PTS Update 36 - Feedback Thread for Combat & Classes

Nser

Mr_Stach wrote: »

PrinceShroob wrote: »

You are attempting to retroactively force Wardens to be cyromancers, at the expense of both its original flavor as a druid and its competitive balance. You are doing this because, due to hardware limitations and your own inability to balance other than through erratic swings, you will not introduce a new cyromancer class.

You will not succeed because you are altering Warden too far from its roots and not far enough to be a workable cyromancer.

Either abandon your attempts or fully commit to them. Your current efforts are half-hearted and half-assed.

To wit, you have taken away about 8% flat damage increase and a 10% tooltip damage increase from Magic and Frost damage skills, to replace with a paltry 2% increase. This is unacceptable--particularly for a paid class.

I have never seen an incremental patch where all the changes are buffs and yet resoundingly rejected, which is a testament to your incompetence. And Gina has to market your madness, poor dear.

Take the following suggestions:

1. Adjust Advanced Species to provide an uncapped boost--Critical Chance, Spell and Weapon Damage, whatever. I really do not give a damn what you pick as long as it's not one of the only two capped stats in the game.

2. Adjust the weighting of Piercing Cold to be closer to 8-10% damage bonus flat with an additional 2% (or higher) for using a frost staff.

I have stayed within the boundaries of the patch changes, as I recognize that larger changes are unlikely to occur. That said, I strongly encourage you to make further adjustments to the changes you have implemented, as I can see you do want to atone for the damage you wrought in Update 35 and actually listening to feedback goes a long way to repairing the fractured relationship with your player base.

I mean Part of Warden's original flavor as expressed had Cryomancy as a main feature along with the Druidism. I don't think it was ever adequately expressed though and honestly still don't think it is with these changes.



That being said, Forcing Frost Staff upon all of warden players is not a great Idea, my suggestion is to make the damage bonus to instead be a more modest 6% damage and bump it up to 8-10% while a Winter's Embrace Skill is Active. Also with this remove the Destro staff dependance on Winter's Revenge.

I agree with Advanced Species Stuff though.

they destroying the class even more now

I was hope they buff warden frost and make passive separately without effecting other warden builds ..
other builds lose so much and dead cuz of this stupid changes

not everyone want to play with ice staff.

Mr_Stach

MurkyWetWolf198 wrote: »

Has anyone been able to test the dps increase to chilled on wardens? Can a console player with no PTS access get some numbers please?

Without Chilled Passive :



With Chilled Passive:


2807 > 6873
40% Increase

Mileage may vary, increase scales with your max stat and is also affected by if you have anything that increases frost damage, such as if you are wearing the Frostbite set. Which in this case, we were.

Depending on your setup, chilled can do some impressive damage:

Nser

suggestions

Warden

Animal Companion
Advanced Species: Increased the Critical Damage bonus of this passive to 2/4% per ability slotted, up from 1/3%. Good

Winter’s Embrace
Glacial Presence: This passive now increases the damage done by your Chilled status effect based on a value determined by your highest offensive stats, rather than adding 10% Critical Damage and Healing to recently Chilled targets. Bad change no one ask for. [reverse the old passive].

Piercing Cold: Increased the damage done bonus of this passive to 6 and 12% with an Ice Staff equipped, up from 5 and 10%.
[change it to 6% and 12% while using ice staff].

LeHarrt91

Nser wrote: »

suggestions

Warden

Animal Companion
Advanced Species: Increased the Critical Damage bonus of this passive to 2/4% per ability slotted, up from 1/3%. Good

Winter’s Embrace
Glacial Presence: This passive now increases the damage done by your Chilled status effect based on a value determined by your highest offensive stats, rather than adding 10% Critical Damage and Healing to recently Chilled targets. Bad change no one ask for. [reverse the old passive].

Piercing Cold: Increased the damage done bonus of this passive to 6 and 12% with an Ice Staff equipped, up from 5 and 10%.
[change it to 6% and 12% while using ice staff].

