Rushing dungeons and can't even report. This is becoming a problem.

Iceman_mat

[snip]

Also almost all of you do not stick to the tank. As in you get hit by a mob and decide to run back to the entrance instead of towards the tank so they can taunt.

I would further go on to say that those 2 reasons, the second one mainly, is why you have these speed issues as well as "fake tank" issues because it is just easier to make a wtf dps and do solo runs.

Why wpuld they then join groups you ask? Good question. They join groups because in some dungeons (e.g fungal 2, wayrest 2) you need a group member to break the unstopable cc.

Do group members break said cc? Usually no, however it is still faster to die with a group on said cc and then keep going.

That is not to mention that no one reses either but ya know who wants ro do mechanics or work togther.

That's what guilds are for.


-cheers

[edited for baiting]

Franchise408

jaws343 wrote: »

thesarahandcompany wrote: »

wtlonewolf20 wrote: »

SeaGtGruff wrote: »

Regarding the reasoning that the speeding players just want to farm their daily transmute crystals on multiple characters:

- How many transmute crystals do you get per dungeon?
- How many transmute crystals can an account have?
- Are they EVER going to reach their limit and stop, or are they just going to keep abusing the Group Finder to farm unending amounts of transmute crystals and convert the excess to gear?

I think I already know the answer to the last question, so it's basically a rhetorical question, but I'm asking it to make a point. In fact, I'm willing to bet that the players who are the worst about abusing the Group Finder this way-- and they are indeed abusing it-- have already acquired and exceeded the maximum amount of transmute crystals on their accounts.

Abusing? How is this abuse? This is no more abuse than ANY other daily activities that you can do multiple times per day per character.

It’s not abuse, the whole idea of banning or reporting speed runners is just absurd and unreasonable. It’s literally the least charitable interpretation of people’s intentions.

Not to mention that there are literal achievements associated with running the dungeon quickly.

Correct

And once that achievement has been collected on the character, you get no more rewards for speed runs. Meaning you need to speed run once. Not every time.

To repeat your point - if you are joining the group finder for the sake of getting a speed run, you are the problem.

MEBengalsFan2001

If the player running ahead isn't waiting at bosses, simply vote to kick.

jaws343

Franchise408 wrote: »

jaws343 wrote: »

thesarahandcompany wrote: »

wtlonewolf20 wrote: »

SeaGtGruff wrote: »

Regarding the reasoning that the speeding players just want to farm their daily transmute crystals on multiple characters:

- How many transmute crystals do you get per dungeon?
- How many transmute crystals can an account have?
- Are they EVER going to reach their limit and stop, or are they just going to keep abusing the Group Finder to farm unending amounts of transmute crystals and convert the excess to gear?

I think I already know the answer to the last question, so it's basically a rhetorical question, but I'm asking it to make a point. In fact, I'm willing to bet that the players who are the worst about abusing the Group Finder this way-- and they are indeed abusing it-- have already acquired and exceeded the maximum amount of transmute crystals on their accounts.

Abusing? How is this abuse? This is no more abuse than ANY other daily activities that you can do multiple times per day per character.

It’s not abuse, the whole idea of banning or reporting speed runners is just absurd and unreasonable. It’s literally the least charitable interpretation of people’s intentions.

Not to mention that there are literal achievements associated with running the dungeon quickly.

Correct

And once that achievement has been collected on the character, you get no more rewards for speed runs. Meaning you need to speed run once. Not every time.

To repeat your point - if you are joining the group finder for the sake of getting a speed run, you are the problem.

But that is my point. It is a two way street. Players needing to do the quest and players speed running are both legitimate playstyles since both are encouraged by the game.

Dungeon finder is not the best place for either playstyle.

But only one of those play styles, namely, doing the quests, actually works to slow down and waste the time of the group.

Both should be done with pre-formed groups for the best results. But completing the dungeon efficiently and quickly should always be the goal of the dungeon finder. Not meandering through the dungeon reading the quest dialogue. So speed running is the far more favorable option of the two.

