STOP spell Radiant (templar)

Billium813

boi_anachronism_ wrote: »

Billium813 wrote: »

boi_anachronism_ wrote: »

IZZEFlameLash wrote: »

It is really fairly uncommon to see RO in death recaps these days. Because no one really plays Templar outside of burst group healer or some players around a zergball who wants to get their kills. Far more common in recaps are meta proc sets and siege. And of course, bomb set procs. So, why is RO problem again?

I mean i think the skill is largely balanced by how vulnerable you are during cast. It can be interrupted, targets can easily avoid it by making use of terrain, you can have so many debuffs hit you in the channel time that you need to purge 2x to remove them all, especially fighting multiple enemies. while it has range gap closers are so common that it barely matters especially since a large chunk of pvp happens in melee range with 2h and dw builds being so popular. I play sorc a fair bit in pvp. Ive rarely died to ro because i can streak right through them. In 1v1 it can be really good. 1vX makes it quite difficult.

Totally agree with all the points here.

It's really one of those "win more" Skills in PvP (I mean, it IS an execute after all...). It hits like wet tissue paper unless the opponent is under 50% and is actively BAD to use when the opponent is healthy! It isn't even really that high in damage unless the opponent is under 20%. But when an opponent is that low, that's the time they start running into cover (breaking line of sight), or throwing up defensive shields/HoTs, or stunning you back! There's just too much counter play and the damage isn't even that high.

It can be very good when in a group and you're actively winning. It's really strong to help pick off weak opponents as they try to run thanks to the long range. I honestly think that's its strongest feature! 28m is massive for an execute! But there's just so much downside to it... It's not as OP as the OP seems to think

good points although im fairly sure the range is 22m not 28m but thats just if we are being nit picky, the point is that the range is there.

"Technically correct" is the best kind of correct, correct?

boi_anachronism_

Alharion wrote: »

Except that a good game doesn't make an effective finisher, already from 50% lol it should be less, should be around 35%, because 50% isn't really a finisher...

That should make sense!!!

For templar its execute atleast for pve is only more effective then its spammable starting at 35%. In pvp id never use it above 35% anyway. It is a channel, they have time to heal and shield, it is highly unlikely you will take out the target at 45% for example, so yes it scales starting at 50% but its not really effective until a much lower percentage. Thing for blades is that they dont channel and the swap from concealed to ab happens very rapidly. They have the ability to take you from full health to execute in about 3 seconds between merciless, concealed, and ab coming out of stealth Templar execute is almost 2 seconds just by itself.

boi_anachronism_

Billium813 wrote: »

boi_anachronism_ wrote: »

Billium813 wrote: »

boi_anachronism_ wrote: »

IZZEFlameLash wrote: »

It is really fairly uncommon to see RO in death recaps these days. Because no one really plays Templar outside of burst group healer or some players around a zergball who wants to get their kills. Far more common in recaps are meta proc sets and siege. And of course, bomb set procs. So, why is RO problem again?

I mean i think the skill is largely balanced by how vulnerable you are during cast. It can be interrupted, targets can easily avoid it by making use of terrain, you can have so many debuffs hit you in the channel time that you need to purge 2x to remove them all, especially fighting multiple enemies. while it has range gap closers are so common that it barely matters especially since a large chunk of pvp happens in melee range with 2h and dw builds being so popular. I play sorc a fair bit in pvp. Ive rarely died to ro because i can streak right through them. In 1v1 it can be really good. 1vX makes it quite difficult.

Totally agree with all the points here.

It's really one of those "win more" Skills in PvP (I mean, it IS an execute after all...). It hits like wet tissue paper unless the opponent is under 50% and is actively BAD to use when the opponent is healthy! It isn't even really that high in damage unless the opponent is under 20%. But when an opponent is that low, that's the time they start running into cover (breaking line of sight), or throwing up defensive shields/HoTs, or stunning you back! There's just too much counter play and the damage isn't even that high.

It can be very good when in a group and you're actively winning. It's really strong to help pick off weak opponents as they try to run thanks to the long range. I honestly think that's its strongest feature! 28m is massive for an execute! But there's just so much downside to it... It's not as OP as the OP seems to think

good points although im fairly sure the range is 22m not 28m but thats just if we are being nit picky, the point is that the range is there.

"Technically correct" is the best kind of correct, correct?

My bad i misremembered it. I guess i got it mixed up with the range on focused charge or something for whatever reason.. so yes. You are correct on that.

Billium813

Alharion wrote: »

Except that a good game doesn't make an effective finisher, already from 50% lol it should be less, should be around 35%, because 50% isn't really a finisher...

That should make sense!!!

Alharion wrote: »

A finisher is supposed to "execute" when you don't have much life left, not even half your life yet.

I worry that players read

Deals up to 480% more damage to enemies below 50% Health

and think that at 49%, the damage suddenly jumps to +480%.

To be fair, I think ZOS really needs to revamp all Tooltips to make them clearer in their functionality and limitations. I mean, Tooltips don't even indicate what KIND of damage each component of the Skill is doing (direct damage, DOT, AOE, ect). These make it confusing when you have CP stars / sets that use different diction and disconnected phrases. But I digress....

