Kicked from dungeons for using sword and board as dps.

SoLooney

if youre doing solo content, play whatever the hell you like, but if youre gonna be doing content with other people, thats really not gonna cut it

you picked a non optimized race for a mag dk, an orc. 2nd, you use a sword and board, nothing in that skillline is gonna give you good dps, its all about defense and damage mitigation. 3rd, youre using bad sets for dps cept for sun
and youre using stamina skills as a magicka user....

they were right to kick you, no one wants bad dps in vet dungeons and no one wants to carry bad dps. either they go or i go

Storymaster

Using a sword is one thing, but if you're not Hack Saw Jim Duggan, don't bring a board to a dungeon.

Minyassa

People are crap. Hopefully luck of the draw won't keep putting you in with that sort of POS. We need a button to push that will reach a hand out of the keyboard and slap people for being stuck-up prisses like that.

Stinkyremy

Merlin13KAGL wrote: »

Stinkyremy wrote: »

6mil dummy
Who the f has time for that.
Sorry but standing hitting a static target for a few minutes to satisfy inner autismo or to prove you are good enough to run vcoa is not my idea of fun.

Anyone with 5 minutes, at 20k dps. It shows more than just your damage, btw. It shows you can sustain, as well.

heck i can run the dungeon solo even with this build as it is now, though last boss does hit like a truck i would need DKs deflect
I ran through vicp with this build today.

Then post some screenshots of the character and the achievements. I have difficulty believing you're wrecking the Fire Maw with this build without some serious assistance.

i appreciate your insight into the actual loss of dps for not running double desto, but it's not like I am running VHR with this char, i was only doing random dungeons to level undaunted so i can finish the build.
if I was unable to kill enemies and letting the team down I understand but this crap is just simple prejudice against sword and shield chars who aren't tank, and there is a lot of them, mainly duelers and pvp players but even they have to run dungeons sometimes.

See, the problem is, there is more to Synergy than just pressing (the PS4 equivalent of) 'X.' There are other factors that help your group synergize in other ways and those things are likely missing with your current setup.

You pretty much have three choices:

• Prove your build is as competent as you say it is
• Stop complaining when people don't take it on faith and you get kicked.
• Run with friends/guildies that have seen you in action and are okay with your setup.

Pick one.

read the thread before [snip]posting please

[Edited to remove profanity]

WrathOfInnos

While it's not the top choice for DPS, many seem to be forgetting that sword and shield is one of the 2 options to get 12 gear slots for a 5-5-2 setup. The shield can be used to complete a set of Julianos for example, and is therefore worth 300 spell damage. That being said, sword and shield is slightly weaker than dual wield for base spell damage and lacks a 5% damage bonus from twin blade and blunt passive, or all the useful destruction staff passives. I would guess that it is a 10% DPS loss at most, which is why I estimated that a 33k build with dual wield or Destro build could still hit 30k while using sword and shield.

The more I think about it, the more I'm leaning toward burning spellweave or mechanical acuity as sets to complete the 5 piece bonus on your front bar weapons (replacing pelinals). A maelstrom destruction staff on the back bar would be ideal if you have access to it, and the MA or BS proc will stay even while on your staff bar. I might have to try this setup with dual wield on my MagDK.

Edit: Orc is also a slight DPS loss over Dunmer for DK, approx 10%. Maybe 25-27k is a reasonable DPS target if you like being an Orc (if not there's always race change in the crown store).

Stinkyremy

SoLooney wrote: »

if youre doing solo content, play whatever the hell you like, but if youre gonna be doing content with other people, thats really not gonna cut it

you picked a non optimized race for a mag dk, an orc. 2nd, you use a sword and board, nothing in that skillline is gonna give you good dps, its all about defense and damage mitigation. 3rd, youre using bad sets for dps cept for sun
and youre using stamina skills as a magicka user....

they were right to kick you, no one wants bad dps in vet dungeons and no one wants to carry bad dps. either they go or i go

read the thread, i'm not a bad dps nor is the build, it was just people assuming a dps with sword and shield cant dps, despite me clearing all the mobs fast they kicked me as soon as I finished with a mob I virtually did on my own

