[Class Rep] Werewolf Feedback Thread

Mr_Wolfe

Chrlynsch wrote: »

@Mr_Wolfe call of the pack passive reduces the cost of remaining in form. That is important because it makes things like bloodrage and feral pounce more effective.


Solo
Transformation: 37.5 seconds
Feral Pounce: 1.25 seconds
Blood Rage: 5 seconds
Devour: 15 seconds (full corpse)

Two werewolves
Transformation: 50 seconds
Feral Pounce: 1.66 seconds
Blood Rage: 6.66 seconds
Devour: 20 seconds (full corpse)

Three werewolves(1 Pack Leader)
Transformation: 75 seconds
Feral Pounce: 2.5 seconds
Blood Rage: 10 seconds
Devour: 30 seconds (full corpse)

Four werewolves (1 Pack Leader & 1 other wolf)
Transformation: 150 seconds
Feral Pounce: 5 seconds
Blood Rage: 20 seconds
Devour: 60 seconds (full corpse)

Ah. I'm aware that it's a 'cost' reduction rather than a direct increase to your timer, but I worded it the way I did for the sake of clarity--since it's a bit weird to think of a timer in terms of 'cost.' Looks like I screwed up on my math a bit as a result though. I blame the education system.

I'm curious if the game rounds the fractions of a second off like it does with other fractions, might have to time it in-game. Either way the point I was trying to make stands: You can actually get a lot more time in werewolf form than the 30 second tooltip suggests.

Asmoxian

Brutal Pounce stops working during fights. I haven't narrowed down the cause, but sometimes the skill becomes unusable until you get out of combat and drag it off the bar and back on. This is a deal breaker if it happens on a boss and you're stuck without a crucial skill.

Mr_Wolfe

Yeah, that happened to me during a run through Moongrave Fane on the pts. Though I think it cleared up on it's own eventually. I just put it down to the usually glitchiness that pounce has had for ages. On the plus side, I don't think I've seen the bug where try go to pounce and get locked in the pre-jump 'linebacker' pose and can't activate any skills since Greymoor went live.

Swen_von_Walhallion

this pounce bug is unfortunetely prety comon, it hapend to me once when i testing dps and around 3 times when i wa s in vKA trial and twice in vBRP. What i read reloadui can fix it but problem is before its reload your WW form is gone, just cancel form is faster

Mr_Wolfe

I usually just mash skills in frustration until it finally works again.

The funny thing is I've started seeing something similar happen to non werewolves. Apparently the bugs are spreading.

Aztlan

Asmoxian wrote: »

Brutal Pounce stops working during fights. I haven't narrowed down the cause, but sometimes the skill becomes unusable until you get out of combat and drag it off the bar and back on. This is a deal breaker if it happens on a boss and you're stuck without a crucial skill.

I experienced this last night in Kyne's Aegis.

Asmoxian

I experienced a new bug tonight. When I died in werewolf form I was rezzed and then had no skills available to use until werewolf form wore off. My character was stuck in a hunched over form and I was not able to rez other players, use potions, or toggle off my werewolf form. I tried opening the crown store, the CP selection window, and my skills window. None of these things fixed the issue. I was in stasis for 30 seconds waiting for it to go away while watching a poor low CP character light attacking a vet HM final boss.

Ryuvain

If the reps still read this: can you at least consider werewolf behemoth being added? It's pretty playable with no changes on test.

Ryuvain

Pts spoilers:

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=qxKoBd72yfs

Video from my other thread about werewolf behemoth. It's very unique and very balanced as is. All we would need is to get it added as a second ultimate after getting Werewolf mastery. That way the original is still there and you can only use 1 of them at a time.

Nord_Raseri

Ryuvain wrote: »

Pts spoilers:

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=qxKoBd72yfs

Video from my other thread about werewolf behemoth. It's very unique and very balanced as is. All we would need is to get it added as a second ultimate after getting Werewolf mastery. That way the original is still there and you can only use 1 of them at a time.

