Trading System is absolutely vile

jdamuso

The trader re-selling and trade guild price gouging is disgusting. anything and everything worth buying is constantly being bought up by players with billions of gold and being re-sold at unreasonable prices. The amount of gold being farmed out of the game is obscene and being filtered into the pocket of a handful of the community [snip]

Howabout account binding items sold through traders huh?

Even to obtain a trader you have to compete with this garbage, which is just encouraging the practice...

And before you come back with some snub retort to the point.... empirical evidence: the cheapest purple inferno staff of a mother's sorrow on the market is 55k yet there are well over 260 of this item available on the market right now. Suggesting there is not the demand for the supply. If it was rare enough to be so valuable then okay. but they are clearly its not that rare if there are 260 of it not being sold...


Now the problem is... EVERYTHING is being bought and re-sold..... EVERYTHING that will sell AT ALL. and being marked up 500-3000% regardless of the demand....

Trade system is broken... the add-ons allowed to interfere make it worse... The economy in this game is one of the worst ive seen EVER in 30 years of gaming... Its an abomination.

The only saving grace of this game... is that i dont mind farming stuff myself, and thank the lord for that, because the economy is a complete embarrassment.

[edited for bashing]

midgetfromtheshire

People would just buy the cheaper stuff to keep the higher priced items in supply.

Aliyavana

its how mmo economies work in general. things in demand are bough and resold at a higher price

BalticBlues

OP is right. ESO guild system basically means playing MONOPOLY.
Once you are part of the monopoly, you make millions easily.
However... at some point, you do not even know what to buy with all your gold.
Because there is nothing worth buying, not even decent mounts or houses. This stuff costs crowns...

Wise_Will

BalticBlues wrote: »

OP is right. ESO guild system basically means playing MONOPOLY.
Once you are part of the monopoly, you make millions easily.
However... at some point, you do not even know what to buy with all your gold.
Because there is nothing worth buying, not even decent mounts or houses. This stuff costs crowns...

I buy crowns with my millions

Beardimus

Another person who doesn't understand how to trade properly so fights against it?

Learn the system, work with it. And you will flourish.

I started the game with nothing, millions in the bank now? Yes. Through effort, daily writs, farming, bargain hunting.

What is it you are struggling with exactly as I'm sure asking for help will do you more good than a rant.

Jurand80

You don't need billions to play a trader. I used to do just what the OP explained untill i reached 1m+ don't rly need much gold after. Today it's a different story coz you can buy crowns.

But if you have a problem with a 55k staff then wow. How big is your bank? 10k? I think i bought my MS staff for 200k. Do you even own a maxed out mount? Make some money and stop with the QQ. There are a lot of guides on that. No amount of QQ is going to change the eso trading system so adapt or uninstall.

barney2525

Jurand80 wrote: »

You don't need billions to play a trader. I used to do just what the OP explained untill i reached 1m+ don't rly need much gold after. Today it's a different story coz you can buy crowns.

But if you have a problem with a 55k staff then wow. How big is your bank? 10k? I think i bought my MS staff for 200k. Do you even own a maxed out mount? Make some money and stop with the QQ. There are a lot of guides on that. No amount of QQ is going to change the eso trading system so adapt or uninstall.

Ah... that standard response from all who are panicked that their own little bubble might be burst if Zos used some common sense and added an Global Auction House.

The fact that adding a GAH to the game would put the current system right out of business shows which system is better And which system the Majority of the players want to use.

And so the millionaires rail against it.

YaYaPineapple

barney2525 wrote: »

Ah... that standard response from all who are panicked that their own little bubble might be burst if Zos used some common sense and added an Global Auction House.

What advantage do auctions have over straight selling of items? Do you want to turn the item sales market into eBay? Or we'd need to place bids hoping to win items instead of just buying those items?

SeaGtGruff

Beardimus wrote: »

Another person who doesn't understand how to trade properly so fights against it?

I take it that by "trade properly" you mean "scalping," since that's what the OP is complaining about?

tahol10069

Be prepared to be gaslighted, insulted and abused because you dare to question the Holy Monopoly Machine of ESO.

Yes, it is an abomination of a system. Yes, some people benefit greatly from it, but most don't. Yes, they will claim that Auction House would lead to exact problems that the system suffers from right now, and they do exactly the things right now they will claim that some horrible, greedy people would do if we had an AH.

It is alsol hellish to use, so bad that many people just don't even bother. Doesn't matter if you want to buy or sell, it is cumbersome, slow and absolutely ridicilous system.