I think the Glacial Pressence passive is a good change since the new Advanced Species is also Crit Damage and as they said in their Dev Comments, wardens were doubling up on a capped stat.

chessalavakia_ESO

Initial Patch 8.22 Feedback.

From a purely Gameplay Perspective:

The changes look to be small enough that I doubt they'll matter much from a gameplay perspective for me.

Since we are on an EU week I can't do a direct comparison to live easily but, my approximation is that the changes don't look like they'd matter that much on any of my Wardens for how I play the game.

From a feelings perspective:

Part of the reason I made a Warden when I came back to the game with the Morrowind Expansion was because I felt the Warden Class wasn't tied strongly to any specific build so I could do what I felt like on it.

So, it kind of stinks for me that the design is moving towards being primarily Frost slanted as I liked the class being more open-ended and that is my least favorite part of the Warden.

What makes this worse is that it feels like the change is driven by a few prolific forum posters rather than the majority of the Wardens wanting this direction. It's one thing to have something not go your way because most other people didn't like that direction. It's another thing to watch the class you liked most change direction because a few people spammed the forums.

Seriously, if you are going to change the game to appease them it'd be less annoying if it was an item addition/change rather than changing the whole class for them.

Ex: Buff Frostbite or come up with a new Frost slanted Monster Set.

Extinct_Solo_Player

get your shovels for templar

MurkyWetWolf198

Mr_Stach wrote: »

MurkyWetWolf198 wrote: »

Has anyone been able to test the dps increase to chilled on wardens? Can a console player with no PTS access get some numbers please?

Without Chilled Passive :



With Chilled Passive:


2807 > 6873
40% Increase

Mileage may vary, increase scales with your max stat and is also affected by if you have anything that increases frost damage, such as if you are wearing the Frostbite set. Which in this case, we were.

Depending on your setup, chilled can do some impressive damage:

Thank you!!

Mr_Stach

Going to drop this feedback here once more, do not punish people for not running a specific weapon.

Glacial Presence is a good change, allowing Warden to do more damage with Chill Procs is a natural way to intice people to use Frost Abilities.

Piercing Cold is a bad direction pushing people to use Frost Staff or do 10% less damage.

Suggestion:

If you do not want to keep the flat damage type boost and want to keep the general damage bonus, make it based on the skill tree and not Frost staff like below:

Piercing Cold
Increases your damage done by 6%, this bonus is increased 10% when a Winter's Embrace Skill is active

As far as the advanced Species change goes, I still think it should go back to damage done or something else that is uncapped. W/S Damage, Crit chance, something.

BasP

MurkyWetWolf198 wrote: »

Has anyone been able to test the dps increase to chilled on wardens? Can a console player with no PTS access get some numbers please?

My (definitely not meta) Redguard Stamden solo build uses both Winter's Embrace and Arctic Blast on the live server. Without changing my build I apparently have a 90% to 95% uptime on Chilled and on the PTS it does around 3.9% to 5.2% of my total damage when parsing on a 3M dummy (instead of 1,4% to 1,9%).

PTS


Live


Some general feedback:

I like the change to Glacial Presence! I agree with Mr_Stach's comments above though.

However, ZOS, if you're hellbent on tying the Ice Staff to the Warden's passives for this patch, please up the damage bonus without an Ice Staff to 6%. I'd be nice if my favorite character would get a little buff instead of nerf.

Edit: If the Crit Damage on Advanced Species is here to stay, changing the relatively useless Icy Aura passive to increased Crit Chance when a Winter's Embrace skill is active would be nice too.

Hotdog_23

gariondavey wrote: »

Week 3 and no templar changes other than the backlash changes from week 1 (which are questionable at best). Not very impressed. If week 4 or 5 doesn't contain something good...

Agree the nerf to only having one at a time is a big change and nerf.

Sorcerer Curse is a AOE explosion Warden Scorch is AOE, Dragonknight inhale is AOE, Necromancer blastbones is AOE, Nigthblade Death Stroke is single target but both morphs have some pretty nice effects compare to Templar Backlash skill and its morphs.

