Revert the class burst heal from NB

PhoenixGrey

Johngo0036 wrote: »

StaticWave wrote: »
Most NBs now just camp Refreshing Path with Vigor + Dark Cloak ticking and pop a Healthy Offering if they are low. It's no longer a squishy & high burst class. It's a tanky & high burst class and that's not balanced.

Every class has access to exactly this kind of heal and also the burst damage you speak of.
I know you will argue about stamsorc not having a burst heal but sorcs DO have 2 even if you dont agree...

You have the pet that heals a ton and even darkdeal though you will argue is not a burst heal. Benefit you have as a sorc with streak is immense.. YES you may have to compromise and use a magicka skill just like stamblades have to if they want a burst heal. FYI my stam blade uses rally and vigor, NONE are NB skills to heal..

have you played a NB lately that you can make all these statements about how tanky they are... if not i suggest you do, as you also have some misconceptions about how good shadowy disguise actually is..

with the introduction of Invisible pots and vamp stage 4 anyone can also get into stealth and in some cases even more effectively than NB shadowy disguise..

You call for nerfs yet you play one of the STRONGEST classes and Builds in cyrodiil..

There are ways to break Shadowy disguise such that the counters against it won’t work most of the time

It’s extremely bugged in favor of the nb which makes the skill the best defense skill which ever existed in this game

I am not sure you have played nb yourself or you would have found how to workaround all the counters to cloak

Yet again you prove my point that nb mains don’t know how their own class works

Marcus684

The hilarious part of discussions about either sorc or NB is looking at the signatures of the commentors. Every sorc main says sorc is trash and NB is OP, while every NB main says the opposite. Y'all should make your biases less obvious.

Twig_Garlicshine

StaticWave wrote: »

boi_anachronism_ wrote: »

Were you around for elswyer? If not id encourage you to look at those patch notes. It was paragraphs of blade nerfs. Before that it was absolutely a NB meta. They already nerfed the concealed buff for pve. No idea why they didnt for pvp but thats another conversation. Additionally there is literally no reason to insult people. While i do main a blade in pve i actually use a 2 bar mag sorc almost exclusively in pvp because i simply like the style for that kind of content better so no, im not "afraid" of a pvp nerf. As ive said, i have no issue with stealth having ramping costs, i think it should. I dont believe concealed should get a buff leaving stealth or crouch either but these are things that only effect pvp meaningfully where as the the overwhelming sentiment of pvp players is that they only care about their side of the issue without any consideration for the larger picture. Thats pretty clear cut based on this thread. Side note- how on earth are you not able to dodge a bow proc? You can see that coming a mile away. I cant remember the last time i was killed by a blade and im hardly a meta pvper in any sense. Streak stuns them out of stealth, a followed by a solid combo and they are basically toast. A decent snare destroys them. Gankers will get hit exceedingly hard this patch as well with detect pots now having a whopping 44.5m radius.

I was around for Elsweyr. I know all those patch notes lol. I played NB for 6 months before switching to stamsorc.

I never died to a spectral bow either, until I moved to Asia and played with 250 ping. Going from 90-100ms to 250-290ms is a massive difference and it's literally impossible to avoid an Incap + Bow Proc combo. You can test that out if you have a VPN. This is not to mention there is a 0.3s delay with roll dodge where you actually don't get an I-frame until the server has registered that you've performed a roll. High ping players usually have trouble against NBs because of ping reasons, not because they don't know how to dodge the bow.

Now I understand why you are calling in multiple threads for multiple nerfs to NBs. ->You moved to high ping.
Game has always favoured lower ping players in both pvp and pve.
Asking Zos to balance around ping would involve a rewrite of just about everything, or worse.
Even sorcs would end up nerfed, so you would lose to other classes more, that are affected by your own skills
as it would involve a nerf to every class and play style, not just skills abilities of one class you currently have an issue with.
Be careful what you wish for as the outcome may make you dislike the whole game.
"To help high ping players be more competitive, we are introducing 3 second global cool downs to skills, light and heavy attacks."

DrNukenstein

also why spec bow is so overrated and unreliable. the earliest it can hit is 1.05 seconds after the incap stun. Only high ping players or players with no pulse take that long to break free and roll.

StaticWave

Fkey wrote: »

StaticWave wrote: »

boi_anachronism_ wrote: »

Were you around for elswyer? If not id encourage you to look at those patch notes. It was paragraphs of blade nerfs. Before that it was absolutely a NB meta. They already nerfed the concealed buff for pve. No idea why they didnt for pvp but thats another conversation. Additionally there is literally no reason to insult people. While i do main a blade in pve i actually use a 2 bar mag sorc almost exclusively in pvp because i simply like the style for that kind of content better so no, im not "afraid" of a pvp nerf. As ive said, i have no issue with stealth having ramping costs, i think it should. I dont believe concealed should get a buff leaving stealth or crouch either but these are things that only effect pvp meaningfully where as the the overwhelming sentiment of pvp players is that they only care about their side of the issue without any consideration for the larger picture. Thats pretty clear cut based on this thread. Side note- how on earth are you not able to dodge a bow proc? You can see that coming a mile away. I cant remember the last time i was killed by a blade and im hardly a meta pvper in any sense. Streak stuns them out of stealth, a followed by a solid combo and they are basically toast. A decent snare destroys them. Gankers will get hit exceedingly hard this patch as well with detect pots now having a whopping 44.5m radius.

