Trader swap issue - EU server

Waynerx8

Mathius_Mordred wrote: »

The people you are suggesting they ban are also the people who spend thousands of £/Euros each year on this game, who build communities, websites, work really hard to encourage and help new players. Sure, go ahead ban them, watch the entire community crumble, then who will you sell your mats to?

Who will ZOS turn to when subs dramatically reduce? We got about 10 million back and it's still in our guild bank, I'm hoping that we get to keep it of course but if we can't so be it, but if bans are handed out to people I know and care about then I'm gone from this game, I was here in closed beta but if they start punishing people because of a ***-up of their own making then this will be the last straw as far as I'm concerned, the 300 people in my guild will have to find another guild, well those who actually continue playing will, the rest, well there's a lot of games out there desperate for cash and players.

You forgot the selfish, thieving sh--s bit.

Can I just say something here, who made them start a guild, I'm sure some do it to feel important, to play boss, as they can't do it in the real world, sick of hearing we give up our time blah blah, GM's choose to waste too much time on a game then spout stuff like this, just go solo and someone else will come along, honestly some GM's make out they are like CEO's in this game.


Solo players spend money on subs and clown store amounting to thousands, you are not anymore special, you made a choice, don't like don't do it, stop making out you are higher up in a GAME.


ALL GM's found guilty of using the excess gold to buy up wax, tempers knowing it was a bug should have their account banned, and should never be trusted again, there are a lot of GM's that did not touch the gold as they were aware of the error, good for them, the others just show their true colours, PROPER p3nises.

Varana

Sorry - but the issue has been widely reported since Sunday evening. If people took the time to write a bug report (hahahahaha! bug reports, in my experience, are a total waste of time in this game), then fine. People who didn't because, you know, the bug was already reported and extensively discussed in public, and bug reports don't do anything anyway, are okay as well. Because, honestly, this is ZOS' fault alone, and GMs should not be doing ZOS' job. If they want to report how much excess gold they got at some point, fine. But really, this is for ZOS to sort out, and no one else.

Sanguinor2

Mathius_Mordred wrote: »

I wrote it in plain English, further expansion on the point is not required, interpret it how you like. All I am saying is people should be careful what they wish for because this whole ridiculous episode could turn out to be very very costly for ZOS and the game in general if not handled right. Fortunately, I doubt the devs in this game will be stupid enough to cower to the witchhunt mentality sweeping this thread, if they do, well then, that's when the *** will really hit the fan.

I dont believe its witchhunting if we want to get People that knowingly violated the TOS to be banned, None of us is after someone innocent.
Not punishing People that dont Play by the rules because they are perceived as important doesnt send a good message either and can lead to exploits becoming trivialised if they go unpunished. Turning a blind eye to exploits of such large scale wont go well.

spekdah

As a software engineer I can be somewhat sympathetic. You build open API's to please your customers. Then they use them in ways you never imagined and end up as a form of DoS.

ZoS aint the first or last. FB, Google etc all done this before as well.

hiyde

sirinsidiator wrote: »

That's great and all, but could you at least consider disabling it only during primetime instead of completely and for who knows how long, so guilds can continue to operate?

THIS x 1000.

Why does guild history need to be down all week (or, as suggested above, during non-primetime while you work on safeguards?

The problem was Sunday night. Why can't we operate at the norm during the week?

Will there be an impact from addons such as Master Merchant trying to catch up when data returns?

Perhaps there's a valid reason, in which case an explanation would be very helpful. Otherwise if feels like needless inconvenience and salt in a wound...

SammiSakura

Jesus Christ, you guys. Could we please stop hating on each other and focus on the REAL problem here: the complete meltdown of the Trader System?!

What we need to be doing is pushing for a fix for this (INCLUDING the gold you all seem more bothered about)

If we dont push for a fix, there's not even any damn vendors to spend it at anyways!!!

14 pages (just on this thread) and 48 hours in, we know its not to be used, and those that have are worse than satan himself -.-

But it would be nice to have at least ONE constructive thread that isnt just causing a scene over bans, tos, etc etc etc

/endrant

StabbityDoom

therift wrote: »

I'm not sure I understand the role played by add-ons.

