Why no love for Templar?

West93

Burning light nerfed in pvp.
Worst passives (passive to fill empty soulgem).
Nerfed super hard right now in cyrodiil due to AOE tests.
Ritual of retribution heal removed for no reason.
Backlash is a joke compared to blighted blastbones, scorch, daedric curse.
No health based heal on a healing class, blazing shield useless ability.
A main dps spammable now is being punished for using as a spammable in cyrodiil.
Useless ultimates for solo pvp.
Bottom tier class in pvp, not best at anything.

Synssaturdayy9

i agree it should get buffed i don't like how i can't do anything with my main rn smh...........
(please zos throw templar a bone pls)

Koubo

I can only support this and i'll add :

• One of the worse MadDD PvE, due to rely a lot on a melee spammable which isn't why you want MagDD in first place. Also, bad sustain
• Lose one of the last utility for groups, which was Minor breach/fracture from PowerOfTheLight because now is part of a s&b skill
• Not the best as healer, while is describe as a holy healer of the game
• Bad in PvP, all around.
• really poor self sustain (health wise) especially as a Stamplar who rely at 200% on external skill.
• too many useless skill (SunShield, Eclipse on top of it)
• too many useless passive (almost all from Restoration light are just garbage)
• Worse tank of the game (fromfeedback. Didn't played tank. But we dont see Templar tank anyway)

Slowbromance

I have been playing my 3 main healers in AvA on live server and was hoping to see some kind of adjustment to Templar to give them something back in the way of healing because right now, group healing appears to be very P2W. Here's why.

Over various patches the healer's tool kit has been stripped and re-worked. While I agree that healing needed a change I think one of the big things over looked is the fact that Templars don't get anywhere near the healing bonuses that Necromancers and Wardens do. I am expecting Warden healing to level some after this next patch when major mending is reduced, but Necromancer will continue to stand out as a healing class above the other two with crit healing becoming the new meta on PvP.

To bring further clarity to my points above, while Warden and Necromancer have been affected by the general heal changes they have been nowhere near as affected as Templar healer due to class bonuses within their kit. Right now, Necromancer is the best AvA healer.

I feel so disappointed and upset for people just starting this game wanting to heal, and they choose Templar in base game as the "healing class" and they see their healing have little to no effect in AvA. The Templar heal ultimate is not even worth slotting in AvA at this point since you get more use from mobility when each of your ultimate heals are only hitting 3-4k each on average and you have AoE proc sets like vicious death hitting for 11-14k.

I want to have fun on my Templar again please, and I want other people to find and enjoy the class as well. Right now it's boring, underwhelming, and looks like you are pushing for people to buy DLC in order to play the game the way they want.

West93

Necromancers have a flat out healing % increase passives.

Why Mending passive cannot give flat 12% increase in healing and not only effect restoring light abilities? Stamina templars only healing is basically extended ritual (retribution doesn't even heal anymore). Major mending was taken away so 12% base would not be OP anymore with battle spirit healing nerf.

Enduring Rays Increases the duration of your Sun Fire, Eclipse, Solar Flare and Nova abilities by 2 seconds. How is that remotely useful, a passive that make a not so good class skill last slightly longer?

Burning light nerf made basically not being able to proc burning light without puncturing strikes. How about ranged magplar dark flare -> javelin combo builds, you don't spam javelin 4 times in a row (without light attack weaving), single javelin doesn't proc burning light anymore.

Power of the light was unique minor fracture debuff, now it is given to one hand and shield skill line, what is the point to slot that skill if you are using puncture? Damage wise it is a joke, burst cannot be buffed by other players damage as it used to.

MincVinyl

West93 wrote: »

Burning light nerfed in pvp.
Worst passives (passive to fill empty soulgem).
Nerfed super hard right now in cyrodiil due to AOE tests.
Ritual of retribution heal removed for no reason.
Backlash is a joke compared to blighted blastbones, scorch, daedric curse.
No health based heal on a healing class, blazing shield useless ability.
A main dps spammable now is being punished for using as a spammable in cyrodiil.
Useless ultimates for solo pvp.
Bottom tier class in pvp, not best at anything.