If ZOS is going to make only limit templar to a single backlash at a time. They could at least make the final explosion and AOE and give Power of the light both major and minor breach like Deep Fissure. Afterall Deep Fissure is also and AOE major and minor breach.

Stay safe

MurkyWetWolf198

MurkyWetWolf198 wrote: »

Mr_Stach wrote: »

MurkyWetWolf198 wrote: »

Has anyone been able to test the dps increase to chilled on wardens? Can a console player with no PTS access get some numbers please?

Without Chilled Passive :



With Chilled Passive:


2807 > 6873
40% Increase

Mileage may vary, increase scales with your max stat and is also affected by if you have anything that increases frost damage, such as if you are wearing the Frostbite set. Which in this case, we were.

Depending on your setup, chilled can do some impressive damage:

Thank you!!

So, given that the "new" passive seems to make Chilled do comparable dps to Relequen's according to the screenshots previously posted (which is absolutely nuts, and I kinda like it), how is warden performing at the moment? What're it's parses at, how does it feel to use, etc.? I heard something about issues with sustain?
Also, how well does Winter's Revenge proc chilled in AoE encounters?

huskandhunger

On Werewolf:

Please consider reverting Claws of Life nerf, the heal feels too low now.

Berserker Light Attack Bleed not applying staus effects.

QoL Considerations

Consider decreasing Feral/Brutal Pounce damage over time durations to speed up ramp up.

Hircine's Rage - allow Major Berserk on use instead of the current health requirement.

Howl of Despair - remove Empower; add something else cool.

acastanza_ESO

Hotdog_23 wrote: »

gariondavey wrote: »

Week 3 and no templar changes other than the backlash changes from week 1 (which are questionable at best). Not very impressed. If week 4 or 5 doesn't contain something good...

Agree the nerf to only having one at a time is a big change and nerf.

Sorcerer Curse is a AOE explosion Warden Scorch is AOE, Dragonknight inhale is AOE, Necromancer blastbones is AOE, Nigthblade Death Stroke is single target but both morphs have some pretty nice effects compare to Templar Backlash skill and its morphs.

If ZOS is going to make only limit templar to a single backlash at a time. They could at least make the final explosion and AOE and give Power of the light both major and minor breach like Deep Fissure. Afterall Deep Fissure is also and AOE major and minor breach.

Stay safe

Deep Fissure is definitely overtuned. Major and Minor Breach on an AOE damage skill is too much. It should be dialed back not more skills made like it. It should loose either the major or minor breach. But sure, giving Blacklash a small AOE explosion like curse probably wouldn't be out of line, but PotL already applies Minor Breach. Maybe, maybe up it to major breach if it is still underperforming, but if that's done the Sorcerer Curse absolutely needs to get at least Major Breach added to it too.

RaptorRodeoGod

Mr_Stach wrote: »

MurkyWetWolf198 wrote: »

Has anyone been able to test the dps increase to chilled on wardens? Can a console player with no PTS access get some numbers please?

Without Chilled Passive :



With Chilled Passive:


2807 > 6873
40% Increase

Mileage may vary, increase scales with your max stat and is also affected by if you have anything that increases frost damage, such as if you are wearing the Frostbite set. Which in this case, we were.

Depending on your setup, chilled can do some impressive damage:

Haha Warden go brrr

ESO_Nightingale

RaptorRodeoGod wrote: »

Mr_Stach wrote: »

MurkyWetWolf198 wrote: »

Has anyone been able to test the dps increase to chilled on wardens? Can a console player with no PTS access get some numbers please?

Without Chilled Passive :



With Chilled Passive:


2807 > 6873
40% Increase

Mileage may vary, increase scales with your max stat and is also affected by if you have anything that increases frost damage, such as if you are wearing the Frostbite set. Which in this case, we were.

Depending on your setup, chilled can do some impressive damage:

Haha Warden go brrr

Also with the chilled passive one that stach quoted, I'd forgotten to put in thief mundus.

Mr_Stach

MurkyWetWolf198 wrote: »

MurkyWetWolf198 wrote: »

Mr_Stach wrote: »

MurkyWetWolf198 wrote: »

Has anyone been able to test the dps increase to chilled on wardens? Can a console player with no PTS access get some numbers please?

