So Vigor will stay OP as hell?

  • John_Falstaff
    John_Falstaff
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    Itzmichi wrote: »
    BattleAxe wrote: »
    Abhaya wrote: »
    ZOS stated that they think vigor is overperforming and are looking into further balance changes. When that will actually come? Who knows.. could be put on the to-do list for next major patch; could be on scalebreaker final patch notes.

    Actually they more specifically mentioned echoing vigor

    Vigor's rework to be a single target Heal over Time hasn't hit the mark we wanted, and currently enables too much healing with the Echoing Vigor morph. We'll be taking a close look at the core identity of the skill and potentially making adjustments.

    When read correctly this implies when u stack vigor or resolving vigor with an echoing vigor it is enabling too much healing.

    Why bother? Tested echoing vigor with 2 people they stack on top of each other with a buffed tooltip of 17-18k on a PvE Stamina Build. The way it is now is just broken. I don't know if there is a cap of stacking them but I'd assume its 6 if there is one.

    You know what they say about assuming, right? Vigor is not a ground HoT, it's an effect applied to a person, and so it'll stack exactly twice, from you and from an ally.
  • danara
    danara
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    Sennecca wrote: »
    susmitds wrote: »
    If Vigor gets nerfed, same should apply to Rapid Regen/Mutagen.
    Stibbons wrote: »
    susmitds wrote: »
    If Vigor gets nerfed, same should apply to Rapid Regen/Mutagen.

    Single target heal that hits random dude. Ok.

    Is not random,hit the lowest ally in the area and heal the same as vigor even more if you add the two passive from resto staff and you can also heal someone when needed.

    If vigor get nerfed rapid should be nerfed aswell and vice versa.
    Derra wrote: »
    Stibbons wrote: »
    susmitds wrote: »
    If Vigor gets nerfed, same should apply to Rapid Regen/Mutagen.

    Single target heal that hits random dude. Ok.

    Is not random,hit the lowest ally in the area and heal the same as vigor even more if you add the two passive from resto staff and you can also heal someone when needed.

    If vigor get nerfed rapid should be nerfed aswell and vice versa.

    I agree they should nerf it by making it heal only the caster - because healing random dudes is a massive advantage and losing that would obviously be a hefty nerf :wink:

    And what is the pve dungeon healer supposed to do when the dps they are “healing” heal themselves better than the healer or the heal heals only themselves. Pve healers will leave the game in droves due to pvp ‘balance’.

    ^
    100% this.

    I dont want to go in the debate "PVE/PVP suffer from PVP/PVE adjustments"

    But i think we can ALL OF US aggree on the fact that even if they want to, they cant figure out to balance PVP and PVE...

    Now it is an important moment, or they find a way to improve pve healer relevance without affecting pvp too much, or they have to separate pve from pvp.

    If they dont do something like that... They dont need to schedule the performances improvement because a lot of player will just leave the game..
  • killingspreeb16_ESO
    killingspreeb16_ESO
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    Derra wrote: »
    Stibbons wrote: »
    susmitds wrote: »
    If Vigor gets nerfed, same should apply to Rapid Regen/Mutagen.

    Single target heal that hits random dude. Ok.

    Is not random,hit the lowest ally in the area and heal the same as vigor even more if you add the two passive from resto staff and you can also heal someone when needed.

    If vigor get nerfed rapid should be nerfed aswell and vice versa.

    I agree they should nerf it by making it heal only the caster - because healing random dudes is a massive advantage and losing that would obviously be a hefty nerf :wink:

    Yeah that's the point of a support weapon heal only the caster /facepalm.
    Also healing a friendly target when needed is an advantage in some scenario,the problem is sometime you get trolled by rapid and die but im doing fine on live with healing ward so yeah.

    I alredy gave a suggestion in one thread,something like if rapid heal another player the heal is split 50% to the caster and 50% to the friendly target.

