Nightblades have it bad and Cloak is now nearly unusable (Previous Thread Expanded)

deepseamk20b14_ESO

[Removed quote]

People just hate NB's apparently. Had a guy hate tell me in BG last night how I was a [Snip] player for being sneaky. Mind you I don't sneak nor do I have cloak slotted. Then he ranted on about some other unrelated stuff and I'm pretty sure he had no idea he hate messaged the wrong person but since I was on his death recap I was target of his rage against NB.

Btw, Shadow image>cloak. Especially now that it works. Which is surprising because nothing seems to work this patch.

[Edited for profanity bypass]

brandonv516

Putting aside all the noise from the trolls here, if the skill is broken we need it to be addressed by someone.

I didn't see anything in the notes other than how gap closers interact with Cloak, so it seems like it is likely a bug.

Invisibility is a integral part of this game and that playstyle is kind of a deal breaker for some people.

What makes some people think it needs to magically go away or be turned into a roleplay tool at this stage in the game is beyond me.

ZOS_Volpe

Greetings,

We've had to remove a few non-constructive and baiting comments. Please remember that while it’s alright to disagree or even debate with each other, provoking conflict, baiting, inciting, mocking, etc. is never acceptable on our forums.

BlueRaven

Eatmyface wrote: »

Delete cloak. Delete snipe. Then we might see NB get some love again.

Until then, the class will just be associated with cowardly gameplay and exploits.

If we delete pvp then maybe all classes can have meaningful class abilities again.

Stebarnz

Deathlord92 wrote: »

Stebarnz wrote: »

Keep cloak as a memento for the rp'ers and balance the class properly!

Its not used in top tier pve and its not used in top tier pvp so get rid and get the class something that is still roguey but not invis and bring the class inline.

Everyone still wanting cloak and class to be higher damage, it wont happen while invis is there! FACT!

Yes i play both magnb and stamnb and no i dont use cloak

As I said in a previous post getting rid of shadow disguise will destroy class identity and will ruin the game for lots of players and you do not speak for everyone because I also play stamblade with dark cloak and I do very well and getting rid of shadow disguise will completely destroy the identity of the class we won’t be a nb or rogue anymore.

I said i dont speak for everyone only those who understand how the game works 2 posts further down pal.

Also read my post i said give it something else rougey, rougesk, rouguly, whatever, im not saying kill the class, i play it too, im saying give it something else other than invis which isnt used competitively anyway only in rp so it can be a memento.

If you keep invis you keep a weak class dont you see this? like talking to a wall man.

Stebarnz

brandonv516 wrote: »

Putting aside all the noise from the trolls here, if the skill is broken we need it to be addressed by someone.

I didn't see anything in the notes other than how gap closers interact with Cloak, so it seems like it is likely a bug.

Invisibility is a integral part of this game and that playstyle is kind of a deal breaker for some people.

What makes some people think it needs to magically go away or be turned into a roleplay tool at this stage in the game is beyond me.

When do YOU use cloak? Give me specific content and situation.

1mirg

brandonv516 wrote: »

Putting aside all the noise from the trolls here, if the skill is broken we need it to be addressed by someone.

I didn't see anything in the notes other than how gap closers interact with Cloak, so it seems like it is likely a bug.

Invisibility for NBs has been effectively broken for years now, this patch just put the final nail in the coffin by having added a unintended feature where you can just effectively swing wildly to get them out of stealth.

What I believe to have caused this issue is there "fix" on feb 20th where they "Fixed an issue where using a single target charge, leap, or teleport ability would not remove targets from stealth or invisibility while you had a detection potion active." but instead doing just that, it also granted users to effectively hit a invisible target no matter what. In other words doing what everyone that hated NBs cloak wanted all along, effectively removing it from use.

