Class Change Tokens - Request Number 73,276
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Jammy420✭✭✭✭✭
✭ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »Hi everyone, just wanted to let you all know that we do not have any plans on implementing class changes tokens at this time. There are a number of technical challenges with implementing them, and it would take a significant amount of time to solve these challenges efficiently and safely.
So, what is being done about those challenges? Or do yall REALLY expect people who have poured thousands of hours into 3 characters to spend unfathomable amounts of time on a new class? Really? Thats extremely anti social and toxic customer service.3 -
Jammy420✭✭✭✭✭
✭[quote="DeathStalker;c-7805415"
I hope it's also understandable to you how the alt system is loved by so many people, and how so many players run alts without complaint. I accept that AwA annnoyed some altoholics (mainly because the way AwA was implemented meant the change took away the character progression tracking and not because of the change to account-wide achievements per se), while also delighting a lot of other players, but the premise of your argument is wrong in my view. These tokens aren't wanted by people who don't like the alt system, they're wanted by people who in any MMO they play always run one character and don't want to run alts under any circumstances whether for time constraints or any other reasons, period.
^This. Some players are used to other games where you can do all specializations on one character. Personally, I love the alt system, and a character's class is deeply intertwined with their identity, so even if tokens existed, I'd still be making alts for new classes and for specs within the new classes.
What alt system? There is no alt system.
Its make a new character, do EVERYTHING over again , which is an unreasonable amount of content to redo, or spend a ton of money on utility upgrades.
That is just called bad QoL and toxic Customer Support.4 -
Tandor✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭[quote="DeathStalker;c-7805415"
I hope it's also understandable to you how the alt system is loved by so many people, and how so many players run alts without complaint. I accept that AwA annnoyed some altoholics (mainly because the way AwA was implemented meant the change took away the character progression tracking and not because of the change to account-wide achievements per se), while also delighting a lot of other players, but the premise of your argument is wrong in my view. These tokens aren't wanted by people who don't like the alt system, they're wanted by people who in any MMO they play always run one character and don't want to run alts under any circumstances whether for time constraints or any other reasons, period.
^This. Some players are used to other games where you can do all specializations on one character. Personally, I love the alt system, and a character's class is deeply intertwined with their identity, so even if tokens existed, I'd still be making alts for new classes and for specs within the new classes.
What alt system? There is no alt system.
Its make a new character, do EVERYTHING over again , which is an unreasonable amount of content to redo, or spend a ton of money on utility upgrades.
That is just called bad QoL and toxic Customer Support.
Why would you need to do EVERYTHING over again? It's just unnecessary.8 -
Elsonso✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »Hi everyone, just wanted to let you all know that we do not have any plans on implementing class changes tokens at this time. There are a number of technical challenges with implementing them, and it would take a significant amount of time to solve these challenges efficiently and safely.
So, what is being done about those challenges? Or do yall REALLY expect people who have poured thousands of hours into 3 characters to spend unfathomable amounts of time on a new class? Really?
Well... yes, that is what people can generally expect. Until such time as they decide to work on those technical challenges, that is. Doesn't sound like they are going to be doing that any time soon.3 -
majulook✭✭✭✭✭
✭if I remember correctly....
The Class change issue was something about Class being the Primary Key in the database and they cannot change it. Now changing the Primary Key in most databases is possible but it can be quite an arduous undertaking. Not knowing what the database ZOS uses for the game makes this a big unknown as to if its possible or not.
The other thing is...
ZOS has made available in the Crown store the ability to purchase everything you need to quickly ( although expensively ) all the skill lines, skyshards, riding lessons, and such as to get a new charterer set as any of your existing characters. Again this is Very Expensive for a Player to do. I do not think ZOS is going to give up this income. ZOS is a business and their primary goal is to make money. If they make this Class change would it be free? Some how I do not think it would be. So what should the cost be? Look at how much they make on all the parts they have in the crown store... Mages guild 3,000 Thieves guild 2,000 Alliance War 3,000 Skyshards per zone is 150 to 900 depending on the zone, and Riding lessons 1,000 per lesson.
So WE ALL need to just keep insisting on a class change.
Edited by majulook on June 2, 2023 8:52PMSi vis pacem, para bellum3 -
Jestir✭✭✭✭@majulook can't quite understand that last bit there
But even with what you have said, even with the difficulties they have said it would take to make me and many others would still very much so want this
I also would think there is a good amount of people would buy class change tokens that have no intention and will never have any of buying skill points/skill lines/riding lessons.
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Kwik1✭✭✭✭I am really curious what the issue is with just making a new toon? You can still have your main toon use all motifs and max crafting, then just make an alt to do the rest of the game.