    Edited by killingspreeb16_ESO on August 1, 2019 10:01AM
  • DocFrost72
    DocFrost72
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    Itzmichi wrote: »
    BattleAxe wrote: »
    Abhaya wrote: »
    ZOS stated that they think vigor is overperforming and are looking into further balance changes. When that will actually come? Who knows.. could be put on the to-do list for next major patch; could be on scalebreaker final patch notes.

    Actually they more specifically mentioned echoing vigor

    Vigor's rework to be a single target Heal over Time hasn't hit the mark we wanted, and currently enables too much healing with the Echoing Vigor morph. We'll be taking a close look at the core identity of the skill and potentially making adjustments.

    When read correctly this implies when u stack vigor or resolving vigor with an echoing vigor it is enabling too much healing.

    Why bother? Tested echoing vigor with 2 people they stack on top of each other with a buffed tooltip of 17-18k on a PvE Stamina Build. The way it is now is just broken. I don't know if there is a cap of stacking them but I'd assume its 6 if there is one.

    Do you have a video of this? It's not how it worked during my testing.
    "Should I do it? No. Will I do it? Of ***ing course I will."
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  • apri
    apri
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    Sennecca wrote: »
    And what is the pve dungeon healer supposed to do when the dps they are “healing” heal themselves better than the healer or the heal heals only themselves. Pve healers will leave the game in droves due to pvp ‘balance’.
    That's the most worrying aspect of the upcoming changes. I could not agree more.

    Then again we have this:
    Vlad9425 wrote: »
    In terms of the vigor buff it's important to note that Stam lost a lot of their healing due to the Rally change so for many builds Vigor will simply have to be their heal option otherwise you handicap many builds which don't have good healing options within their class.
    One could easily counter like "well why should everyone have strong heals?" And would it not be the honest consequence to the "too much heal in the game" outcry? But I won't do that. What I say instead is as old as the game. It's very difficult to bring all the aspects of the game in balance.

    We have such a wide range of different types of players and playstyles from solo PVE, casually grouped overland and dungeons to organized dungeon and trial parties, each with different expectations on heals and self-heals. And as if that was not enough, we have the same in PVP, too. We have duels, we have small-scale groups, solo players, zergs, battlegrounds and the icing on top is we have PVP content with and without CP. Each of that we have for magicka and for stamina driven builds or even a mix of both. It's literally impossible to satisfy everyone.

    But... and here is the but. If it's not possible to bring all of this in balance and if it is not possible to seperate all these portions of the game properly in terms of healing efficiency and healing balance, then we should not fall into the trap and ask to tailor healing balance around niche segments of the game. I won't elaborate this highly debate-happy thought any further since it's ZOS' decision in the end to make the call who among those groups to please the most.

    However some quite vocal people who seek for the perfect solo build should not forget one important thing. It's a MMO. There's nothing massive in duels. There's nothing massive in solo PVP. It's perfectly fine that you play how you play, don't get me wrong here. But ESO is ESO and should stay a MMO. With group focus. With damage dealers. With tanks. And last but not leasts with healers, as well. Healers are in jeopardy now, across the board throughout the game as a whole. Which is more of an issue than a slightly better or worse self-heal with skill A, B or C.
  • Itzmichi
    Itzmichi
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    Itzmichi wrote: »
    BattleAxe wrote: »
    Abhaya wrote: »
    ZOS stated that they think vigor is overperforming and are looking into further balance changes. When that will actually come? Who knows.. could be put on the to-do list for next major patch; could be on scalebreaker final patch notes.

    Actually they more specifically mentioned echoing vigor

    Vigor's rework to be a single target Heal over Time hasn't hit the mark we wanted, and currently enables too much healing with the Echoing Vigor morph. We'll be taking a close look at the core identity of the skill and potentially making adjustments.

    When read correctly this implies when u stack vigor or resolving vigor with an echoing vigor it is enabling too much healing.

    Why bother? Tested echoing vigor with 2 people they stack on top of each other with a buffed tooltip of 17-18k on a PvE Stamina Build. The way it is now is just broken. I don't know if there is a cap of stacking them but I'd assume its 6 if there is one.