But speed running is no less legitimate a game action that doing the quests. And certainly not a reportable offense.

TheImperfect

I would still really love a story mode run that is repeatable but you only get the skill point the first time. It's good to pug and run also though, I also enjoy the fast runs.

tmbrinks

Amazing that so many people feel entitled to have everybody else run dungeons their own special way.

If you want a specific outcome... make your own group.

I go for dungeon achievements, I found a group of 3 others who want to do the same (even though I have gotten some of them on alt characters with pug groups)

I've pugged and gotten achievements. I've pugged on my tank and been doing 50%+ of the DPS... it was a 25 minute pull to kill the final boss of BCII. The point is, you don't know what you're going to get when you use the group finder.

But, if you get angry enough that you have to make a forum thread about it... don't pug, you can make your own group.

Franchise408

jaws343 wrote: »

Franchise408 wrote: »

jaws343 wrote: »

thesarahandcompany wrote: »

wtlonewolf20 wrote: »

SeaGtGruff wrote: »

Regarding the reasoning that the speeding players just want to farm their daily transmute crystals on multiple characters:

- How many transmute crystals do you get per dungeon?
- How many transmute crystals can an account have?
- Are they EVER going to reach their limit and stop, or are they just going to keep abusing the Group Finder to farm unending amounts of transmute crystals and convert the excess to gear?

I think I already know the answer to the last question, so it's basically a rhetorical question, but I'm asking it to make a point. In fact, I'm willing to bet that the players who are the worst about abusing the Group Finder this way-- and they are indeed abusing it-- have already acquired and exceeded the maximum amount of transmute crystals on their accounts.

Abusing? How is this abuse? This is no more abuse than ANY other daily activities that you can do multiple times per day per character.

It’s not abuse, the whole idea of banning or reporting speed runners is just absurd and unreasonable. It’s literally the least charitable interpretation of people’s intentions.

Not to mention that there are literal achievements associated with running the dungeon quickly.

Correct

And once that achievement has been collected on the character, you get no more rewards for speed runs. Meaning you need to speed run once. Not every time.

To repeat your point - if you are joining the group finder for the sake of getting a speed run, you are the problem.

But that is my point. It is a two way street. Players needing to do the quest and players speed running are both legitimate playstyles since both are encouraged by the game.

Dungeon finder is not the best place for either playstyle.

But only one of those play styles, namely, doing the quests, actually works to slow down and waste the time of the group.

Both should be done with pre-formed groups for the best results. But completing the dungeon efficiently and quickly should always be the goal of the dungeon finder. Not meandering through the dungeon reading the quest dialogue. So speed running is the far more favorable option of the two.

But speed running is no less legitimate a game action that doing the quests. And certainly not a reportable offense.

And only one of those playstyles, namely, doing speed runs, actively prevent others from achieving their objectives. So no, speed running is not the more favorable option of the 2.

AlnilamE

jaws343 wrote: »

Franchise408 wrote: »

jaws343 wrote: »

thesarahandcompany wrote: »

wtlonewolf20 wrote: »

SeaGtGruff wrote: »

Regarding the reasoning that the speeding players just want to farm their daily transmute crystals on multiple characters:

- How many transmute crystals do you get per dungeon?
- How many transmute crystals can an account have?
- Are they EVER going to reach their limit and stop, or are they just going to keep abusing the Group Finder to farm unending amounts of transmute crystals and convert the excess to gear?

I think I already know the answer to the last question, so it's basically a rhetorical question, but I'm asking it to make a point. In fact, I'm willing to bet that the players who are the worst about abusing the Group Finder this way-- and they are indeed abusing it-- have already acquired and exceeded the maximum amount of transmute crystals on their accounts.

Abusing? How is this abuse? This is no more abuse than ANY other daily activities that you can do multiple times per day per character.

