-->[Unnecessary Health on Dungeon Bosses]<--

Lightspeedflashb14_ESO

Mystrius_Archaion wrote: »

NeetoCheeto1 wrote: »

Right Click and press Open in a New tab to view
If there is easy way to upload pics please let me know ty

Like this?

I did that by doing what you said then right clicking your picture in the source link and clicking "open image in new tab" and copying that address bar "https://preview.ibb.co/dnHp1o/Screenshot_20180714_203853.png&quot; with "img /img" tags.
This forum is tricky, but it works best with direct links to images without the extra background page elements.

Edit:
I suppose I could have gotten the correct address by also clicking "copy image address" instead of "open image in new tab".

your stats are terrible, you have no idea how the game actually plays and you are level 18, not even close to level 50 and much less cp 160, the level were gear stops leveling. do overland quests till you hit those numbers. maybe actually learn how to play the game @NeetoCheeto1, before asking for nerfs.

Doctordarkspawn

Milvan wrote: »

NeetoCheeto1 wrote: »

-->[Unnecessary Health on Dungeon Bosses]<--

It isn't that fun to spam 5 buttons for 15 mins on one boss
The health is way to high for 4 man group of newbs

Instead of asking for a health nerf, why don't you ask for more intense and mindful mechanics that requires not only dps but also awareness?

Except one boss fight has both.

The poison guy from Scalecaller. He has mechanics, that you need to be aware for, entire team needs to be involved, and he also has about ten mil health.

Which is ridculous. I'm serious when I say boss health outside of trials should not exceed 4 mil.

starkerealm

TheCyberDruid wrote: »

Selene (for example) has a bit under 1.3m health, so if you need 15 minutes with 4 people... I think it is literally impossible to kill her that slow. Given if the DPS in your group do less than 10k dps then it takes quite some time, but reading that you 'hit 5 buttons' the issue might be easily solved with a bit of Google usage.

Much as I support the general idea behind this post. I've been in dungeon runs on my tanks, where I was pulling more than 50% of group DPS. Now, granted, my tanks tend to be a little more aggressive than you'd expect. When I'm on my sorc tank and pulling down 10k, okay, cool. This is going to take a minute. When I'm on my Imperial DK or my Warden and only pulling ~4-5k, and I see that +50%, it's more than a little depressing.

TheCyberDruid

starkerealm wrote: »

Much as I support the general idea behind this post. I've been in dungeon runs on my tanks, where I was pulling more than 50% of group DPS. Now, granted, my tanks tend to be a little more aggressive than you'd expect. When I'm on my sorc tank and pulling down 10k, okay, cool. This is going to take a minute. When I'm on my Imperial DK or my Warden and only pulling ~4-5k, and I see that +50%, it's more than a little depressing.

I can't even imagine why people that would struggle even against delve bosses want to queue for a dungeon. Each to their own, but that's probably why I don't do PUGs any more

Mystrius_Archaion

TheCyberDruid wrote: »

starkerealm wrote: »

Much as I support the general idea behind this post. I've been in dungeon runs on my tanks, where I was pulling more than 50% of group DPS. Now, granted, my tanks tend to be a little more aggressive than you'd expect. When I'm on my sorc tank and pulling down 10k, okay, cool. This is going to take a minute. When I'm on my Imperial DK or my Warden and only pulling ~4-5k, and I see that +50%, it's more than a little depressing.

I can't even imagine why people that would struggle even against delve bosses want to queue for a dungeon. Each to their own, but that's probably why I don't do PUGs any more

Random Dungeon Finder Event created by the developers perhaps to get more people into the queue?

They want us to play everything. They fail to realize that we don't want that and it will never happen.

MakoFore

Milvan wrote: »

NeetoCheeto1 wrote: »

-->[Unnecessary Health on Dungeon Bosses]<--

It isn't that fun to spam 5 buttons for 15 mins on one boss
The health is way to high for 4 man group of newbs

Instead of asking for a health nerf, why don't you ask for more intense and mindful mechanics that requires not only dps but also awareness?

ask for world peace while youre at it why dont you.

Seri

PlagueSD wrote: »

zaria wrote: »

PlagueSD wrote: »

NeetoCheeto1 wrote: »

-->[Unnecessary Health on Dungeon Bosses]<--

It isn't that fun to spam 5 buttons for 15 mins on one boss
The health is way to high for 4 man group of newbs

If it's taking you 15 minutes to kill a dungeon boss, you're doing it wrong.

