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• PC/Mac: EU megaserver for maintenance – September 9, 22:00 UTC (6:00PM EDT) - September 10, 16:00 UTC (12:00PM EDT) https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/682784
- = Sorcs were not nerfed = -
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yodased✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Awhh guildie
is nice to see.
Magnus do you play a sorc? Kind of presumptuous to negate peoples feelings with a sanctimonious post declaring that you are the official word on sorc skills. People feel like their class was changed for the worse, they have the right to declare that the same way you can look down on them from your high horse.Tl;dr really weigh the fun you have in game vs the business practices you are supporting.6 -
TehMagnus✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭@TehMagnus I am starting a new sorc and can't decide between Breton and Imperial. But since I am not a huge fan of light armor and destro staffs, what's your take on Imperial Sorcs?
http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/153895/pve-bloodspawn-stamina-dd-test-all-classes-tested-video-passive-skills in that post you can find testing done with Stamina Sorc so you can have an idea of how it is, def looks fun to play, I know @xMovingTarget is leveling a sorc that I think he wants to make Stamina. Def fun in PVP, no idea if viable in PVE since it seems many sorcs spend more time complaining on forums than testing things & publishing results.
As for sorc builds, I have a guildie using @pppontus 's build (modified version) that you can find in Tamriel foundry and getting slightly less DPS (2-3k depending on situation) than me on a DK and with very nice burst damage. Yet again, his build isn't optimized, neither is mine.
As for people asking for # etc, all I can see is from what I've tested and my gameplay. In 1.5 I'd frown upon any sorc joining a trial or a VDSA group. Now they are much more useful than before since negate is needed again (even nerfed), due to the overall nerf to players. DPS also matters less than in 1.5 so to my eyes, all these posts about sorcs are just plain and simple QQ.
As for PVP, I've been playing it much more than before and been dueling a bit as well, I can OS some sorcs (prolly the ones complaining that sorcs have been nerfed), and others put up very nice fights and even beat me. Remember that just because you fail, it doesn't always mean the class is bad, it can also mean you're bad.Edited by TehMagnus on March 13, 2015 1:12PM3 -
Merlin13KAGL✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭
@spoqster, Altmer, of course.@TehMagnus I am starting a new sorc and can't decide between Breton and Imperial. But since I am not a huge fan of light armor and destro staffs, what's your take on Imperial Sorcs?
Just because you don't like the way something is doesn't necessarily make it wrong...
Earn it.
IRL'ing for a while for assorted reasons, in forum, and in game.I am neither warm, nor fuzzy...
Probably has checkbox on Customer Service profile that say High Aggro, 99% immunity to BS0 -
TehMagnus✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Awhh guildie is nice to see.
Magnus do you play a sorc? Kind of presumptuous to negate peoples feelings with a sanctimonious post declaring that you are the official word on sorc skills. People feel like their class was changed for the worse, they have the right to declare that the same way you can look down on them from your high horse.
#1: I play with good sorcs, and they aren't complaining at all, I'm talking about people who rerolled DK in 1.5 to be OP and are playing sorc again.
#2: Stating that X or Y has been nerfed in a game that basically rebooted last week is a bit stupid IMO, I bet half the people complaining haven't even tried looking for new builds and ways to improve which is why the multiple sanctimonious posts declaring sorcs where nerfed annoy me.
#3: I am as entitled to make this kind of sanctimonious posts as much as the people making posts saying "Sorcs where nerfed again" since afaik, they aren't the official word on sorc skills either.
Everybody feels their class was changed for the worse except Templars (in the DPS department at least). Deal with it.
Edited by TehMagnus on March 13, 2015 1:26PM4 -
pppontus✭✭✭✭✭
✭I think everyone already knows that I consider Sorcs to be really buffed. I mean, I am going from spending most of my time on Templar/NB to trying to powerlevel my Undaunted on Sorc because it's so much fun to play now. Especially that it now has capability to do good DPS from range, and high AOE DPS (Skoria+LL+Thundering Presence+Impulse = lots of dead things) together with an insane survivability skill (Ward) which will make the Sorc a real asset in SO imo.
