Calypso589 wrote: »@ZOS_
Can we please just get some straight talk on why, after 6 years, changing how 200+ abilities work in Cyrodiil is the step that's being taken instead of literally anything else?
And all of this happening on top of the audit you've been conducting on the PvE side as well?
What? Hello?
Please. What resources do you need and why are you apparently not getting them?
Calypso589 wrote: »@ZOS_
Can we please just get some straight talk on why, after 6 years, changing how 200+ abilities work in Cyrodiil is the step that's being taken instead of literally anything else?
And all of this happening on top of the audit you've been conducting on the PvE side as well?
What? Hello?
Please. What resources do you need and why are you apparently not getting them?
It's been 6 years of trying many things. All games never stop tinkering with the core rules.
So cast times is one of hard restrictions, but then channels are different version of cast times, so Jabs could be unaffected by this as they are not instant cast aoe like rest.If an ability is a single target ability that has an area component and has no cast time.
Please dont put this into pve....
ZOS_RichLambert wrote: »We will be very upfront, but please be aware that if these tests confirm our hypothesis, then chain-casting AOE abilities will no longer form the core of the ESO PvP experience in the way it has for the last few years. We would then go through each class and ensure that there are viable builds for each and make adjustments as necessary.
HalvarIronfist wrote: »
ZOS_RichLambert wrote: »Over the years, player power has grown considerably. With the addition of the Champion System, various armor/weapons sets, and changes to abilities, we have reached the stage where players - with the right build - can cast near-infinite numbers of abilities.
At launch, Cyrodiil’s processes were able to keep up with the number of AOEs cast, because most players couldn’t cast that many of them: they ran out of Magicka or Stamina, so they had to use AOEs judiciously. Over time, as player knowledge grew and regen builds grew in power, more players could cast more and more AOEs before running out of resources.
Premise: Power/resource creep is causing the performance issue.
Wouldn't the logical conclusion be to temper the power/resource creep in Cyro, via Battle Spirit, as a first test? If the problem is unlimited resources, fix the unlimited resources?
Adjusting resource regeneration across the board or for the specific abilities/sets that are causing it to over-perform in PvP seems like a better solution that completely gutting a well-beloved combat system.
its a *** lie... one patch ago they released mutiple sustain sets, i guess it wasnt a problem back than ? Moreover in no cp you cant realy sustain eternay but its still lagging af. Their fixes will not fix anything
ZOS_RichLambert wrote: »We will be very upfront, but please be aware that if these tests confirm our hypothesis, then chain-casting AOE abilities will no longer form the core of the ESO PvP experience in the way it has for the last few years.
Having cooldown on spammable ability feel like overkill already.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HzG-t7e4y7I
You literally wont kill anyone in pvp for duration of test simply coz your main dps skill will be on cooldown. I guess light attacking someone to death.. Same for rest of tests, dont want to imagine cooldown+ramming cost.
Same stuff for survivability - when your class survivabiltiy tools are aoes and on cooldown you won't even survive unless you stacking with zerg. Drastical reduction in survivability.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8A_zWfD70ow
So templar will be able to cast 1 Honor when enemy can land 3 Uppercauts into him..
Having cooldown on spammable ability feel like overkill already.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HzG-t7e4y7I
You literally wont kill anyone in pvp for duration of test simply coz your main dps skill will be on cooldown. I guess light attacking someone to death.. Same for rest of tests, dont want to imagine cooldown+ramming cost.
Same stuff for survivability - when your class survivabiltiy tools are aoes and on cooldown you won't even survive unless you stacking with zerg. Drastical reduction in survivability.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8A_zWfD70ow
So templar will be able to cast 1 Honor when enemy can land 3 Uppercauts into him..
.Having cooldown on spammable ability feel like overkill already.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HzG-t7e4y7I
You literally wont kill anyone in pvp for duration of test simply coz your main dps skill will be on cooldown. I guess light attacking someone to death.. Same for rest of tests, dont want to imagine cooldown+ramming cost.
