Halls of torment / Lyris Doppelganger

fvanvliet

this is the second time i tried now as level 36 nightblade
as soon as she transforms im screwed so again i filled out a bug report as i did the first time
only this time i was not as nice see below is a copy of the report

==== begin quote ===

you need to really tone this quest down im level 36 after lyris transforms to naga i cant beat her anymore i might aswell quit and commit suicide it is part of the main quest line .. IF U GUYS WANT PEOPLE TO GET DEMOTIVATED THIS SURE IS THE WAY TO DO IT !!
if i cant get any further in the main quest i might as well sell off my account to someone who is willing to suffer the humiliation of a company who appears to be only in it for the finances and doesnt give a damn about their customers complaining about something being overpowered

regards a severly pissed off player
===== end quote ====

wish more players would actualy bug report this
maybe they will get their head out fo their asses ..
they nerve molag baal but they leave this *** the way she is grr

Ysne58

I may be able to beat with a templar -- won't know till I got that leveled up. But the nightblade, out leveled by 20 levels and still cannot win and with my disabilities ... won't ever win.

kasain

I HATE HER!!!!!!

lvl 44 Sor. Completed the Mages and fighters guild quest. Solo killed the Sigfud giant. Killed the brother to the king with two whisper healers and so many other bosses 10+ lvls higher then her, yet this is the one boss I can't beat.

I say she overpowered as she only lvl 30. You can't tell me she stronger than the dragon in F guilde, or that giant.

I didn't beat her, but one time I did take her to the back and tried holding her on the spikes in the back. Her HP did drop, and she was far from balls. But at same time I was somewhat boxed in to avoid her conal attack. If you can heal, this may work.

Allyah

Raubrey wrote: »

Allyah wrote: »

Apricot wrote: »

Winnower wrote: »

And this is why nerfing Doshia ends up being a bad idea. Anyone who learned how to easily kill Doshia shouldn't have any problems with this fight.

Sorry but this fight is fundamentally problematic in the same way that Dosia was - it's overtuned and very build specific.[...]

Build specific? Not really? Can't you just find a strategy that works for your build? I don't know. I came out of these fights understanding my class skills better (not what they do but rather when to use them). Also saying something is over-tuned when the NPC that should be helping you doesn't help seems a little premature.

And Doshia wasn't really hard at all once you knew to destroy the orbs...

You've gotten your point across that you don't agree. How about not muddying up the thread with your repetitive posts and passive aggressive remarks against other posters(yes, you, started the forum pvp pot shots at Lana and anyone who doesn't agree with you).

It is obvious you don't understand the limits of all the otherwise good builds that are problematic. Maybe an AOE skill needs to be added to nightblade (no) or else just tell everyone up front to train for a bow (no). I'm a siphon/2H NB ...now an off-healer as well.

I'm sure all you epic players out there who owned this fight at level 12 have something better to do on a Friday night. I do not, sadly.

The same who also don't understand that other mechanics may come into play be it lag, buggy inconsistent AI etc. may also affect performance (and oh the lucky ones with a stuck doshia) -- and the sheer fact that the fight is not only difficult beyond reason but tremendously non-entertaining...for some people. And if you don't think so...fine that has been made clear, very clear, kill the orbs, clear, gotcha, you owned it. Oakie dokie.

I can say that of 41 people in my guild, maybe 3 would consider this fight reasonable -- though I am speculating about some from past experience, and of the two that said they did it at 30 only one said it was not too hard. No one has said they liked the fight.

Forum: a place, meeting, or medium where ideas and views on a particular issue can be exchanged.

I am in the correct place, yes? Also, there have been many people here who I have not agreed with (edit: who I have not responded to). In fact, this last response was only meant to incite a discussion (giving an opening, if you will) for the poster to explain something to me. Hence, the questions.

As far as I know, there is no build so limited that it cannot do that quest. Again, that's why I formed my responses as questions.

I understand game mechanics just fine. But thank you for your concern.

Also, I have already posted when I did this and how and I certainly didn't find it easier or do it at level 12. Thank you for your unnecessary exaggeration.

Raubrey wrote: »

Funny my build works in 99% of the other quests.[...]

