Is Necromancer Goliath Bash Spam intended?

kpittsniperb14_ESO

Nicalas wrote: »

250 cost ultimate with no ultimate generation during those 20 seconds. Giant character model to easily pick out of the group. Can be countered by CC/Roots/Snares/Blocking. High stamina cost. Once this got out most players who pay half attention knew exactly what to do when encountering this ultimate. Any change to this ultimate makes it a dead morph. It requires a specific build that outside of the transformation makes the player more or less useless.

But yes lets nerf it into the ground and add it to the pile of useless skills in the game.

The Necro as a class is already pitiful in PvP with drain skills that can be los'd, a healing pet that can be los'd and poor sustain. You know what happens when you cast siphon or coil on a player who releases? The skill is cancelled. You get nothing and cannot recast without another corpse.

Necro is a one trick pony. Pay attention to who or what you are fighting. Hold block. CC/Snare/Root. Any smart bash build will immediately change targets if you start blocking. They get 20 seconds to do something and thats it.

I get a kick out of these types of defensive posts about a completely broken mechanic, every single broken OP thing that's been added to this game over the years has been defended with this same tired mantra....boiled down to L2P. But I'll bite.

You act as though immovability and CC immunity isn't a thing but any decent player running this build knows how and when to use immovability. But it is a high cost ult right? Compare this ultimate to any other 250 cost ultimate in game for damage and defense and get back to me, it simply does too much and it lasts 20 seconds....let that sink in people. In 1v1 situations this could potentially be countered I'll give you that, in large scale combat however is where this ultimate overperforms by a huge margin, you're dead before you can react becasue there is ZERO counter play possible....which is really the problem with this ultimate, lack of counter play. It simply does too much damage in too short of a window while making you a tank....heavy armor damage sets OP, but this Ult is fine right? When this ult is used in group play it boils down to which side has moar bash and who alpha striked whom which is a terrible environment for mmorpg pvp….first person shooters are a more appropriate setting for that. This isn't the first time we've had the alpha strike meta in this game, wasn't healthy for pvp then and it isn't healthy now.

The fact that the magicka morph isn't even considered for use when compared to the stamina morph is telling...so even within the class itself there is a huge imbalance. It's a zerg buster you say.....and now the zergs are starting to use it in force making it nearly impossible to fight them when outnumbered.

Necro needs some upward adjustments and frankly some fixes to it's buggy and at times broken skills and shouldn't be crutching on a single overperforming mechanic to make it viable. If Necro is truly a one trick pony class then fix the class, adjust the ultimate...this is what you should be asking for. What you're going to end up with is an underperforming class and a nerfed ultimate if things keep on the way they are. I mean, once the sales targets for Elsweyr are met that is.

Dr_Ganknstein

It's the dumbest thing I've seen in a long time in any mmorpg. I cancelled my eso plus until it's fixed. Speak with your wallet and they will listen.

Beaverton

Almost every death recap from last night was filled with Necro Bash. I mean usually there are Dawnbreakers, Eye of the storm, a few gravity crushes thrown in. Not last night. It got boring real fast. Maybe it is time to play something else for awhile.

The zergs we were fighting had 8-10 BashHos. I assume the one streamer loaded his group up with them in order to document how OP they are and the other didn't do that in order to provide contrast. It was effective.

This was in no CP. Bollocksdan or whatever it is called.

Lokey0024

eovogtb16_ESO wrote: »

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2RXxUY9CbKE

holy *** this game is becoming a joke

Y dey don cC dEm? Lurn 2 play

Chaosball is great with this btw...

Hashtag_

Beaverton wrote: »

Almost every death recap from last night was filled with Necro Bash. I mean usually there are Dawnbreakers, Eye of the storm, a few gravity crushes thrown in. Not last night. It got boring real fast. Maybe it is time to play something else for awhile.

The zergs we were fighting had 8-10 BashHos. I assume the one streamer loaded his group up with them in order to document how OP they are and the other didn't do that in order to provide contrast. It was effective.

This was in no CP. Bollocksdan or whatever it is called.

Nah he just does it to be an a hole because he knows it’s broken.

Kartalin

Hashtag_ wrote: »

Beaverton wrote: »

Almost every death recap from last night was filled with Necro Bash. I mean usually there are Dawnbreakers, Eye of the storm, a few gravity crushes thrown in. Not last night. It got boring real fast. Maybe it is time to play something else for awhile.

The zergs we were fighting had 8-10 BashHos. I assume the one streamer loaded his group up with them in order to document how OP they are and the other didn't do that in order to provide contrast. It was effective.