Same stuff for survivability - when your class survivabiltiy tools are aoes and on cooldown you won't even survive unless you stacking with zerg. Drastical reduction in survivability.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8A_zWfD70ow
So templar will be able to cast 1 Honor when enemy can land 3 Uppercauts into him..
lol
looks awesome
Coz everything that has radius check, even it single target skill, is considered as aoe per zos quote:I just dont get it why HoD is considered AoE as it heals one target. Basically it is a smart single target heal.Having cooldown on spammable ability feel like overkill already.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HzG-t7e4y7I
You literally wont kill anyone in pvp for duration of test simply coz your main dps skill will be on cooldown. I guess light attacking someone to death.. Same for rest of tests, dont want to imagine cooldown+ramming cost.
Same stuff for survivability - when your class survivabiltiy tools are aoes and on cooldown you won't even survive unless you stacking with zerg. Drastical reduction in survivability.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8A_zWfD70ow
So templar will be able to cast 1 Honor when enemy can land 3 Uppercauts into him..
For now it lookse like those tests will be paradise for stam specs, farming ton of AP on magicka spec opponents majority of wich wont be able to fight back.The ability’s initial cast requires a radius to function. This includes abilities like Breath of Life that require a radius check to fire its heal at the appropriate target.
Coz everything that has radius check, even it single target skill, is considered as aoe per zos quote:I just dont get it why HoD is considered AoE as it heals one target. Basically it is a smart single target heal.Having cooldown on spammable ability feel like overkill already.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HzG-t7e4y7I
You literally wont kill anyone in pvp for duration of test simply coz your main dps skill will be on cooldown. I guess light attacking someone to death.. Same for rest of tests, dont want to imagine cooldown+ramming cost.
Same stuff for survivability - when your class survivabiltiy tools are aoes and on cooldown you won't even survive unless you stacking with zerg. Drastical reduction in survivability.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8A_zWfD70ow
So templar will be able to cast 1 Honor when enemy can land 3 Uppercauts into him..For now it lookse like those tests will be paradise for stam specs, farming ton of AP on magicka spec opponents majority of wich wont be able to fight back.The ability’s initial cast requires a radius to function. This includes abilities like Breath of Life that require a radius check to fire its heal at the appropriate target.
Coz everything that has radius check, even it single target skill, is considered as aoe per zos quote:I just dont get it why HoD is considered AoE as it heals one target. Basically it is a smart single target heal.Having cooldown on spammable ability feel like overkill already.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HzG-t7e4y7I
You literally wont kill anyone in pvp for duration of test simply coz your main dps skill will be on cooldown. I guess light attacking someone to death.. Same for rest of tests, dont want to imagine cooldown+ramming cost.
Same stuff for survivability - when your class survivabiltiy tools are aoes and on cooldown you won't even survive unless you stacking with zerg. Drastical reduction in survivability.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8A_zWfD70ow
So templar will be able to cast 1 Honor when enemy can land 3 Uppercauts into him..For now it lookse like those tests will be paradise for stam specs, farming ton of AP on magicka spec opponents majority of wich wont be able to fight back.The ability’s initial cast requires a radius to function. This includes abilities like Breath of Life that require a radius check to fire its heal at the appropriate target.
Basically almost every heal in the game that can be used on alies (except resto channel, warden pull and symbiosis) will have a CD of 3 seconds. Then I doubt that they can make all these skills to be locked for 3 seconds. So the skills should have their own CD, then ppl will start spamming 1 2 3 and then repeat.
Are these changes PvP only or they will be brought to PvE too if they are accepted?
Coz everything that has radius check, even it single target skill, is considered as aoe per zos quote:I just dont get it why HoD is considered AoE as it heals one target. Basically it is a smart single target heal.Having cooldown on spammable ability feel like overkill already.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HzG-t7e4y7I
You literally wont kill anyone in pvp for duration of test simply coz your main dps skill will be on cooldown. I guess light attacking someone to death.. Same for rest of tests, dont want to imagine cooldown+ramming cost.
