2740 CP to get all the PVP/Combat related passives???

relentless_turnip

the1andonlyskwex wrote: »

relentless_turnip wrote: »

Apologies guys I was totally wrong about how many points you will need to be at full power.

What I have realised is you really don't need to unlock everything and am actually more excited than before. In terms of build craft this amazing for variety. For pve end gamers I can see this as a little more frustrating.

I can't wait to try this!

Oh yeah, the build diversity will be great, because almost nobody will have enough CP to run meta builds, and will resign themselves to getting stomped by the few that do.

Have you actually seen the numbers... What cp gives you isn't the same as it is on live. Most of our power is now earned levelling 1-50, cp just augments build choices.

The difference in power between 1000cp and 1500cp will be negligible imo. Above cp 1500 the population gets seriously thin. Noone will be forming groups with extreme prejudice. Dummies are bugged and so are some of the stats in the cp tree. I would guess DPS at cp 1000 on the PTS will be similar to live once the bugs have been fixed. There may be a small reduction in power, but I also think that is justified.

BalticBlues

James-Wayne wrote: »

As someone who is on 1800CP I'm loving this new system, I put the time in so I should be stronger then players at 900CP.

Do not be surprised then when you soon have to play in Cyro alone by yourself.

If PvP beginners will be butchered by long-time players due to CP 2.0,
there soon will be no PvP beginners anymore. Cyro will die out then.

Good games like FIFA or OVERWATCH are played in e-sports
because they are won by skill.

Bad games like ESO PvP is going to become with CP 2.0
will never ever play a role in e-sports and be left empty one day.

Did I say how much I love ESO BG's with NO SKILLPOINTS?
This is how ESO PvP should be everywhere. Fair and square.

ESO PvE Overland and so questing all regular content also sucks with CP.
Can we players please win by skill in this game and not by CPs?

techyeshic

BalticBlues wrote: »

James-Wayne wrote: »

As someone who is on 1800CP I'm loving this new system, I put the time in so I should be stronger then players at 900CP.

Do not be surprised then when you soon have to play in Cyro alone by yourself.

If PvP beginners will be butchered by long-time players due to CP 2.0,
there soon will be no PvP beginners anymore. Cyro will die out then.

Good games like FIFA or OVERWATCH are played in e-sports
because they are won by skill.

Bad games like ESO PvP is going to become with CP 2.0
will never ever play a role in e-sports and be left empty one day.

Did I say how much I love ESO BG's with NO SKILLPOINTS?
This is how ESO PvP should be everywhere. Fair and square.

ESO PvE Overland and so questing all regular content also sucks with CP.
Can we players please win by skill in this game and not by CPs?

People have the option of no CP pvp so beginners gave an entry point.

No CP is absolutely awful with procs. Bad enough with CP

SodanTok

Env_t wrote: »

@SodanTok but EXP CURVE IS NOT AJUSTED


on PTS you need x4 more EXP per CP after old 810 CP cap, same as on live

so old cap diminishing of exp still there

PTS doesnt matter yet, they havent changed anything related to XP curve there despite confirming plans about changing it

jaws343 wrote: »

SodanTok wrote: »

jaws343 wrote: »

SodanTok wrote: »

Since xp curve will be adjusted any current experience how "hard" it is to get to 1000,1200,...1800...2000 CP is very false. Getting 3600 CP from 0 might very much be as hard as was 1000 from 0. Unlikely but still closer to reality than thinking getting to 2000 CP in new update will be as hard as getting to 2000 now...

I am fairly certain that they said the ease of earning CP would end around 1200, so if you are already post 1200, the CP gain will be the same for you.

I watched the stream I read the article yet I dont remember them confirming getting to 1201 CP (from 1200) next patch will be as hard as now. Care to link me to source?

For the record, current formula for XP needed for each CP is both calculated with cap and with arbitrary penalty for earning CP past the cap. There is no reason to believe the Cap would be 810 or 1200 or any other number than 3600 and EVEN IF there was some cap set, there is no reason to believe any of those numbers below 3600 would retain the penalty.