I think a lot of the complaints come because yes, Sorcs do have to change quite a lot of their bar setups. It's a bigger adjustment than for some builds, for sure. But that is a good thing because Sorcs used to be the most boring class ever to play. Single Target DPS = 2 Skills (Surge+Crushing), AOE DPS = 2 Skills (Surge+Impulse), Survivability? Yes, just press this one button (again, Surge). Now we have an actual toolkit, we can go double destro and still struggle to fit all these great skills in.. I am going crazy because I want to have so many skills on my bar but can't.
Imo, complaints seem to be .. misdirected. If you truly wanted to continue playing with only 2 buttons, then that's a very different complaint.
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Yolokin_Swagonborn✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Sorcs were nerfed. But there is a vocal minority that wants to keep sorcs nerfed. So they keep spreading this mis-information that "sorcs are fine" and obfuscating the entire conversations about the holistic sorc toolkit and the problems with it.
They hold up one skill or another and say "sorcs are fine because they have skill X." then skill X gets nerfed. That doesn't deter the anti-sorc brigadiers, they just shift the goalposts and come up with another skill that is the savior of sorcs.
The real issue here is that other classes hate losing to sorcs. Period. They would rather be killed by a talons spamming DK or an ambush spamming NB than a sorc because sorcs are supposed to be "squishy" and that translates to "always kill-able" in their minds.
Look at the signatures of the loudest "sorcs are fine" people. They usually have a DK or NB, or multiple characters but prefer their DK.
They don't want to let their investment lose value if another class becomes dominant so they brigade sorc threads and post misinformation to keep their DKs strong.11 -
pppontus✭✭✭✭✭
✭
That comment makes me sad, because it's true.. my Stamina NB does not see much use at the moment.
I'm stubbornly sticking to DW because I can't stand the 2H "rotation" of WB -> HA -> WB -> HA -> WB, and still I can't really compete with that *sorry about the language* piece of ***.2 -
TehMagnus✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭anitajoneb17_ESO wrote: »Talking strictly PVE.... what I can say is : MY sorc was destroyed.
Perhaps not all sorcs, maybe not your sorc, maybe not anyone's sorc, but this I don't care, I'm talking about MY sorc and MY sorc was destroyed.
In 1.5 it used to be able to sustain 900-1K DPS and to have an off heal in the 2nd bar, which was very much appreciated in many groups and compensated for the somewhat lower DPS.
In 1.6 with the same gear as 1.5 I died easily and achieved a ridiculous 4K DPS. So I looked and tried new gear, skills and so on... learned a completely new rotation, following new templates and tutorials, and finally manage some 8K-9K DPS, but this time WITHOUT an off-heal !! What use am I to a group now ? They're better off with another class. They don't reject me, I'm the one who refuses to be the useless one in a group. I only run normal daily pledges now, I don't join groups for vet dungeons, let alone trials. What sensible raid leader would seek a sorc now for trials ?
My sorc is not a lively thing, it's a virtual thing, still it's not a toolbox. I am really reluctant to have to *change* her to that extent and switch to a playstyle that is not "hers" (and that i don't enjoy playing). I *refuse* to use pets because they are absolutely ugly and because it makes no sense. Fighting Molag Bal and Oblivion badasses all game long for finally having to rely on your own "friendly" daedric slaves makes no sense at all. I also *refuse* to play a stamina sorc because that's not the type of character I wanted to play ! I want a magicka sorc !
You mention that all classes have to adapt. That's partly true, but from what I've noticed in my guilds, the effort and amount of change is 1/ less, far less than for sorcs. Most other classes just change their gear and don't even have to touch their skillbars 2/ more rewarding : after adjusting, they feel stronger than before. We magicka sorcs feel AT BEST the same as before. It's not fun to adjust and re-learn for... just the same (AT BEST).
I have a VR2 templar as well. I did not need any adjustments and feels stronger than before. BUT he's still in the leveling solo zones so it's not a valid comparison I guess. Still, I don't like to play him. I like my sorc, I want to play my magicka sorc.
If at least we could understand WHY it was changed so drastically ! Some aspects I understand (light armor protecting significantly less than medium or heavy is a change I understand and support, I also approve of not being able the re-up the ulti outside of combat) but most changes I don't understand at all : WHY was there a need to change the negate ?? why don't the crit matter any more ?? ...
