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GAME BREAKING ISSUE - spamming block can now disconnect you from the server

  • mocap
    mocap
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    confirm. ~20 seconds. High ping, then disconnect.
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  • fred4
    fred4
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    If only t-bagging would produce this result.
    PC EU (EP): Magicka NB (main), Stamina NB, Stamina DK, Stamina Sorcerer, Magicka Warden, Magicka Templar, Stamina Templar
    PC NA (EP): Magicka NB
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  • RD065
    RD065
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    The only times I've crashed is going to homes but nothing in combat but tonight twice between Dolhman's. One time I was jumping around, the other I was standing still.
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  • Thevampirenight
    Thevampirenight
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    Well l have a theory, basically its the way its handled now. To fix health desync issues and dead times with block. Which I assume was hurting performance hence the change. How block canceling worked before update 25 from what I understand there was a window a desync between the animation cancel and then communicating with the server. Basically dead time which for blocking could be disastrous if this happened when you need block the most and this delay in communication with the server. If at the wrong moment the block cancel actually causes you to die because of the desync and dead time.

    Now the new blocking system has a two way better communication with the server where animation canceling still works however. There is a priority communication between the two. My theory is when you block canceling its still desyncing out the animation but in another way. Your desyncing the communication itself. Before it caused a delay before communicating, now it is delaying communication between client and servers mid communication. Can possibly animation cancel a few times with block however it might mess with the communication in the same manner if you for example you disconnect you internet and reconnect it just a couple of seconds after causing you to lose connection to the servers and you get kicked to log in screen.

    Try this, try spamming block without animation canceling just block do this many 7 to 8 times or even ten or twenty times then stop. Wait thirty seconds then try spamming block with your animation canceling routine. If I'm right what it would do is disconnect you because the communication might think you lost internet access and cut you off from the servers. If my theory is wrong then this bug would happen even when not animation canceling.

    I tried replicating it but it seems not to be disconnecting me. So it might be an issue some players have and other players do not. Or it could be because my latency seems to be in a good place when I was testing it or because I'm in one of my player homes trying to replicate it. I'm not sure so it might be a case on case basis bug.
    Edited by Thevampirenight on February 29, 2020 7:48AM
    PC NA
    Please add Fangs to Vampires.
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  • fred4
    fred4
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    RD065 wrote: »
    The only times I've crashed is going to homes but nothing in combat but tonight twice between Dolhman's. One time I was jumping around, the other I was standing still.
    This thread isn't crashing, though. That's the other one. This thread is about a clean disconnect to login screen.
    PC EU (EP): Magicka NB (main), Stamina NB, Stamina DK, Stamina Sorcerer, Magicka Warden, Magicka Templar, Stamina Templar
    PC NA (EP): Magicka NB
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  • fred4
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    Try this, try spamming block without animation canceling just block do this many 7 to 8 times or even ten or twenty times then stop.
    It results in a logout, for me, if I do this long enough (20 to 30 seconds). I don't have to cancel anything. Standing in PvE, outside of combat.

    We only need to show ZOS how to reproduce this. We don't have the source code and don't know how this truly works. As a programmer it drives me up the wall when customers speculate and they want their uninformed speculation to be heard.
    PC EU (EP): Magicka NB (main), Stamina NB, Stamina DK, Stamina Sorcerer, Magicka Warden, Magicka Templar, Stamina Templar
    PC NA (EP): Magicka NB
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  • Major_Lag
    Major_Lag
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    SeveN085 wrote: »
    Yep, just like when you spam too much 2 or more emotes with addons that let you bind them to buttons.
    Wait, so blocking is an emote now? :D
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  • Sorbin
    Sorbin
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    Dusk_Coven wrote: »
    SeveN085 wrote: »
    If you don't believe, spam block button yourself real fast for like 10-15 seconds and you will get kicked.
    L2Pissue wrote: »
    Yep it works
    I just spammed block for 15 seconds to log out,
    Thanks for this feature.

    Then maybe don't go around spamming block for 15 seconds till you're kicked?
    If it turns out to be destabilizing the server and/or affecting the players around you, honestly a kick should be followed by a ban for deliberately sabotaging the game.

    Stop shooting yourselves in the foot and asking ZOS for a bandaid.