Same stuff for survivability - when your class survivabiltiy tools are aoes and on cooldown you won't even survive unless you stacking with zerg. Drastical reduction in survivability.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8A_zWfD70ow
So templar will be able to cast 1 Honor when enemy can land 3 Uppercauts into him..For now it lookse like those tests will be paradise for stam specs, farming ton of AP on magicka spec opponents majority of wich wont be able to fight back.The ability’s initial cast requires a radius to function. This includes abilities like Breath of Life that require a radius check to fire its heal at the appropriate target.
Yes:
+elite2
+elite3
that's way better and certainly not an issue.
- Test 1 – Shared global AOE cooldown - 3 second timer. This test adds a global 3 second shared cooldown to any AOE ability. This means that when you cast an AOE, you will not be able to cast another for 3 seconds. For example, as a Templar, if I cast Ritual of Retribution, I wouldn’t be able to cast Puncturing Sweep for 3 seconds.
silver1surfer69 wrote: »This is all only about AOE abilities (for now). I hope it is really only the AOEs that are the problem, maybe it is not.
MCBIZZLE300 wrote: »Part of me thinks this is just zenimax's slow transition to slow combat to accomodate for people that can't press buttons fast enough. Their proposed idea and reasons for the light and heavy attack changes really shocked me. The skill delay never used to be there untill they changed the way the game communicates with the players and for me the skill delay is by far the biggest problem.
Ballgroup sustain is insane.LadyLethalla wrote: »Can someone please explain to me how players can spam AOEs without running out of resources...?
Wait. Simple solution to Cyrodiil combat. Don't we have a series of "rock paper scissors" emotes?davidj8291 wrote: »ZOS_RichLambert wrote: »We will be very upfront, but please be aware that if these tests confirm our hypothesis, then chain-casting AOE abilities will no longer form the core of the ESO PvP experience in the way it has for the last few years.
I don't know how much I can stress to you that this would absolutely kill group play with less than 24 in Cyrodiil, in addition to completely neutralizing several existing classes.
Unlikely. Keep in mind that they might not use a 3 second cooldown, or any cooldown beyond the global cooldown, and accomplish this via other means. Maybe cap regen and increase the AoE skill cost. Maybe casting an AoE disables regen for some duration. Maybe a cast time on the AoE skills to help prevent spamming. Maybe only allow a certain number of AoE to be active in an area at a time. All they really need to do is make it so that players don't continuously spam AoE. How they do that is an open field, and does not have to be one of the methods they test.
Wait. Simple solution to Cyrodiil combat. Don't we have a series of "rock paper scissors" emotes?davidj8291 wrote: »ZOS_RichLambert wrote: »We will be very upfront, but please be aware that if these tests confirm our hypothesis, then chain-casting AOE abilities will no longer form the core of the ESO PvP experience in the way it has for the last few years.
I don't know how much I can stress to you that this would absolutely kill group play with less than 24 in Cyrodiil, in addition to completely neutralizing several existing classes.
Unlikely. Keep in mind that they might not use a 3 second cooldown, or any cooldown beyond the global cooldown, and accomplish this via other means. Maybe cap regen and increase the AoE skill cost. Maybe casting an AoE disables regen for some duration. Maybe a cast time on the AoE skills to help prevent spamming. Maybe only allow a certain number of AoE to be active in an area at a time. All they really need to do is make it so that players don't continuously spam AoE. How they do that is an open field, and does not have to be one of the methods they test.
Another solution they could do is to rework AOE skills similar to Blastbones. Make it so that you can only have 1 of each type of AOE skill up for the duration of that skill. Drop a ground based AOE and you can't drop another ground based on until it expires. Cast a player based AOE and it has to expire before you can cast another. Instant AOE skills, like jabs or whirlwind would still be spammable. And for something like Purge, you could change it from an instant removal of effects to removing 1 effect every second for 5 seconds or something. That way it still has the power to clear negative effects, but it works over time and wouldn't be able to be recast until the effect ends.