I'm not arguing / demanding / threatening nor "QQing" as you like to name it; but as a matter of fact, MY sorc was destroyed, I don't feel any incentive for playing my "new" sorc, nor playing my templar, so for now I totally enjoy the justice system and the improved graphics of 1.6, BUT sooner or later I will probably log in less often and simply leave the game.
1) Your templar is buffed in DPS but is nerfed in healing department.
2) Game has totally changed DKs have had to change a lot as well, if you refuse to adapt you can't blame it on the class and you don't need pets to pull good DPS.
3) 8-9k is totally alright (at the moment) and you don't need to have a healer staff, the only reason for healer staff is because we needed sorcs to regen their negate asap in order to spam them. This is no longer possible,
4) Just have fun and play, 8-9k dps is equal to more than many people you're playing with will be pulling.Edited by TehMagnus on March 13, 2015 1:38PM0 -
Erock25✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Yolokin_Swagonborn wrote: »Look at the signatures of the loudest "sorcs are fine" people. They usually have a DK or NB, or multiple characters but prefer their DK.
I think I've been pretty loud in saying magicka sorc are fine and I have around 32 days played on my Sorc and around 5 on my DK and that is about the same ratio I have since 1.6 launched.You earned the 500 LOLs badge.
You received 500 LOLs. It ain't no fluke, you post great stuff and we're lucky to have you here. +50 points2 -
Bfish22090✭✭✭✭✭Sorc crit surge cool down was nerfed, but it was buffed to have a spell power morph.
Sorcs have a great heal in the clanfear now0 -
pppontus✭✭✭✭✭
✭Yolokin_Swagonborn wrote: »Sorcs were nerfed. But there is a vocal minority that wants to keep sorcs nerfed. So they keep spreading this mis-information that "sorcs are fine" and obfuscating the entire conversations about the holistic sorc toolkit and the problems with it.
They hold up one skill or another and say "sorcs are fine because they have skill X." then skill X gets nerfed. That doesn't deter the anti-sorc brigadiers, they just shift the goalposts and come up with another skill that is the savior of sorcs.
The real issue here is that other classes hate losing to sorcs. Period. They would rather be killed by a talons spamming DK or an ambush spamming NB than a sorc because sorcs are supposed to be "squishy" and that translates to "always kill-able" in their minds.
Look at the signatures of the loudest "sorcs are fine" people. They usually have a DK or NB, or multiple characters but prefer their DK.
They don't want to let their investment lose value if another class becomes dominant so they brigade sorc threads and post misinformation to keep their DKs strong.
Sorcs were buffed. But there is a vocal minority that wants to make Sorcs extremely OP. So they keep spreading this misinformation that "sorcs are bad" blabla.
You see, just because you say so.. doesn't make it so.
Since 1.6 launched I've spent 80% of my time on my Sorc, 20% spread fairly even across the other characters.
You can fail to adapt and continue crying, or you can adapt to the changes and enjoy a class in a much better position than before.3 -
TehMagnus✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Yolokin_Swagonborn wrote: »Sorcs were nerfed. But there is a vocal minority that wants to keep sorcs nerfed. So they keep spreading this mis-information that "sorcs are fine" and obfuscating the entire conversations about the holistic sorc toolkit and the problems with it.
It's not actually a vocal minority, any decent player that knows how to play will tell you sorcs are not worse than they where before. Some will even say they where buffed.Yolokin_Swagonborn wrote: »The real issue here is that other classes hate losing to sorcs. Period. They would rather be killed by a talons spamming DK or an ambush spamming NB than a sorc because sorcs are supposed to be "squishy" and that translates to "always kill-able" in their minds.
I don't know how you come to this conclusion, maybe months of frustration for playing the underdog class, probably the same kind of feeling that makes people post "sorcs are nerfed threads". FYI, sorcs played well are not squishy at all. I can OS sorcs or NBs or DKs with 24k crits and some sorcs I barely take 10% of their HP because... you know... they know how to block & dodge and increase their resistances.Yolokin_Swagonborn wrote: »Look at the signatures of the loudest "sorcs are fine" people. They usually have a DK or NB, or multiple characters but prefer their DK.
