Should Auction House be Public or Guild only?

selisa381b14_ESO

My problem is there is no way to search for just what you want and with having 5 guilds to search through it takes a long time to find 1 thing.

lichmeister

Tarelyn wrote: »

cant see any valid reasoning for Guild Only. Does anyone have any input on why its like that in the first place?
ive only played one other MMO (-DDO-) so maybe im bit clueless that way.
is it like this in other games?

not really, no.

its a strange mechanic and the fees on all transactions (whether CoD or guild stores) are so steep it has forced everyone back to the dark ages of selling everything by virtue of shouting in public zones and hoping someone sees your post in the resulting cacophony.

nudel

chaosngn_ESO wrote: »

They need to do one of the three:

1. Institute a mass auction house
2. Cut back on how many drops people get
3. Cheapen bag space

Far too many greens and blues are dropping in this game. That makes it difficult to have an economy without an auction house. Selling in the guild store isn't working as a solution since bag and bank space is so expensive later on and since so many people are getting the drops, they are hard to sell in /zone to begin with. Not only that, we're basically spamming the hell out of /zone with sales.

This means you are loaded down with greens and blues and basically can't sell them quick enough or do anything with them.

If they cut down the drop rates, this would help. But the best solution overall is a marketplace.

What I would suggest is have auction houses be realms just like PvP. You have to pick one to be on, and you can change your auction house realm only once per week/month.

This would help alleviate the strain on the mail/auction servers since it is one megaserver.

The problem isn't the drop rate, it's what you're selling. Yea that unremarkable green/ blue you just looted off of some dark anchor fodder isn't worth much b/c it's unremarkable. From what I've seen the most in-demand things right now are items for crafting, crafted items, and set items. So, you could extract that blue or green and hope to get a blue or green temper/ tannin which could fetch some decent gold and would move quickly as long as you don't get greedy about pricing. You could craft things themselves with the materials you extracted and sell those. Believe it or not many people are not maxxing every profession on every character and may be in need of your services. Or you could just farm the dropped set pieces if you could care less about crafting. Some of the dropped sets are really nice and they are distinct from the sets that can be crafted. Someone who has Robe of the Warlock, may very well be looking to complete the set with two other pieces. Yea, they're just greens and blues, but they're unique set pieces not unremarkable greens and blues. Know your market.

Your idea of realm based auction houses sounds terrible. At least with the current system, I can leave a guild if it's inactive or I don't like their prices.

selisa381b14_ESO

Holycannoli wrote: »

I vote for a 3rd option: a dedicated market zone that works sort of similar to Everquest's bazaar from the Luclin era.

I don't remember much of it but I would like a separate zone where we can hire NPCs to sell our wares, who stand around stalls much like they do in the cities now. We pay a fee for the NPC, deposit what we want to sell and what price and that's it. We come back whenever we want to take profits.

The zone would have a search feature for buyers to locate NPCs who have the item they're interested in or a list of NPCs that have items that fit the search criteria. The search feature only tells them which NPC to browse and where to find them, they still need to run to that NPC and buy from it. If possible I'd want the search to work across multiple instances.

It's not quite an auction house but it does allow buying and AFK selling with your entire faction, not just one guild.

Actually FFXIV did that at first but now they have retainers which is nice.

7788b14_ESO

SWG had a nice thing where you could craft and sale out of your home. As you developed a reputation people would fly to your planet to buy from you because of the quality of your goods. They also had forums where you could advertise, buy , and sale. And they had an auction house.

GreatPlayer

I have a suspicion the reason the auction house is guild only is because items are a lot easier to find and crafting material are a lot easier to gather! So i am not really against the current decision to make auction guild only! But I do want to be able to put up more then 30 items in a guild store!

nathanmaxtrob14_ESO

Frankly I don't like guilds at all and I never join them. Though with the way ESO is set up, I realize that I'm at a severe disadvantage for not being in a guild just because the game doesn't have an auction house.

I'm basically going to have to join a guild just so I can have access to more items. Is that really what guilds are for?

Greydog

chaosngn_ESO wrote: »

Tarelyn wrote: »

cant see any valid reasoning for Guild Only. Does anyone have any input on why its like that in the first place?
ive only played one other MMO (-DDO-) so maybe im bit clueless that way.
is it like this in other games?

Yes, gold sellers.

