Terrible Drop Rate for Dungeon Blueprints

MehrunesFlagon

markulrich1966 wrote: »

MehrunesFlagon wrote: »

Elara_Northwind wrote: »

Blaqmagik wrote: »

Almost as bad as me having to complete pve content in order to be able to competently compete in pvp. You'll be alright

Haha! Yes, we were talking about that too! Before housing, all I did in this game was pvp, and it was annoying having to farm dungeons, but at least I was able to do them. Some of these people literally have never even done a dungeon before, let alone a vet HM one. Again, I'm not talking about all housing people here, but many do only play the game for the housing aspect.

I agree though, they should probably make the best sets for pvp only available in pvp and same for pve, it would make people much happier

If you want hard or near impossible to get,you should look at The Yolo and Lokke statues and what they require to purchase.They require HM on those two dragon vSS.Also those things are bind on pick up,so no buying one from people that can clear either.

those are achievement furnishings, not standard parts.

Yes I am aware of that.

Aliyavana

Which furnishing plan requires hm btw?

Elara_Northwind

Aliyavana wrote: »

Which furnishing plan requires hm btw?

It doesn't require it, but it's pretty much impossible even with it. The drop rate is that insanely low.

https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/489695/new-scalebreaker-furnishing-plans-elsweyr-shrine-tower-can-anyone-make-them-yet

max_only

Dusk_Coven wrote: »

Elara_Northwind wrote: »

People who want to enjoy their time in the game doing pvp or pve aren't forced to spend hours decorating houses in order to get the things they need, so why is it ok for this to be the other way around?

Because
(1) no game has figured out how to make decorating a "game" -- that is, with mechanics and a measurable goal -- that is challenging;

Small refutation. No game in this genre you mean to say. There are games that have decorating as a mechanic with measurable goals and a challenge.

The Sims and Animal Crossing are the first to come to mind.

Elara_Northwind

max_only wrote: »

Dusk_Coven wrote: »

Elara_Northwind wrote: »

People who want to enjoy their time in the game doing pvp or pve aren't forced to spend hours decorating houses in order to get the things they need, so why is it ok for this to be the other way around?

Because
(1) no game has figured out how to make decorating a "game" -- that is, with mechanics and a measurable goal -- that is challenging;

Small refutation. No game in this genre you mean to say. There are games that have decorating as a mechanic with measurable goals and a challenge.

The Sims and Animal Crossing are the first to come to mind.

To me, decorating in ESO is a game. Maybe not in terms of in game achievements, but in terms of personal achievements and the community. I always have a goal when I am decorating or building in ESO, and at times it can be extremely challenging.

Aliyavana

So its already rare since it drops in hm only, but an additional layer of rng is added that makes them even rarer

yodased

Elara_Northwind wrote: »

Dusk_Coven wrote: »

Elara_Northwind wrote: »

People who want to enjoy their time in the game doing pvp or pve aren't forced to spend hours decorating houses in order to get the things they need, so why is it ok for this to be the other way around?

Because
(1) no game has figured out how to make decorating a "game" -- that is, with mechanics and a measurable goal -- that is challenging; and this is easier said than done considering that people are willing to exploit whatever they can do in order to reduce or remove challenge in any endeavour, even if it means basically bypassing the game part. e.g., Fungal Grotto 1 shortcut.

(2) rarity is gated behind challenge of some sort other than currency because too quickly currency is no challenge

(3) without rarity, everyone can get everything quickly, and there's no more game left. Well, except for the furniture people because they can continue to happily experiment with furnishing different houses endlessly. But even with these groups...

(4) rarity -> exclusivity -> social status. And that's an underlying component of housing (and outfits). It's hard for non-housing non-outfit people to understand sometimes, but there's a certain something to owning something that few people have.
That's why companies like Rolex price everything so high (exclusivity) AND limit quantities around the world (rarity).

I agree, I think these plans should still be rare, just not locked behind vet hm dungeons which make them unobtainable to the vast majority of people who actually need them. The rarity isn't the biggest issue here, it's the fact that even the chance to get these plans is not a possibility for a large part of the playerbase who actually care about them. If they were as easily obtainable on normal, then that would solve the issue of both housing people being able to have the opportunity to get the things that they need to enjoy their own game, and the traders taking advantage of the people who they know don't have the time or expertise to do a vet HM dungeon 100 times for a chance to get a plan.