You get to use all your CP's at lvl 1, and once you hit 50 you can instantly use all gear. While levelling you can grab all shards and do public dungeons and whatever else so you have enough skill points to do whatever you want.
There should be SOME sort of responsibility to making a character, and ESO has eliminated most of them. You literally have 1 thing you can't change which is your class, which is totally reasonable.5 -
Jestir✭✭✭✭I am really curious what the issue is with just making a new toon? You can still have your main toon use all motifs and max crafting, then just make an alt to do the rest of the game.
You get to use all your CP's at lvl 1, and once you hit 50 you can instantly use all gear. While levelling you can grab all shards and do public dungeons and whatever else so you have enough skill points to do whatever you want.
There should be SOME sort of responsibility to making a character, and ESO has eliminated most of them. You literally have 1 thing you can't change which is your class, which is totally reasonable.
The real 2 things we can't change is the time put into the character and the time most don't have to put into another one3 -
I feel like they should have token changes for 15 per class and have it be any class you get to lv 50.
That way it helps them A) monetize more which I really don't think they need help with but also B.) gives many of us what we want without giving people classes they are not trained in.
I played way back during the beta and left due to not liking the game. Just came back after seeing how it was and bought it so I could play and I prefer healing classes that are not so focused on what we currently have.
Arcanist fits my main character rp wise and fits the gamestyle I love so would have loved to be able to convert my main over and that arcanist I plan to level to warden.Edited by Princess_Lily on May 31, 2023 4:39AM0 -
Kwik1✭✭✭✭I am really curious what the issue is with just making a new toon? You can still have your main toon use all motifs and max crafting, then just make an alt to do the rest of the game.
You get to use all your CP's at lvl 1, and once you hit 50 you can instantly use all gear. While levelling you can grab all shards and do public dungeons and whatever else so you have enough skill points to do whatever you want.
There should be SOME sort of responsibility to making a character, and ESO has eliminated most of them. You literally have 1 thing you can't change which is your class, which is totally reasonable.
The real 2 things we can't change is the time put into the character and the time most don't have to put into another one
I get that for sure, but you don't need to put as much time into the next one. The important things will transfer over like CP's. At the outfit station you can use whatever style/motif's your main has open to make your alts look however you want them to look.
The only thing you have to spend much time on is gathering shards (really don't need to spend much on this as they are super easy and quick) and some skill lines.
I understand hating to do excavation or Psijic skill lines again, but you really don't need to. You can get the leads on your new toon and just use your main to excavate it.
You would literally just need to put a few days for hittng 50 and gathering skyshards and you are set3 -
Hurbster✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Not really the point, a lot of people are attached to their mains and want to play them as another class. I know I certainly do.So they raised the floor and lowered the ceiling. Except the ceiling has spikes in it now and the floor is also lava.7 -
i feel like this would be a BAD decision, those who have $$ could change their class to fit their situation whenever they want..... its very "PAY TO WIN" feeling......
XBOX ONE PLAYER2 -
Jestir✭✭✭✭Amethyst_Unearthed wrote: »i feel like this would be a BAD decision, those who have $$ could change their class to fit their situation whenever they want..... its very "PAY TO WIN" feeling......
Those same people are the ones with maxed out character slots and are the few who buy the skyshards and skill lines, game already invokes P2W from many people for that and the dlc classes. You should check any topic on the PTS section on arcanist performance, despite it looking like a jack of all trades master of none, any positive about the class or anything it brings that other classes do not is being pushed as P2W/buy the expansion or underperform0 -
JMadFour✭✭✭✭✭Amethyst_Unearthed wrote: »i feel like this would be a BAD decision, those who have $$ could change their class to fit their situation whenever they want..... its very "PAY TO WIN" feeling......
They do that anyway, with their 18 fully maxed out alts so they can FOTM swap whenever they want.0 -
jad11mumbler✭✭✭✭✭Class change tokens are never coming, thankfully.174 characters and counting over 13 accounts.
120 writ certified. 73 at CP rank.4 -
jad11mumbler✭✭✭✭✭[quote="ZOS_GinaBruno;c-7804848".
Or do yall REALLY expect people who have poured thousands of hours into 3 characters to spend unfathomable amounts of time on a new class? . [/quote]
Levelling a new class can be done in an hour.
Anything else is an unnecessary item that you want to get.
It's certainly not needed to do everything again on an alt.174 characters and counting over 13 accounts.
120 writ certified. 73 at CP rank.2 -
TaSheen✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭It's no skin off my nose if y'all get class change. I'll never use it - I have alts. Lots of alts. I level them all slowly, steadily, having fun in the game. Also happening with (eventually) 12 arcanists - two on each account both PC megaservers.