If PCNA appeared to run smoothly, and PCEU was a clusterphooey, how did add-ons screw one server and not the other?

I'm just a console pleb, so the nefarious actions of evil add-ons is just one great big mystery.

Oh, and LOL.

I think many of us assumed they put a change in NA after EU went south. But now, I'm thinking about it, and realizing given they said nothing about it in the natch potes and there's been no confirmation anyhow, maybe it is like you said. Maybe EU server failed at processing but NA didn't, which lends to the theory of 2nd class nobody loves EU server. I'd like to know if they DID any scrambling to protect NA or did we just get lucky?

immozz01

Zos, you allow addons, to be used at own risk. therefore not all players use addons, the latest detail of the eso soap happened sunday and effects all players if you like it or not

Murphy kicks in because of what you release in the game and you point at the addons?..

You respond 48 hours later stating you will gather information and act on it, you should had closed the server in 48 seconds. but you cant because you have no clue when Murphy comes to visit us, we always need to tell you. hours later: "we are looking in to this"

You are going to take "action", sure.... and you will never tell us anything anyway because you will hide behind legal stuff.

The worst episodes of Dallas had a more convincing story to tell...

i am wondering how the car would look like if you ran a car company

StabbityDoom

VaranisArano wrote: »

therift wrote: »

I'm not sure I understand the role played by add-ons.

If PCNA appeared to run smoothly, and PCEU was a clusterphooey, how did add-ons screw one server and not the other?

I'm just a console pleb, so the nefarious actions of evil add-ons is just one great big mystery.

Oh, and LOL.

Its the difference between PC/EU primetime and PC/NA primetime server loads.

PC/EU has its high population/high demand time very concentrated whereas PC/NA is somewhat more spread out. So at peak load, PC/EU comes under much higher demand relative to the amount of load the servers can handle than PC/NA does. ZOS basically explained that with their post on PC/EU issues months ago and the fundamentals haven't changed.

So if we take the 3 factors Gina mentioned: add-ons, multibid and game server requests, we see based on their previous issues that PC/EU sees a higher concentration of game server requests than PC/NA due to the higher population at their peak time. Addons and multibid are effectively the same.

So if that's the problem, why remove add-ons API?

Because that's the easiest fix. ZOS isnt going to remove multibidding because that's their new baby, and ZOS doesnt want to have less players to generate less game server requests, so the simplest thing to remove is the guild history API.

This is what I was getting at, @therift - which then means they did nothing to protect us after EU went boom, which kinda makes me irate.

VaranisArano

SammiSakura wrote: »

Jesus Christ, you guys. Could we please stop hating on each other and focus on the REAL problem here: the complete meltdown of the Trader System?!

What we need to be doing is pushing for a fix for this (INCLUDING the gold you all seem more bothered about)

If we dont push for a fix, there's not even any damn vendors to spend it at anyways!!!

14 pages (just on this thread) and 48 hours in, we know its not to be used, and those that have are worse than satan himself -.-

But it would be nice to have at least ONE constructive thread that isnt just causing a scene over bans, tos, etc etc etc

/endrant

Gina said they are working additional safeguards.

Just what exactly do you want us to do to push for a fix that we havent done already? Is there something we can do besides post stuff like "Well, it better not happen again, ZOS! Or else!"

So, um, you got something constructive for us to do? Or shall we all just continue posting our opinions on what and how we think ZOS should fix what went down (which includes the excessive bid refunds, natch.)?

StabbityDoom

VaranisArano wrote: »

SammiSakura wrote: »

Jesus Christ, you guys. Could we please stop hating on each other and focus on the REAL problem here: the complete meltdown of the Trader System?!

What we need to be doing is pushing for a fix for this (INCLUDING the gold you all seem more bothered about)

If we dont push for a fix, there's not even any damn vendors to spend it at anyways!!!

14 pages (just on this thread) and 48 hours in, we know its not to be used, and those that have are worse than satan himself -.-

But it would be nice to have at least ONE constructive thread that isnt just causing a scene over bans, tos, etc etc etc

/endrant

Gina said they are working additional safeguards.