-Burning light was literally bugged
-If you care at all about actually playing pvp you should be happy that zos is actually doing testing regardless
-Ritual is now properly split into a damage and healing morph
-nothing compares to blastbones rn, scorch is up there aswell, but id say backlash compares well with curse
-Most of templar's health based *** and counter zerg tools were nerfed into the ground like 3-4 years ago
-again be happy zos is investing any amount of time in cyrodil
-sweep and nova can find themselves in a build easily. Ever try using an ult for stamsorc, a highly mobile and movement based class that has a clunky ult that can get you banned and two ground placed non moving over time ults.
its easily mid tier, without testing involved its most likely sitting behind Necro>warden>dk=templar=sorc>nightblade

West93

MincVinyl wrote: »

West93 wrote: »

Burning light nerfed in pvp.
Worst passives (passive to fill empty soulgem).
Nerfed super hard right now in cyrodiil due to AOE tests.
Ritual of retribution heal removed for no reason.
Backlash is a joke compared to blighted blastbones, scorch, daedric curse.
No health based heal on a healing class, blazing shield useless ability.
A main dps spammable now is being punished for using as a spammable in cyrodiil.
Useless ultimates for solo pvp.
Bottom tier class in pvp, not best at anything.

-Burning light was literally bugged
-If you care at all about actually playing pvp you should be happy that zos is actually doing testing regardless
-Ritual is now properly split into a damage and healing morph
-nothing compares to blastbones rn, scorch is up there aswell, but id say backlash compares well with curse
-Most of templar's health based *** and counter zerg tools were nerfed into the ground like 3-4 years ago
-again be happy zos is investing any amount of time in cyrodil
-sweep and nova can find themselves in a build easily. Ever try using an ult for stamsorc, a highly mobile and movement based class that has a clunky ult that can get you banned and two ground placed non moving over time ults.
its easily mid tier, without testing involved its most likely sitting behind Necro>warden>dk=templar=sorc>nightblade

-Burning light was not bugged.
-I am pvping since 2016 on my templar and this is worst time with AOE tests for the class.
-Ritual sucks in both pvp and pve now.
-Every class has a health based heal while templar doesn't have it and even deosn't have its health based shield because its nerfed to the ground.
-Sweeps are trash for pvp with cast time, hit like wet noodle, you don't use nova for solo pvp it's useless, sorc can at least use negate and get passives from slotting atronach if needed. I never ever used templar ultimates while playing solo. (Spellwall,dawnbreaker, psijic ultimate all of them are better)
-Templar is bottom tier in no cp pvp, while stamsorc is still top tier in no cp pvp due to proc set abusing, sustain, mobility.

MincVinyl

West93 wrote: »

MincVinyl wrote: »

West93 wrote: »

Burning light nerfed in pvp.
Worst passives (passive to fill empty soulgem).
Nerfed super hard right now in cyrodiil due to AOE tests.
Ritual of retribution heal removed for no reason.
Backlash is a joke compared to blighted blastbones, scorch, daedric curse.
No health based heal on a healing class, blazing shield useless ability.
A main dps spammable now is being punished for using as a spammable in cyrodiil.
Useless ultimates for solo pvp.
Bottom tier class in pvp, not best at anything.

-Burning light was literally bugged
-If you care at all about actually playing pvp you should be happy that zos is actually doing testing regardless
-Ritual is now properly split into a damage and healing morph
-nothing compares to blastbones rn, scorch is up there aswell, but id say backlash compares well with curse
-Most of templar's health based *** and counter zerg tools were nerfed into the ground like 3-4 years ago
-again be happy zos is investing any amount of time in cyrodil
-sweep and nova can find themselves in a build easily. Ever try using an ult for stamsorc, a highly mobile and movement based class that has a clunky ult that can get you banned and two ground placed non moving over time ults.
its easily mid tier, without testing involved its most likely sitting behind Necro>warden>dk=templar=sorc>nightblade