It’s not abuse, the whole idea of banning or reporting speed runners is just absurd and unreasonable. It’s literally the least charitable interpretation of people’s intentions.

Not to mention that there are literal achievements associated with running the dungeon quickly.

Correct

And once that achievement has been collected on the character, you get no more rewards for speed runs. Meaning you need to speed run once. Not every time.

To repeat your point - if you are joining the group finder for the sake of getting a speed run, you are the problem.

But that is my point. It is a two way street. Players needing to do the quest and players speed running are both legitimate playstyles since both are encouraged by the game.

Dungeon finder is not the best place for either playstyle.

But only one of those play styles, namely, doing the quests, actually works to slow down and waste the time of the group.

Both should be done with pre-formed groups for the best results. But completing the dungeon efficiently and quickly should always be the goal of the dungeon finder. Not meandering through the dungeon reading the quest dialogue. So speed running is the far more favorable option of the two.

But speed running is no less legitimate a game action that doing the quests. And certainly not a reportable offense.

There are no speedrun achievements in Normal dungeons.

DMuehlhausen

Ryuvain wrote: »

Just had a third dungeon quest be unable to be completed because someone rushes ahead alone and solo's boss without anyone else.

Normally yes, you can report them for this, but you still lose out on a dungeon run completely. Theres also the problem of them not saying anything and leaving group immediately after doing it. That way you don't have any way to report them because there's no recent player list as far as I know.

This is becoming a huge pain and the amount of players who rush ahead and don't care seems to be increasing. If theres a recent player list let me know, otherwise this is seriously a problem.

While I enjoy a good dungeon story....find a group a friends to go with if it's your first time.

DMuehlhausen

DarcyMardin wrote: »

Wow, I can’t believe that people are defending this sort of griefing behavior. These are 4 person dungeons. If someone races ahead, kills the final boss and exits the group and the dungeon, leaving the other 3 people with no loot, that person should absolutely be reported for griefing the other three. If someone wants to run the dungeon alone, let them enter it solo instead of using the *group* finder.

This rude, selfish “I-want-my-reward-right-now-so-tough-for-you” behavior in group dungeons must stop!

Nobody is griefing. It's somebody looking to do a random normal for 10 transmutes. They are as DPS so they already sat for at least 30 minutes probably. They don't want to, and shouldn't have to wait for the other people or one person to sit and read all the quest text.

spartaxoxo

DMuehlhausen wrote: »

DarcyMardin wrote: »

Wow, I can’t believe that people are defending this sort of griefing behavior. These are 4 person dungeons. If someone races ahead, kills the final boss and exits the group and the dungeon, leaving the other 3 people with no loot, that person should absolutely be reported for griefing the other three. If someone wants to run the dungeon alone, let them enter it solo instead of using the *group* finder.

This rude, selfish “I-want-my-reward-right-now-so-tough-for-you” behavior in group dungeons must stop!

Nobody is griefing. It's somebody looking to do a random normal for 10 transmutes. They are as DPS so they already sat for at least 30 minutes probably. They don't want to, and shouldn't have to wait for the other people or one person to sit and read all the quest text.

You do NOT have to even be reading the quests in some dungeons and just clicking skip real quick and still miss it. They absolutely should wait a few seconds for that. When you join a team, yours cease to be the only needs that matter. It's basic human decency.

Questers should form premades to listen to the quests but should be given a few seconds to get through unskippable dialgoue.

WiseSky

I used to RP in dungeons and listen to all the dialogue and let the team run ahead.

Was fun until I got kicked.

Now every first Time I do a Dungeon I solo it at my own pace

DrSlaughtr

If you're doing the actual quest and you tell the group in chat, most players are respectful and don't prevent you from doing it, in my experience. If they ignore you and keep running, then they're being jerks. But most aren't like that.

On the flip side, there are some players who want to read every bookcase, check every nook and cranny for trash loot, attack mobs that aren't in the actual path of the dungeon for no reason, etc. That can also be frustrating.