Wait, what? How? Is this the new dungeon? How did you become a behemoth?(Ps4 pleb)

Tommy_The_Gun

Nord_Raseri wrote: »

Ryuvain wrote: »

Pts spoilers:

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=qxKoBd72yfs

Video from my other thread about werewolf behemoth. It's very unique and very balanced as is. All we would need is to get it added as a second ultimate after getting Werewolf mastery. That way the original is still there and you can only use 1 of them at a time.

Wait, what? How? Is this the new dungeon? How did you become a behemoth?(Ps4 pleb)

It is a dungeon exclusive mechanics... And I hope it will stay that way... (Imagine people drinking a potion in overland to become WW behemoth, it would kinda make WW skill line pointless).

Side note:
Wonder if it works same as regular WW (Disabled weapon passive), or what happens in case if you are vamp ? Do you keep your vamp passives ? ? ?

Nord_Raseri

Tommy_The_Gun wrote: »

Nord_Raseri wrote: »

Ryuvain wrote: »

Pts spoilers:

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=qxKoBd72yfs

Video from my other thread about werewolf behemoth. It's very unique and very balanced as is. All we would need is to get it added as a second ultimate after getting Werewolf mastery. That way the original is still there and you can only use 1 of them at a time.

Wait, what? How? Is this the new dungeon? How did you become a behemoth?(Ps4 pleb)

It is a dungeon exclusive mechanics... And I hope it will stay that way...

Side note:
Wonder if it works same as regular WW (Disabled weapon passive), or what happens in case if you are vamp ? Do you keep your vamp passives ? ? ?

Ah, was thinking maybe it'd only happen to WW toons, like how that one vamp was experimenting on werewolves in greymoor. Too bad.

Ryuvain

Nord_Raseri wrote: »

Tommy_The_Gun wrote: »

Nord_Raseri wrote: »

Ryuvain wrote: »

Pts spoilers:

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=qxKoBd72yfs

Video from my other thread about werewolf behemoth. It's very unique and very balanced as is. All we would need is to get it added as a second ultimate after getting Werewolf mastery. That way the original is still there and you can only use 1 of them at a time.

Wait, what? How? Is this the new dungeon? How did you become a behemoth?(Ps4 pleb)

It is a dungeon exclusive mechanics... And I hope it will stay that way...

Side note:
Wonder if it works same as regular WW (Disabled weapon passive), or what happens in case if you are vamp ? Do you keep your vamp passives ? ? ?

Ah, was thinking maybe it'd only happen to WW toons, like how that one vamp was experimenting on werewolves in greymoor. Too bad.

Yeah, that's the one thing that bothers me. In comparison it makes werewolf useless.

Tommy_The_Gun wrote: »

Nord_Raseri wrote: »

Ryuvain wrote: »

Pts spoilers:

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=qxKoBd72yfs

Video from my other thread about werewolf behemoth. It's very unique and very balanced as is. All we would need is to get it added as a second ultimate after getting Werewolf mastery. That way the original is still there and you can only use 1 of them at a time.

Wait, what? How? Is this the new dungeon? How did you become a behemoth?(Ps4 pleb)

It is a dungeon exclusive mechanics... And I hope it will stay that way... (Imagine people drinking a potion in overland to become WW behemoth, it would kinda make WW skill line pointless).

Side note:
Wonder if it works same as regular WW (Disabled weapon passive), or what happens in case if you are vamp ? Do you keep your vamp passives ? ? ?

I do want behemoth playable, just fix the lore around these potions being so easy. Even regular people taking it aren't even turned into werewolves afterwards.

erio

Hey guys I keep running into unkillable wws in bgs, any idea what gear they run?

Mr_Wolfe

Nobody's unkillable, though there are a number of ways to build a werewolf with high survivability. Ultimately that's less about gear though and more a question of their experience playing a werewolf in PvP vs their opponent's experience fighting werewolf players.

Kory

I would love to play as the werewolf behemoth outside one dungeon. Maybe it could be an ability used once a day for werewolves?

Hotdog_23

Sure, others will chime in and say oh they are easy to kill you just have a L2p issue, but WW are too strong in BG’s.

Think maybe it’s because they have such a good heal that uses magic when all their other skills are stamina based. So, their heal is always ready and can stay on the offensive and not worry too much about resources.