So I really don't have a horse in this race. I wish they'd come up with some way to make y'all happy.______________________________________________________
"But even in books, the heroes make mistakes, and there isn't always a happy ending." Mercedes Lackey, Into the West
PC NA, PC EU (non steam)- four accounts, many alts....0 -
Jammy420✭✭✭✭✭
✭[quote="DeathStalker;c-7805415"
I hope it's also understandable to you how the alt system is loved by so many people, and how so many players run alts without complaint. I accept that AwA annnoyed some altoholics (mainly because the way AwA was implemented meant the change took away the character progression tracking and not because of the change to account-wide achievements per se), while also delighting a lot of other players, but the premise of your argument is wrong in my view. These tokens aren't wanted by people who don't like the alt system, they're wanted by people who in any MMO they play always run one character and don't want to run alts under any circumstances whether for time constraints or any other reasons, period.
^This. Some players are used to other games where you can do all specializations on one character. Personally, I love the alt system, and a character's class is deeply intertwined with their identity, so even if tokens existed, I'd still be making alts for new classes and for specs within the new classes.
What alt system? There is no alt system.
Its make a new character, do EVERYTHING over again , which is an unreasonable amount of content to redo, or spend a ton of money on utility upgrades.
That is just called bad QoL and toxic Customer Support.
Why would you need to do EVERYTHING over again? It's just unnecessary.
Some people only have 2 or 3 characters, and have an ungodly amount of time invested. Sithis forbid people actually have characters they are attached to.1 -
Vulkunne✭✭✭✭✭
✭Amethyst_Unearthed wrote: »i feel like this would be a BAD decision, those who have $$ could change their class to fit their situation whenever they want..... its very "PAY TO WIN" feeling......
Exactly. It is a personal decision we wish to make as needed to adjust incrementally.
It doesn't matter whether it costs money or is a free feature, the point is its needed to bring some things either into balance or bring them together. For example, I have like 3 Templar. I hate the changes made to Templar, ZOS doesn't seem to care what many of us think about those changes, therefore I use one Templar skill line for heals and that's all I need.
That's it. The other two are wasted in their current state and would suite me and my needs (raid guild also) and the way I play... better... as being reassigned to another class which better fits the builds I want to use them with. Never mind the time and money I have already spent on them. Are you gonna say that's pay to win also?Edited by Vulkunne on June 1, 2023 7:56PMA sword-day, a red day, ere the sun rises!!!0 -
Braggar✭✭✭✭Difficult to do or not. I would like to get a Class change, and I would pay for it period.8
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Elsonso✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭
Still, it isn't necessary to do everything all over again with a new character. Actually, it isn't even possible to do everything over again.
As for being attached to characters, it is partially that reason that I would not consider anything like a class or race change on them. They would be significantly different characters and the former attachment would be irrelevant. After thousands of hours playing them, that would be a tragedy.
However, my objection to the Class Change Token isn't because I would not use it, or because I just don't want others to be able to use it. This is supposed to be an RPG game and creating and leveling characters is core to what an RPG is. Class Change Tokens are an RPG line that ZOS has not crossed. I am sure there are RPG games out there that do it anyway, but I would just question whether they are actually an RPG or just an action adventure game. Maybe ESO is really a multiplayer action adventure game that is mislabeled as an "RPG"? Time will tell.
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Jammy420✭✭✭✭✭
✭
Still, it isn't necessary to do everything all over again with a new character. Actually, it isn't even possible to do everything over again.
As for being attached to characters, it is partially that reason that I would not consider anything like a class or race change on them. They would be significantly different characters and the former attachment would be irrelevant. After thousands of hours playing them, that would be a tragedy.
However, my objection to the Class Change Token isn't because I would not use it, or because I just don't want others to be able to use it. This is supposed to be an RPG game and creating and leveling characters is core to what an RPG is. Class Change Tokens are an RPG line that ZOS has not crossed. I am sure there are RPG games out there that do it anyway, but I would just question whether they are actually an RPG or just an action adventure game. Maybe ESO is really a multiplayer action adventure game that is mislabeled as an "RPG"? Time will tell.
If this were skyrim, or a single player game, I could respect what you are saying. It is an mmo however, with thousands upon thousands of hours of content, and it is not immersion breaking for our characters to LEARN over time. As it stands right now, a new school of magic is discovered, and our characters seem to be incapable of learning. Even games like SWTOR understood, that if you make new content, at a point you NEED to offer the ability to bypass all the old content once you have done it once. Then at least it would be a middle ground of " choices have consequences " and " I dont want my character to be a hollow husk ala street fighter "2 -
Tandor✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭
Still, it isn't necessary to do everything all over again with a new character. Actually, it isn't even possible to do everything over again.
