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Hide Vampirism option. Please?
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HappyLittleTree✭✭✭✭✭
✭Yeah well I don't want to say anything but even in the game there is a quest (DC) where you meet a vamp that is hiding his appearance *cough* Count Verandis Ravenwatch *cough*
so i don't think it would be that of a problem...
I like my vamp nb but still i get why some people want to hide it and not use skinsThuu chakkuth lod Hajhiit c’oo? Hajhiit gortsuquth gorihuth thuu gooluthduj thdeitoluu!
XBox-EU3 -
White wabbit✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭White wabbit wrote: »White wabbit wrote: »White wabbit wrote: »You want the pros well then you have to take the cons too
there are enough cons without making your character look terrible.. like you know that whole needing to feed and weakness to fire thing.
But the pros outweigh the cons or you would have cured it , where does it stop werewolfs not actually changing into werewolfs , sorry but no it should stay as is
so basically what you are saying is that you want to punish vampires becasue werewolf is useless? instead of proposing solutions to make werewolf more viable? and in any case, my wolf only turns wolfie in COMBAT. when I'm in town, I can easily ignore being a wolf. it doesn't mess with my appearance. it doesn't change anything until I CHOSE to use it.
so... its fine if vampirism becomes visible once you use VAMPIRE abilities. but outside of that? glamour IS a thing, and in game npc vampires DO get to use it. just not players for some reason.
Didn't say any of that read posts before commenting
you absolutely implied it, as does everyone else who is against an option to hide vampirism. you WANT vampire players to be punished, one way or another.
I'm vamp on 5 of my characters and I have No issue with how they look if you want the perks of the skill line then yes you should put up with how it looks or go cure your self1 -
preevious✭✭✭✭✭
✭There are too many vampire, it break immersion !
Give them a skin, so they can hide, and we'll see less of them. Give us back our immersion by giving them a skin !
Plus, if you want to adress the argument (the silly, idiotic, absolutely stupid argument) made by the pvp community that it would allow vampire to "hide their powers", gaining an upper hand in battle ... just disable skins while in Cyrodiil.
Actually, scratch that .. disable skins, disguises, outfits, hats, tatoos and everything and the like, while in cyrodiil .. also, force enable the hide helmet option, in cyrodiil .. I'm pretty sure the pvp community, all against dirty cheaters such as hidden vampires, would heavily support that.
Because, yes, it's all about potential cheaters .. it's not about not wanting other players to benefit of something they won't benefit of
3 -
White wabbit✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭There are too many vampire, it break immersion !
Give them a skin, so they can hide, and we'll see less of them. Give us back our immersion by giving them a skin !
Plus, if you want to adress the argument (the silly, idiotic, absolutely stupid argument) made by the pvp community that it would allow vampire to "hide their powers", gaining an upper hand in battle ... just disable skins while in Cyrodiil.
Actually, scratch that .. disable skins, disguises, outfits, hats, tatoos and everything and the like, while in cyrodiil .. also, force enable the hide helmet option, in cyrodiil .. I'm pretty sure the pvp community, all against dirty cheaters such as hidden vampires, would heavily support that.
Because, yes, it's all about potential cheaters .. it's not about not wanting other players to benefit of something they won't benefit of
Personally I think it's a very small percentage that care about the look ,most who have it just want the passives ,so I think ZOS should charge those that want to hide it1 -
Luthivar✭✭✭Omg, can't you just stay away from vampire teeth, if you don't like to look like a tes vampire? Fast movement during stealth can be obtained through wearing 3 parts of a set. 10 percent less reg? Try it, you won't note the difference; HA works better than reg anyway.
If you think you need vampirism and dislike the look at stage 4, wear a mask. Stage 1 vamps (maybe with a hood) look like pale humans. And if we are talking of lore: Yes, Lamae told sth of there being a crown able to fully hide vampirism. But thats an unique artifact. Wouldn't be so unique if worn by everybody, would it?
This is the second thread on this topic within 1 week, with exactly the same comments from the same people linking the same admins. Don't you get tired of it already?Edited by Luthivar on May 23, 2018 8:59AM2 -
White wabbit✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Omg, can't you just stay away from vampire teeth, if you don't like to look like a tes vampire? Fast movement during stealth can be obtained through wearing 3 parts of a set. 10 percent less reg? Try it, you won't note the difference; HA works better than reg anyway.