    You know what they say about assuming, right? Vigor is not a ground HoT, it's an effect applied to a person, and so it'll stack exactly twice, from you and from an ally.
    DocFrost72 wrote: »
    Itzmichi wrote: »
    BattleAxe wrote: »
    Abhaya wrote: »
    ZOS stated that they think vigor is overperforming and are looking into further balance changes. When that will actually come? Who knows.. could be put on the to-do list for next major patch; could be on scalebreaker final patch notes.

    Actually they more specifically mentioned echoing vigor

    Vigor's rework to be a single target Heal over Time hasn't hit the mark we wanted, and currently enables too much healing with the Echoing Vigor morph. We'll be taking a close look at the core identity of the skill and potentially making adjustments.

    When read correctly this implies when u stack vigor or resolving vigor with an echoing vigor it is enabling too much healing.

    Why bother? Tested echoing vigor with 2 people they stack on top of each other with a buffed tooltip of 17-18k on a PvE Stamina Build. The way it is now is just broken. I don't know if there is a cap of stacking them but I'd assume its 6 if there is one.

    Do you have a video of this? It's not how it worked during my testing.




    You know what they say about pictures and actual testing,right? I mean sure, could be my imagination.

    Screenshot_20190730_223406.png


    Edited by Itzmichi on August 1, 2019 4:28PM
    Here, have a chill pill 💊!
  • Anyron
    Anyron
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    Sennecca wrote: »
    susmitds wrote: »
    If Vigor gets nerfed, same should apply to Rapid Regen/Mutagen.
    Stibbons wrote: »
    susmitds wrote: »
    If Vigor gets nerfed, same should apply to Rapid Regen/Mutagen.

    Single target heal that hits random dude. Ok.

    Is not random,hit the lowest ally in the area and heal the same as vigor even more if you add the two passive from resto staff and you can also heal someone when needed.

    If vigor get nerfed rapid should be nerfed aswell and vice versa.
    Derra wrote: »
    Stibbons wrote: »
    susmitds wrote: »
    If Vigor gets nerfed, same should apply to Rapid Regen/Mutagen.

    Single target heal that hits random dude. Ok.

    Is not random,hit the lowest ally in the area and heal the same as vigor even more if you add the two passive from resto staff and you can also heal someone when needed.

    If vigor get nerfed rapid should be nerfed aswell and vice versa.

    I agree they should nerf it by making it heal only the caster - because healing random dudes is a massive advantage and losing that would obviously be a hefty nerf :wink:

    And what is the pve dungeon healer supposed to do when the dps they are “healing” heal themselves better than the healer or the heal heals only themselves. Pve healers will leave the game in droves due to pvp ‘balance’.

    Easy.. 1 tank and 3 dds ( one focused on dots and healing.. Maybe stamplar)
    Just throw your magicka healer to trash and go stamina like others
  • SodanTok
    SodanTok
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    Vigor used to stack and notes say nothing that should change it. It works like any ability and if there is some HoT/DoT that doesnt stack they need to bring it to standard.
    PC | EU | AD
  • DocFrost72
    DocFrost72
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    Itzmichi wrote: »
    Itzmichi wrote: »
    BattleAxe wrote: »
    Abhaya wrote: »
    ZOS stated that they think vigor is overperforming and are looking into further balance changes. When that will actually come? Who knows.. could be put on the to-do list for next major patch; could be on scalebreaker final patch notes.

    Actually they more specifically mentioned echoing vigor

    Vigor's rework to be a single target Heal over Time hasn't hit the mark we wanted, and currently enables too much healing with the Echoing Vigor morph. We'll be taking a close look at the core identity of the skill and potentially making adjustments.

    When read correctly this implies when u stack vigor or resolving vigor with an echoing vigor it is enabling too much healing.

    Why bother? Tested echoing vigor with 2 people they stack on top of each other with a buffed tooltip of 17-18k on a PvE Stamina Build. The way it is now is just broken. I don't know if there is a cap of stacking them but I'd assume its 6 if there is one.