This, take an 8M health boss with 30K group dps and boss will be dead in less than 5 minutes. 30K group dps is low.
Granted you have fights there boss is immune a lot and you have to focus on adds.

For normal the non dlc only have low health bosses. I guess boss is healed and none kills or interrupt healers.
The 1 normal's don't have any hard kill mechanic so with competent tank or healer you can not die.

Or it's the last boss in Direfrost keep, Drodda of Icereach. That boss is a PUG killer. You MUST break free from her heal ability or she'll just keep healing back to full health.

My vote could be Fungal Grotto II, Spider Shepherd boss with the 3 adds.

Mystrius_Archaion wrote: »

TheCyberDruid wrote: »

starkerealm wrote: »

Much as I support the general idea behind this post. I've been in dungeon runs on my tanks, where I was pulling more than 50% of group DPS. Now, granted, my tanks tend to be a little more aggressive than you'd expect. When I'm on my sorc tank and pulling down 10k, okay, cool. This is going to take a minute. When I'm on my Imperial DK or my Warden and only pulling ~4-5k, and I see that +50%, it's more than a little depressing.

I can't even imagine why people that would struggle even against delve bosses want to queue for a dungeon. Each to their own, but that's probably why I don't do PUGs any more

Random Dungeon Finder Event created by the developers perhaps to get more people into the queue?

They want us to play everything. They fail to realize that we don't want that and it will never happen.

There's nothing actually forcing those that don't want to play to queue though. Back when the group finder was introduced (assuming the queue didn't break completely) there was still a reasonable chance of completing. Now it's always a gamble as to how much DPS % my healer will be doing.

Septimus_Magna

How much dps do you pull self-buffed on a 3m target dummy? Even on a heavy attack pet sorc build with 30k dps I can carry almost all randoms groups through non-dlc vet dungeons.

Ragnarock41

Mystrius_Archaion wrote: »

Ragnarock41 wrote: »

Mystrius_Archaion wrote: »

Ragnarock41 wrote: »

NeetoCheeto1 wrote: »

-->[Unnecessary Health on Dungeon Bosses]<--

It isn't that fun to spam 5 buttons for 15 mins on one boss

Why mmorpg genre is dying, in a nutshell.

This is not an ESO specific issue. All MMORPGs I've played since wow had this very same issue.

I'm more a fan of spamming buttons than sweating with blocks and break free and interrupts. I hate rock/paper/scissors mechanics, especially when they're far too common on even the weakest enemies and not even done as good as other examples I have seen.

I game to relax with optional challenges, not be annoyed by piranhas.

A good PvE experience should do a lot more than just asking you to mash some buttons in the correct order. That is just repetetive and anti-fun.

Fun is relative, which is why games like Farmville and Solitaire and "Bubble Witch Saga" and many more are so popular. Sometimes we just want relatively mindless games with great graphics.
I like to mod godmode on Skyrim, for example. You think that makes the game boring? Well, I don't think that because I play to feel strong, which is mostly opposite of my real world stature, and to look as cool as possible with many customization options.

I'm in ESO for the high-fantasy theme and graphics, not any sort of challenge. I constantly wish for cheats, sanctioned by the developers of course such as if they would give me an "easy mode" solo option for everything. This makes me also hate when cosmetics that would make me(my character) look cool are locked behind the "hardest mode".

I really do not find it fun when my character is stuck not able to do absolutely every action I have either because of running out of resources or silence, stun or needing to interrupt or dodge. I like stealth and positioning and strategy, but I do not like "twitch twitch" reaction games that play like the dreaded Battletoads Tubro Tunnel #CarpalTunnelForLife

One person's "fun challenging content" is many more people's "annoying and frustrating barrier to fun", which both are technically a barrier but one enjoys "banging his head against the barrier".

While fun is relative, games are experiences, and playing them on ''easy mode'', or ''god mode'', basically makes the whole experience pointless(unless the game is a sandbox).

So I'm pretty happy those skins and cosmetics are locked behind a challenge. Those are the proof of One's skill at the game, and one of the very few things that actually reward the top tier players in this game, for their effort and love at the game.