If you think you need vampirism and dislike the look at stage 4, wear a mask. Stage 1 vamps (maybe with a hood) look like pale humans. And if we are talking of lore: Yes, Lamae told sth of there being a crown able to fully hide vampirism. But thats an unique artifact. Wouldn't be so unique if worn by everybody, would it?
This is the second thread on this topic within 1 week, with exactly the same comments from the same people linking the same admins. Don't you get tired of it already?
Well said , think people think If they keep going on about something that it will become true0 -
xeNNNNN✭✭✭✭✭
✭Rohamad_Ali wrote: »
....again
and it will continue again and again and again....and should they ever win? A new kind of person will make another thread!......The reverse kind!Ah, e-communities - the "pinnacle" of the internet............yeah, right.1 -
MLGProPlayer✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Omg, can't you just stay away from vampire teeth, if you don't like to look like a tes vampire? Fast movement during stealth can be obtained through wearing 3 parts of a set. 10 percent less reg? Try it, you won't note the difference; HA works better than reg anyway.
If you think you need vampirism and dislike the look at stage 4, wear a mask. Stage 1 vamps (maybe with a hood) look like pale humans. And if we are talking of lore: Yes, Lamae told sth of there being a crown able to fully hide vampirism. But thats an unique artifact. Wouldn't be so unique if worn by everybody, would it?
This is the second thread on this topic within 1 week, with exactly the same comments from the same people linking the same admins. Don't you get tired of it already?
Vampirism is mandatory for optimal PvE performance.
There are 2 reasons to play an MMO:
1. Complete content
2. Look cool doing it
Vampirism prevents either #1 or #2 because it's a gameplay mechanic with a cosmetic "drawback". It's poor game design.Edited by MLGProPlayer on May 23, 2018 9:48AM4 -
DerpyShadowz✭✭✭✭I would like to hide it also, and im surprised Zenimax hasn't done anything about it, Just think of all those Tattoo's in the crown store people would buy if they could actually see them while being vampire
Lurking in the shadows.2 -
Runschei✭✭✭✭✭
✭The fact that people don't seem to understand that this is an RP game where looks are valued. If people don't value looks then let's get rid off all the bloody motifs and stick to one, remove dye station, remove costumes and skins, remover everything that allows you to change anything about your appearance! Let's all look like the exact same and run around with twigs.
No? 3 -
Coatmagic✭✭✭✭✭
✭As stated multiple times in this thread, quest disguises hide vampirism.
You can have quite a lot of fun with this if you just roll with it as you can have two completely looking characters!
The other thing I have done, though you may not want to spend crowns on, is get vamp'd, get starved, then pay for appearance change and 'fix' yourself. If you feel you are too pale when starved, I find the red on black skeleton paint (basic creation) gives starved vamps a less washed out tone
They may not be what you wanted to look like, but if you create a character TO BE a vampire, then it's less soul destroying when they get the dead look.1 -
Runschei✭✭✭✭✭
✭As stated multiple times in this thread, quest disguises hide vampirism.
You can have quite a lot of fun with this if you just roll with it as you can have two completely looking characters!
The other thing I have done, though you may not want to spend crowns on, is get vamp'd, get starved, then pay for appearance change and 'fix' yourself. If you feel you are too pale when starved, I find the red on black skeleton paint (basic creation) gives starved vamps a less washed out tone
They may not be what you wanted to look like, but if you create a character TO BE a vampire, then it's less soul destroying when they get the dead look.
And as also stated several times in this thread; Disguises obtainable from quests completely puts your character back to vanilla mode and removes any crown store cosmetics like hairstyles, makeup, awesome dwemer goggles etc. It also prevents you from putting on an outfit and costume.2 -
Digiman✭✭✭✭✭would defeat the purpose of it being a curse, honestly sick of players who don't care about the lore ruining the game because they don't like the look of their stat boosts.1 -
Linaleah✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭would defeat the purpose of it being a curse, honestly sick of players who don't care about the lore ruining the game because they don't like the look of their stat boosts.
in LORE, you can actualy use glamour to hide vampirism. so in LORE? you SHOULD be able to look normal.
for people who like the look? awesome, keep the look. the many of you who are against an OPTION to hide it, in a game where you can already hide it with skins and quest disguises are honestly? just being pettydirty worthless casual.