They don't want to let their investment lose value if another class becomes dominant so they brigade sorc threads and post misinformation to keep their DKs strong.
And look at people like @pppontus whose guild is probably the perfect example that you don't need to be a hardcore nor sacrifice your playstile nor go for the "OP class" to be up there in the competition, who says sorc haven't been nerfed. But yeah, @pppontus is probably conspiring to make sure his next reroll destroys sorcs. Moreover, people with multiple chars who have sorcs don't care if they get buffed since they will be able to play them and people like me who just go for the next OP thing will just quickly level up an alt if a class becomes more op than the other
. Edited by TehMagnus on March 13, 2015 1:50PM2 -
yodased✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭people like me who just go for the next OP thing will just quickly level up an alt if a class becomes more op than the other.
Is the reason balance can never be achieved. Winning is the only thing that matters, actual class balance doesn't to you. Fundamental difference why you won't ever understand those that you feel are "QQ".
They are attached in an emotional way to the character they created, its not a win-at-any cost adapt survive. They take hours and hours to create a character and invest in it, when that investment is changed it upsets them.
You fail to understand this, nor have any sort of empathy for them.
Tl;dr really weigh the fun you have in game vs the business practices you are supporting.6 -
Tankqull✭✭✭✭✭
✭Yolokin_Swagonborn wrote: »Sorcs were nerfed. But there is a vocal minority that wants to keep sorcs nerfed. So they keep spreading this mis-information that "sorcs are fine" and obfuscating the entire conversations about the holistic sorc toolkit and the problems with it.
It's not actually a vocal minority, any decent player that knows how to play will tell you sorcs are not worse than they where before. Some will even say they where buffed.
well if you lose the last reason to be picked for pve (negate) without any ground winning in other pve resorts you stay the most unused class for pve.
no matter if you call the loss a nerf or not - sorcs are garbage in pve if you are not joining the wrecking blow train.
spelling and grammar errors are free to be abused
Sallington wrote: »Anything useful that players are wanting added into the game all fall under the category of "Yer ruinin my 'mersion!"2 -
TehMagnus✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭people like me who just go for the next OP thing will just quickly level up an alt if a class becomes more op than the other.
Is the reason balance can never be achieved. Winning is the only thing that matters, actual class balance doesn't to you. Fundamental difference why you won't ever understand those that you feel are "QQ".
They are attached in an emotional way to the character they created, its not a win-at-any cost adapt survive. They take hours and hours to create a character and invest in it, when that investment is changed it upsets them.
You fail to understand this, nor have any sort of empathy for them.
I had empathy before, in 1.5 where sorcs where utterly useless.
Not anymore since in 1.6 sorcs are as useful as NBs. IMO people who, as you say, love their sorcs, should rejoice instead of crying, their class is actually raid worthy now. People who can't stand the fact they need to change their way to play have no empathy from me since we're all in the same boat.2 -
Kypho✭✭✭✭Sorc the best class in pvp. Shield spam, up to 13k fragment dmg (or bit more) even to a heavy armor, 7k+ curse, streak spam, did i mentioned the übershield spam? 8k minespam dmg, chrushingshock animcancel to get fragment proc + umm shield spam and streak, and shield spam.....
The only sorc dies faster, is the one who dont have class shield. but DK who dont block and doesnt have GDB is weak and nerfed. Templar who has no heals on bar is nerfed. NB is bad anyway.
Magic build is OP compared to Stamina with any class. Why? Magic damage is out of control even for a weak nerfed sorc, i mentioned those insane crits. Wrecking blow can hit that too? Well only lucky ones, besida that:
you need stamina for:
Sneak, Block, Roll, Fart, Breath
you need magicka for:
Spam spam spam spam the huge dmg and you arent using stamina at all
If blocking magic would cost magicka, it would be better balanced, still magic dmg is out of controll
So a nerfed sorc need only spam the low cost class shield, can get away with streak spam, what can chain CC anyone, animcanceling attack makes average 10k fragment spam, 6k+ curse, or if anyone tries meele drop the 8k dmg mine, and i could continue the great abilities.
