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The Current Destro Pain Train Meta Needs To Die
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Joy_Division✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Izanagi.Xiiib16_ESO wrote: »Joy_Division wrote: »Izanagi.Xiiib16_ESO wrote: »I've never misquoted you and you agreed you misrepresented yourself.Izanagi.Xiiib16_ESO wrote: »"Your mission to remove tools to deal with faction stacks by trying to remove organised group play"
dis·in·gen·u·ous
adjective
Not candid or sincere, typically by having an intended meaning altered or misrepresented or by pretending that one knows less about something than one really does.
synonyms: insincere, dishonest, untruthful, false, deceitful, duplicitous, lying, mendacious; hypocritical
do you mean like posting:Joy_Division wrote: »Anyway, I'm done here
and then continuing to reply?
If you continue to disseminate false information about me on these forums, I am going to reply.4 -
Egocanemveresum✭✭✭Joy_Division wrote: »Izanagi.Xiiib16_ESO wrote: »Joy_Division wrote: »Izanagi.Xiiib16_ESO wrote: »I've never misquoted you and you agreed you misrepresented yourself.Izanagi.Xiiib16_ESO wrote: »"Your mission to remove tools to deal with faction stacks by trying to remove organised group play"
dis·in·gen·u·ous
adjective
Not candid or sincere, typically by having an intended meaning altered or misrepresented or by pretending that one knows less about something than one really does.
synonyms: insincere, dishonest, untruthful, false, deceitful, duplicitous, lying, mendacious; hypocritical
do you mean like posting:Joy_Division wrote: »Anyway, I'm done here
and then continuing to reply?
If you continue to disseminate false information about me on these forums, I am going to reply.
He's only made himself look like a fool for many, many pages in some strange attempt at saving face and/or whiteknighting. He's not worth your time at this point to be honest.14 -
Izanagi.Xiiib16_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Joy_Division wrote: »Izanagi.Xiiib16_ESO wrote: »Joy_Division wrote: »Izanagi.Xiiib16_ESO wrote: »I've never misquoted you and you agreed you misrepresented yourself.Izanagi.Xiiib16_ESO wrote: »"Your mission to remove tools to deal with faction stacks by trying to remove organised group play"
dis·in·gen·u·ous
adjective
Not candid or sincere, typically by having an intended meaning altered or misrepresented or by pretending that one knows less about something than one really does.
synonyms: insincere, dishonest, untruthful, false, deceitful, duplicitous, lying, mendacious; hypocritical
do you mean like posting:Joy_Division wrote: »Anyway, I'm done here
and then continuing to reply?
If you continue to disseminate false information about me on these forums, I am going to reply.
You could maybe answer some questions when you reply then
there's a few of them on my previous post. @Solar_Breeze
NA ~ Izanerys: Dracarys (Videos | Dracast)
EU ~ Izanagi: Roleplay Circle (AOE Rats/ Zerg Squad / Banana Squad)2 -
Rainraven✭✭✭✭✭Egocanemveresum wrote: »Joy_Division wrote: »Izanagi.Xiiib16_ESO wrote: »Joy_Division wrote: »Izanagi.Xiiib16_ESO wrote: »I've never misquoted you and you agreed you misrepresented yourself.Izanagi.Xiiib16_ESO wrote: »"Your mission to remove tools to deal with faction stacks by trying to remove organised group play"
dis·in·gen·u·ous
adjective
Not candid or sincere, typically by having an intended meaning altered or misrepresented or by pretending that one knows less about something than one really does.
synonyms: insincere, dishonest, untruthful, false, deceitful, duplicitous, lying, mendacious; hypocritical
do you mean like posting:Joy_Division wrote: »Anyway, I'm done here
and then continuing to reply?
If you continue to disseminate false information about me on these forums, I am going to reply.
He's only made himself look like a fool for many, many pages in some strange attempt at saving face and/or whiteknighting. He's not worth your time at this point to be honest.
This thread's been more illuminating than is probably intended.3 -
Izanagi.Xiiib16_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Egocanemveresum wrote: »Joy_Division wrote: »Izanagi.Xiiib16_ESO wrote: »Joy_Division wrote: »Izanagi.Xiiib16_ESO wrote: »I've never misquoted you and you agreed you misrepresented yourself.Izanagi.Xiiib16_ESO wrote: »"Your mission to remove tools to deal with faction stacks by trying to remove organised group play"
dis·in·gen·u·ous
adjective
Not candid or sincere, typically by having an intended meaning altered or misrepresented or by pretending that one knows less about something than one really does.
synonyms: insincere, dishonest, untruthful, false, deceitful, duplicitous, lying, mendacious; hypocritical
do you mean like posting:Joy_Division wrote: »Anyway, I'm done here
and then continuing to reply?
If you continue to disseminate false information about me on these forums, I am going to reply.
He's only made himself look like a fool for many, many pages in some strange attempt at saving face and/or whiteknighting. He's not worth your time at this point to be honest.
This thread's been more illuminating than is probably intended.