_adhyffbjjjf12

TheEndBringer wrote: »

If you're doing the actual quest and you tell the group in chat, most players are respectful and don't prevent you from doing it, in my experience. If they ignore you and keep running, then they're being jerks. But most aren't like that.

On the flip side, there are some players who want to read every bookcase, check every nook and cranny for trash loot, attack mobs that aren't in the actual path of the dungeon for no reason, etc. That can also be frustrating.

this is what i see as well, if anyone asks then almost every group i've seen slow down so its not really an issue, ESO culture is generally pretty mature - but you have to speak up, people are not mind readers.

To opening poster as well, next year you will probably be 50% faster than this year, same the year after as you gear up - will you slow yourself down by 100% to compensate? its not a malicious behaviour , its simple progression in mature mmorpg.

Amottica

Xebov wrote: »

Amottica wrote: »

The solution Zenimax should have implemented is one that requires all players to be at the boss before the encounter can start. Ofc, this also means no porting of anyone that is left behind as it would allow those who are doing the quest, or just plain do not want to run past the mobs, to go at a normal pace. I have seen this done in other games and it works well.

Because having to wait for little joe that loots every box he can find and is 3 rooms behind you is a nice thing.

@Xebov

There is a vote-to-kick option to handle this situation and is easy to perform. It is much more difficult to do a vote to kick when in combat. So this is not a big deal yet the person who gets their quest messed up is.

Xebov

Amottica wrote: »

Xebov wrote: »

Amottica wrote: »

The solution Zenimax should have implemented is one that requires all players to be at the boss before the encounter can start. Ofc, this also means no porting of anyone that is left behind as it would allow those who are doing the quest, or just plain do not want to run past the mobs, to go at a normal pace. I have seen this done in other games and it works well.

Because having to wait for little joe that loots every box he can find and is 3 rooms behind you is a nice thing.

@Xebov

There is a vote-to-kick option to handle this situation and is easy to perform. It is much more difficult to do a vote to kick when in combat. So this is not a big deal yet the person who gets their quest messed up is.

Then they simply try it again. Its not the end of the world.

I run dungeons very frequently. I cannot recall any situation in the past months where the situations laid out in this thread happened.

Amottica

Xebov wrote: »

Amottica wrote: »

Xebov wrote: »

Amottica wrote: »

The solution Zenimax should have implemented is one that requires all players to be at the boss before the encounter can start. Ofc, this also means no porting of anyone that is left behind as it would allow those who are doing the quest, or just plain do not want to run past the mobs, to go at a normal pace. I have seen this done in other games and it works well.

Because having to wait for little joe that loots every box he can find and is 3 rooms behind you is a nice thing.

@Xebov

There is a vote-to-kick option to handle this situation and is easy to perform. It is much more difficult to do a vote to kick when in combat. So this is not a big deal yet the person who gets their quest messed up is.

Then they simply try it again. Its not the end of the world.

I run dungeons very frequently. I cannot recall any situation in the past months where the situations laid out in this thread happened.

I have, though it is not common. It is where the example you edited out came from. We ended up being able to vote and kicked the speedrunner and their whispers in response were entertaining to say the least (our party member did not reply). so they got what they deserved. So you are right, they can simply try again.

I am someone that feels we should all have some general respect for each other when in random groups. That speed runner shows a willful disregard for the rest of the group and the person who is looting every container, especially when the group is going at a normal pace, clearly only cares about themselves and does not respect others. It goes both ways equally, both respect and disrespet.

Xebov

Amottica wrote: »

Xebov wrote: »

Amottica wrote: »

Xebov wrote: »

Amottica wrote: »

The solution Zenimax should have implemented is one that requires all players to be at the boss before the encounter can start. Ofc, this also means no porting of anyone that is left behind as it would allow those who are doing the quest, or just plain do not want to run past the mobs, to go at a normal pace. I have seen this done in other games and it works well.

Because having to wait for little joe that loots every box he can find and is 3 rooms behind you is a nice thing.