Without Chilled Passive :



With Chilled Passive:


2807 > 6873
40% Increase

Mileage may vary, increase scales with your max stat and is also affected by if you have anything that increases frost damage, such as if you are wearing the Frostbite set. Which in this case, we were.

Depending on your setup, chilled can do some impressive damage:

Thank you!!

So, given that the "new" passive seems to make Chilled do comparable dps to Relequen's according to the screenshots previously posted (which is absolutely nuts, and I kinda like it), how is warden performing at the moment? What're it's parses at, how does it feel to use, etc.? I heard something about issues with sustain?
Also, how well does Winter's Revenge proc chilled in AoE encounters?

Some things to consider:

• Chilled has no CD so it will proc all the time.
• Glacial Presence increases status chance of Winter's Embrace skills by 200%
• Arctic Blast has an increased 15% status chance on top of other status chances to proc chilled.
• If you're using Frost Staff, that’s another 100% status chance.

I think it's all about your setup, your ability to maintain. Personally I think Warden needs better sustain tools, maybe buffing Betty or Flourish, but as is I'm seeing people do some awesome stuff as is.

warich

This is getting really tiring and frustrating.

Warden needs to not be tied to a specific weapon. Stamden needs love. Frost is one part of the warden's tool kit, stop trying to make it the entire class.

Some ideas:

Buff hemorraging damage for warden, like make it a dual bonus with the chilled damage

Remove the ice staff passive. No one wants to be confined to a specific weapon. Play how you want.

Return the Advanced Species passive to an uncapped stat, unless you remove the cap on warden it helps no one in optimized groups.

Mr_Stach

warich wrote: »

This is getting really tiring and frustrating.

Warden needs to not be tied to a specific weapon. Stamden needs love. Frost is one part of the warden's tool kit, stop trying to make it the entire class.

Some ideas:

Buff hemorraging damage for warden, like make it a dual bonus with the chilled damage

Remove the ice staff passive. No one wants to be confined to a specific weapon. Play how you want.

Return the Advanced Species passive to an uncapped stat, unless you remove the cap on warden it helps no one in optimized groups.

I think for right now the biggest issue is Piercing Cold, Weapons being Tied to Passives and Skills (I'm looking at you Winter's Revenge) is not a good direction to go.

We've looked at different iterations to make this passive a happy middle ground that everyone should like:

Piercing Cold
Increases Damage by +6%
Increases Frost Damage by +6%

Even Advanced species as it is, is not as big of an issue as Piercing cold is right now. The Crit Damage can be worked around, you cannot build around Piercing Cold. People worry that this will buff Stamden setups too much because of DW/2H Passives, which is fine because Destro for a long time has needed to be brought up to speed.

Zos. Please Consider these suggestions, Warden should not be forced into using Frost Staff. Frost Staff and Destro Staff as a whole should be made better inside the Destro Staff Skill Line.

Caribou77

I really don't want to see Piercing Cold drop below the 10% damage increase it's currently giving Magic and Frost skills, even if it means sticking me with a frost staff.

I main a PVP MagWarden, and really don't want to lose any damage, at all. Nerf to Deep Fissure damage in U35, as well as loss of Advanced Species/2% dmg increase, has hurt enough already.

I guess I'm echoing most of the voices hear by wishing we simply could be given more frost damage skills (frost shalks, or do something with useful with Icy Aura), so that we could get some synergy out of the Frostbite Set, rather than the greatly limiting proposal of having to equip an ice staff.

It would be really nice to hear what ZOS's vision of the warden class is for the future -- where they're trying to get to, for BOTH StamWarden and MagWarden (very different animals, imo) in both PVP and PVE.

Then maybe the community could make suggestions that complement and improve that vision.

Mr_Stach

Caribou77 wrote: »

I really don't want to see Piercing Cold drop below the 10% damage increase it's currently giving Magic and Frost skills, even if it means sticking me with a frost staff.