If formula remains the same and cap is raised to 3600 earning the last CP of 3600 cap would cost as much as last CP of 810 cap. If by some unknown reason they decided that 1200 would be the break point getting the last CP of 3600 cap would still be only as hard as getting 1600th CP point under current 810 cap.

From the Update 29 Combat Preview article.
https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/559230/update-29-combat-preview/p1

Considering we haven’t raised the cap by 30 per patch in quite some time, we adjusted the CP curve to accommodate for that difference with a focus on speeding up the gain between 810 CP and roughly 1200 CP. This means you’ll gain CP levels faster at lower levels, and the rate at which you gain CP between 810 and 1200 (ish) will be slightly faster than how it is now with CP 1.0. After 1200 CP or so, the CP gain rate will feel about the same as it did in CP 1.0 once you reached higher ranks.

So post 1200, CP gain will be exactly as it is now for high CP players. 810-1200 will be faster than now.

Splendid, thank you. That confirms their cap in mind is 1200. Unfortunately it doesnt say anything more so we just have to wait and see. Reasonable guess would be that reaching CP1200 puts big brakes on cp gain like 810 does now but that would make progression 810-1200 way faster than "slightly faster"

Wuuffyy

Oreyn_Bearclaw wrote: »

It seems like a very simple fix to the system would be to not require points to be split evenly among the three constellations. That would allow people to focus on combat trees first if they want to, thus curbing vertical progression at far lower CP threshold but allowing horizontal progression all they way to the cap (which is what I thought they were trying to do in the first place). It seems we have one constellation that has nothing to do with actual combat.

If someone wants to put all their points into the blue constellation, let them. It would reduce the CP requirement for a max level combat character by at least a third, and would likely make a lot of us older players in the low/mid teens of CP much happier. I can get behind needing to grind a few hundred CP to be at peak combat efficiency. But If I need to grind like 1500, I am just not sure I will keep playing. I have been at the caps since there were caps. I had 5 VR16 toons when they made the change, and I was above the CP cap when first implemented. I dont like how far they are moving the goal line at one time.

This. ^^^

Seems like the quickest fix if they still want to push it through this otherwise lackluster patch until they tweak it more.

Maxx7410

Good this way we will have many hr days week months YEARS of fun leveling!

Kittytravel

Oreyn_Bearclaw wrote: »

It seems like a very simple fix to the system would be to not require points to be split evenly among the three constellations. That would allow people to focus on combat trees first if they want to, thus curbing vertical progression at far lower CP threshold but allowing horizontal progression all they way to the cap (which is what I thought they were trying to do in the first place). It seems we have one constellation that has nothing to do with actual combat.

If someone wants to put all their points into the blue constellation, let them. It would reduce the CP requirement for a max level combat character by at least a third, and would likely make a lot of us older players in the low/mid teens of CP much happier. I can get behind needing to grind a few hundred CP to be at peak combat efficiency. But If I need to grind like 1500, I am just not sure I will keep playing. I have been at the caps since there were caps. I had 5 VR16 toons when they made the change, and I was above the CP cap when first implemented. I dont like how far they are moving the goal line at one time.

100% what I wish they would do. Especially for solo-players who spend 99% of their time in Overland they likely don't care a single bit about that extra 1-5% damage; they care more for the Craft tree bonuses because they generate far more revenue if they can double their furnish plan drops or fence for me. I'd much prefer them fully unlocking CP points to any tree especially now that you have to slot major bonuses and are restricted to four of them.

Sorbin

My position on this is simple: I've already put a lot of time into this game to reach endgame status. Even at endgame, I still have to put a lot of time to stay relevant with each patch and each shifting meta, which is exploring the width and breadth of horizontal progression in this game. Just finding the time to grind out Antiquities was hard enough, but it's fine, I could accept that.

