The night-capping in Cyrodiil needs to stop.

RaikaNA

StevieKingslayer wrote: »

Im not gonna stop playing my timezone because you dont have your faction on at the time. Maybe tap your own alliance to wake up and come pvp instead of leaving us to pvdoor because there is nothing for us to do

NA and EU server sucks for us ping wise. So we have to put up with bad ping and now you guys complaining we play at all.

Sorry but prime time usually starts at 7pm est until 11PM or 12AM. I can say the same thing about you... how come you guys can't come on during prime time? How fun is it to log in to a campaign that is recently logged off? How fun is it from a PvP perspective to have to PvDoor for what? an hour because all you do is fight guards, and not other players. If all you wanna do is fight guards then guess what? there is a zone called Craglorn that offers you tons and tons of PvE elements. People start up normal trials all the time.. you can certainly get your PvE fix there.

Olen_Mikko

[snip]

You know other timezones exists? People wants to play different times than you?
Never have any campaign won during prime time anyways, so no. No artificial buffs or debuffs just because prime times differ feom yours

[edited for baiting]

mocap

nah, night PvDoers are ok, doesn't matter which alliance. They make nice gameplay at primetime for the rest of the alliances, while 2/2/2 scrolls layout is just evening boring, making Cyro looks and play more like a battleground.

Dark_Lord_Kuro

There are people playing this game around the world they have as much right than anyone to capture keep no matter the times of the day

biminirwb17_ESO

Its not about numbers its about organization. An good group can take the map while other factions chase players around a resource tower.

madrab73

The scoring should be reduced during prime time to encourage more to play during the rest of 24 hours for 30 days.

StevieKingslayer

RaikaNA wrote: »

StevieKingslayer wrote: »

Im not gonna stop playing my timezone because you dont have your faction on at the time. Maybe tap your own alliance to wake up and come pvp instead of leaving us to pvdoor because there is nothing for us to do

NA and EU server sucks for us ping wise. So we have to put up with bad ping and now you guys complaining we play at all.

Sorry but prime time usually starts at 7pm est until 11PM or 12AM. I can say the same thing about you... how come you guys can't come on during prime time? How fun is it to log in to a campaign that is recently logged off? How fun is it from a PvP perspective to have to PvDoor for what? an hour because all you do is fight guards, and not other players. If all you wanna do is fight guards then guess what? there is a zone called Craglorn that offers you tons and tons of PvE elements. People start up normal trials all the time.. you can certainly get your PvE fix there.

I legitimately am on at that time. When I pvp, I pvp from 3pm my time - 2am generally. [snip] I just happen to live in oceanic timezones. By the time I can get on and play, it's either A) So laggy I cant move. B; You've all logged off. What exactly do you want me to do about that? How does that personally offend you that me, as an Ebonheart player, who gets rolled over on my faction constantly at the time we play?(For 3 months we were steamrolled by a yellow zerg, when there was legit like 10 of us on trying to defend our home keeps, and we got gated everynight, but you dont hear us crying about it, just complaints that we cant hold the map - maybe if ZOS hadn't alienated the rest of the oceanics this wouldnt have been a problem.) [snip]

[snip] People have jobs, lives and families. Im not gonna stop pvping at the time I can simply because you live somewhere different. Not my circus, not my monkey. [snip] It is not fun for me to have to log on and fight a door to try and force a fight from the 3 people that are online on the other alliances, while there 3 on mine too. [snip] You try riding around for 3 hours looking for a fight. Heck, go watch the NZ/Aus streamers riding around LOOKING for something to do. If you had to deal with that nonsense you'd just hit doors for the free AP too.

Edit to add: Also its really obvious you've never stayed up in our timezone in any aspect of the game because when you get bored of trying to find fights in pvp, you do go to pve and guess what; theres no one there either. Should try it sometime, staring into an empty craglorn is really weird. You guys honestly dont know how lucky you have it lmao.

[edited for baiting]

biminirwb17_ESO

The faction that wins the campaign is the one who has the most keeps, resources and scrolls for the longest time, skill has nothing to do with this outcome.

My personal view is that faction campaign scores should be scrapped they cause more issues than they solve. The extra gold and a few wall repair kits or rings to deconstruct are little incentive for most players.