If they want the thing they figure it out. If they are that important you can not design around them buy them.

Also by your own definitions you devalue the players who actually DO have the time and skill to run the content, disparage them calling them bad people taking advantage. How date someone be compensated for their efforts.

If people in the housing community are just upset they want something and it's inconvienent they don't have it ommediately for a price they feel is fair, well kick rocks.

Elara_Northwind

yodased wrote: »

Elara_Northwind wrote: »

Dusk_Coven wrote: »

Elara_Northwind wrote: »

People who want to enjoy their time in the game doing pvp or pve aren't forced to spend hours decorating houses in order to get the things they need, so why is it ok for this to be the other way around?

Because
(1) no game has figured out how to make decorating a "game" -- that is, with mechanics and a measurable goal -- that is challenging; and this is easier said than done considering that people are willing to exploit whatever they can do in order to reduce or remove challenge in any endeavour, even if it means basically bypassing the game part. e.g., Fungal Grotto 1 shortcut.

(2) rarity is gated behind challenge of some sort other than currency because too quickly currency is no challenge

(3) without rarity, everyone can get everything quickly, and there's no more game left. Well, except for the furniture people because they can continue to happily experiment with furnishing different houses endlessly. But even with these groups...

(4) rarity -> exclusivity -> social status. And that's an underlying component of housing (and outfits). It's hard for non-housing non-outfit people to understand sometimes, but there's a certain something to owning something that few people have.
That's why companies like Rolex price everything so high (exclusivity) AND limit quantities around the world (rarity).

I agree, I think these plans should still be rare, just not locked behind vet hm dungeons which make them unobtainable to the vast majority of people who actually need them. The rarity isn't the biggest issue here, it's the fact that even the chance to get these plans is not a possibility for a large part of the playerbase who actually care about them. If they were as easily obtainable on normal, then that would solve the issue of both housing people being able to have the opportunity to get the things that they need to enjoy their own game, and the traders taking advantage of the people who they know don't have the time or expertise to do a vet HM dungeon 100 times for a chance to get a plan.

If they want the thing they figure it out. If they are that important you can not design around them buy them.

Also by your own definitions you devalue the players who actually DO have the time and skill to run the content, disparage them calling them bad people taking advantage. How date someone be compensated for their efforts.

If people in the housing community are just upset they want something and it's inconvienent they don't have it ommediately for a price they feel is fair, well kick rocks.

There really is no need to be so rude. I devalued nobody at all (although it always makes me laugh to myself a little inside when people equate the word 'skill' to a video game) to me everybody is equal and lovely until they prove themselves to be otherwise, such as those people who go around buying furnishing plans out of guild stores in order to increase their prices, yes those people I will happily devalue. I will never see a person who exploits others to benefit themselves as a good human being.

Half of the 'housing community' along with half of the playerbase, which is who we are actually talking about here, not just one community, can in fact do the dungeons, myself included (not due to some magical skill though) but they still don't get the plans because the drop rate is so completely and utterly ridiculous, even on vet hm where apparently chances are supposed to be increased. The drop rate is completely broken and it needs fixing, for everybody, especially for such a simple item which is also available for crowns. The entire thing is literally a money making ploy by ZOS, and only blindness could prevent somebody from seeing that, or realizing that the drop rate for these plans is broken. And no, it is not acceptable for people to sell a furnishing plan for a very basic platform for 6 million gold, the highest I have seen one of these go for. I have completed the dungeon on vet hm a few times, and I can assure you, the effort is minimal and certainly not worth 6 million gold!

Nobody is complaining about having the plan immediately either, it should be a rare reward but not almost impossible to obtain for anybody in the game. I can only assume that you have no idea what this thread or post is even about from your extremely uninformed and rude comment, either that or you have had a bad day and want somebody to argue with, if so, I hope that this has satisfied your urge to spread a bit more negativity to the world, have a wonderful evening

Elara_Northwind

Aliyavana wrote: »

So its already rare since it drops in hm only, but an additional layer of rng is added that makes them even rarer

Yes, rare unless you want to buy them for 600 crowns a piece... And not even just rare, even on vet hm they are pretty much impossible to obtain. The drop rate is so utterly ridiculous, but I guess it's sold a few extra crowns...