I main a PVP MagWarden, and really don't want to lose any damage, at all. Nerf to Deep Fissure damage in U35, as well as loss of Advanced Species/2% dmg increase, has hurt enough already.

I guess I'm echoing most of the voices hear by wishing we simply could be given more frost damage skills (frost shalks, or do something with useful with Icy Aura), so that we could get some synergy out of the Frostbite Set, rather than the greatly limiting proposal of having to equip an ice staff.

It would be really nice to hear what ZOS's vision of the warden class is for the future -- where they're trying to get to, for BOTH StamWarden and MagWarden (very different animals, imo) in both PVP and PVE.

Then maybe the community could make suggestions that complement and improve that vision.

I would love for the Balance team to do a big spread of their vision for all the classes. We don't know what their plans are or if they are simply firing from the hip with a lot of these changes.

One thing is certain, Winter's Revenge was a Test that Led to Piercing Cold. If it goes live, I am afraid of where the Warden test will lead for other classes.

Although there are obviously people that oppose the Frost Staff Change, myself among them, I do think that Warden needs to have a greater unification of Skills and Passives to improve as an overall class for both Stamina Warden and Magicka Warden. I find that Stamina leaning into the Bleed Damage and getting bonuses to that playstyle is very important. I also think that Frost Damage and the Cryomancy potential is infinitely more interesting than straight magic damage. Some people oppose this and that's understandable, but I think that it can be done in a way that everyone is happy with the result if Zos is thoughtful and listens to feedback.

Frost Staff is the wrong direction to make warden better, there are more interesting and dynamic ways to make Warden a Better Class that everyone can enjoy.

Panachudo

My two cents as a Warden main;

1. This is where the struggle lies. .../snip

Advanced Species: Increased the,.../snip

Well, I'll eat my own words now. Quoting my original post and the 8.2.2 update it seems there is in fact a method to elevating the potential of frost damage and linking it with the use of an ice staff. This approach has certainly peaked my interest. Associating Glacial Presence with Piercing Cold and the use of chilled effect ties it all together nicely. It also doesn't shut the door on variability of builds. Clever. A frosty warden can now be a 100% uptimer for chilled. I wonder if Nanatuk would be of benefit here for major brittle. Though its uptime is a bit low it does open the door for a Warden providing substantial gains for a group with minor and major brittle. Looking forward to this going live to be honest. A genuine bravo to you guys.

Panachudo

Caribou77 wrote: »

or do something with useful with Icy Aura...

This would be cool. Off the top of my head it could be a damage passive. Upon chilling enemies release an icy aura in a 5m radius damaging enemies for [insert number]. This effect can only occur every [insert number] seconds.

Mr_Stach

Panachudo wrote: »

My two cents as a Warden main;

1. This is where the struggle lies. .../snip

Advanced Species: Increased the,.../snip

Well, I'll eat my own words now. Quoting my original post and the 8.2.2 update it seems there is in fact a method to elevating the potential of frost damage and linking it with the use of an ice staff. This approach has certainly peaked my interest. Associating Glacial Presence with Piercing Cold and the use of chilled effect ties it all together nicely. It also doesn't shut the door on variability of builds. Clever. A frosty warden can now be a 100% uptimer for chilled. I wonder if Nanatuk would be of benefit here for major brittle. Though its uptime is a bit low it does open the door for a Warden providing substantial gains for a group with minor and major brittle. Looking forward to this going live to be honest. A genuine bravo to you guys.

Here is my disconnect, I have no problem elevating the potential of Frost Damage, or Ice Staff becoming better. In fact I want both of these to happen. The issue lies in the implementation.

Tying Weapons to Class Passives is a dangerous precedent for ESO. And if it goes live, I am sure zos will look to implement it in other classes.

Zos could raise the effectiveness of Frost inside Warden without including Frost Staff. Zos could improve Frost staff's effectiveness within the Destruction Staff skill line.

Destruction staff for a long time has fallen behind DW/2H due to the lack of several things, such as consistent Damage buffs across all three elements, a lack of an Execute, also forcing tanking onto Frost Staff, which I know is a tired subject. If Zos focused on improving the Destro Line, to make it better across the board, people would want to use it instead of feeling the need to use it because it has one specific skill or because in warden's case, you will lose out on a LOT of damage otherwise.