-Burning light was not bugged.
-I am pvping since 2016 on my templar and this is worst time with AOE tests for the class.
-Ritual sucks in both pvp and pve now.
-Every class has a health based heal while templar doesn't have it and even deosn't have its health based shield because its nerfed to the ground.
-Sweeps are trash for pvp with cast time, hit like wet noodle, you don't use nova for solo pvp it's useless, sorc can at least use negate and get passives from slotting atronach if needed. I never ever used templar ultimates while playing solo. (Spellwall,dawnbreaker, psijic ultimate all of them are better)
-Templar is bottom tier in no cp pvp, while stamsorc is still top tier in no cp pvp due to proc set abusing, sustain, mobility.

You are claiming another class is strong because of an out of class tool? That is an issue all around with the game not particular to any class.

Firstmep

MincVinyl wrote: »

West93 wrote: »

MincVinyl wrote: »

West93 wrote: »

Burning light nerfed in pvp.
Worst passives (passive to fill empty soulgem).
Nerfed super hard right now in cyrodiil due to AOE tests.
Ritual of retribution heal removed for no reason.
Backlash is a joke compared to blighted blastbones, scorch, daedric curse.
No health based heal on a healing class, blazing shield useless ability.
A main dps spammable now is being punished for using as a spammable in cyrodiil.
Useless ultimates for solo pvp.
Bottom tier class in pvp, not best at anything.

-Burning light was literally bugged
-If you care at all about actually playing pvp you should be happy that zos is actually doing testing regardless
-Ritual is now properly split into a damage and healing morph
-nothing compares to blastbones rn, scorch is up there aswell, but id say backlash compares well with curse
-Most of templar's health based *** and counter zerg tools were nerfed into the ground like 3-4 years ago
-again be happy zos is investing any amount of time in cyrodil
-sweep and nova can find themselves in a build easily. Ever try using an ult for stamsorc, a highly mobile and movement based class that has a clunky ult that can get you banned and two ground placed non moving over time ults.
its easily mid tier, without testing involved its most likely sitting behind Necro>warden>dk=templar=sorc>nightblade

-Burning light was not bugged.
-I am pvping since 2016 on my templar and this is worst time with AOE tests for the class.
-Ritual sucks in both pvp and pve now.
-Every class has a health based heal while templar doesn't have it and even deosn't have its health based shield because its nerfed to the ground.
-Sweeps are trash for pvp with cast time, hit like wet noodle, you don't use nova for solo pvp it's useless, sorc can at least use negate and get passives from slotting atronach if needed. I never ever used templar ultimates while playing solo. (Spellwall,dawnbreaker, psijic ultimate all of them are better)
-Templar is bottom tier in no cp pvp, while stamsorc is still top tier in no cp pvp due to proc set abusing, sustain, mobility.

You are claiming another class is strong because of an out of class tool? That is an issue all around with the game not particular to any class.

Stamsorcs and stamblades synergise insanely well with procsets.
Sorc Beacuse crit surge and dark deal doesn't care about your stats.
Nb Beacuse you can safely procc from range and cloak shade if someone tries to get close to you.
For wpd builds necro and warden reign supreme, and warden has insane built in healing and is not punished for building high hp on top.
StamDK is kind of in similar shoes Exept they have better sustain via battle roar and mountains blessing since they don't have to run as much regen.
Stamplar has none of those.
Our class based "heal" costs 5k Magicka, it's a static aoe hot that ticks every 2 seconds.
Purfiy is great, but in the current meta you can literally spam it 5 times and still have 67 dots on you.
We have no built in mobility, no proper class based heal, half our passives don't even apply to stamplar.
Then last patch they nerfed burning light, Backlash gets double mitigated again(nowhere near curse), while the skill doesnt even scale with wpd/spd.
Empowering sweep is a steaming pile of hot garbage with the cast time.
But yeah, nightblades reaaaaaaaly needed 3k more hybrid pen passively.
Oh and they put minor breach on pierce armor on pts so stamplar dd/magplar healer brings even less to the group now.
Oh and I'm so glad they're buffing minor recovery buffs, since we have to double bar repentance to get those buffs, while other classes get built %recovery modifiers or in the case of necro just flat out regen for having a pet active.
Stamplar is so far down the drain at this point, I see 1 person besides myself every 10 bg playing it.
Meanwhile stamdens, sorcs and nightblades are everywhere.
Oh and can't even play cyro cuz my spammable skill, that literally only does any decent dmg to single target has a ramping cost increase.
Okay.