Passive aggressive? Hello pot.

Apricot

Allyah wrote: »

Build specific? Not really? Can't you just find a strategy that works for your build? I don't know. I came out of these fights understanding my class skills better (not what they do but rather when to use them). Also saying something is over-tuned when the NPC that should be helping you doesn't help seems a little premature.

Yes, build specific. Really. And before anything else is said, I one-shot this encounter on my 31 templar simply because it was the "right" build. There is no way my NB or DK could beat this sorry excuse for solo boss at that level with their builds. Knowing what to do and being able to do it are two different things.

So yes, the useless NPC's have something to do with the crap this encounter is, but it being build specific is even more problematic. And this isn't the only one. This is a poor game design at its very core.

What's just as bad is the way you have to go about defeating . . . well just about everything. Auto attack, auto attack, auto attack . . . save your stam for dodging and sprinting away and your magika for heals and an occasional shot at the mob . . . auto attack, auto attack, auto attack. Because you have these cool abilities but you can only use some of them sometimes.

Some people may find that type of combat fun, I don't. I'd like to use my abilities to, you know, kill stuff, not plink away with auto attacks or else become resource starved.

Allyah wrote: »

And Doshia wasn't really hard at all once you knew to destroy the orbs...

Doshia was garbage. You're talking about a level eight boss. A level where you could dodge twice before running out of stam. Everyone knows to destroy the orbs. When you figure out how to keep doing that while stam or magika starved let us know.

kasain

Yea, and then many JA don't even work. I cant use uppercut. It won't knock her back or stun her. I cant use the bind move on her, magic as even if she bound she does her moves and balls go to her. My crave great axe move can AOE balls but even a 110 base dmg great sword is either not enough to one shot all balls, or you run out of stamina to fast.


Yet, the lvl 50 ones in Fighter guilde quest I can beat, and the lvl 40 ones out in open. So something is wrong here.

Yankee

It can be beat even on a Nightblade near or at level, and even with a glitched follower. There have been a lot of people pass that quest under those conditions or VR would be empty.

That is all I was trying to say. But sure, the followers should work better.

And even then it is a tough fight with little room for error for some class builds. But it feels good to beat it.

ZOS will be reading the feedback and not want to lose the subscriptions. No doubt they will nerf the fight, as they have others.

Allyah

Apricot wrote: »

Allyah wrote: »

Build specific? Not really? Can't you just find a strategy that works for your build? I don't know. I came out of these fights understanding my class skills better (not what they do but rather when to use them). Also saying something is over-tuned when the NPC that should be helping you doesn't help seems a little premature.

Yes, build specific. Really. And before anything else is said, I one-shot this encounter on my 31 templar simply because it was the "right" build. There is no way my NB or DK could beat this sorry excuse for solo boss at that level with their builds. Knowing what to do and being able to do it are two different things.

So yes, the useless NPC's have something to do with the crap this encounter is, but it being build specific is even more problematic. And this isn't the only one. This is a poor game design at its very core.

What's just as bad is the way you have to go about defeating . . . well just about everything. Auto attack, auto attack, auto attack . . . save your stam for dodging and sprinting away and your magika for heals and an occasional shot at the mob . . . auto attack, auto attack, auto attack. Because you have these cool abilities but you can only use some of them sometimes.

Some people may find that type of combat fun, I don't. I'd like to use my abilities to, you know, kill stuff, not plink away with auto attacks or else become resource starved.

Allyah wrote: »

And Doshia wasn't really hard at all once you knew to destroy the orbs...

Doshia was garbage. You're talking about a level eight boss. A level where you could dodge twice before running out of stam. Everyone knows to destroy the orbs. When you figure out how to keep doing that while stam or magika starved let us know.

I, too, am a Templar and beat this at level 31 but I was not able to one-shot it. Could you tell me how you did that? *Genuine curiosity* <--(because every time I say something, someone seems to think I mean something else).

Although I can see someone being limited by their lack of stamina or health, learning to manage them so that you aren't continuously running out (at least with pve fights) would be a good idea. There are armor, racial, class skills, and enchants that help this. There is no auto attack, but I'll assume you meant melee. Some bosses I have had to almost completely melee but I've also been able to mix skills and melee with some.