I was around for Elsweyr. I know all those patch notes lol. I played NB for 6 months before switching to stamsorc.

I never died to a spectral bow either, until I moved to Asia and played with 250 ping. Going from 90-100ms to 250-290ms is a massive difference and it's literally impossible to avoid an Incap + Bow Proc combo. You can test that out if you have a VPN. This is not to mention there is a 0.3s delay with roll dodge where you actually don't get an I-frame until the server has registered that you've performed a roll. High ping players usually have trouble against NBs because of ping reasons, not because they don't know how to dodge the bow.

Now I understand why you are calling in multiple threads for multiple nerfs to NBs. ->You moved to high ping.
Game has always favoured lower ping players in both pvp and pve.
Asking Zos to balance around ping would involve a rewrite of just about everything, or worse.
Even sorcs would end up nerfed, so you would lose to other classes more, that are affected by your own skills
as it would involve a nerf to every class and play style, not just skills abilities of one class you currently have an issue with.
Be careful what you wish for as the outcome may make you dislike the whole game.
"To help high ping players be more competitive, we are introducing 3 second global cool downs to skills, light and heavy attacks."

Nah, it’s not about high ping. The thread isn’t even asking for NB’s damage to be nerfed. My title doesn’t say anything about nerfing Nb dmg either. I brought up NB damage to support my argument that a bursty and stealthy class shouldn’t have a spammable burst heal.

I’m asking for their survivability to be readjusted towards a stealthy, elusive class with decent heal over time instead of a class with a generic heal like everybody else.

Weckless

PhoenixGrey wrote: »

Johngo0036 wrote: »

StaticWave wrote: »
Most NBs now just camp Refreshing Path with Vigor + Dark Cloak ticking and pop a Healthy Offering if they are low. It's no longer a squishy & high burst class. It's a tanky & high burst class and that's not balanced.

Every class has access to exactly this kind of heal and also the burst damage you speak of.
I know you will argue about stamsorc not having a burst heal but sorcs DO have 2 even if you dont agree...

You have the pet that heals a ton and even darkdeal though you will argue is not a burst heal. Benefit you have as a sorc with streak is immense.. YES you may have to compromise and use a magicka skill just like stamblades have to if they want a burst heal. FYI my stam blade uses rally and vigor, NONE are NB skills to heal..

have you played a NB lately that you can make all these statements about how tanky they are... if not i suggest you do, as you also have some misconceptions about how good shadowy disguise actually is..

with the introduction of Invisible pots and vamp stage 4 anyone can also get into stealth and in some cases even more effectively than NB shadowy disguise..

You call for nerfs yet you play one of the STRONGEST classes and Builds in cyrodiil..

There are ways to break Shadowy disguise such that the counters against it won’t work most of the time

It’s extremely bugged in favor of the nb which makes the skill the best defense skill which ever existed in this game

I am not sure you have played nb yourself or you would have found how to workaround all the counters to cloak

Yet again you prove my point that nb mains don’t know how their own class works

[snip] For every time cloak works when it shouldnt there are exponentially more times it didn't work when it should have. [snip]

[Edited for baiting]

Weckless

StaticWave wrote: »

Fkey wrote: »

StaticWave wrote: »

boi_anachronism_ wrote: »

Were you around for elswyer? If not id encourage you to look at those patch notes. It was paragraphs of blade nerfs. Before that it was absolutely a NB meta. They already nerfed the concealed buff for pve. No idea why they didnt for pvp but thats another conversation. Additionally there is literally no reason to insult people. While i do main a blade in pve i actually use a 2 bar mag sorc almost exclusively in pvp because i simply like the style for that kind of content better so no, im not "afraid" of a pvp nerf. As ive said, i have no issue with stealth having ramping costs, i think it should. I dont believe concealed should get a buff leaving stealth or crouch either but these are things that only effect pvp meaningfully where as the the overwhelming sentiment of pvp players is that they only care about their side of the issue without any consideration for the larger picture. Thats pretty clear cut based on this thread. Side note- how on earth are you not able to dodge a bow proc? You can see that coming a mile away. I cant remember the last time i was killed by a blade and im hardly a meta pvper in any sense. Streak stuns them out of stealth, a followed by a solid combo and they are basically toast. A decent snare destroys them. Gankers will get hit exceedingly hard this patch as well with detect pots now having a whopping 44.5m radius.

