- = Sorcs were not nerfed = -

rishardnelsonb14_ESO

I just want to say sorcs are a great class I am King Richard and i play the class well. However I am limited in my build options in 1.6. I am forced to run destro resto staff resto because no self heal destro because no insta cast dps. With no insta cast dps or dots to do damage i am stuck using crushing shock for pressure dps. No self heal forces me to use a resto staff and being forced to have resto and destro for max sustain and dps on a sorc eliminates going stam build. There is no stam build sorc in the game right now that can beat my magicka build. That is only because sorcs fit best with resto destro staff. I want option on my sorceres if i have a good single target dps ability i could go sword and board easy. If i had a self heal that was a class ability i can drop resto staff and try something different.Not to mention pets are complete trash in his game i honestly dont know why they are apart of the game they play and look like crap and i hate pets. Not to mention thecast times makes them useless. Any way thats enough of my rants i hope zos starts giving sorcs better options. Starting with insta cast dps maybe a heal and a aoe dps ability.

Vahrokh

TehMagnus wrote: »

Vahrokh wrote: »

TehMagnus wrote: »

Then why are you complaining? Your class allows you to complete any content in the game and it is strong enough to do so. If you don't compete what do you care if your DPS is a bit lower or even what other people are doing with their classes?

Because the world is not black and white.
One thing is being so dedicated to get crazy for a 1% DPS drop.
One thing, instead, is to be: "happy camper, content with squatting progress and getting carried by my guild mates".

I'd rather prefer avoiding both.

We've already established that Stamina or Magicka sorcs are pulling 1 to 2% less DPS than other classes, so you're not squatting progress.

Today one of his guild sorcs actually posted a very nice damage report.

Today, one of my soft core, non min maxing, non potting etc. etc. casual guild DKs posted his DPS. No 95 CPs freak, no super-mega min maxed setup blah blah. The DPS posted: 16498.



So, how comes that the one of the players in the top world guild posted 13200 DPS - once again in a short fight with lots of lucky crits, whereas a super-casual guild (we have to invite randoms from zone chat sometimes!) DK can pull 20% (not 2%) more, on a large health pool encounter (so, no lucky crits to affect it)?

Pray tell me.

pppontus

As I explained obviously the right side boss is bugged with the damage report.

Plus, there is no one to respond because ZOS sees it fit to ban members of every top guild in the game for expressing concerns or negative feedback.. soo I don't think you're gonna hear very much in terms of response to anything.

Vahrokh

pppontus wrote: »

As I explained obviously the right side boss is bugged with the damage report.

Plus, there is no one to respond because ZOS sees it fit to ban members of every top guild in the game for expressing concerns or negative feedback.. soo I don't think you're gonna hear very much in terms of response to anything.

It's since closed beta that - as you certainly noticed - I more than loudly express my negative feedback about basically everything about ESO. I am still here.

A moderator PMed me asking to not use distruptive / sarcastic / superiority / dismissive / confrontational wording.

I clearly didn't use sarcastic or superiority or dimissive... wording since I am on the receiving end both of the game changes and of the "kind remarks".
Do I guess who was on the "originating end" went a bit too far instead?

Yesterday I had the official, final confirmation that Negate is not a "fight changer" any more in the last encounter I hoped it'd be. Starting today, my class is officially optional and actually a slowdown to quick guild progress. The player, instead, is busy fixing that, by levelling another class.

pppontus

Vahrokh wrote: »

pppontus wrote: »

As I explained obviously the right side boss is bugged with the damage report.

Plus, there is no one to respond because ZOS sees it fit to ban members of every top guild in the game for expressing concerns or negative feedback.. soo I don't think you're gonna hear very much in terms of response to anything.

It's since closed beta that - as you certainly noticed - I more than loudly express my negative feedback about basically everything about ESO. I am still here.

A moderator PMed me asking to not use distruptive / sarcastic / superiority / dismissive / confrontational wording.

I clearly didn't use sarcastic or superiority or dimissive... wording since I am on the receiving end both of the game changes and of the "kind remarks".
Do I guess who was on the "originating end" went a bit too far instead?

Yesterday I had the official, final confirmation that Negate is not a "fight changer" any more in the last encounter I hoped it'd be. Starting today, my class is officially optional and actually a slowdown to quick guild progress. The player, instead, is busy fixing that, by levelling another class.

That's alright, meanwhile I'm doing all my raids on my Sorc in a top guild and helping my guild progress. Opposites I guess

I'm not trying to be dismissive or anything, I am just saying what is the actual case for me/us, and almost no one I see is pulling more DPS than the Sorcs in Trials right now. Maybe our other classes are bad, or the Sorcs are exceptional cases or whatever.. I really do not know, but at the end of the day all numbers are incredibly similar and I am impressed with how well they have managed to balance "sustained DPS" between classes and specs.