Personally, I find the repetitiveness of the Doshia-type bosses found throughout the game to be more annoying than it being challenging to kill them. I am frustrated throughout some of the boss fights but I definitely prefer it over how easy it is to kill boss mobs in other games.

There was no need to repeat that everyone knows to destroy the orbs. It was never my point that they didn't know. I was simply responding to:

Apricot wrote: »

Sorry but this fight is fundamentally problematic in the same way that Dosia was - it's overtuned and very build specific. Everyone knows to kill the orbs. Everyone knows to kill the orbs.

...where you mentioned Doshia was also overtuned and build specific. All I was saying is I didn't have trouble with it when I learned that I needed to kill the orbs in that first Doshia-type boss fight.

Seriously, though, one shot. How?[Now that I'm thinking about it, I can think of a couple of ways (if you have the "right" setup/skills), but I'd still like to know yours.]

Allyah

fvanvliet wrote: »

this is the second time i tried now as level 36 nightblade
as soon as she transforms im screwed so again i filled out a bug report as i did the first time
only this time i was not as nice see below is a copy of the report

==== begin quote ===

you need to really tone this quest down im level 36 after lyris transforms to naga i cant beat her anymore i might aswell quit and commit suicide it is part of the main quest line .. IF U GUYS WANT PEOPLE TO GET DEMOTIVATED THIS SURE IS THE WAY TO DO IT !!
if i cant get any further in the main quest i might as well sell off my account to someone who is willing to suffer the humiliation of a company who appears to be only in it for the finances and doesnt give a damn about their customers complaining about something being overpowered

regards a severly pissed off player
===== end quote ====

wish more players would actualy bug report this
maybe they will get their head out fo their asses ..
they nerve molag baal but they leave this *** the way she is grr

Rage is sure to get you what you desire. Threats work even better.

Apricot

Allyah wrote: »

I, too, am a Templar and beat this at level 31 but I was not able to one-shot it. Could you tell me how you did that? *Genuine curiosity* <--(because every time I say something, someone seems to think I mean something else).

I basically strafed around the outer part of the circle using an occasional binding javelin or draining shot. The rest was just white damage from my bow, including shooting the orbs. I would throw a heal on myself if I dropped below 60% and dodge when I needed to. When the orbs came up I just picked them off as fast as I could and started strafing again. I made sure my ultimate was full before beginning the fight.

After an eternity of this she was almost dead. I threw solar disturbance on her and finished her off.

Allyah wrote: »

Although I can see someone being limited by their lack of stamina or health, learning to manage them so that you aren't continuously running out (at least with pve fights) would be a good idea. There are armor, racial, class skills, and enchants that help this.

I think this is the biggest troll any MMO has ever perpetuated on its customer base. Here are these abilities. You can only use a handful at a time. Even worse, you can't use them that much because the devs played Scrooge with resources and also added dodge ball to the game. For the most part you will be hitting things with all the force of your grandmother wearing oven mitts. Isn't that challenging and fun?

Allyah wrote: »

There is no auto attack, but I'll assume you meant melee. Some bosses I have had to almost completely melee but I've also been able to mix skills and melee with some.

You're correct. There is no actual auto attack. I was referring to the basic default left button white damage attack.

Allyah wrote: »

Personally, I find the repetitiveness of the Doshia-type bosses found throughout the game to be more annoying than it being challenging to kill them. I am frustrated throughout some of the boss fights but I definitely prefer it over how easy it is to kill boss mobs in other games.

If by "easy" you mean actually able to use your dps skills, then I'll have to go with "easy" being more fun. There are other ways to make encounters challenging than "LOL can't use your skills Trolololol!"

Allyah

Apricot wrote: »

I basically strafed around the outer part of the circle using an occasional binding javelin or draining shot. The rest was just white damage from my bow, including shooting the orbs. I would throw a heal on myself if I dropped below 60% and dodge when I needed to. When the orbs came up I just picked them off as fast as I could and started strafing again. I made sure my ultimate was full before beginning the fight.