But if I have to go from ~1000 CP to 2700 just to be in the ballpark of endgame viability? I simply don't have the time of the inclination to do that, particularly when what that really entails is an absolutely mindless Skyreach grind to do it in any reasonable length of time. I don't mind grinding to get that last bit of power at endgame or to explore a new skill line, but to essentially start from square one again and be sentenced to Skyreach would absolutely be enough for me to finally drop the game and move on. My playtime is already dwindling as it is.

Sahidom

I like the idea to use all my CP; but it also invites all the bot grinding users into the game. Still. Having a system that let's you progress with newly earned CP is better than sitting on a stash unused.

CP PVP with all changes coming in will definitely be different, where people will just shift to no-CP and build around this for PVP.

In the end, the differences in CP levels between players means not everyone will eat their cake with cherries on top. It's fine. It will be hard on those who are use to a mediocrity sysyem thats gives out trophies to everyone.

jonzhao68

Artanisul wrote: »

Olupajmibanan wrote: »

Driving out vet players is a thing that really concerns me. This game is awesome but with this increasing cattering to casuals without any adjustments to vet players, Elder Scrolls Online might soon get reputation of "CASUAL/RPING-ONLY MMO". All these "no sorry, no retroactive changes" like jewelcrafting, arena weapons and now very possibly CPs is just another thing to drive vet players out.

I am 1400 CP, finished all trial hard modes, two trifectas (IR and TTT), Flawless Conqueror on 7 different characters, but if they don't rescale CP I'm out. Competition on MMO market is big and there are plenty of other options that are not casual-only like ESO is becoming. Not even saying that Classic TBC is coming out very soon (very possibly even before new Chapter on ESO).

This MMO does have that rep, in all circles of discussion. ESO is THE casual MMO. That is not just the journalist opinion, and it's not just lately or "becoming casual." It's been called that, because it became that, since One Tamriel.

Actually, that title belongs to Guild Wars 2 thank you very much.

LadyDestiny

Heresyall wrote: »

Olupajmibanan wrote: »

Driving out vet players is a thing that really concerns me. This game is awesome but with this increasing cattering to casuals without any adjustments to vet players, Elder Scrolls Online might soon get reputation of "CASUAL/RPING-ONLY MMO". All these "no sorry, no retroactive changes" like jewelcrafting, arena weapons and now very possibly CPs is just another thing to drive vet players out.

I am 1400 CP, finished all trial hard modes, two trifectas (IR and TTT), Flawless Conqueror on 7 different characters, but if they don't rescale CP I'm out. Competition on MMO market is big and there are plenty of other options that are not casual-only like ESO is becoming. Not even saying than Classic TBC is coming out very soon (very possibly even before new Chapter on ESO).

Exactly, if i have to perma grind, i would rather play BDO that has a better combat system and better graphics.

This feels like it's heading in that direction. An enless grind farming points every day with no time to do anything else. I quit BDO because of this. It was an eternity of grind with no respect for players time. Don't get me wrong, all games require work and time and I have no issue with grinding to a point. But I can't stand a game that sunsets what you already have invested in it, just to make you regrind it all again to keep you logged into the game.

Foto1

this is VERY VERY VERY MUCH. I spent 4 years in this game. I believe that this is enough to get the most out of the new state of CP system. "effective cap" should be reduced to 1500-1800 CP

Firstmep

Nordic__Knights wrote: »

Kodiak709 wrote: »

zvavi wrote: »

The worst is that the diminishing returns are gone. The gap between max CP (1700~) to 600 CP is huge

PVPers worst nightmare... Even the gap between 1700 and 2200, for example is huge. If relatively evenly matched, the 1700 will never win because if they take all damage related CP as the 1700, they miss SO much mitigation and healing compared to the 2200. Guess the person whose spent 10 hours a day for the past year grinding CP is ready to have fun (at everyone else's expense!

thats what putting in the time should do ive always hated this way of thinking, new players or players that dont play often should be below them that put in the time its an mmo not an fps we aint all the same nor should we

Erm why? I hate this obsession some games have with endgame progression systems.

