QUIT CHANGING COMBAT EVERY PATCH

webrgesner
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Not many of us have gold like that. Im tired of having to gold out new gears, traitchange, and learning a new rotation. I DONT MIND them changing it every now and then but this the 3rd time in a row. This sets us back in raiding cuz we have to farm BIS gears and hit a certain amount of numbers on the target dummy. Not only that... but its just NERF NERF NERF... Jeez DPS role is basically crap next patch
  • kargen27
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    They told us changes were coming and after the first round told us more changes were coming. Raiding groups are going to need to adjust the numbers down some to take into account the changes. We have known since before the big sustain nerf ZoS intended to do something about the power creep in PvE. Knowing that we need to be planning accordingly. Yeah I know we can't see what specific changes are coming so won't know what gear to farm. There are other things we can do so the changes don't it us quite so hard.

    Zos says those high DPS numbers were not intended and they are working to bring them down. One way or another they are going to lower overall DPS. I was upset at first to see my DPS drop but now I think the adjustments will make the game more fun.
  • Stebarnz
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    Stebarnz wrote: »
    When content becomes face roll they have to do something!

    When there are many threads about buffing content difficulty, they have to do something!

    When teams clear VMOL HM in 14 mins they have to do something!

    When people post 141k parses they have to do something!

    Im not saying they have got it right but at least they are trying something!

    Im the first to bash on zos when they F up but this dot meta didn't work so they are acting, so lets see what the final live release is before losing minds. Bear in mind this game has to be balanced around pvp as that's the only true test!
    pve balance is easy.

    Most content is not a faceroll! Do you know how many people can pull those numbers and clear vmol HM that fast? On PC we're talking about a hundred people AT MOST. Out of millions of active players. Yes, that is the state of the endgame community.

    As someone progging vSS HMs, we've basically got until this patch goes live to clear all before the team disbands. You act like the whole endgame playerbase is steamrolling through content but the reality is that it's still tough even with the high DPS we have right now.

    The game cannot and should not be balanced around the tiny handful of people who have cleared everything and play like a machine.

    MOST content IS faceroll as you are naming 1 trial, I am naming the entire game!

    Have you and your disbanding team tested pts or the version that will be released on live?

    Listen man, like I said im the first to call zos out on their bs and I don't think this is the right move for them but ill wait to see whats actually released, what it plays like and if I enjoy it before hitting the mental button.
  • kargen27
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    Stebarnz wrote: »
    When content becomes face roll they have to do something!

    When there are many threads about buffing content difficulty, they have to do something!

    When teams clear VMOL HM in 14 mins they have to do something!

    When people post 141k parses they have to do something!

    Im not saying they have got it right but at least they are trying something!

    Im the first to bash on zos when they F up but this dot meta didn't work so they are acting, so lets see what the final live release is before losing minds. Bear in mind this game has to be balanced around pvp as that's the only true test!
    pve balance is easy.

    Most content is not a faceroll! Do you know how many people can pull those numbers and clear vmol HM that fast? On PC we're talking about a hundred people AT MOST. Out of millions of active players. Yes, that is the state of the endgame community.

    As someone progging vSS HMs, we've basically got until this patch goes live to clear all before the team disbands. You act like the whole endgame playerbase is steamrolling through content but the reality is that it's still tough even with the high DPS we have right now.

    The game cannot and should not be balanced around the tiny handful of people who have cleared everything and play like a machine.

    A good part of the time groups fail because they do not pay attention to mechanics not because they lack the DPS. Yes they lack the DPS to burn through like the elite groups do but that doesn't mean the content is too hard. I joined groups that tried to burn Black Rose Prison like two groups in popular YouTube videos did it. I went in as the healer. The groups failed. We didn't have the DPS to do it. We then learned to slow down pay attention to more than just burning the boss and though it was a struggle we made it through. These changes will make more players have to take mechanics into account. That is a good change.
    Most in these forums tried to tell me my healer was dead when those changes were put in place. No way would I ever be able to heal without multiple orbs. They were wrong. I had to change my rotation but I heal just fine. There is no content that I could do before that now I cannot. I'm guessing the same will be true with these changes. We will adapt and everything will be okay.
  • VaranisArano
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    SydneyGrey wrote: »
    Stebarnz wrote: »
    When content becomes face roll they have to do something!

    When there are many threads about buffing content difficulty, they have to do something!