If thats the overnerfed sorc, then i want that ZoS overnerf all classes, to the level of sorcs.1 -
TehMagnus✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Yolokin_Swagonborn wrote: »Sorcs were nerfed. But there is a vocal minority that wants to keep sorcs nerfed. So they keep spreading this mis-information that "sorcs are fine" and obfuscating the entire conversations about the holistic sorc toolkit and the problems with it.
It's not actually a vocal minority, any decent player that knows how to play will tell you sorcs are not worse than they where before. Some will even say they where buffed.
well if you lose the last reason to be picked for pve (negate) without any ground winning in other pve resorts you stay the most unused class for pve.
no matter if you call the loss a nerf or not - sorcs are garbage in pve if you are not joining the wrecking blow train.
In 1.5, you didn't need negate, you could use Nova after Nova and overheal every and any content with a good templar. With the new ultimate limitations, the fights lasting longer and the nerf to healing + removal of softcaps, sorcs are more needed than before. Negate Might be nerfed but it still removes *** from the ground.
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pppontus✭✭✭✭✭
✭Yolokin_Swagonborn wrote: »Sorcs were nerfed. But there is a vocal minority that wants to keep sorcs nerfed. So they keep spreading this mis-information that "sorcs are fine" and obfuscating the entire conversations about the holistic sorc toolkit and the problems with it.
It's not actually a vocal minority, any decent player that knows how to play will tell you sorcs are not worse than they where before. Some will even say they where buffed.
well if you lose the last reason to be picked for pve (negate) without any ground winning in other pve resorts you stay the most unused class for pve.
no matter if you call the loss a nerf or not - sorcs are garbage in pve if you are not joining the wrecking blow train.
In 1.5, you didn't need negate, you could use Nova after Nova and overheal every and any content with a good templar. With the new ultimate limitations, the fights lasting longer and the nerf to healing + removal of softcaps, sorcs are more needed than before. Negate Might be nerfed but it still removes *** from the ground.
Actually I kind of like the changes to negate, it is admittedly less powerful, but the change makes it require a lot more skill to use properly. Noticed when doing AA 2nd boss a lot of Sorcs don't even know what it is they were negating in 1.5, they just dropped it there and prayed they would get another one before it ran out..
Now you have to time it to negate the right thing at the right time. For me anything that takes the "point and spray" feeling out of the game is a plus.
Edited by pppontus on March 13, 2015 2:09PM3 -
Tankqull✭✭✭✭✭
✭Yolokin_Swagonborn wrote: »Sorcs were nerfed. But there is a vocal minority that wants to keep sorcs nerfed. So they keep spreading this mis-information that "sorcs are fine" and obfuscating the entire conversations about the holistic sorc toolkit and the problems with it.
It's not actually a vocal minority, any decent player that knows how to play will tell you sorcs are not worse than they where before. Some will even say they where buffed.
well if you lose the last reason to be picked for pve (negate) without any ground winning in other pve resorts you stay the most unused class for pve.
no matter if you call the loss a nerf or not - sorcs are garbage in pve if you are not joining the wrecking blow train.
In 1.5, you didn't need negate, you could use Nova after Nova and overheal every and any content with a good templar. With the new ultimate limitations, the fights lasting longer and the nerf to healing + removal of softcaps, sorcs are more needed than before. Negate Might be nerfed but it still removes *** from the ground.
sure it still removes *** from the ground but only once, the rest of the time you are "plagued" with a supbar DD or heal or an not even mentionable tank while the negate can be easily substituted by e.g. your allready mentioned Nova and gain a fully worthwhile healer, more DPS or a tough tank.spelling and grammar errors are free to be abused
Sallington wrote: »Anything useful that players are wanting added into the game all fall under the category of "Yer ruinin my 'mersion!"1 -
c0rp✭✭✭✭✭
✭Bfish22090 wrote: »Sorc crit surge cool down was nerfed, but it was buffed to have a spell power morph.
Sorcs have a great heal in the clanfear now
LOL the clanfear is a POS. I REFUSE to be forced to use a pet whos only purpose is to be cast, and destroyed on a weapon swap in order to have a decent heal. I refuse to do this based on the PRINCIPLE of it being absolutely RIDICULOUS. I know I am not alone. This is the tip of an iceberg as far as what is wrong with sorc. No way I am wasting time to retype what others have already pointed out time and time again...