Its actually quite an interesting cultural study for those who are interested in that sort of thing @Solar_Breeze
NA ~ Izanerys: Dracarys (Videos | Dracast)
EU ~ Izanagi: Roleplay Circle (AOE Rats/ Zerg Squad / Banana Squad)3 -
Joy_Division✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Izanagi.Xiiib16_ESO wrote: »
Feel free to quote my insults towards youIzanagi.Xiiib16_ESO wrote: »Anyone with a full brain understands what @Rin_Senya typed. I guess there is a lack of those left these days judging by this type of response...
...As for the rest of the cheerleader participation it constituted a circle of people patting each other on the back (as usual) and this is why its not worth the time to read it.Izanagi.Xiiib16_ESO wrote: »
This is why its important to consider the whole argument and why good positive discussion is important before coming to a conclusion.
Edited by Joy_Division on January 5, 2018 4:01PM0 -
Izanagi.Xiiib16_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Joy_Division wrote: »Izanagi.Xiiib16_ESO wrote: »
Feel free to quote my insults towards youIzanagi.Xiiib16_ESO wrote: »Anyone with a full brain understands what @Rin_Senya typed. I guess there is a lack of those left these days judging by this type of response...
...As for the rest of the cheerleader participation it constituted a circle of people patting each other on the back (as usual) and this is why its not worth the time to read it.Izanagi.Xiiib16_ESO wrote: »
This is why its important to consider the whole argument and why good positive discussion is important before coming to a conclusion.
I highlighted your mistake. Still waiting for any constructive reply to my points but avoidance definitely speaks volumes
Here's a link in case you can't find it:
https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/comment/4750137/#Comment_4750137
Edited by Izanagi.Xiiib16_ESO on January 5, 2018 4:56PM@Solar_Breeze
NA ~ Izanerys: Dracarys (Videos | Dracast)
EU ~ Izanagi: Roleplay Circle (AOE Rats/ Zerg Squad / Banana Squad)0 -
Egocanemveresum✭✭✭I feel like @Izanagi.Xiiib16_ESO could make a cameo on r/iamverysmart at this point.13
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Kilandros✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Egocanemveresum wrote: »I feel like @Izanagi.Xiiib16_ESO could make a cameo on r/iamverysmart at this point.
lolInvictus
Kilandros - Dragonknight / Grand Overlord
Deimos - Templar / Grand Warlord
Sias - Sorcerer / PrefectZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »Short answer is DKs likely won't be seeing a ton of changes before we go live; this class is still quite powerful (as it should be being a tank), even after some of the adjustments we've made to other classes and abilities.
DK IS NOT JUST A TANK CLASS. #PLAYTHEWAYYOUWANT1 -
Izanagi.Xiiib16_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Egocanemveresum wrote: »I feel like @Izanagi.Xiiib16_ESO could make a cameo on r/iamverysmart at this point.
I see its shift change at the first responders. Multiple posts on "mule accounts" don't make a point more valid.Egocanemveresum wrote: »this is a mule account not my main account@Solar_Breeze
NA ~ Izanerys: Dracarys (Videos | Dracast)
EU ~ Izanagi: Roleplay Circle (AOE Rats/ Zerg Squad / Banana Squad)3 -
Kilandros✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭@Publius_Scipio your promise for story time is the only reason we're still reading this thread. I hope you intend to deliver.Invictus
Kilandros - Dragonknight / Grand Overlord
Deimos - Templar / Grand Warlord
Sias - Sorcerer / PrefectZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »Short answer is DKs likely won't be seeing a ton of changes before we go live; this class is still quite powerful (as it should be being a tank), even after some of the adjustments we've made to other classes and abilities.
DK IS NOT JUST A TANK CLASS. #PLAYTHEWAYYOUWANT6 -
Egocanemveresum✭✭✭Izanagi.Xiiib16_ESO wrote: »Egocanemveresum wrote: »I feel like @Izanagi.Xiiib16_ESO could make a cameo on r/iamverysmart at this point.
I see its shift change at the first responders. Multiple posts on "mule accounts" don't make a point more valid.Egocanemveresum wrote: »this is a mule account not my main account
Yeah. Because surely everythone who thinks you're acting like a besmirched fool (spoiler: it's a lot of people) are surely just part of some conspiracy against you. We're all secretly just Joy Division. lolEdited by Egocanemveresum on January 5, 2018 5:40PM5 -
Izanagi.Xiiib16_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Egocanemveresum wrote: »Izanagi.Xiiib16_ESO wrote: »Egocanemveresum wrote: »I feel like @Izanagi.Xiiib16_ESO could make a cameo on r/iamverysmart at this point.
I see its shift change at the first responders. Multiple posts on "mule accounts" don't make a point more valid.Egocanemveresum wrote: »this is a mule account not my main account
Yeah. Because surely everythone who thinks you're acting like a besmirched fool (spoiler: it's a lot of people) are surely just part of some conspiracy against you. We're all secretly just Joy Division. lol
You could always just answer some of the points in my post on Joys behalf, or even your own thoughts on them. Perhaps you
could come up with some constructive points of your own if you wish to be involved in the conversation.