And we are acting here like if eso is such a difficult game. It is not. %95 of the content in this game is *** easy to complete, it is so easy that people actually set bots to farm the content because it is, as I said, braindead easy, so a braindead bot can do it. I mean %95 of the content is already nerfed down to please the average skyrim player, while all that remains are some vet trials and some vet dungeons with HM.

If a braindead bot can do it, you sir , have no right to complain. If what you want is a fantasy world with good graphics, and absolutely no challange at all, you should play skyrim with cheats.. It looks pretty damn good with HD mods by the way.

starkerealm

Seri wrote: »

PlagueSD wrote: »

zaria wrote: »

PlagueSD wrote: »

NeetoCheeto1 wrote: »

-->[Unnecessary Health on Dungeon Bosses]<--

It isn't that fun to spam 5 buttons for 15 mins on one boss
The health is way to high for 4 man group of newbs

If it's taking you 15 minutes to kill a dungeon boss, you're doing it wrong.

This, take an 8M health boss with 30K group dps and boss will be dead in less than 5 minutes. 30K group dps is low.
Granted you have fights there boss is immune a lot and you have to focus on adds.

For normal the non dlc only have low health bosses. I guess boss is healed and none kills or interrupt healers.
The 1 normal's don't have any hard kill mechanic so with competent tank or healer you can not die.

Or it's the last boss in Direfrost keep, Drodda of Icereach. That boss is a PUG killer. You MUST break free from her heal ability or she'll just keep healing back to full health.

My vote could be Fungal Grotto II, Spider Shepherd boss with the 3 adds.

Oh god, not the spiders! I need chains to pull the DPS off the adds! Why!?

NeetoCheeto1

Lightspeedflashb14_ESO wrote: »

your stats are terrible, you have no idea how the game actually plays and you are level 18, not even close to level 50 and much less cp 160, the level were gear stops leveling. do overland quests till you hit those numbers. maybe actually learn how to play the game @NeetoCheeto1, before asking for nerfs.

Do you have suggestions on what would help ?
What should I change?

Trinity_Is_My_Name

LOL! Raise your DPS and it won't take as long.

Prof_Bawbag

Since making my first tank and needing to level my undaunted, I can see why some new players would actually say this. Even in normal dungeons, as the tank is set up for trials and is more or less a health tank, and coupled with the fact I'm too damn lazy to keeping changing skills and gear, it's actually been a real eye opener doing pledges and daily randoms. More often than not, I've done more damage than the dds and I hit for something ridiculously low (4k-6k).

Never moaned about it as some of that is on me not changing my tank to a dd when running normal, but there's been a few times I've changed to my dd just to help these guys out. Otherwise the likes of Wayrest sewers 2 would last 5 hours. The pain this guy talks about is real.

Vulsahdaal

NeetoCheeto1 wrote: »

Lightspeedflashb14_ESO wrote: »

your stats are terrible, you have no idea how the game actually plays and you are level 18, not even close to level 50 and much less cp 160, the level were gear stops leveling. do overland quests till you hit those numbers. maybe actually learn how to play the game @NeetoCheeto1, before asking for nerfs.

Do you have suggestions on what would help ?
What should I change?

@NeetoCheeto1 As mentioned in this thread, your stats need some help. This is a big hindrance to your dps, even more than your level. I have a DK also, who was doing fine in most normal dungeons at level 18 as well as soloing public dungeons, but his stats were a bit better than yours.

I think your first step should be to decide your role. I assumed from your first post it was DPS, but from what I can see in the pics you provided, you are running a bow (same as my DK) but then you have sword and shield unlocked (which is usually for tanks). However, I cant see if your actually using this, because I only see one bar. You do have the other bar unlocked, dont you?

Which brings me to your points that you seem to have equally divided between magicka and stamina.
Its not impossible, but it is rather difficult to make a decent dps build trying to be both. You may want to consider which of these you would like to concentrate on (stamina or magicka) and put all your points there (again, this is for dps. Tanks are more forgiving with spreading the points around.)

Im not going to tell you to give up dungeons until youre cp160. The earlier you learn the mechanics and how things work, the better. However, Im going to suggest that you first decide your role, and if your a stam or magicka build, then start researching online for leveling and build ideas for your character. Look up StamDK or MagDK depending which you prefer.

Good luck, and looking around on these forums is also a good place to get information as well.

