magnb and reflective skills

Flame_of_Hades

So I have a question. Does anyone have a reason that wings should reflect within melee range? Playing both a magdk and a magblade, the only time i feel i need wings, is when the ranged build runs away. If/When the fight becomes a melee, why should i be able to negate the damage when i can hit back? That's what wings are for, so that dks (who originally had very low mobility and thus could be abused by ranged builds) can't be abused by range builds without the ability to fight back. What we have NOW is a complete reversal of the situation that wings were put in place to prevent.

kaithuzar

ccmedaddy wrote: »

Iskiab wrote: »

Still don't understand the whole mobility thing DKs are talking about. Are they saying they're slow when they block cast? Otherwise they have the same mobility as everyone else + they have a way to cleanse snares. They're actually better off then other classes except sorc. Maybe just don't want to use things like the steed mundus? IDK.

NBs have Shadow Image+Cloak to get out of dodgy situations (when Shadow Image works as intended, that is). Sorcs have Streak. DKs, Wardens and Templars don't have anything comparable. That's the mobility gap. DKs do have it slightly better than the other two though thanks to snare removal+immunity.

To quote “he who shall not be named”..
“Templars have a house & they should stand in it, if you come in their house, you’re going to get messed up”;
Thus no need for mobility


Also...I don’t know a single magic class than can kill a warden while they’re keeping shimmering shield up...
Maybe magdk w/skoria?

Baphomet

Rock-paper-scissors = you can't be strong against everything.

Go melee or use forcepulse - there are counters against wings, so this discussion is a bit moot, in my opinion.

frostz417

RinaldoGandolphi wrote: »

Wings works the way it does due to DK lack of mobility built into the class.

But these unreflectable buffs to cripple and strife are absurd. You already get just by slotying either one of those skills:

3% increased healing
8% increased max magicka
20 ultimate for drinking a potion
2 ultimate every 4 seconds while using the ability in combat

Let’s just make it unreflectable too while we’re at it. That’s ridiculous. Both of those skills are long range spammables with one of them being a root followed by a snare. Both strife and cripple are overturned due to their passives.

Wing are integral to a DK defense just like shields are for sorcery and Cloak and Shade are for Nightblades.

Folks need to learn how to play around wings even in Seducer + Lich it’s imposdible to keep wings up 100% of the time. You just gotta play around it.

All these nerfs are getting out of hand. Mag nightblade with a ranged build is strong against every other spec in the game that’s pretty balanced considering no other mag ranged class is as strong against other as many other specs as magblade is

If you can’t sustain wings you’re just a bad player

likecats

Baphomet wrote: »

Rock-paper-scissors = you can't be strong against everything.

Go melee or use forcepulse - there are counters against wings, so this discussion is a bit moot, in my opinion.

Your lack of ignorance about the class makes you feel that this discussion is moot.

Melee magblade is not a counter to anything; because it is not viable in 2019. As a melee magblade, you get rooted implies you're dead because you can't deal dmg, can't tank, can't get away or can't heal (effectively). No other melee class in this game is so ineffective against snares. Eitther they can dodgeroll plentifully to ignore snares, or they have abilities to remove snares, or they have great tankiness and healing.

Force pulse is a counter to wings, however when force pulse was made unreflectable and swallow soul was not, the class balance was very different. In the past, swallow soul was 1/2 the cost of force pulse, and provided minor vitality, plus nightblade had much better sustain and healing in general. Back then it was justifiable why swallow soul was reflectable and force pulse was not (x2 cost).

Now, they nerfed swallow soul again and again, to the point where they made the cost the same, and removed minor vitality. The reduced cost in the past allowed magblade to cast more defensive abilities, this is no longer the case. On top, they nerfed nightblade defense in healing options, to the point where swallow soul is less of a choice and more of a necessity. Nightblade either needs a hardenward like instant shield, or BOL like heal in 2019 to say that swallow soul is a choice and not a necessity.