@Xebov

There is a vote-to-kick option to handle this situation and is easy to perform. It is much more difficult to do a vote to kick when in combat. So this is not a big deal yet the person who gets their quest messed up is.

Then they simply try it again. Its not the end of the world.

I run dungeons very frequently. I cannot recall any situation in the past months where the situations laid out in this thread happened.

I have, though it is not common. It is where the example you edited out came from. We ended up being able to vote and kicked the speedrunner and their whispers in response were entertaining to say the least (our party member did not reply). so they got what they deserved. So you are right, they can simply try again.

I am someone that feels we should all have some general respect for each other when in random groups. That speed runner shows a willful disregard for the rest of the group and the person who is looting every container, especially when the group is going at a normal pace, clearly only cares about themselves and does not respect others. It goes both ways equally, both respect and disrespet.

Of course it goes both ways and respect is importent, but i see it very often that players dont bother to announce that they want to do the quest or that they stay behind 3 rooms because they want to loot every wooden box they find. Today i had a guy nearly viping the group because he pulled together whole rooms in his search for chests. But realistically these issues are rarely occuring. I run alot of dungeons, especially since the last patch and as a tank iam the slowest player in terms of movement speed and i never had an issue in keeping up and i never saw someone fail on their quest except for cases where they messed up talking to npcs themselves.

_adhyffbjjjf12

Amottica wrote: »

Xebov wrote: »

Amottica wrote: »

Xebov wrote: »

Amottica wrote: »

The solution Zenimax should have implemented is one that requires all players to be at the boss before the encounter can start. Ofc, this also means no porting of anyone that is left behind as it would allow those who are doing the quest, or just plain do not want to run past the mobs, to go at a normal pace. I have seen this done in other games and it works well.

Because having to wait for little joe that loots every box he can find and is 3 rooms behind you is a nice thing.

@Xebov

There is a vote-to-kick option to handle this situation and is easy to perform. It is much more difficult to do a vote to kick when in combat. So this is not a big deal yet the person who gets their quest messed up is.

Then they simply try it again. Its not the end of the world.

I run dungeons very frequently. I cannot recall any situation in the past months where the situations laid out in this thread happened.

I have, though it is not common. It is where the example you edited out came from. We ended up being able to vote and kicked the speedrunner and their whispers in response were entertaining to say the least (our party member did not reply). so they got what they deserved. So you are right, they can simply try again.

I am someone that feels we should all have some general respect for each other when in random groups. That speed runner shows a willful disregard for the rest of the group and the person who is looting every container, especially when the group is going at a normal pace, clearly only cares about themselves and does not respect others. It goes both ways equally, both respect and disrespet.

before you kicked him, did you ask him to slow down?

Avoranti

Speed runners and fake roles are something I really hate in this game. I find speed running to be selfish and fake roles to teach bad habits. Nothing like a new player who learned to queue as a fake role become confused, frustrated or even angry because they got kicked from a vet dlc for doing the same thing.

But the real problem here is the reward. Transmute crystals. Having random normal dungeons give 10 per character per day has created this toxicity. The fake role situation has contributed to it.

The fake role thing is also the result of a bad queue system. On PlayStation, queueing as a tank or healer almost always gets you in quickly while queueing as a DD can sometimes take up to 2 hours for a pick up. So as a result, a lot of DD’s swap roles so they aren’t waiting for hours to get in.

The solution? Perhaps not awarding 10 transmutes for a random normal. Award them for a random vet and I bet a lot of the speed running and fake roles will probably go away.
In addition, maybe penalize players for swapping roles by also forcing them to reallocate attributes, CP and skill points every time they swap roles. And lastly, make improvements to the queue system so that it doesn’t take 2 hours for a DD to get a pick up.

_adhyffbjjjf12

Avoranti wrote: »

Speed runners and fake roles are something I really hate in this game. I find speed running to be selfish and fake roles to teach bad habits. Nothing like a new player who learned to queue as a fake role become confused, frustrated or even angry because they got kicked from a vet dlc for doing the same thing.