DanteYoda

Ragnarock41 wrote: »

Mystrius_Archaion wrote: »

Ragnarock41 wrote: »

Mystrius_Archaion wrote: »

Ragnarock41 wrote: »

NeetoCheeto1 wrote: »

-->[Unnecessary Health on Dungeon Bosses]<--

It isn't that fun to spam 5 buttons for 15 mins on one boss

Why mmorpg genre is dying, in a nutshell.

This is not an ESO specific issue. All MMORPGs I've played since wow had this very same issue.

I'm more a fan of spamming buttons than sweating with blocks and break free and interrupts. I hate rock/paper/scissors mechanics, especially when they're far too common on even the weakest enemies and not even done as good as other examples I have seen.

I game to relax with optional challenges, not be annoyed by piranhas.

A good PvE experience should do a lot more than just asking you to mash some buttons in the correct order. That is just repetetive and anti-fun.

Fun is relative, which is why games like Farmville and Solitaire and "Bubble Witch Saga" and many more are so popular. Sometimes we just want relatively mindless games with great graphics.
I like to mod godmode on Skyrim, for example. You think that makes the game boring? Well, I don't think that because I play to feel strong, which is mostly opposite of my real world stature, and to look as cool as possible with many customization options.

I'm in ESO for the high-fantasy theme and graphics, not any sort of challenge. I constantly wish for cheats, sanctioned by the developers of course such as if they would give me an "easy mode" solo option for everything. This makes me also hate when cosmetics that would make me(my character) look cool are locked behind the "hardest mode".

I really do not find it fun when my character is stuck not able to do absolutely every action I have either because of running out of resources or silence, stun or needing to interrupt or dodge. I like stealth and positioning and strategy, but I do not like "twitch twitch" reaction games that play like the dreaded Battletoads Tubro Tunnel #CarpalTunnelForLife

One person's "fun challenging content" is many more people's "annoying and frustrating barrier to fun", which both are technically a barrier but one enjoys "banging his head against the barrier".

While fun is relative, games are experiences, and playing them on ''easy mode'', or ''god mode'', basically makes the whole experience pointless(unless the game is a sandbox).

Not if you play games solely for story, i play Skyrim with Cheats on as well because for me the only thing interesting is the story, like reading a book i want to see the end..

Dying repeatedly ruins my experience so i add cheats to remove the fake challenge holding back the story.

zaria

Seri wrote: »

PlagueSD wrote: »

zaria wrote: »

PlagueSD wrote: »

NeetoCheeto1 wrote: »

-->[Unnecessary Health on Dungeon Bosses]<--

It isn't that fun to spam 5 buttons for 15 mins on one boss
The health is way to high for 4 man group of newbs

If it's taking you 15 minutes to kill a dungeon boss, you're doing it wrong.

This, take an 8M health boss with 30K group dps and boss will be dead in less than 5 minutes. 30K group dps is low.
Granted you have fights there boss is immune a lot and you have to focus on adds.

For normal the non dlc only have low health bosses. I guess boss is healed and none kills or interrupt healers.
The 1 normal's don't have any hard kill mechanic so with competent tank or healer you can not die.

Or it's the last boss in Direfrost keep, Drodda of Icereach. That boss is a PUG killer. You MUST break free from her heal ability or she'll just keep healing back to full health.

My vote could be Fungal Grotto II, Spider Shepherd boss with the 3 adds.

Mystrius_Archaion wrote: »

TheCyberDruid wrote: »

starkerealm wrote: »

Much as I support the general idea behind this post. I've been in dungeon runs on my tanks, where I was pulling more than 50% of group DPS. Now, granted, my tanks tend to be a little more aggressive than you'd expect. When I'm on my sorc tank and pulling down 10k, okay, cool. This is going to take a minute. When I'm on my Imperial DK or my Warden and only pulling ~4-5k, and I see that +50%, it's more than a little depressing.

I can't even imagine why people that would struggle even against delve bosses want to queue for a dungeon. Each to their own, but that's probably why I don't do PUGs any more

Random Dungeon Finder Event created by the developers perhaps to get more people into the queue?

They want us to play everything. They fail to realize that we don't want that and it will never happen.

There's nothing actually forcing those that don't want to play to queue though. Back when the group finder was introduced (assuming the queue didn't break completely) there was still a reasonable chance of completing. Now it's always a gamble as to how much DPS % my healer will be doing.