Stinkyremy

WrathOfInnos wrote: »

While it's not the top choice for DPS, many seem to be forgetting that sword and shield is one of the 2 options to get 12 gear slots for a 5-5-2 setup. The shield can be used to complete a set of Julianos for example, and is therefore worth 300 spell damage. That being said, sword and shield is slightly weaker than dual wield for base spell damage and lacks a 5% damage bonus from twin blade and blunt passive, or all the useful destruction staff passives. I would guess that it is a 10% DPS loss at most, which is why I estimated that a 33k build with dual wield or Destro build could still hit 30k while using sword and shield.

The more I think about it, the more I'm leaning toward burning spellweave or mechanical acuity as sets to complete the 5 piece bonus on your front bar weapons (replacing pelinals). A maelstrom destruction staff on the back bar would be ideal if you have access to it, and the MA or BS proc will stay even while on your staff bar. I might have to try this setup with dual wield on my MagDK.

why is it such an hard concept to grasp that I ACTUALLY WANT TO USE PELINAL APTITUUDE WITH AN ORC USING A SWORD AND SHIELD
i'm not lacking in skill, i'm not lacking in damage, i'm not lacking in intelligence and I do my role perfectly fine.

i don't need advice on some meta set or a set you read some random internet celebrity told you is the best. i thought about how I would like to play, I made the build, i enjoy playing it, and I play it well.
wtf is the problem with that.

idk

It's sad how average players need their hands held but stronger players and hennce kick out those they think will be an issue.

At that, play as you want still exists and meta builds have been out since early in. Certainly one should not expect any choice they made would be a solid build for any role.

S&B has never been a good go to weapon choice for PvE dps. At least not since the bashomatic 5000 us od was nerfed.

WrathOfInnos

Nevermind, I was trying to help you not get kicked. Any of my recommendations were pretty far from Meta, and would keep your build's flavor while increasing DPS. Using sword and shield does not inherently make you a bad player. Being unwilling to try new things, test your build, or consider ways to improve, on the other hand...

VaranisArano

I won't kick a DPS who's using a sword and shield. But if I see you using Puncture/Ransack/Pierce Armor and you keep pulling taunt away from my tank I'm going to ask you if you realize that you are taunting the boss.

After that warning, if you taunt it, you get to tank it. Otherwise, we're fine.

Aeorath

Astrid_V wrote: »

Stinkyremy wrote: »

I remember the "play as you want" slogan as marketing for the game

Stopped reading here

Of course OP can still play 'way he wants' which in a random group is the easy way to get kicked out of a dungeon. Unless he finds a nice guild with even nicer people who will accept there are quite a few different ways to play the game.

But oh 'the elites'....

Stinkyremy

VaranisArano wrote: »

I won't kick a DPS who's using a sword and shield. But if I see you using Puncture/Ransack/Pierce Armor and you keep pulling taunt away from my tank I'm going to ask you if you realize that you are taunting the boss.

After that warning, if you taunt it, you get to tank it. Otherwise, we're fine.

obviously, I am a tank main, I know how to tank and what is good/bad for the tank too, I'm not gonna cancel th etanks taunt and take the boss, I wouldn't evenI slot the skill. Though I did tank arx today and ncos with this char just by swapping heroic strike for pierce armour I tanked the dungeon until a tank joined for last boss.....and died constantly because he was low cp and looks like he didn't know mechs

lynog85

Stinkyremy wrote: »

lynog85 wrote: »

Id kick you too. Nomatter whether you was from pc or not. Wtf are you doing playing a orc mag dk anyway?

Because I want to, I thought it was implicit in the thread, I want to run a build that i want to play with, an orc DK with a sword and shield doing flame damage because that is the way i want to play. The pelinal aptitude allows me to use the sword and shield as a mag char with no damage drop off, and also works with the orcs melee passives.
Orcs move fast as f and with all the aoe and target attack I have going on I am chewing threw mobs running around like a maniac.