Force weapon swap to have priority over EVERYTHING. Close enough.
Make stamina builds even with magicka builds.
Disable abilities while holding block.
Give us a REASON to do dungeons more than once.
Remove PVP AoE CAP. It is ruining Cyrodiil.
Fix/Remove Forward Camps. They are ruining Cyrodiil.
Impenetrability needs to REDUCE CRIT DAMAGE. Not negate entire builds.
Werewolf is not equal to Vamps/Bats.4 -
TehMagnus✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Yolokin_Swagonborn wrote: »Sorcs were nerfed. But there is a vocal minority that wants to keep sorcs nerfed. So they keep spreading this mis-information that "sorcs are fine" and obfuscating the entire conversations about the holistic sorc toolkit and the problems with it.
It's not actually a vocal minority, any decent player that knows how to play will tell you sorcs are not worse than they where before. Some will even say they where buffed.
well if you lose the last reason to be picked for pve (negate) without any ground winning in other pve resorts you stay the most unused class for pve.
no matter if you call the loss a nerf or not - sorcs are garbage in pve if you are not joining the wrecking blow train.
In 1.5, you didn't need negate, you could use Nova after Nova and overheal every and any content with a good templar. With the new ultimate limitations, the fights lasting longer and the nerf to healing + removal of softcaps, sorcs are more needed than before. Negate Might be nerfed but it still removes *** from the ground.
sure it still removes *** from the ground but only once, the rest of the time you are "plagued" with a supbar DD or heal or an not even mentionable tank while the negate can be easily substituted by e.g. your allready mentioned Nova and gain a fully worthwhile healer, more DPS or a tough tank.
Nova won't help you in 2nd boss of AA, it needs to be under the add and not under the party. Putting it down will negate the damage from the boss but won't negate the damage from the nullifier if he is outside of the Nova. A well placed negate will remove the AOE from nullfier though, that way the party doesn't have to move, and you don't waste DPS.
Just because something didn't work in 1.5 you can't just dismiss it in 1.6 and just because something worked in 1.5 doesn't mean it will in 1.6, especially not at the beginning.1 -
eventide03b14a_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭
I don't disagree that they had been nerfed at one point, but the argument here is whether they were nerfed in 1.6 and the answer in my opinion is no.Yolokin_Swagonborn wrote: »Sorcs were nerfed. But there is a vocal minority that wants to keep sorcs nerfed. So they keep spreading this mis-information that "sorcs are fine" and obfuscating the entire conversations about the holistic sorc toolkit and the problems with it.
They hold up one skill or another and say "sorcs are fine because they have skill X." then skill X gets nerfed. That doesn't deter the anti-sorc brigadiers, they just shift the goalposts and come up with another skill that is the savior of sorcs.
The real issue here is that other classes hate losing to sorcs. Period. They would rather be killed by a talons spamming DK or an ambush spamming NB than a sorc because sorcs are supposed to be "squishy" and that translates to "always kill-able" in their minds.
Look at the signatures of the loudest "sorcs are fine" people. They usually have a DK or NB, or multiple characters but prefer their DK.
They don't want to let their investment lose value if another class becomes dominant so they brigade sorc threads and post misinformation to keep their DKs strong.
That's why I stopped playing my NB too. I want the DW to not suck but sadly I feel like it really does. The AoE DPS with DW is just awful.
That comment makes me sad, because it's true.. my Stamina NB does not see much use at the moment.
I'm stubbornly sticking to DW because I can't stand the 2H "rotation" of WB -> HA -> WB -> HA -> WB, and still I can't really compete with that *sorry about the language* piece of ***.
:trollin:1 -
pppontus✭✭✭✭✭
✭Yolokin_Swagonborn wrote: »Sorcs were nerfed. But there is a vocal minority that wants to keep sorcs nerfed. So they keep spreading this mis-information that "sorcs are fine" and obfuscating the entire conversations about the holistic sorc toolkit and the problems with it.
It's not actually a vocal minority, any decent player that knows how to play will tell you sorcs are not worse than they where before. Some will even say they where buffed.
well if you lose the last reason to be picked for pve (negate) without any ground winning in other pve resorts you stay the most unused class for pve.
no matter if you call the loss a nerf or not - sorcs are garbage in pve if you are not joining the wrecking blow train.