Lois McMaster Bujold "A Civil Campaign"Reputation is what other people know about you. Honor is what you know about yourself. Guard your honor. Let your reputation fall where it will. And outlive the ***3 -
White wabbit✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭would defeat the purpose of it being a curse, honestly sick of players who don't care about the lore ruining the game because they don't like the look of their stat boosts.
in LORE, you can actualy use glamour to hide vampirism. so in LORE? you SHOULD be able to look normal.
for people who like the look? awesome, keep the look. the many of you who are against an OPTION to hide it, in a game where you can already hide it with skins and quest disguises are honestly? just being petty
And finally we have it as you have pointed out with skins and quest disguises you have an option to hide it so nothing else is needed, it would seem that you are actually the one being petty asking for something that you want that isn't actually needed as you have pointed out above , it not mine or anyone else's fault you don't like the option that ZOS have in the game , I think it's a small percentage that have a issue with this and the majority accept that if they want the passives that they have to accept the downside0 -
Lord_Ninka✭✭✭At the very least in stage 1, yes. I like the gameplay of vampirism but still feel robbed of all the time I spent in character creation.
It particularly bothers me how it gives elves human looking eyes. It's.... ugh, why would they get human looking eyes from vampirism? It's all wrong.
And with regards to PvP, it's not like you can tell I'm a vampire from my looks anyway when I just cover myself up in proper armor to hide the ugliness, but I'd gladly have a hide-vampirism option be PvE only, especially if we could go ahead and disable all other disguises in PvP, which also hide Vampirism (as well as armor type)
As for it being a curse, well, you can just let it be a curse if you like and not hide it. We don't all have to rp your way by ourselves, do we?Edited by Lord_Ninka on May 23, 2018 12:55PM1 -
Aliyavana✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭White wabbit wrote: »would defeat the purpose of it being a curse, honestly sick of players who don't care about the lore ruining the game because they don't like the look of their stat boosts.
in LORE, you can actualy use glamour to hide vampirism. so in LORE? you SHOULD be able to look normal.
for people who like the look? awesome, keep the look. the many of you who are against an OPTION to hide it, in a game where you can already hide it with skins and quest disguises are honestly? just being petty
And finally we have it as you have pointed out with skins and quest disguises you have an option to hide it so nothing else is needed, it would seem that you are actually the one being petty asking for something that you want that isn't actually needed as you have pointed out above , it not mine or anyone else's fault you don't like the option that ZOS have in the game , I think it's a small percentage that have a issue with this and the majority accept that if they want the passives that they have to accept the downside
Talks about being petty, is petty himself1 -
jaschacasadiob16_ESO✭✭✭✭✭Let's face it, the whole vampire thing is pretty much ...poorly done and managed. Vampires are not attacked on sight and don't burn under the sun.
ZOS, just give us all the nebefits of vampirism. No more ugly faces. All happy."Yesterday while searching a barrel in vVoM I found a lemon. Best drop of the whole run."
Protect the weak. Heal the sick.
Treasure the gifts of friendship. Seek joy and inspiration in the mysteries of love.
Honor the Earth, its creatures, and the spirits. Use Nature's gifts wisely. Respect her power. Fear her fury.1 -
White wabbit✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭White wabbit wrote: »would defeat the purpose of it being a curse, honestly sick of players who don't care about the lore ruining the game because they don't like the look of their stat boosts.
in LORE, you can actualy use glamour to hide vampirism. so in LORE? you SHOULD be able to look normal.
for people who like the look? awesome, keep the look. the many of you who are against an OPTION to hide it, in a game where you can already hide it with skins and quest disguises are honestly? just being petty
And finally we have it as you have pointed out with skins and quest disguises you have an option to hide it so nothing else is needed, it would seem that you are actually the one being petty asking for something that you want that isn't actually needed as you have pointed out above , it not mine or anyone else's fault you don't like the option that ZOS have in the game , I think it's a small percentage that have a issue with this and the majority accept that if they want the passives that they have to accept the downside
Talks about being petty, is petty himself
Yep when someone sits there and acuses people of being petty because they aren't getting their way, Then yes I'm going to be petty back at them , especially on a thread that all everyone does is to round and round, there are options in play to cover the question raised so is no need for the many threads opened on this1 -
Aliyavana✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭White wabbit wrote: »White wabbit wrote: »would defeat the purpose of it being a curse, honestly sick of players who don't care about the lore ruining the game because they don't like the look of their stat boosts.