Until then all I see is someone crying for attention. Don't worry I'm more than happy to talk to you if you can bring something interesting to the discussion.@Solar_Breeze
NA ~ Izanerys: Dracarys (Videos | Dracast)
EU ~ Izanagi: Roleplay Circle (AOE Rats/ Zerg Squad / Banana Squad)0 -
Egocanemveresum✭✭✭Izanagi.Xiiib16_ESO wrote: »Egocanemveresum wrote: »Izanagi.Xiiib16_ESO wrote: »Egocanemveresum wrote: »I feel like @Izanagi.Xiiib16_ESO could make a cameo on r/iamverysmart at this point.
I see its shift change at the first responders. Multiple posts on "mule accounts" don't make a point more valid.Egocanemveresum wrote: »this is a mule account not my main account
Yeah. Because surely everythone who thinks you're acting like a besmirched fool (spoiler: it's a lot of people) are surely just part of some conspiracy against you. We're all secretly just Joy Division. lol
You could always just answer some of the points in my post on Joys behalf, or even your own thoughts on them. Perhaps you
could come up with some constructive points of your own if you wish to be involved in the conversation.
Until then all I see is someone crying for attention. Don't worry I'm more than happy to talk to you if you can bring something interesting to the discussion.
There is no such thing as responding constructively to an ... argument ... which is primarily designed to be a convoluted ad hom. The only reason you're still here is you refuse to let Joy get the last word. You have consistently insulted him and his intelligence while hilariously denying that you're doing it. You are not worth engaging because you are unwilling or incapable of engaging in rational discussion, judging from this thread.
You may continue making yourself look like a fool. It's apparent to everyone here except for you.9 -
Izanagi.Xiiib16_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Egocanemveresum wrote: »Izanagi.Xiiib16_ESO wrote: »Egocanemveresum wrote: »Izanagi.Xiiib16_ESO wrote: »Egocanemveresum wrote: »I feel like @Izanagi.Xiiib16_ESO could make a cameo on r/iamverysmart at this point.
I see its shift change at the first responders. Multiple posts on "mule accounts" don't make a point more valid.Egocanemveresum wrote: »this is a mule account not my main account
Yeah. Because surely everythone who thinks you're acting like a besmirched fool (spoiler: it's a lot of people) are surely just part of some conspiracy against you. We're all secretly just Joy Division. lol
You could always just answer some of the points in my post on Joys behalf, or even your own thoughts on them. Perhaps you
could come up with some constructive points of your own if you wish to be involved in the conversation.
Until then all I see is someone crying for attention. Don't worry I'm more than happy to talk to you if you can bring something interesting to the discussion.
There is no such thing as responding constructively to an ... argument ... which is primarily designed to be a convoluted ad hom. The only reason you're still here is you refuse to let Joy get the last word. You have consistently insulted him and his intelligence while hilariously denying that you're doing it. You are not worth engaging because you are unwilling or incapable of engaging in rational discussion, judging from this thread.
You may continue making yourself look like a fool. It's apparent to everyone here except for you.
Which about my points do you feel is not rational.
Here they are again:
1)Joy_Division wrote: »You have no comprehension how pejorative and deprecating what you write is. Yet you are so keen to point out how other people insult you.
I pointed it out because you mentioned "how quick we are to insult you" whilst insulting us yourself. I don't believe I've ever said that I personally minded being insulted or using insulting language. Perhaps you should stop misrepresenting me
2)Joy_Division wrote: »"Meanwhile, what you and Rin have against me is directed at me personally. That's another level entirely."
I believe I have shown adequately the insults directed at us by both you and your first responders (I know you love that description :P). Again, if you don't like it don't dish it out.
3)
Every quote of yours has been unedited other than to bold particular sections to highlight a response. I have never "Misquoted" you.Joy_Division wrote: »"deliberately misquote me numerous times."
If what you typed isn't what you think then thats your issue not mine
4)Joy_Division wrote: »"called me a hypocrite on the basis of these wrong assumptions."
See the first paragraph of this post, you admit changing your language when attacking organised groups. The fact that you then later "joined an organised group that evening" doesn't change the fact that when you posted this you didn't have one. Its also evidence that you have calmed down since supposedly now "having a group and MANY INVITES YOU DECLINED".Izanagi.Xiiib16_ESO wrote: »That is what makes you a hypocrite, not the fact necessarily that you once played in them <...> now you no longer have the option you have stepped up your attacks on that style to try and get it removed.
5)
You posted the video as proof of your language towards groups not changing. Why are you so "Incredibly insulted" when we analyse your 'proof' and find it doesn't amount to anything.Joy_Division wrote: »"And then I have to sit here and listen to you and Rin tell me why I made my own video, my motivations behind it, and what I was criticizing."
Should I just post a picture of a cat and say "it proves my argument that you are a hypocrite but don't analyse it because its my picture?
6)Joy_Division wrote: »"How would you like it if I posted in your video threads:
"Hi Brian Wheeler, Eric Wrobel, and Rich Lambert. You see, Rin and Izzy and the rest of Drac claim <...>"
I would love it if you tried to do it
The difference is that I don't come and post a video of mine to try and prove something it doesn't relate to.
7)
You really don't like Monkey pictures do you.Joy_Division wrote: »But then you lecture me about why I made my video and then post a disparaging picture as if I somehow couldn't not comprehend your brilliance.
