Now that the game is almost ten years old, can we address jumping without cost?

LunaFlora · February 15

Carcamongus wrote: »

I find it ridiculous when a bunch of people are hopping around in PvP combat. Sure, more often than not I end up dead, but at least I didn't behave like a monkey on skooma. I always thought the jumping around had some purpose, but even then I wouldn't agree to adding a stamina cost to it. Some people in this thread have said the bounce has no advantages, so if that's the case, nothing needs to change. Others have argued it does have advantages and, if so, remove whatever those are instead of making the action cost.

By the way, my distaste for the hop doesn't include those folks who jump around seemingly at random in cities. I actually find it relaxing to watch them.

the advantage of hopping is fun

Uvi_AUT · February 15

Did you know that Breathing also doesnt cost any Stamina. ZOS, make it so that being alive costs Stamina too! If you dont reg every 30 seconds you suffocate. Cool new mechanic if you ask me.

RetPing · February 15

Uvi_AUT wrote: »

Did you know that Breathing also doesnt cost any Stamina. ZOS, make it so that being alive costs Stamina too! If you dont reg every 30 seconds you suffocate. Cool new mechanic if you ask me.

Now try irl to breathe 500 times and to jump 500 times.
Tell me, have you find any problem in doing one? Which one?

xclassgaming · February 15

LunaFlora wrote: »

Northwold wrote: »

LunaFlora wrote: »

that is absurd

people use jumping outside of combat too like when decorating houses.

People also sprint out of combat and that consumes stamina?

so? which game has a cost attached to jumping?
i have never heard of one.

and changing ESO this way after 10 years really would be absurd.

i know there is one, but i honestly dont remember what game it is. either way its annoying.

Edit: im pretty sure it was fallout 76

Rowjoh · February 15

How many games can you name where jumping costs a resource or is penalised in some way......... ?

The answer to this question might give you a clue as to why

AlterBlika · February 15

Yeah we also need to add standing still/walking stamina consumption like in older TES games, plus IRL you wouldn't be able to walk/stand still for a long time, especially if you fight and run around all day you ought to have insane fatigue

Uvi_AUT · February 15

RetPing wrote: »

Uvi_AUT wrote: »

Did you know that Breathing also doesnt cost any Stamina. ZOS, make it so that being alive costs Stamina too! If you dont reg every 30 seconds you suffocate. Cool new mechanic if you ask me.

Now try irl to breathe 500 times and to jump 500 times.
Tell me, have you find any problem in doing one? Which one?

Last time I checked I wasnt some kind of Godslaying Superhuman. But I will check again after work.

Watchdog · February 15

RetPing wrote: »

Uvi_AUT wrote: »

Did you know that Breathing also doesnt cost any Stamina. ZOS, make it so that being alive costs Stamina too! If you dont reg every 30 seconds you suffocate. Cool new mechanic if you ask me.

Now try irl to breathe 500 times and to jump 500 times.
Tell me, have you find any problem in doing one? Which one?

Now, try irl to cast a spell. Can you do it? No? Perhaps ZOS should delete magic, because it's totally unrealistic?

Four_Fingers · February 15

A lot of denial about ranged LOS improvement by jumping going on, must be a lot of Sorcs. lol
I suggest a compromise of ramping cost on jumping with the first jump free.

JanTanhide · February 15

Here we go again. If players want the game to be realistic then let's just make it all realistic. Every thing you do that in real life cost stamina should apply in game.

You pick up a big two handed sword/bow etc. then it's gonna cost you. You mount and unmount, it's gonna cost you. You walk it's gonna cost you. You run it's gonna cost you a lot more.

Realism you want then when you swing that Axe and block with that shield you get tired. Same for swinging a 2H melee weapon. After three swings you are out and down resting to regain stamina. Who in the world would get stamina BACK from swinging a weapon like that? No one.

Heavy armour is gonna cost you to wear so you get tired quicker than medium and so on.

So if jumping is going to cost stamina then everything else should too.