The boss in fungal 2 is all about mechanic, you should not kill the spiders, if you do he get an serious damage shield.

No issue with finder outside some bugs, yes you have an fail rate but i find it pretty low. Now I only group for pledge dungeons as I think this increase quality.

webrgesner

3 things you silly noobs need to keep in mind.
Aoe, Dots, and Spamable

Slack

Lightspeedflashb14_ESO wrote: »

Mystrius_Archaion wrote: »

NeetoCheeto1 wrote: »

Right Click and press Open in a New tab to view
If there is easy way to upload pics please let me know ty

Like this?

I did that by doing what you said then right clicking your picture in the source link and clicking "open image in new tab" and copying that address bar "https://preview.ibb.co/dnHp1o/Screenshot_20180714_203853.png&quot; with "img /img" tags.
This forum is tricky, but it works best with direct links to images without the extra background page elements.

Edit:
I suppose I could have gotten the correct address by also clicking "copy image address" instead of "open image in new tab".

your stats are terrible, you have no idea how the game actually plays and you are level 18, not even close to level 50 and much less cp 160, the level were gear stops leveling. do overland quests till you hit those numbers. maybe actually learn how to play the game @NeetoCheeto1, before asking for nerfs.

You rewd forum elitists!
Those people always get discriminated just because the have the fighting power of a mashed potato.

Naughty_Ryder

Death to the noobs!

Chilly-McFreeze

DanteYoda wrote: »

Ragnarock41 wrote: »

Mystrius_Archaion wrote: »

Ragnarock41 wrote: »

Mystrius_Archaion wrote: »

Ragnarock41 wrote: »

NeetoCheeto1 wrote: »

-->[Unnecessary Health on Dungeon Bosses]<--

It isn't that fun to spam 5 buttons for 15 mins on one boss

Why mmorpg genre is dying, in a nutshell.

This is not an ESO specific issue. All MMORPGs I've played since wow had this very same issue.

I'm more a fan of spamming buttons than sweating with blocks and break free and interrupts. I hate rock/paper/scissors mechanics, especially when they're far too common on even the weakest enemies and not even done as good as other examples I have seen.

I game to relax with optional challenges, not be annoyed by piranhas.

A good PvE experience should do a lot more than just asking you to mash some buttons in the correct order. That is just repetetive and anti-fun.

Fun is relative, which is why games like Farmville and Solitaire and "Bubble Witch Saga" and many more are so popular. Sometimes we just want relatively mindless games with great graphics.
I like to mod godmode on Skyrim, for example. You think that makes the game boring? Well, I don't think that because I play to feel strong, which is mostly opposite of my real world stature, and to look as cool as possible with many customization options.

I'm in ESO for the high-fantasy theme and graphics, not any sort of challenge. I constantly wish for cheats, sanctioned by the developers of course such as if they would give me an "easy mode" solo option for everything. This makes me also hate when cosmetics that would make me(my character) look cool are locked behind the "hardest mode".

I really do not find it fun when my character is stuck not able to do absolutely every action I have either because of running out of resources or silence, stun or needing to interrupt or dodge. I like stealth and positioning and strategy, but I do not like "twitch twitch" reaction games that play like the dreaded Battletoads Tubro Tunnel #CarpalTunnelForLife

One person's "fun challenging content" is many more people's "annoying and frustrating barrier to fun", which both are technically a barrier but one enjoys "banging his head against the barrier".

While fun is relative, games are experiences, and playing them on ''easy mode'', or ''god mode'', basically makes the whole experience pointless(unless the game is a sandbox).

Not if you play games solely for story, i play Skyrim with Cheats on as well because for me the only thing interesting is the story, like reading a book i want to see the end..

Dying repeatedly ruins my experience so i add cheats to remove the fake challenge holding back the story.

The difference between reading a book/ watching a movie is that you actually have to be "active" in a game. If you take away the possibility to die you set that "active" part nearly completely down to again just watching how things play out. If I'd want that I'd go watch a movie or read a book. But to each their own, I guess.

starkerealm

NeetoCheeto1 wrote: »

Right Click and press Open in a New tab to view
If there is easy way to upload pics please let me know ty

Yeah, if the link doesn't end in a file extension, the forum's IMG function can't parse it. For reference, I know .jpg, .gif, and .png work, I'm not sure what other formats are accepted, though, .gifv is not.