I was around for Elsweyr. I know all those patch notes lol. I played NB for 6 months before switching to stamsorc.

I never died to a spectral bow either, until I moved to Asia and played with 250 ping. Going from 90-100ms to 250-290ms is a massive difference and it's literally impossible to avoid an Incap + Bow Proc combo. You can test that out if you have a VPN. This is not to mention there is a 0.3s delay with roll dodge where you actually don't get an I-frame until the server has registered that you've performed a roll. High ping players usually have trouble against NBs because of ping reasons, not because they don't know how to dodge the bow.

Now I understand why you are calling in multiple threads for multiple nerfs to NBs. ->You moved to high ping.
Game has always favoured lower ping players in both pvp and pve.
Asking Zos to balance around ping would involve a rewrite of just about everything, or worse.
Even sorcs would end up nerfed, so you would lose to other classes more, that are affected by your own skills
as it would involve a nerf to every class and play style, not just skills abilities of one class you currently have an issue with.
Be careful what you wish for as the outcome may make you dislike the whole game.
"To help high ping players be more competitive, we are introducing 3 second global cool downs to skills, light and heavy attacks."

Nah, it’s not about high ping. The thread isn’t even asking for NB’s damage to be nerfed. My title doesn’t say anything about nerfing Nb dmg either. I brought up NB damage to support my argument that a bursty and stealthy class shouldn’t have a spammable burst heal.

I’m asking for their survivability to be readjusted towards a stealthy, elusive class with decent heal over time instead of a class with a generic heal like everybody else.

Every good NB I know actually says the same thing. The whole tanky brawlblade playstyle isnt well-received and only used because the other options have been made weaker. I hate the dw/ice staff meta personally i wish they would make the ranged nightblade playstyle more competitive and show some love to swallow soul or make bow proc have a different bonus when fired from outside the range of the heal

PhoenixGrey

Weckless wrote: »

PhoenixGrey wrote: »

Johngo0036 wrote: »

StaticWave wrote: »
Most NBs now just camp Refreshing Path with Vigor + Dark Cloak ticking and pop a Healthy Offering if they are low. It's no longer a squishy & high burst class. It's a tanky & high burst class and that's not balanced.

Every class has access to exactly this kind of heal and also the burst damage you speak of.
I know you will argue about stamsorc not having a burst heal but sorcs DO have 2 even if you dont agree...

You have the pet that heals a ton and even darkdeal though you will argue is not a burst heal. Benefit you have as a sorc with streak is immense.. YES you may have to compromise and use a magicka skill just like stamblades have to if they want a burst heal. FYI my stam blade uses rally and vigor, NONE are NB skills to heal..

have you played a NB lately that you can make all these statements about how tanky they are... if not i suggest you do, as you also have some misconceptions about how good shadowy disguise actually is..

with the introduction of Invisible pots and vamp stage 4 anyone can also get into stealth and in some cases even more effectively than NB shadowy disguise..

You call for nerfs yet you play one of the STRONGEST classes and Builds in cyrodiil..

There are ways to break Shadowy disguise such that the counters against it won’t work most of the time

It’s extremely bugged in favor of the nb which makes the skill the best defense skill which ever existed in this game

I am not sure you have played nb yourself or you would have found how to workaround all the counters to cloak

Yet again you prove my point that nb mains don’t know how their own class works

[snip] For every time cloak works when it shouldnt there are exponentially more times it didn't work when it should have. [snip]

[Edited for baiting]

That’s when you use shade

Few understand this….

PhoenixGrey

DrNukenstein wrote: »

also why spec bow is so overrated and unreliable. the earliest it can hit is 1.05 seconds after the incap stun. Only high ping players or players with no pulse take that long to break free and roll.

I would still use the skill if it hit 5 seconds after stun.

How would you feel about a frag proc chance which did 200% more damage and 10% proc chance.

Weckless

Id be fine with it if made a loud audible queue when it was fired and then took 500 ms to land

DrNukenstein

PhoenixGrey wrote: »

That’s when you use shade

Few understand this….

Genuinely asking, have you ever used that move or read what it does?

You have to place it where you want to go before you need to go there. That has several implications:

-The most straight forward way to use it is to set it up before you go in. This requires the mag sustain or pool to have a shade ready each go when that resource is competing with your heal, cloak, and other important things such as the meta spammable. You have 20 seconds to make use of this shade from the end of your setup to the time you need it.

-You have to be in range to return to it. 28 meters, which is not that far. If you go 40 meters away from your shade when setting up (a common distance to setup from) you have to go 12 meters in the direction of your shade to return to it, otherwise you just place another and look like a clown while you get gibbed

-A really great way to use it on the spot is to drop it, roll, go in one direction, then return right as you reach max range. This is awesome, and feels great to pull off. It's not like an easy thing to do that anyone playing the class for the first time would think of or pull off without trouble.