A bonus for winning the hour would be better, rewarding players at the time they play the game.

RaikaNA

Dark_Lord_Kuro wrote: »

[snip] People have jobs, lives and families. Im not gonna stop pvping at the time I can simply because you live somewhere different. Not my circus, not my monkey.[snip] It is not fun for me to have to log on and fight a door to try and force a fight from the 3 people that are online on the other alliances, while there 3 on mine too. [snip] You try riding around for 3 hours looking for a fight. Heck, go watch the NZ/Aus streamers riding around LOOKING for something to do. If you had to deal with that nonsense you'd just hit doors for the free AP too.

Edit to add: Also its really obvious you've never stayed up in our timezone in any aspect of the game because when you get bored of trying to find fights in pvp, you do go to pve and guess what; theres no one there either. Should try it sometime, staring into an empty craglorn is really weird. You guys honestly dont know how lucky you have it lmao.

[snip]

PvP means Player vs Player... by fighting guards with no resistance is basically PvE - player vs environment.

Again going to Craglorn is the way to go if you desire this kind of gameplay.

I don't consider myself to be lucky.... I'm smart about buying online MMO games... I refuse to buy a game that doesn't support NA servers because I'm from NA..

[edited for flaming & to remove quote]

madrab73

biminirwb17_ESO wrote: »

The faction that wins the campaign is the one who has the most keeps, resources and scrolls for the longest time, skill has nothing to do with this outcome.

My personal view is that faction campaign scores should be scrapped they cause more issues than they solve. The extra gold and a few wall repair kits or rings to deconstruct are little incentive for most players.

A bonus for winning the hour would be better, rewarding players at the time they play the game.

Reduce it from an hour to 15 minutes and you have BGs?

hafgood

[snip]

This game is based on the principle of play how you want.

That means play on the server you want to at the time you want to. No one should be told that their gaming time is worth less than anyone else's gaming time and that is exactly what is happening.

Everyone night caps as it is always night somewhere, it just happens that many of you play at the same time. Those who don't still PvP, they are just as entitled to play in Cyrodiil in their prime time, as you are in yours.

We should all be inclusive instead of trying to exclude players because their time zone is different to our own.

[edited for discussing moderator action]

madrab73

RaikaNA wrote: »

Dark_Lord_Kuro wrote: »

[snip] People have jobs, lives and families. Im not gonna stop pvping at the time I can simply because you live somewhere different. Not my circus, not my monkey.[snip] It is not fun for me to have to log on and fight a door to try and force a fight from the 3 people that are online on the other alliances, while there 3 on mine too. [snip] You try riding around for 3 hours looking for a fight. Heck, go watch the NZ/Aus streamers riding around LOOKING for something to do. If you had to deal with that nonsense you'd just hit doors for the free AP too.

Edit to add: Also its really obvious you've never stayed up in our timezone in any aspect of the game because when you get bored of trying to find fights in pvp, you do go to pve and guess what; theres no one there either. Should try it sometime, staring into an empty craglorn is really weird. You guys honestly dont know how lucky you have it lmao.

[snip]

PvP means Player vs Player... by fighting guards with no resistance is basically PvE - player vs environment.

Again going to Craglorn is the way to go if you desire this kind of gameplay.

I don't consider myself to be lucky.... I'm smart about buying online MMO games... I refuse to buy a game that doesn't support NA servers because I'm from NA..

[edited for flaming & to remove quote]

In the first post you confirmed that you PVdoor DC before they come online?

ZOS_Icy

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Celephantsylvius_Bornasfinmo

TX12001rwb17_ESO wrote: »

You do know places like Australia exist right? Where it is Daytime here while your asleep in the US.

So Aussies only get to Pve-door by themselves?
What a let down!

Not that many people play late at night here on PC EU. We generally end up dancing or chatting as the same regular enemy groups begin to torment what is left of the map in with numerical advantages and we all log off.

There are certain groups that login very early in the morning to take a big portion of the map or some scrolls. I find that a bit silly as they little to no resistance. It kind of defeats the purpose of the PvP 'game' we are playing.

fizl101

Youyouz06 wrote: »

TX12001rwb17_ESO wrote: »

You do know places like Australia exist right? Where it is Daytime here while your asleep in the US.