Actually the picture (of a monkey scratching its head, the height of insult I agree XD) was a direct response to your quote:
"when it's crystal clear to everyone that it's a metaphor and not meant to be taken literally." It was preceded by my comment "I thought that's what we did now on the forum." being a reply to the previous posts from your guild.
8)
I understand now that you consider a disparaging view of your comments insults. Thats why you consider that I have insulted you so much. Thanks for explaining. I disagree with your claim that you made it clear and you have typed previously that your words did not convey your true thoughts and accepted how they can be misconstrued so its actually you in the wrongJoy_Division wrote: »"This false accusation was already put out in this thread and I made it clear that was not how I felt or what I wrote. Knowing this full well, you decided to write it again. This goes beyond insulting and heads toward libelous."
9)You post
but group my thoughts and views with all of Drac's. "You see, Rin and Izzy and the rest of Drac claim"Joy_Division wrote: »"Because it's not my job to moderate Tex. Tex is not me. Tex does not speak for me. If you have an issue with Tex, either take it up with him or contact a ZoS moderater."
There's a word for this.. (its one you don't like)
10) I think this is the funniest denial you insist on repeting. My quote:
you then typeIzanagi.Xiiib16_ESO wrote: »you still ignore your own words and insist that you were insulting tacticsJoy_Division wrote: »Not true. I wrote this in response.
You also refused to answer the "tactics" you were referring to in each of the quotes a-h that I provided. Thanks confirming my view again.Joy_Division wrote: »I can see how you and others may have taken my insults to the tactics you use personally.
11)Joy_Division wrote: »So let's get this straight. You actually read my acknowledgemnt of how what I said was insulting and how it was counterproductive and yet you still wrote that I "still ignore your own words and insist that you were insulting tactics." The words were not ignored and an admission was made.
Again TACTICS is not PLAYERS. See 10.
12)Joy_Division wrote: »This is not a black and white issue, not an either or. ESO has improved with respect to certain things and devolved with others.
I agree its not a black and white issue. but when you blame X and say "its good it was removed" to then say 2 paragraphs later removing "X was a bad thing"
Its just poor consitency.
13)
"preferred fighting ball-groups" vs "I don't want to see them".Joy_Division wrote: »So you are assuming that just because I wanted to fight other guilds that I approved of this meta, thought it was so wonderful for the game, and invalidated my criticism against it?
Can you see the difference. its not a matter of if you "Liked this style" its the fact that your view changed from wanting to fight a group to not wanting to see them. Why do you keep avoiding this point.
14)
Groups have ALWAYS been devastating to those that don't run in them. The current meta is actually HARDER on groups (excluding the introduction of earthgore) because they can be killed so quickly.Joy_Division wrote: »Because this particular tactic is too devastating against those that don't run it.
15)
Feel free to listen to some other guilds talk about how they enjoy playing together.Joy_Division wrote: »"tons of evidence that many players believe that ball-groups and mass PBAoEs are a sore spot on the game
Where are your facts that your stack-on-crown destro-bombing at Ash is so appreciated by the rest of the PvP community? Shall I take some screenshots of DC zone chat to give you some perspective from the other side?"
https://youtu.be/pYyQ8ODTC6U
btw Zone screenshots being given as proof of issues its hilarious.
16)
Notice the difference:Joy_Division wrote: »You still calling people out for using disparaging language? You talk the talk, but don't walk the walk.
its actually a big problem when people use disparaging language referring to either side and bias the discussion.
Vs
Replying to someone off topic.
The quote you linked wasn't related to any mechanics discussion or even the topic.
@Solar_Breeze
NA ~ Izanerys: Dracarys (Videos | Dracast)
EU ~ Izanagi: Roleplay Circle (AOE Rats/ Zerg Squad / Banana Squad)1 -
Joy_Division✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Izanagi.Xiiib16_ESO wrote: »why good positive discussion is important before coming to a conclusion.Izanagi.Xiiib16_ESO wrote: »Joy_Division wrote: »Izanagi.Xiiib16_ESO wrote: »
Feel free to quote my insults towards youIzanagi.Xiiib16_ESO wrote: »Anyone with a full brain understands what @Rin_Senya typed. I guess there is a lack of those left these days judging by this type of response...
...As for the rest of the cheerleader participation it constituted a circle of people patting each other on the back (as usual) and this is why its not worth the time to read it.Izanagi.Xiiib16_ESO wrote: »
This is why its important to consider the whole argument and why good positive discussion is important before coming to a conclusion.
I highlighted your mistake. Still waiting for any constructive reply to my points but avoidance definitely speaks volumes
Here's a link in case you can't find it:
https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/comment/4750137/#Comment_4750137
That's not my mistake.
That was my attempt to acknowledge your perspective, and that's all it is, that what I said could be taken as an insult to some players and thus end an unnecessary point of acrimony in this discussion.
It was, in short, a small step and concession I made as positive discussions entail both parties do this.
And you throw it back into my face as "proof" that someone you were right all along and the rest of us who disagree with you and Rin don't have a full brain and whose participation is not worth reading.
You're not interested in having a positive discussion. You're only interested in trying to prove that somehow, you and Rin are right. Even when your assumptions about my history in the game and me not playing in organized groups was wrong. Even when people point out you're only considering you're point of view.Izanagi.Xiiib16_ESO wrote: »"preferred fighting ball-groups" vs "I don't want to see them".