Mr_Walker

Didn't read whole thread. Have I missed all the gatekeepers?

Juhasow

Some people take housing too serious. And that is why prices on rare furnishings are high.

Elara_Northwind

Juhasow wrote: »

Some people take housing too serious. And that is why prices on rare furnishings are high.

Indeed. Some people take the entire game too seriously. People are rude and belittling to one another about all aspects of the GAME on a daily basis, no matter which area of the game it may be, it's very sad to see. People also take the trading side of the game far too seriously, to be spending their time running around buying up plans all day to rip people off by increasing the value of them.

It doesn't change the fact though, that the drop rate for these needs increasing on both vet and normal, because it's currently at a level that is just ridiculous.

deepseamk20b14_ESO

If there is nothing to work for what’s the point? I’m still trying to unlock some trial skins and I mostly PvP. Slowly but surely I get them. It’s a pain, I get it. But it’s impossible to make everyone completely happy because people have different goals in a game. You make it hard to get stuff people will not like it. Make it easy and there will be another group of people who don’t like that.

Grimm13

Elara_Northwind wrote: »

Grimm13 wrote: »

Elara_Northwind wrote: »

...snip...

Would you lock a new rare weapon behind a housing or (I know they don't exist but) a roleplaying achievement? Would you introduce a new epic set which can only be obtained through fishing, but also so rare that you would need to fish for days to get one piece? It's almost like ZOS don't seem to realise that there are a huge amount of different players who play this game, not everybody is into the same thing, which is what makes this game so wonderfully diverse in the first place. Why make these plans so rare, and why lock them (or the most chance to get them) behind vet hm dungeons, when the majority of the people who want to use these plans don't do vet, or in some cases even normal dungeons, because they physically feel like they can't.

...snip...

You are so correct that not everyone is into the same thing. I see here that ZOS is spreading out where you can find some plans in various parts of the game. This gives a range of people into different things the chance to acquire something rare that they can collect, sale or trade. With diversity of play come diversity of rewards.

I agree with you that people should try new things, variety is the spice of life, but at the same time some players who aren't into that sort of gameplay can't complete the dungeon on vet, they can barely complete it on normal, so why can't ZOS just allow the drop rate for this very plain ordinary platform, which is also available on the crown store, it's not like it is an achievement item, be just as obtainable on normal as it is on vet? Because they want their numbers to look better whilst people farm for gold, or they want people to spend more money on crowns when they need this item? Or maybe it is a mixture of both. I very much doubt that ZOS care about people enjoying experiencing different parts of the game. They care about money and figures, and this plan being locked mostly behind vet hm gives them just that.

No I am saying they are giving different groups of people the chance to get something unique to their choice of play. It's just not your choice. In an area that is your choice you could be getting something else that they do not and is not their play style idea.

This is how you spread items out into a game so that you can foster trade between players should they choose not to pursue all aspects of the game. Having items drop in unique areas is not new to the game been done since beta. Armor, weapons and even housing items and plans. Or did you see the bubbler available all over Tamriel and gotten by other than picking a pocket?

Now drop rates is a whole different issue. Drop rates have been horrible throughout the game.

Carbonised

First of all, there's so much misinformation and speculation in this thread that you wouldn't think people even read patch notes any more.

Here's the facts: Theres SIX recipes in Scalebreaker, 3 purple and 3 blue. 1 tower, 2 platforms and 3 shrines.
They are indeed sourced as ZOS mention in the patch notes, which means that they drop mostly from the last boss, with normal having a next to no chance of a drop at all, vet having a somewhat higher chance, and vet HM having the most generous dropchance.