It is also unequal, and when there is unequality in play, some minor percent of people benefit from it. They will defend it to their graves, no matter how bad it is for the game as total or how much most of the player base suffers from it.

Undefwun

barney2525 wrote: »

Ah... that standard response from all who are panicked that their own little bubble might be burst if Zos used some common sense and added an Global Auction House.

The fact that adding a GAH to the game would put the current system right out of business shows which system is better And which system the Majority of the players want to use.

And so the millionaires rail against it.

Now you got a global auction house.. cool

What is stopping those 'billionaires' from buying up anything cheap and re-list it for more?
Now they don't even have to go from trader to trader to snap up bargains.. they just sit in at the auction house...

jainiadral

YaYaPineapple wrote: »

barney2525 wrote: »

Ah... that standard response from all who are panicked that their own little bubble might be burst if Zos used some common sense and added an Global Auction House.

What advantage do auctions have over straight selling of items? Do you want to turn the item sales market into eBay? Or we'd need to place bids hoping to win items instead of just buying those items?

Most MMO "auction houses" aren't bid-based. They're like a giant guild trader for the entire population for the game. You list your item at the price you want to sell it for and wait for a buyer. If no one purchases it before the listing period is up, the item is usually kicked back to you in the mail along with at least a portion of your listing fees.

Auction house isn't the best name for it, TBH.

MajBludd

From what I've been told by a friend who played wow for years, it has or had an AH.

He said that the ppl with the most money would buy up items that are underpriced and resell at a higher value.

How is that much different than what happens in eso? The only thing different from what he told me is wow has an AH, eso does not.

AbysmalGhul

I mean, what can you really do about it? If you can't afford the prices, just farm....

You can't change the culture

Beardimus

barney2525 wrote: »

Jurand80 wrote: »

You don't need billions to play a trader. I used to do just what the OP explained untill i reached 1m+ don't rly need much gold after. Today it's a different story coz you can buy crowns.

But if you have a problem with a 55k staff then wow. How big is your bank? 10k? I think i bought my MS staff for 200k. Do you even own a maxed out mount? Make some money and stop with the QQ. There are a lot of guides on that. No amount of QQ is going to change the eso trading system so adapt or uninstall.

Ah... that standard response from all who are panicked that their own little bubble might be burst if Zos used some common sense and added an Global Auction House.

The fact that adding a GAH to the game would put the current system right out of business shows which system is better And which system the Majority of the players want to use.

And so the millionaires rail against it.

How do you think the millionaires became millionaires?

Yep....with the exact same system you have. They just put the effort in.

AH isn't crap because it impacts the billionaire fat cats, it craps as it removes the gain from effort that rewards the little guy. I never had more than 10k for about the first year in game till i clocked it, and progressed.

Haenk

There is plenty of gold to be made - by everyone, in short time. So a 55k item is really not expensive at all.
Go dragon farming for a day, sell receipts and stuff - there you go, you can probably buy 2 or 3 of these staffs.
And after all, the market *is* moving quite a bit, all of the time.

(No, I don't have a million in the bank most of the time, all the money goes into motifs and receipts, to complete the collection. *That* is a true endgame boss.)

SoLooney

The only thing I don't like about traders is porting to each zone and experiencing the lame load screens and moving around to each npc

If you play the system, you can make millions. Not hard, between writs, skin sales, and stocking my guild trader, money flows in

Dont play harder, play smarter

Beardimus

SeaGtGruff wrote: »

Beardimus wrote: »

Another person who doesn't understand how to trade properly so fights against it?

I take it that by "trade properly" you mean "scalping," since that's what the OP is complaining about?

What is actually wrong with it? Sure if every item was being bought up across every platform and region and the entire population was being held to random perhaps there's a point. He's taking about a free to farm staff, that's in demand (i.e. A few streamers have mentioned it) Thus price is up.

Buying low and selling high took me from no gold to my first 100k. As an utter noob. But i knew the prices of Kutas and Wax and trawled traders in remote places to find deals and resell. It took a huge amount of time, but got me going. Not as a fat cat but as someone that could be bothered.

Effort - reward.