If you put in the time and a long time vet, you already have much better mechanics, understanding and tons of experience vs a newer player. Why do you feel the need to have much better baseline stats as well on top of all that?

WrathOfInnos

relentless_turnip wrote: »

the1andonlyskwex wrote: »

relentless_turnip wrote: »

Apologies guys I was totally wrong about how many points you will need to be at full power.

What I have realised is you really don't need to unlock everything and am actually more excited than before. In terms of build craft this amazing for variety. For pve end gamers I can see this as a little more frustrating.

I can't wait to try this!

Oh yeah, the build diversity will be great, because almost nobody will have enough CP to run meta builds, and will resign themselves to getting stomped by the few that do.

Have you actually seen the numbers... What cp gives you isn't the same as it is on live. Most of our power is now earned levelling 1-50, cp just augments build choices.

The difference in power between 1000cp and 1500cp will be negligible imo. Above cp 1500 the population gets seriously thin. Noone will be forming groups with extreme prejudice. Dummies are bugged and so are some of the stats in the cp tree. I would guess DPS at cp 1000 on the PTS will be similar to live once the bugs have been fixed. There may be a small reduction in power, but I also think that is justified.

Not a whole lot for DPS. Best estimate I’ve seen is 3-4% DPS gain from 1000 CP to 1440 CP with the new system. What’s far more significant IMO is that after maxing out DPS at 1440 you’ll want another 450 CP’s to invest in damage mitigation. The difference between 1440 and 1890 is 20% reduction in damage taken. This is because defensive CP’s are no longer parallel with damage CP’s, both are in the blue constellation.

You could make the argument that 1450 CP players should just invest 1000 into damage, put the rest into mitigation, and accept the 3-4% DPS loss until they gain more CP’s. This would certainly make a lot of content smoother, but I doubt many will do it, glass cannon is too tempting for anything competitive. Most DPS will just be squishy until they reach high CP’s.

Foto1

they have to make more star slotable than non-slotable. just like in the green constellation, which now has 465 passive points and 1275 active points

Foto1

katorga wrote: »

SeaUnicorn wrote: »

I had a quick look and healer has same issue. To get the perks that hybrid healers use - you need so much. There is one perk for proccing status effects that uses 100 cp on its own and requires at least 10 cp invested in the parent node to get to it. And you have to pick between defense, offense and healing because all of that is in the same tree, so to be efficient off-healer I need so much CP it's crazy....

I think that is the point, want damage then give up heals and defense.

To be honest, If I were a brand new player and saw a 3600 point grind in front of me....I'd uninstall.

I agree, if I were a beginner, I would be scared of such a large number. they could make a " denomination." remove one zero. 10 old cp -> 1 new cp

Unified_Gaming

relentless_turnip wrote: »

the1andonlyskwex wrote: »

relentless_turnip wrote: »

Apologies guys I was totally wrong about how many points you will need to be at full power.

What I have realised is you really don't need to unlock everything and am actually more excited than before. In terms of build craft this amazing for variety. For pve end gamers I can see this as a little more frustrating.

I can't wait to try this!

Oh yeah, the build diversity will be great, because almost nobody will have enough CP to run meta builds, and will resign themselves to getting stomped by the few that do.

Have you actually seen the numbers... What cp gives you isn't the same as it is on live. Most of our power is now earned levelling 1-50, cp just augments build choices.

The difference in power between 1000cp and 1500cp will be negligible imo. Above cp 1500 the population gets seriously thin. Noone will be forming groups with extreme prejudice. Dummies are bugged and so are some of the stats in the cp tree. I would guess DPS at cp 1000 on the PTS will be similar to live once the bugs have been fixed. There may be a small reduction in power, but I also think that is justified.