Think about this. They can farm all day long, but without a massive auction house, they can't sell the items they get to make the gold they sell unless it's in a guild or in trade.

We've seen how effective they are in trade, and most guilds wouldn't stand for it. My guess is that this was a decision from the beginning to combat gold selling.

I added 10 more gold sellers to my ignore list today. Not having an AH is obviously no deterrent.

daan2006

i come from mmorpgs that have always been Server Wide so imo Server Wide

dpayne83_ESO

Guild Only Auction House helps combat gold farmers, keeps monopolies from happening, and helps the economy more than a central, all-encompassing auction house. Give me a reason why the server wide is needed without resorting to anything sounding like "I'm too lazy to shift through 5 guild stores." or "Because another game has it". And don't say because it's better.

Every game that has a central AH that I've played has had a crappy economy full of greedy money grubbers who doesn't have any idea the value of items because they take advantage of creating the monopolies on specific items which screws other players. It's a design feature by the devs that I and quite a few others actually agree with. I hate coming off sounding a little gruff but this is probably the 200th time I've seen a crying thread about the auction houses. So many people like the current system and so many people hate it. Devs caving in to pointless player requests is why WoW went from being awesome to really being an easy MMO that pretty much hands you everything which I personally hate.

Drachenfier

dpayne83_ESO wrote: »

Public auction houses open up the option for people to hold monopolies on certain things. Take the rare motif books for instance. If someone has the money they would buy them all and mark them up to ridiculous prices and keep doing it so the other gamers don't have a choice but to buy their overpriced wares. If anything the auction houses should be by zone, not server wide.

and guild stores supposedly prevent this from happening? Not that it's a common occurence, been MMOing since 1999 and I've never seen any instances of this....ultra rare items are generally very high priced in any market, real or fantasy, no matter who's selling them.

Odditorium

I don't like the idea of a public auction house. It will homogenize everybody. You could buy high level equip to lvl your skills. The way the game is now really enriches everybody's char.

Drachenfier

chaosngn_ESO wrote: »

Tarelyn wrote: »

cant see any valid reasoning for Guild Only. Does anyone have any input on why its like that in the first place?
ive only played one other MMO (-DDO-) so maybe im bit clueless that way.
is it like this in other games?

Yes, gold sellers.

Think about this. They can farm all day long, but without a massive auction house, they can't sell the items they get to make the gold they sell unless it's in a guild or in trade.

We've seen how effective they are in trade, and most guilds wouldn't stand for it. My guess is that this was a decision from the beginning to combat gold selling.

I'm assuming you never played Lineage 2. That game was completely dominated by gold sellers, and guess what? No auction house. At all. Period.

However, Rift, SWTOR, WOW, LOTRO, etc, all have auction houses, and no tinfoil hat gold selling domination of the market.

Herp, derp.

dpayne83_ESO

Drachenfier wrote: »

I'm assuming you never played Lineage 2. That game was completely dominated by gold sellers, and guess what? No auction house. At all. Period.

However, Rift, SWTOR, WOW, LOTRO, etc, all have auction houses, and no tinfoil hat gold selling domination of the market.

Herp, derp.

Really, you put WoW is the same sentence as gold selling domination of the market, yeah ok. I guess all these ingame mails and friend request from the gold sellers are just nothing. We have them now in ESO but at least they don't have a strong ingame platform to make good gold outside of hacking accounts. One of the reasons the Real Money Auction House for Diablo 3 was pulled because was of gold sellers abusing the system. Farming really expensive items and then selling them for cheap to make quick money.

The only way you 100% get rid of gold farmers is for people to stop buying from them. And that will never happen because there are people out there who just don't want to work for it so they use their wallet to give their characters and advantage and break the ToS.

zaria

KerinKor wrote: »

Eris wrote: »

People just sit there all day buying up the cheap stuff and listing it for way more than its worth artificially inflating the value of items.

Easy fix for that is make the item un-sellable once bought off the AH. Sadly no MMO does it and every MMO is full of leeches 'playing the AH'.

This will be harder on a megaserver, rater it will be easy to grab all the under-priced items, however it will be hard to corner the marked for some items like runes for enchanting as the supply is large.