Can you see the difference. its not a matter of if you "Liked this style" its the fact that your view changed from wanting to fight a group to not wanting to see them. Why do you keep avoiding this point.
Yes, I can! Just because YOU cannot does not automatically mean that your perspective is the irrefutable truth and anyone who doesn't agree with you has less than a half a brain.
I have never liked stack-on-crown mass PBAoE tactics. I don't want to see them. Pretty clear.
However, because the meta in ESO has made it such that these tactics are pretty much the go to way for people who want to compete, then that's what my organized group and others have used.
So, now that I'm in a destro ball-group and there are other destro-ball groups, it's not really that hard to figure out of that the better fights are going to be against that other destro ball-groups rather than farming PuGs or chasing small-man groups.
My view has not changed. I PREFERRED (not synonymous with "want." A preference could be between ostensibly undesirable options, the proverbial lesser of two evils.) fighting ball-groups while in a ball-group because of ESO's meta. It was circumstantial. And let's be clear about something, I did, still do, and always will want to fight a GROUP. You keep disingenuously using that word interchangeably with the specific tactics that I am criticizing. As for what I have always wanted, that's for the ESO devs to re-examine Cyrodiil's mechanics such that organized group tactics go beyond stacking together and employing mass PBAoEs.
I'm not avoiding the point. You just refuse to accept any perspective that does not align with you and Rin's presumptions.Edited by Joy_Division on January 5, 2018 6:08PM4 -
Egocanemveresum✭✭✭@Izanagi.Xiiib16_ESO
First, you accused Joy of "insulting PBAOE ball groups" only since his guild left the game. He clarified that he had always been critical of PBAOE ball groups even though he had and does play with them often. He was critical of PBAOE ball groups even while his guild was still playing. This point is settled. It was a personal grievance you took up against Joy which is clear to everyone here you were simply wrong about. Yet you keep droning on and on.
Second, you accused Joy of being hypocritical because he only started hating on ball groups once his guild left. He again demonstrated that he was critical of ball groups the entire time. There was even a satirical video he made about it which he made quite a long time ago. Thus it is clear to everyone here, except for you, that the personal grievance you took up was something you were simply wrong about. Yet you keep droning on and on.
Third, you completely unironically took issue with Joy allegedly using insulting language, all while you insulted him, THEN insisted that condescendingly calling everyone cheer leaders wasn't actually an insult. They were just interpreting it that way! This is, ironically, the textbook definition of hypocrisy. That means you are a hypocrite.
A spade is a spade, and fool is a fool, and you are a fool. I look forward to your next reply because it's quite clear you compulsively cannot let go of having the last word lol.Edited by Egocanemveresum on January 5, 2018 6:07PM6 -
Ghostbane✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Chris Nolan should take this thread as a movie script. Someone call Hans Zimmer.{★★★★★ · ★★★★★ · ★★ · ★★★★★}350m+ AP PC - EUAddons
AD :: Imported Waffles [37]EP :: Wee ee ee ee ee [16]DC :: Ghostbane's DK [16], Impending Loadscreen [12]PC - NA
AD :: Ghostbane [50], yer ma [43], Sir Humphrey Winterbottom 2.0 [18], robotic baby legs [18]EP :: Wee Mad Arthur [50], avast ye buttcrackz [49], Sir Horace Foghorn [27], Brother Ballbag [24], Scatman John [16]DC :: W T B Waffles [36], Morale Boost [30], W T F Waffles [17], Ghostbanë [15]RIPAD :: Sir Humphrey Winterbottom 1.0 [20]- AP Meter : All your AP needs
- Greyskull : Customisable, colour-coded Damage Meter
- Auto Research Scrolls : Automatic management of crafting research scrolls
- ITTs Donation Bot : Donation tracker for Guilds
- ITTs Roster Bot : Roster management for Guilds
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Izanagi.Xiiib16_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Egocanemveresum wrote: »@Izanagi.Xiiib16_ESO
First, you accused Joy of "insulting PBAOE ball groups" only since his guild left the game. He clarified that he had always been critical of PBAOE ball groups even though he had and does play with them often. He was critical of PBAOE ball groups even while his guild was still playing. This point is settled. It was a personal grievance you took up against Joy which is clear to everyone here you were simply wrong about. Yet you keep droning on and on.
Second, you accused Joy of being hypocritical because he only started hating on ball groups once his guild left. He again demonstrated that he was critical of ball groups the entire time. There was even a satirical video he made about it which he made quite a long time ago. Thus it is clear to everyone here, except for you, that the personal grievance you took up was something you were simply wrong about. Yet you keep droning on and on.
Third, you completely unironically took issue with Joy allegedly using insulting language, all while you insulted him, THEN insisted that condescendingly calling everyone cheer leaders wasn't actually an insult. They were just interpreting it that way! This is, ironically, the textbook definition of hypocrisy. That means you are a hypocrite.
A spade is a spade, and fool is a fool, and you are a fool. I look forward to your next reply because it's quite clear you compulsively cannot let go of having the last word lol.
Its nice that after concluding that you don't wish to engage with such an irrational post that you then try to come up with your own reply. The funniest part is the fact that you insist on calling me a fool whilst insisting that I should let you have the last word.