Just what exactly do you want us to do to push for a fix that we havent done already? Is there something we can do besides post stuff like "Well, it better not happen again, ZOS! Or else!"

So, um, you got something constructive for us to do? Or shall we all just continue posting our opinions on what and how we think ZOS should fix what went down (which includes the excessive bid refunds, natch.)?

Yes. Suggestions with how to handle timing of flip, perhaps some ideas on how we could reduce server load. Refuting the garbage theory that addons did this. Requesting change of how they are currently handled guild history in this "fix." Questioning the handling, timing, and communication regarding this mess. And demanding better.

Sandman929

If not bans, then at least take their fingertips.

Arrodisia

StabbityDoom wrote: »

VaranisArano wrote: »

therift wrote: »

I'm not sure I understand the role played by add-ons.

If PCNA appeared to run smoothly, and PCEU was a clusterphooey, how did add-ons screw one server and not the other?

I'm just a console pleb, so the nefarious actions of evil add-ons is just one great big mystery.

Oh, and LOL.

Its the difference between PC/EU primetime and PC/NA primetime server loads.

PC/EU has its high population/high demand time very concentrated whereas PC/NA is somewhat more spread out. So at peak load, PC/EU comes under much higher demand relative to the amount of load the servers can handle than PC/NA does. ZOS basically explained that with their post on PC/EU issues months ago and the fundamentals haven't changed.

So if we take the 3 factors Gina mentioned: add-ons, multibid and game server requests, we see based on their previous issues that PC/EU sees a higher concentration of game server requests than PC/NA due to the higher population at their peak time. Addons and multibid are effectively the same.

So if that's the problem, why remove add-ons API?

Because that's the easiest fix. ZOS isnt going to remove multibidding because that's their new baby, and ZOS doesnt want to have less players to generate less game server requests, so the simplest thing to remove is the guild history API.

This is what I was getting at, @therift - which then means they did nothing to protect us after EU went boom, which kinda makes me irate.

I didn't see any patch for NA. I didn't hear of a server restart either. The EU server was lagging all week, and it got heavier and heavier on the weekend. Then, Sunday we started seeing bigger issues, and no replies to the complaints in the forums. Then came the trader swap delay, and such. The EU server needs to be fixed or replaced. It can't handle the day to day transactions of all of the players on this server at prime times. Heck, it even lags on off times now.

StabbityDoom

juttaa77b16_ESO wrote: »

StabbityDoom wrote: »

VaranisArano wrote: »

therift wrote: »

I'm not sure I understand the role played by add-ons.

If PCNA appeared to run smoothly, and PCEU was a clusterphooey, how did add-ons screw one server and not the other?

I'm just a console pleb, so the nefarious actions of evil add-ons is just one great big mystery.

Oh, and LOL.

Its the difference between PC/EU primetime and PC/NA primetime server loads.

PC/EU has its high population/high demand time very concentrated whereas PC/NA is somewhat more spread out. So at peak load, PC/EU comes under much higher demand relative to the amount of load the servers can handle than PC/NA does. ZOS basically explained that with their post on PC/EU issues months ago and the fundamentals haven't changed.

So if we take the 3 factors Gina mentioned: add-ons, multibid and game server requests, we see based on their previous issues that PC/EU sees a higher concentration of game server requests than PC/NA due to the higher population at their peak time. Addons and multibid are effectively the same.

So if that's the problem, why remove add-ons API?

Because that's the easiest fix. ZOS isnt going to remove multibidding because that's their new baby, and ZOS doesnt want to have less players to generate less game server requests, so the simplest thing to remove is the guild history API.

This is what I was getting at, @therift - which then means they did nothing to protect us after EU went boom, which kinda makes me irate.

I didn't see any patch for NA. I didn't hear of a server restart either. The EU server was lagging all week, and it got heavier and heavier on the weekend. Then, Sunday we started seeing bigger issues, and no replies to the complaints in the forums. Then came the trader swap delay, and such. The EU server needs to be fixed or replaced. It can't handle the day to day transactions of all of the players on this server at prime times. Heck, it even lags on off times now.