in LORE, you can actualy use glamour to hide vampirism. so in LORE? you SHOULD be able to look normal.
for people who like the look? awesome, keep the look. the many of you who are against an OPTION to hide it, in a game where you can already hide it with skins and quest disguises are honestly? just being petty
And finally we have it as you have pointed out with skins and quest disguises you have an option to hide it so nothing else is needed, it would seem that you are actually the one being petty asking for something that you want that isn't actually needed as you have pointed out above , it not mine or anyone else's fault you don't like the option that ZOS have in the game , I think it's a small percentage that have a issue with this and the majority accept that if they want the passives that they have to accept the downside
Talks about being petty, is petty himself
Yep when someone sits there and acuses people of being petty because they aren't getting their way, Then yes I'm going to be petty back at them , especially on a thread that all everyone does is to round and round, there are options in play to cover the question raised so is no need for the many threads opened on this
There are options that are insufficient to get our desired look we spent hrs working on, not all of us want to look like we have flashlight skins1 -
JobooAGS✭✭✭✭✭
✭I disagree with the motion to make a skin or something to completely erase the apperance of vamprism (ie a human/elf/beast skin) HOWEVER, I am in favor of having vampire exclusive skins ie the skyrim vamp skins, oblivion style vamp skin, etc.0 -
White wabbit✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭White wabbit wrote: »White wabbit wrote: »would defeat the purpose of it being a curse, honestly sick of players who don't care about the lore ruining the game because they don't like the look of their stat boosts.
in LORE, you can actualy use glamour to hide vampirism. so in LORE? you SHOULD be able to look normal.
for people who like the look? awesome, keep the look. the many of you who are against an OPTION to hide it, in a game where you can already hide it with skins and quest disguises are honestly? just being petty
And finally we have it as you have pointed out with skins and quest disguises you have an option to hide it so nothing else is needed, it would seem that you are actually the one being petty asking for something that you want that isn't actually needed as you have pointed out above , it not mine or anyone else's fault you don't like the option that ZOS have in the game , I think it's a small percentage that have a issue with this and the majority accept that if they want the passives that they have to accept the downside
Talks about being petty, is petty himself
Yep when someone sits there and acuses people of being petty because they aren't getting their way, Then yes I'm going to be petty back at them , especially on a thread that all everyone does is to round and round, there are options in play to cover the question raised so is no need for the many threads opened on this
There are options that are insufficient to get our desired look we spent hrs working on, not all of us want to look like we have flashlight skins
Again we probably a very small percentage so you want ZOS to work on something for a few of you , as I said in a post that zos should do it but at a cost ie crowns
Since this thread is a waste I can't be bothered anymoreEdited by White wabbit on May 23, 2018 1:21PM0 -
Aliyavana✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭White wabbit wrote: »White wabbit wrote: »White wabbit wrote: »would defeat the purpose of it being a curse, honestly sick of players who don't care about the lore ruining the game because they don't like the look of their stat boosts.
in LORE, you can actualy use glamour to hide vampirism. so in LORE? you SHOULD be able to look normal.
for people who like the look? awesome, keep the look. the many of you who are against an OPTION to hide it, in a game where you can already hide it with skins and quest disguises are honestly? just being petty
And finally we have it as you have pointed out with skins and quest disguises you have an option to hide it so nothing else is needed, it would seem that you are actually the one being petty asking for something that you want that isn't actually needed as you have pointed out above , it not mine or anyone else's fault you don't like the option that ZOS have in the game , I think it's a small percentage that have a issue with this and the majority accept that if they want the passives that they have to accept the downside
Talks about being petty, is petty himself
Yep when someone sits there and acuses people of being petty because they aren't getting their way, Then yes I'm going to be petty back at them , especially on a thread that all everyone does is to round and round, there are options in play to cover the question raised so is no need for the many threads opened on this
There are options that are insufficient to get our desired look we spent hrs working on, not all of us want to look like we have flashlight skins
Again we probably a very small percentage so you want ZOS to work on something for a few of you , as I said in a post that zos should do it but at a cost ie crowns
Since this thread is a waste I can't be bothered anymore
I would be willing to pay 5k crowns if that's the cost for a mortal skin.I disagree with the motion to make a skin or something to completely erase the apperance of vamprism (ie a human/elf/beast skin) HOWEVER, I am in favor of having vampire exclusive skins ie the skyrim vamp skins, oblivion style vamp skin, etc.