A good quote to remember is "if you are convinced you are arguing with a fool, first make sure the other person isn't doing the same".
In response to your points (see this is quite a good way of communicating, actually replying to points)
1) Joy SAID he had been critical of ball groups but posted no proof. He then ADMITTED that his language changed after 3 years etc etc. So yes the point was settled in my favour.Joy_Division wrote: »Well I'm not perfect. After three plus years of frustration and also having to put up with you and Rin's snide remarks condemning VE for things your own guild does, yes I insulted the those tactics that we both use..
2) Joy admitted that his language did not represent his feelings.Joy_Division wrote: »I can see how you and others may have taken my insults to the tactics you use personally. Especially since they imply something I do not believe, namely it doesn't take skill to be a good destro-bomb group.
3) You can read point 1) of my previous post:
"1)Joy_Division wrote: »You have no comprehension how pejorative and deprecating what you write is. Yet you are so keen to point out how other people insult you.
I pointed it out because you mentioned "how quick we are to insult you" whilst insulting us yourself. I don't believe I've ever said that I personally minded being insulted or using insulting language. Perhaps you should stop misrepresenting me"
@Solar_Breeze
NA ~ Izanerys: Dracarys (Videos | Dracast)
EU ~ Izanagi: Roleplay Circle (AOE Rats/ Zerg Squad / Banana Squad)0 -
Publius_Scipio✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭@Publius_Scipio your promise for story time is the only reason we're still reading this thread. I hope you intend to deliver.
I know about honor and keep promises. Remember? I chose the COVENANT back in late March/early April of 2014. You on the other hand sold your soul to a lesser conviction, a pact (a pact with lizard people, can't forget that. Yeah you made a pact with the Geico Gecko). And ever since then whether you liked it or not, you have served the will of warlords like Mad King Krotha, Fixate, Crystalized, Tom Hanks (fake), Murder Thumbs, Blinxey and Bishop of Small Biceps, etc etc etc.2 -
Egocanemveresum✭✭✭Its nice that after concluding that you don't wish to engage with such an irrational post that you then try to come up with your own reply. The funniest part is the fact that you insist on calling me a fool whilst insisting that I should let you have the last word.
A good quote to remember is "if you are convinced you are arguing with a fool, first make sure the other person isn't doing the same".
In response to your points (see this is quite a good way of communicating, actually replying to points)
1) Joy SAID he had been critical of ball groups but posted no proof. He then ADMITTED that his language changed after 3 years etc etc. So yes the point was settled in my favour.
What I choose to do and when I choose to do it is entirely up to me. You actually have no say in that matter so it's curious you would try to.
You should slow down and take some time to think. Did I say that I wanted the last word? Or did I say that you insisted on getting the last word?
Joy demonstrated beyond any reasonable doubt that he had always been critical of ball groups. If anything, his tone softened over time. Yet, he remained critical. He was consistent. Not a single point was settled in your favor in this entire thread in spite of your insistence that it did. You are merely droning on and on because you refuse to let someone else get last word in some strange display of adolescent ego.
To be clear:
(1) You claimed Joy only become critical of ball groups at a certain point, namely when his guild left. You borrowed this point from @Rin_Senya, who become unwilling to continue making himself look stupid. Wise.
(2) Joy proved beyond any reasonable doubt that he was critical of ball groups for much longer than that, and even while he was in them.
(3) Thus, your claim that joy only became critical of ball groups at a certain point is incorrect.
You must prove that Joy was, at some point, not critical of ball groups. Then you must prove that his criticism of ball groups only occurred concurrent with his guild leaving and him not having a ball group to play with. If you cannot do these, then please for the love of God just shut up already.Edited by Egocanemveresum on January 5, 2018 6:36PM4 -
Izanagi.Xiiib16_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭
You replied to a couple of my points. Its a start i'll take itJoy_Division wrote: »Izanagi.Xiiib16_ESO wrote: »Joy_Division wrote: »Izanagi.Xiiib16_ESO wrote: »
Feel free to quote my insults towards youIzanagi.Xiiib16_ESO wrote: »Anyone with a full brain understands what @Rin_Senya typed. I guess there is a lack of those left these days judging by this type of response...
...As for the rest of the cheerleader participation it constituted a circle of people patting each other on the back (as usual) and this is why its not worth the time to read it.Izanagi.Xiiib16_ESO wrote: »
This is why its important to consider the whole argument and why good positive discussion is important before coming to a conclusion.
I highlighted your mistake. Still waiting for any constructive reply to my points but avoidance definitely speaks volumes
Here's a link in case you can't find it:
https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/comment/4750137/#Comment_4750137
That's not my mistake.
That was my attempt to acknowledge your perspective, and that's all it is, that what I said could be taken as an insult to some players and thus end an unnecessary point of acrimony in this discussion.
My quote said "quote my insult against YOU" you then quote something that I responded to someone else and directed at your fan squad not you. This is the mistake.
About the full brain comment. It was in reply to someone saying:
My response is in context. You trying to use it out of context is misrepresentation which I believe you aren't a fan of ehDamn just stop. Its blatantly clear to anyone with half a brain that in that video he is showing his disdain for ball groups.