Be safe and have fun

Mr_Wolfe

Hotdog_23 wrote: »

Sure, others will chime in and say oh they are easy to kill you just have a L2p issue, but WW are too strong in BG’s.

Think maybe it’s because they have such a good heal that uses magic when all their other skills are stamina based. So, their heal is always ready and can stay on the offensive and not worry too much about resources.

Be safe and have fun

Sure, until you've used it one or two times.

It's a very expensive heal for what it does, and because it relies on your off-resource you have a much smaller pool to cast from that you can't easily replenish. Self-healing on werewolves is actually extremely limited compared to the options non-werewolves have. They're also much more vulnerable to CC and DoTs/Debuffs, because werewolves don't have access to any skills that purge or grant cc immunity. Werewolves have a lot of strengths, but they also have plenty of weaknesses if you learn what they are and know how to exploit them.

Ryuvain

Mr_Wolfe wrote: »

Hotdog_23 wrote: »

Sure, others will chime in and say oh they are easy to kill you just have a L2p issue, but WW are too strong in BG’s.

Think maybe it’s because they have such a good heal that uses magic when all their other skills are stamina based. So, their heal is always ready and can stay on the offensive and not worry too much about resources.

Be safe and have fun

Sure, until you've used it one or two times.

It's a very expensive heal for what it does, and because it relies on your off-resource you have a much smaller pool to cast from that you can't easily replenish. Self-healing on werewolves is actually extremely limited compared to the options non-werewolves have. They're also much more vulnerable to CC and DoTs/Debuffs, because werewolves don't have access to any skills that purge or grant cc immunity. Werewolves have a lot of strengths, but they also have plenty of weaknesses if you learn what they are and know how to exploit them.

This, they don't get class passives either. They struggle with cc/stuns so much.

Mr_Wolfe

I'm pretty sure some class passives still work in werewolf form, though obviously not the ones that require you to use or slot a certain skill. But yeah, CC is a major weakness for werewolves--which really sucks in PvP since stuns and immobilizations are such a big part of PvP combat.

Kilcosu

on the subject of cc's, stuns and immobilizations...

a serious pain point @ZOS_GinaBruno

the pounce (gap close) / carnage (dot) SHOULD NOT hinder us from gap closing targets twice in succession, werewolves already had so many weaknesses baked into our toolkit regarding kiting we did not need this clearly intentionally designed handicap against opponents kiting.

I DO NOT want to feel more involved in a werewolf rotation if it also means I can not catch someone kiting me. every other gap close has a slow mechanic to it (or stun) i'd rather have that

Stx

Hotdog_23 wrote: »

Sure, others will chime in and say oh they are easy to kill you just have a L2p issue, but WW are too strong in BG’s.

Think maybe it’s because they have such a good heal that uses magic when all their other skills are stamina based. So, their heal is always ready and can stay on the offensive and not worry too much about resources.

Be safe and have fun

WW heal is much worse than stamina heals or magicka heals. It scales on max health and costs a whopping 6k magicka.

Yes you can build a Ww to be able to cast it more often, but you will be giving up damage, unlike normal builds who get damage AND healing from stacking their primary resource and wep/spell damage.

ccfeeling

Sustain huge increase killed the WW last patch .

Mr_Wolfe

Kilcosu wrote: »

on the subject of cc's, stuns and immobilizations...

a serious pain point @ZOS_GinaBruno

the pounce (gap close) / carnage (dot) SHOULD NOT hinder us from gap closing targets twice in succession, werewolves already had so many weaknesses baked into our toolkit regarding kiting we did not need this clearly intentionally designed handicap against opponents kiting.

I DO NOT want to feel more involved in a werewolf rotation if it also means I can not catch someone kiting me. every other gap close has a slow mechanic to it (or stun) i'd rather have that

Yeah, removing the stun from pounce really hurt--and effectively adding a 5 second cooldown only made it worse. I used to 'chain pounce' when soloing dungeons to aggro multiple groups of adds and pull them all together, now it feels like I'm constantly straining against a leash.