    LOL
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  • fred4
    fred4
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    Major_Lag wrote: »
    SeveN085 wrote: »
    Yep, just like when you spam too much 2 or more emotes with addons that let you bind them to buttons.
    Wait, so blocking is an emote now? :D
    Yeah, you gotta have boundaries.
    PC EU (EP): Magicka NB (main), Stamina NB, Stamina DK, Stamina Sorcerer, Magicka Warden, Magicka Templar, Stamina Templar
    PC NA (EP): Magicka NB
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  • Foxhearted
    Foxhearted
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    Just got kicked out the game just from reading this thread... :D
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  • WilliamESO
    WilliamESO
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    Thanks ZOS it's great !!! only skills an IQ deserves to work in combat now players have to be good instead of spamming block
    Edited by WilliamESO on February 29, 2020 8:15AM
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  • Mitrenga
    Mitrenga
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    Hire this man for your QA team, ZOS.
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  • itscompton
    itscompton
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    Dusk_Coven wrote: »
    I dunno how well you read the OP, in which they describe this causing crashes in the course of their legitimate gameplay during battlegrounds depending on how often their different class characters block. Another poster noted that this explains some of their crashes in trials.

    Or, this 15 seconds of spamming block is triggering ANOTHER reason for the game logging them out that doesn't have anything to do with a live situation. Like one specifically designed to detect people spamming block or other things for no reason. Or, as the OP included,
    SeveN085 wrote: »
    Yep, just like when you spam too much 2 or more emotes with addons that let you bind them to buttons.
    Unintended behavior outside the bounds of reasonable expectation.
    Maybe spamming the same action over and over without doing anything in between is one of the indicators to initiate a kick of the player. Who knows?
    If in the course of "normal" gameplay someone does in fact stand around for 15 seconds doing nothing but spam-clicking block... maybe that's considered unintended and unreasonable by ZOS.

    And if someone who does a lot of blocking gets kicked after a lot LESS time than 10-15 seconds, then it's even more likely that some other mechanic than straight block spam is at work.

    Sure, spamming block a lot may be related to crashes, but being able to replicate this one unreasonable behavior, is, on its own, not enough cause to accuse ZOS of negligence. It just shows that players can do unreasonable things. And when players do unreasonable things, kicking them off the server is an acceptable way to stop it.

    Lol, you should just stop because if you dig yourself any deeper you're going to wind up in China and catch the Coronavirus.
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  • Thevampirenight
    Thevampirenight
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    fred4 wrote: »
    Try this, try spamming block without animation canceling just block do this many 7 to 8 times or even ten or twenty times then stop.
    It results in a logout, for me, if I do this long enough (20 to 30 seconds). I don't have to cancel anything. Standing in PvE, outside of combat.

    We only need to show ZOS how to reproduce this. We don't have the source code and don't know how this truly works. As a programmer it drives me up the wall when customers speculate and they want their uninformed speculation to be heard.

    Well that was one theory I could think of but clearly is wrong since it disconnects people even if not block canceling so that isn't the culprit. Sometimes speculation can help if it can help narrow down a problem most of the time it might not. But I understand your point we don't know the source code could be any number of reasons why its happening. Its likely a bug that hasn't been stamped out yet, I'm sure they are still working on fixing any bugs or kinks with the new block system. If they get knowledge of them and I'm sure threads like this helps them find out these issues. So hopefully its something Zenimax is able to replicate and fix.

    Edited by Thevampirenight on February 29, 2020 9:01AM
    PC NA
    Please add Fangs to Vampires.
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  • fred4
    fred4
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    WilliamESO wrote: »
    Thanks ZOS it's great !!! only skills an IQ deserves to work in combat now players have to be good instead of spamming block
    I think you confuse selective blocking with perma-blocking. Only the former will trigger this problem. As far as I can tell the latter won't.
    PC EU (EP): Magicka NB (main), Stamina NB, Stamina DK, Stamina Sorcerer, Magicka Warden, Magicka Templar, Stamina Templar
    PC NA (EP): Magicka NB
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  • Varana
    Varana
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    Well that was one theory I could think of
    Or in other words, "let me quickly think of some way to connect an actual problem with my wild theories about animation cancelling so I can bring that up again in a totally unrelated topic!" ;)
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  • JumpmanLane
    JumpmanLane
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    Confirmed. Block leads to crashing. Spam block and you crash. They don't even all go off.

    As an aside, in Blessed Crucible with 84 ping and 60 fps (my monitor is capped at 60), solo, block didn't reliably go off. I couldn't block when i needed to block. I didn't die of course; but, I ate damage I wouldn't have say a week ago.

    Further. Cyrodill is BROKEN. Everyone knows. Crash after crash. I'd rather have the lag and poor performance of last week, rather than what we have there now. It's like this patch broke the GAME. I'm not gonna even go into leap...

    New players won't notice. Very few new players rush off to Cyro, (I did! Level 10 lol). Bad players won't care. They don't push scores in Maelstrom or trials.

    The chances of these changes just being reverted until a truly working version of said changes is created is slim to none. All we can hope for is a "fix." It's getting to the point the WHOLE game needs a fix...interest wanes...