As for being attached to characters, it is partially that reason that I would not consider anything like a class or race change on them. They would be significantly different characters and the former attachment would be irrelevant. After thousands of hours playing them, that would be a tragedy.
However, my objection to the Class Change Token isn't because I would not use it, or because I just don't want others to be able to use it. This is supposed to be an RPG game and creating and leveling characters is core to what an RPG is. Class Change Tokens are an RPG line that ZOS has not crossed. I am sure there are RPG games out there that do it anyway, but I would just question whether they are actually an RPG or just an action adventure game. Maybe ESO is really a multiplayer action adventure game that is mislabeled as an "RPG"? Time will tell.
If this were skyrim, or a single player game, I could respect what you are saying. It is an mmo however, with thousands upon thousands of hours of content, and it is not immersion breaking for our characters to LEARN over time. As it stands right now, a new school of magic is discovered, and our characters seem to be incapable of learning. Even games like SWTOR understood, that if you make new content, at a point you NEED to offer the ability to bypass all the old content once you have done it once. Then at least it would be a middle ground of " choices have consequences " and " I dont want my character to be a hollow husk ala street fighter "
For that reason, while opposed to both "class change" tokens and "instant maxed out character" tokens, I regard the latter as the lesser of the two evils, especially if it came along once in a blue moon rather than as a permanent item in the crown store.1 -
Elsonso✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭.
Still, it isn't necessary to do everything all over again with a new character. Actually, it isn't even possible to do everything over again.
As for being attached to characters, it is partially that reason that I would not consider anything like a class or race change on them. They would be significantly different characters and the former attachment would be irrelevant. After thousands of hours playing them, that would be a tragedy.
However, my objection to the Class Change Token isn't because I would not use it, or because I just don't want others to be able to use it. This is supposed to be an RPG game and creating and leveling characters is core to what an RPG is. Class Change Tokens are an RPG line that ZOS has not crossed. I am sure there are RPG games out there that do it anyway, but I would just question whether they are actually an RPG or just an action adventure game. Maybe ESO is really a multiplayer action adventure game that is mislabeled as an "RPG"? Time will tell.
If this were skyrim, or a single player game, I could respect what you are saying. It is an mmo however, with thousands upon thousands of hours of content, and it is not immersion breaking for our characters to LEARN over time. As it stands right now, a new school of magic is discovered, and our characters seem to be incapable of learning. Even games like SWTOR understood, that if you make new content, at a point you NEED to offer the ability to bypass all the old content once you have done it once. Then at least it would be a middle ground of " choices have consequences " and " I dont want my character to be a hollow husk ala street fighter "
The thing is that "RPG" does not include anything about whether it is single player or multiplayer.
"NEED" vs "WANT"... In ESO, it is not required to repeat the entire game experience on each character in order to be able to function at a high level in the end game. The new end game character does not need to be everything the other characters on the account are. If you think about it, a player that has spent thousands of hours in the game, and has access to the wisdom of the internet, should be able to build a second character that can do all PVE end game content in just a handful of hours. Without spending any Crowns. PVP will require that, plus Crowns for mount speed.
Should they do this thing... I suspect that the "choices have consequences" that ZOS would lay down will be a source of "forum rage" for a very long time.
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Spawn186✭✭I play with one character since 6/7 years. It's boring. I create a Alts, begin game and when i see how much i lost and so many time needed, i return on my main. I remember 7 years with this chara. I play for story and sometime dungeons trials etc. But so boring, now i'm connect only for endeavor and stoped my subcribe.
Why we can change everything like race, name, alliance but stuck with class/job ?
Non sens !4 -
wolfie1.0.✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭[quote="DeathStalker;c-7805415"
I hope it's also understandable to you how the alt system is loved by so many people, and how so many players run alts without complaint. I accept that AwA annnoyed some altoholics (mainly because the way AwA was implemented meant the change took away the character progression tracking and not because of the change to account-wide achievements per se), while also delighting a lot of other players, but the premise of your argument is wrong in my view. These tokens aren't wanted by people who don't like the alt system, they're wanted by people who in any MMO they play always run one character and don't want to run alts under any circumstances whether for time constraints or any other reasons, period.
^This. Some players are used to other games where you can do all specializations on one character. Personally, I love the alt system, and a character's class is deeply intertwined with their identity, so even if tokens existed, I'd still be making alts for new classes and for specs within the new classes.
What alt system? There is no alt system.