My own warning just expired the other day, I stayed off the forums for the duration. I don't necessarily agree with it but I guess they don't want the new B2P:ers to see behind the curtains just yet.

Morvul

pppontus wrote: »

Vahrokh wrote: »

pppontus wrote: »

As I explained obviously the right side boss is bugged with the damage report.

Plus, there is no one to respond because ZOS sees it fit to ban members of every top guild in the game for expressing concerns or negative feedback.. soo I don't think you're gonna hear very much in terms of response to anything.

It's since closed beta that - as you certainly noticed - I more than loudly express my negative feedback about basically everything about ESO. I am still here.

A moderator PMed me asking to not use distruptive / sarcastic / superiority / dismissive / confrontational wording.

I clearly didn't use sarcastic or superiority or dimissive... wording since I am on the receiving end both of the game changes and of the "kind remarks".
Do I guess who was on the "originating end" went a bit too far instead?

Yesterday I had the official, final confirmation that Negate is not a "fight changer" any more in the last encounter I hoped it'd be. Starting today, my class is officially optional and actually a slowdown to quick guild progress. The player, instead, is busy fixing that, by levelling another class.

That's alright, meanwhile I'm doing all my raids on my Sorc in a top guild and helping my guild progress. Opposites I guess

well, you obviously love playing your sorc (as do I, btw).
But that does not change the fact that if you would play a DK as well as you play your sorc, you would be helping your guild even more. (that won't happen though, since you don't enjoy the DK as much).

which is all fine and dandy, but balanced it is not
(even if balance seems better now then it was in 1.5 - in my opinion)

pppontus

Morvul wrote: »

pppontus wrote: »

Vahrokh wrote: »

pppontus wrote: »

As I explained obviously the right side boss is bugged with the damage report.

Plus, there is no one to respond because ZOS sees it fit to ban members of every top guild in the game for expressing concerns or negative feedback.. soo I don't think you're gonna hear very much in terms of response to anything.

It's since closed beta that - as you certainly noticed - I more than loudly express my negative feedback about basically everything about ESO. I am still here.

A moderator PMed me asking to not use distruptive / sarcastic / superiority / dismissive / confrontational wording.

I clearly didn't use sarcastic or superiority or dimissive... wording since I am on the receiving end both of the game changes and of the "kind remarks".
Do I guess who was on the "originating end" went a bit too far instead?

Yesterday I had the official, final confirmation that Negate is not a "fight changer" any more in the last encounter I hoped it'd be. Starting today, my class is officially optional and actually a slowdown to quick guild progress. The player, instead, is busy fixing that, by levelling another class.

That's alright, meanwhile I'm doing all my raids on my Sorc in a top guild and helping my guild progress. Opposites I guess

well, you obviously love playing your sorc (as do I, btw).
But that does not change the fact that if you would play a DK as well as you play your sorc, you would be helping your guild even more. (that won't happen though, since you don't enjoy the DK as much).

which is all fine and dandy, but balanced it is not
(even if balance seems better now then it was in 1.5 - in my opinion)

I don't know, you might be right, but then again I've had plenty of posts before I had 90CP where I beat both Stam and Magicka DKs who had 90CP, in actual Trial fights that is. On short burst DPS tests they clearly win by far, but they seem to lose quite a bit in most boss fights, more so than the Sorc does on burst vs. sustain.

In the end, this does nothing but reinforce the whole statement - it's way too early to completely assess class balance. We still have bugged penetration, Sharpened this time, which inflates numbers like Nirn inflated numbers before and so on. People have differing amounts of CP which influences a lot, we still don't know yet how to distribute CP optimally and we don't know how much of a difference "correctly" placed CP is worth compared to someone who placed it on random.. and so on.

Too many factors and too little facts to conclude that some class is worse or better, in my opinion. I tried DPS spec on my DK but it doesn't seem any better and felt kinda boring so I specced back to tanking again.

Vahrokh

pppontus wrote: »

Vahrokh wrote: »

pppontus wrote: »

As I explained obviously the right side boss is bugged with the damage report.

Plus, there is no one to respond because ZOS sees it fit to ban members of every top guild in the game for expressing concerns or negative feedback.. soo I don't think you're gonna hear very much in terms of response to anything.

It's since closed beta that - as you certainly noticed - I more than loudly express my negative feedback about basically everything about ESO. I am still here.

A moderator PMed me asking to not use distruptive / sarcastic / superiority / dismissive / confrontational wording.