In 1.5, you didn't need negate, you could use Nova after Nova and overheal every and any content with a good templar. With the new ultimate limitations, the fights lasting longer and the nerf to healing + removal of softcaps, sorcs are more needed than before. Negate Might be nerfed but it still removes *** from the ground.
sure it still removes *** from the ground but only once, the rest of the time you are "plagued" with a supbar DD or heal or an not even mentionable tank while the negate can be easily substituted by e.g. your allready mentioned Nova and gain a fully worthwhile healer, more DPS or a tough tank.
Nova won't help you in 2nd boss of AA, it needs to be under the add and not under the party. Putting it down will negate the damage from the boss but won't negate the damage from the nullifier if he is outside of the Nova. A well placed negate will remove the AOE from nullfier though, that way the party doesn't have to move, and you don't waste DPS.
Just because something didn't work in 1.5 you can't just dismiss it in 1.6 and just because something worked in 1.5 doesn't mean it will in 1.6, especially not at the beginning.
Exactly. Again, part of the problem is failure to adapt. Honestly, there's a reason why people in the "top" guilds say Sorcs weren't nerfed.
Because it's people like us who know the ins and outs of every strategy, build and class in this game..
And I'm not trying to be a jackass and say l2p, I'm really not.
But most people who have spent months negating the 2nd boss don't even know that it's the nullifiers AOE they are negating. They do it because people who figured out the strategies told them to do it.
Now it's a new playing field and time to relearn stuff. Not the time to ask for buffs before we even know the potential of what we have right now.
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ZRage✭✭✭Sorc the best class in pvp. Shield spam, up to 13k fragment dmg (or bit more) even to a heavy armor, 7k+ curse, streak spam, did i mentioned the übershield spam? 8k minespam dmg, chrushingshock animcancel to get fragment proc + umm shield spam and streak, and shield spam.....
The only sorc dies faster, is the one who dont have class shield. but DK who dont block and doesnt have GDB is weak and nerfed. Templar who has no heals on bar is nerfed. NB is bad anyway.
Magic build is OP compared to Stamina with any class. Why? Magic damage is out of control even for a weak nerfed sorc, i mentioned those insane crits. Wrecking blow can hit that too? Well only lucky ones, besida that:
you need stamina for:
Sneak, Block, Roll, Fart, Breath
you need magicka for:
Spam spam spam spam the huge dmg and you arent using stamina at all
If blocking magic would cost magicka, it would be better balanced, still magic dmg is out of controll
So a nerfed sorc need only spam the low cost class shield, can get away with streak spam, what can chain CC anyone, animcanceling attack makes average 10k fragment spam, 6k+ curse, or if anyone tries meele drop the 8k dmg mine, and i could continue the great abilities.
If thats the overnerfed sorc, then i want that ZoS overnerf all classes, to the level of sorcs.
I agree that sorc can do damage with frags and curse mostly into people who don't know how to block, but its situational. On top of that leaderboards prove that sorc isn't anywhere near being the best class, neither it's most played class. So dream along
Also fragment spam, I don't even know what this means, relistically you can count on 1 proc per 4-5 second, and the cast delay after frag is also around 1 second. Let's say It crit's for 15k just for the sake of the argument, divide it by 5 second its 3k dps. Rest is laughable with destro staff you are paperwall, curse realistically deals damage every 4 second including cast time. Just try rolling sorc and tell me if it looks like the best class lol.
Also you won't get near 10k dmg into heavy armor user, the way spell penetration was nerfed just makes it so..Edited by ZRage on March 13, 2015 2:38PM2 -
Potenza✭✭✭✭✭Awhh guildie is nice to see.
Magnus do you play a sorc? Kind of presumptuous to negate peoples feelings with a sanctimonious post declaring that you are the official word on sorc skills. People feel like their class was changed for the worse, they have the right to declare that the same way you can look down on them from your high horse.
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TehMagnus✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭j.murro2ub17_ESO wrote: »Awhh guildie is nice to see.
Magnus do you play a sorc? Kind of presumptuous to negate peoples feelings with a sanctimonious post declaring that you are the official word on sorc skills. People feel like their class was changed for the worse, they have the right to declare that the same way you can look down on them from your high horse.