Don't get me wrong, I like that we have an execute now--but it would've been better to add that functionality to our Claws or Howl instead.

ccfeeling wrote: »

Sustain huge increase killed the WW last patch .

Werewolf has been niche and underperforming pretty much since it came out. We had a brief moment of almost relevance with the Wolfhunter DLC, (though only with one specific build, and on console werewolf was nearly unusable due to bugs for much of that time) and then got nerfed into the ground with every subsequent patch until Greymoor came out. I watched entire ww-focused guilds implode because of that, and I'd be lying if I said I wasn't still a little salty.

LtAscott

@ZOS_GinaBruno Please forward to the team ASAP Werewolf Transformation Ultimate Berserker morph is broken, it resets to Werewolf transformation rank 1 (as if you just acquired the skill) when zoning. I switched between stros mkai and bangkorai, reset to rank 1 (morph skill point lost) after relevelling/remorphing in a dungeon (after which when finished and zoning back it was reset) so far I have lost 2 skill points to the void from spending them on the re-morph to Berserker, not sure if I will be getting the skill points back so dont really want to gamble more to fully figure out the issue.

Other details: when zoning out of dungeon, the transformation ultimate was not ready to be cast (not enough ultimate). When zoning between stros mkai and bangkorai the ultimate was ready to be cast. Both times it reset to base transformation rank one (and the skill point was lost) so in total so far I've lost 3 skill points (first from the original morph, second from remorph in dungeon, 3rd remorphing in overland).

Skoomah

LtAscott wrote: »

@ZOS_GinaBruno Please forward to the team ASAP Werewolf Transformation Ultimate Berserker morph is broken, it resets to Werewolf transformation rank 1 (as if you just acquired the skill) when zoning. I switched between stros mkai and bangkorai, reset to rank 1 (morph skill point lost) after relevelling/remorphing in a dungeon (after which when finished and zoning back it was reset) so far I have lost 2 skill points to the void from spending them on the re-morph to Berserker, not sure if I will be getting the skill points back so dont really want to gamble more to fully figure out the issue.

Other details: when zoning out of dungeon, the transformation ultimate was not ready to be cast (not enough ultimate). When zoning between stros mkai and bangkorai the ultimate was ready to be cast. Both times it reset to base transformation rank one (and the skill point was lost) so in total so far I've lost 3 skill points (first from the original morph, second from remorph in dungeon, 3rd remorphing in overland).

@ZOS_GinaBruno
@ZOS_JessicaFolsom

Hi Gina and Jessica. Confirmed, this is affecting all werewolves. Our ultimate skill keeps getting reverted back to its base morph level 1 at no experience. And we are missing a skill point because of this bug too.

Amdar_Godkiller

So how's the light attack nerf going to affect us? Pretty bad, I'm guessing...

Wuuffyy

Amdar_Godkiller wrote: »

So how's the light attack nerf going to affect us? Pretty bad, I'm guessing...

Wrong and moot thread as they disbanded this system (class rep), but yes.

More generalized and horrible werewolf nerfs. Nerf on claws and the morph heal as well.

Amdar_Godkiller

Wolf_Watching wrote: »

Amdar_Godkiller wrote: »

So how's the light attack nerf going to affect us? Pretty bad, I'm guessing...

Wrong and moot thread as they disbanded this system (class rep), but yes.

Yeah, I didn't want to start a new thread, and this was the last place I posted before I took a two year hiatus from the game. Regardless, I find the fact that they didn't even address WW light attacks as an ill omen of bad moons to come.

Wuuffyy

Amdar_Godkiller wrote: »

Wolf_Watching wrote: »

Amdar_Godkiller wrote: »

So how's the light attack nerf going to affect us? Pretty bad, I'm guessing...

Wrong and moot thread as they disbanded this system (class rep), but yes.

Yeah, I didn't want to start a new thread, and this was the last place I posted before I took a two year hiatus from the game. Regardless, I find the fact that they didn't even address WW light attacks as an ill omen of bad moons to come.

Same. As soon as I saw it was announced it was all I was thinking about. Unlike other classes/ etc, werewolf has a finite amount of damage it can pull and once lost can’t be made up else where.