It's sad that these rock-paper-scissor mechanics are kept exclusively for magblades. Magblade wouldn't be near the top class even if they removed these mechanics. I play stam-dk, stamplar, magplar, and stamblade, and none of these classes have a wing-like (rock-paper-scissor) counter to them. Where is the balance?

Swiftfox_Bouncyface

Baphomet wrote: »

Rock-paper-scissors = you can't be strong against everything.

Go melee or use forcepulse - there are counters against wings, so this discussion is a bit moot, in my opinion.

Ok going by this logic, why don't we duel, while your only skill you're allowed to damage me with is whip? Can't light attack either. We'll see if you have any chance to kill in that scenario. Because that's what it is when you tell "smh just use FP"

Noctus

Swiftfox_Bouncyface wrote: »

Baphomet wrote: »

Rock-paper-scissors = you can't be strong against everything.

Go melee or use forcepulse - there are counters against wings, so this discussion is a bit moot, in my opinion.

Ok going by this logic, why don't we duel, while your only skill you're allowed to damage me with is whip? Can't light attack either. We'll see if you have any chance to kill in that scenario. Because that's what it is when you tell "smh just use FP"

i couldnt have made a better argument. i hope now that even the weakest of minds get the idea

LordTareq

That’s not mobility, its an escape tool which they lack. The argument DK use about lack of mobility is mostly due to not having a gap closer other than an ultimate, which is of course bullocks since they have a class inherent pull instead, plus 2 potential charges from weapon skill lines.

On the other hand I also don’t really understand the argument where magblade doesn’t have mobility, its the most mobile class I’ve played. The snare issue is only a problem for caster magblades, and even then you have a workaround with shade.

Iskiab

For sure, magblades are mobile. That’s definitely not a weakness of the class.

Koensol

LordTareq wrote: »

The snare issue is only a problem for caster magblades, and even then you have a workaround with shade.

This is just not true, and I wish people would stop spreading this nonsense. Shade is a one time escape. If you already have snare and rootspamming zerglings on you, you have no way to escape. In essence, magden and magplar have the same problems, but they have slightly better tools to deal with it (shimmering shield to prevent ranged snares + netch fot magden, and cleanse for templar). Magblade has absolutely nothing if you get jumped.

On top of that all your damage is single target and dodgable/reflectable. Magdks and stamblades will have a major advantage. Against magdk it is just a meme. No other class in the game gets this hardcountered.

Just give magblades a tool to remove snares/roots + immunity and balance cloak and shade accordingly so it doesn't become too much. I feel cloak is the reason why these things are denied to magblades.

brandonv516

LordTareq wrote: »

That’s not mobility, its an escape tool which they lack. The argument DK use about lack of mobility is mostly due to not having a gap closer other than an ultimate, which is of course bullocks since they have a class inherent pull instead, plus 2 potential charges from weapon skill lines.

On the other hand I also don’t really understand the argument where magblade doesn’t have mobility, its the most mobile class I’ve played. The snare issue is only a problem for caster magblades, and even then you have a workaround with shade.

Wrong. So wrong.

Melee Magblade should not be pigeonholed into 2H + FM.

Other than running this, Melee Magblade has the same issues (even more) than Ranged Magblade.

LordTareq

brandonv516 wrote: »

LordTareq wrote: »

That’s not mobility, its an escape tool which they lack. The argument DK use about lack of mobility is mostly due to not having a gap closer other than an ultimate, which is of course bullocks since they have a class inherent pull instead, plus 2 potential charges from weapon skill lines.

On the other hand I also don’t really understand the argument where magblade doesn’t have mobility, its the most mobile class I’ve played. The snare issue is only a problem for caster magblades, and even then you have a workaround with shade.

Wrong. So wrong.

Melee Magblade should not be pigeonholed into 2H + FM.

Other than running this, Melee Magblade has the same issues (even more) than Ranged Magblade.

You use the tools available to you. Yes it forces you to use a 2-hander, but if that provided the best toolkit for pvp, why wouldn’t you?

likecats

Rumors has it reflects are being removed. Wings will now reduce projectiles by 50% but no projectile cap. Good balance change that buffs wings, but also doesn't make it the ultimate counter to magblades. /thread

LordTareq

Well its better, but a 50% reduction on all our skills is still not so great for us, and no projectile cap. That said its nice not to be crippled by my own crippling grasp anymore. 50% is better than 0% at least.