After an eternity of this she was almost dead. I threw solar disturbance on her and finished her off.

Ahhh, I thought you actually meant you one hit her. Not that you killed her in one try. My mistake.

Apricot wrote: »

I think this is the biggest troll any MMO has ever perpetuated on its customer base. Here are these abilities. You can only use a handful at a time. Even worse, you can't use them that much because the devs played Scrooge with resources and also added dodge ball to the game. For the most part you will be hitting things with all the force of your grandmother wearing oven mitts. Isn't that challenging and fun?

I guess I'll just agree to disagree with you on the limited skills. As I get higher in level, it seems to have become even easier to never run out of resources (unless I know I'm not going to need the resources and spam the **** out of skills.

Apricot wrote: »

If by "easy" you mean actually able to use your dps skills, then I'll have to go with "easy" being more fun. There are other ways to make encounters challenging than "LOL can't use your skills Trolololol!"

I use my dps skills a lot but this does come down to what you enjoy, I guess. Thanks for your responses.

Ramgart

this *** *** is so annoying!! they need to proper balance this encounter!

bucknut2006

Not sure why everyone is having problems. Did this with my level 30 templar in under 1 minute. Just continual do a shield smash until she was stunned and then used Biting Jabs. Only had her spawn the globes once and used Biting Jabs to make sure I got them all.

gwessingrwb17_ESO

lol, not everyone uses your build so stating don't know why everyone is having probs as you used shield smash/biting jabs is ridiculous.

Darzil

Not sure if it's my build coming into it's own, or if I'm finally getting the hang of this game. The harvester bit was a lot easier than Doshia due to having room to run around and target the globes (I'm in Ebonheart Pact, where Doshia is a rather confined fight). Am a 30 Nightblade wearing Heavy/Medium and using Bow. Just used ranged attacks and kited anything dangerous. Had Tharn as my companion.

Warec

bucknut2006 wrote: »

Not sure why everyone is having problems. Did this with my level 30 templar in under 1 minute. Just continual do a shield smash until she was stunned and then used Biting Jabs. Only had her spawn the globes once and used Biting Jabs to make sure I got them all.

Sorry man but I have a hard time believe ya. Too many people here having the same issue, at much higher lvl for a lvl 30 to suddenly breeze thru it.

I am a 30 templar and I didn't stand a chance, especially with dum@ss Lyris not doing anything but standing there trying to looking pretty.

This(along with some other end quest bosses) need serious adjustment for the level they are supposed to be.

Dayel

As a Level 35 sorcerer I can handle Tharn and the skeletons before and after, but multiple attempts at Lyris the Doppelganger have proved hopeless. I do hit the globes but she wipes me out anyway. Hope eventually they tone this one down a bit, or it will have to wait till I am a 50.

crislevin

shayafb14_ESO wrote: »

As a Level 35 sorcerer I can handle Tharn and the skeletons before and after, but multiple attempts at Lyris the Doppelganger have proved hopeless. I do hit the globes but she wipes me out anyway. Hope eventually they tone this one down a bit, or it will have to wait till I am a 50.

Get a pet and stay behind, as far as you can, use light attack, it seems she won't even generate orbs if she doesn't get closer to you.

Yankee

Got around to do this at level 32 on my Sorc. It was pretty easy. Tharn was my follower, he was handy for about the first 15 seconds until he got focused then was out of health and stood there.

I leveled with a resto staff, only slot Rapid Regeneration. Endless Fury, Twilight Matriarch, Crystal Fragments, and Silver Bolts. Use the Storm Antronach. I have a 2 hander but hardly ever use it. I have all light armor. With food, my Magicka is about maxed out and I take all the spell cost reduction passives I can and Jewlery.

Anyway never fell below 75% health. Just stayed at range, avoided her ground cast, and mage furied her orbs.

I usually save my ultimate for when I get in trouble, so I never used it although I should have.

I have taken all 4 classes through within a couple levels of the quest. I would rate Templar, Nightblade, DK, and Sorc from hardest to easiest the way I had them specced out. On my tank Templar (besides not having done the fight before) I just had way too many defensives and heals,lacked DPS, and ended up resource starved.