I know there is a small group of people that hate NBs but it's really ridiculous to how much sway those that hate my class have on the development team. If ZoS wants to do something for NBs then they should get to work on buffing a good number of our skills, including cloak.

thankyourat

Stebarnz wrote: »

Deathlord92 wrote: »

Stebarnz wrote: »

Keep cloak as a memento for the rp'ers and balance the class properly!

Its not used in top tier pve and its not used in top tier pvp so get rid and get the class something that is still roguey but not invis and bring the class inline.

Everyone still wanting cloak and class to be higher damage, it wont happen while invis is there! FACT!

Yes i play both magnb and stamnb and no i dont use cloak

As I said in a previous post getting rid of shadow disguise will destroy class identity and will ruin the game for lots of players and you do not speak for everyone because I also play stamblade with dark cloak and I do very well and getting rid of shadow disguise will completely destroy the identity of the class we won’t be a nb or rogue anymore.

I said i dont speak for everyone only those who understand how the game works 2 posts further down pal.

Also read my post i said give it something else rougey, rougesk, rouguly, whatever, im not saying kill the class, i play it too, im saying give it something else other than invis which isnt used competitively anyway only in rp so it can be a memento.

If you keep invis you keep a weak class dont you see this? like talking to a wall man.

Cloak is just as strong as other defensive abilities so it makes little sense to punish the class offensively for it. Most classes have strong defensive abilities and strong offensive abilities I don’t see why nightblade needs to be different. What would you consider competitive PvP? I’ve always played magblade and have been basically playing solo for 5 years and I always slot cloak (when it works).

L_Nici

Sadly this post is very true. After the Big Patch itself I actually had no problems in PvP unlike many others, but since Monday I really feel the issues.

I play a Gankblade for fun, just made it last month, it worked amazing in BG and in overworld PvP, I mean who doesn't love to see his enemy die in a split second before he can even react, but since monday it feels like cloak is completely wasted. It costs Magicka and has no effect, Pets are following you, and attacking even if you were cloaked before you approached the enemy.
All Skills with a mentioned or hidden casttime on your side pull you out of cloak before you actually hit and on top of that even if you roledodge -> cloak absolutely every skill cast by the enemy will hit you, no matter if it is a light attack, a heavy attack, an ultimate or whatever, once spotted in combat, you can't cloak anymore because everything makes you visible again with wasted Magicka on your side.
As the only way to really defend yourself from a pretty quick death that is just a no go, I get if people are annoyed by NBs that hit->cloak->hit->cloak but there were counters to it, Mages light, Potions, Poisons, Hunter and AoE attacks, now you can ignore cloaking NBs because they are visible anyway no matter what you do.
It really is no surprise that the PvP gets cleared of all NBs, I rarely meet anyone who actually wants to play it, because it sucks so hard right now. Everything a NB can do a Stamsorc for example can do better, and doesn't even need to cloak for it.

Skullderic

A NB Cloaking (Not be be confused w/ Hidden) is what makes it a NB. For the most part, Its Cloak has been the same for years & years. Using most skills pull you out of stealth, Healing, buffs, etc.

Imo, update 25, 100% broke the skill.

Sets, Skill are based around it's stealth. When all damage removes it's stealth, Its no long a Cloak (stealth) ability.
When you're 20m away from a player & getting pew, pew'd (light attacks) and can't use the skill as intended that's not working.

So how about it, Is there going to be a fix for this @ZOS_GinaBruno ?

brandonv516

Stebarnz wrote: »

brandonv516 wrote: »

Putting aside all the noise from the trolls here, if the skill is broken we need it to be addressed by someone.

I didn't see anything in the notes other than how gap closers interact with Cloak, so it seems like it is likely a bug.

Invisibility is a integral part of this game and that playstyle is kind of a deal breaker for some people.

What makes some people think it needs to magically go away or be turned into a roleplay tool at this stage in the game is beyond me.

When do YOU use cloak? Give me specific content and situation.

I use Shadowy Disguise regularly in high MMR BGs as both a healer Magblade and a damage Magblade on Xbox NA.