I mean it's an extremely potent outplay tool for the nightblade, but it is not instant peel at all. That would be streak.

boi_anachronism_

StaticWave wrote: »

boi_anachronism_ wrote: »

Were you around for elswyer? If not id encourage you to look at those patch notes. It was paragraphs of blade nerfs. Before that it was absolutely a NB meta. They already nerfed the concealed buff for pve. No idea why they didnt for pvp but thats another conversation. Additionally there is literally no reason to insult people. While i do main a blade in pve i actually use a 2 bar mag sorc almost exclusively in pvp because i simply like the style for that kind of content better so no, im not "afraid" of a pvp nerf. As ive said, i have no issue with stealth having ramping costs, i think it should. I dont believe concealed should get a buff leaving stealth or crouch either but these are things that only effect pvp meaningfully where as the the overwhelming sentiment of pvp players is that they only care about their side of the issue without any consideration for the larger picture. Thats pretty clear cut based on this thread. Side note- how on earth are you not able to dodge a bow proc? You can see that coming a mile away. I cant remember the last time i was killed by a blade and im hardly a meta pvper in any sense. Streak stuns them out of stealth, a followed by a solid combo and they are basically toast. A decent snare destroys them. Gankers will get hit exceedingly hard this patch as well with detect pots now having a whopping 44.5m radius.

I was around for Elsweyr. I know all those patch notes lol. I played NB for 6 months before switching to stamsorc.

I never died to a spectral bow either, until I moved to Asia and played with 250 ping. Going from 90-100ms to 250-290ms is a massive difference and it's literally impossible to avoid an Incap + Bow Proc combo. You can test that out if you have a VPN. This is not to mention there is a 0.3s delay with roll dodge where you actually don't get an I-frame until the server has registered that you've performed a roll. High ping players usually have trouble against NBs because of ping reasons, not because they don't know how to dodge the bow.

Thats my ping rn and ive never had an issue..

boi_anachronism_

Weckless wrote: »

boi_anachronism_ wrote: »

Were you around for elswyer? If not id encourage you to look at those patch notes. It was paragraphs of blade nerfs. Before that it was absolutely a NB meta. They already nerfed the concealed buff for pve. No idea why they didnt for pvp but thats another conversation. Additionally there is literally no reason to insult people. While i do main a blade in pve i actually use a 2 bar mag sorc almost exclusively in pvp because i simply like the style for that kind of content better so no, im not "afraid" of a pvp nerf. As ive said, i have no issue with stealth having ramping costs, i think it should. I dont believe concealed should get a buff leaving stealth or crouch either but these are things that only effect pvp meaningfully where as the the overwhelming sentiment of pvp players is that they only care about their side of the issue without any consideration for the larger picture. Thats pretty clear cut based on this thread. Side note- how on earth are you not able to dodge a bow proc? You can see that coming a mile away. I cant remember the last time i was killed by a blade and im hardly a meta pvper in any sense. Streak stuns them out of stealth, a followed by a solid combo and they are basically toast. A decent snare destroys them. Gankers will get hit exceedingly hard this patch as well with detect pots now having a whopping 44.5m radius.

Yea these dudes dont know about NB with major fracture on surprise attack, major defile on incap, and 8% minor berserk and minor endurance on relentless focus and the old double take, with major expedition on crippling grasp 🤣

Excuse me that is a major reach. I literally never said they dont know the class. What i said is that they have a completely one sided perspective. Idk where you got that from... [snip]

[edited for baiting]

rabidmyers

birdik wrote: »

StaticWave wrote: »

birdik wrote: »

Jesus top tier pvp... Class that easily shut downed by pressing block, easiest targets imo

It’s not about their damage. Idk how many times I have to repeat myself.

For the last time, this thread is about addressing their ability to spam their burst heal, on a class that was designed to be squishy with high damage.

I don’t care about their damage, even if it’s high. I’m strictly talking about their healing.

Woopsie dk, wardens, plars have better heal and i dont think that they have lesser damage ( well plars mb)

Oh there is no good cc for nb, no dots, invisible is ez to counter

Just delete this theme

common misconception, nightblades actually have the highest raw healing output potential of any other class

Weckless

rabidmyers wrote: »

birdik wrote: »

StaticWave wrote: »

birdik wrote: »

Jesus top tier pvp... Class that easily shut downed by pressing block, easiest targets imo

It’s not about their damage. Idk how many times I have to repeat myself.

For the last time, this thread is about addressing their ability to spam their burst heal, on a class that was designed to be squishy with high damage.

I don’t care about their damage, even if it’s high. I’m strictly talking about their healing.

