Why PvErs don't like IC

RandomKodiak

ZoS needs to improve drop rates for things like leads and loot from bosses there. I don't lose much gold and don't care about the Telvar but after 20 bosses no leads barely any loot it gets old. PvErs for the most part only go there when they have to with the understanding that they are going to get killed. The old battle cry from PvPers of "I have to PvE so shut up." does not hold water though for one reason, PvErs can't stop you from getting your dungeon loot with friends or Trials for that matter. PvErs going into IC have to deal with both range AND PvPers killing them. If they would up the drop rate in IC it might be worth going there but with the same crappy range and getting ganked every 5 seconds while trying to get loot, is why I can't and I'm sure others be bothered. Plus for all the sweaties about to respond "Git Gud", which requires millions in gold worth of more sets for a play style I hate, would you really hate it if you could get your loot faster in your favorite play style?

MrBrownstone

How many leads are there in IC at all anyway? I only know about the Malacath Ring, which is a PvP item.

Tandor

The reason a lot of PvEers don't like IC is because the PvE content is locked behind PvP, a mistake ZOS have said they won't make again. Many simply won't go there, regardless of the potential rewards for doing so.

RandomKodiak

Ring of Fete has one, Chest piece has one, the new helm, I think one other. I am not a completionist but know there are many out there. Was just pointing out the biggest issue with the difference in tickets and rewards when placed PvE or PvP, IC specifically. It is the fact you are fighting range and players, as opposed to when PvPers do dungeons for loot or are shuffled into overland for tickets, which can be done virtually naked by anyone.

RandomKodiak

Tandor wrote: »

The reason a lot of PvEers don't like IC is because the PvE content is locked behind PvP, a mistake ZOS have said they won't make again. Many simply won't go there, regardless of the potential rewards for doing so.

Yes but then they keep putting tickets and leads in there anyway.

FluffWit

4 leads I think- one furnishing and 3 gear pieces.

What lead are you trying to get Kodiak?

lillybit

MrBrownstone wrote: »

How many leads are there in IC at all anyway? I only know about the Malacath Ring, which is a PvP item.

There's at least 3, 2 from patrolling horrs and another from sewer bosses. Can't remember off hand what the are but I'm sure someone will!

I don't mind having to go places for dailies when there's an event on, but forcing everyone to IC three times a year is a bit much. I hate that place so much! It's literally the only thing in the game I avoid unless I have absolutely no choice and definitely will not go there during an event. If I can face it, I'll do the dailies on a few characters before it starts to hand in once a day for tickets but even that's a struggle.

How long has it been since the last Wrothgar event before today (been waiting for one to farm perfected weapons)? But they make us go to IC three times a year.

MirandaSharp

PVE players don't like getting ganked when trying to solo some boss...

MrBrownstone

MirandaSharp wrote: »

PVE players don't like getting ganked when trying to solo some boss...

Because it's not the place to solo a boss.

Celephantsylvius_Bornasfinmo

Because it's the same old..year in...year out.

I'm a Pvper (a lot of hours, but on break since..well..nothing has changed).

IC has those long loading screens, doors everywhere and it's well...kinda boring.

MrBrownstone

Tandor wrote: »

The reason a lot of PvEers don't like IC is because the PvE content is locked behind PvP, a mistake ZOS have said they won't make again. Many simply won't go there, regardless of the potential rewards for doing so.

It's not PvE content locked behind PvP. Just because it's a PvP enabled zone that doesn't mean there shouldn't be anything else other than players. Even resource nodes would be enough for you to call it "PvE content" apparently... I like when there are also quests and mobs around when I'm playing PvP so you calling that content "PvE locked behind PvP" is just nonsense. It's not PvE content if it's in a PvP zone. Killing mobs reward gold, telvar and xp, those are NOT things that only PvE players need.

Lady_Galadhiel

Lot of PvP players dont like IC either,not only the PvE'ers.

