hard mode trials that they were brought to. Sorcerers or the DPS roll shouldn't be changed because of how board that type of player must get when constantly using crushing shock and spell symmetry over and over.
Does players who want to do the bare minimum justify a massive change to the game? No.
Does just doing the same thing over and over justify a massive change to the game? No. It is often an incorrect way of viewing what players are really doing.
i´m not disagreeing, but blocking is the only defensive option that does not require the slightest thinking by the user, wich is obviously not part of the active gameplay ZOS aimed for - so the statement this change is based purely on PvP issues is BS as it obviously infringes with the goal of the combat system.
I just want to point something out. Tanks do more than Hold up Block. They avoid red circles that bosses drop everywhere. In fact they also try to herd the boss in such a way that those red circles don't mess up their team mates, among other things. They CC mobs and grab attention. They interrupt. One reason I enjoy tanking is that it requires a lot MORE thinking than ***-hum spamming a few dps abilities that I could easily macro on a Logitech keyboard or mouse (or really any gaming keyboard or mouse). Does that sound insulting to dps players? Yes. Its meant to make players feel a little uncomfortable about mocking a tank for using his shield, and yes it is an oversimplification about playing DPS. The truth remains that playing as a Tank is fun in large part because it is about herding the tempo of the battle to make it go smoothly for your team mates. Its insulting to sum it up as 'hold block and yay job done'.
Yes. If you are the only taunter, the boss won't get taunt immunity against you if you taunt too often.Did i read somewhere that they were removing over-taunting from the game, would allow me to get more from my master 1H sword.
mousekime111rwb17_ESO wrote: »What justifies a massive change to the game is a frustrating mechanic the detracts from a large portion of the game experience for a large number of players.
I've been playing around in pledges, dsa, trials with my tank, experimenting with less blocking. It's definitely doable, especially if you have the right team to support you. Did i read somewhere that they were removing over-taunting from the game, would allow me to get more from my master 1H sword. Some instances like the axes in AA are definitely a challenge, but I've had decent (not guaranteed) success combining various methods of defense to lessen the burden of block.
I've changed up my build for this type of play-style, it's definitely more engaging (more "fun") so i will wait to see how it works on PTS before judging.
Personofsecrets wrote: »mousekime111rwb17_ESO wrote: »What justifies a massive change to the game is a frustrating mechanic the detracts from a large portion of the game experience for a large number of players.
You are saying that holding block is a frustrating mechanic that detracts from a large portion of the game experiences for a large number of players.
You are implying that having to release block and then block isn't going to be a frustrating mechanic that detracts from a large portion of the game experience for a large number of players.
You are incorrect on both accounts.
mousekime111rwb17_ESO wrote: »Personofsecrets wrote: »mousekime111rwb17_ESO wrote: »What justifies a massive change to the game is a frustrating mechanic the detracts from a large portion of the game experience for a large number of players.
You are saying that holding block is a frustrating mechanic that detracts from a large portion of the game experiences for a large number of players.
You are implying that having to release block and then block isn't going to be a frustrating mechanic that detracts from a large portion of the game experience for a large number of players.
You are incorrect on both accounts.
Block casting is still currently a problem in PVP and does make bringing some people down a nightmare (especially given their relative damage output)<THE BRACKETS ARE IMPORTANT HERE. As for having to release block, there's only two instances I know of personally where that could even pose a slight problem (axes and VDSA) and the answer to that is simple > pop magma armour or bolstering darkness or stack shields and heavy attack for as long as you have the massive DR.
Azurephoenix999 wrote: »