I clearly didn't use sarcastic or superiority or dimissive... wording since I am on the receiving end both of the game changes and of the "kind remarks".
Do I guess who was on the "originating end" went a bit too far instead?

Yesterday I had the official, final confirmation that Negate is not a "fight changer" any more in the last encounter I hoped it'd be. Starting today, my class is officially optional and actually a slowdown to quick guild progress. The player, instead, is busy fixing that, by levelling another class.

That's alright, meanwhile I'm doing all my raids on my Sorc in a top guild and helping my guild progress. Opposites I guess

You know what annoys me even more? Being here, smashing heads to find the build yielding those 500 more DPS on a sunny day, while the other players are just crushing stuff without even the need to min max, study the 101% perfect build, nor read forums, nor spend hours perfectioning a rotation and so on.
No surprise to find the sorc player as being superior in skill and theorycrafting to all the others.

pppontus wrote: »

I'm not trying to be dismissive or anything, I am just saying what is the actual case for me/us, and almost no one I see is pulling more DPS than the Sorcs in Trials right now. Maybe our other classes are bad, or the Sorcs are exceptional cases or whatever.. I really do not know, but at the end of the day all numbers are incredibly similar and I am impressed with how well they have managed to balance "sustained DPS" between classes and specs.

You are still replying, therefore you posted in a well mannered enough way I guess
Also, is it just me, or does it take all of 1 second disattention here and there or some lag to get our DPS crash down to 6k?

pppontus wrote: »

My own warning just expired the other day, I stayed off the forums for the duration. I don't necessarily agree with it but I guess they don't want the new B2P:ers to see behind the curtains just yet.

ESO moderators are really nice. On another MMO I play, you get 2-3 warnings that never expire then it's perma ban.

pppontus

Vahrokh wrote: »

pppontus wrote: »

Vahrokh wrote: »

pppontus wrote: »

As I explained obviously the right side boss is bugged with the damage report.

Plus, there is no one to respond because ZOS sees it fit to ban members of every top guild in the game for expressing concerns or negative feedback.. soo I don't think you're gonna hear very much in terms of response to anything.

It's since closed beta that - as you certainly noticed - I more than loudly express my negative feedback about basically everything about ESO. I am still here.

A moderator PMed me asking to not use distruptive / sarcastic / superiority / dismissive / confrontational wording.

I clearly didn't use sarcastic or superiority or dimissive... wording since I am on the receiving end both of the game changes and of the "kind remarks".
Do I guess who was on the "originating end" went a bit too far instead?

Yesterday I had the official, final confirmation that Negate is not a "fight changer" any more in the last encounter I hoped it'd be. Starting today, my class is officially optional and actually a slowdown to quick guild progress. The player, instead, is busy fixing that, by levelling another class.

That's alright, meanwhile I'm doing all my raids on my Sorc in a top guild and helping my guild progress. Opposites I guess

You know what annoys me even more? Being here, smashing heads to find the build yielding those 500 more DPS on a sunny day, while the other players are just crushing stuff without even the need to min max, study the 101% perfect build, nor read forums, nor spend hours perfectioning a rotation and so on.
No surprise to find the sorc player as being superior in skill and theorycrafting to all the others.

pppontus wrote: »

I'm not trying to be dismissive or anything, I am just saying what is the actual case for me/us, and almost no one I see is pulling more DPS than the Sorcs in Trials right now. Maybe our other classes are bad, or the Sorcs are exceptional cases or whatever.. I really do not know, but at the end of the day all numbers are incredibly similar and I am impressed with how well they have managed to balance "sustained DPS" between classes and specs.

You are still replying, therefore you posted in a well mannered enough way I guess
Also, is it just me, or does it take all of 1 second disattention here and there or some lag to get our DPS crash down to 6k?

pppontus wrote: »

My own warning just expired the other day, I stayed off the forums for the duration. I don't necessarily agree with it but I guess they don't want the new B2P:ers to see behind the curtains just yet.

ESO moderators are really nice. On another MMO I play, you get 2-3 warnings that never expire then it's perma ban.

The first point, I disagree very much. Most builds rely on a combination of DoTs, some ground placed effects and keeping buffs up - same as Sorcs. The only thing that really is specific to us is the Frag procs, but that really just takes some getting used to and my muscle memory now instantly moves to frags once I hear the "ding". ^^

I don't find that my DPS goes down that much when I don't pay attention, 1-2K definitely if I constantly miss procs and more so if I miss DoTs but I'd have to be very sloppy to miss out enough. I mean just simply Medium Attacks, Force Pulse and Frag Procs is ~11K or so to drop that low you'd have to miss weaving and all as well(?). I'm very used to that specific medium weaving / pulse rotation as I've used it on many characters for months though. But it's the same for any class, so it's not like you can *not* weave, dot and buff with a DK or a Templar or a NB.