Its make a new character, do EVERYTHING over again , which is an unreasonable amount of content to redo, or spend a ton of money on utility upgrades.
That is just called bad QoL and toxic Customer Support.
Everything on a new character you can upgrade using either the crown store or in game assets really quickly. The only a few skill lines are nor purchasable via crown store and all but two skyshards are there I think. You can shortcut almost all of them. Zos gives out exp scrolls for free like candy. Even with out that you can have any character set up for whatever content you want within a few weeks at most. Faster if you already have a new character.
Is this a qol issue? Maybe, but it definitely isn't bad customer support. It has almost nothing to do with customer support, it's a technical aspect of the game.
The last thing I would want is for ZOS to rush this because of a forum request and it be bugged and result in a complete wipe of my favorite character.
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Jammy420✭✭✭✭✭
✭wolfie1.0. wrote: »[quote="DeathStalker;c-7805415"
I hope it's also understandable to you how the alt system is loved by so many people, and how so many players run alts without complaint. I accept that AwA annnoyed some altoholics (mainly because the way AwA was implemented meant the change took away the character progression tracking and not because of the change to account-wide achievements per se), while also delighting a lot of other players, but the premise of your argument is wrong in my view. These tokens aren't wanted by people who don't like the alt system, they're wanted by people who in any MMO they play always run one character and don't want to run alts under any circumstances whether for time constraints or any other reasons, period.
^This. Some players are used to other games where you can do all specializations on one character. Personally, I love the alt system, and a character's class is deeply intertwined with their identity, so even if tokens existed, I'd still be making alts for new classes and for specs within the new classes.
What alt system? There is no alt system.
Its make a new character, do EVERYTHING over again , which is an unreasonable amount of content to redo, or spend a ton of money on utility upgrades.
That is just called bad QoL and toxic Customer Support.
Everything on a new character you can upgrade using either the crown store or in game assets really quickly. The only a few skill lines are nor purchasable via crown store and all but two skyshards are there I think. You can shortcut almost all of them. Zos gives out exp scrolls for free like candy. Even with out that you can have any character set up for whatever content you want within a few weeks at most. Faster if you already have a new character.
Is this a qol issue? Maybe, but it definitely isn't bad customer support. It has almost nothing to do with customer support, it's a technical aspect of the game.
The last thing I would want is for ZOS to rush this because of a forum request and it be bugged and result in a complete wipe of my favorite character.
Rush this? This has been requested since warden was introduced. How much more time would they need than nearly seven years?
And it is horrible customer service and massive QoL issue..
Still, it isn't necessary to do everything all over again with a new character. Actually, it isn't even possible to do everything over again.
As for being attached to characters, it is partially that reason that I would not consider anything like a class or race change on them. They would be significantly different characters and the former attachment would be irrelevant. After thousands of hours playing them, that would be a tragedy.
However, my objection to the Class Change Token isn't because I would not use it, or because I just don't want others to be able to use it. This is supposed to be an RPG game and creating and leveling characters is core to what an RPG is. Class Change Tokens are an RPG line that ZOS has not crossed. I am sure there are RPG games out there that do it anyway, but I would just question whether they are actually an RPG or just an action adventure game. Maybe ESO is really a multiplayer action adventure game that is mislabeled as an "RPG"? Time will tell.
If this were skyrim, or a single player game, I could respect what you are saying. It is an mmo however, with thousands upon thousands of hours of content, and it is not immersion breaking for our characters to LEARN over time. As it stands right now, a new school of magic is discovered, and our characters seem to be incapable of learning. Even games like SWTOR understood, that if you make new content, at a point you NEED to offer the ability to bypass all the old content once you have done it once. Then at least it would be a middle ground of " choices have consequences " and " I dont want my character to be a hollow husk ala street fighter "
The thing is that "RPG" does not include anything about whether it is single player or multiplayer.
"NEED" vs "WANT"... In ESO, it is not required to repeat the entire game experience on each character in order to be able to function at a high level in the end game. The new end game character does not need to be everything the other characters on the account are. If you think about it, a player that has spent thousands of hours in the game, and has access to the wisdom of the internet, should be able to build a second character that can do all PVE end game content in just a handful of hours. Without spending any Crowns. PVP will require that, plus Crowns for mount speed.
Should they do this thing... I suspect that the "choices have consequences" that ZOS would lay down will be a source of "forum rage" for a very long time.
It wouldnt effect you or any other of the nay sayers one bit for there to be a class change token. It does however create a massive financial wall in order for us to make alts if we dont want to do everything again.
Its always mememe in here honestly. Sithis forbid we have a middle ground.2