Woopsie dk, wardens, plars have better heal and i dont think that they have lesser damage ( well plars mb)

Oh there is no good cc for nb, no dots, invisible is ez to counter

Just delete this theme

common misconception, nightblades actually have the highest raw healing output potential of any other class

Only because wardens heal that scales from spell damage only heals them and coag is a self heal as well

rabidmyers

Weckless wrote: »

rabidmyers wrote: »

birdik wrote: »

StaticWave wrote: »

birdik wrote: »

Jesus top tier pvp... Class that easily shut downed by pressing block, easiest targets imo

It’s not about their damage. Idk how many times I have to repeat myself.

For the last time, this thread is about addressing their ability to spam their burst heal, on a class that was designed to be squishy with high damage.

I don’t care about their damage, even if it’s high. I’m strictly talking about their healing.

Woopsie dk, wardens, plars have better heal and i dont think that they have lesser damage ( well plars mb)

Oh there is no good cc for nb, no dots, invisible is ez to counter

Just delete this theme

common misconception, nightblades actually have the highest raw healing output potential of any other class

Only because wardens heal that scales from spell damage only heals them and coag is a self heal as well

well it is a lot more than just those reasons, nightblades kit allows them to reach the highest healing done. refreshing path heals harder than most other ground aoe heals. you got funnel health which heals more than mutagen, stack healing %'s and damage to maximize the potential healing from it. burst heal health loss effect is virtually nothing since it got the nerf and you get minor mending along with it too. nb has passives that increase max magicka and healing done with siphoning abilities slotted. you also get the siphoning attacks light attack heal and that is very strong when you stack healing. there are other matters such as sap essence and dark cloak. oh not to mention that their soul siphon ultimate is the strongest healing move in the entire game

been a nb healer for many years long before their burst heal was a thing and it was that skill that roots, many ppl believe that templar or warden are unmatched in healing output but nb heals are much much stronger if built right, their skills, passives etc allow them to naturally heal harder than any other class. actually dk's come pretty damn close to matching their healing output as well but yeah

Weckless

rabidmyers wrote: »

Weckless wrote: »

rabidmyers wrote: »

birdik wrote: »

StaticWave wrote: »

birdik wrote: »

Jesus top tier pvp... Class that easily shut downed by pressing block, easiest targets imo

It’s not about their damage. Idk how many times I have to repeat myself.

For the last time, this thread is about addressing their ability to spam their burst heal, on a class that was designed to be squishy with high damage.

I don’t care about their damage, even if it’s high. I’m strictly talking about their healing.

Woopsie dk, wardens, plars have better heal and i dont think that they have lesser damage ( well plars mb)

Oh there is no good cc for nb, no dots, invisible is ez to counter

Just delete this theme

common misconception, nightblades actually have the highest raw healing output potential of any other class

Only because wardens heal that scales from spell damage only heals them and coag is a self heal as well

well it is a lot more than just those reasons, nightblades kit allows them to reach the highest healing done. refreshing path heals harder than most other ground aoe heals. you got funnel health which heals more than mutagen, stack healing %'s and damage to maximize the potential healing from it. burst heal health loss effect is virtually nothing since it got the nerf and you get minor mending along with it too. nb has passives that increase max magicka and healing done with siphoning abilities slotted. you also get the siphoning attacks light attack heal and that is very strong when you stack healing. there are other matters such as sap essence and dark cloak. oh not to mention that their soul siphon ultimate is the strongest healing move in the entire game

been a nb healer for many years long before their burst heal was a thing and it was that skill that roots, many ppl believe that templar or warden are unmatched in healing output but nb heals are much much stronger if built right, their skills, passives etc allow them to naturally heal harder than any other class. actually dk's come pretty damn close to matching their healing output as well but yeah

But you have to build a nb to specifically be a healer for that. A regular nb has good healing but not the best. Cinder storm outheals path and ritual is just better. Funnel health is tied to the damage it does. Soul siphon is amazing but resto ult is more bang for your buck. Dark cloak is kind of ruined for pvp. Its healing is pretty much carried by its burst heal now which is probably too cheap and that's what I think the issue is

rabidmyers

Weckless wrote: »

rabidmyers wrote: »

Weckless wrote: »

rabidmyers wrote: »

birdik wrote: »

StaticWave wrote: »

birdik wrote: »

Jesus top tier pvp... Class that easily shut downed by pressing block, easiest targets imo

It’s not about their damage. Idk how many times I have to repeat myself.

For the last time, this thread is about addressing their ability to spam their burst heal, on a class that was designed to be squishy with high damage.

I don’t care about their damage, even if it’s high. I’m strictly talking about their healing.