    You know what they say about assuming, right? Vigor is not a ground HoT, it's an effect applied to a person, and so it'll stack exactly twice, from you and from an ally.
    DocFrost72 wrote: »
    Itzmichi wrote: »
    BattleAxe wrote: »
    Abhaya wrote: »
    ZOS stated that they think vigor is overperforming and are looking into further balance changes. When that will actually come? Who knows.. could be put on the to-do list for next major patch; could be on scalebreaker final patch notes.

    Actually they more specifically mentioned echoing vigor

    Vigor's rework to be a single target Heal over Time hasn't hit the mark we wanted, and currently enables too much healing with the Echoing Vigor morph. We'll be taking a close look at the core identity of the skill and potentially making adjustments.

    When read correctly this implies when u stack vigor or resolving vigor with an echoing vigor it is enabling too much healing.

    Why bother? Tested echoing vigor with 2 people they stack on top of each other with a buffed tooltip of 17-18k on a PvE Stamina Build. The way it is now is just broken. I don't know if there is a cap of stacking them but I'd assume its 6 if there is one.

    Do you have a video of this? It's not how it worked during my testing.

    <snip>

    Screenshot_20190730_223406.png


    Interesting, and you're sure it was generating heals for each tick? Not just placing the icon on your buff tracker?

    Edit: misread quote
    Edited by DocFrost72 on August 1, 2019 4:36PM
    "Should I do it? No. Will I do it? Of ***ing course I will."
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  • Itzmichi
    Itzmichi
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    DocFrost72 wrote: »
    Itzmichi wrote: »
    Itzmichi wrote: »
    BattleAxe wrote: »
    Abhaya wrote: »
    ZOS stated that they think vigor is overperforming and are looking into further balance changes. When that will actually come? Who knows.. could be put on the to-do list for next major patch; could be on scalebreaker final patch notes.

    Actually they more specifically mentioned echoing vigor

    Vigor's rework to be a single target Heal over Time hasn't hit the mark we wanted, and currently enables too much healing with the Echoing Vigor morph. We'll be taking a close look at the core identity of the skill and potentially making adjustments.

    When read correctly this implies when u stack vigor or resolving vigor with an echoing vigor it is enabling too much healing.

    Why bother? Tested echoing vigor with 2 people they stack on top of each other with a buffed tooltip of 17-18k on a PvE Stamina Build. The way it is now is just broken. I don't know if there is a cap of stacking them but I'd assume its 6 if there is one.

    You know what they say about assuming, right? Vigor is not a ground HoT, it's an effect applied to a person, and so it'll stack exactly twice, from you and from an ally.
    DocFrost72 wrote: »
    Itzmichi wrote: »
    BattleAxe wrote: »
    Abhaya wrote: »
    ZOS stated that they think vigor is overperforming and are looking into further balance changes. When that will actually come? Who knows.. could be put on the to-do list for next major patch; could be on scalebreaker final patch notes.

    Actually they more specifically mentioned echoing vigor

    Vigor's rework to be a single target Heal over Time hasn't hit the mark we wanted, and currently enables too much healing with the Echoing Vigor morph. We'll be taking a close look at the core identity of the skill and potentially making adjustments.

    When read correctly this implies when u stack vigor or resolving vigor with an echoing vigor it is enabling too much healing.

    Why bother? Tested echoing vigor with 2 people they stack on top of each other with a buffed tooltip of 17-18k on a PvE Stamina Build. The way it is now is just broken. I don't know if there is a cap of stacking them but I'd assume its 6 if there is one.

    Do you have a video of this? It's not how it worked during my testing.

    <snip>

    Screenshot_20190730_223406.png


    Interesting, and you're sure it was generating heals for each tick? Not just placing the icon on your buff tracker?

    Edit: misread quote

    There were several ticks mine and vanas were low while the other guy had pve equipment with ticks up to nearly 2k+
    Here, have a chill pill 💊!
  • John_Falstaff
    John_Falstaff
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    @Itzmichi , if you checked combat log and you see ticks from more than two (external) vigors, it's a (PTS-introduced) bug. And if so, it should get fixed, that's about it.