Rev Rielle

In no way shape or form is this type of MMO - or any other in the past - primarily about making money (EVE excluded). Players some how have gotten it into their heads for an unknown reason that success in an MMO is tied to how much coin your character has, or can, make.
The simple fact is that, in-game coin is not needed for anything save repair costs.
Any attempt by an online game to try and move the greater community away from this misguided emphasis on coin acquisition is a commendable one; in this case being the absence of such ineffective and available auction houses.
Finally, anyone that's played most any MMO over a significant amount of time knows just how bad auction houses are for the long term in-game economy as a whole. It's clear that when put in the hands of the player community the economy becomes distorted. Zenimax has taken steps to mitigate this it seems, and that's a good thing.

Drachenfier

dpayne83_ESO wrote: »

Drachenfier wrote: »

I'm assuming you never played Lineage 2. That game was completely dominated by gold sellers, and guess what? No auction house. At all. Period.

However, Rift, SWTOR, WOW, LOTRO, etc, all have auction houses, and no tinfoil hat gold selling domination of the market.

Herp, derp.

Really, you put WoW is the same sentence as gold selling domination of the market, yeah ok. I guess all these ingame mails and friend request from the gold sellers are just nothing. We have them now in ESO but at least they don't have a strong ingame platform to make good gold outside of hacking accounts. One of the reasons the Real Money Auction House for Diablo 3 was pulled because was of gold sellers abusing the system. Farming really expensive items and then selling them for cheap to make quick money.

The only way you 100% get rid of gold farmers is for people to stop buying from them. And that will never happen because there are people out there who just don't want to work for it so they use their wallet to give their characters and advantage and break the ToS.

I"m sorry, but the existence of gold sellers doesn't mean they dominate the market. There are gold sellers in ESO...there are even gold sellers in Age of Conan, and hardly anybody plays that game anymore. You cannot escape the gold sellers, and an auction house makes no difference either way in that regard.

I get more gold seller spam in ESO right now than in ANY of the games I listed above. As a matter of fact, of the games I listed, only ESO and WoW have gold seller spam at all.

Forztr

If we don't gave a server wide auction house , I'd like to see at least see town stores where you each main town of an area had its own separate Auction House.

Chomppa

I'm happy without auction houses , but if the majority wants the auction house then they'll get it .

Jeremy

Chomppa wrote: »

I'm happy without auction houses , but if the majority wants the auction house then they'll get it .

I hope you're right, because the lack of a public auction house is really holding this game back. My biggest fear though is the developers are set in their ways and will refuse to bend on this issue, which would be a tragic mistake. Because this game has so much potential.

I'm glad to see this thread is still active.

Blackhorne

Greydog wrote: »

chaosngn_ESO wrote: »

Tarelyn wrote: »

cant see any valid reasoning for Guild Only. Does anyone have any input on why its like that in the first place?
ive only played one other MMO (-DDO-) so maybe im bit clueless that way.
is it like this in other games?

Yes, gold sellers.

Think about this. They can farm all day long, but without a massive auction house, they can't sell the items they get to make the gold they sell unless it's in a guild or in trade.

We've seen how effective they are in trade, and most guilds wouldn't stand for it. My guess is that this was a decision from the beginning to combat gold selling.

I added 10 more gold sellers to my ignore list today. Not having an AH is obviously no deterrent.

That's just a negative version of the "Tiger Repellent" fallacy. Just because gold farmers exist doesn't mean that the lack of a server-wide auction house doesn't deter some gold farmers. It's possible that having a server-wide auction house could lead to dozens or hundreds more gold sellers than we see now.

In other words, not having an AH is certainly not a panacea for the gold-farmer issue, but it is quite possibly a deterrent.

Jeremy

Blackhorne wrote: »

Greydog wrote: »

chaosngn_ESO wrote: »

Tarelyn wrote: »

cant see any valid reasoning for Guild Only. Does anyone have any input on why its like that in the first place?
ive only played one other MMO (-DDO-) so maybe im bit clueless that way.
is it like this in other games?

Yes, gold sellers.

Think about this. They can farm all day long, but without a massive auction house, they can't sell the items they get to make the gold they sell unless it's in a guild or in trade.

We've seen how effective they are in trade, and most guilds wouldn't stand for it. My guess is that this was a decision from the beginning to combat gold selling.

I added 10 more gold sellers to my ignore list today. Not having an AH is obviously no deterrent.