Being balanced - i AM on Xbox EU. And in general i think both Xbox and EU see less antics going on in the trading space. I.e. I'm in the bigger trading guilds and none charge for membership. Things do always sound worse on PC NA for that type of stuff

Welkynar

I do not see how marking up can be an issue, at least on Xbox. If somebody decides to buy all of a particular item and list them at their trader, they can only have 30 listings and how will they compete with the many other traders with many other sellers who will sell at a lower price so people will buy their stuff? Will they buy those lower priced items again and hope to sell them while their 30 listings aren't being sold because nobody wants to buy those overpriced items? 55k gold for a purple MS inferno staff is okay given its rarity. Try spending a day farming for one. If you want it sold for like 5k gold then you're out of your mind I sell them at a lower price in Elden Root. If you're looking at Mournhold traders, I feel like they mostly have the higher prices, at least on Xbox (that's why I usually don't buy there).

Seriously, making gold through traders is very easy. When I don't farm I just do my writs and surveys and sell gold material. I also craft some gear and sell. When I farm I go to Deshaan and sell the gear I obtain. Easy money. I have to sell at a lower price too, otherwise my listings don't move.

Ysbriel

Use TTC and haul.

Vajrak

55k is too expensive....

2 hours farming IC Sewers, just the general mobs, nets enough Tel Var to get at least 2 Hakeijo (15kea), maybe 3 if you can handle the roaming bosses, and about another 10k in trash drops to just vendor.

Just vendoring trash from daily dungeons nets you about 5-8k per 15-20 minute run.

Stealing and Laundering, if you go for lowdown, and only steal/launder whites (40g) nets you around 8k.

The price of some items will jump around as the meta changes, and other items (crafting materials mostly) are commodities, to the price stays pretty stable.

55k can be accomplished in about 4 hours without engaging with the traders at all, going on lazy methods to do so.

Urigall

Trading would work fine were it not for the influence of the few players who have corrupted the system. Huge wealth, and the temptation to indulge in some dodgy practices, has pushed kiosk prices higher and put a road block in the way of owning kiosks with a high rate of sales turnover. Direct your ire towards the few who have corrupted the system, not towards those who are playing as fairly as they can. The corrupting influence of the scammers is probably completely disproportionate to their number.

"Guilt by association" is the phrase that comes to mind.

If ZoS thought the entire system was rotten they would not have left it - more or less - intact. The changes they are proposing are probably aimed at doing what they can to stop the scammers, in the hope that those who want to play fair will get a better opportunity to do just that. ZoS's patch notes bear that out - ghost guilds and kiosk reselling feature prominently therein. ZoS are not changing the system because everyone involved in it is corrupt.

As for the claim that item prices are too high, the fact that items can be bought cheaply disproves that contention. Not everyone who buys a cheap item does so to resell it. If the flippers can buy an item cheaply, so can a genuine buyer. Cheap items can be found. Just takes a bit of effort.

YaYaPineapple

jainiadral wrote: »

Most MMO "auction houses" aren't bid-based. They're like a giant guild trader for the entire population for the game. You list your item at the price you want to sell it for and wait for a buyer. If no one purchases it before the listing period is up, the item is usually kicked back to you in the mail along with at least a portion of your listing fees.

Auction house isn't the best name for it, TBH.

Why not use the term "Global Market" then? There have been other mmos that used that term, which seems to better fit what you mean. No reason to call it an "Auction House" if there are not any actual auctions happening.


auc·tion
/ˈôkSH(ə)n/
noun
noun: auction; plural noun: auctions

1.
a public sale in which goods or property are sold to the highest bidder.

Reevster

Wont matter what system is in place, there will always be players/ buyers buying low from players that sell too low for whatever reason. There will always be rich players trying to corner a market , thats never going to change.

Biggest problem is the bidding system , seems to have gotten worst lately, most of my guilds have bumped up the min selling , donation requirements in the last month or so with renewed warnings of removal.

While it doesn't really affect me , been playing since 2014 with a few breaks now and again,gold is not an issue for me.

But for many selling 400k a week in sales for example isn't going to happen . So they would need to donate 20,000 gold or more just to stay in said guild, times that by 5 guilds, 100,000 a week give or take and rising.

Not easy to get for the casual player every week, and that is just to give away , not considering your day to day in game expenses , and gear buying etc etc.

Dont know the fix for that, but seems like its getting out of hand, imo anyways.

jainiadral

YaYaPineapple wrote: »

jainiadral wrote: »

Most MMO "auction houses" aren't bid-based. They're like a giant guild trader for the entire population for the game. You list your item at the price you want to sell it for and wait for a buyer. If no one purchases it before the listing period is up, the item is usually kicked back to you in the mail along with at least a portion of your listing fees.

Auction house isn't the best name for it, TBH.