Which means everyone screaming EU was the guinea pig was wrong, that we just took the same risks EU did and we just have a better situation, which proves the point of those saying EU is unloved.

Gandrhulf_Harbard

Tatanko wrote: »

Gandrhulf_Harbard wrote: »

Your game runs crap with or without add-ons.

Blaming add-ons for ZOS incompetency is just flat out shameful.

I'm not defending ZOS, but you clearly don't understand that: local machine performance and server performance are not the same thing. Servers are what is in question here, not the local client. Addons are pinging the server for information, what they do to your own computer is irrelevant to the issue at hand.

And you clearly don't understand that selective quoting can mean YOU missed the point.

X-Box and PS4 have NO MODS - so there can be no server performance overhead from them; and X-Box and PS4 still runs like crap.

Ergo, Mods are not the cause here, they may well be a contributory factor to even worse performance on PC, but they are not the cause of overall, cross-platform, poor performance.

The cause of that is ZOS incompetency.


All The Best

wavingblue

spekdah wrote: »

As a software engineer I can be somewhat sympathetic. You build open API's to please your customers. Then they use them in ways you never imagined and end up as a form of DoS.

ZoS aint the first or last. FB, Google etc all done this before as well.

Care to state exactly how Master Merchant is using the calls in a way they never imagined? If add-ons were the issue why are the same lag issues prevalent on console?

SammiSakura

StabbityDoom wrote: »

VaranisArano wrote: »

SammiSakura wrote: »

Jesus Christ, you guys. Could we please stop hating on each other and focus on the REAL problem here: the complete meltdown of the Trader System?!

What we need to be doing is pushing for a fix for this (INCLUDING the gold you all seem more bothered about)

If we dont push for a fix, there's not even any damn vendors to spend it at anyways!!!

14 pages (just on this thread) and 48 hours in, we know its not to be used, and those that have are worse than satan himself -.-

But it would be nice to have at least ONE constructive thread that isnt just causing a scene over bans, tos, etc etc etc

/endrant

Gina said they are working additional safeguards.

Just what exactly do you want us to do to push for a fix that we havent done already? Is there something we can do besides post stuff like "Well, it better not happen again, ZOS! Or else!"

So, um, you got something constructive for us to do? Or shall we all just continue posting our opinions on what and how we think ZOS should fix what went down (which includes the excessive bid refunds, natch.)?

Yes. Suggestions with how to handle timing of flip, perhaps some ideas on how we could reduce server load. Refuting the garbage theory that addons did this. Requesting change of how they are currently handled guild history in this "fix." Questioning the handling, timing, and communication regarding this mess. And demanding better.

See, some very good suggestions there. There's loads of better things to discuss than just "ban ban ban"

If zos decide to ban, they will, or they won't. That's already been decided.


Oh and "we are working on safeguards" is another bull-hooey sentence that we've all heard before

Konstant_Tel_Necris

I just have one question, can I actually play game today without worries that's all my progress will be rolled back tomorrow?

SammiSakura

Konstant_Tel_Necris wrote: »

I just have one question, can I actually play game today without worries that's all my progress will be rolled back tomorrow?

Yes. They're not gonna roll back almost 3 days

JN_Slevin

Wait isn't there already a safety net installed?

If you send too many messages to the Server, you are gonna get kicked of the game.

Everyone who promoted to many Guildees, wrote too many Notes or has used Dressing Room too fast knows this.

Why didn't that do anything on Sunday if "Add-ons" were on of the factors?

(Not a programmer / dev, just a genuine question.)

VaranisArano

StabbityDoom wrote: »

VaranisArano wrote: »

SammiSakura wrote: »

Jesus Christ, you guys. Could we please stop hating on each other and focus on the REAL problem here: the complete meltdown of the Trader System?!

What we need to be doing is pushing for a fix for this (INCLUDING the gold you all seem more bothered about)

If we dont push for a fix, there's not even any damn vendors to spend it at anyways!!!

14 pages (just on this thread) and 48 hours in, we know its not to be used, and those that have are worse than satan himself -.-

But it would be nice to have at least ONE constructive thread that isnt just causing a scene over bans, tos, etc etc etc

/endrant

Gina said they are working additional safeguards.