Skjaldbjorn

West93 wrote: »

-Ritual sucks in both pvp and pve now.

No lol. I've been playing a fair bit of Stamplar this patch, in PVE their DPS is very good atm and Ritual performs well.

Sanguinor2

MincVinyl wrote: »

nothing compares to blastbones rn, scorch is up there aswell, but id say backlash compares well with curse

Doubt on that one after the bugfix. Backlash takes 6 seconds to go off and in those 6 seconds needs you to do a ton of damage otherwise it wont do any damage at all and even so it hits very low these days (many stamplars actually unslotted it since the damage isnt worth most of the time anymore) while you just have to place curse and wait for it to go off.
So in summary backlash takes twice as long as scorch, blastbones and curse, takes a lot more work for it to reach high damage and even with a lot of work it still wont hit as hard as either scorch, blastbones or curse.

Aznarb

-Cry in Tankplar-

Cinbri

This update apparently wont get any class changes so how bout just fix things from previous pts - improve Burning Light. Zos have enough data to approve that previous pts change was very negatively affected passive in pvp scenario. Just add proper skill memory to it that take longer than 1sec to store stacks.

Slowbromance

Aznarb wrote: »

-Cry in Tankplar-

Stellar input.

techyeshic

Major evasion being reduced makes sweeps and Jabs a dominant spammable. At the same time; more eggs in that basket for people to complain about templars spamming jabs. Its literally becoming the class.

Koubo

I'm glad i didn't had to respond to the other guy, thanks @Firstmep @West93

MincVinyl wrote: »

West93 wrote: »

-Burning light was literally bugged

BackLash was bugged, not BurningLight. . . And got fix. The problem isn't to fix bugs. It's good to fix them. Problem is, the skill was scale on THAT bug, and removing it make it less effective as any other skill of that kind. Hit like noodle even with much effort in PvP (mostly dont even worth that effort) while some Stamplar do literally more damage without it in PvE (i still use it for the fun, the habit and Minor Frac/Breach which wont be necessary next patch anyway)
Meanwhile, BB does enough damage to be top source of damage (if not first?) for Necros. (only downside is when it's bugged, but that's not because of it's damage but how it codded. That's another topic)

Koubo

failed the quote above | MyBad

LovesCoffee

magplar still good in pve as a healer and both dd types if u don't count loosing class utility, which lack i can't say about pvp, but im agreed big part of passives and skills are trash and it looks like this class need serious rework

mmtaniac

Stamplar feel weak compared to nb or other classes your burst not exist your only dmg is potl and jabs if you want use class passives(burning light should work with direct damage skills not only aedric tree).

His heal feel like not exist you must use no class abilities only purge but even this cost tons.

Defense i try to find it but can't i don't know maybe its invisible skill hidden somewhere and i don't see it.

Sustain is can be but sometimes in critical moments on dk i use ult ta da bonus sustain on nb just manage sustain skill ta da bonus 10000k stamina in critical moment. Of course i can use repentance(necromancer can produce corpses to use his sustain abilities) but it require kills its little hard when you are against 2-3 people and your class lack burst.