Not trying to be egotistical, but I have yet to meet a Magblade using Dark Cloak that has performed better than me.

But all I play is Magblade and all I do is BGs, so there's a reason I find success with Shadowy Disguise where others don't.

Irfind

The only reason why i play my NB is the PVP lvl rank i dont want to start new on another char (also its my first char in this game) sadly i am not helping my team mutch this days, i interrupt with magnum shot and shild my team with Barrier.

- Cloak doesn't work, but cost magicka (sometimes) and every other LA usw. breaks it
- since the patch even Executioner doesn't go off, after hammering 3-4 times it does but to bad my target is healed full *nice*

Nyladreas

Irfind wrote: »

The only reason why i play my NB is the PVP lvl rank i dont want to start new on another char (also its my first char in this game) sadly i am not helping my team mutch this days, i interrupt with magnum shot and shild my team with Barrier.

- Cloak doesn't work, but cost magicka (sometimes) and every other LA usw. breaks it
- since the patch even Executioner doesn't go off, after hammering 3-4 times it does but to bad my target is healed full *nice*

That's sad... Wow... I can't imagine abandoning my nightblade that much, but I totally see why

Kombinator

Tommy_The_Gun wrote: »

Kombinator wrote: »

I love the part when i can run through the entire public dungeon without pulling a single enemy with cloak. Something you can't do with any of the other classes.

Invisibility potions...

45sec. cd. Your turn!

Oh yes you can turn down to 30 with alchemy. Still in public dungeons you need 90% of the time.

Kombinator

Spaceroamer wrote: »

Kombinator wrote: »

I love the part when i can run through the entire public dungeon without pulling a single enemy with cloak. Something you can't do with any of the other classes.

I think, that cloak needs a bit rework. It shouldn't be an "escape from prison" card. Instead it should be for moving around, and engage.

My idea: default cloak: lasts 30 seconds, no other change.
morph1: your next sneak attack damage deals 100% more damage. Works only once on same target until it leaves combat.
morph2: unchanged.

You can do that with normal sneak, while using invisibility potions when needed (30 second cooldown).

And in public dungeons, and certain delves. It's needed 90% of the way.

Fur_like_snow

I find the comparison to the DW gap closer hilarious and ironic since that was a skill that wasn’t OP(when it was single target and not some horrible gap closer) that was changed for no other reason than for the sake of change.

If cloak is no longer as useful as it was in the past take it off your bar and consider alternatives.

Na0cho

So you want them to balance nb skills around bad performance instead of just fixing their game?

PieMaster1

Eatmyface wrote: »

Delete cloak. Delete snipe. Then we might see NB get some love again.

Until then, the class will just be associated with cowardly gameplay and exploits.

NO! DO NOT REMOVE CLOAK. This is the only thing that resembles actual stealth and sneaking by enemies in both game modes. Nightblade without it’s trademark stealth is just like every other class, ESO is becoming Communist from everything i’m seeing. (One Tamriel, anyone?)

If this skill gets removed i’m never coming back to this game. Maybe i’ll play LOTRO because THEIR sneak class has never been touched. A lot of people are playing it now for a 2007 PC game and honestly i’m much more familiar with the lore. Kind of like Runescape, also extremely immersive.

Skullderic

Na0cho wrote: »

So you want them to balance nb skills around bad performance instead of just fixing their game?

Shouldn't be hard to fix the game, i guess they're working on it. That has nothing to do w/ the change made to Cloak.

And I still don't know if it was changed or broken w/ the update. hasn't been confirmed.

Is there a NB rep? If so, what are they saying, if anything?

Edit: So as not to be confused, My main is a Mag Sorc.

Its a little odd, the last 2 months i started working on a NB Bomber & a NB DpS. then this Cloak mess happened.

Tried to play my bomber, that was funny & by funny I mean a joke. all damage pulls you out of stealth. So i just run at the mob and hope for the best. >.>

Nyladreas

Na0cho wrote: »

So you want them to balance nb skills around bad performance instead of just fixing their game?