In general, this system would be fine. It worked reasonably well for Wolfhunter dungeons, and you can buy the plans for not too much gold at traders.
This time, the dropchance seems to be a lot lower than last time, though, which means the plans are super rare, with prices of course going through the roof. Had the dropchance been slightly higher, we wouldn't be having this discussion. I also agree that essentially rewarding vet HM players with these super rare plans is a FU finger to the housing comunity, as those vet progression people already have a ton of other ways to earn huge amounts of gold, as many of them also sell completion runs, skins, titles and other dungeon/trial rewards for an obscene amount of gold.

I have bought all 6 plans for a large amount of M gold, and am selling all the items across all my trading guilds on PC-EU for a reasonable price, so at least you can buy any amount of them for your building, so you don't have to go to the crown store.
Considering that the mat cost alone for a purple platform is 10k, guild fees are around 2k and the plan cost is around 1M in investment, I don't think charging 18-20k per item is anything but reasonable.

In conclusion: In general I don't like sourcing housing plans behind ultra hard content. It gives a sour taste to most housing people. However, the current system has its benefits, some of us invest a large amount of gold in buying these plans, and selling them across our guilds will at least make more "casual" players able to buy them if they want them, without the huge investment for the actual plan. The dropchance for these particular plans, however, seems to be on the low side, and should probably have been increased a bit. Maybe this also shows just how few people actually bother running these ultra hard vet HM DLC dungeons, when not even the prospect of looting a 1-2M plan is enough to make people do that stupid content.

Elara_Northwind

deepseamk20b14_ESO wrote: »

If there is nothing to work for what’s the point? I’m still trying to unlock some trial skins and I mostly PvP. Slowly but surely I get them. It’s a pain, I get it. But it’s impossible to make everyone completely happy because people have different goals in a game. You make it hard to get stuff people will not like it. Make it easy and there will be another group of people who don’t like that.

The issue is that you are guaranteed your trial skin as a reward for completing an achievement, you could run a vet hm dungeon a million times and not even get one of these very basic looking, crown purchasable plans because the drop rate is broken...

It’s easy for some people to say that they don’t understand why some others can’t just go and do a vet dungeon because to them, that’s easy, but the truth of the matter is, to some people it’s not only ‘not easy’ but actually virtually impossible to complete even once, let alone the million times it could take to obtain one plan!

Elara_Northwind

Grimm13 wrote: »

Elara_Northwind wrote: »

Grimm13 wrote: »

Elara_Northwind wrote: »

...snip...

Would you lock a new rare weapon behind a housing or (I know they don't exist but) a roleplaying achievement? Would you introduce a new epic set which can only be obtained through fishing, but also so rare that you would need to fish for days to get one piece? It's almost like ZOS don't seem to realise that there are a huge amount of different players who play this game, not everybody is into the same thing, which is what makes this game so wonderfully diverse in the first place. Why make these plans so rare, and why lock them (or the most chance to get them) behind vet hm dungeons, when the majority of the people who want to use these plans don't do vet, or in some cases even normal dungeons, because they physically feel like they can't.

...snip...

You are so correct that not everyone is into the same thing. I see here that ZOS is spreading out where you can find some plans in various parts of the game. This gives a range of people into different things the chance to acquire something rare that they can collect, sale or trade. With diversity of play come diversity of rewards.

I agree with you that people should try new things, variety is the spice of life, but at the same time some players who aren't into that sort of gameplay can't complete the dungeon on vet, they can barely complete it on normal, so why can't ZOS just allow the drop rate for this very plain ordinary platform, which is also available on the crown store, it's not like it is an achievement item, be just as obtainable on normal as it is on vet? Because they want their numbers to look better whilst people farm for gold, or they want people to spend more money on crowns when they need this item? Or maybe it is a mixture of both. I very much doubt that ZOS care about people enjoying experiencing different parts of the game. They care about money and figures, and this plan being locked mostly behind vet hm gives them just that.

No I am saying they are giving different groups of people the chance to get something unique to their choice of play. It's just not your choice. In an area that is your choice you could be getting something else that they do not and is not their play style idea.

This is how you spread items out into a game so that you can foster trade between players should they choose not to pursue all aspects of the game. Having items drop in unique areas is not new to the game been done since beta. Armor, weapons and even housing items and plans. Or did you see the bubbler available all over Tamriel and gotten by other than picking a pocket?