    Edited by JumpmanLane on February 29, 2020 11:26AM
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  • Tommy_The_Gun
    Tommy_The_Gun
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    "spamming block can now disconnect you from the server"

    You can't keep a straight face when reading game "features" like that... :joy::D
    Just LOL.... ZOS fixed block & improved block animation cancel... I can't stop laughing :joy::joy:
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  • Kr3do
    Kr3do
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    ZOS is ingenious.
    Blocking causes performance issues, so just kick everyone that's blocking.
    How didn't they come up with that earlier?
    Edited by Kr3do on February 29, 2020 11:27AM
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  • JumpmanLane
    JumpmanLane
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    "spamming block can now disconnect you from the server"

    You can't keep a straight face when reading game "features" like that... :joy::D
    Just LOL.... ZOS fixed block & improved block animation cancel... I can't stop laughing :joy::joy:

    You left out the funniest part: "ZOS fixed block & improved block animation cancel.. .and improved performance in Cyrodil by doing so!" lol
    Edited by JumpmanLane on February 29, 2020 11:31AM
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  • Flamingfunk
    Flamingfunk
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    Can confirm, no wonder I got logged out during battlegrounds so often.
    Could this be a "fix" to the block macro users?
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  • JinxxND
    JinxxND
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    Lol anyone else find it funny how last patch of all the changes that needed to be made to improve performance and balance issues they choose to go work on block which no one asked for or wanted and now its creating a whole new slew of problems. This is like a common trend with the current combat team and it blows my mind that whoever's in charge of them allows them to go through with their ideas with their track record of changes that have the game going like 1 step forward and 10 steps back.
    PC NA -
    'Jinxx - Nightblade
    'Jinxx X Necromancer
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  • VaranisArano
    VaranisArano
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    I was able to replicate it. Ticket # 200229-001623

    Blocking at a steady pace didn't trigger a logout.
    Spamming Caltrops+block didn't trigger it.

    Rapidly clicking block did send me back to the login screen.

    Edit:
    Additional testing, though I only did this once.
    5 secs of rapid blocking - fine
    10 secs of rapid blocking - fine
    15 secs of rapid blocking - fine
    20 secs of rapid blocking - to the log-in screen with me!
    Edited by VaranisArano on February 29, 2020 12:59PM
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  • Carespanker
    Carespanker
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    I was able to replicate it.

    Blocking at a steady pace didn't trigger a logout.
    Spamming Caltrops+block didn't trigger it.

    Rapidly clicking block did send me back to the login screen.

    I triggered it tanking vet blackrose third and forth boss multiple times last night. It may be a bug in specific environments but it's a bug nonetheless.
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  • Aurielle
    Aurielle
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    If only the game would auto boot people who spam light attacks in dungeons. :p
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  • JinxxND
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    Aurielle wrote: »
    If only the game would auto boot people who spam light attacks in dungeons. :p

    Lol
    PC NA -
    'Jinxx - Nightblade
    'Jinxx X Necromancer
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  • JanTanhide
    JanTanhide
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    Dusk_Coven wrote: »
    SeveN085 wrote: »
    If you don't believe, spam block button yourself real fast for like 10-15 seconds and you will get kicked.
    L2Pissue wrote: »
    Yep it works
    I just spammed block for 15 seconds to log out,
    Thanks for this feature.

    Then maybe don't go around spamming block for 15 seconds till you're kicked?
    If it turns out to be destabilizing the server and/or affecting the players around you, honestly a kick should be followed by a ban for deliberately sabotaging the game.

    Stop shooting yourselves in the foot and asking ZOS for a bandaid.

    Pretty silly thing to write. Op found a serious bug. Let's get it fixed.
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  • Granicus
    Granicus
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    This actually solves the occasional Logout issue where you’re mysteriously required to wait for the countdown to zero, and then about another 5-10 seconds after the countdown, to actually Logout! Just spam Block for a quicker exit! Can we get a keybind on this? :);)

    Wow, just wow, this game. SMH 🤦‍♂️
    PC/NA
    PvE
    Intel I9-9900K
    32GB RAM
    2x 1TB Samsung 970 Pro NVMe M.2 SSDs
    Nvidia RTX 2080 TI 11GB
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  • Cirantille
    Cirantille
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    Omg

    It is true

    I just tried it :O

    It kicked me out

    I usually do blocks when I am not doing anything and bored because the Psijic globe thingy looks funny and this :o

    Is it because they made changes to block system?

    Because in Cyrodiil sometimes you press buttons too many times in order for a skill, block or LA to fire, could that be a reason that we keep crashing?
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  • TheFM
    TheFM
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    SeveN085 wrote: »
    If someone's wondering... this is not exclusive to spamming. Clicking it real fast is just the easiest way to replicate this bug. In PVP you may hold block for a second, drop it and then depending on the situation, hold it again for a second and drop it again and do that over and over again. Add in some block cancel animations in between and that's already enough to get booted.

    Lol considering you have to dodge with block first on controller, this would explain a lot. Wtaf ZoS xD.
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