Again we have a reading comprehension issue. I thought we had got over these already with Tactics vs Players.Izanagi.Xiiib16_ESO wrote: »"preferred fighting ball-groups" vs "I don't want to see them".
Can you see the difference. its not a matter of if you "Liked this style" its the fact that your view changed from wanting to fight a group to not wanting to see them. Why do you keep avoiding this point.
was replied withJoy_Division wrote: »I have never liked stack-on-crown mass PBAoE tactics. I don't want to see them. Pretty clear.
I welcome your response to my other points.Edited by Izanagi.Xiiib16_ESO on January 5, 2018 6:37PM@Solar_Breeze
NA ~ Izanerys: Dracarys (Videos | Dracast)
EU ~ Izanagi: Roleplay Circle (AOE Rats/ Zerg Squad / Banana Squad)0 -
Izanagi.Xiiib16_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Egocanemveresum wrote: »Its nice that after concluding that you don't wish to engage with such an irrational post that you then try to come up with your own reply. The funniest part is the fact that you insist on calling me a fool whilst insisting that I should let you have the last word.
A good quote to remember is "if you are convinced you are arguing with a fool, first make sure the other person isn't doing the same".
In response to your points (see this is quite a good way of communicating, actually replying to points)
1) Joy SAID he had been critical of ball groups but posted no proof. He then ADMITTED that his language changed after 3 years etc etc. So yes the point was settled in my favour.
What I choose to do and when I choose to do it is entirely up to me. You actually have no say in that matter so it's curious you would try to.
<...>
You must prove that Joy was, at some point, not critical of ball groups. Then you must prove that his criticism of ball groups only occurred concurrent with his guild leaving and him not having a ball group to play with. If you cannot do these, then please for the love of God just shut up already.
It's curious you think i'm trying to control you whilst you issue requests for my actions.
Additionally I have already proved these points by admission. See my response to your post.
Thanks for playing, you can tag in the next one
Remember my comment:
A good quote to remember is "if you are convinced you are arguing with a fool, first make sure the other person isn't doing the same".Edited by Izanagi.Xiiib16_ESO on January 5, 2018 6:48PM@Solar_Breeze
NA ~ Izanerys: Dracarys (Videos | Dracast)
EU ~ Izanagi: Roleplay Circle (AOE Rats/ Zerg Squad / Banana Squad)1 -
Egocanemveresum✭✭✭Izanagi.Xiiib16_ESO wrote: »Egocanemveresum wrote: »Its nice that after concluding that you don't wish to engage with such an irrational post that you then try to come up with your own reply. The funniest part is the fact that you insist on calling me a fool whilst insisting that I should let you have the last word.
A good quote to remember is "if you are convinced you are arguing with a fool, first make sure the other person isn't doing the same".
In response to your points (see this is quite a good way of communicating, actually replying to points)
1) Joy SAID he had been critical of ball groups but posted no proof. He then ADMITTED that his language changed after 3 years etc etc. So yes the point was settled in my favour.
What I choose to do and when I choose to do it is entirely up to me. You actually have no say in that matter so it's curious you would try to.
<...>
You must prove that Joy was, at some point, not critical of ball groups. Then you must prove that his criticism of ball groups only occurred concurrent with his guild leaving and him not having a ball group to play with. If you cannot do these, then please for the love of God just shut up already.
It's curious you think i'm trying to control you whilst you issue requests for my actions.
Additionally I have already proved these points by admission. See my response to your post.
Thanks for playing, you can tag in the next one
Remember my comment:
A good quote to remember is "if you are convinced you are arguing with a fool, first make sure the other person isn't doing the same".
You really have a way of utterly misrepresenting everything you read. It's like people are writing certain things to you and you comprehend next to nothing of what they write. Regardless, I had a more rational proposition for you which I will now repost.
(1) You claimed Joy only become critical of ball groups at a certain point, namely when his guild left. You borrowed this point from @Rin_Senya, who become unwilling to continue making himself look stupid. Wise.
(2) Joy proved beyond any reasonable doubt that he was critical of ball groups for much longer than that, and even while he was in them.
(3) Thus, your claim that joy only became critical of ball groups at a certain point is incorrect.
You must prove that Joy was, at some point, not critical of ball groups. Then you must prove that his criticism of ball groups only occurred concurrent with his guild leaving and him not having a ball group to play with. If you cannot do these, then please for the love of God just shut up already.0 -
Izanagi.Xiiib16_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Egocanemveresum wrote: »You really have a way of utterly misrepresenting everything you read. It's like people are writing certain things to you and you comprehend next to nothing of what they write. Regardless, I had a more rational proposition for you which I will now repost.
Repetition doesn't make a weak post better. I replied to this already.@Solar_Breeze
NA ~ Izanerys: Dracarys (Videos | Dracast)
EU ~ Izanagi: Roleplay Circle (AOE Rats/ Zerg Squad / Banana Squad)0 -
Morvane✭✭✭✭The Current Thread Needs To Die And Stop Spam In My NotificationsDC Dunmer Sorcerer since 2014
@morvayn54, PC/EU2 -
Egocanemveresum✭✭✭Izanagi.Xiiib16_ESO wrote: »Egocanemveresum wrote: »You really have a way of utterly misrepresenting everything you read. It's like people are writing certain things to you and you comprehend next to nothing of what they write. Regardless, I had a more rational proposition for you which I will now repost.