That's just a negative version of the "Tiger Repellent" fallacy. Just because gold farmers exist doesn't mean that the lack of a server-wide auction house doesn't deter some gold farmers. It's possible that having a server-wide auction house could lead to dozens or hundreds more gold sellers than we see now.

In other words, not having an AH is certainly not a panacea for the gold-farmer issue, but it is quite possibly a deterrent.

It's not much of a deterrent considering they are everywhere. I see constant spams and letters from them every time I play.

But I think their point is that even if you are correct and it does hinder their activities in some significant way... it certainly isn't enough to justify squashing a public market and denying players an accessible and thriving economy they can use.

As I've said before, this is one such case where the supposed cure is worse than the disease itself.

Greydog

Blackhorne wrote: »

Greydog wrote: »

chaosngn_ESO wrote: »

Tarelyn wrote: »

cant see any valid reasoning for Guild Only. Does anyone have any input on why its like that in the first place?
ive only played one other MMO (-DDO-) so maybe im bit clueless that way.
is it like this in other games?

Yes, gold sellers.

Think about this. They can farm all day long, but without a massive auction house, they can't sell the items they get to make the gold they sell unless it's in a guild or in trade.

We've seen how effective they are in trade, and most guilds wouldn't stand for it. My guess is that this was a decision from the beginning to combat gold selling.

I added 10 more gold sellers to my ignore list today. Not having an AH is obviously no deterrent.

That's just a negative version of the "Tiger Repellent" fallacy. Just because gold farmers exist doesn't mean that the lack of a server-wide auction house doesn't deter some gold farmers. It's possible that having a server-wide auction house could lead to dozens or hundreds more gold sellers than we see now.

In other words, not having an AH is certainly not a panacea for the gold-farmer issue, but it is quite possibly a deterrent.

Reported/ignored at least 10 more so far today and I've only been logged in for less than two hours.

@Jeremy read me right. While not having an open market may hinder their ability to transfer their product ..it is no hindrance to advertising and it will absolutely not stop them.

Orizuru

Jeremy wrote: »

Chomppa wrote: »

I'm happy without auction houses , but if the majority wants the auction house then they'll get it .

I hope you're right, because the lack of a public auction house is really holding this game back. My biggest fear though is the developers are set in their ways and will refuse to bend on this issue, which would be a tragic mistake. Because this game has so much potential.

I'm glad to see this thread is still active.

Would you care to explain how it holds the game back? I hear this response a lot, but nobody has really given a convincing argument other than they want something and don't want to have to do a little leg work to find a market to buy it.

Do we really have to have a WalMart mentality in video games?

Jeremy

NaciremaDiputs wrote: »

Jeremy wrote: »

Chomppa wrote: »

I'm happy without auction houses , but if the majority wants the auction house then they'll get it .

I hope you're right, because the lack of a public auction house is really holding this game back. My biggest fear though is the developers are set in their ways and will refuse to bend on this issue, which would be a tragic mistake. Because this game has so much potential.

I'm glad to see this thread is still active.

Would you care to explain how it holds the game back? I hear this response a lot, but nobody has really given a convincing argument other than they want something and don't want to have to do a little leg work to find a market to buy it.

Do we really have to have a WalMart mentality in video games?

It holds the game back because players have no reliable way to trade for items they themselves cannot reasonably obtain on their own.

For example, I would like to be able to deck my character out in at least a full set of blue crafted gear so I can optimize my character to my standards as I level up. I find this impossible, because there is little or no economy to speak of.

zaria

Greydog wrote: »

Blackhorne wrote: »

Greydog wrote: »

chaosngn_ESO wrote: »

Tarelyn wrote: »

cant see any valid reasoning for Guild Only. Does anyone have any input on why its like that in the first place?
ive only played one other MMO (-DDO-) so maybe im bit clueless that way.
is it like this in other games?

Yes, gold sellers.

Think about this. They can farm all day long, but without a massive auction house, they can't sell the items they get to make the gold they sell unless it's in a guild or in trade.

We've seen how effective they are in trade, and most guilds wouldn't stand for it. My guess is that this was a decision from the beginning to combat gold selling.

I added 10 more gold sellers to my ignore list today. Not having an AH is obviously no deterrent.

That's just a negative version of the "Tiger Repellent" fallacy. Just because gold farmers exist doesn't mean that the lack of a server-wide auction house doesn't deter some gold farmers. It's possible that having a server-wide auction house could lead to dozens or hundreds more gold sellers than we see now.