Why not use the term "Global Market" then? There have been other mmos that used that term, which seems to better fit what you mean. No reason to call it an "Auction House" if there are not any actual auctions happening.


auc·tion
/ˈôkSH(ə)n/
noun
noun: auction; plural noun: auctions

1.
a public sale in which goods or property are sold to the highest bidder.

Because I didn't make up the term. It's one that's commonly used. And some games with a "Global Market" call their "global market" an "Auction House." Like Secret World Legends, for example. The name is literally, "Auction House." Anyway, if we're arguing over commonly used MMO terms instead of merely trying to clarify what people are actually asking for in this game vs. common misconceptions, I'm all done

My goal was to clarify, not debate.

p_tsakirisb16_ESO

Ysbriel wrote: »

Use TTC and haul.

[snip]

BalticBlues wrote: »

OP is right. ESO guild system basically means playing MONOPOLY.
Once you are part of the monopoly, you make millions easily.
However... at some point, you do not even know what to buy with all your gold.
Because there is nothing worth buying, not even decent mounts or houses. This stuff costs crowns...

Wake up. ESO guild system is fine, and was fine until the TTC mod converted the whole game into a "WoW auction house" (where no auction is taking place actually), against the will and design of ZOS. That mod API allows the "traders" to buy cheap something that was posted minutes ago from X place, and put it on Y place for sale at inflated prices.

Don't blame ZOS on that. The system was fine before this [snip] (TTC) appeared, with hub traders been more valuable (Craglorn, Elden Root etc) where you could find everything you wanted at good prices.

[edited for baiting]

rpa

I used to hate the trading system until I realized it's part of this game. Not a part I'm personally interested of but still something some people play hadcore. For us casuals, there is plenty of very useful non-bis stuff to buy in reasonable price and one can always dump sellables to guild store in bargain price and let more dedicated guildies handle it.

YaYaPineapple

jainiadral wrote: »

Because I didn't make up the term. It's one that's commonly used. And some games with a "Global Market" call their "global market" an "Auction House." Like Secret World Legends, for example. The name is literally, "Auction House." Anyway, if we're arguing over commonly used MMO terms instead of merely trying to clarify what people are actually asking for in this game vs. common misconceptions, I'm all done

My goal was to clarify, not debate.

There's debate or argument, I'm only suggesting using a term with a meaning closer to what is wanted. I think there would be even more support for the idea if it were clear that people don't actually want to have auctions for items. I agree with you that "auction house" isn't the best term to use for it.

That's why I asked what was meant. If "Auction House" meant having "auctions", I'd be against the idea.

jainiadral

YaYaPineapple wrote: »

jainiadral wrote: »

Because I didn't make up the term. It's one that's commonly used. And some games with a "Global Market" call their "global market" an "Auction House." Like Secret World Legends, for example. The name is literally, "Auction House." Anyway, if we're arguing over commonly used MMO terms instead of merely trying to clarify what people are actually asking for in this game vs. common misconceptions, I'm all done

My goal was to clarify, not debate.

There's debate or argument, I'm only suggesting using a term with a meaning closer to what is wanted. I think there would be even more support for the idea if it were clear that people don't actually want to have auctions for items. I agree with you that "auction house" isn't the best term to use for it.

That's why I asked what was meant. If "Auction House" meant having "auctions", I'd be against the idea.

Ah, gotcha. Sorry for jumping the gun. I've had a lot of, er, unpleasant exchanges that involved lots of debate over jargon and people actually doing the online equivalent of yelling at me for explaining lines of thinking-- as if I was actually the one making an argument one way or another

How about, "Global Trader System?" Or "Universal Trader System?" Gives it a bit of the 'ole ESO spin

Juomuuri

In my opinion, ESO has waaaay better economy than GW2 (the only other MMO I play). In that game, you can't even craft your own gear since it would cost more than buying from Trading Post. And people ask outrageous prices for these things, if you want to make a decent build, you need to spend like 50-70 gold (equivalent to maybe 100k gold in ESO, as far as I've calculated, likely wrong but eh). I say this because I play 25 toons in GW2, and 16 in ESO (all for RP).

There sure is monopoly in the current trading system, but thank god ZOS doesn't force a global trading system, it would kill the economy even more than it already is.

It's such a relief that you can find cheap stuff in guild stores if you just check TTC and dash to the correct traders to snatch the items. I do this to get them for personal use - gear, furnishing plans, motifs, furniture... But there is no one to stop the flippers from doing that too. All MMO ecomonies are bad in their own ways, but currently, ESO's system is good enough for me.