THIS
#1: I play with good sorcs, and they aren't complaining at all, I'm talking about people who rerolled DK in 1.5 to be OP and are playing sorc again.
#2: Stating that X or Y has been nerfed in a game that basically rebooted last week is a bit stupid IMO, I bet half the people complaining haven't even tried looking for new builds and ways to improve which is why the multiple sanctimonious posts declaring sorcs where nerfed annoy me.
#3: I am as entitled to make this kind of sanctimonious posts as much as the people making posts saying "Sorcs where nerfed again" since afaik, they aren't the official word on sorc skills either.
Everybody feels their class was changed for the worse except Templars (in the DPS department at least). Deal with it.
THAT4 -
rfennell_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭A lot of sorcs in the 1.5 world were forced to reroll to "useful" classes to raid.
So... a lot of sorcs pve experience was small scale dungeons or dsa or soloing stuff. In this particular way sorcs were seriously overnerfed as critical surge and it's morphs are far weaker than in 1.5 for this type of play.
In 1.6 there is no change to sorcs for raiding that makes them better at it.
Conclusion: Sorcs were nerfed.
But I guess a couple guys who don't play sorcs or raid with sorcs feel the need to drop into every thread they can (or make new ones) claiming the class they don't play is fine.
ps pppontus likely doesn't play his sorc much and I'd bet certainly doesn't and hasn't raided on a sorc. He just keeps claiming otherwise to offset his obvious dk bias. I guess he could post all his "on my sorc" leaderboard screenies but I'm betting they are all on his dk.
Teh_magnus tries to pretend that his guild hadn't proclaimed they wouldn't bring sorcs to raids in 1.6. I'd love to see the many sorcs they bring along on their leaderboard runs.
If pvp is the argument, well sorcs were never weak in pvp. They are somewhat stronger now, though a bit squishier (hello stealth uppercut uppercut dead light armor sorc). In pvp, if you can pick "soft targets" out of a crowd, well sorcs are likely the best at annihilating them; particularly with their ability to move in and out of combat via streak and bolt. If you are mad about getting gibbed by a sorc, you might want to think about the "soft target" comment a bit.Edited by rfennell_ESO on March 13, 2015 3:23PM5 -
TehMagnus✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭
They aren't, they just require you to change your playstyle. It's just as if I said: DKs where nerfed because FOO is changed and now I cant solo stuff or do DSA. Guess what, I can, I just use other skillsrfennell_ESO wrote: »A lot of sorcs in the 1.5 world were forced to reroll to "useful" classes to raid.
So... a lot of sorcs pve experience was small scale dungeons or dsa or soloing stuff. In this particular way sorcs were seriously overnerfed as critical surge and it's morphs are far weaker than in 1.5 for this type of play.
rfennell_ESO wrote: »ps pppontus likely doesn't play his sorc much and I'd bet certainly doesn't and hasn't raided on a sorc. He just keeps claiming otherwise to offset his obvious dk bias. I guess he could post all his "on my sorc" leaderboard screenies but I'm betting they are all on his dk.
I remember clearly @pppontus and I arguing about sorcs, I was telling him the reason his guild was #5 or 6 was their unwillingness to reroll to DK and his answer was clearly that he didn't care, he got the job done with sorcs (amongst whose some where pulling more DPS than DKs in Manticora fight).rfennell_ESO wrote: »Teh_magnus tries to pretend that his guild hadn't proclaimed they wouldn't bring sorcs to raids in 1.6. I'd love to see the many sorcs they bring along on their leaderboard runs.
We haven't started raiding yet, we're farming CP, and you can be damn sure that our sorcs will get a spot in our groups in the beginning of 1.6. Whereas other people we don't close any doors. The leaderboard system has been totally remade and we don't know how it works, thus we won't be discarding any kind of play or class until we understand how it works which can only be done by trial and error. And our guild never proclaimed we wouldn't bring sorcs to raid in 1.6, we said we preferred not to take anything else than DKs and Templars (and our star NB) in a 1.5 raid. So please stop lying 
. Edited by TehMagnus on March 13, 2015 3:32PM3