From testing with 810 cp I could get my magsorc to have 44k magicka, 4k spell damage and 7.7k health regen. The system is unbalanced heavily and even with those stats I could see I was missing a lot of base bonuses like max health, healing passives and more because the cp was too low. Even at 1500 I wouldn't be able to slot what I would like and would have to give up some always active passives. If you had 2.4k+ cp though you could have all passives always on + 4 active ones fully maxed and so the balance becomes more and more.

Great system but too many stars passive ones rather than active. Solution - make more passive stars active and then increase the slotable bar so you choose more rather than have a large blanket at 2.4k cp with minimal choice beyond that. I would also suggest they allow you to spend points where you like rather than they get split between 3 ways.

relentless_turnip

Unified_Gaming wrote: »

relentless_turnip wrote: »

the1andonlyskwex wrote: »

relentless_turnip wrote: »

Apologies guys I was totally wrong about how many points you will need to be at full power.

What I have realised is you really don't need to unlock everything and am actually more excited than before. In terms of build craft this amazing for variety. For pve end gamers I can see this as a little more frustrating.

I can't wait to try this!

Oh yeah, the build diversity will be great, because almost nobody will have enough CP to run meta builds, and will resign themselves to getting stomped by the few that do.

Have you actually seen the numbers... What cp gives you isn't the same as it is on live. Most of our power is now earned levelling 1-50, cp just augments build choices.

The difference in power between 1000cp and 1500cp will be negligible imo. Above cp 1500 the population gets seriously thin. Noone will be forming groups with extreme prejudice. Dummies are bugged and so are some of the stats in the cp tree. I would guess DPS at cp 1000 on the PTS will be similar to live once the bugs have been fixed. There may be a small reduction in power, but I also think that is justified.

From testing with 810 cp I could get my magsorc to have 44k magicka, 4k spell damage and 7.7k health regen. The system is unbalanced heavily and even with those stats I could see I was missing a lot of base bonuses like max health, healing passives and more because the cp was too low. Even at 1500 I wouldn't be able to slot what I would like and would have to give up some always active passives. If you had 2.4k+ cp though you could have all passives always on + 4 active ones fully maxed and so the balance becomes more and more.

Great system but too many stars passive ones rather than active. Solution - make more passive stars active and then increase the slotable bar so you choose more rather than have a large blanket at 2.4k cp with minimal choice beyond that. I would also suggest they allow you to spend points where you like rather than they get split between 3 ways.

I have tested on 810 too and I guess I just interpreted it differently. I figured I would need 1200ish cp to be very competitive. I found you don't need to max out every passive to get everything you need. The increases in damage are quite small, as the highest stat density is now earned 1-50. For instance you don't need to max out all spell damage and magicka. You can invest 10-20 points and move on and max them out as you progress. The difference then between cp is quite small. They will have slightly higher mitigation and damage if you balance your cp or they will have higher damage or higher mitigation if you max out one side first.

I do agree that making more of them active would be a good move. On the whole I really like this system.

BlazingDynamo

It's called progression. The game lost it when they started with this one tamerial. Thank god it's back. Cause this game needs it. Sounds like a bunch of babies wanting all the power right off the bat. You shouldn't be playing an MMO if that's the case.

IronWooshu

Why do people assume they should be able to get everything in the tree?

techyeshic

BlazingDynamo wrote: »

It's called progression. The game lost it when they started with this one tamerial. Thank god it's back. Cause this game needs it. Sounds like a bunch of babies wanting all the power right off the bat. You shouldn't be playing an MMO if that's the case.

It's more that people have it, it gets ripped out, and you have to go get it back. That's not progression. It's regression recovery.

ApostateHobo

techyeshic wrote: »

BlazingDynamo wrote: »

It's called progression. The game lost it when they started with this one tamerial. Thank god it's back. Cause this game needs it. Sounds like a bunch of babies wanting all the power right off the bat. You shouldn't be playing an MMO if that's the case.

It's more that people have it, it gets ripped out, and you have to go get it back. That's not progression. It's regression recovery.