    @SodanTok , vigor can't stack indefinitely because it's a target-applied effect. Ground HoTs do stack, but target-applied HoTs don't, same as, for instance, Mutagen - if two healers cast it, only one copy will be running on target, but different morphs would stack, so if another healer runs Rapid Regen, it will stack with Mutagen.
    Edited by John_Falstaff on August 1, 2019 5:11PM
  • MaxJrFTW
    MaxJrFTW
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    Vigor is getting nerfed because of PvE. It renders healers useless and obviously unnecessary. Rapid Regen however, is healing just as much and is a lot easier to buff up with a heavy attack and brp resto.

    Nobody is talking about rapid regen even though it is a lot stronger than vigor considering how easy it is to increase its healing.

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  • Iskiab
    Iskiab
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    My 2 cents:

    1. The self heal vigor is fine, people will need it with damage being up. Why do you think they buffed it?
    2. Having to use a resto on a mag class in pvp is fine. The devs are leaving bread crumbs to players to not be bad, but it’s like the old horse and water adage
    3. Vigor is a bit stronger then rapid regen because of how stam and mag are built differently. Stam go weapon damage instead or getting pen, but I don’t think it’s an issue
    4. PvE and PvP healers will use mutagen. The 5 second duration on rapid regen is too short for a healer I think

    What IS an issue is there’s no auto-self cast mag heal. I’ve changed my opinion on this. The issue is glass canon potatoes in pvp, without a way to control an ability to self heal they’ll be sucking up all the healing causing the group to wipe. I think this is the only outstanding mag issue.

    I’ve been playing with single target abilities on live to see how they perform (no BGs on PTS) and am sure this is how it will play out. It’ll be even worse then live BGs where one Carebear per group can still work, it will only take 1 to sink a group. It only takes one with all single target healing abilities to soak up 70%+ of all a healer’s healing basicly meaning 2 spots are wasted in a group.
    Edited by Iskiab on August 1, 2019 5:22PM
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  • DocFrost72
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    @Itzmichi , if you checked combat log and you see ticks from more than two (external) vigors, it's a (PTS-introduced) bug. And if so, it should get fixed, that's about it.

    That was my understanding and I couldn't agree more to the bolded.
    @SodanTok , vigor can't stack indefinitely because it's a target-applied effect. Ground HoTs do stack, but target-applied HoTs don't, same as, for instance, Mutagen - if two healers cast it, only one copy will be running on target, but different morphs would stack, so if another healer runs Rapid Regen, it will stack with Mutagen.

    And this was my understanding of its function on live and pts when I checked.
    Edited by DocFrost72 on August 1, 2019 5:17PM
    "Should I do it? No. Will I do it? Of ***ing course I will."
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  • MaxJrFTW
    MaxJrFTW
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    Stibbons wrote: »
    susmitds wrote: »
    If Vigor gets nerfed, same should apply to Rapid Regen/Mutagen.

    Single target heal that hits random dude. Ok.

    Don't zerg and it won't be going to a random dude.
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    ―Ulrich Leland, 3E 433
  • Veinblood1965
    Veinblood1965
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    I'm all for it being OP, the less choices I have for play styles the more I like it......

    >>>Sarcasm
  • p00tx
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    Stibbons wrote: »
    susmitds wrote: »
    If Vigor gets nerfed, same should apply to Rapid Regen/Mutagen.

    Single target heal that hits random dude. Ok.

    Is not random,hit the lowest ally in the area and heal the same as vigor even more if you add the two passive from resto staff and you can also heal someone when needed.

    If vigor get nerfed rapid should be nerfed aswell and vice versa.

    But you still have to slot a resto staff, and it hits one target. Vigor hits all targets in the area and requires no specific weapon or class. There is no mag equivalent.
    Xbox NA

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  • SodanTok
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    Itzmichi , if you checked combat log and you see ticks from more than two (external) vigors, it's a (PTS-introduced) bug. And if so, it should get fixed, that's about it.