But the real problem here is the reward. Transmute crystals. Having random normal dungeons give 10 per character per day has created this toxicity. The fake role situation has contributed to it.

The fake role thing is also the result of a bad queue system. On PlayStation, queueing as a tank or healer almost always gets you in quickly while queueing as a DD can sometimes take up to 2 hours for a pick up. So as a result, a lot of DD’s swap roles so they aren’t waiting for hours to get in.

The solution? Perhaps not awarding 10 transmutes for a random normal. Award them for a random vet and I bet a lot of the speed running and fake roles will probably go away.
In addition, maybe penalize players for swapping roles by also forcing them to reallocate attributes, CP and skill points every time they swap roles. And lastly, make improvements to the queue system so that it doesn’t take 2 hours for a DD to get a pick up.

What the reward does is attract vets to play, you would be queuing for much much longer without it. speed running is only toxic if the group asks them to slow down and they don't and equally when people join a group that is speeding and don't ask for the group to wait, but then complains afterwords, or say nothing then vote to kick etc. The solution is that people have manners and speak to each other. As others have said, i've rarely seen issues with speed running where people have asked/communicated so i'm not sure how real the problem is. Put it this way, eventually all slow players speed up once they have done a dungeon many times, that doesn't make them toxic.

newtinmpls

EF321 wrote: »

You don't do story runs with randoms.

What does this have to do with a jerk running ahead and messing up my undaunted run?

I'm NOT doing a story run.
I'm NOT looting every container.

I just want to do the bosses, get the drops and especially any fancy drop that only happens on the last boss - like - say - the undaunted credit

Pevey

With the loot system and transmutes, the game actively encourages you to run a dungeon not one time, not ten times, but hundreds of times. Of course after running a dungeon so many times, any person would tend toward running it faster and faster. This is just natural.

The number of players who are relatively new to a dungeon and may be trying to get a skill point and not as confident in where to go is much much smaller than the number who are getting their daily dungeon or pledges done.

These repeatable dungeon quests are designed to keep up interest in dungeons so that those experience players will participate. Otherwise, if you had to queue just with people who want to do the dungeon quest, it would take soooo long, longer than the average play session.

Don’t hate these experienced players, these fast dungeoneers. They are the only reason group finder is effective at all. Your alternative is always to find a different group.

Even though I generally expect people to act in their own interest and don’t assume they will put themselves out for me (because assuming that would be inconsiderate, in my opinion), I am often surprised in this game how helpful some people will be. Yesterday I was on a newish room that I had gotten to 50 and was leveling undaunted skill line on. Was doing vet wayrest pledge, and the group was rocking it, going super fast. I asked in chat if we could please do the side boss (so that I could get the vet completion achievement to help power level undaunted). I didn’t expect a yes only because of what I said above. It’s rude to have an expectation that other people will inconvenience themselves for you. But as soon as I asked, everyone headed that way and melted the side boss. I was grateful.

My general group finder experience in this game is not like so many forum posts describe at all. If you are starting to think that every single other person is antisocial, maybe the issue is not with everyone else but with yourself.

Amottica

_adhyffbjjjf12 wrote: »

Amottica wrote: »

Xebov wrote: »

Amottica wrote: »

Xebov wrote: »

Amottica wrote: »

The solution Zenimax should have implemented is one that requires all players to be at the boss before the encounter can start. Ofc, this also means no porting of anyone that is left behind as it would allow those who are doing the quest, or just plain do not want to run past the mobs, to go at a normal pace. I have seen this done in other games and it works well.

Because having to wait for little joe that loots every box he can find and is 3 rooms behind you is a nice thing.

@Xebov

There is a vote-to-kick option to handle this situation and is easy to perform. It is much more difficult to do a vote to kick when in combat. So this is not a big deal yet the person who gets their quest messed up is.