So Aussies only get to Pve-door by themselves?
What a let down!

Not that many people play late at night here on PC EU. We generally end up dancing or chatting as the same regular enemy groups begin to torment what is left of the map in with numerical advantages and we all log off.

There are certain groups that login very early in the morning to take a big portion of the map or some scrolls. I find that a bit silly as they little to no resistance. It kind of defeats the purpose of the PvP 'game' we are playing.

We like a dance on PS EU too on a sunday evening

Arunei

Izanagi.Xiiib16_ESO wrote: »

People always post about "those in other timezones" the issue isn't the time that the map is being flipped it's the population imbalance.
To cure this all zos needed to implement was scaling evaluation timers based on population ratios. (suggested 4 years+ ago). And potentially some interesting 'reinforcement' mechanics for low pop factions like NPC battalions which go to siege keeps / scaling guard numbers or difficulty based on population imbalance in last 3 keeps etc.

People keep bringing up timezones because of the fact that others keep acting like nightcapping somehow exists in a game where it's day for one portion of players and night for another. If the problem is population imbalance then call it that, but that's not what's being said or implied.

RaikaNA wrote: »

StevieKingslayer wrote: »

Im not gonna stop playing my timezone because you dont have your faction on at the time. Maybe tap your own alliance to wake up and come pvp instead of leaving us to pvdoor because there is nothing for us to do

NA and EU server sucks for us ping wise. So we have to put up with bad ping and now you guys complaining we play at all.

Sorry but prime time usually starts at 7pm est until 11PM or 12AM. I can say the same thing about you... how come you guys can't come on during prime time? How fun is it to log in to a campaign that is recently logged off? How fun is it from a PvP perspective to have to PvDoor for what? an hour because all you do is fight guards, and not other players. If all you wanna do is fight guards then guess what? there is a zone called Craglorn that offers you tons and tons of PvE elements. People start up normal trials all the time.. you can certainly get your PvE fix there.

This sounds so incredibly selfish. Your prime time might be between those hours, but you are willingly ignoring at this point that your prime time isn't the only one. Are you seriously asking why people can't come on during those hours? You honestly expect people to forgo work, family, and other responsibilities to play only when you can?

PvP doesn't revolve around any single person's lifestyle, and if people honestly expect it to, they should also expect a whole lot of disappointment. PvP isn't going to shut off just because your time zone has logged off for the night. Sometimes the level of entitlement genuinely baffles me.

SpacemanSpiff1

pleximus wrote: »

drsalvation wrote: »

Kwoung wrote: »

While I will agree that it would be wrong to punish players in other time zones, I think many are missing the point that in most of the nightcapping cases I have seen, it isn't players from another country doing it. It is a group of local players staying up late to nightcap purposefully and all they have to do is wait for 10pm PST or so on NA servers, run the map and go to bed, leaving it whatever color until the players from asia log in and start playing and moving the map around again.

and what's stopping other alliances from doing the same?

This!

Start an alliance exclusive guild to combat this "problem".

This is the solution.

Don't like "night-capping"? Go fight them.

ajkb78

RaikaNA wrote: »

Start buffing up guards during non-prime time hours... I suggest boosting guards up to veteran trial level... giving them a massive amount of health plus letting them hit hard.



DC isn't winning in Ravenwatch (NA) because they're good... they're winning because as soon as AD logs off for the night... DC logs in and take the entire map without much of a fight.

You know there are players in other time zones, playing legitimately in their own prime times? Just because it's a different alliance to yours that happens to dominate your night time doesn't make it any less valid. Besides, it gives you something to do the next day recapturing the map again.

VaranisArano

Izanagi.Xiiib16_ESO wrote: »

People always post about "those in other timezones" the issue isn't the time that the map is being flipped it's the population imbalance.
To cure this all zos needed to implement was scaling evaluation timers based on population ratios. (suggested 4 years+ ago). And potentially some interesting 'reinforcement' mechanics for low pop factions like NPC battalions which go to siege keeps / scaling guard numbers or difficulty based on population imbalance in last 3 keeps etc.

People talk about time zones because the reality is that those times of population imbalance track pretty well to certain timezones, and especially time zones when regional guilds log on and play in Cyrodiil.