Woopsie dk, wardens, plars have better heal and i dont think that they have lesser damage ( well plars mb)

Oh there is no good cc for nb, no dots, invisible is ez to counter

Just delete this theme

common misconception, nightblades actually have the highest raw healing output potential of any other class

Only because wardens heal that scales from spell damage only heals them and coag is a self heal as well

well it is a lot more than just those reasons, nightblades kit allows them to reach the highest healing done. refreshing path heals harder than most other ground aoe heals. you got funnel health which heals more than mutagen, stack healing %'s and damage to maximize the potential healing from it. burst heal health loss effect is virtually nothing since it got the nerf and you get minor mending along with it too. nb has passives that increase max magicka and healing done with siphoning abilities slotted. you also get the siphoning attacks light attack heal and that is very strong when you stack healing. there are other matters such as sap essence and dark cloak. oh not to mention that their soul siphon ultimate is the strongest healing move in the entire game

been a nb healer for many years long before their burst heal was a thing and it was that skill that roots, many ppl believe that templar or warden are unmatched in healing output but nb heals are much much stronger if built right, their skills, passives etc allow them to naturally heal harder than any other class. actually dk's come pretty damn close to matching their healing output as well but yeah

But you have to build a nb to specifically be a healer for that. A regular nb has good healing but not the best. Cinder storm outheals path and ritual is just better. Funnel health is tied to the damage it does. Soul siphon is amazing but resto ult is more bang for your buck. Dark cloak is kind of ruined for pvp. Its healing is pretty much carried by its burst heal now which is probably too cheap and that's what I think the issue is

oh yeah well a regular nb you are right yeah, i was speaking from a pure nb healer's aspect hahah

StaticWave

boi_anachronism_ wrote: »

StaticWave wrote: »

boi_anachronism_ wrote: »

Were you around for elswyer? If not id encourage you to look at those patch notes. It was paragraphs of blade nerfs. Before that it was absolutely a NB meta. They already nerfed the concealed buff for pve. No idea why they didnt for pvp but thats another conversation. Additionally there is literally no reason to insult people. While i do main a blade in pve i actually use a 2 bar mag sorc almost exclusively in pvp because i simply like the style for that kind of content better so no, im not "afraid" of a pvp nerf. As ive said, i have no issue with stealth having ramping costs, i think it should. I dont believe concealed should get a buff leaving stealth or crouch either but these are things that only effect pvp meaningfully where as the the overwhelming sentiment of pvp players is that they only care about their side of the issue without any consideration for the larger picture. Thats pretty clear cut based on this thread. Side note- how on earth are you not able to dodge a bow proc? You can see that coming a mile away. I cant remember the last time i was killed by a blade and im hardly a meta pvper in any sense. Streak stuns them out of stealth, a followed by a solid combo and they are basically toast. A decent snare destroys them. Gankers will get hit exceedingly hard this patch as well with detect pots now having a whopping 44.5m radius.

I was around for Elsweyr. I know all those patch notes lol. I played NB for 6 months before switching to stamsorc.

I never died to a spectral bow either, until I moved to Asia and played with 250 ping. Going from 90-100ms to 250-290ms is a massive difference and it's literally impossible to avoid an Incap + Bow Proc combo. You can test that out if you have a VPN. This is not to mention there is a 0.3s delay with roll dodge where you actually don't get an I-frame until the server has registered that you've performed a roll. High ping players usually have trouble against NBs because of ping reasons, not because they don't know how to dodge the bow.

Thats my ping rn and ive never had an issue..

You are the first person with high ping who says he can break free fast enough to avoid the bow proc.

[snip]
[edited for baiting]

Twig_Garlicshine

[/quote]

I've played with both high and low ping to see the massive difference low ping can make against a NB.[/quote]

As I said before I wonder how much of your calls for nerfs are related to your problems with ping.

Balancing class skills around ping would create a totally different game.

PhoenixGrey

DrNukenstein wrote: »

PhoenixGrey wrote: »

That’s when you use shade

Few understand this….

Genuinely asking, have you ever used that move or read what it does?

You have to place it where you want to go before you need to go there. That has several implications:

-The most straight forward way to use it is to set it up before you go in. This requires the mag sustain or pool to have a shade ready each go when that resource is competing with your heal, cloak, and other important things such as the meta spammable. You have 20 seconds to make use of this shade from the end of your setup to the time you need it.

-You have to be in range to return to it. 28 meters, which is not that far. If you go 40 meters away from your shade when setting up (a common distance to setup from) you have to go 12 meters in the direction of your shade to return to it, otherwise you just place another and look like a clown while you get gibbed

-A really great way to use it on the spot is to drop it, roll, go in one direction, then return right as you reach max range. This is awesome, and feels great to pull off. It's not like an easy thing to do that anyone playing the class for the first time would think of or pull off without trouble.

I mean it's an extremely potent outplay tool for the nightblade, but it is not instant peel at all. That would be streak.

Except streak does not allow you to tank out a 20k bow proc even while having major/ minor resolve along with major/ minor protection buffs.

Cloak and shade both ensure that you don’t take instant burst damage.

StaticWave

Fkey wrote: »

As I said before I wonder how much of your calls for nerfs are related to your problems with ping.