Animus-ESO

Yeah with all the nerfs my Templar is feeling as weak as it ever has. If backlash was bugged for so long and our damage was adjusted in that time I think we got over nerfed. The burning light passive would have been a decent change if the stacks lasted more then 1 second. The lack of a decent solo ult mixed with every Stam class slotting major evasion is killing Templar. 20% mitigation to our primary damage source aoe. If they made jabs single target and burning light stacks last at least 5 seconds then I think the class would be in alot better shape. Right now magplar has to choose either to use a electro staff for aoe damage or fire staff for single target. It effectively cut our damage in half either way.

techyeshic

Thrusts-His-Spear wrote: »

Yeah with all the nerfs my Templar is feeling as weak as it ever has. If backlash was bugged for so long and our damage was adjusted in that time I think we got over nerfed. The burning light passive would have been a decent change if the stacks lasted more then 1 second. The lack of a decent solo ult mixed with every Stam class slotting major evasion is killing Templar. 20% mitigation to our primary damage source aoe. If they made jabs single target and burning light stacks last at least 5 seconds then I think the class would be in alot better shape. Right now magplar has to choose either to use a electro staff for aoe damage or fire staff for single target. It effectively cut our damage in half either way.

I would not make jabs single target at this point. Major evasion is getting reduced. Jabs is pretty much going to carry the class more than ever and that includes all the NBs running around getting flushed out of stealth. You'd only be doing them a favor. At least as things stand right now on PTS

I ran my stamplar last night for a while and had very little trouble with killing. What gets me is no real defensive ability or alt. ER is only about 500 magicka cheaper than efficient purge and see what happens if you tell another stam class to slot that. And of course the issue I had last night is; I could sustain Jabs with ramping costs OK as I rebuff after 2 or 3 tops; but then ER would cost like 7 k magicka.

What I do find odd; is POTL has single target minor breach. Other classes have AOE major breach (until warden loses it then just DK) and that never made much sense to me. PL gets a heal that is not really practical nor fills what the role of the skill feels like it should be similar to NBs assassins will was. I think keeping the minor is fine; but it would be cool that when the effect expires or is purged, it explodes causing major breach. Or something that makes the ability not feel wasted due to conditions of needing to fill it with un-wieldy damage or have it be purged.

Koubo

And if you turn Jab/Sweep into a ST ability, then Stamplars (especially) will lose a lot in AoE content, only rely on EH, RoR and WW(if sloted, which isn't the case most of the time)
The class isn't the best in AoE (Stamplar i mean. MagPlar is gine in my opinion with 3-4 ground AoE in the rotation)

Everything isn't only about PvP. (even if, clearly, the class need tweak to compet at all in PvP where it's bad)

Solariken

I've mained stamplar since game launch, and I've never felt this frustrated. I'm trying to work up the nerve to change my main but I've got so much invested in this character.

Burning Light and POTL nerfs obliterated what little power the class had left.

Most classes have really strong gimmicks and special synergies that you can build around and really lean into. Stamplar has nothing to build for except weapon damage, and Power of the Light doesn't even scale with it lol.

Maybe if they added a 1k DPS DOT to Power of the Light it would be at least usable.

Burning Light needs an extension on the timer at least to 4 seconds.

Binding Javelin stun should be made unblockable. If Sorcs can unavoidably stun 12 people with damage then I think we should be able to stun 1 through block. God-like strength amirite?

And lastly we really need a disengage. Living Dark is the only skill we have for this so make the heal proc on all damage and add Major Protection (new nerfed value)

Joy_Division

MincVinyl wrote: »

West93 wrote: »

Burning light nerfed in pvp.
Worst passives (passive to fill empty soulgem).
Nerfed super hard right now in cyrodiil due to AOE tests.
Ritual of retribution heal removed for no reason.
Backlash is a joke compared to blighted blastbones, scorch, daedric curse.
No health based heal on a healing class, blazing shield useless ability.
A main dps spammable now is being punished for using as a spammable in cyrodiil.
Useless ultimates for solo pvp.
Bottom tier class in pvp, not best at anything.