    When teams clear VMOL HM in 14 mins they have to do something!

    When people post 141k parses they have to do something!

    Im not saying they have got it right but at least they are trying something!

    Im the first to bash on zos when they F up but this dot meta didn't work so they are acting, so lets see what the final live release is before losing minds. Bear in mind this game has to be balanced around pvp as that's the only true test!
    pve balance is easy.
    Why should the entire game get changed just to suit the top 1% of players?
    Maybe they need to just buff the difficulty for the hardest content, not nerf everybody's characters across the board no matter what their playstyle is. All that'll do is make things very frustrating for the newer players and the more casual players, who aren't among that top 1% of players that you want to cater to.

    Its not the hardest content that's the issue. That's still really hard.

    Its more that power creep makes older PVE content obsolete. To keep pace, ZOS would have to buff base game dungeons and Craglorn trials. That takes time, effort, and money that ZOS doesn't want to spend when they've got to pump out new content quarterly to draw players back in.
  • Jayroo
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    Sorry to be the bearer of bad news, but...

    "update 24 combat ability improvements"
    "update 25 combat ability improvements"
    https://www.elderscrollsonline.com/en-us/news/post/56681
  • Katahdin
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    kargen27 wrote: »
    Raiding groups are going to need to adjust the numbers down some to take into account the changes.

    I agree but I doubt you'll see it.
    The pool of players will just get way smaller
    Beta tester November 2013
  • Stebarnz
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    Stebarnz wrote: »
    When content becomes face roll they have to do something!

    When there are many threads about buffing content difficulty, they have to do something!

    When teams clear VMOL HM in 14 mins they have to do something!

    When people post 141k parses they have to do something!

    Im not saying they have got it right but at least they are trying something!

    Im the first to bash on zos when they F up but this dot meta didn't work so they are acting, so lets see what the final live release is before losing minds. Bear in mind this game has to be balanced around pvp as that's the only true test!
    pve balance is easy.

    Soo basically they should throw the majority of players under the bus because a couple of trial guilds are op?

    That's what you got from my post? smh ok.

    What would be your move if you were in charge?
  • Stebarnz
    Stebarnz
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    Stebarnz wrote: »
    Stebarnz wrote: »
    When content becomes face roll they have to do something!

    When there are many threads about buffing content difficulty, they have to do something!

    When teams clear VMOL HM in 14 mins they have to do something!

    When people post 141k parses they have to do something!

    Im not saying they have got it right but at least they are trying something!

    Im the first to bash on zos when they F up but this dot meta didn't work so they are acting, so lets see what the final live release is before losing minds. Bear in mind this game has to be balanced around pvp as that's the only true test!
    pve balance is easy.

    Soo basically they should throw the majority of players under the bus because a couple of trial guilds are op?

    That's what you got from my post? smh ok.

    What would be your move if you were in charge?

    Thing is, flat nerfs affect middle tier players the most. Those with 100k parses are a very small and dedicated minority - and they will adapt like they always have, maybe they will even end up improving their dps.
    But they are the minority, and a very small one at that. How many groups managed to achieve Godslayer, for example? 3 or 4 out of 12 million players? Even titles like Dromathra destroyer are relatively rare despite the fact that vmol was released years ago and it's not very hard compared to the new trials.
    Your post sounds like everyone and their dog is gamebreakingly op and that it must be fixed, but that's simply not the case. Average pugs struggle to get 20-30k dps just like they did years ago. Dlc trial hms are out of reach for pretty much any average player.

    As for my personal perspective... I remember how much more people were into trials in Homestead patch compared to Morrowind and to be honest it's just sad. I witnessed a lot of smaller guilds die because of blanket nerfs and I will never believe that it's a good thing.
    I think they should focus on improving game's stability and creating new content for all types of players. A few hundred players brandishing their dps on youtube and discords do not change anything in the grand scheme of things and the game should not be balanced around them.

    100% agree with you, if what is on pts goes live then it will hurt middle to low tier players a lot!

    To say 12 million players is a bit of a stretch, lets concentrate on how many players hit max cp, not how many players played it on a free weekend then uninstalled.

    Definitely they should improve stability, and new content should keep coming in without adding bugs etc.

    If they don't balance the game around the best then endgame becomes stale and unchallenging, even if its possible to do what they were doing they have to address it, I get what you are saying the majority will never achieve it but honestly what choice do they have?