This was in no CP. Bollocksdan or whatever it is called.

Nah he just does it to be an a hole because he knows it’s broken.

Absolutely. Pretty sure @Beaverton was being sarcastic there.

hmsdragonfly

Nicalas wrote: »

250 cost ultimate with no ultimate generation during those 20 seconds. Giant character model to easily pick out of the group. Can be countered by CC/Roots/Snares/Blocking. High stamina cost. Once this got out most players who pay half attention knew exactly what to do when encountering this ultimate. Any change to this ultimate makes it a dead morph. It requires a specific build that outside of the transformation makes the player more or less useless.

But yes lets nerf it into the ground and add it to the pile of useless skills in the game.

The Necro as a class is already pitiful in PvP with drain skills that can be los'd, a healing pet that can be los'd and poor sustain. You know what happens when you cast siphon or coil on a player who releases? The skill is cancelled. You get nothing and cannot recast without another corpse.

Necro is a one trick pony. Pay attention to who or what you are fighting. Hold block. CC/Snare/Root. Any smart bash build will immediately change targets if you start blocking. They get 20 seconds to do something and thats it.

IN BEFORE BASH SPAMMING ABUSERS LIKE THIS GUY SAYING "JUST RUN AWAY FOR 20 SECONDS LOL", LET ME REMIND YOU THAT BATTLEGROUND IS AN OBJECTIVE-BASED GAME, SO IF THE BASH SPAMMER IS PLAYING THE ODJECTIVE IE. HOLDING RELICS, CAPPING FLAGS ETC, YOU CAN'T RUN AWAY FROM THE BASH SPAMMER OR ELSE YOU LOSE THE GAME.

CC? You can CC the necro once, and he breaks free and have 6 seconds of CC immunity. Lmao.
Block? YEAH TRY BLOCKING A BASH SPAMMER IF YOU DONT BUILD TOWARDS TANKINESS/BLOCKING.

Necro class should be *** reworked.

Steelriver

I'd rather be bashed to death and die because i didn't move then killed by VD Because some other dude has 10k health and 10 resists.

Waffennacht

Every BG Pummeling Goliath gets killed after getting little more than a few kills

eovogtb16_ESO

Shokasegambit1 wrote: »

In case you didn't know ...



You have to build for it to be OP






You have to build for it to be OP






You have to build for it to be OP





You have to build for it to be OP






You have to build for it to be OP






You have to build for it to be OP



When your out of juice your a wet noodle in the wind.

Change this or nerf this, the class is a negitive zero in CP PvP - and a joke to be in Cyrodiil. It already is awful to be a stamcro in PvP without using weapon or other abilities that are proven viable already.

The class is built strictly for PvE trial boss executes - dps tests - and epic Necro role playing. 😂

But I have no faith left in this community anymore. What ever kills you without a rotation give it to mag players per vicious death. If it's stam nerf it into oblivion so there is even more healbot and block fighting cancer without a good defile.


And remember -

You have to build for it to be OP. 🤔

you definitly do not have to build for it to be OP.

I equip hulking dragur and spriggans and can bash people for 5-8k a hit and wipe whole zergs, that is with zero reduced bash jewelry and zero done to the gear.

Waffennacht

.

eovogtb16_ESO wrote: »

Shokasegambit1 wrote: »

In case you didn't know ...



You have to build for it to be OP






You have to build for it to be OP






You have to build for it to be OP





You have to build for it to be OP






You have to build for it to be OP






You have to build for it to be OP



When your out of juice your a wet noodle in the wind.

Change this or nerf this, the class is a negitive zero in CP PvP - and a joke to be in Cyrodiil. It already is awful to be a stamcro in PvP without using weapon or other abilities that are proven viable already.

The class is built strictly for PvE trial boss executes - dps tests - and epic Necro role playing. 😂

But I have no faith left in this community anymore. What ever kills you without a rotation give it to mag players per vicious death. If it's stam nerf it into oblivion so there is even more healbot and block fighting cancer without a good defile.


And remember -

You have to build for it to be OP. 🤔

you definitly do not have to build for it to be OP.

I equip hulking dragur and spriggans and can bash people for 5-8k a hit and wipe whole zergs, that is with zero reduced bash jewelry and zero done to the gear.

I do think it was a joke

Demra

When people say just move out what do they mean by it? Can't the goliath "move" after them and use cc as well? What stopping it to move? Cc? Aren't there counters to cc and cc immunity? Out run somebody for 20 seconds is the counter play? Fights don't last this long in no cp. Dodge doesn't work against aoe either. I don't understand.