Now drop rates is a whole different issue. Drop rates have been horrible throughout the game.

I completely understand where you are coming from, but not only is the drop rate for this possibly one of the worst I have ever seen for anything in the game in my 5+ years of playing, but it’s also not a unique item... It’s a very basic platform which is readily available to buy for crowns.

Elara_Northwind

Carbonised wrote: »

First of all, there's so much misinformation and speculation in this thread that you wouldn't think people even read patch notes any more.

Here's the facts: Theres SIX recipes in Scalebreaker, 3 purple and 3 blue. 1 tower, 2 platforms and 3 shrines.
They are indeed sourced as ZOS mention in the patch notes, which means that they drop mostly from the last boss, with normal having a next to no chance of a drop at all, vet having a somewhat higher chance, and vet HM having the most generous dropchance.

In general, this system would be fine. It worked reasonably well for Wolfhunter dungeons, and you can buy the plans for not too much gold at traders.
This time, the dropchance seems to be a lot lower than last time, though, which means the plans are super rare, with prices of course going through the roof. Had the dropchance been slightly higher, we wouldn't be having this discussion. I also agree that essentially rewarding vet HM players with these super rare plans is a FU finger to the housing comunity, as those vet progression people already have a ton of other ways to earn huge amounts of gold, as many of them also sell completion runs, skins, titles and other dungeon/trial rewards for an obscene amount of gold.

I have bought all 6 plans for a large amount of M gold, and am selling all the items across all my trading guilds on PC-EU for a reasonable price, so at least you can buy any amount of them for your building, so you don't have to go to the crown store.
Considering that the mat cost alone for a purple platform is 10k, guild fees are around 2k and the plan cost is around 1M in investment, I don't think charging 18-20k per item is anything but reasonable.

In conclusion: In general I don't like sourcing housing plans behind ultra hard content. It gives a sour taste to most housing people. However, the current system has its benefits, some of us invest a large amount of gold in buying these plans, and selling them across our guilds will at least make more "casual" players able to buy them if they want them, without the huge investment for the actual plan. The dropchance for these particular plans, however, seems to be on the low side, and should probably have been increased a bit. Maybe this also shows just how few people actually bother running these ultra hard vet HM DLC dungeons, when not even the prospect of looting a 1-2M plan is enough to make people do that stupid content.

Thank you very much for your very fair, honest and informative post I think you have probably put the problem down into words better than anybody else, and it’s also very good of you to be selling the actual platform for people at a decent price! So at least people don’t have to spend real money, although ideally everybody should have an equal chance to be able to find these plans, weather they are capable of doing the dungeon on vet hm or not.

It’s not like people are asking for monster helms to drop in normal dungeons, it’s a platform.

idk

It seems like a great idea to put desired items behind challenging and specific content. Throughout the entire game there are very clear indications Zos is specifically encouraging us to play different content and this is not different.

While the sentence was fairly garbled, OP seems to indicate they do not want to spend time obtaining what they want to decorate their home. To that I suggest they do not have to. They can buy those plans or items crafted from them.

Elara_Northwind

idk wrote: »

It seems like a great idea to put desired items behind challenging and specific content. Throughout the entire game there are very clear indications Zos is specifically encouraging us to play different content and this is not different.

While the sentence was fairly garbled, OP seems to indicate they do not want to spend time obtaining what they want to decorate their home. To that I suggest they do not have to. They can buy those plans or items crafted from them.

Yes.... I would suggest reading a post before responding in future

idk

Elara_Northwind wrote: »

idk wrote: »

It seems like a great idea to put desired items behind challenging and specific content. Throughout the entire game there are very clear indications Zos is specifically encouraging us to play different content and this is not different.

While the sentence was fairly garbled, OP seems to indicate they do not want to spend time obtaining what they want to decorate their home. To that I suggest they do not have to. They can buy those plans or items crafted from them.

Yes.... I would suggest reading a post before responding in future

TBF it was very lengthy. I would suggest a TLDR summary with such long posts. However I seemed to have gotten the gist of it and merely missed you complaining about having to buy them since you do not want to clear the content.