In other words, not having an AH is certainly not a panacea for the gold-farmer issue, but it is quite possibly a deterrent.

Reported/ignored at least 10 more so far today and I've only been logged in for less than two hours.

@Jeremy read me right. While not having an open market may hinder their ability to transfer their product ..it is no hindrance to advertising and it will absolutely not stop them.

I have never heard a gold seller, I tend to turn of zone chat as it breaks up guild chat with people selling stuff, however I have it on in slow hours like during night and don't get any, EU server, AD level 24 if its servers or levels they hunt on.

Anyway the lack of global AH is not because of gold sellers, its two reasons.
First is probably to make guilds more important, this works great for me, we mostly swap around in guild, no gold involved, note that this was common in wow too.

The second who is more important is how the economy in an MMO work, the majority of players want an fast and sure sale, if lots of similar items are sold they will underbid each other, ESO run on two servers with hundreds of thousand players, the only items who will have any value is things who has more buyers than sellers.

Now unlike wow anybody can gather any crafting material, fewer items are bound on pickup and even bound items can be deconstructed by anybody.

In short the only thing in ESO who will be worth far more than the npc merchant pay is good and rare armor set, and legendary stuff.

Morvoldo

we really do need an Auction house or something as guild stores hardly have anything in them (even when guild has 500 players in them but mostly only ever half or less than that is actually online) the 25% charge dont help as no one wants to add anything Special / big ie weapons/armor and not enough players contribute, and all that sell are potion 1 of and Junk like Deadra Husks for 20g WTF and race stones for 20g or less 1 of WHY tis not worth it, and lots of other stuff thats a waste of time, especially when u have to search through a whole list of 5 guilds.

i'm really fed up as theres no ware to sell my wares or to buy anything decent, and please dont say its the guild/s your in as if that was the case these threads wouldn't be here and there all over these forums.
i would love to go and buy a dozen Trait stones or some race stones or even some decent armor without spamming trade for them and waiting hours for a reply, when i could just go to a single place and search for what i want.
this game Needs it i'm sorry but this guild thing is not working ,even if you can look at other guild store u have to be pvp ready/or skilled to bloody do that or to even keep them there and only guilds that have those store charge over the top prices. thats no economy.

sorry my views which i agree with all who say this game does need a Auction House.

STO, wow ,Swtor lots of others have them and they do just fine.
i was always finding what i want to buy and sell in all of them with no problems / trouble at all.

loops73

we need a proper auction house, I hate having to search through a 1000 items within 4 different guild stores to find what I need.

Greydog

zaria wrote: »

Anyway the lack of global AH is not because of gold sellers, its two reasons.

First is probably to make guilds more important, this works great for me, we mostly swap around in guild, no gold involved, note that this was common in wow too.

The second who is more important is how the economy in an MMO work, the majority of players want an fast and sure sale, if lots of similar items are sold they will underbid each other, ESO run on two servers with hundreds of thousand players, the only items who will have any value is things who has more buyers than sellers.

Now unlike wow anybody can gather any crafting material, fewer items are bound on pickup and even bound items can be deconstructed by anybody.

In short the only thing in ESO who will be worth far more than the npc merchant pay is good and rare armor set, and legendary stuff.

First ..Guilds in most "normal" MMO's are there to promote community and provide a gathering place for like minded players to easily find others to game with. In essence, ZOS has greatly diminished that by making them a sole vehicle for trade and by making membership by account rather than by character.

Second ..Yes, prices will go down and the majority of players will be better for it.

As you noted yourself. Most items in this game get either vendored, researched or deconstructed. Leaving only the best items, mats and consumables that will need to be posted. The best items will be sold at their worth, the rest will even out at some point.

seaef

Tarelyn wrote: »

Eris wrote: »

I voted guild only mostly because I feel that server wide auction houses just lead to market manipulation and price gouging. People just sit there all day buying up the cheap stuff and listing it for way more than its worth artificially inflating the value of items.

i understand what you mean. but dont u think they will still do that in Guild anyway?
i mean, in theory, no... but people r people anyway. and greed is still greed.
i just dont get it.

Not in the three guilds I'm in. Everyone is pretty reasonable about balancing profit and supporting guild-mates. If your guild buddies are price-gouging, you may want to find a different guild.