Well, I'm sure they will ban me anyway as soon as they find a reason to do so. After all I've posted some videos of PvP lag..

Morvul

pppontus wrote: »

Well, I'm sure they will ban me anyway as soon as they find a reason to do so. After all I've posted some videos of PvP lag..

I sure hope you manage to avoid that!
while I disagree with your main statement of "sorcs are perfectly fine", I certainly like to see your perspective and input (and copy the builds you find and post xD )

bryanhaas

TehMagnus wrote: »

They are actually more useful than before.

"But I die faster": Everybody in LA dies faster. Not a sorc nerf, global nerf.
"But Negate was nerfed": It wasn't really needed anywhere anyways in PVE and was overpowered in PVP (wher sorcs feel stronger than b4, those that know how to play anyways).
"But x Skill was nerfed": It wasn't nerfed it was changed as where many others. If you expect to use the same build from 1.5 and have it still work in 1.6, you can be damn sure it won't work, then again, it's the same for other classes, not Sorc nerf, just a new game.
" But I'm pullin less DPS than other classes:" What's the difference with 1.5?
" But the DPS difference is wider than before": It actually isn't when you're using a good build and it's a very subjective statement since all the values have changed and many people are still testing things.

Conclusion:
Sorc wasn't nerfed. At best you can say it still sucks as much as before, and IMO it's too soon to tell .

Now please stop spamming the forum with your QQ posts and biased polls. Ask for buffs I can understand, but crying and complaining about "nerfs" just because you're frustrated that you're still not OP is annoying and counter-productive. Remember that the game just basically relaunched and people are still testing stuff. Instead of complaining over here, your time would be better spent trying to create a good build or figuring out and giving feedback on some aspects that could help buffing the class a little bit.

Edit:
A class viability isn't determined by comparing Healing/damage/CC capacities between 1.5 and 1.6 it's determined by the overall usefulness of the class in 1.6 compared to the overall usefulness of the class in 1.5 and after less than 2 weeks of 1.6 it's too soon to say that Sorcs where nerfed in PVE since we are barely scratching the surface of the new leaderboard system.

I just ran the daily pledge and we 2 manned norm Elden Hollow. Yeah Sorcs weren't nerfed they were buffed. I don't get how people are saying they are nerfed.

dsalter

bryanhaas wrote: »

TehMagnus wrote: »

They are actually more useful than before.

"But I die faster": Everybody in LA dies faster. Not a sorc nerf, global nerf.
"But Negate was nerfed": It wasn't really needed anywhere anyways in PVE and was overpowered in PVP (wher sorcs feel stronger than b4, those that know how to play anyways).
"But x Skill was nerfed": It wasn't nerfed it was changed as where many others. If you expect to use the same build from 1.5 and have it still work in 1.6, you can be damn sure it won't work, then again, it's the same for other classes, not Sorc nerf, just a new game.
" But I'm pullin less DPS than other classes:" What's the difference with 1.5?
" But the DPS difference is wider than before": It actually isn't when you're using a good build and it's a very subjective statement since all the values have changed and many people are still testing things.

Conclusion:
Sorc wasn't nerfed. At best you can say it still sucks as much as before, and IMO it's too soon to tell .

Now please stop spamming the forum with your QQ posts and biased polls. Ask for buffs I can understand, but crying and complaining about "nerfs" just because you're frustrated that you're still not OP is annoying and counter-productive. Remember that the game just basically relaunched and people are still testing stuff. Instead of complaining over here, your time would be better spent trying to create a good build or figuring out and giving feedback on some aspects that could help buffing the class a little bit.

Edit:
A class viability isn't determined by comparing Healing/damage/CC capacities between 1.5 and 1.6 it's determined by the overall usefulness of the class in 1.6 compared to the overall usefulness of the class in 1.5 and after less than 2 weeks of 1.6 it's too soon to say that Sorcs where nerfed in PVE since we are barely scratching the surface of the new leaderboard system.

I just ran the daily pledge and we 2 manned norm Elden Hollow. Yeah Sorcs weren't nerfed they were buffed. I don't get how people are saying they are nerfed.

you just necro'd a post from march 2015...

SienneYviete

Sick necro bruh

lDcoyl

They are only expressing their feelings, just as you are now. Is that not what a good community does? Disguss concerns, air feelings, share information...

Yolokin_Swagonborn

More proof we need a necromancer class.