There are smarter and more interesting ideas to make Frost Warden good, Tying Frost Staff to it should be reworked in some way to keep the desired effect, without tangling weapons into class trees.

Cast_El

Templar Change is bad once again 😞 .for PVP, it has been a defensive and offensive skill, but now it's only offensive, and you will need to keep up pressure for 6 seconds hit hard, without swapping to your back bar

Panachudo

Mr_Stach wrote: »

Here is my disconnect, I have no problem elevating the potential of Frost Damage, or Ice Staff becoming better. In fact I want both of these to happen. The issue lies in the implementation.

Tying Weapons to Class Passives is a dangerous precedent for ESO. And if it goes live, I am sure zos will look to implement it in other classes.

Zos could raise the effectiveness of Frost inside Warden without including Frost Staff. Zos could improve Frost staff's effectiveness within the Destruction Staff skill line.

Destruction staff for a long time has fallen behind DW/2H due to the lack of several things, such as consistent Damage buffs across all three elements, a lack of an Execute, also forcing tanking onto Frost Staff, which I know is a tired subject. If Zos focused on improving the Destro Line, to make it better across the board, people would want to use it instead of feeling the need to use it because it has one specific skill or because in warden's case, you will lose out on a LOT of damage otherwise.

There are smarter and more interesting ideas to make Frost Warden good, Tying Frost Staff to it should be reworked in some way to keep the desired effect, without tangling weapons into class trees.

I see what you are saying but I dont think they are there yet. Changing the frost staff to that extent has the potential to disrupt many many tanks in the game. We are already short on tanks. What would be the backbar option for a tank if frost was converted to dps? This is a rabbit hole and something that I am apprehensive to bring up though. So in its current guise I think they are trying to find a solution by tying it into the class passives. What do you think?

Mr_Stach

Panachudo wrote: »

Mr_Stach wrote: »

Here is my disconnect, I have no problem elevating the potential of Frost Damage, or Ice Staff becoming better. In fact I want both of these to happen. The issue lies in the implementation.

Tying Weapons to Class Passives is a dangerous precedent for ESO. And if it goes live, I am sure zos will look to implement it in other classes.

Zos could raise the effectiveness of Frost inside Warden without including Frost Staff. Zos could improve Frost staff's effectiveness within the Destruction Staff skill line.

Destruction staff for a long time has fallen behind DW/2H due to the lack of several things, such as consistent Damage buffs across all three elements, a lack of an Execute, also forcing tanking onto Frost Staff, which I know is a tired subject. If Zos focused on improving the Destro Line, to make it better across the board, people would want to use it instead of feeling the need to use it because it has one specific skill or because in warden's case, you will lose out on a LOT of damage otherwise.

There are smarter and more interesting ideas to make Frost Warden good, Tying Frost Staff to it should be reworked in some way to keep the desired effect, without tangling weapons into class trees.

I see what you are saying but I dont think they are there yet. Changing the frost staff to that extent has the potential to disrupt many many tanks in the game. We are already short on tanks. What would be the backbar option for a tank if frost was converted to dps? This is a rabbit hole and something that I am apprehensive to bring up though. So in its current guise I think they are trying to find a solution by tying it into the class passives. What do you think?

The way that I personally would approach the issue, is to take the tanking passives connected to Frost Staff and make it a singular new Destro Passive that is not connected to a specific element, but the line as a whole. So anyone with a Destro Staff can spec into the passive. Tanks get to keep their playstyle, Frost Wardens can use Frost Staff as DPS and everyone is happy. Frost would need to be adjusted considering the passives got switched up, but that's doable.

LeHarrt91

Panachudo wrote: »

Mr_Stach wrote: »

Here is my disconnect, I have no problem elevating the potential of Frost Damage, or Ice Staff becoming better. In fact I want both of these to happen. The issue lies in the implementation.