I wouldn't mind a skyrim vampire skin1 -
Lord_Wrath✭✭✭✭✭Great to know the only thing Zos says is "keep it friendly". No "Yea we might implement something" or "We cant do that". McDonalds employees must be a dime a dozen.1300+ CP | Lørd Wrath | - Sorcerer - Palatine - Grand Master Crafter - 30000 Achievement Points
Launch Player - PC - NA - EP1 -
bg22✭✭✭✭✭
✭White wabbit wrote: »White wabbit wrote: »White wabbit wrote: »White wabbit wrote: »You want the pros well then you have to take the cons too
there are enough cons without making your character look terrible.. like you know that whole needing to feed and weakness to fire thing.
But the pros outweigh the cons or you would have cured it , where does it stop werewolfs not actually changing into werewolfs , sorry but no it should stay as is
so basically what you are saying is that you want to punish vampires becasue werewolf is useless? instead of proposing solutions to make werewolf more viable? and in any case, my wolf only turns wolfie in COMBAT. when I'm in town, I can easily ignore being a wolf. it doesn't mess with my appearance. it doesn't change anything until I CHOSE to use it.
so... its fine if vampirism becomes visible once you use VAMPIRE abilities. but outside of that? glamour IS a thing, and in game npc vampires DO get to use it. just not players for some reason.
Didn't say any of that read posts before commenting
you absolutely implied it, as does everyone else who is against an option to hide vampirism. you WANT vampire players to be punished, one way or another.
I'm vamp on 5 of my characters and I have No issue with how they look if you want the perks of the skill line then yes you should put up with how it looks or go cure your self
You’re clueless...
The whole point is that it’s literally mandatory for minmaxing. I and MANY others will be vamp regardless of the cosmetic drawbacks bc it makes your character better... but we don’t WANT to be a vampire. I hate vampires. I hate twilight. I hate Dracula. But I’m forced to be a vamp if I want to be as powerful as possible...
So no matter what, I’ll be a vampire, despite hating them... bc of stats.
Tying such benefits to such a cosmetic change is bullcrap for that exact reason.
The thing I don’t get is, by me hiding my terrible vampire looks, it affects ABSOLUTELY NO ONE but myself... so why would anyone be against being able to let ME look how I want MY CHARACTER to look?
How can anyone say “more options are bad!’?
It’s crazy that anyone would think that.
So instead of me hiding my helmet like I want to, I’m forced to hide my vampirism with a helmet or mask. Which I do.
So tell me again, how does me not actually looking like a vampire hurt ANYONE? It doesn’t.
Nobody in pvp thinks “oh look a vampire, I can see his eyes! I’m goin to use fire!” That just doesn’t happen.
What kind of ppl are against letting ppl look and feel better about how they’re playing, if it doesn’t affect you WHATSOEVER?
Insane.2 -
JobooAGS✭✭✭✭✭
✭White wabbit wrote: »White wabbit wrote: »White wabbit wrote: »White wabbit wrote: »You want the pros well then you have to take the cons too
there are enough cons without making your character look terrible.. like you know that whole needing to feed and weakness to fire thing.
But the pros outweigh the cons or you would have cured it , where does it stop werewolfs not actually changing into werewolfs , sorry but no it should stay as is
so basically what you are saying is that you want to punish vampires becasue werewolf is useless? instead of proposing solutions to make werewolf more viable? and in any case, my wolf only turns wolfie in COMBAT. when I'm in town, I can easily ignore being a wolf. it doesn't mess with my appearance. it doesn't change anything until I CHOSE to use it.
so... its fine if vampirism becomes visible once you use VAMPIRE abilities. but outside of that? glamour IS a thing, and in game npc vampires DO get to use it. just not players for some reason.