Maulkin

likecats wrote: »

Rumors has it reflects are being removed. Wings will now reduce projectiles by 50% but no projectile cap. Good balance change that buffs wings, but also doesn't make it the ultimate counter to magblades. /thread

End thread on a rumour? I think not. Also that rumour can't be true, where did you hear that? That'd be a humongous nerf to MagDks who are in a decent shape atm, yet not OP and can't afford such big nerfs.

Currently you can at least spam your wings a few times until you get to LoS, if you build for sustain a bit. But taking 50% of Assassin Will, Frags, Snipes and Dark Flares is still tons of incoming damage. And if you're also being hard CCed by skills like master Reach or Draining Shot then you wont even make it to LoS. Warden's Shimmering at least absorbs a lot more than 50% damage and also grants Major Heroism and returns magicka making it nearly free. Wings will be beyond useless if they nerf them so hard that you take ranged damage though them without any major secondary buffs while they also cost tons of magicka. I give that rumour 0% chance of either being true or ever making it to live, there would be an outcry.

And also people are focusing too hard on Scales, when they are not even half the problem. Spell Wall is used by all nearly all stamina builds and many magicka builds as well. If they nerf wings, Mag DKs will use Spell Wall too. And magblades will keep getting rooted by their own Cripple reflected off Spell Wall. It will solve nothing.

The answer is not give snare immunity to MagBlades, not nerf other classes.

Ariades_swe

Maulkin wrote: »

likecats wrote: »

Rumors has it reflects are being removed. Wings will now reduce projectiles by 50% but no projectile cap. Good balance change that buffs wings, but also doesn't make it the ultimate counter to magblades. /thread

End thread on a rumour? I think not. Also that rumour can't be true, where did you hear that? That'd be a humongous nerf to MagDks who are in a decent shape atm, yet not OP and can't afford such big nerfs.

Currently you can at least spam your wings a few times until you get to LoS, if you build for sustain a bit. But taking 50% of Assassin Will, Frags, Snipes and Dark Flares is still tons of incoming damage. And if you're also being hard CCed by skills like master Reach or Draining Shot then you wont even make it to LoS. Warden's Shimmering at least absorbs a lot more than 50% damage and also grants Major Heroism and returns magicka making it nearly free. Wings will be beyond useless if they nerf them so hard that you take ranged damage though them without any major secondary buffs while they also cost tons of magicka. I give that rumour 0% chance of either being true or ever making it to live, there would be an outcry.

And also people are focusing too hard on Scales, when they are not even half the problem. Spell Wall is used by all nearly all stamina builds and many magicka builds as well. If they nerf wings, Mag DKs will use Spell Wall too. And magblades will keep getting rooted by their own Cripple reflected off Spell Wall. It will solve nothing.

The answer is not give snare immunity to MagBlades, not nerf other classes.

Its in Dottz stream. He got to playtest the changes.

Fiktius

LordTareq wrote: »

Well its better, but a 50% reduction on all our skills is still not so great for us, and no projectile cap. That said its nice not to be crippled by my own crippling grasp anymore. 50% is better than 0% at least.

This would be interesting change if it wouldn't be sad complicated way to solve simple problem.

I can follow the logic behind this change so far:
Wings on their current form is shutting down entire tool kit of ranged mag blades, making wings unbalanced.

> As a solution developers remove reflect away and they open combat chance for mag blades again.
> However properly sustained mag DK build can keep uptime of the wings high anyways, so in order to make sure that mag blades won't make proper damage, developers will remove Minor Berserker from Merciless resolve and add the function on wings, which decreases damage from projectiles by 50 % and make sure NB ranged skills will hit like wet noodles as often as wings are up.