Just what exactly do you want us to do to push for a fix that we havent done already? Is there something we can do besides post stuff like "Well, it better not happen again, ZOS! Or else!"

So, um, you got something constructive for us to do? Or shall we all just continue posting our opinions on what and how we think ZOS should fix what went down (which includes the excessive bid refunds, natch.)?

Yes. Suggestions with how to handle timing of flip, perhaps some ideas on how we could reduce server load. Refuting the garbage theory that addons did this. Requesting change of how they are currently handled guild history in this "fix." Questioning the handling, timing, and communication regarding this mess. And demanding better.

Okay, so continuing to post our opinions on how ZOS should fix it.

I'm going to add one more to your list: discussing how the excessive guild refunds ought to be handled now, and if it happens again in the future.

See, I'm suspicious that if any bug happens once, it can happen again, and so in addition to all your fine ideas, I think its pretty important to establish with clarity how GMs ought to handle getting excessive refunds under the TOS, and how GMs who didnt get the appropriate refunds can contact ZOS to get reimbursed.

Bids are a pretty important part of the trader system, and so is knowing that the GM knows how to behave appeopriate in the face of a major cluster**ck, whether that's to know that your GM can get the proper refund from ZOS or that your GM isnt going to get banned for choosing to spend the excessive refund instead of reporting it.

It happened. Dealing with the fallout of the excessive bids and missing refunds is one part of moving forward from the meltdown.

StabbityDoom

Cani wrote: »

Wait isn't there already a safety net installed?

If you send too many messages to the Server, you are gonna get kicked of the game.

Everyone who promoted to many Guildees, wrote too many Notes or has used Dressing Room too fast knows this.

Why didn't that do anything on Sunday if "Add-ons" were on of the factors?

(Not a programmer / dev, just a genuine question.)

It's not messages to the server, it's request to the API, which they get many tons of per second, *but* I thought they put the push thing in already, instead of the api request. Didn't they?

Tandor

StabbityDoom wrote: »

juttaa77b16_ESO wrote: »

StabbityDoom wrote: »

VaranisArano wrote: »

therift wrote: »

I'm not sure I understand the role played by add-ons.

If PCNA appeared to run smoothly, and PCEU was a clusterphooey, how did add-ons screw one server and not the other?

I'm just a console pleb, so the nefarious actions of evil add-ons is just one great big mystery.

Oh, and LOL.

Its the difference between PC/EU primetime and PC/NA primetime server loads.

PC/EU has its high population/high demand time very concentrated whereas PC/NA is somewhat more spread out. So at peak load, PC/EU comes under much higher demand relative to the amount of load the servers can handle than PC/NA does. ZOS basically explained that with their post on PC/EU issues months ago and the fundamentals haven't changed.

So if we take the 3 factors Gina mentioned: add-ons, multibid and game server requests, we see based on their previous issues that PC/EU sees a higher concentration of game server requests than PC/NA due to the higher population at their peak time. Addons and multibid are effectively the same.

So if that's the problem, why remove add-ons API?

Because that's the easiest fix. ZOS isnt going to remove multibidding because that's their new baby, and ZOS doesnt want to have less players to generate less game server requests, so the simplest thing to remove is the guild history API.

This is what I was getting at, @therift - which then means they did nothing to protect us after EU went boom, which kinda makes me irate.

I didn't see any patch for NA. I didn't hear of a server restart either. The EU server was lagging all week, and it got heavier and heavier on the weekend. Then, Sunday we started seeing bigger issues, and no replies to the complaints in the forums. Then came the trader swap delay, and such. The EU server needs to be fixed or replaced. It can't handle the day to day transactions of all of the players on this server at prime times. Heck, it even lags on off times now.

Which means everyone screaming EU was the guinea pig was wrong, that we just took the same risks EU did and we just have a better situation, which proves the point of those saying EU is unloved.

It may simply prove what ZOS has said all along, namely that the EU servers' greater problems stem from the fact that the EU population is bunched narrowly around the same time zone, whereas the NA servers' population is spread much more widely between several time zones. Such problems are compounded by a trading system that doesn't spread all activity evenly throughout the week but concentrates the bidding process at a single time, currently set at peak weekend game-time.