Navigate to the image, then right click select, "view image" and copy the address, or "copy image location," and paste the results.

EDIT: Also, a lot of people on the boards use imgur for their photo hosting. In part, it's convenient because it includes a direct link along the side bar that you can simply copy and paste onto the boards with minimal fuss.

Okay, I'll come back to the actual subject matter in a minute.

starkerealm

Okay, no real judgement here, but I do have some warnings. And, you're probably already starting to feel some of these effects.

NeetoCheeto1 wrote: »

You do not want to split stats like this. You need to decide what kind of a character you want, and then stick to that. This can either be a magic user (in the case of a DK, that's going to be mostly fire magic), or a stamina based rogue (in the case of a DK, this will be heavily poison focused.)

Your advisor is set for the former. If you're a magic user, you're going to want to stick to staves. A stamina user has access to the other four weapon lines, with one important caveat: Your Sword and Board is for tanking, not DPS. Same is true of the Ice Staff. You will sometimes encounter players who really know their stuff using them effectively out of role, (or tanking without either), but most players who attempt that cannot make it work.

If you're a magicka build, you'll want light armor, if you're a stamina build you'll want medium. Assuming you're not wearing an outfit, it looks like you're wearing two pieces of heavy armor and five light. Given you're using stam weapons, that's going to hurt you quite a bit. You can safely pass on the medium armor once you know your stuff, and the heavy armor.

I'd also strongly advise you mess around with the level advisor, and figure out which skills it wants you to use. It's not perfect, but it is a good starting point. You can also switch between multiple starter builds with it, so if you want to use your DK as a stealthy rogue, that is an option. In some cases, you will need to take an ability it doesn't want simply to level the appropriate skill line, but it will go a long way towards shoring up your build.

Seri

zaria wrote: »

Seri wrote: »

PlagueSD wrote: »

zaria wrote: »

PlagueSD wrote: »

NeetoCheeto1 wrote: »

-->[Unnecessary Health on Dungeon Bosses]<--

It isn't that fun to spam 5 buttons for 15 mins on one boss
The health is way to high for 4 man group of newbs

If it's taking you 15 minutes to kill a dungeon boss, you're doing it wrong.

This, take an 8M health boss with 30K group dps and boss will be dead in less than 5 minutes. 30K group dps is low.
Granted you have fights there boss is immune a lot and you have to focus on adds.

For normal the non dlc only have low health bosses. I guess boss is healed and none kills or interrupt healers.
The 1 normal's don't have any hard kill mechanic so with competent tank or healer you can not die.

Or it's the last boss in Direfrost keep, Drodda of Icereach. That boss is a PUG killer. You MUST break free from her heal ability or she'll just keep healing back to full health.

My vote could be Fungal Grotto II, Spider Shepherd boss with the 3 adds.

Mystrius_Archaion wrote: »

TheCyberDruid wrote: »

starkerealm wrote: »

Much as I support the general idea behind this post. I've been in dungeon runs on my tanks, where I was pulling more than 50% of group DPS. Now, granted, my tanks tend to be a little more aggressive than you'd expect. When I'm on my sorc tank and pulling down 10k, okay, cool. This is going to take a minute. When I'm on my Imperial DK or my Warden and only pulling ~4-5k, and I see that +50%, it's more than a little depressing.

I can't even imagine why people that would struggle even against delve bosses want to queue for a dungeon. Each to their own, but that's probably why I don't do PUGs any more

Random Dungeon Finder Event created by the developers perhaps to get more people into the queue?

They want us to play everything. They fail to realize that we don't want that and it will never happen.

There's nothing actually forcing those that don't want to play to queue though. Back when the group finder was introduced (assuming the queue didn't break completely) there was still a reasonable chance of completing. Now it's always a gamble as to how much DPS % my healer will be doing.

The boss in fungal 2 is all about mechanic, you should not kill the spiders, if you do he get an serious damage shield.

I'm well aware of the mechanics - my experience is that many group-finder members are not.

Me, leading up to boss: "Please leave the adds alive. DO NOT kill them, or the boss takes reduced dmg"
*both DDs lay all dots ensuring the 3 spiders are all being damaged*
Me, watching the health bar ticking down 100hp at a time: "Or don't..."