Tying Weapons to Class Passives is a dangerous precedent for ESO. And if it goes live, I am sure zos will look to implement it in other classes.

Zos could raise the effectiveness of Frost inside Warden without including Frost Staff. Zos could improve Frost staff's effectiveness within the Destruction Staff skill line.

Destruction staff for a long time has fallen behind DW/2H due to the lack of several things, such as consistent Damage buffs across all three elements, a lack of an Execute, also forcing tanking onto Frost Staff, which I know is a tired subject. If Zos focused on improving the Destro Line, to make it better across the board, people would want to use it instead of feeling the need to use it because it has one specific skill or because in warden's case, you will lose out on a LOT of damage otherwise.

There are smarter and more interesting ideas to make Frost Warden good, Tying Frost Staff to it should be reworked in some way to keep the desired effect, without tangling weapons into class trees.

I see what you are saying but I dont think they are there yet. Changing the frost staff to that extent has the potential to disrupt many many tanks in the game. We are already short on tanks. What would be the backbar option for a tank if frost was converted to dps? This is a rabbit hole and something that I am apprehensive to bring up though. So in its current guise I think they are trying to find a solution by tying it into the class passives. What do you think?

I think even just changing a few morphs will go along way, for all staff elements make Unstable Wall do more damage and Blockade can be the tank/ support morph with snare/ shield on frost and off balance on Shock, this ideally would try to help Shock staff Sorcs as well. Then maybe add a damage buff to one of the Impulse morphs.

Turtle_Bot

Panachudo wrote: »

Mr_Stach wrote: »

Here is my disconnect, I have no problem elevating the potential of Frost Damage, or Ice Staff becoming better. In fact I want both of these to happen. The issue lies in the implementation.

Tying Weapons to Class Passives is a dangerous precedent for ESO. And if it goes live, I am sure zos will look to implement it in other classes.

Zos could raise the effectiveness of Frost inside Warden without including Frost Staff. Zos could improve Frost staff's effectiveness within the Destruction Staff skill line.

Destruction staff for a long time has fallen behind DW/2H due to the lack of several things, such as consistent Damage buffs across all three elements, a lack of an Execute, also forcing tanking onto Frost Staff, which I know is a tired subject. If Zos focused on improving the Destro Line, to make it better across the board, people would want to use it instead of feeling the need to use it because it has one specific skill or because in warden's case, you will lose out on a LOT of damage otherwise.

There are smarter and more interesting ideas to make Frost Warden good, Tying Frost Staff to it should be reworked in some way to keep the desired effect, without tangling weapons into class trees.

I see what you are saying but I dont think they are there yet. Changing the frost staff to that extent has the potential to disrupt many many tanks in the game. We are already short on tanks. What would be the backbar option for a tank if frost was converted to dps? This is a rabbit hole and something that I am apprehensive to bring up though. So in its current guise I think they are trying to find a solution by tying it into the class passives. What do you think?

This issue could be easily fixed if they implemented a new weapon line "1 hand and ward" or "wand and shield" that would act as a magicka version of the 1 hand and shield line with its own passives and actives that would be a mix of the current 1h+s and frost staff skills and uses mag for its skills and block.

warich

Warden is not a frost only class. Currently stamden is getting the short end of the frost stick and being forced into using a specific weapon to even be close to viable in "end game" groups.

I can not express how frustrating this is after your play how you want mantra is introduced. Please acknowledge this does not support your vision. And while you're at it, fix warden shalks hitting Taleria.

Listen to your players or at least please improve communications.

@ZOS_GinaBruno

Mr_Stach

warich wrote: »

Warden is not a frost only class. Currently stamden is getting the short end of the frost stick and being forced into using a specific weapon to even be close to viable in "end game" groups.

I can not express how frustrating this is after your play how you want mantra is introduced. Please acknowledge this does not support your vision. And while you're at it, fix warden shalks hitting Taleria.

Listen to your players or at least please improve communications.

@ZOS_GinaBruno

Ah yes the "OH to hit this Boss with Shalks we need to stand in Slaughterfish Infested Water" This is a great trade-off