That said, my experience of MMORPGs over the years is that it is always a balancing act for developers when it comes to the provision of localised servers. On the one hand, developers understand that players in Europe want to have a faster connection and play with people in their own time zone, on the other hand a remote server halfway round the world is far more difficult for a developer to maintain and manage. At least ZOS try to keep such arrangements going. I've played both EQ and EQ2 for many years and in both respects SOE as they then were attempted (unsuccessfully due to player revolt) to sell off their European players first to Ubisoft and then to ProSiebensat.1.

Gandrhulf_Harbard

SammiSakura wrote: »

Konstant_Tel_Necris wrote: »

I just have one question, can I actually play game today without worries that's all my progress will be rolled back tomorrow?

Yes. They're not gonna roll back almost 3 days

They should roll back.

Because even if the majority of Trade GM have been like you and done nothing with the excess gold they got through a bug, the minority that have used that gold have completely destroyed the in-game economy.

Gold tempers are now selling at between 10 and 15 times what there were a week ago.

Even if ZOS recoups all the "free gold" from the system, how do they work out how much more gold to take from the Traders who have used that gold to game the system? They'd need to track EVERY SINGLE transaction from EVeRY GUILD for the last 3 days to figure it all out.

Unless they do that the in-game economy is still going to be way over-heated negatively impacting ALL player - regardless of if they are in a Trade Guild or not - because commodity prices are horrendously over-inflated because of the extra gold.

Taking the excess gold out of the system is NOT enough, you also have to find some way to take back the knock-on effects of the gold that was used by the minority of dishonest Trade Guilds.

If you don't those dishonest guilds have still benefited from their deliberate dishonesty, while everyone else has suffered because of it.

The ONLY solution that deal not only with the "extra gold" but more importantly also deal with the knock-on effects of the "extra gold" is a complete roll-back to a point before that "extra gold" was in the system.

All The Best

hiyde

Waynerx8 wrote: »

Can I just say something here, who made them start a guild, I'm sure some do it to feel important, to play boss, as they can't do it in the real world, sick of hearing we give up our time blah blah, GM's choose to waste too much time on a game then spout stuff like this, just go solo and someone else will come along, honestly some GM's make out they are like CEO's in this game.

Solo players spend money on subs and clown store amounting to thousands, you are not anymore special, you made a choice, don't like don't do it, stop making out you are higher up in a GAME.

Oh myy

Why so negative?

There are always bad apples but it's never effective to paint with such a wide brush.

In my experience, many of the best guilds are run by those who hold jobs that require them to be highly organized, helpful, engaged in helping others succeed, etc. Things I've learned as a trade guild GM have actually helped me at my RL job as a non-CEO (lol) at a large media company...and vice versa! Actually, I owe my entire career path (going back 30+ years), to helping others "online".

In my experience, NONE of the GMs I know who run trade guilds do it for the status lol. Most of us do it because we get satisfaction out of helping others enjoy a game such as this.

Just as they consult expert players in other areas of the game for feedback, I don't think it's too much for experienced Trade Guild GMs to be consulted on things like Multi-bidding, bid times, etc. That's not pretending to be better than others, that's trying to help the game evolve in the right direction, imho.

Why isn't there a rep for Guilds/Trade Guilds? (or, if such a person exists, I've never heard of them).

-H

ajm1946

Bring in a single marke, get rid of the guild traders and ban all add-ons

StabbityDoom

ajm1946 wrote: »

Bring in a single marke, get rid of the guild traders and ban all add-ons

They'd lose so much money from this it'd be Armageddon.

JN_Slevin

hiyde wrote: »

Waynerx8 wrote: »

Can I just say something here, who made them start a guild, I'm sure some do it to feel important, to play boss, as they can't do it in the real world, sick of hearing we give up our time blah blah, GM's choose to waste too much time on a game then spout stuff like this, just go solo and someone else will come along, honestly some GM's make out they are like CEO's in this game.

Solo players spend money on subs and clown store amounting to thousands, you are not anymore special, you made a choice, don't like don't do it, stop making out you are higher up in a GAME.