Four_Fingers · February 15

Not about realism, about advantage gained if you know what you are doing that the best players learn to use just like light attack weaving.
Look at the video in this thread where the target is just over a rise or obstacle that you can target while in the air and then the target can't fire back when you land because you are out of LOS.
It is called jump sniping in other games and benefits ranged players.
And yes, it is a PvP thing.

Rowjoh · February 15

It makes me very cross that I can loot heavy weapons and armour from a mudcrab the size of an infants slipper, without any discernible penalty to the mudcrab.

xclassgaming · February 16

Pixiepumpkin wrote: »

Or rather its been a problem for 10 years, but few understand this/notice it.

If jumping allows for damage to be mitigated like dodge rolling from certain player abilities in PVP, then the OP absolutely has a point.

Bunny hopping has always been an issue in MMORPGs, and some developers have curbed this.

no they do not. jumping should not have a resource pentalty, it would completely ruin the game for many people.

xclassgaming · February 16

Muizer wrote: »

I'd have no problem at all with repeated jumping having a ramping cost. It shouldn't bother anyone except when they are doing something silly and it adds a bit of harmless realism.

This is a fantasy game, i dont want more "realism" we live in a world where dragons exist, people shoot fire from our hands, living "gods" are laying about in a land full of giant mushrooms. if i want realism, i'll play some realistic survival game. eso isnt that.

spartaxoxo · February 16

Jumping having an advantage in niche situations does not at all justify capping it the vast majority of the time imo.

prof-dracko · February 16

Has there been any actual evidence besides anecdotes that jumping does anything, because I've never seen people avoid damage that way and I sure as hell don't when I've tried. You don't even move faster by jumping, it just carries your momentum. If you're slowed when you start a jump you'll be slow in the air.

Ragged_Claw · February 16

This is a nerf sorc thread isn't it?

Gilvoth · April 12

is this still being looked at?
i hope it is.

Sakiri · April 13

LunaFlora wrote: »

Northwold wrote: »

LunaFlora wrote: »

that is absurd

people use jumping outside of combat too like when decorating houses.

People also sprint out of combat and that consumes stamina?

so? which game has a cost attached to jumping?
i have never heard of one.

and changing ESO this way after 10 years really would be absurd.

Morrowind.

Fatigue (stamina) also affects hit chance, how well npcs like you at any given moment, and even vendor prices.

You lose fatigue when running and jumping, and you jump everywhere because it levels your acrobatics skill letting you jump even higher and further...

Hapexamendios · April 13

It's fine the way it is.

Shadowbinder7 · July 18

LunaFlora wrote: »

that is absurd

people use jumping outside of combat too like when decorating houses.

So make it active only when Battle Spirit is active??? ZOS needs to more actively separate PVP, PVE and just general loreplay/housing without it stopping them from balancing for fair fighting

Shadowbinder7 · July 18

KS_Amt38 wrote: »

Make a survey and see the results. Probably 80% of the player base is against it.

If this is true eso PVP need a major rehaul. It’s not a fun fighting system to feel forced to jump around CONSTANTLY while casting two bars and aiming manually. If that’s what it takes to get to top tier PVP, yeah screw that. Not fun or realistic or even fantasy fulfilling in ANY way.

Hope you reading ZOS. Many more players will agree with me than you think, accounting for the many who don’t touch forums. Improve PVP combat system starting with things like this please, or you push away a bigger dynamic playerbase

Shadowbinder7 · July 18

RetPing wrote: »

Add cost to to jumping with battle spirit in PvP.
Looking at those bunny hopping is quite ridiculous.

RIDICULOUS. That’s the word I was looking for

I say this to all of you who constant bunny hop in PVP. It looks ridiculous. Even the Joker doesn’t do this when he fights Batman

Shadowbinder7 · July 18

spartaxoxo wrote: »

It's been the design for years and never caused problems. No need to fix what isn't broken.

It causes problems for full time controller players on PC. Just like the problem with bash builds (no feasible available bind button for bashing without blocking, draining stam if you bash weave) on a standard controller.