I'm not trying to play a meta, or be the world wide champ for highest dps, I am just trying to play a build/playstyle that I want to play.

You know if I was incompitent and not doing any damage I would understand that people would complain, but I am actually doing the opposite.
Think of any stam DK you have seen, have you ever seen then run in mobs at sanic speeds slamming venomous claw on every one of the mob with massive aoe dots constantly renewing all without taking little to no damage

Nomatter what way you wanna dress it up bro. Youre damage is massively lower than it coukd be. People know this and hence youre being booted.

GrigorijMalahevich

Do the dungeon solo if your style is sufficient to be DPS.

When proc sets could crit, my stamsorc with tremor, viper and knight something set with s&b and vMA bow back bar could easily tank and do around 18k dps...

Vaoh

Stinkyremy wrote: »

SoLooney wrote: »

if youre doing solo content, play whatever the hell you like, but if youre gonna be doing content with other people, thats really not gonna cut it

you picked a non optimized race for a mag dk, an orc. 2nd, you use a sword and board, nothing in that skillline is gonna give you good dps, its all about defense and damage mitigation. 3rd, youre using bad sets for dps cept for sun
and youre using stamina skills as a magicka user....

they were right to kick you, no one wants bad dps in vet dungeons and no one wants to carry bad dps. either they go or i go

read the thread, i'm not a bad dps nor is the build, it was just people assuming a dps with sword and shield cant dps, despite me clearing all the mobs fast they kicked me as soon as I finished with a mob I virtually did on my own

Stinkyremy wrote: »

WrathOfInnos wrote: »

While it's not the top choice for DPS, many seem to be forgetting that sword and shield is one of the 2 options to get 12 gear slots for a 5-5-2 setup. The shield can be used to complete a set of Julianos for example, and is therefore worth 300 spell damage. That being said, sword and shield is slightly weaker than dual wield for base spell damage and lacks a 5% damage bonus from twin blade and blunt passive, or all the useful destruction staff passives. I would guess that it is a 10% DPS loss at most, which is why I estimated that a 33k build with dual wield or Destro build could still hit 30k while using sword and shield.

The more I think about it, the more I'm leaning toward burning spellweave or mechanical acuity as sets to complete the 5 piece bonus on your front bar weapons (replacing pelinals). A maelstrom destruction staff on the back bar would be ideal if you have access to it, and the MA or BS proc will stay even while on your staff bar. I might have to try this setup with dual wield on my MagDK.

why is it such an hard concept to grasp that I ACTUALLY WANT TO USE PELINAL APTITUUDE WITH AN ORC USING A SWORD AND SHIELD
i'm not lacking in skill, i'm not lacking in damage, i'm not lacking in intelligence and I do my role perfectly fine.

i don't need advice on some meta set or a set you read some random internet celebrity told you is the best. i thought about how I would like to play, I made the build, i enjoy playing it, and I play it well.
wtf is the problem with that.

@Stinkyremy I think I’ve figured out the issue here... there are two things working against you.

The first is that One Handed and Shield is a tanking weapon. No exceptions (at least in PvE). Feel free to use whatever you want solo, but never try to tell others they have to accept you in a Veteran group when you are purposely building in a way that you know is extremely unorthadox/ineffective for your role.
If you use a Hybrid 1H/S then expect to explain why you’re doing that as a Damage Dealer. If you are kicked from a Normal Dungeon I agree with you that those ppl are unreasonable, but you should definitively expect to get kicked from Vet dungeons. I could tell my group members I love my fists and run around casting skills/punching stuff, but would not be angry at them for kicking me even if I do well. If you disagree or don’t like this, group with friends. A group often won’t want to carry players who fail to perform their role effectively enough or who do it in a ridiculous way. It’s like a DPS queuing as a tank and saying their damage shields make them a tank - you are almost asking them to kick you on your current setup.