What is the solution for mag blade?
Funny enough, we're back at square one and it sounds like slotting Force Pulse still is not bad idea, if there's space in the skill bar due it's not a projectile. However I do find this sad that instead of doing easy fixes and just leaving wings to be and making Swallow soul and Criple unreflectable, now developers are going hard way and by trying to solve one problem, they create another one.

likecats

Fiktius wrote: »

LordTareq wrote: »

Well its better, but a 50% reduction on all our skills is still not so great for us, and no projectile cap. That said its nice not to be crippled by my own crippling grasp anymore. 50% is better than 0% at least.

This would be interesting change if it wouldn't be sad complicated way to solve simple problem.

I can follow the logic behind this change so far:
Wings on their current form is shutting down entire tool kit of ranged mag blades, making wings unbalanced.

> As a solution developers remove reflect away and they open combat chance for mag blades again.
> However properly sustained mag DK build can keep up time of the wings high anyways, so in order to make sure that mag blades won't make proper damage, developers will remove Minor Berserker from Merciless resolve and add the function on wings, which decreases damage from projectiles by 50 % and make sure NB ranged skills will hit like wet noodles as often as wings are up.

What is the solution for mag blade?
Funny enough, we're back at square one and it sounds like slotting Force Pulse still is not bad idea, if there's space in the skill bar due it's not a projectile. However I do find this sad that instead of doing easy fixes and just leaving wings to be and making Swallow soul and Criple unreflectable, now developers are going hard way and by trying to solve one problem, they create another one.

It was always the DKs who vehemently opposed the idea of magblade getting any unreflected ability.

The new wings don't have a cap, so it will still be a great ability . Just not rock paper scissors strong.

Fiktius

likecats wrote: »

Fiktius wrote: »

LordTareq wrote: »

Well its better, but a 50% reduction on all our skills is still not so great for us, and no projectile cap. That said its nice not to be crippled by my own crippling grasp anymore. 50% is better than 0% at least.

This would be interesting change if it wouldn't be sad complicated way to solve simple problem.

I can follow the logic behind this change so far:
Wings on their current form is shutting down entire tool kit of ranged mag blades, making wings unbalanced.

> As a solution developers remove reflect away and they open combat chance for mag blades again.
> However properly sustained mag DK build can keep up time of the wings high anyways, so in order to make sure that mag blades won't make proper damage, developers will remove Minor Berserker from Merciless resolve and add the function on wings, which decreases damage from projectiles by 50 % and make sure NB ranged skills will hit like wet noodles as often as wings are up.

What is the solution for mag blade?
Funny enough, we're back at square one and it sounds like slotting Force Pulse still is not bad idea, if there's space in the skill bar due it's not a projectile. However I do find this sad that instead of doing easy fixes and just leaving wings to be and making Swallow soul and Criple unreflectable, now developers are going hard way and by trying to solve one problem, they create another one.

It was always the DKs who vehemently opposed the idea of magblade getting any unreflected ability.

The new wings don't have a cap, so it will still be a great ability . Just not rock paper scissors strong.

The solution is definitely 50 % better than the situation where we are right now on live servers, but if the wing up time is high due there's no cap for projectiles and some builds have no issues to refresh wings often when they time out, I would still say that this is not the best approach to solve the original problem.
And yes, I understand that in general there are some players who do not like the idea that other classes can actually have some counterplay, so getting counters against wings is something that some DKs never ever want to see.
But that's the case with other classes too, what comes with X counters to Y. People love their power their class have and don't want to let that go.
That's why it's important that developers would see the whole picture and make adjustments based on that.
Well, I guess we have to wait for actual patch notes, before we also can see whole picture and other coming balance changes too.

kaithuzar

It’s just annoying because I don’t feel like this change should be made without other changes, but I haven’t seen any hinting of other changes that could take place.

Removing the 8% damage is a direct Nerf to both ranged and melee magblade play styles.

Changing wings the way they have buffs ranged magblade, but without something such as making light attacks and heavy attacks scale with max damage or maxed stat, melee magblade is still in the gutter.

Without some amount of snare removal/immunity, players are forced into melee magblade just for access to forward momentum.

I’m actually fine with the change assuming that’s not all.