    SodanTok , vigor can't stack indefinitely because it's a target-applied effect. Ground HoTs do stack, but target-applied HoTs don't, same as, for instance, Mutagen - if two healers cast it, only one copy will be running on target, but different morphs would stack, so if another healer runs Rapid Regen, it will stack with Mutagen.

    @John_Falstaff Then explain why I have great amount of logs from various trials where one person is getting healed by 2 or even more resolving vigors even at same second. I am listening.

    igy8yfd98cwe.png
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  • John_Falstaff
    John_Falstaff
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    SodanTok wrote: »
    Itzmichi , if you checked combat log and you see ticks from more than two (external) vigors, it's a (PTS-introduced) bug. And if so, it should get fixed, that's about it.

    SodanTok , vigor can't stack indefinitely because it's a target-applied effect. Ground HoTs do stack, but target-applied HoTs don't, same as, for instance, Mutagen - if two healers cast it, only one copy will be running on target, but different morphs would stack, so if another healer runs Rapid Regen, it will stack with Mutagen.

    @John_Falstaff Then explain why I have great amount of logs from various trials where one person is getting healed by 2 or even more resolving vigors even at same second. I am listening.

    igy8yfd98cwe.png

    You sure people aren't spamming it? Because if everyone around spams it, yes, you will get multiple initial ticks that will appear the moment effect refreshes.
  • Mettaricana
    Mettaricana
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    Stibbons wrote: »
    Seems like that. Well we all have to play stamina then.

    Im ok with this from a pve perspective since stam classes aside from stam sorc have guarshit self heals that scale poorly off resources.

    Pvp eh work around it hit harder burst them down faster defile them etc
    Edited by Mettaricana on August 1, 2019 6:23PM
    I'm everything that doesn't belong in the pact but i'm there anyway...
  • SodanTok
    SodanTok
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    SodanTok wrote: »
    Itzmichi , if you checked combat log and you see ticks from more than two (external) vigors, it's a (PTS-introduced) bug. And if so, it should get fixed, that's about it.

    SodanTok , vigor can't stack indefinitely because it's a target-applied effect. Ground HoTs do stack, but target-applied HoTs don't, same as, for instance, Mutagen - if two healers cast it, only one copy will be running on target, but different morphs would stack, so if another healer runs Rapid Regen, it will stack with Mutagen.

    @John_Falstaff Then explain why I have great amount of logs from various trials where one person is getting healed by 2 or even more resolving vigors even at same second. I am listening.

    igy8yfd98cwe.png

    You sure people aren't spamming it? Because if everyone around spams it, yes, you will get multiple initial ticks that will appear the moment effect refreshes.

    upib6alx0831.png

    Same log, this time casts in that same time span. While yes one person is here 3 times you can see my previous log happened after his 2nd cast and before 3rd
    PC | EU | AD
  • Wolf_Watching
    Wolf_Watching
    ✭✭✭✭✭
    Give me a shield or rapid regen (vigor) and Ill be fine with it... Oh wait. Nerf echoing by another 15% and leave resolve alone. ****
    Edited by Wolf_Watching on August 1, 2019 6:30PM
    For All Those Who Don’t Understand What Real Balancing is, or What The Word Buff Means in Video Games:
    Please just stop (with the nerfomancing). We are all sick of people like you, no offense. Just play the game w/o gear or armor. You are going to die and scream anyway.

    Otherwise I don’t mind helping you fix your build for either PvE or PvP. Just hit me up w/ a PM.
  • Wolf_Watching
    Wolf_Watching
    ✭✭✭✭✭
    SodanTok wrote: »
    SodanTok wrote: »
    Itzmichi , if you checked combat log and you see ticks from more than two (external) vigors, it's a (PTS-introduced) bug. And if so, it should get fixed, that's about it.