    I sound like I'm defending zos here and that would be a first believe me but they have to do something... What they have put on pts is not a good move and really needs a change and they better listen to feedback from pts testers this time! I would rather them do something than nothing though!

    This isn't a pick up and play game and people need to realise it takes a bit of dedication to get somewhere with it! I will get on pts and give some feedback on what I think from my POV will help the game move forward and attempt to help new players and also challenge the elite. Whether it gets listened to is another matter.

    I want the game to succeed and be good for everybody who puts effort in, not instantly rewarding.
  • Cadbury
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    Good luck. We've got more class changes for Nightblades and Templars coming up, passives need to be worked over, and so on. Plus, this is how ZOS does Horizontal Progression and handles power creep. Not to mention the future CP rework...

    The nerfings will continue until morale improves.

    tenor.gif?itemid=6130024
    "If a person is truly desirous of something, perhaps being set on fire does not seem so bad."
  • ihazzit
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    The nerfings will continue until morale improves.
    70303451_2409643445974471_429466999836377088_n.jpg?_nc_cat=110&_nc_oc=AQkWfjeCMqwpnBvvAlg71prUjWywcoXj4YAKURXgLoUhhlfSQEiOcdVxxdPLT3ay7zY&_nc_ht=scontent.fcmh1-1.fna&oh=f1e6c16885b1aa7eb18c8d060e707391&oe=5E332704
    People are toxic due to their own incompetence and anger is how we punish ourselves due to our own stupidity, but being both at the same time? That takes a special kind of broken, one that can't be fixed.

    Sometimes you make the right decision and sometimes you make the decision right. ZOS has done quite a bit of the latter lately.
  • TelvanniWizard
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    Stebarnz wrote: »
    Stebarnz wrote: »
    When content becomes face roll they have to do something!

    When there are many threads about buffing content difficulty, they have to do something!

    When teams clear VMOL HM in 14 mins they have to do something!

    When people post 141k parses they have to do something!

    Im not saying they have got it right but at least they are trying something!

    Im the first to bash on zos when they F up but this dot meta didn't work so they are acting, so lets see what the final live release is before losing minds. Bear in mind this game has to be balanced around pvp as that's the only true test!
    pve balance is easy.

    Soo basically they should throw the majority of players under the bus because a couple of trial guilds are op?

    That's what you got from my post? smh ok.

    What would be your move if you were in charge?

    Thing is, flat nerfs affect middle tier players the most. Those with 100k parses are a very small and dedicated minority - and they will adapt like they always have, maybe they will even end up improving their dps.
    But they are the minority, and a very small one at that. How many groups managed to achieve Godslayer, for example? 3 or 4 out of 12 million players? Even titles like Dromathra destroyer are relatively rare despite the fact that vmol was released years ago and it's not very hard compared to the new trials.
    Your post sounds like everyone and their dog is gamebreakingly op and that it must be fixed, but that's simply not the case. Average pugs struggle to get 20-30k dps just like they did years ago. Dlc trial hms are out of reach for pretty much any average player.

    As for my personal perspective... I remember how much more people were into trials in Homestead patch compared to Morrowind and to be honest it's just sad. I witnessed a lot of smaller guilds die because of blanket nerfs and I will never believe that it's a good thing.
    I think they should focus on improving game's stability and creating new content for all types of players. A few hundred players brandishing their dps on youtube and discords do not change anything in the grand scheme of things and the game should not be balanced around them.

    You, sir, are so damm right. Totally agree.
    Si hoc imprimis intellegis, nolli dubitare, scribe me ad latine loquendum. Lingua est colenda.

    PAWS - Say NO to crown crates!

  • ArchMikem
    ArchMikem
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    You don't HAVE to gold your gear, it's such a minute increase in stats that staying purple doesn't hurt you. All you reasonably need gold is your weapons.

    Besides if the combat stayed exactly the same for the last 5 years everyone would've quit playing because of how stale it's been.
    CP1,100+ Master Explorer - AvA Brigadier - Console Peasant

    The constant state of Cyrodiil PvP:
    https://i.imgur.com/CHyI36F.png
  • Welkynar
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    I would tolerate lower dps if combat was reworked to be more fun. For example, changing Bound Armaments is sort of what I’d like. Or, add new skills to the classes or new morphs. I don’t like changes like percentage decreases every patch.
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