Elara_Northwind

idk wrote: »

Elara_Northwind wrote: »

idk wrote: »

It seems like a great idea to put desired items behind challenging and specific content. Throughout the entire game there are very clear indications Zos is specifically encouraging us to play different content and this is not different.

While the sentence was fairly garbled, OP seems to indicate they do not want to spend time obtaining what they want to decorate their home. To that I suggest they do not have to. They can buy those plans or items crafted from them.

Yes.... I would suggest reading a post before responding in future

TBF it was very lengthy. I would suggest a TLDR summary with such long posts. However I seemed to have gotten the gist of it and merely missed you complaining about having to buy them since you do not want to clear the content.

Again, probably best not to blindly comment on random posts if you haven’t read them, kind of a weird thing to do.

I have completed the content multiple times, this is a thread about terrible drop rates, now please go and spread your negativity elsewhere on this beautiful morning. I hope that the rest of your day is a happier one

Dusk_Coven

Elara_Northwind wrote: »

Would you lock a new rare weapon behind a housing or (I know they don't exist but) a roleplaying achievement?

To be honest I'd love to see them try this just to see what the reaction would be.
Maybe a gear set that gives you a better chance of getting furnishing material drops from gathering nodes as a reward in a DLC that's about rebuilding (by making furnishings!) ruined / wartorn zones that have been secured after alliance/zone quests are done.

Elara_Northwind

Dusk_Coven wrote: »

Elara_Northwind wrote: »

Would you lock a new rare weapon behind a housing or (I know they don't exist but) a roleplaying achievement?

To be honest I'd love to see them try this just to see what the reaction would be.
Maybe a gear set that gives you a better chance of getting furnishing material drops from gathering nodes as a reward in a DLC that's about rebuilding (by making furnishings!) ruined / wartorn zones that have been secured after alliance/zone quests are done.

Haha! 😂 that would actually be a really cool idea! I would 100% wear that set when farming, because the drop rate for furnishing materials can be painful at times too!

modaretto

Elara_Northwind wrote: »

The issue is that you are guaranteed your trial skin as a reward for completing an achievement, you could run a vet hm dungeon a million times and not even get one of these very basic looking, crown purchasable plans because the drop rate is broken...

It’s easy for some people to say that they don’t understand why some others can’t just go and do a vet dungeon because to them, that’s easy, but the truth of the matter is, to some people it’s not only ‘not easy’ but actually virtually impossible to complete even once, let alone the million times it could take to obtain one plan!

I am a bit outdated here since not very active in game but I'm gonna comment on this based on my previous experience.

I have done Halls of Habrications on HM many times and not gotten the factotum polymorph myself, it's a pretty rare drop chance on that yet that's the fun of rerunning any content, you still have a chance of that rare surprise drop. Then there's imperial city and Soul Shriven skin. I've spent months in that damp dark place farming and haven't gotten it. Bought it recently during the event as it still didn't drop for me despite the increased drop chance. So I wouldn't say the housing community is specifically hindered here as all game aspects have some sort of reward hidden behind difficult and random content. There have also been reskins of both that skin and polymorph on limited time in crown stores, if i remember correctly it was 2k crowns, so when you compare it to a platform, the price seems fair as well.

But let's think specifics here about how much it costs to run a trial or a dungeon. Persoanlly a trial night would cost me 200 pots and unless I am doing a trial that has some nice drops that I can sell, it's gold that I am not getting back but investing in my progress. Multiply that by any amount of nights a week people do trials. For new and hard content dungeons cost is probably less between 50-100 pots unless you run content on dropped pots and blue gear but that's another story. I am not even counting all the golded gear you need especially jewelry costs nowadays.

All that's profitable atm is perhaps black rose prison with that motif drop. So if you see people selling runs in zone I wouldn't say it's because they want profit. For any progression group it's really no fun to have to do carries, so if they do it, it's probably to be able to afford their own progression runs because it's expensive as hell.

Atm every gaming group has something of profit to offer that is adequate to time and effort spent doing it, fishing has roe, farming has nirn and so on and so forth. I support any drop that gives the dungeon and trial community any payback on the time they put into it, it looks balanced and fair as it is but correct me on the drop and item info if mine are outdated.