I'm on PC/NA. We've already had people complaining that players stay up late past NA primetime to flip the map. I've fought Oceanic guilds in the early morning in hours. Your proposed NPC battalions are only going to trigger during certain timezones.

I mean, the more people try to take timezones out of the equation, the more obvious it becomes that this IS about timezones. It's about people who have the audacity to play a 24/7 zone during times when most North American players are sleeping. It's about players in the NA primetime timezones feeling like their few hours of play should have a bigger impact on the score because it's oh so "competitive."

Maybe you aren't trying to make this about timezones.

But when all the suggested changes are going to have a disproportionate effect on players in certain timezones because primetime players don't like the effects of "nightcapping"...it's about timezones.

xDeusEJRx

I do think OP raises a good point about how flawed the system is, cause imagine if the server is typically 6 bars during prime time, and when everyone gets off and it goes to 0 bars and there's basically no one on. One person could easily flip campaign score just taking resources alone, since native resources are worth 2 points, you add 2 points for each of your factions resources and remove 2 from enemy's native resources. Then it gets more convoluted when you have a dedicated group vs factions that are empty. I've been on at times where only 1 faction still has full pop at about 3 am and every other faction has 0, and basically no one in zone chat besides myself.
System is honestly kind of flawed, a rework would be nice but buffing guards isn't the way to go

Arunei

xDeusEJRx wrote: »

I do think OP raises a good point about how flawed the system is, cause imagine if the server is typically 6 bars during prime time, and when everyone gets off and it goes to 0 bars and there's basically no one on. One person could easily flip campaign score just taking resources alone, since native resources are worth 2 points, you add 2 points for each of your factions resources and remove 2 from enemy's native resources. Then it gets more convoluted when you have a dedicated group vs factions that are empty. I've been on at times where only 1 faction still has full pop at about 3 am and every other faction has 0, and basically no one in zone chat besides myself.
System is honestly kind of flawed, a rework would be nice but buffing guards isn't the way to go

It's not flawed though. It's people from other timezones getting on to play, or people who work like second shift getting on to play. Just because a campaign is dead doesn't mean anything, and trying to make any sort of "balance" against population will only favor people who play during a certain timeframe in a certain timezone. Faction has absolutely nothing to do with timezone either. Not all AD players are in the same timezone, not all EP players are in the same timezone.

The simple fact is there are people who play at different times than you (a general you, not aimed at anyone specific). You can't expect other people to conform to your prime time, and you can't expect others to be given a disadvantage just because when they play there are fewer people on.

Wolfpaw

Different time zones is not the problem, "night" capping is not the problem... it's the population imbalance (scoring), & alliance population not given the time to balance (crown store).

Region Locked mega servers: NA mega server/Americas, JP, & AU. Everyone else not in those regions/clients should get a free server transfer to the EU mega server. Global mega server is not healthy for the game.

Alliance Change token: Add a 3 month cooldown after purchase, this CD has helped balance faction/alliance change purchase in other mmorpg's.

Alliance Change token: Open/close Alliance Change depending on an Alliance's population. This has helped in other games.

Give Cyrodiil time to breath and balance.

madrab73

Wolfpaw wrote: »

Different time zones is not the problem, "night" capping is not the problem... it's the population imbalance (scoring), & alliance population not given the time to balance (crown store).

Region Locked mega servers: NA mega server/Americas, JP, & AU. Everyone else not in those regions/clients should get a free server transfer to the EU mega server. Global mega server is not healthy for the game.

Alliance Change token: Add a 3 month cooldown after purchase, this CD has helped balance faction/alliance change purchase in other mmorpg's.

Alliance Change token: Open/close Alliance Change depending on an Alliance's population. This has helped in other games.

Give Cyrodiil time to breath and balance.