Sparr0w

Seri wrote: »

zaria wrote: »

Seri wrote: »

PlagueSD wrote: »

zaria wrote: »

PlagueSD wrote: »

NeetoCheeto1 wrote: »

-->[Unnecessary Health on Dungeon Bosses]<--

It isn't that fun to spam 5 buttons for 15 mins on one boss
The health is way to high for 4 man group of newbs

If it's taking you 15 minutes to kill a dungeon boss, you're doing it wrong.

This, take an 8M health boss with 30K group dps and boss will be dead in less than 5 minutes. 30K group dps is low.
Granted you have fights there boss is immune a lot and you have to focus on adds.

For normal the non dlc only have low health bosses. I guess boss is healed and none kills or interrupt healers.
The 1 normal's don't have any hard kill mechanic so with competent tank or healer you can not die.

Or it's the last boss in Direfrost keep, Drodda of Icereach. That boss is a PUG killer. You MUST break free from her heal ability or she'll just keep healing back to full health.

My vote could be Fungal Grotto II, Spider Shepherd boss with the 3 adds.

Mystrius_Archaion wrote: »

TheCyberDruid wrote: »

starkerealm wrote: »

Much as I support the general idea behind this post. I've been in dungeon runs on my tanks, where I was pulling more than 50% of group DPS. Now, granted, my tanks tend to be a little more aggressive than you'd expect. When I'm on my sorc tank and pulling down 10k, okay, cool. This is going to take a minute. When I'm on my Imperial DK or my Warden and only pulling ~4-5k, and I see that +50%, it's more than a little depressing.

I can't even imagine why people that would struggle even against delve bosses want to queue for a dungeon. Each to their own, but that's probably why I don't do PUGs any more

Random Dungeon Finder Event created by the developers perhaps to get more people into the queue?

They want us to play everything. They fail to realize that we don't want that and it will never happen.

There's nothing actually forcing those that don't want to play to queue though. Back when the group finder was introduced (assuming the queue didn't break completely) there was still a reasonable chance of completing. Now it's always a gamble as to how much DPS % my healer will be doing.

The boss in fungal 2 is all about mechanic, you should not kill the spiders, if you do he get an serious damage shield.

I'm well aware of the mechanics - my experience is that many group-finder members are not.

Me, leading up to boss: "Please leave the adds alive. DO NOT kill them, or the boss takes reduced dmg"
*both DDs lay all dots ensuring the 3 spiders are all being damaged*
Me, watching the health bar ticking down 100hp at a time: "Or don't..."

Let a DD take agro, chain the spiders away from the group

starkerealm

Seri wrote: »

zaria wrote: »

Seri wrote: »

PlagueSD wrote: »

zaria wrote: »

PlagueSD wrote: »

NeetoCheeto1 wrote: »

-->[Unnecessary Health on Dungeon Bosses]<--

It isn't that fun to spam 5 buttons for 15 mins on one boss
The health is way to high for 4 man group of newbs

If it's taking you 15 minutes to kill a dungeon boss, you're doing it wrong.

This, take an 8M health boss with 30K group dps and boss will be dead in less than 5 minutes. 30K group dps is low.
Granted you have fights there boss is immune a lot and you have to focus on adds.

For normal the non dlc only have low health bosses. I guess boss is healed and none kills or interrupt healers.
The 1 normal's don't have any hard kill mechanic so with competent tank or healer you can not die.

Or it's the last boss in Direfrost keep, Drodda of Icereach. That boss is a PUG killer. You MUST break free from her heal ability or she'll just keep healing back to full health.

My vote could be Fungal Grotto II, Spider Shepherd boss with the 3 adds.

Mystrius_Archaion wrote: »

TheCyberDruid wrote: »

starkerealm wrote: »

Much as I support the general idea behind this post. I've been in dungeon runs on my tanks, where I was pulling more than 50% of group DPS. Now, granted, my tanks tend to be a little more aggressive than you'd expect. When I'm on my sorc tank and pulling down 10k, okay, cool. This is going to take a minute. When I'm on my Imperial DK or my Warden and only pulling ~4-5k, and I see that +50%, it's more than a little depressing.

I can't even imagine why people that would struggle even against delve bosses want to queue for a dungeon. Each to their own, but that's probably why I don't do PUGs any more

Random Dungeon Finder Event created by the developers perhaps to get more people into the queue?

They want us to play everything. They fail to realize that we don't want that and it will never happen.