God no. Never. I want them to balance in addition to fixing their game.

Tommy_The_Gun

Kombinator wrote: »

Tommy_The_Gun wrote: »

Kombinator wrote: »

I love the part when i can run through the entire public dungeon without pulling a single enemy with cloak. Something you can't do with any of the other classes.

Invisibility potions...

45sec. cd. Your turn!

Oh yes you can turn down to 30 with alchemy. Still in public dungeons you need 90% of the time.

You sound like you would want to have it for free on every class....

Edit:
Can NB have free streak too ?

Nyladreas

Tommy_The_Gun wrote: »

Kombinator wrote: »

Tommy_The_Gun wrote: »

Kombinator wrote: »

I love the part when i can run through the entire public dungeon without pulling a single enemy with cloak. Something you can't do with any of the other classes.

Invisibility potions...

45sec. cd. Your turn!

Oh yes you can turn down to 30 with alchemy. Still in public dungeons you need 90% of the time.

You sound like you would want to have it for free on every class....

Edit:
Can NB have free streak too ?

Can you actually imagine though? I would become 100% more addicted almost instantly.

Skullderic

NB Cloak ~ NO~ Bait or Bash. Thx.

Nyladreas

martinhpb16_ESO wrote: »

Mr_Walker wrote: »

Nyladreas wrote: »

That's why so many of us end up just running so often after we hit people.

When you do that, we're both stuck in combat. The worst part is the idiots who do this, cloak off, I get bored of looking, try and jog off, maybe hopefully get out of combat again, and they engage again. Rinse and repeat. A lot don't even seem to be using it as a tool to survive and win fights any more, just to be pests. It's just sheer stupidity.

Sorry, but my sympathy has evaporated. Also sick of stam sorcs who streak through you then just vanish off into the distance. If you're going to engage, fight. If you don't actually want to fight, do us both a favour and don't hit people.

If you really want to be a pest go to the crafting stations at Summerset and blast music.

Presumably you feel the same DKs running around rocks, or wardens that can only be killed by a zerg, or groups hiding in towers or the myriad of ways players evade death - no? didn't think so

So noble of you to choose the way of the samurai

I get it, but please try not to go this way.

jadarock

Stebarnz wrote: »

brandonv516 wrote: »

Putting aside all the noise from the trolls here, if the skill is broken we need it to be addressed by someone.

I didn't see anything in the notes other than how gap closers interact with Cloak, so it seems like it is likely a bug.

Invisibility is a integral part of this game and that playstyle is kind of a deal breaker for some people.

What makes some people think it needs to magically go away or be turned into a roleplay tool at this stage in the game is beyond me.

When do YOU use cloak? Give me specific content and situation.

In pvp i use it to engage or disengage for positioning ect and also to guarantee a crit.

Why?

brandonv516

jadarock wrote: »

Stebarnz wrote: »

brandonv516 wrote: »

Putting aside all the noise from the trolls here, if the skill is broken we need it to be addressed by someone.

I didn't see anything in the notes other than how gap closers interact with Cloak, so it seems like it is likely a bug.

Invisibility is a integral part of this game and that playstyle is kind of a deal breaker for some people.

What makes some people think it needs to magically go away or be turned into a roleplay tool at this stage in the game is beyond me.

When do YOU use cloak? Give me specific content and situation.

In pvp i use it to engage or disengage for positioning ect and also to guarantee a crit.

Why?

He asked the question because he believes invisibility cannot be used in competitive PvP content.

He is wrong though.

Obviously I agree that it is useless in endgame PvE content.

Iskiab

brandonv516 wrote: »

Stebarnz wrote: »

brandonv516 wrote: »

Putting aside all the noise from the trolls here, if the skill is broken we need it to be addressed by someone.

I didn't see anything in the notes other than how gap closers interact with Cloak, so it seems like it is likely a bug.