The second issue here is far worse tbh. You strike me as a player who is actually quite “bad” at the game by the standards of a DPS who would be taken into trials. You’ve already said you don’t care which is fine - trials don’t interest everyone. The issue is that despite this, you are likely one of the biggest elitists I have ever heard of before. An elitist who is also not even good at their role. You have this idea that anything which could possibly prove your DPS to be low (video clips, screenshots, DPS tests, etc) is completely worthless and others who use them to any effect are dumb. You on the other hand are the opposite. You tell us you’re intelligent, have a good build, play your role perfectly, and are basically above everyone else. You kill every mob while your group is almost useless until they kick you. Target dummies are for people’s egos and nothing else.... but you brag elsewhere you melt mobs easy and solo dungeons.

Now I don’t know if this elitism is just something I’m getting from your posts on the Forums or if you’re actually like that in-game. If you behave that way *no one* will want to group with you. I kick people with attitudes asap from dungeons no matter their DPS/build/whatever.

I think that if you really want to play this build then you shouldn’t have to change it. Just don’t take it into Veteran dungeons. If you want to run Veteran dungeons you are much better off running the tried and true DPS sets and setups (not 1H/S).

NordSwordnBoard

@Stinkremy

The analogy is simple, you don't need to know much about any sport - change football team to track team if that helps you comprehend it. Just understand that unorthodox methods need to proven, not taken on faith. 3 other people are affected by the way you play, if you don't respect that, don't expect respect in return.

When you claim:

Stinkyremy wrote: »

i was doing mega dps in a coa pledge

Backing up that claim with anything other than actual dps test numbers makes people suspicious, especially when you say those methods of measurement are poor indicators.

Saying you can melt a mob quick or complete content with three (or two) other people doesn't prove much other than you have burst damage and you can do the content together. Soloing a dungeon can be done on a tank with 5-10k dps, it just takes some time.

I wouldn't boot you, and shame on those who prejudge somebody's que away. I can usually tell before the first boss if its worth stating in the group. Crappy experiences are the PUG life though, don't have lofty expectations from PUGs. Many of PUGs are ignorant, bad, and sometimes both.

You can choose to adapt to the PUG, or have the PUG adapt to you. One of these results in less kicks and more completes.

Merlin13KAGL

Stinkyremy wrote: »

Merlin13KAGL wrote: »

Stinkyremy wrote: »

6mil dummy
Who the f has time for that.
Sorry but standing hitting a static target for a few minutes to satisfy inner autismo or to prove you are good enough to run vcoa is not my idea of fun.

Anyone with 5 minutes, at 20k dps. It shows more than just your damage, btw. It shows you can sustain, as well.

heck i can run the dungeon solo even with this build as it is now, though last boss does hit like a truck i would need DKs deflect
I ran through vicp with this build today.

Then post some screenshots of the character and the achievements. I have difficulty believing you're wrecking the Fire Maw with this build without some serious assistance.

i appreciate your insight into the actual loss of dps for not running double desto, but it's not like I am running VHR with this char, i was only doing random dungeons to level undaunted so i can finish the build.
if I was unable to kill enemies and letting the team down I understand but this crap is just simple prejudice against sword and shield chars who aren't tank, and there is a lot of them, mainly duelers and pvp players but even they have to run dungeons sometimes.

See, the problem is, there is more to Synergy than just pressing (the PS4 equivalent of) 'X.' There are other factors that help your group synergize in other ways and those things are likely missing with your current setup.

You pretty much have three choices:

• Prove your build is as competent as you say it is
• Stop complaining when people don't take it on faith and you get kicked.
• Run with friends/guildies that have seen you in action and are okay with your setup.

Pick one.

read the thread before [snip]posting please

First, I, nor anyone else trying to help you here, am having an issue getting kicked.

As has been explained by several different people, if you insist on running an non-standard build, expect to have to back it up. You don't have to prove anything to anyone here. That's fine.

In your own mind, clearly you're badass, and maybe you are. Problem is it's up to you to prove you are. It's not up to others to prove you aren't.

So, like I said before, you can provide some proof, either here or every time you get into a group that is not familiar with you. Your call.