VaranisArano

If anyone wanders onto this thread looking for the "Git Gud" without much sweatiness, here's some beginner tips for doing the Imperial City Daily(s) as a non-PVPer:

https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/584661/imperial-city-101-for-non-pvpers-an-event-guide

If you just want to farm rewards as a non-PVPer, I'd recommend seeing if one of your guilds wants to run a farming session. Alternatively, see if there's a farming group in IC when you get there. Strength in numbers is a great way to compensate for lack of gear and PVP reflexes, as long as you realize that even PVPers die a bunch in IC. Bring detect potions, bank your Tel Var before you go out into the Districts, and good luck farming!

molecule

MrBrownstone wrote: »

, but forcing everyone to IC three times a year is a bit much.

1 ) No-one is ' forcing' you - your game wont uninstall if you dont go there.

2 ) 3 whole times a year - is that really too much ?

Vevvev

Lady_Galadhiel wrote: »

Lot of PvP players dont like IC either,not only the PvE'ers.

^ This

Open world + tight spaces + powerful PvE foes = An unenjoyable time for everyone.

There is a reason the survival and farming tactics in the Imperial city are very selfish and stealth oriented. Going with a group splits the Tel'Var rewards evenly among all the people that fought the opponent, which means if you're going in a group it'll end up being a slower farm than going solo. Going solo gives you a higher chance of the rewards, but without numbers on your side you need speed and stealth should you encounter enemy combatants. Sure you could try a brawler or tank approach but how long till you get overwhelmed? Is the risk of staying and fighting worth it when you lose 50% of your Tel'Var currency?

The zone has too many gotchas in it for both PvP and PvE people to be fun and enjoyable for most.

VaranisArano

molecule wrote: »

MrBrownstone wrote: »

, but forcing everyone to IC three times a year is a bit much.

1 ) No-one is ' forcing' you - your game wont uninstall if you dont go there.

2 ) 3 whole times a year - is that really too much ?

So, I'm a PVPer, just for context.

Yeah, doing the same Imperial City District Dailies three times a year is too many.

Here's why:

- Midyear Mayhem 2019 handed out event tickets for any PvPvE daily quest in Cyrodiil and Battlegrounds. MYM in Jan 2020 handed out three event tickets for any PvPvE daily quest in Cyrodiil, Battlegrounds, and the Imperial City. This business of "Thou must do an Imperial City Daily if thou desires tickets" is something ZOS has chosen to do. It's not how MYM was originally implemented. There's no reason ZOS couldn't give us tickets for doing just one daily.

- Past Imperial City Events gave tickets for completing White Gold Tower or Imperial City Prison. That's right - players used to have a PVE-only, completely safe option to get tickets. Again, "Thou must do an Imperial City Daily for tickets" is a choice ZOS has made.

- It's the only daily we have to do three times this year for event tickets. Sorry, ZOS, but the IC dailies aren't that good. One of them literally involves sitting on your spawn tower and taking potshots at nearby daedra. Thrilling gameplay.

- It's extremely limited compared to similar options for non-PVPers. In Cyrodiil, you've got a lot of options for how to do a daily quest. I'm a PVPer, so I usually do one of the kill X players quests. Meanwhile a non-PVPer can pick from scouting missions or five towns worth of dailies. In Imperial City, you have 6 dailies to choose from.


The result is that we've done the same six dailies three times this year for no reason other than that ZOS really, really wants players to do the Imperial City District Dailies.

And as a PVPer who prefers Cyrodiil, it sucks.

Deep_01

I do every content in-game and I enjoy imperial city. Don't expect to gain always and never lose. Its the only place in-game where you can lose a lot, win sometimes and win big if you are lucky/smart/experienced.

Franchise408

Your attempt to jump has failed

rpa

I don't mind being killed but in my limited pve character experience IC is just so boring. Its boring when my (whatever characters) faction horde stomps other faction strays, boring when other faction horde stomps me and even more boring out of event when there is nobody but me, daedra and one ganker to remind why one should not bother.

Chips_Ahoy

I just don't like pvp.

there must be some philosophical reason behind it?

I've never felt the need to force myself to do something I don't like in the game, everything is optional, ZOS does not force anyone to do something they do not want, that is in your ocd mind.

Agenericname

VaranisArano wrote: »

molecule wrote: »

MrBrownstone wrote: »

, but forcing everyone to IC three times a year is a bit much.

1 ) No-one is ' forcing' you - your game wont uninstall if you dont go there.

2 ) 3 whole times a year - is that really too much ?

So, I'm a PVPer, just for context.