-Burning light was literally bugged
-If you care at all about actually playing pvp you should be happy that zos is actually doing testing regardless
-Ritual is now properly split into a damage and healing morph
-nothing compares to blastbones rn, scorch is up there aswell, but id say backlash compares well with curse
-Most of templar's health based *** and counter zerg tools were nerfed into the ground like 3-4 years ago
-again be happy zos is investing any amount of time in cyrodil
-sweep and nova can find themselves in a build easily. Ever try using an ult for stamsorc, a highly mobile and movement based class that has a clunky ult that can get you banned and two ground placed non moving over time ults.
its easily mid tier, without testing involved its most likely sitting behind Necro>warden>dk=templar=sorc>nightblade

-Just because something is bugged, doesn't mean make it mechanically unviable is an acceptable fix
-Won't be happy until ZOS stops selling me BS about performance and comes clean about why they cannot just invest/improve their servers.
-I do not agree that proper morphs require oversimplying and dumbing down the game such that abilities conform to basic single defined functions.
-So a fire and forget skill curse that guarantees for X damage in 3.5 seconds compares with a skill that requires the player to continuously hit the target for 6 seconds to get similar damage?
-Nerfed 3-4 years ago doesn't mean, it's totally cool the stuff got nerfed.
-Nova is just tool for ball groups to abuse harmony, and next patch will solidify that even more with the (de)buff nerf.
-Just because Stam sorcs have crap choices for ultimates doesn't mean the solution to that problem is make all the classes have crap choices-
-Sorc has never been mid tier since 1.6 patch dropped (or at least the magicka version of it) and to put templar in its tier this patch is laughable.

Drdeath20

At this point nerf everything templar bcz well why not?!

West93

Cinbri wrote: »

This update apparently wont get any class changes so how bout just fix things from previous pts - improve Burning Light. Zos have enough data to approve that previous pts change was very negatively affected passive in pvp scenario. Just add proper skill memory to it that take longer than 1sec to store stacks.

Just finished grinding my stamcro undaunted today. I guess I'll stay on him this and next patch from now on till they bring back templar being viable in pvp again.

Used same sets on my stamcro as on stamplar just switched trollking to malubeth, I never played another stamclass and never used dizzy swing and executioner before, I am so terrible not even close to being 20% good as on my templar, yet class carried me so much that I could walk down 1v1 anyone, felt 3x times more tankier and if landing blastboned and dizzy at same time burst is so much better than stamplars.

Grayhost cyrodiil.

YandereGirlfriend

I would love to see Blazing Shield turned into something useful.

Both morphs I just sit there wondering "Why...?"

ealdwin

YandereGirlfriend wrote: »

I would love to see Blazing Shield turned into something useful.

Both morphs I just sit there wondering "Why...?"

IMO, one of the morphs should scale off of Max Mag, providing Magicka Templars with a class shield ability. Personally, I'd like to see this be done to the Radiant Ward morph, so that Magplars have a better tool for surviving when outnumbered. Another thought would be to rework Blazing Shield into Blinding Shield, and have it stun enemies on cast, with each enemy increasing the length of the stun. This morph would still scale off of Max Health, and would give Templar Tanks a hard CC option within the class kit.

Dihaki

The templar is one of the classes with the greatest balance between damage and healing that exists.

Koubo

ealdwin wrote: »

YandereGirlfriend wrote: »

I would love to see Blazing Shield turned into something useful.

Both morphs I just sit there wondering "Why...?"

IMO, one of the morphs should scale off of Max Mag, providing Magicka Templars with a class shield ability. Personally, I'd like to see this be done to the Radiant Ward morph, so that Magplars have a better tool for surviving when outnumbered. Another thought would be to rework Blazing Shield into Blinding Shield, and have it stun enemies on cast, with each enemy increasing the length of the stun. This morph would still scale off of Max Health, and would give Templar Tanks a hard CC option within the class kit.

I honestly like the design behind your suggestion. Dosent solve the state of Stamplar tho :sad_cat:

Firstmep

Dihaki wrote: »

The templar is one of the classes with the greatest balance between damage and healing that exists.

Balanced vs what? Naked magnbs?

Both templars are pretty bottom tier for pvp atm.
Last patch they took away a lot of our dmg.
As for healing, LOL.
A sorcerer can put out better healing than Templars. Let's be real here.