    SodanTok , vigor can't stack indefinitely because it's a target-applied effect. Ground HoTs do stack, but target-applied HoTs don't, same as, for instance, Mutagen - if two healers cast it, only one copy will be running on target, but different morphs would stack, so if another healer runs Rapid Regen, it will stack with Mutagen.

    @John_Falstaff Then explain why I have great amount of logs from various trials where one person is getting healed by 2 or even more resolving vigors even at same second. I am listening.

    igy8yfd98cwe.png

    You sure people aren't spamming it? Because if everyone around spams it, yes, you will get multiple initial ticks that will appear the moment effect refreshes.

    upib6alx0831.png

    Same log, this time casts in that same time span. While yes one person is here 3 times you can see my previous log happened after his 2nd cast and before 3rd

    Then raise the cost not nerf the skill.
    For All Those Who Don’t Understand What Real Balancing is, or What The Word Buff Means in Video Games:
    Please just stop (with the nerfomancing). We are all sick of people like you, no offense. Just play the game w/o gear or armor. You are going to die and scream anyway.

    Otherwise I don’t mind helping you fix your build for either PvE or PvP. Just hit me up w/ a PM.
  • SodanTok
    SodanTok
    ✭✭✭✭✭
    ✭✭
    SodanTok wrote: »
    SodanTok wrote: »
    Itzmichi , if you checked combat log and you see ticks from more than two (external) vigors, it's a (PTS-introduced) bug. And if so, it should get fixed, that's about it.

    SodanTok , vigor can't stack indefinitely because it's a target-applied effect. Ground HoTs do stack, but target-applied HoTs don't, same as, for instance, Mutagen - if two healers cast it, only one copy will be running on target, but different morphs would stack, so if another healer runs Rapid Regen, it will stack with Mutagen.

    @John_Falstaff Then explain why I have great amount of logs from various trials where one person is getting healed by 2 or even more resolving vigors even at same second. I am listening.

    igy8yfd98cwe.png

    You sure people aren't spamming it? Because if everyone around spams it, yes, you will get multiple initial ticks that will appear the moment effect refreshes.

    upib6alx0831.png

    Same log, this time casts in that same time span. While yes one person is here 3 times you can see my previous log happened after his 2nd cast and before 3rd

    Then raise the cost not nerf the skill.

    I dont believe the skill is OP in slightest, one has to play magicka religiously and avoid trying medium stam build in PVP like a plague to honestly believe that.

    But I believe it stacks.
    Edited by SodanTok on August 1, 2019 6:38PM
    PC | EU | AD
  • killingspreeb16_ESO
    killingspreeb16_ESO
    ✭✭✭✭
    p00tx wrote: »
    Stibbons wrote: »
    susmitds wrote: »
    If Vigor gets nerfed, same should apply to Rapid Regen/Mutagen.

    Single target heal that hits random dude. Ok.

    Is not random,hit the lowest ally in the area and heal the same as vigor even more if you add the two passive from resto staff and you can also heal someone when needed.

    If vigor get nerfed rapid should be nerfed aswell and vice versa.

    But you still have to slot a resto staff, and it hits one target. Vigor hits all targets in the area and requires no specific weapon or class. There is no mag equivalent.

    Yes and magika got class skill about heal/shield unlike stamina alredy said this more than one time.
    Also the vigor people complain about is single target so idk what are you talking about.
    The aoe vigor is going to get some change too.

    Stamina is forced on the 2h aswell so?how is so different?spare me the crap about how resto staff is weak which is BS.
    Edited by killingspreeb16_ESO on August 1, 2019 6:53PM
  • John_Falstaff
    John_Falstaff
    ✭✭✭✭✭
    SodanTok wrote: »
    SodanTok wrote: »
    Itzmichi , if you checked combat log and you see ticks from more than two (external) vigors, it's a (PTS-introduced) bug. And if so, it should get fixed, that's about it.

    SodanTok , vigor can't stack indefinitely because it's a target-applied effect. Ground HoTs do stack, but target-applied HoTs don't, same as, for instance, Mutagen - if two healers cast it, only one copy will be running on target, but different morphs would stack, so if another healer runs Rapid Regen, it will stack with Mutagen.