Yeah, doing the same Imperial City District Dailies three times a year is too many.

Here's why:

- Midyear Mayhem 2019 handed out event tickets for any PvPvE daily quest in Cyrodiil and Battlegrounds. MYM in Jan 2020 handed out three event tickets for any PvPvE daily quest in Cyrodiil, Battlegrounds, and the Imperial City. This business of "Thou must do an Imperial City Daily if thou desires tickets" is something ZOS has chosen to do. It's not how MYM was originally implemented. There's no reason ZOS couldn't give us tickets for doing just one daily.

- Past Imperial City Events gave tickets for completing White Gold Tower or Imperial City Prison. That's right - players used to have a PVE-only, completely safe option to get tickets. Again, "Thou must do an Imperial City Daily for tickets" is a choice ZOS has made.

- It's the only daily we have to do three times this year for event tickets. Sorry, ZOS, but the IC dailies aren't that good. One of them literally involves sitting on your spawn tower and taking potshots at nearby daedra. Thrilling gameplay.

- It's extremely limited compared to similar options for non-PVPers. In Cyrodiil, you've got a lot of options for how to do a daily quest. I'm a PVPer, so I usually do one of the kill X players quests. Meanwhile a non-PVPer can pick from scouting missions or five towns worth of dailies. In Imperial City, you have 6 dailies to choose from.


The result is that we've done the same six dailies three times this year for no reason other than that ZOS really, really wants players to do the Imperial City District Dailies.

And as a PVPer who prefers Cyrodiil, it sucks.

Im not surprised that the dungeons arent there this time. I havent been in a while, but last I remember Molag Kena could glitch and become invulnerable and the fall damage from the portal hadnt been fixed.

I suppose they could tie tickets to bosses, or maybe taking a district, but there isnt a lot of content to draw from in the IC.

Ryath_Waylander

Blanket generalisations are so boring OP. Try using the word "I" in that thread title?

VaranisArano

Agenericname wrote: »

VaranisArano wrote: »

molecule wrote: »

MrBrownstone wrote: »

, but forcing everyone to IC three times a year is a bit much.

1 ) No-one is ' forcing' you - your game wont uninstall if you dont go there.

2 ) 3 whole times a year - is that really too much ?

So, I'm a PVPer, just for context.

Yeah, doing the same Imperial City District Dailies three times a year is too many.

Here's why:

- Midyear Mayhem 2019 handed out event tickets for any PvPvE daily quest in Cyrodiil and Battlegrounds. MYM in Jan 2020 handed out three event tickets for any PvPvE daily quest in Cyrodiil, Battlegrounds, and the Imperial City. This business of "Thou must do an Imperial City Daily if thou desires tickets" is something ZOS has chosen to do. It's not how MYM was originally implemented. There's no reason ZOS couldn't give us tickets for doing just one daily.

- Past Imperial City Events gave tickets for completing White Gold Tower or Imperial City Prison. That's right - players used to have a PVE-only, completely safe option to get tickets. Again, "Thou must do an Imperial City Daily for tickets" is a choice ZOS has made.

- It's the only daily we have to do three times this year for event tickets. Sorry, ZOS, but the IC dailies aren't that good. One of them literally involves sitting on your spawn tower and taking potshots at nearby daedra. Thrilling gameplay.

- It's extremely limited compared to similar options for non-PVPers. In Cyrodiil, you've got a lot of options for how to do a daily quest. I'm a PVPer, so I usually do one of the kill X players quests. Meanwhile a non-PVPer can pick from scouting missions or five towns worth of dailies. In Imperial City, you have 6 dailies to choose from.


The result is that we've done the same six dailies three times this year for no reason other than that ZOS really, really wants players to do the Imperial City District Dailies.

And as a PVPer who prefers Cyrodiil, it sucks.

Im not surprised that the dungeons arent there this time. I havent been in a while, but last I remember Molag Kena could glitch and become invulnerable and the fall damage from the portal hadnt been fixed.

I suppose they could tie tickets to bosses, or maybe taking a district, but there isnt a lot of content to draw from in the IC.

That's a good point.

I'm annoyed on behalf of the PVE-only players that they don't get a safe option this year...but I can see where it'd be a disaster if the "safe" options are bugged to the point of breaking.