Demra

Based on last two days in cyrodiil, it seems to me that the group with more goliaths will always prevail.

kpittsniperb14_ESO

Demra wrote: »

When people say just move out what do they mean by it? Can't the goliath "move" after them and use cc as well? What stopping it to move? Cc? Aren't there counters to cc and cc immunity? Out run somebody for 20 seconds is the counter play? Fights don't last this long in no cp. Dodge doesn't work against aoe either. I don't understand.

Not to mention that it being a stamina based class they have easy access to gap closers from the same weapon set they are using to make this build. So on a magicka class you get one dodge roll away if you're on point with situational awareness then gap closed and finished. The skill is an absolute joke at this point with entire zergs running around using this and ZOS is a joke as well for their inability or unwillingness to make adjustments outside of their scheduled 3 month window. Considering that the entire game is a giant dumpster fire after this DLC I doubt this would even be on the front burner anyway so we have a good several months of this nonsense in front of us. At least the crown store is working. YEEEEEAAAAHHH!!!!

kpittsniperb14_ESO

Hashtag_ wrote: »

Beaverton wrote: »

Almost every death recap from last night was filled with Necro Bash. I mean usually there are Dawnbreakers, Eye of the storm, a few gravity crushes thrown in. Not last night. It got boring real fast. Maybe it is time to play something else for awhile.

The zergs we were fighting had 8-10 BashHos. I assume the one streamer loaded his group up with them in order to document how OP they are and the other didn't do that in order to provide contrast. It was effective.

This was in no CP. Bollocksdan or whatever it is called.

Nah he just does it to be an a hole because he knows it’s broken.

Oh come on now, he's only running it and streaming to highlight to ZOS how OP it is.

Ankael07

kpittsniperb14_ESO wrote: »

Hashtag_ wrote: »

Beaverton wrote: »

Almost every death recap from last night was filled with Necro Bash. I mean usually there are Dawnbreakers, Eye of the storm, a few gravity crushes thrown in. Not last night. It got boring real fast. Maybe it is time to play something else for awhile.

The zergs we were fighting had 8-10 BashHos. I assume the one streamer loaded his group up with them in order to document how OP they are and the other didn't do that in order to provide contrast. It was effective.

This was in no CP. Bollocksdan or whatever it is called.

Nah he just does it to be an a hole because he knows it’s broken.

Oh come on now, he's only running it and streaming to highlight to ZOS how OP it is.

Except people already highlighted this during PTS. Maybe only shown in 1 on 1 situation but its not that hard to apply that to AvA.

Every time they need to sell a chapter/dlc they introduce something OP and it gets worse every time.

WeylandLabs

I'll tell you what - if this community has can rally complaints about the bash to nerf it. Eso deserves to lose 1/3 of there player base, because of players competency playing TESO. This isn't an Esport - you cannot gauge actual skill on RNG fighting so stop trying to turn it into one.

Yes in PvP bash is really good, but that's it. That's all it has everything about the class is awful for PvP.

Players are so quick to jump on this and make logical complaints and why this or why that. Look the game itself and it's entirety lacks performance and the real issues are brushed aside to make purchases.

I've never been apart of a gaming community that doesn't address real issues first. Or maybe your Esport failures grasping onto redemption and live for this RNG gutiar hero fighting system. I dont know but a necro bash should be your last option, it's funny I remember when people were trying to nerf VD. Didn't work out for a reason I guess lol Same thing...

Koensol

Shokasegambit1 wrote: »

I'll tell you what - if this community has can rally complaints about the bash to nerf it. Eso deserves to lose 1/3 of there player base, because of players competency playing TESO. This isn't an Esport - you cannot gauge actual skill on RNG fighting so stop trying to turn it into one.

Yes in PvP bash is really good, but that's it. That's all it has everything about the class is awful for PvP.

Players are so quick to jump on this and make logical complaints and why this or why that. Look the game itself and it's entirety lacks performance and the real issues are brushed aside to make purchases.

I've never been apart of a gaming community that doesn't address real issues first. Or maybe your Esport failures grasping onto redemption and live for this RNG gutiar hero fighting system. I dont know but a necro bash should be your last option, it's funny I remember when people were trying to nerf VD. Didn't work out for a reason I guess lol Same thing...