Oh myy

Why so negative?

There are always bad apples but it's never effective to paint with such a wide brush.

In my experience, many of the best guilds are run by those who hold jobs that require them to be highly organized, helpful, engaged in helping others succeed, etc. Things I've learned as a trade guild GM have actually helped me at my RL job as a non-CEO (lol) at a large media company...and vice versa! Actually, I owe my entire career path (going back 30+ years), to helping others "online".

In my experience, NONE of the GMs I know who run trade guilds do it for the status lol. Most of us do it because we get satisfaction out of helping others enjoy a game such as this.

Just as they consult expert players in other areas of the game for feedback, I don't think it's too much for experienced Trade Guild GMs to be consulted on things like Multi-bidding, bid times, etc. That's not pretending to be better than others, that's trying to help the game evolve in the right direction, imho.

Why isn't there a rep for Guilds/Trade Guilds? (or, if such a person exists, I've never heard of them).

-H

There isn't even a Sub-Forum for "Trade and Economy" on here...

SammiSakura

Gandrhulf_Harbard wrote: »

SammiSakura wrote: »

Konstant_Tel_Necris wrote: »

I just have one question, can I actually play game today without worries that's all my progress will be rolled back tomorrow?

Yes. They're not gonna roll back almost 3 days

They should roll back.

Because even if the majority of Trade GM have been like you and done nothing with the excess gold they got through a bug, the minority that have used that gold have completely destroyed the in-game economy.

Gold tempers are now selling at between 10 and 15 times what there were a week ago.

Even if ZOS recoups all the "free gold" from the system, how do they work out how much more gold to take from the Traders who have used that gold to game the system? They'd need to track EVERY SINGLE transaction from EVeRY GUILD for the last 3 days to figure it all out.

Unless they do that the in-game economy is still going to be way over-heated negatively impacting ALL player - regardless of if they are in a Trade Guild or not - because commodity prices are horrendously over-inflated because of the extra gold.

Taking the excess gold out of the system is NOT enough, you also have to find some way to take back the knock-on effects of the gold that was used by the minority of dishonest Trade Guilds.

If you don't those dishonest guilds have still benefited from their deliberate dishonesty, while everyone else has suffered because of it.

The ONLY solution that deal not only with the "extra gold" but more importantly also deal with the knock-on effects of the "extra gold" is a complete roll-back to a point before that "extra gold" was in the system.

All The Best

I think at this point, over 50 hours since the incident, they won't rollback, whether they should or not. That is even if they have a backup from Sunday evening

SammiSakura

hiyde wrote: »

Waynerx8 wrote: »

Can I just say something here, who made them start a guild, I'm sure some do it to feel important, to play boss, as they can't do it in the real world, sick of hearing we give up our time blah blah, GM's choose to waste too much time on a game then spout stuff like this, just go solo and someone else will come along, honestly some GM's make out they are like CEO's in this game.

Solo players spend money on subs and clown store amounting to thousands, you are not anymore special, you made a choice, don't like don't do it, stop making out you are higher up in a GAME.

Oh myy

Why so negative?

There are always bad apples but it's never effective to paint with such a wide brush.

In my experience, many of the best guilds are run by those who hold jobs that require them to be highly organized, helpful, engaged in helping others succeed, etc. Things I've learned as a trade guild GM have actually helped me at my RL job as a non-CEO (lol) at a large media company...and vice versa! Actually, I owe my entire career path (going back 30+ years), to helping others "online".

In my experience, NONE of the GMs I know who run trade guilds do it for the status lol. Most of us do it because we get satisfaction out of helping others enjoy a game such as this.

Just as they consult expert players in other areas of the game for feedback, I don't think it's too much for experienced Trade Guild GMs to be consulted on things like Multi-bidding, bid times, etc. That's not pretending to be better than others, that's trying to help the game evolve in the right direction, imho.

Why isn't there a rep for Guilds/Trade Guilds? (or, if such a person exists, I've never heard of them).

-H

Yeah I also don't know anyone who does it for status. Also, not all of us start guilds. I inherited mine from a friend who no longer plays.
Not sure where this guy has got his very warped view of GMs.