It is kind of funny though “the assassin class can’t do damage”, it’s going to be the new theme.

Iskiab

I think the change, if real, to wings will only help magblade in that crippling will become a consistent way to get major expedition. All the abilities like swallow soul will still be next to useless and impulse/crushing shock will still be the best spammable.

I could see sorcs becoming more popular.

Have to read all the patch notes to judge really. I still think it’s part of a larger change and you can’t look at these things in isolation.

If they’re adding a melee magical based weapon I’ll be happy no matter what.

Heimpai

Well that sucks..with the grim focus nerf i was going to slot FP in it’s place but it’ll be pointless now thanks to the wing change..gg

Mayrael

Just to be clear. I play ranged magblade and here are my observations:
If I play as a vampire, I am literally melting. DBoS and flame damage is everywhere, I go from full to execute range in seconds but, at least I can stay mobile and If you're good at kiting it can compensate being very squishy, especially when facing more enemies.

On the other hand, having a lot higher health regen, without vampire vulnerabilities and with mist replaced by double take, oh man, playing LA feels like playing some tank. Suddenly I can mow all trash magDKs like they were fresh grass, DBoS deals laughable damage etc. but it has a cost: when outnumbered snares are deadly, I can't use shadow as effective as I used to do with mist, cloak became almost useless because you can't get away from melee range even when trying to dodge roll.


TLDR; In general I've traded 1vX survivability for 1v1 power and here we go to conclusion: StamNB can have it all combined, that's what makes that class so darn good, you can have both survivability and mobility, while still having decent damage. Magblades need snare immunity at least.

Iskiab

Mayrael wrote: »

Just to be clear. I play ranged magblade and here are my observations:
If I play as a vampire, I am literally melting. DBoS and flame damage is everywhere, I go from full to execute range in seconds but, at least I can stay mobile and If you're good at kiting it can compensate being very squishy, especially when facing more enemies.

On the other hand, having a lot higher health regen, without vampire vulnerabilities and with mist replaced by double take, oh man, playing LA feels like playing some tank. Suddenly I can mow all trash magDKs like they were fresh grass, DBoS deals laughable damage etc. but it has a cost: when outnumbered snares are deadly, I can't use shadow as effective as I used to do with mist, cloak became almost useless because you can't get away from melee range even when trying to dodge roll.


TLDR; In general I've traded 1vX survivability for 1v1 power and here we go to conclusion: StamNB can have it all combined, that's what makes that class so darn good, you can have both survivability and mobility, while still having decent damage. Magblades need snare immunity at least.

Don’t be a vampire in pvp, it’s a very very very bad idea. It’s like taking all your armour off and complaining about burst damage.

Actually it’s worse, you’re probably taking more fire damage then if you wore no armour.

Koensol

Iskiab wrote: »

Mayrael wrote: »

Just to be clear. I play ranged magblade and here are my observations:
If I play as a vampire, I am literally melting. DBoS and flame damage is everywhere, I go from full to execute range in seconds but, at least I can stay mobile and If you're good at kiting it can compensate being very squishy, especially when facing more enemies.

On the other hand, having a lot higher health regen, without vampire vulnerabilities and with mist replaced by double take, oh man, playing LA feels like playing some tank. Suddenly I can mow all trash magDKs like they were fresh grass, DBoS deals laughable damage etc. but it has a cost: when outnumbered snares are deadly, I can't use shadow as effective as I used to do with mist, cloak became almost useless because you can't get away from melee range even when trying to dodge roll.


TLDR; In general I've traded 1vX survivability for 1v1 power and here we go to conclusion: StamNB can have it all combined, that's what makes that class so darn good, you can have both survivability and mobility, while still having decent damage. Magblades need snare immunity at least.

Don’t be a vampire in pvp, it’s a very very very bad idea. It’s like taking all your armour off and complaining about burst damage.

Actually it’s worse, you’re probably taking more fire damage then if you wore no armour.