Repetition doesn't make a weak post better. I replied to this already.
No. You did not. Prove that he was not critical of ball groups. Then prove that it occurred concurrent to his guild leaving. If you cannot, your conclusion is wrong. That's how logic works bucko.
I'll just assume that you can't if you don't.Edited by Egocanemveresum on January 5, 2018 7:06PM2 -
Izanagi.Xiiib16_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Egocanemveresum wrote: »Izanagi.Xiiib16_ESO wrote: »Egocanemveresum wrote: »You really have a way of utterly misrepresenting everything you read. It's like people are writing certain things to you and you comprehend next to nothing of what they write. Regardless, I had a more rational proposition for you which I will now repost.
Repetition doesn't make a weak post better. I replied to this already.
No. You did not. Prove that he was not critical of ball groups. Then prove that it occurred concurrent to his guild leaving. If you cannot, your conclusion is wrong.
Unfortunately you have again make a mistake in your conclusion. As I made clear in my previous posts (which I'm sure you have read before coming to your summary)@Solar_Breeze
NA ~ Izanerys: Dracarys (Videos | Dracast)
EU ~ Izanagi: Roleplay Circle (AOE Rats/ Zerg Squad / Banana Squad)0 -
Egocanemveresum✭✭✭Izanagi.Xiiib16_ESO wrote: »Egocanemveresum wrote: »Izanagi.Xiiib16_ESO wrote: »Egocanemveresum wrote: »You really have a way of utterly misrepresenting everything you read. It's like people are writing certain things to you and you comprehend next to nothing of what they write. Regardless, I had a more rational proposition for you which I will now repost.
Repetition doesn't make a weak post better. I replied to this already.
No. You did not. Prove that he was not critical of ball groups. Then prove that it occurred concurrent to his guild leaving. If you cannot, your conclusion is wrong.
Unfortunately you have again make a mistake in your conclusion. As I made clear in my previous posts (which I'm sure you have read before coming to your summary)
I haven't made a claim regarding Joy. It is YOUR conclusion that requires evidence. I have read your posts and none of them cite any of Joy's words as being non-critical or supportive of PBAOE ball groups nor were they timed around when his guild left, which I am assuming is fairly recent. You assert over and over that he was using "insulting language" only because his guild left without any real proof other than your point blank assertion. An unsupported, point blank assertion is not rational and proves nothing. Furthermore, a video was posted and Joy's post history was dissected demonstrating that he was always critical of ball groups even while he participated in them. That does not constitute evidence for your point now nor did it then. Your conclusion's premises are either wrong or unproven. I.e. you're full of shite calling in Joy a hypocrite.
I don't think you know how logic works. YOU made a claim about joy. YOU must support it. If you have such undeniable evidence, e.g. Joy's own words, copy/pasting them in a response to this shouldn't be very hard at all considering how much posting you and I have been doing already.
Prove it or shush about it. It's fairly simple.Edited by Egocanemveresum on January 5, 2018 7:46PM2 -
Izanagi.Xiiib16_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Egocanemveresum wrote: »Izanagi.Xiiib16_ESO wrote: »Egocanemveresum wrote: »Izanagi.Xiiib16_ESO wrote: »Egocanemveresum wrote: »You really have a way of utterly misrepresenting everything you read. It's like people are writing certain things to you and you comprehend next to nothing of what they write. Regardless, I had a more rational proposition for you which I will now repost.
Repetition doesn't make a weak post better. I replied to this already.
No. You did not. Prove that he was not critical of ball groups. Then prove that it occurred concurrent to his guild leaving. If you cannot, your conclusion is wrong.
Unfortunately you have again make a mistake in your conclusion. As I made clear in my previous posts (which I'm sure you have read before coming to your summary)
I haven't made a claim regarding Joy. It is YOUR conclusion that requires evidence. I have read your posts and none of them cite any of Joy's words as being non-critical or supportive of PBAOE ball groups nor were they timed around when his guild left, which I am assuming is fairly recent. You assert over and over that he was using "insulting language" only because his guild left without any real proof other than your point blank assertion. An unsupported, point blank assertion is not rational and proves nothing. Furthermore, a video was posted and Joy's post history was dissected demonstrating that he was always critical of ball groups even while he participated in them. That does not constitute evidence for your point now nor did it then. Your conclusion's premises are either wrong or unproven. I.e. you're full of shite calling in Joy a hypocrite.
I don't think you know how logic works. YOU made a claim about joy. YOU must support it. If you have such undeniable evidence, e.g. Joy's own words, copy/pasting them in a response to this shouldn't be very hard at all considering how much posting you and I have been doing already.
Prove it or shush about it. It's fairly simple.
my point was proved and has been admitted. Good try though.
Try something original please Edited by Izanagi.Xiiib16_ESO on January 5, 2018 8:47PM@Solar_Breeze
NA ~ Izanerys: Dracarys (Videos | Dracast)
EU ~ Izanagi: Roleplay Circle (AOE Rats/ Zerg Squad / Banana Squad)0