Wonder if ZOS will fix them in time for the Undaunted Festival?

danno8

Franchise408 wrote: »

Your attempt to jump has failed

I got that a lot today.

Also, I passed by about 5 DC while doing the daily. They didn't attack me, I didn't attack them. Everyone wins.

Oh, I do PvP but haven't in the last year or so with any regularity because it's pretty terrible.

SeaGtGruff

I'm a PvEr and I like the Imperial City. I mean, it certainly isn't my favorite zone, but I definitely don't hate it, and I sometimes go there to do the district dailies or run around the sewers outside of these events.

If you want my honest opinion, the biggest problem with the Imperial City is that the dailies are too monotonous. And that's a problem that some of the other zones have, as well.

In some zones a particular quest-giver will cycle through several different quests, usually 1 quest per day, so you can go back the next day and you won't have to repeat the same exact quest as the day before.

But in zones like the Imperial City and Craglorn, a particular quest-giver will always offer the exact same quest every single day, such that after a certain number of days of doing the same quests over and over, you begin to lose interest.

Even in zones where there are a smaller number of delves and world bosses, it helps break up the monotony a bit when the quest-givers keep sending you back to the same delves and world bosses but with a slightly different goal each time, such as was done in Southern Elsweyr. This is especially true if the different goals require you to go to different locations in a delve.

If the Imperial City dailies could be varied from day to day, I think it would help make the zone more interesting to go back to from day to day. If they can't add more dailies in each district, even something as simple as limiting it to just one district per day, with a quest-giver in the sewer base who tells you which district you need to do today's daily in, then you go there and get the details of the quest from the existing quest-givers, might help to keep things more interesting, since it would take 6 days to go through the complete cycle of dailies. And maybe they could add another quest-giver in the sewer base who asks you to go to a different district and kill the patrolling boss there.

Anyway, better RNG would be nice, and more desirable rewards would be great, but in my opinion there needs to be a bit more variety from day to day or things tend to get stale pretty fast.

SaintSubwayy

Tandor wrote: »

The reason a lot of PvEers don't like IC is because the PvE content is locked behind PvP, a mistake ZOS have said they won't make again. Many simply won't go there, regardless of the potential rewards for doing so.

A problem which could be fixed, by adding a ne IC no PVP Campain / or a Zone which is normally accessable by wayshrines, with massivly lowered Telvar rewards and all the quests in there aswell.

or lower the Telvar loss in IC to something like 10-15% upon death....but 50% is still to high.

MirandaSharp

MrBrownstone wrote: »

MirandaSharp wrote: »

PVE players don't like getting ganked when trying to solo some boss...

Because it's not the place to solo a boss.

Yeah, we get the message and stay out(unless there's some event going on)..

moo_2021

The entire city above surface is like an abandoned wasteland most of time.

A populated warzone would feel much safer, being able to see other players and boundary between alliances.

An abandoned one means whenever I turn a corner I may die from stealth attack. It's rather exhausting unless the goal is to cloak and pick easy players, no quest, no flag capture.

Sometimes I can find a few others to group, but at times it's completely empty while all districts are owned by one alliance (probably the same guild). It becomes impossible to do anything.

FlopsyPrince

Gankers should get much lower rewards.

That would help a whole lot except for those who love to get easy kills whatever the reward. But benefitted for camping out near a catapult is more than a bit ridiculous.

FlopsyPrince

SaintSubwayy wrote: »

Tandor wrote: »

The reason a lot of PvEers don't like IC is because the PvE content is locked behind PvP, a mistake ZOS have said they won't make again. Many simply won't go there, regardless of the potential rewards for doing so.

A problem which could be fixed, by adding a ne IC no PVP Campain / or a Zone which is normally accessable by wayshrines, with massivly lowered Telvar rewards and all the quests in there aswell.

or lower the Telvar loss in IC to something like 10-15% upon death....but 50% is still to high.

I agree. Too many rewards for simply camping a quest area (such as a catapult) and then getting telvar killing those who are just running the quest. Making that "easy telvar" goes against the idea of having good gameplay.

moo_2021

It wouldn't be a problem if there is a healthy population in IC, like over 100 on surface for each alliance, rather than 10-2-0.