Thing is, you are FORCED to go vampire if you want to have any chance at mobility as a magblade (get out of snares/roots). This is essential in smallscale group play for cyrodiil. You need to be able to move or retreat, or you are a sitting duck. Magplar and magden has the same problems. No snare immunity whatsoever, so we are forced to use the garbage that is mistform to prevent us from being locked down by snare and root spamming zergtards and leave the group a man down.

Vampire isn't altogether trash though. I willingly use it on my healer build (stage 3), because vampire undeath passive together with Pariah set is insane mitigation at low health. Plus the sustain is really helpful. I am tanky enough and have more than enough self healing to deal with the increased fire damage.

Iskiab

Koensol wrote: »

Iskiab wrote: »

Mayrael wrote: »

Just to be clear. I play ranged magblade and here are my observations:
If I play as a vampire, I am literally melting. DBoS and flame damage is everywhere, I go from full to execute range in seconds but, at least I can stay mobile and If you're good at kiting it can compensate being very squishy, especially when facing more enemies.

On the other hand, having a lot higher health regen, without vampire vulnerabilities and with mist replaced by double take, oh man, playing LA feels like playing some tank. Suddenly I can mow all trash magDKs like they were fresh grass, DBoS deals laughable damage etc. but it has a cost: when outnumbered snares are deadly, I can't use shadow as effective as I used to do with mist, cloak became almost useless because you can't get away from melee range even when trying to dodge roll.


TLDR; In general I've traded 1vX survivability for 1v1 power and here we go to conclusion: StamNB can have it all combined, that's what makes that class so darn good, you can have both survivability and mobility, while still having decent damage. Magblades need snare immunity at least.

Don’t be a vampire in pvp, it’s a very very very bad idea. It’s like taking all your armour off and complaining about burst damage.

Actually it’s worse, you’re probably taking more fire damage then if you wore no armour.

Thing is, you are FORCED to go vampire if you want to have any chance at mobility as a magblade (get out of snares/roots). This is essential in smallscale group play for cyrodiil. You need to be able to move or retreat, or you are a sitting duck. Magplar and magden has the same problems. No snare immunity whatsoever, so we are forced to use the garbage that is mistform to prevent us from being locked down by snare and root spamming zergtards and leave the group a man down.

Vampire isn't altogether trash though. I willingly use it on my healer build (stage 3), because vampire undeath passive together with Pariah set is insane mitigation at low health. Plus the sustain is really helpful. I am tanky enough and have more than enough self healing to deal with the increased fire damage.

They changed the way vulnerabilities work. Vulnerabilities add damage based on the pre-mitigation amount. That means even if you have full resists, minor and major protection... whatever, the person gets a quarter of their tooltip added onto every fire attack.

If you’re against lightning, ice, etc... then it doesn’t matter, but vs MagDKs and maybe magblades depending on your spec you will blow up fast.

You know I’ve been using an ice staff, I should probably switch to fire to take advantage.

Koensol

Iskiab wrote: »

Koensol wrote: »

Iskiab wrote: »

Mayrael wrote: »

Just to be clear. I play ranged magblade and here are my observations:
If I play as a vampire, I am literally melting. DBoS and flame damage is everywhere, I go from full to execute range in seconds but, at least I can stay mobile and If you're good at kiting it can compensate being very squishy, especially when facing more enemies.

On the other hand, having a lot higher health regen, without vampire vulnerabilities and with mist replaced by double take, oh man, playing LA feels like playing some tank. Suddenly I can mow all trash magDKs like they were fresh grass, DBoS deals laughable damage etc. but it has a cost: when outnumbered snares are deadly, I can't use shadow as effective as I used to do with mist, cloak became almost useless because you can't get away from melee range even when trying to dodge roll.


TLDR; In general I've traded 1vX survivability for 1v1 power and here we go to conclusion: StamNB can have it all combined, that's what makes that class so darn good, you can have both survivability and mobility, while still having decent damage. Magblades need snare immunity at least.

Don’t be a vampire in pvp, it’s a very very very bad idea. It’s like taking all your armour off and complaining about burst damage.

Actually it’s worse, you’re probably taking more fire damage then if you wore no armour.