So much this!!! People aren't going to be able to do content that they can currently do on live if it's implemented how it is on pts. That's likely going to end up driving away lots of veteran players because nobody wants to grind for months (or more) just to get back what they already had.

katorga

IronWooshu wrote: »

Why do people assume they should be able to get everything in the tree?

Which raises the question which classes will be most efficient at leveraging the new CP system?

From looking at the system it seems like some classes, due to their kit, are going to hit maximum power at a lower CP spend than others. It will all even out around 2.4K cp, but initially...

Nordic__Knights

Firstmep wrote: »

Nordic__Knights wrote: »

Kodiak709 wrote: »

zvavi wrote: »

The worst is that the diminishing returns are gone. The gap between max CP (1700~) to 600 CP is huge

PVPers worst nightmare... Even the gap between 1700 and 2200, for example is huge. If relatively evenly matched, the 1700 will never win because if they take all damage related CP as the 1700, they miss SO much mitigation and healing compared to the 2200. Guess the person whose spent 10 hours a day for the past year grinding CP is ready to have fun (at everyone else's expense!

thats what putting in the time should do ive always hated this way of thinking, new players or players that dont play often should be below them that put in the time its an mmo not an fps we aint all the same nor should we

Erm why? I hate this obsession some games have with endgame progression systems.

If you put in the time and a long time vet, you already have much better mechanics, understanding and tons of experience vs a newer player. Why do you feel the need to have much better baseline stats as well on top of all that?

ill put this in an way you get it if you worked somewhere for 4 year making 20$ and an new guy comes in and their making 20$ to after 1 year how would you fell about your job ? that your time invested with them mint nothing ( in this $=power and when long term investment has been put in you expect your investment to give you MORE POWER then them that only have short term investment

on top of it theres an thing called respect ive pre ordered every new anything and been subed since release day on my PS4 main account , i have 12 accounts there too and i kept one of them subed to tell i moved to PC where i have pre ordered everything here as well as my PS4 since coming over , been subed fulltime here and my PS4 too thats showing LOTS of respect on my part for the GAME right but then they go and say ty for playing our game this whole time sorry we held you back for 4 years with caps but now we are removing them so that players that START playing / paying into the game CAN BE WERE YOUR AT IN 6 MONTHS thats an big middle finger to all VET PLAYERS LONG TERM INVESTERS OF THEIR GAME !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Jaimeh

WrathOfInnos wrote: »

Edit: I also just remembered the Vicious Death passive, which I would definitely want to swap for Deadly Aim on trash for any competitive trial runs. So add another 150 CPs onto the total grind. That makes the total optimized PVE build a reality at 2790 CP’s.

That's absurd, imagine completion rates in trial HMs, achievements, etc., afterwards... I can't fathom their combat team; people asked for a CP rework to ameliorate how powerful some CP trees were, and the general sentiment for this year was 'less combat releated changes, more improved performance', something that Matt Firor also mentioned in his letter to the community. This massive change doesn't balance how powerful CP are, it only makes allocation more complicated, time consuming, unintuitive, and introduces a huge grind, and even though there are some interesting new buffs/features added in some stars, I don't think anyone is looking forward to farming the CP needed to reach equivalent live effectiveness, let alone having all the extra perks. I wish they found a different way to keep players engaged, and keep players playing, messing up with combat so frequently and to such an extent, is just the most out of touch their team could be with the playerbase.

Shadowasrial

All of you players who haven’t been here since launch need to be quiet and just accept that your going to have to grind. Iv been here literally since the game was only on pc and I’m only at 1400cp (because I don’t nonstop grind for it even during events.) according to a collection of statements of your over 1200cp then there’s no longer a xp boost for your cp. you don’t deserve to complain about having to grind. It took me 6 years to get where I am. And new players will get easy grind to 1200 no sweat all while I still gain about 1cp a day if I’m not grinding. If I’m not going to complain then you don’t get to complain.

I for one am happy that I have something to grind for. I’m already a grand overlord in pvp so I don’t even need to go in cyrodil anymore. I’ll grind my happy ass with the hundreds of formerly useless xp scrolls that zenimax gave me and grind to 3600 then go back into cyrodil and smack the ever loving crap out of anyone who thinks they deserve to have the same power as players who have been here since the start.