Elara_Northwind

modaretto wrote: »

Elara_Northwind wrote: »

The issue is that you are guaranteed your trial skin as a reward for completing an achievement, you could run a vet hm dungeon a million times and not even get one of these very basic looking, crown purchasable plans because the drop rate is broken...

It’s easy for some people to say that they don’t understand why some others can’t just go and do a vet dungeon because to them, that’s easy, but the truth of the matter is, to some people it’s not only ‘not easy’ but actually virtually impossible to complete even once, let alone the million times it could take to obtain one plan!

I am a bit outdated here since not very active in game but I'm gonna comment on this based on my previous experience.

I have done Halls of Habrications on HM many times and not gotten the factotum polymorph myself, it's a pretty rare drop chance on that yet that's the fun of rerunning any content, you still have a chance of that rare surprise drop. Then there's imperial city and Soul Shriven skin. I've spent months in that damp dark place farming and haven't gotten it. Bought it recently during the event as it still didn't drop for me despite the increased drop chance. So I wouldn't say the housing community is specifically hindered here as all game aspects have some sort of reward hidden behind difficult and random content. There have also been reskins of both that skin and polymorph on limited time in crown stores, if i remember correctly it was 2k crowns, so when you compare it to a platform, the price seems fair as well.

But let's think specifics here about how much it costs to run a trial or a dungeon. Persoanlly a trial night would cost me 200 pots and unless I am doing a trial that has some nice drops that I can sell, it's gold that I am not getting back but investing in my progress. Multiply that by any amount of nights a week people do trials. For new and hard content dungeons cost is probably less between 50-100 pots unless you run content on dropped pots and blue gear but that's another story. I am not even counting all the golded gear you need especially jewelry costs nowadays.

All that's profitable atm is perhaps black rose prison with that motif drop. So if you see people selling runs in zone I wouldn't say it's because they want profit. For any progression group it's really no fun to have to do carries, so if they do it, it's probably to be able to afford their own progression runs because it's expensive as hell.

Atm every gaming group has something of profit to offer that is adequate to time and effort spent doing it, fishing has roe, farming has nirn and so on and so forth. I support any drop that gives the dungeon and trial community any payback on the time they put into it, it looks balanced and fair as it is but correct me on the drop and item info if mine are outdated.

No problem! It doesn't matter how often you play, everybodies informed opinions are just as valid

I have to say though, that you can't really compare things like skins to a plan of a simple platform which is purchasable with crowns. People go to these dungeons to get things like monster helms from the final boss, why lock a housing plan behind that too, when ZOS know full well that the majority of the housing community won't be able to complete the content?

There are many communities in this game and many of us, like myself, are drifters. I have been a part of pvp, pve and housing communities over the past 5+ years, and can safety say that people who mainly just focus on housing in this game have no real payback at all. It's an expensive hobby with no real reward aside from your own personal satisfaction. I also disagree with dungeons being expensive, even using 100 potions uses 25 of each flower, it's not much, and having completed this dungeon on vet hm myself, I really wouldn't say if was an insane amount of effort worth taking millions of gold from somebody for. People who are heavily into trials make much more than this just through carries. I have many friends in this game from all different areas of the game, and those in end game trials guilds are the richest of them all.

With all of that said, the drop rate for these very basic, crown purchasable and certainly not exclusive or achievement related plans is one of the worst I have ever seen in this game, it's absolutely ridiculous.I'm not arguing the fact that these plans should be rare, I think that adds to the excitement of finding them, but when they are so rare that you only know one person who has ever even found one, then you know that there is a problem. The drop rate for these plans needs to be made the same across both vet and normal, and increased overall IMO, because even on vet hm these plans are virtually impossible to come by, and it's not like they are dungeon related or even part of any sets in the dungeons which people may be farming. They are plans. For crown purchasable furniture.

mague

Elara_Northwind wrote: »

It just feels strange to lock rare furnishing plans behind dungeons, and then those furnishing plans fall into the wrong hands, and people who have busy real lives are having to farm gold for days to give to greedy traders just to get these plans! Its quite ridiculous.