You made the thread, which has been read in its entirely, btw, but you refuse to take any advice. I'm leaning towards that as the reason you may be getting kicked more so than your gear choice ever will be. I think you're confusing "Play as I want" with "Play as I want effectively."

Best of luck. I suspect you're gonna need it.

[Edited for quote]

visionality

@Stinkremy

I'm hard pressed to believe your story. I'm running with random groups regularily (good practice for my healer), and I have NEVER EVER seen anybody being kicked (or even voted to kick) for his GEAR. Low cp yes, as people tend to see this as an indicator for experience, but never the equipment. Most people do not even look at the gear of their group mates until they feel something is off. That something being dps ofc when talking about DDs.

Next: You claim you run around so fast that nobody can see you switching bars and cancel animations while you do extreme damage. Lets face the facts: if I were member in a group where one player is moving around extremely fast and every NPC in his vicinity dies (this player being a DD), I would never think of kicking him. Even if I could NOT see how he does his "insane damage" (which I always can, maybe you should invest in a better video card?). I cannot imagine anybody elso doing it.

So ... Could your idea of high ("insane") dps simply be a bit different?

Magdalina

Alright, uh...where do we start on this...first, there is absolutely no benefit for using s&b as a dps. I mean, you can choose to use what you want obviously. Just like you can choose to run around the game absolutely naked, no one can forbid you. But do not try to justify it as "viable dps way that short sighted people are failing to see". You're losing spell/weapon damage. You're losing passives. You're losing actual dps-y skills. You are gaining an ability to get 5+5+2 combo but if that's what you're after, you should use DW, it'd also provide higher spelldamage than even a destro staff and a useful passive. S&b offers you NOTHING except some extra defence - which makes it viable "dps" off-weapon in PvP, mind you, and still provides 0 reason for it in group PvE where you're supposed to be running with tank and healer.

You CAN play how you want. But if you want to do vet content, you need to actually know how your way of play fairs against the game's rules. If you absolutely want to s&b as a dps, then do so, but do so understanding that you are consciously making a choice to be significantly less effective in order to keep playing your way. There is no "they just don't understand how good it is", you are choosing to be less effective. And do understand that other players did not agree to play your way, and they might prefer someone more effective in their group.

Next, did I misread it or are you using Pelinal's to bring your WEAPON damage on par with your SPELL damage? That's...how to put it...that's a set bonus wasted in terms of effectiveness. Only thing making Pelinal remotely(very remotely) viable is that you can stack weapon damage much higher than spelldamage, use this set and get 4-5k spelldamage. Otherwise you're missing out on spelldamage due to not using a full spelldamage set AND you're missing out on weapon damage because you still don't have anywhere near the weapondamage of a half decent stambuild. In terms of ESO maths, 1/2(spelldamage)+1/2(wep damage)=/=1(full spell/wep dmg potential). Once again, you are free to choose a set of your liking or even no set at all - but while doing so, be aware this is a (very) suboptimal choice in terms of effectiveness.

And last, you started a discussion in which you're claiming to be a great player and dps, despite the logic of your choices speaking against you, but you're refusing to provide any proof. Target dummies are no measure of how good a player is, but they do give some measure of how much dps they can be capable of. A good dps will give at least a decent score on a dummy whereas a bad dps won't be able to do so. Find at least 3 mil dummy(representative enough, and quicker than the 6 mil one) and show us a parse. If you're right, it'll be a great parse and we all will have to take our words back and welcome the next s&b dps that shows up in our group. Furthermore, you'll be able to rub it in the face of everyone asking about your s&b - "yo dude, I do 25k dps sustained with this!"

Thunderknuckles

Beardimus wrote: »

The proof SHOULD be in the pudding. If you can thump out the DPS and don't hold the group up it shouldn't be a problem. If you wipe 5 times on first boss and your DPS is 10k then that's an issue for some groups (in a rush etc)

PvE 'vet' crowd are very fickle tho and judge fast, before you have chance. It only gets worst with the trials community.

However as @anitajoneb17_ESO says stop pugging and play with mates / guildies maybe only pug a normal for XP.