Radiant Glory really should say

Burn an enemy with a ray of holy fire, dealing 3258 Magic Damage every 0.6 seconds over 1.8 seconds.

The damage increases up to 480% to enemies below 50% Health, based on the target's missing Health.
You restore up to 480 Magicka every 0.6 seconds, based on the target's missing Health.
You heal for 17% of the damage inflicted.

"based on the target's missing Health" is still pretty nebulous, but I think it's enough that a player can visualize a straight line curve in the damage increase where +0% is at 50% Health and +480% is at 0% health.

boi_anachronism_

Billium813 wrote: »

Alharion wrote: »

Except that a good game doesn't make an effective finisher, already from 50% lol it should be less, should be around 35%, because 50% isn't really a finisher...

That should make sense!!!

Alharion wrote: »

A finisher is supposed to "execute" when you don't have much life left, not even half your life yet.

I worry that players read

Deals up to 480% more damage to enemies below 50% Health

and think that at 49%, the damage suddenly jumps to +480%.

To be fair, I think ZOS really needs to revamp all Tooltips to make them clearer in their functionality and limitations. I mean, Tooltips don't even indicate what KIND of damage each component of the Skill is doing (direct damage, DOT, AOE, ect). These make it confusing when you have CP stars that use different diction and disconnected phrases. But I digress....

Radiant Glory really should say

Burn an enemy with a ray of holy fire, dealing 3258 Magic Damage every 0.6 seconds over 1.8 seconds.

The damage increases up to 480% to enemies below 50% Health, based on the target's missing Health.
You restore up to 480 Magicka every 0.6 seconds, based on the target's missing Health.
You heal for 17% of the damage inflicted.

I agree. The tooltips can be very confusing for a lot of people. I can see how people might look at that and go "this is so broken, how does it exist?" So while it may look that way its only as a result of scaling. Executes arent effective at their max damage immediately. For it to scale to the point of actual execute, effectively a 1 shot, you would have to be well below 49%.

boi_anachronism_

Im not spectacular math so this might be a bit fuzzy here and im ballparking a little but if im calculating right for every percentage point of health below 49% you would be getting around 9.7% additional damage. with the base being 3258 at .6x3 we are looking at 9774 for the duration. the bonus by percentage point around 315 dps per .6 seconds give or take or just under 1k for the full duration of the skill per % point. So for it to do 100% more damage its going to have to be 39% ish health ect. So when i say i dont start execute until 35% its because the bonus is now tacking on somewhere abouts 14k to the skill over the duration.

You arent getting 46.9k additional damage starting at 49%

Feel free to correct me if im wrong here. Probably should be using a calculator lol

And again this is just base so no cp or buffs.

IZZEFlameLash

boi_anachronism_ wrote: »

IZZEFlameLash wrote: »

It is really fairly uncommon to see RO in death recaps these days. Because no one really plays Templar outside of burst group healer or some players around a zergball who wants to get their kills. Far more common in recaps are meta proc sets and siege. And of course, bomb set procs. So, why is RO problem again?

I mean i think the skill is largely balanced by how vulnerable you are during cast. It can be interrupted, targets can easily avoid it by making use of terrain, you can have so many debuffs hit you in the channel time that you need to purge 2x to remove them all, especially fighting multiple enemies. while it has range gap closers are so common that it barely matters especially since a large chunk of pvp happens in melee range with 2h and dw builds being so popular. I play sorc a fair bit in pvp. Ive rarely died to ro because i can streak right through them. In 1v1 it can be really good. 1vX makes it quite difficult.

Yeah, apparently Templars are quite strong in 1v1 and that's about all it has going for it. Tbf, RO hate has been here since the beginning of its life as strong execute. But it also is quite easily countered unless you are like beamed by 10 people while being at 20-30% health. And yeah, as you say, only time I feel safe beaming when on Templar is 1v1 or you are outnumbering other group.

Alharion

Nord_Raseri wrote: »

Killer's Blade(nightblade): execute starts at 50% health.

yeah, so this one must work 1 time out of 10 million, I can't even count the number of times it's supposed to work and in the end it does nothing lol

Vaqual

I think the part most people struggle with is that all counterplay options evaporate once you get hit with the cc+desync from javelin
knockbacks in the game are just not well made

SandandStars

Part of the issue I see with RO in pvp is that it’s a pretty braindead way to get kills.

I do BGs mostly, and there’s always one Plar hanging back spamming RO into the main combat.

Also, like certain meta (M DW/Vatesh) spamming Arcanists, I’m seeing more and more Plars build uber tanky/healy who stand in their bubble spamming RO.

Templars probably the most boring playing style currently available, imo. I used to enjoy it when jabs & pol worked, there was some dynamism. Now it’s nothing but RO with occasional javelins just to break up the monotony.

I have real sympathy for templar mains who played before this dead RO routine was all that remains.

SandandStars

Baconlad wrote: »

Only Nightblades are allowed to be glass canons in ESO

Agree, except when you have top heals and top speed you’re no longer glass.

Nb, as many have noted, is absurdly unbalanced.