Didn't say any of that read posts before commenting
you absolutely implied it, as does everyone else who is against an option to hide vampirism. you WANT vampire players to be punished, one way or another.
I'm vamp on 5 of my characters and I have No issue with how they look if you want the perks of the skill line then yes you should put up with how it looks or go cure your self
You’re clueless...
The whole point is that it’s literally mandatory for minmaxing. I and MANY others will be vamp regardless of the cosmetic drawbacks bc it makes your character better... but we don’t WANT to be a vampire. I hate vampires. I hate twilight. I hate Dracula. But I’m forced to be a vamp if I want to be as powerful as possible...
So no matter what, I’ll be a vampire, despite hating them... bc of stats.
Tying such benefits to such a cosmetic change is bullcrap for that exact reason.
The thing I don’t get is, by me hiding my terrible vampire looks, it affects ABSOLUTELY NO ONE but myself... so why would anyone be against being able to let ME look how I want MY CHARACTER to look?
How can anyone say “more options are bad!’?
It’s crazy that anyone would think that.
So instead of me hiding my helmet like I want to, I’m forced to hide my vampirism with a helmet or mask. Which I do.
So tell me again, how does me not actually looking like a vampire hurt ANYONE? It doesn’t.
Nobody in pvp thinks “oh look a vampire, I can see his eyes! I’m goin to use fire!” That just doesn’t happen.
What kind of ppl are against letting ppl look and feel better about how they’re playing, if it doesn’t affect you WHATSOEVER?
Insane.
Im not a fan of vampires either, my sisters forcing me to watch the sparkling "vamps" in twilight caused me to hate them. The dawnguard dlc allowed me to get my revenge, and you know, once you had a taste.... you become like that dark elf vamp hunter and isran0 -
Linaleah✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭White wabbit wrote: »would defeat the purpose of it being a curse, honestly sick of players who don't care about the lore ruining the game because they don't like the look of their stat boosts.
in LORE, you can actualy use glamour to hide vampirism. so in LORE? you SHOULD be able to look normal.
for people who like the look? awesome, keep the look. the many of you who are against an OPTION to hide it, in a game where you can already hide it with skins and quest disguises are honestly? just being petty
And finally we have it as you have pointed out with skins and quest disguises you have an option to hide it so nothing else is needed, it would seem that you are actually the one being petty asking for something that you want that isn't actually needed as you have pointed out above , it not mine or anyone else's fault you don't like the option that ZOS have in the game , I think it's a small percentage that have a issue with this and the majority accept that if they want the passives that they have to accept the downside
no. skins ALSO change your look. which is the point. people asking to be able to disable the appearance of vampire. are asking to get back their original skin and eye color.
P.S. you started out being petty. I'm just calling it like it is. having an OPTION to hide the appearance doesn't preclude you from keeping it visible. god, i hate to bring up that game, but one of the few things swtor does better is, from the start - allow you to hide, or show appearance of dark side. it would be nice to have that option in ESO.Edited by Linaleah on May 23, 2018 1:54PMdirty worthless casual.
Lois McMaster Bujold "A Civil Campaign"Reputation is what other people know about you. Honor is what you know about yourself. Guard your honor. Let your reputation fall where it will. And outlive the ***2 -
White wabbit✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Here's the answer ZOS just do a blanket cure for vampirism across all platforms and servers then this won't an issue for the do's and don'ts on here1 -
_Salty_✭✭✭✭✭MLGProPlayer wrote: »Another day, another hide vampirism thread.
If you want to reap the benifits of being a Vamp you should have to actually look like one.
I know exercising logic is an out of practice skill these days.
Gameplay benefits should always come with gameplay drawbacks. Gameplay and cosmetics should be kept 100% separate, and are for the most part in this game (you can hide your helmet and arnour and even weapon type). Vampirism should be no different.
There is a difference between hiding a helmet hiding a fundamental part of being a Vampire.
It defeats the true nature and game design of it.
Everyone wants their cake and eat it too. You people want all the perks with no drawbacks. Life doesn't work that way.Psn l---Salty---l
Patiently waiting to make a Stankcromancer.0
This discussion has been closed.