Balancing class skills around ping would create a totally different game.

Again, completely missing the point. I’m not asking for their dmg to be nerfed lol..

It’s almost like my title says “Revert Healthy Offering” instead of “Nerf Spectral Bow”.

Weckless

DrNukenstein wrote: »

PhoenixGrey wrote: »

That’s when you use shade

Few understand this….

Genuinely asking, have you ever used that move or read what it does?

You have to place it where you want to go before you need to go there. That has several implications:

-The most straight forward way to use it is to set it up before you go in. This requires the mag sustain or pool to have a shade ready each go when that resource is competing with your heal, cloak, and other important things such as the meta spammable. You have 20 seconds to make use of this shade from the end of your setup to the time you need it.

-You have to be in range to return to it. 28 meters, which is not that far. If you go 40 meters away from your shade when setting up (a common distance to setup from) you have to go 12 meters in the direction of your shade to return to it, otherwise you just place another and look like a clown while you get gibbed

-A really great way to use it on the spot is to drop it, roll, go in one direction, then return right as you reach max range. This is awesome, and feels great to pull off. It's not like an easy thing to do that anyone playing the class for the first time would think of or pull off without trouble.

I mean it's an extremely potent outplay tool for the nightblade, but it is not instant peel at all. That would be streak.

Shade was actually nerfed to 22 meters to ensure you're in the range of gap closers and you can no longer place it in the air which hit the ability to juke with it pretty hard

Weckless

PhoenixGrey wrote: »

DrNukenstein wrote: »

PhoenixGrey wrote: »

That’s when you use shade

Few understand this….

Genuinely asking, have you ever used that move or read what it does?

You have to place it where you want to go before you need to go there. That has several implications:

-The most straight forward way to use it is to set it up before you go in. This requires the mag sustain or pool to have a shade ready each go when that resource is competing with your heal, cloak, and other important things such as the meta spammable. You have 20 seconds to make use of this shade from the end of your setup to the time you need it.

-You have to be in range to return to it. 28 meters, which is not that far. If you go 40 meters away from your shade when setting up (a common distance to setup from) you have to go 12 meters in the direction of your shade to return to it, otherwise you just place another and look like a clown while you get gibbed

-A really great way to use it on the spot is to drop it, roll, go in one direction, then return right as you reach max range. This is awesome, and feels great to pull off. It's not like an easy thing to do that anyone playing the class for the first time would think of or pull off without trouble.

I mean it's an extremely potent outplay tool for the nightblade, but it is not instant peel at all. That would be streak.

Except streak does not allow you to tank out a 20k bow proc even while having major/ minor resolve along with major/ minor protection buffs.

Cloak and shade both ensure that you don’t take instant burst damage.

They only allow you to avoid the damage temporarily once you get caught you will still eat that damage. Shade and cloak do not make you invincible only slippery. I also will be putting together a montage showing how often cloak fails for all you grifters pushing these insane narratives

Twig_Garlicshine

StaticWave wrote: »

Fkey wrote: »

As I said before I wonder how much of your calls for nerfs are related to your problems with ping.

Balancing class skills around ping would create a totally different game.

Again, completely missing the point. I’m not asking for their dmg to be nerfed lol..

It’s almost like my title says “Revert Healthy Offering” instead of “Nerf Spectral Bow”.

Not missing the point at all.
I never said you were asking for a damage nerf to nightblades.
A survivability nerf so you can kill easier is still a nerf.

Melzo

TybaltKaine wrote: »

It's a single target burst heal, meant as an emergency burst to survive and evade. You didn't even address the fact that I destroyed the entire basis for your argument by pointing out that you can't be running both Dark Cloak and Shadowy Disguise, effectively locking the Nightblade in as either a Tank or a Gank.

You wanna talk about broken, let's discuss Sorc pets, specifically in Stam builds. You get a huge burst heal, big aoe damage and an on-demand stun, splash/dot damage with liquid lightning, streak for mobility and ANOTHER stun on demand, the only class with access to Silence, which mitigates 90% of a NB's kit as it nearly ALL MAGICKA BASED.

If you are losing to a tanky Nightblade as a Stamsorc in 1v1, that's in the words of every one's favorite new Argonian companion, "Skill issue".

I fought with my DK against nb and nb due to very high critical damage, I healed myself for wave health. When you have 7k healing you crit for 15-17k. I couldn't kill him because at 30 percent health he healed himself for 33 more full health. I don't know what to say but this is overkill. I don't mind nb's healing but he literally heals more than any other class.

LittlePinkDot

Melzo wrote: »

TybaltKaine wrote: »

It's a single target burst heal, meant as an emergency burst to survive and evade. You didn't even address the fact that I destroyed the entire basis for your argument by pointing out that you can't be running both Dark Cloak and Shadowy Disguise, effectively locking the Nightblade in as either a Tank or a Gank.