Everything after your 1st paragraph is completely irrelevant. And your 1st paragraph makes it look like you are scared to death to lose your crutch. Not sure you even realize how much influence this bash exploiting has on the game. If a goliath basher gets killed in a BG, I have seen more than once, both the other teams stop fighting just to mass teabag the basher. Wars stopped for that teabag. I've never seen anything like that before. Not even petsorc premades draw that much hate.

But there is always the forums, where people will defend broken mechanics with an immunity to reason and logic. Do I need to remind you of sloads, snipe, torugs enchant meta, etc.? In the end all that got nerfed and so will this. Just wait

Earthewen

Way to go ZOS …

This sort of thing was done with the Warden when it first came out. The whole MO is rather predictable. Build a DLC that includes a new class that is play-to-win. Make sure it is OP as hell so everyone will want it, but they can only get it if they buy the DLC. Make it the new "easy button" of PvP so everyone will use it, and there ya go. AND make it cheesy as hell so even stupid players can get kills that they couldn't get before.

And then the next thing is for sure … the cheesiest players who are interested in the newest "easy button" run it constantly out in PvP. No skill required to run it … just bash. People complain about it, oh yes. But the complaints are ignored or it is said "as intended". But don't nerf it! No. Can't do that until the marketing and accounting department says it's finally time because the sales of the new DLC has dropped. They'll nerf it then in preparation for the next "easy button" creation that will lure the cheese players into buying the next DLC.

End of story

Ender1310

Why did they make bash off of the light attack cooldown? I think that would fix it. Maybe make it not worth slotting though.

wheem_ESO

Earthewen wrote: »

Way to go ZOS …

This sort of thing was done with the Warden when it first came out. The whole MO is rather predictable. Build a DLC that includes a new class that is play-to-win. Make sure it is OP as hell so everyone will want it, but they can only get it if they buy the DLC. Make it the new "easy button" of PvP so everyone will use it, and there ya go. AND make it cheesy as hell so even stupid players can get kills that they couldn't get before.

And then the next thing is for sure … the cheesiest players who are interested in the newest "easy button" run it constantly out in PvP. No skill required to run it … just bash. People complain about it, oh yes. But the complaints are ignored or it is said "as intended". But don't nerf it! No. Can't do that until the marketing and accounting department says it's finally time because the sales of the new DLC has dropped. They'll nerf it then in preparation for the next "easy button" creation that will lure the cheese players into buying the next DLC.

End of story

Just because one morph of one ultimate is overpowered for stamina builds doesn't mean that the whole class is "pay-to-win." In fact, Magicka Necromancer is basically the worst thing in the game, suffering from both design flaws and very impactful bugs. A multitude of changes need to happen for Necromancers, and the bash spam is just one of them.

CompM4s

Its a situational build for groups, very ineffective outside of goliath form. Same as any other bomb

Waffennacht

Just play BGs

This isn't necessarily a solution to any of your problems

I just want you to play BGs


So....


Play more BGs

Illuvatarr

The individual bash damage is fine.The rate at which it can be done allowing zero counterplay is the issue.

eovogtb16_ESO

Can we get an official response on this?

Davadin

it just needs a cooldown.

max 1 per sec. no animation cancelling. make it like Dizzying Swing.

montiferus

Another broken skill in the long line of missteps by ZOS. Every patch there is some new food stamp for the cripples to crutch on and this happens to be it.

Just for giggles I wanted to test the range radius on this thing. I positioned myself directly behind someone at the top of a resource to see if I could avoid taking damage and guess what. I still got hit! So add 360 degree range to the list of things that are stupid about this ability.

Waffennacht

I would so love this ability to be changed just so there's no longer any call to P2W type stuff. I'd hope necro gets a little love after such a change. Especially mag necro

Not entirely sure how to make it better, but definitely would sacrifice this ult for it

Insco851

Waffennacht wrote: »

I would so love this ability to be changed just so there's no longer any call to P2W type stuff. I'd hope necro gets a little love after such a change. Especially mag necro

Not entirely sure how to make it better, but definitely would sacrifice this ult for it

Stam and mag both are interesting kits that just don’t do much alone. (Besides bash bs)

They have one of the strongest group ults to use and it’s not easy to line up or get players willing enough to listen to help actually use it.

How many folks stand in the stationary destro ults? That’s basically the same effect colossus has in open areas.

Kartalin

Insco851 wrote: »

How many folks stand in the stationary destro ults? That’s basically the same effect colossus has in open areas.

The problem is not a single goliath basher open field though. When you get hit by one of these groups they negate, streak and encase you as 3+ bashers roll through and kill you in literally a second.