Then they simply try it again. Its not the end of the world.

I run dungeons very frequently. I cannot recall any situation in the past months where the situations laid out in this thread happened.

I have, though it is not common. It is where the example you edited out came from. We ended up being able to vote and kicked the speedrunner and their whispers in response were entertaining to say the least (our party member did not reply). so they got what they deserved. So you are right, they can simply try again.

I am someone that feels we should all have some general respect for each other when in random groups. That speed runner shows a willful disregard for the rest of the group and the person who is looting every container, especially when the group is going at a normal pace, clearly only cares about themselves and does not respect others. It goes both ways equally, both respect and disrespet.

before you kicked him, did you ask him to slow down?

@_adhyffbjjjf12

Yes and my post that started this conversation clearly stated they were asked to stop so the quest could be picked up. You didn’t see that in what you quoted because the person who originally replied to it edited it out.

I don’t consider someone disrespectful and worthy of being kicked to the curb because they cannot read minds. However, we do kick people who want to do their own thing and disregard the group or if they act like a jerk. It’s the nice thing of not running solo. We don’t have to put up with jerks.

_adhyffbjjjf12

2

Amottica wrote: »

_adhyffbjjjf12 wrote: »

Amottica wrote: »

Xebov wrote: »

Amottica wrote: »

Xebov wrote: »

Amottica wrote: »

The solution Zenimax should have implemented is one that requires all players to be at the boss before the encounter can start. Ofc, this also means no porting of anyone that is left behind as it would allow those who are doing the quest, or just plain do not want to run past the mobs, to go at a normal pace. I have seen this done in other games and it works well.

Because having to wait for little joe that loots every box he can find and is 3 rooms behind you is a nice thing.

@Xebov

There is a vote-to-kick option to handle this situation and is easy to perform. It is much more difficult to do a vote to kick when in combat. So this is not a big deal yet the person who gets their quest messed up is.

Then they simply try it again. Its not the end of the world.

I run dungeons very frequently. I cannot recall any situation in the past months where the situations laid out in this thread happened.

I have, though it is not common. It is where the example you edited out came from. We ended up being able to vote and kicked the speedrunner and their whispers in response were entertaining to say the least (our party member did not reply). so they got what they deserved. So you are right, they can simply try again.

I am someone that feels we should all have some general respect for each other when in random groups. That speed runner shows a willful disregard for the rest of the group and the person who is looting every container, especially when the group is going at a normal pace, clearly only cares about themselves and does not respect others. It goes both ways equally, both respect and disrespet.

before you kicked him, did you ask him to slow down?

@_adhyffbjjjf12

Yes and my post that started this conversation clearly stated they were asked to stop so the quest could be picked up. You didn’t see that in what you quoted because the person who originally replied to it edited it out.

I don’t consider someone disrespectful and worthy of being kicked to the curb because they cannot read minds. However, we do kick people who want to do their own thing and disregard the group or if they act like a jerk. It’s the nice thing of not running solo. We don’t have to put up with jerks.

I totally agree, speed/slow/avg running is not toxic on its own, but either ignoring the team or not communicating then being toxic later because the group are not mind readers is toxic.

shadyjane62

I was subjected to bad behavior by a fellow player during a dungeon the first year of WoW. Have not dungeon since in the last 17 years.

Would very much like an alternative story dungeon as I don't care about loot, just want to see the story progression.

Left WoW because by Legion I had no connection to the game story.

Decided instead just eliminate that part of the game for me.

Dungeons would be great if only you didn't have to do them with other people.

KhajiitLivesMatter

shadyjane62 wrote: »

I was subjected to bad behavior by a fellow player during a dungeon the first year of WoW. Have not dungeon since in the last 17 years.

Would very much like an alternative story dungeon as I don't care about loot, just want to see the story progression.

Left WoW because by Legion I had no connection to the game story.

Decided instead just eliminate that part of the game for me.