Malthesian

I'm not a skilled player by any means, but I took this on as a level 30 Destro staff Sorc and got through it my first try with Lyris as a follower. She didn't bug on me at all on the final encounter, she paused for a bit but always ended coming back swinging. Greater Storm Astro as the Ult and any time orbs got close I used Unstable wall of Elements to prevent them from hitting her. By 30, a player should be hitting the Harvesters with AOE attacks on solo encounters like Doshia, Rillis, etc. for the Feasts.

Raubrey

Malthesian wrote: »

By 30, a player should be hitting the Harvesters with AOE attacks on solo encounters like Doshia, Rillis, etc. for the Feasts.

I think this addresses part of the problem. It doesn't seem to be common knowledge that AOE was a required skill for this game -- unless you're grouping etc.-- and certainly some classes and particularly certain builds have little to none.

I imagine the healer templar is going to be a bugger too like Yankee mentioned, though he apparently managed. Sadly that is on my second build though I hope I will have enough dps...we'll see. I expect to be resourced starved as well.

neurovore

I took more dirt naps here, on Lyris than anywhere else so far (lvl 30 NB).
The strategy that worked for me was bow + scatter shot + siphoning strikes for sta/mag regen and strife for dot and health regen (if i fumbled and was standing in her cone attack)

Then i just proceeded to knock her back - away from the bubbles while i killed them. Took a while, but was easy.

Edit : and yeah, had Lyris with me and she was just standing there like a big ironclad meat slab all the time

Covarnis

Did that with 32 sorcerer from a 4th or so try. Switching from restoration staff to destruction back and forth.

First, when she was in Lyris form, healed Tharn as much as I could, it helped to get her into slug form with almost no effort, however somehow got killed by bad positioning (pressed by her into corner!)

Added some more heavy armour (I usually have at least 5 light armour) on (some quest rewards etc. which remained in my inventory).

I got her quite easily in the end by focusing on destroying the balls as soon as they appear and avoiding getting stuck in tables, corners, hit by her attacks etc. I was also using entropy (mages guild), silver bolts (fighters guild), dark magic stunning/interrupting ultimate (and putting on her several walls of elements while she was stunned), also heavy staff attack here and there. Moving constantly helped a lot.

My main (only?) complaint about this fight was actually ping/lag. European server is not in Europe and usually I get very horrible ping and delays in my abilities, which adds even more "challenge" (having Mac probably doesn't help this as well), as sometimes you get by things earlier than you see them on screen, the same with firing your own abilities.

Morthur

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Pchela

What is this add on? My Lyris Doppleganger is bugged out and shows no animation when she attacks at all. I've had CS abandon the quest for me to try and fix it, but it's still not working. I'd like to try this addon to see if that helps any.

ambrynn_ESO

Lyris companion is totally useless. I wish I could abandon this quest and take Tharn.

Ysne58

Tharn is equally useless at the moment.

yenkin2001b14_ESO

I just gave this encounter a try, OMG, I did not stand a chance, the companion was useless, and evertime I got her down the life bubbles had to be shot at the same time avoiding her AOE. going to have to try this again in 5 levels, level 30 is no match for her. I don't mind a challenge and a long fight, but with the miserly gold model, it would take days to get back the repair bill.

Warlordgreebo

Good greeblings,

Warlord Greebo here. I bring greebly news; this is an EASY fight... if you know how to greeble her properly. Of course, that can be said about many things:)


1. fight ranged, in a line, so orb spawn will be away from her.
2. orb spawn= time to CC lyris doppelganger
3. kill orb ranged bow or staff are fine
4. GREEBLE GROBBLE!!!

NB have literally NO excuse if they do not learn how/when to use their CC's. For my killing bar- I use bow Drainign shot

You will be surprised how fast she dies when not gettting healed.

To those who follow my greebly method, this is your first step into a larger universe. Such is The Way of The Grobble.

In this world, it isnt so much about getting lucky... but changing your skills and approach to the challenge. It would be ungreebly if we just ran thru all content with no challenge.

IF you need heals.. I found the blood altar from Undaunted to be a great way to heal without needing a staff:)


GREEBLE GROBBLE!!!

Morthur

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