There's nothing actually forcing those that don't want to play to queue though. Back when the group finder was introduced (assuming the queue didn't break completely) there was still a reasonable chance of completing. Now it's always a gamble as to how much DPS % my healer will be doing.

The boss in fungal 2 is all about mechanic, you should not kill the spiders, if you do he get an serious damage shield.

I'm well aware of the mechanics - my experience is that many group-finder members are not.

Me, leading up to boss: "Please leave the adds alive. DO NOT kill them, or the boss takes reduced dmg"
*both DDs lay all dots ensuring the 3 spiders are all being damaged*
Me, watching the health bar ticking down 100hp at a time: "Or don't..."

Fortunately, that fight is one of the easiest ones for the tank to reset. Taunt the boss and try to drag her down the ramp. She'll leash, and go back to start, with the spiders respawned. This can be a lifesaver if the DPS accidentally wax the adds, or you're trying to demonstrate the mechanics.

tinythinker

Milvan wrote: »

NeetoCheeto1 wrote: »

-->[Unnecessary Health on Dungeon Bosses]<--

It isn't that fun to spam 5 buttons for 15 mins on one boss
The health is way to high for 4 man group of newbs

Instead of asking for a health nerf, why don't you ask for more intense and mindful mechanics that requires not only dps but also awareness?

Acrolas wrote: »

Mechanics don't always translate into engaging content.

I think the bigger problem is that the "boss fight" concept is becoming outdated. It was fine in side-scrollers when bosses acted as gatekeepers who changed color and blinked before disappearing in a puff of smoke and points.

But with more complex environments and character motives, I'm wondering if dungeons wouldn't benefit from more objectives-based goals with mobs of varying strengths (including a few functionally immortal ones) preventing you from reaching those goals.

Starting *** with some guards in a city shouldn't be more fascinating and challenging combat than paid content.

Good discussion point. Will get lost in this thread. Could be new thread to get more traction.

josiahva

Didaco wrote: »

I think the problem lies in the genre itself.

Mechanics are what are used in this genre to make fights more engaging... The more health they have, the more mechanics you do.
I wonder what will happen when mmorpg developers will finally realize how a proper AI would impact the gameplay in a positive way.

Like, I don't know, having a boss capable of recognizing AoE dots and, instead of stepping in it like a child in a pond, it circles them...

Or a boss that recognises your attacks and actively dodges them...

I don't know, these are things that the videogame industry has known for a long time, but it seem that the mmorpg genre lives in a parallel world where the only few concepts of hostile NPC are:

-give them gazillions of HP
-give them some stat check mechanics, punishing player with one shot attacks when those checks are not satisfied (dps races for example)
-make them braindead turrets, only capable of spamming basic attacks, waiting for the next cooldown to wear off in order to use the first skill they have available at the time
-give them health values thresholds in order to make mechanics kick in

That's why I usually enjoy more PvP in a game than PvE.

Oh how I wish for bosses that were as unpredictable as players. The DPS drop would be crazy...and DPS would be about more than some rotation repeated ad nauseum...in fact it would become more about survival than DPS.

DenMoria

I can understand on trial bosses or high-level stuff, but I always wondered why a starter level boss had 400-500K in health. Honestly, spamming dps until they're down is boring and NOBODY can be that powerful if they're a person.

I can understand high stats on maybe some giant monster, but a friggin Necromancer?

Mystrius_Archaion

DenMoria wrote: »

I can understand on trial bosses or high-level stuff, but I always wondered why a starter level boss had 400-500K in health. Honestly, spamming dps until they're down is boring and NOBODY can be that powerful if they're a person.

I can understand high stats on maybe some giant monster, but a friggin Necromancer?

LOL
This is the very reason for my signature and link in that. Everyone should know and try to avoid the "max level rat"/"high level normal" problem. It kills the immersion in games and makes interest die.

starkerealm

DenMoria wrote: »

I can understand on trial bosses or high-level stuff, but I always wondered why a starter level boss had 400-500K in health. Honestly, spamming dps until they're down is boring and NOBODY can be that powerful if they're a person.

I can understand high stats on maybe some giant monster, but a friggin Necromancer?

If you're getting bored in a 20 second boss fight... yeah, I don't know, I really don't. Trial bosses usually have somewhere around 26 to 52 million health. So, that might be a bit out of your reach.