Derra

Apparently they stated in a german stream that "you only need 1200cp to fulfill one role so everything past that is horizontal progression".

So when you´re set as a dd you should not be able to take any dmg from enemy npcs or players thus making dmg reduction or (self)healing passives useless - because if dmg reduction and (self)healing passives were not entirely useless to a dd then they would not qualify as horizontal progression - they would instead make you more capable in combat.
That is vertical progression.

Do some people have to go back to primary school too learn about the difference of horizontal and vertical i wonder - because judging from their words and actions either some of the people doing balance and combat design or communication clearly have deficiencies some 2nd graders don´t have.

starkerealm

Oreyn_Bearclaw wrote: »

It seems like a very simple fix to the system would be to not require points to be split evenly among the three constellations. That would allow people to focus on combat trees first if they want to, thus curbing vertical progression at far lower CP threshold but allowing horizontal progression all they way to the cap (which is what I thought they were trying to do in the first place). It seems we have one constellation that has nothing to do with actual combat.

If someone wants to put all their points into the blue constellation, let them. It would reduce the CP requirement for a max level combat character by at least a third, and would likely make a lot of us older players in the low/mid teens of CP much happier. I can get behind needing to grind a few hundred CP to be at peak combat efficiency. But If I need to grind like 1500, I am just not sure I will keep playing. I have been at the caps since there were caps. I had 5 VR16 toons when they made the change, and I was above the CP cap when first implemented. I dont like how far they are moving the goal line at one time.

Problem with that would be that it would make the green tree way less appealing, because you'd be giving up damage for those passives.

I could get behind blue and red being intermingled, but they really do seem to be designed around the idea that you're going to have to take points in all three.

zvavi

Derra wrote: »

Apparently they stated in a german stream that "you only need 1200cp to fulfill one role so everything past that is horizontal progression".

That's a blatant lie. As a PvE dd you will want:
5x50 slottable stars (because you can't attack all enemies from behind)
50 point pen
50 points crit
50 points max resource
50 points spell dmg/weapon power
100 points in status effects

That's already 550 blue CP. And that's only the dmg passives+actives. Add to it another 60 for 15% mitigation (which is very very important) and we are sitting at 1830 CP total. And that's if I didn't forget anything.

Gilvoth

this has certainly been a very interesting read thusfar.
i think i agree most with this person below, i highlight @Shadowasrial;c-7101446 full comment as i do very much agree with that opinion and view. but i have to add, that i have zero intention to grind anymore after i have spent the past 7 years here, and several Years in other mmo's, has made my desire to grind in any mmo, is just gone.
i am an old man, and i just dont have the oomph to work hard anymore.
but, it used to be that 1200 CP prety much gave you the most of what you needed, and any more than that was not really much of an increase and did very little to help, i am willing to bet the same is still true.
who knows, only time, and testing on the PTS and on LIVE as welll as any changes they might make will tell what the end result will be.

Shadowasrial wrote: »

All of you players who haven’t been here since launch need to be quiet and just accept that your going to have to grind. Iv been here literally since the game was only on pc and I’m only at 1400cp (because I don’t nonstop grind for it even during events.) according to a collection of statements of your over 1200cp then there’s no longer a xp boost for your cp. you don’t deserve to complain about having to grind. It took me 6 years to get where I am. And new players will get easy grind to 1200 no sweat all while I still gain about 1cp a day if I’m not grinding. If I’m not going to complain then you don’t get to complain.

I for one am happy that I have something to grind for. I’m already a grand overlord in pvp so I don’t even need to go in cyrodil anymore. I’ll grind my happy ass with the hundreds of formerly useless xp scrolls that zenimax gave me and grind to 3600 then go back into cyrodil and smack the ever loving crap out of anyone who thinks they deserve to have the same power as players who have been here since the start.