Or come PvP were theres no judgement or DPS checks or snobbery on builds and play ur own merit

Have to agree with all of this. I have one toon that's not meta, a stamDK orc that I have in heavy armor (right now) and using DW and 2H. I love this guy. If, however, I take him into a pugged vet dungeon I stand a very good chance of being vote kicked very, very rapidly. ha ha So...I just kick around on him for fun. It's too bad, really, that you can't actually make a toon based on a class and skills that YOU like and still be able to do end game content.

I say that, but...like you guys pointed out, if you get with friends who don't care then go for it. I do actually use my stam DK with some friends, even in vet dungeons, and they have no problems with it. Pug with him? No way.

Stinkyremy

To those who replied, I actually have just done coa vet with the char and we all just ran through it, we did vicp after, it's not a matter of me not being able to dps adequately, it was a matter of people seeing i had a shield and kicking me.
The guy (well obviously vote kick) who kicked me form coa earlier whispered me after with "dps with shield I don't think so", like he has a clue about my damage. it wasn't as if i was there spending 5 minutes killing a scamp I was just running through crushing mobs as any dps does to get the pledge over quick.

After testing this build out I am considering to scrap the pelenals aptitude and crafting seducer in it's place so that i have more sustain, probably get rid of heroic strike and use pure DK skills other than elemental blockade. I found that I am messing up rotations with this build atm and am wasting a lot of magika on aoe dots where the situation changes, like tank has to roll out of aoe dam ect, icp was a drain on resources too, seducer will help better with that.

dodgehopper_ESO

SydneyGrey wrote: »

You aren't going to get the best DPS using an orc magicka build with sword and shield. Even if it was a stamina orc build with s&s, you still won't get the best DPS. For one thing, melee weapons like swords scale off of stamina, so being a magicka build will hurt your damage output with weapons.
I made the exact same noob mistake that you did ... I made a magicka DK character with sword and shield when I was new to the game, except mine was a Dark Elf. I later switched her to using a flame staff, and was very happy I changed it.

He did say he was using Pelinals and that he realizes Julianos is better for a magic build. I'm not sure you're teaching him something he doesn't know. Pelinals 5 pc takes the highest of either WD or SD and makes it the number for both, in case you didn't know.

Vet dungeons you can make anything work practically as long as you can make it work. Trials are harder. I suspect he can make it work. That being said Orc isn't the best race to run around as a mage with, neither is Redguard or Khajiit. Personally, I think the racial component needs major reconsideration in this game, but that has been my contention for years. The racial balance is far worse than what it was when this game started. Given the way the game operates now I still recommend and call for them to make all racial bonuses be a static # that is additive and not multiplicative. Racial bonus should add last to all calculations, and not be part of any multipliers. That is my opinion and I am sticking to it. This would make them useful bonuses but also not work against creativity on the part of players.

Nvm I should have kept reading the build. I thought you were using Pelinals to be dominantly stamina with a couple of magic moves on an orc. Yeah its not your best bet. Wouldn't have been anyway but if you paid a lot in upgrading and such it could be workable. Why not just make a Stam DK? Those do great as is, and they're up close and personal. Grab DW or 2H or something. You'll have fun with it.

Morgul667

I always give chances to people I see in dungeons and try to help, but I have never seen a sword and shield DPS actually pull some DPS

Either your build is great (cause your S&B is just here for the cool look) and you can show the DPS either it isn't and you wasting everybody's time (in a vet dungeon).

kyle.wilson

For a while I was S-B/ Destro on my Mag DK.
Before Morrowind I was doing 30-40k dps in trials, so even though I would hear grief for it. It usually didn't last long. I could keep up DPS with them, and I would rarely die.
I did this, because I stopped grinding for a BSW necklace, as I already had a BSW Sharp Sword.

Morgul667

kyle.wilson wrote: »

For a while I was S-B/ Destro on my Mag DK.
Before Morrowind I was doing 30-40k dps in trials, so even though I would hear grief for it. It usually didn't last long. I could keep up DPS with them, and I would rarely die.
I did this, because I stopped grinding for a BSW necklace, as I already had a BSW Sharp Sword.