You wanna talk about broken, let's discuss Sorc pets, specifically in Stam builds. You get a huge burst heal, big aoe damage and an on-demand stun, splash/dot damage with liquid lightning, streak for mobility and ANOTHER stun on demand, the only class with access to Silence, which mitigates 90% of a NB's kit as it nearly ALL MAGICKA BASED.

If you are losing to a tanky Nightblade as a Stamsorc in 1v1, that's in the words of every one's favorite new Argonian companion, "Skill issue".

I fought with my DK against nb and nb due to very high critical damage, I healed myself for wave health. When you have 7k healing you crit for 15-17k. I couldn't kill him because at 30 percent health he healed himself for 33 more full health. I don't know what to say but this is overkill. I don't mind nb's healing but he literally heals more than any other class.

I would argue polar wind is the best heal in the game

Melzo

LittlePinkDot wrote: »

Melzo wrote: »

TybaltKaine wrote: »

It's a single target burst heal, meant as an emergency burst to survive and evade. You didn't even address the fact that I destroyed the entire basis for your argument by pointing out that you can't be running both Dark Cloak and Shadowy Disguise, effectively locking the Nightblade in as either a Tank or a Gank.

You wanna talk about broken, let's discuss Sorc pets, specifically in Stam builds. You get a huge burst heal, big aoe damage and an on-demand stun, splash/dot damage with liquid lightning, streak for mobility and ANOTHER stun on demand, the only class with access to Silence, which mitigates 90% of a NB's kit as it nearly ALL MAGICKA BASED.

If you are losing to a tanky Nightblade as a Stamsorc in 1v1, that's in the words of every one's favorite new Argonian companion, "Skill issue".

I fought with my DK against nb and nb due to very high critical damage, I healed myself for wave health. When you have 7k healing you crit for 15-17k. I couldn't kill him because at 30 percent health he healed himself for 33 more full health. I don't know what to say but this is overkill. I don't mind nb's healing but he literally heals more than any other class.

I would argue polar wind is the best heal in the game

Relatively. A skill based on max stats heals for 4500-5500 hp. A skill based on max health has more potential at high health, but weakens other sources of healing if stamina or mana is siphoned into health. But this healing is affected by health reduction and healing reduction. It's funny to see when your healing is reduced by 24%, and health by 10%, and at the same time you can not boast of high critical damage as NB. Warden is good at hot healing, but not burst healing.

Weckless

Melzo wrote: »

TybaltKaine wrote: »

It's a single target burst heal, meant as an emergency burst to survive and evade. You didn't even address the fact that I destroyed the entire basis for your argument by pointing out that you can't be running both Dark Cloak and Shadowy Disguise, effectively locking the Nightblade in as either a Tank or a Gank.

You wanna talk about broken, let's discuss Sorc pets, specifically in Stam builds. You get a huge burst heal, big aoe damage and an on-demand stun, splash/dot damage with liquid lightning, streak for mobility and ANOTHER stun on demand, the only class with access to Silence, which mitigates 90% of a NB's kit as it nearly ALL MAGICKA BASED.

If you are losing to a tanky Nightblade as a Stamsorc in 1v1, that's in the words of every one's favorite new Argonian companion, "Skill issue".

I fought with my DK against nb and nb due to very high critical damage, I healed myself for wave health. When you have 7k healing you crit for 15-17k. I couldn't kill him because at 30 percent health he healed himself for 33 more full health. I don't know what to say but this is overkill. I don't mind nb's healing but he literally heals more than any other class.

Coag is a way stronger heal than healthy offering so idk what you are complaining about

AndreNoir

PhoenixGrey wrote: »

DrNukenstein wrote: »

PhoenixGrey wrote: »

That’s when you use shade

Few understand this….

Genuinely asking, have you ever used that move or read what it does?

You have to place it where you want to go before you need to go there. That has several implications:

-The most straight forward way to use it is to set it up before you go in. This requires the mag sustain or pool to have a shade ready each go when that resource is competing with your heal, cloak, and other important things such as the meta spammable. You have 20 seconds to make use of this shade from the end of your setup to the time you need it.

-You have to be in range to return to it. 28 meters, which is not that far. If you go 40 meters away from your shade when setting up (a common distance to setup from) you have to go 12 meters in the direction of your shade to return to it, otherwise you just place another and look like a clown while you get gibbed

-A really great way to use it on the spot is to drop it, roll, go in one direction, then return right as you reach max range. This is awesome, and feels great to pull off. It's not like an easy thing to do that anyone playing the class for the first time would think of or pull off without trouble.

I mean it's an extremely potent outplay tool for the nightblade, but it is not instant peel at all. That would be streak.

Except streak does not allow you to tank out a 20k bow proc even while having major/ minor resolve along with major/ minor protection buffs.

Cloak and shade both ensure that you don’t take instant burst damage.

Man, discover a roll dodge button already