Dungeons would be great if only you didn't have to do them with other people.

you dont? on normal u can solo 90% of all dungoens

KhajiitLivesMatter

newtinmpls wrote: »

EF321 wrote: »

You don't do story runs with randoms.

What does this have to do with a jerk running ahead and messing up my undaunted run?

I'm NOT doing a story run.
I'm NOT looting every container.

I just want to do the bosses, get the drops and especially any fancy drop that only happens on the last boss - like - say - the undaunted credit

u get portet to most bosses / if u dont maybe dont sneak role play to the boss - even the best play will need ATLEAST 30sec to kill a boss if u need 30sec more for walking a cleared path thats not the fault of the other players its yours

KhajiitLivesMatter

Avoranti wrote: »

Speed runners and fake roles are something I really hate in this game. I find speed running to be selfish and fake roles to teach bad habits. Nothing like a new player who learned to queue as a fake role become confused, frustrated or even angry because they got kicked from a vet dlc for doing the same thing.

But the real problem here is the reward. Transmute crystals. Having random normal dungeons give 10 per character per day has created this toxicity. The fake role situation has contributed to it.

The fake role thing is also the result of a bad queue system. On PlayStation, queueing as a tank or healer almost always gets you in quickly while queueing as a DD can sometimes take up to 2 hours for a pick up. So as a result, a lot of DD’s swap roles so they aren’t waiting for hours to get in.

The solution? Perhaps not awarding 10 transmutes for a random normal. Award them for a random vet and I bet a lot of the speed running and fake roles will probably go away.
In addition, maybe penalize players for swapping roles by also forcing them to reallocate attributes, CP and skill points every time they swap roles. And lastly, make improvements to the queue system so that it doesn’t take 2 hours for a DD to get a pick up.

take 2 hours for a DD to get a pick up.
how? get more players to play tank/ healer !
whats the oposite of more tank / healers ? = removing fake roles -> if no one fakes and dds already wait 2h than after that it will be 6h


In addition, maybe penalize players for swapping roles
yea than i go to the new fancy armory system and fixed in less than 10sec
and btw u dont need to switch role all the time my dds are flagged as tanks /healers for years

moleculardrugs

KhajiitLivesMatter wrote: »

Avoranti wrote: »

Speed runners and fake roles are something I really hate in this game. I find speed running to be selfish and fake roles to teach bad habits. Nothing like a new player who learned to queue as a fake role become confused, frustrated or even angry because they got kicked from a vet dlc for doing the same thing.

But the real problem here is the reward. Transmute crystals. Having random normal dungeons give 10 per character per day has created this toxicity. The fake role situation has contributed to it.

The fake role thing is also the result of a bad queue system. On PlayStation, queueing as a tank or healer almost always gets you in quickly while queueing as a DD can sometimes take up to 2 hours for a pick up. So as a result, a lot of DD’s swap roles so they aren’t waiting for hours to get in.

The solution? Perhaps not awarding 10 transmutes for a random normal. Award them for a random vet and I bet a lot of the speed running and fake roles will probably go away.
In addition, maybe penalize players for swapping roles by also forcing them to reallocate attributes, CP and skill points every time they swap roles. And lastly, make improvements to the queue system so that it doesn’t take 2 hours for a DD to get a pick up.

take 2 hours for a DD to get a pick up.
how? get more players to play tank/ healer !
whats the oposite of more tank / healers ? = removing fake roles -> if no one fakes and dds already wait 2h than after that it will be 6h


In addition, maybe penalize players for swapping roles
yea than i go to the new fancy armory system and fixed in less than 10sec
and btw u dont need to switch role all the time my dds are flagged as tanks /healers for years

Because dungeon queueing was so slow, I just do mostly healer or tank roles now in the nRDs. I sometimes put out more DPS than our actual DPS's too. I think everyone should have some skills put into their skillbar that would help the team as a whole, even if it wasn't specific to their actual role. Like a stamDPS using caltrops to help the tank.