There is nothing wrong with the situation and even in RP it make sense to talk to the "Undaunted" if you need a job get done. And for quite some of the Dungeon Crawlers such is their only income. Maybe they do alchemy and cooking but have to buy the ingredient. It should be a healthy relation...

The question is: Are they to greedy ? Haggle, haggle as housing community !

Dusk_Coven

Elara_Northwind wrote: »

There are many communities in this game and many of us, like myself, are drifters. I have been a part of pvp, pve and housing communities over the past 5+ years, and can safety say that people who mainly just focus on housing in this game have no real payback at all. It's an expensive hobby with no real reward aside from your own personal satisfaction.

We actually have it easier in ESO compared to something like NWO. Where you only have a CHANCE of successfully making something as mundane as a fireplace, assuming you qualify to craft that and have assembled the stupidly hard to get/expensive materials.
Too many MMOs use crafting as a currency sink / time sink unless the game revolves around crafting/building to begin with. (e.g., Cadria Item Shop is an interesting reverse MMO where crafting is required to adventure successfully and furnishing is required to support your crafting.)

Unless people like you continue to push for crafting / furnishing / decorating to become a more primary game activity, it won't change in this genre where kill-things-get-loot is the basic game, with bot-farming-for-gold a close second.

Elara_Northwind

mague wrote: »

Elara_Northwind wrote: »

It just feels strange to lock rare furnishing plans behind dungeons, and then those furnishing plans fall into the wrong hands, and people who have busy real lives are having to farm gold for days to give to greedy traders just to get these plans! Its quite ridiculous.

There is nothing wrong with the situation and even in RP it make sense to talk to the "Undaunted" if you need a job get done. And for quite some of the Dungeon Crawlers such is their only income. Maybe they do alchemy and cooking but have to buy the ingredient. It should be a healthy relation...

The question is: Are they to greedy ? Haggle, haggle as housing community !

The drop rate of the plans is completely and utterly broken, so there is definitely something wrong with the situation!!

Luckily, most people who are heavily into housing can craft, or know somebody who can craft most, if not all rare recipes, and we don't charge one another for furniture crafting because the community is a wonderful one, but nobody knows these ones, because the drop rate for them has been set so incredibly low that I think doing vet hm 100 times would probably still not give you just one of these plans! I still think that this is a money making ploy by ZOS, because the items are being sold for an unreasonable amount of crowns. How would trials people feel if those skins they farm were suddenly made available for crowns?

Not all but half of the community isn't able to complete the dungeon on vet, as even on normal it is a struggle for them. So many people just can't seem to see beyond their own nose when I mention this, it's like they can't comprehend somebody else not being able to do something just because they can, but the truth is that there is a huge gap between the players who regularly complete vet dungeons and trails, and those who have never completed even a normal dungeon in their lives, not everybody is able to do this dungeon on vet hm, and it's honestly just plain weird for ZOS to lock a basic furnishing plan behind this. The only reason I can see for them to do this is purely to get people who already spend £100s each month to spend even more if they want to use these platforms by purchasing them with crowns.

Elara_Northwind

Dusk_Coven wrote: »

Elara_Northwind wrote: »

There are many communities in this game and many of us, like myself, are drifters. I have been a part of pvp, pve and housing communities over the past 5+ years, and can safety say that people who mainly just focus on housing in this game have no real payback at all. It's an expensive hobby with no real reward aside from your own personal satisfaction.

We actually have it easier in ESO compared to something like NWO. Where you only have a CHANCE of successfully making something as mundane as a fireplace, assuming you qualify to craft that and have assembled the stupidly hard to get/expensive materials.
Too many MMOs use crafting as a currency sink / time sink unless the game revolves around crafting/building to begin with. (e.g., Cadria Item Shop is an interesting reverse MMO where crafting is required to adventure successfully and furnishing is required to support your crafting.)

Unless people like you continue to push for crafting / furnishing / decorating to become a more primary game activity, it won't change in this genre where kill-things-get-loot is the basic game, with bot-farming-for-gold a close second.

I will never stop pushing! ZOS will have to ban me to stop me from standing up for what I believe is right and just