ZOS should address issues like this in QoL updates to make the game smoother and fairer and “play your style” so to speak, for every player. And no please don’t bring up “CP difference” because that’s different and sorted. There should be some disparity in pve and pvp from low to high CP anyway

Shadowbinder7 · July 18

NeoXanthus wrote: »

Ph1p wrote: »

If it is such an issue in PvP, then I’d go with the suggestion to add a (ramping) cost after X jumps in Y seconds, but have the initial few jumps still for free. This would only reign in excessive hopping, but not impact other gameplay too much.

A ramping cost is an excellent idea. That behaves much like the Sorc bolt escape. If you use it occasionally, it costs almost nothing, but if you use it excessively more and more, it gets expensive. That is exactly the best idea I have read.

Yes

You added it to Vault and Vampire mist.

Please add ramping cost within 4 seconds to jump button, only if Battle Spirit is active. Problem solved!

Please ZOS

Shadowbinder7 · July 18

JanTanhide wrote: »

Here we go again. If players want the game to be realistic then let's just make it all realistic. Every thing you do that in real life cost stamina should apply in game.

You pick up a big two handed sword/bow etc. then it's gonna cost you. You mount and unmount, it's gonna cost you. You walk it's gonna cost you. You run it's gonna cost you a lot more.

Realism you want then when you swing that Axe and block with that shield you get tired. Same for swinging a 2H melee weapon. After three swings you are out and down resting to regain stamina. Who in the world would get stamina BACK from swinging a weapon like that? No one.

Heavy armour is gonna cost you to wear so you get tired quicker than medium and so on.

So if jumping is going to cost stamina then everything else should too.

This is such a predictable response. Jumping is specific to PVP making it difficult to manually target, effectively like a form of evasion. That’s why people want a cost.

The other stuff is irrelevant as I’m sure you know

Shadowbinder7 · July 18

prof-dracko wrote: »

Has there been any actual evidence besides anecdotes that jumping does anything, because I've never seen people avoid damage that way and I sure as hell don't when I've tried. You don't even move faster by jumping, it just carries your momentum. If you're slowed when you start a jump you'll be slow in the air.

It’s much harder to aim at a jumping target while moving, especially in the chaos of cyrodiil, not to mention that WHILE jumping they can heal stack, block, shield spam all at the same time.

It’s too effective, and unfair given controller users on PC cannot use it

GuuMoonRyoung · July 18

Player 1: I am going to shoot you dead!

Player 2: Nope! (Jumps and moves to avoid being shot)

Player 1: NOOOOO YOU CAN'T DO THAT! Just stand still and let me shoot you!

I leave it here so that people can understand what is being discussed.

tom6143346 · July 18

I mean make jump a cost and let’s see if it will help the game in any point 😂 ( sarcasm) the casual community will love it I guess edit: the game and the mechanics in game are simple not designed to have jump at a cost , it would be needed to redesign the whole old/ new trials dungeons overland etc.

kringled_1 · July 18

Shadowbinder7 wrote: »

prof-dracko wrote: »

Has there been any actual evidence besides anecdotes that jumping does anything, because I've never seen people avoid damage that way and I sure as hell don't when I've tried. You don't even move faster by jumping, it just carries your momentum. If you're slowed when you start a jump you'll be slow in the air.

It’s much harder to aim at a jumping target while moving, especially in the chaos of cyrodiil, not to mention that WHILE jumping they can heal stack, block, shield spam all at the same time.

It’s too effective, and unfair given controller users on PC cannot use it

There's barely any aiming in this game. If you have a single target that's jumping in the open, jumping will almost never prevent you from hitting them with a ranged attack.
What will happen in larger fights in cyro is that you'll hit something else because eso effectively functions with lots of giant overlapping hit boxes that aren't shown to the player. Displacing one of those vertically shifts what box the game picks but it's hard to justify a stamina cost based on that. Especially since jumping is also just used to negotiate slightly uneven surfaces because walking/running in game won't negotiate small obstacles.