    @John_Falstaff Then explain why I have great amount of logs from various trials where one person is getting healed by 2 or even more resolving vigors even at same second. I am listening.

    igy8yfd98cwe.png

    You sure people aren't spamming it? Because if everyone around spams it, yes, you will get multiple initial ticks that will appear the moment effect refreshes.

    upib6alx0831.png

    Same log, this time casts in that same time span. While yes one person is here 3 times you can see my previous log happened after his 2nd cast and before 3rd

    Checked if logs distinguish between morphs? Because it's perfectly okay to have your own + external resolving + external echoing and/or base morph ticking.

    But I'll definitely double-check once I'm near the game, and if same morphs happen to stack, then it just doesn't abide by same rules as other target-applied HoTs.
  • SodanTok
    SodanTok
    ✭✭✭✭✭
    ✭✭
    SodanTok wrote: »
    SodanTok wrote: »
    Itzmichi , if you checked combat log and you see ticks from more than two (external) vigors, it's a (PTS-introduced) bug. And if so, it should get fixed, that's about it.

    SodanTok , vigor can't stack indefinitely because it's a target-applied effect. Ground HoTs do stack, but target-applied HoTs don't, same as, for instance, Mutagen - if two healers cast it, only one copy will be running on target, but different morphs would stack, so if another healer runs Rapid Regen, it will stack with Mutagen.

    @John_Falstaff Then explain why I have great amount of logs from various trials where one person is getting healed by 2 or even more resolving vigors even at same second. I am listening.

    igy8yfd98cwe.png

    You sure people aren't spamming it? Because if everyone around spams it, yes, you will get multiple initial ticks that will appear the moment effect refreshes.

    upib6alx0831.png

    Same log, this time casts in that same time span. While yes one person is here 3 times you can see my previous log happened after his 2nd cast and before 3rd

    Checked if logs distinguish between morphs? Because it's perfectly okay to have your own + external resolving + external echoing and/or base morph ticking.

    But I'll definitely double-check once I'm near the game, and if same morphs happen to stack, then it just doesn't abide by same rules as other target-applied HoTs.

    For one yes they do and for second I play with these people :D Nobody uses echoing. And I can find hundreds of these situation
    Edited by SodanTok on August 1, 2019 6:48PM
    PC | EU | AD
  • John_Falstaff
    John_Falstaff
    ✭✭✭✭✭
    SodanTok wrote: »
    SodanTok wrote: »
    SodanTok wrote: »
    Itzmichi , if you checked combat log and you see ticks from more than two (external) vigors, it's a (PTS-introduced) bug. And if so, it should get fixed, that's about it.

    SodanTok , vigor can't stack indefinitely because it's a target-applied effect. Ground HoTs do stack, but target-applied HoTs don't, same as, for instance, Mutagen - if two healers cast it, only one copy will be running on target, but different morphs would stack, so if another healer runs Rapid Regen, it will stack with Mutagen.

    @John_Falstaff Then explain why I have great amount of logs from various trials where one person is getting healed by 2 or even more resolving vigors even at same second. I am listening.

    igy8yfd98cwe.png

    You sure people aren't spamming it? Because if everyone around spams it, yes, you will get multiple initial ticks that will appear the moment effect refreshes.

    upib6alx0831.png

    Same log, this time casts in that same time span. While yes one person is here 3 times you can see my previous log happened after his 2nd cast and before 3rd

    Checked if logs distinguish between morphs? Because it's perfectly okay to have your own + external resolving + external echoing and/or base morph ticking.

    But I'll definitely double-check once I'm near the game, and if same morphs happen to stack, then it just doesn't abide by same rules as other target-applied HoTs.

    For one yes they do and for second I play with these people :D Nobody uses echoing. And I can find hundreds of these situation

    All right; will trust your word on that, but I will definitely want to check for myself, because that'd be most glaring inconsistency in a long while, and I'm not sure why that would be happening, because it shouldn't be by any sane measure.
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