Invisibility is a integral part of this game and that playstyle is kind of a deal breaker for some people.

What makes some people think it needs to magically go away or be turned into a roleplay tool at this stage in the game is beyond me.

When do YOU use cloak? Give me specific content and situation.

I use Shadowy Disguise regularly in high MMR BGs as both a healer Magblade and a damage Magblade on Xbox NA.

Not trying to be egotistical, but I have yet to meet a Magblade using Dark Cloak that has performed better than me.

But all I play is Magblade and all I do is BGs, so there's a reason I find success with Shadowy Disguise where others don't.

I played with dark cloak for a bit, it was good right up until about a half year ago when dizzy got buffed. Since then I think shadowy disguise is definitely better because without a burst heal magblades can’t deal with high burst damage, it’s run or die.

Myself I just play magblade 100% ranged, I dropped soul harvest and added meteor.

Most people who talk up dark cloak are remembering a magblade who did well from a while ago, not recently.

dazee

Eatmyface wrote: »

Delete cloak. Delete snipe. Then we might see NB get some love again.

Until then, the class will just be associated with cowardly gameplay and exploits.

How about make it viable to dodge snipes so theres counterplay and not just removing any playstyle you personally dont approve of?

Stebarnz

brandonv516 wrote: »

Stebarnz wrote: »

brandonv516 wrote: »

Putting aside all the noise from the trolls here, if the skill is broken we need it to be addressed by someone.

I didn't see anything in the notes other than how gap closers interact with Cloak, so it seems like it is likely a bug.

Invisibility is a integral part of this game and that playstyle is kind of a deal breaker for some people.

What makes some people think it needs to magically go away or be turned into a roleplay tool at this stage in the game is beyond me.

When do YOU use cloak? Give me specific content and situation.

I use Shadowy Disguise regularly in high MMR BGs as both a healer Magblade and a damage Magblade on Xbox NA.

Not trying to be egotistical, but I have yet to meet a Magblade using Dark Cloak that has performed better than me.

But all I play is Magblade and all I do is BGs, so there's a reason I find success with Shadowy Disguise where others don't.

So obviously you want the ONLY class you play to be better no matter what, where as im saying for the good of the class and game over all, if you need cloak to be effective thats cool you gonna have to bite the bullet as it gets less and less effective because as long as cloak is there it wont get balanced correctly as its too powerful on stam blade while initiating combat, thats the balancing act they have to play.

Mag nb is in a bad place and you have to scarifice a lot to get anywhere near good enough to compete. Stam close but not as bad.

Ive not met a magblade i cant kill but i have been ripped by a couple of really good stam blades.

Nyladreas

Stebarnz wrote: »

brandonv516 wrote: »

Stebarnz wrote: »

brandonv516 wrote: »

Putting aside all the noise from the trolls here, if the skill is broken we need it to be addressed by someone.

I didn't see anything in the notes other than how gap closers interact with Cloak, so it seems like it is likely a bug.

Invisibility is a integral part of this game and that playstyle is kind of a deal breaker for some people.

What makes some people think it needs to magically go away or be turned into a roleplay tool at this stage in the game is beyond me.

When do YOU use cloak? Give me specific content and situation.

I use Shadowy Disguise regularly in high MMR BGs as both a healer Magblade and a damage Magblade on Xbox NA.

Not trying to be egotistical, but I have yet to meet a Magblade using Dark Cloak that has performed better than me.

But all I play is Magblade and all I do is BGs, so there's a reason I find success with Shadowy Disguise where others don't.

So obviously you want the ONLY class you play to be better no matter what, where as im saying for the good of the class and game over all, if you need cloak to be effective thats cool you gonna have to bite the bullet as it gets less and less effective.

It's extremely stupid though. Why should anyone ruin a valid playstyle and make it weak or subpar. It doesn't have to be like that at all, but someone at ZOS actually needs to get off their social media and DO SOMETHING.