Thing is, you are FORCED to go vampire if you want to have any chance at mobility as a magblade (get out of snares/roots). This is essential in smallscale group play for cyrodiil. You need to be able to move or retreat, or you are a sitting duck. Magplar and magden has the same problems. No snare immunity whatsoever, so we are forced to use the garbage that is mistform to prevent us from being locked down by snare and root spamming zergtards and leave the group a man down.

Vampire isn't altogether trash though. I willingly use it on my healer build (stage 3), because vampire undeath passive together with Pariah set is insane mitigation at low health. Plus the sustain is really helpful. I am tanky enough and have more than enough self healing to deal with the increased fire damage.

They changed the way vulnerabilities work. Vulnerabilities add damage based on the pre-mitigation amount. That means even if you have full resists, minor and major protection... whatever, the person gets a quarter of their tooltip added onto every fire attack.

If you’re against lightning, ice, etc... then it doesn’t matter, but vs MagDKs and maybe magblades depending on your spec you will blow up fast.

You know I’ve been using an ice staff, I should probably switch to fire to take advantage.

Yea I heard about that. But at least on my particular healer build I'm not noticing the increased damage too much. It doesn't feel more threatening than before at least. A single magdk has no chance of killing me either way unless he is assisted by more than 2 extra people (no-CP). It really depends on the build wether or not vamp is worth it. I'm taking a lot less damage from all other sources of damage because of vampire undeath passive, so it works for me.

For a dd build it is literally hell on earth. 4-5k hits from master staff flame reach and 2-3k light attacks on a 24k resist build. I wish I could drop it, but in a small/medium scale group of 4-8, you really do need mistform. You can deal with the fire dmg through group off healing, vigor stacking, rapid regen, class hots, etc. Not having mistform as a magblade/magplar/magden of any spec in Cyrodiil is very unwise and a lot more dangerous than fire damage and dawnbreakers. Not only to yourself but also to your group.

Iskiab

IDK, what I do as a healer is use shadowy disguise, mass hysteria (pbaoe fear), and double take. If a melee train comes down on me I break free > mass hysteria > disguise > double take (doesn’t break cloak). I can definitely see it on a templar or another class, but as a magblade I don’t think it’s required.

Last two death matches I managed no deaths too. Mass hysteria is great... but other players were off healing too (I had really strong pugs).

I’ve noticed something in my last two matches as well. Typically when someone resto ults they save themselves from certain death. My team has been able to keep attacking them and punch through the resto ult. I’ve only been seeing this recently, and can’t help thinking vampire is a part of it.

P.S. I also started using the steed mundus

Koensol

Iskiab wrote: »

IDK, what I do as a healer is use shadowy disguise, mass hysteria (pbaoe fear), and double take. If a melee train comes down on me I break free > mass hysteria > disguise > double take (doesn’t break cloak). I can definitely see it on a templar or another class, but as a magblade I don’t think it’s required.

Last two death matches I managed no deaths too. Mass hysteria is great... but other players were off healing too (I had really strong pugs).

I’ve noticed something in my last two matches as well. Typically when someone resto ults they save themselves from certain death. My team has been able to keep attacking them and punch through the resto ult. I’ve only been seeing this recently, and can’t help thinking vampire is a part of it.

P.S. I also started using the steed mundus

I'm not sure if you ever played in smaller groups against zergs, but Mass Hysteria + cloak isn't enough when there are 10+ people coming at you spamming cc, snares and roots. The moment you sit still for 1 moment you get jumped and popped.

In BGs or bigger groups your strategy can work, but when you fight outnumbered, you absolutely need to be able to escape from these situation. Mistform is a vital and key ability needed to reposition from these situations. When the ground of a resource tower is filled with frost walls and other AoE, your cloak will get you nowhere.

LordTareq

I actually just cured vampirism yesterday, and I’m still in two minds whether to go back. Yes you take a bit less fire damage, but magblade is about evading damage so I didn’t take much damage to begin with. The reduced sustain of no longer being vamp is noticeable, but the thing I miss most is the stealth speed. So I may go back to vamp, but I’ll give it a couple more days.