No thanks. Like many I play on both servers and have done for 6 years. People only come on here to complain about night capping when their alliance is losing the campaign (not night capping this month)

xDeusEJRx

Arunei wrote: »

xDeusEJRx wrote: »

I do think OP raises a good point about how flawed the system is, cause imagine if the server is typically 6 bars during prime time, and when everyone gets off and it goes to 0 bars and there's basically no one on. One person could easily flip campaign score just taking resources alone, since native resources are worth 2 points, you add 2 points for each of your factions resources and remove 2 from enemy's native resources. Then it gets more convoluted when you have a dedicated group vs factions that are empty. I've been on at times where only 1 faction still has full pop at about 3 am and every other faction has 0, and basically no one in zone chat besides myself.
System is honestly kind of flawed, a rework would be nice but buffing guards isn't the way to go

It's not flawed though. It's people from other timezones getting on to play, or people who work like second shift getting on to play. Just because a campaign is dead doesn't mean anything, and trying to make any sort of "balance" against population will only favor people who play during a certain timeframe in a certain timezone. Faction has absolutely nothing to do with timezone either. Not all AD players are in the same timezone, not all EP players are in the same timezone.

The simple fact is there are people who play at different times than you (a general you, not aimed at anyone specific). You can't expect other people to conform to your prime time, and you can't expect others to be given a disadvantage just because when they play there are fewer people on.

That's not always the case. Is there people in time zones getting on to play? Yes, but the fact remains I could choose stay on at 3 am and flip a bunch of resources and gradually tick the score over because there's not anyone to resist me as in prime time. One person alone has enough potential to drastically change campaign score, especially if its an empty server. Like I said 1 resource is worth 2 points, if there's no one to take anything back. I can flip all enemy resources and take away 72 points(from other 2 factions) from the campaign score with ease is kind of ridiculous, considering cyro's supposed to be team oriented, how is that not flawed?

I'm not saying there aren't people playing in different time zones(I never made that argument, the argument I'm making is how easy it is to flip the campaign score when there's no players), but if you have multiple solos running around doing the same stuff or even work together they can flip the score. I've had times where I'm playing solo in BR on PSNA and there's quite literally no one from my faction in zone chat but myself and DC have been able to run scrolls back with 2 people. There was barely anyone online on DC as well, even when I stopped scroll there was maybe 4 people who showed up to get it back


When I took this screenshot, one of the scrolls I was chasing was being ran by literally 2 people, how exactly is it not flawed that small groups like 5 people taking scrolls/gate keeps/scrolls. I'm not advocating for making super guards like OP, but I still think it's kind of crazy how easy it is to flip campaign score when no one was on. That day I was playing by myself with a few people in zone chat who just said they were leaving because everything was blue, but there was maybe 10 different blues running around the map at the time(mainly because there was nothing they didn't already own)
It's a little ridiculous how you can flip score, quite literally only needing 2-4 people to run scrolls from deep in enemy territory when no one's playing against you. I think that is a bit a flawed somewhat

madrab73

xDeusEJRx wrote: »

Arunei wrote: »

xDeusEJRx wrote: »

I do think OP raises a good point about how flawed the system is, cause imagine if the server is typically 6 bars during prime time, and when everyone gets off and it goes to 0 bars and there's basically no one on. One person could easily flip campaign score just taking resources alone, since native resources are worth 2 points, you add 2 points for each of your factions resources and remove 2 from enemy's native resources. Then it gets more convoluted when you have a dedicated group vs factions that are empty. I've been on at times where only 1 faction still has full pop at about 3 am and every other faction has 0, and basically no one in zone chat besides myself.
System is honestly kind of flawed, a rework would be nice but buffing guards isn't the way to go

It's not flawed though. It's people from other timezones getting on to play, or people who work like second shift getting on to play. Just because a campaign is dead doesn't mean anything, and trying to make any sort of "balance" against population will only favor people who play during a certain timeframe in a certain timezone. Faction has absolutely nothing to do with timezone either. Not all AD players are in the same timezone, not all EP players are in the same timezone.

The simple fact is there are people who play at different times than you (a general you, not aimed at anyone specific). You can't expect other people to conform to your prime time, and you can't expect others to be given a disadvantage just because when they play there are fewer people on.

That's not always the case. Is there people in time zones getting on to play? Yes, but the fact remains I could choose stay on at 3 am and flip a bunch of resources and gradually tick the score over because there's not anyone to resist me as in prime time. One person alone has enough potential to drastically change campaign score, especially if its an empty server. Like I said 1 resource is worth 2 points, if there's no one to take anything back. I can flip all enemy resources and take away 72 points(from other 2 factions) from the campaign score with ease is kind of ridiculous, considering cyro's supposed to be team oriented, how is that not flawed?