Could be. But 99% of S&B from group finder , pull less than 6k DPS

kyle.wilson

Morgul667 wrote: »

kyle.wilson wrote: »

For a while I was S-B/ Destro on my Mag DK.
Before Morrowind I was doing 30-40k dps in trials, so even though I would hear grief for it. It usually didn't last long. I could keep up DPS with them, and I would rarely die.
I did this, because I stopped grinding for a BSW necklace, as I already had a BSW Sharp Sword.

Could be. But 99% of S&B from group finder , pull less than 6k DPS

I also really used it on only back bar to proc BSW, and maintain 5 piece juli all around with 2 scoria.

Vapirko

I don’t see the point of this thread. You CAN play however you want but so can everyone else, and if others only want to play with people who run meta builds then that’s their choice. So if you want to run an off build that isn’t going to maximize dps and take a little longer then just find a group who doesn’t care but don’t expect everyone to want to play that way. But the bottom line is, if you want those groups to not kick you then prove that you have the numbers and say so otherwise just stear clear and move on.

Stinkyremy

dodgehopper_ESO wrote: »

SydneyGrey wrote: »

You aren't going to get the best DPS using an orc magicka build with sword and shield. Even if it was a stamina orc build with s&s, you still won't get the best DPS. For one thing, melee weapons like swords scale off of stamina, so being a magicka build will hurt your damage output with weapons.
I made the exact same noob mistake that you did ... I made a magicka DK character with sword and shield when I was new to the game, except mine was a Dark Elf. I later switched her to using a flame staff, and was very happy I changed it.

He did say he was using Pelinals and that he realizes Julianos is better for a magic build. I'm not sure you're teaching him something he doesn't know. Pelinals 5 pc takes the highest of either WD or SD and makes it the number for both, in case you didn't know.

Vet dungeons you can make anything work practically as long as you can make it work. Trials are harder. I suspect he can make it work. That being said Orc isn't the best race to run around as a mage with, neither is Redguard or Khajiit. Personally, I think the racial component needs major reconsideration in this game, but that has been my contention for years. The racial balance is far worse than what it was when this game started. Given the way the game operates now I still recommend and call for them to make all racial bonuses be a static # that is additive and not multiplicative. Racial bonus should add last to all calculations, and not be part of any multipliers. That is my opinion and I am sticking to it. This would make them useful bonuses but also not work against creativity on the part of players.

Thank you, I already know I am not doing optimal dps with this char, that is why i premised the thread with that i am an original beta player, and the marketing for this game was that we can play any race, weapon and class that we like and be able to do any role with our desired race, weapon and class. Now we have this sort of elitism that if we don't play a meta we are a bad player.
There was also the marketing that "there will never be pay gates" but that got scrapped the next dlc after craglorn.
I am enjoying the build I have atm and that was the reason I made it, to play the game for fun, i'm not looking on vet trias or being a god tier PvP player with an alt i just made for fun.

Stinkyremy

Morgul667 wrote: »

I always give chances to people I see in dungeons and try to help, but I have never seen a sword and shield DPS actually pull some DPS

Either your build is great (cause your S&B is just here for the cool look) and you can show the DPS either it isn't and you wasting everybody's time (in a vet dungeon).

my dps is pretty good, i'm 64 in magika, have two tri glyphs on infused chest and legs, the rest magika, and small pieces divines with apprentice mundus. valkyn and 5 piece sun set, all gold apart fron the two sun rings.
i'm only using heroic strike in the s&s skill like for ult gen, which DK relies upon their utl, every other skill apart from wall of elements is DK class skills.
Basically everything I am doing is flae damage. i'm using pelenals specifically because I want to use sword and shield to be in melee range using DK target attacks without the sword being there for show hitting like a soggy piece of paper.

Curragraigue

Seems a bit of a waste to wear Perennial just for Heroic Slash. Wouldn't you get more damage going dual wield re passives and skills if you want to run a hybrid