I'm not saying there aren't people playing in different time zones(I never made that argument, the argument I'm making is how easy it is to flip the campaign score when there's no players), but if you have multiple solos running around doing the same stuff or even work together they can flip the score. I've had times where I'm playing solo in BR on PSNA and there's quite literally no one from my faction in zone chat but myself and DC have been able to run scrolls back with 2 people. There was barely anyone online on DC as well, even when I stopped scroll there was maybe 4 people who showed up to get it back


When I took this screenshot, one of the scrolls I was chasing was being ran by literally 2 people, how exactly is it not flawed that small groups like 5 people taking scrolls/gate keeps/scrolls. I'm not advocating for making super guards like OP, but I still think it's kind of crazy how easy it is to flip campaign score when no one was on. That day I was playing by myself with a few people in zone chat who just said they were leaving because everything was blue, but there was maybe 10 different blues running around the map at the time(mainly because there was nothing they didn't already own)
It's a little ridiculous how you can flip score, quite literally only needing 2-4 people to run scrolls from deep in enemy territory when no one's playing against you. I think that is a bit a flawed somewhat

Blackreach is a dead campaign, maybe play in the main campaign instead?

Adernath

TX12001rwb17_ESO wrote: »

You do know places like Australia exist right? Where it is Daytime here while your asleep in the US.

Frequent argument used by night cappers...

vms11934

madrab73 wrote: »

Blackreach is a dead campaign, maybe play in the main campaign instead?

Happens on PSNA Grey Host too.

This isn't a matter of whose time zones are more important. It is a matter of how a very small number of players in the span of one or two hours can have an equaling or surpassing influence on the campaign than full servers of players having at it for 8+ hours.

hafgood

Wolfpaw wrote: »

Different time zones is not the problem, "night" capping is not the problem... it's the population imbalance (scoring), & alliance population not given the time to balance (crown store).

Region Locked mega servers: NA mega server/Americas, JP, & AU. Everyone else not in those regions/clients should get a free server transfer to the EU mega server. Global mega server is not healthy for the game.

Alliance Change token: Add a 3 month cooldown after purchase, this CD has helped balance faction/alliance change purchase in other mmorpg's.

Alliance Change token: Open/close Alliance Change depending on an Alliance's population. This has helped in other games.

Give Cyrodiil time to breath and balance.

As I have said to you on many other threads - no.

This would absolutely destroy the game. It wouldn't save Cyrodiil, it would destroy it.

This game is promoted as play how you like - and that means on whichever server you want and whichever platform you want. Many people play on both servers.

If this was ever implemented I would walk away from this game without a backwards glance. The NA server is for anyone to play on, as is the EU.

Wolfpaw

hafgood wrote: »

Wolfpaw wrote: »

Different time zones is not the problem, "night" capping is not the problem... it's the population imbalance (scoring), & alliance population not given the time to balance (crown store).

Region Locked mega servers: NA mega server/Americas, JP, & AU. Everyone else not in those regions/clients should get a free server transfer to the EU mega server. Global mega server is not healthy for the game.

Alliance Change token: Add a 3 month cooldown after purchase, this CD has helped balance faction/alliance change purchase in other mmorpg's.

Alliance Change token: Open/close Alliance Change depending on an Alliance's population. This has helped in other games.

Give Cyrodiil time to breath and balance.

As I have said to you on many other threads - no.

This would absolutely destroy the game. It wouldn't save Cyrodiil, it would destroy it.

This game is promoted as play how you like - and that means on whichever server you want and whichever platform you want. Many people play on both servers.

If this was ever implemented I would walk away from this game without a backwards glance. The NA server is for anyone to play on, as is the EU.

I also doubt this would ever happen, but if it did I bet ESO wouldn't even see a dip in player base at all. ESO will continue to gain popularity & grow.

Unfortunately though, performance and alliance balance will continue the status quo for now thanks to the flooding of one mega server/one campaign, & Alliance Change token lack of restrictions.

phairdon

Outside of banning play during certain hours, what can you do? People live in different time zones around the world.