Why does everybody hate or avoid vet white gold tower
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PlagueSD✭✭✭✭✭
✭#1 reason:
Pinion fight. You HAVE to be on voice comms for that to coordinate who's taking pinion and who's got portals. You don't have time to stop and type.
In regular, 2 people can do pinion the whole fight.Edited by PlagueSD on October 9, 2017 11:17PM3 -
Magdalina✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Because is a waste of time if players dont have 500CP+
Absurd. People have done this back when we all had like 200-300 cp at most(coincidentally that was also BEFORE last couple of WGT nerfs so back when it was even harder). Hell people have speedrun no death hm'd and/or 3 manned it back then too. I think two of my friends have 2 manned it back at ~300 cp as well. Your success or failure there has nothing to do with extra few hundred cp but mostly with your ability to follow mechanics.
The answer is simple, people don't like WGT because it requires effort. Fulfilling your role, paying attention, following mechanics and communicating with your teammates - all the things ESO pugs do NOT like doing.
Coordinated groups don't mind it because it's really easy by now. Personally I've stopped enjoying it with coordinated groups a long time ago, this is yawn festival for the most part and I like my dungeons fun. If I vet WGT, it's almost exclusively pugs lately
3 -
Malacthulhu✭✭✭✭bloodthirstyvampire wrote: »I queued for 4 hours yesterday, asked my guild no luck massive guild too and even area chat in every major city, 50 players (not literally) in every direction people avoid it like the plague
I have not had that issue. Usually people ignore the longer runs like icp etc.Xbox One Na0 -
Thunderknuckles✭✭✭✭Peekachu99 wrote: »People can’t grasp the pinion mechanics and/ or tanks aren’t capable of solo holding it till she’s blue-flame. Oh, and some half-wit usually misses like all the portals when it’s their turn and hasn’t spoken up when asked: “Is anyone new?”
This! Ha ha ha It's so awesome when you ask several times, "Anyone not familiar with this boss?" and one or more don't answer. Then when you're on the third wipe you say, "Okay, you have to...blah blah blah" and the quiet player in the group finally says something like, "How am I supposed to know!? It's my 1st t1m3 in hir!"
Edited for typo.Edited by Thunderknuckles on October 10, 2017 4:11AM0 -
newtinmpls✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭disintegr8 wrote: »3. Those who are here for fun and see no need to get frustrated pugging a pointless dungeon.
I game either with my sweetie, or with two other friends. Only 1 of us plays enough (and has a logical/tactical enough mind) to both get BiS stuff (mostly) and to really explore and understand all the weird mechanics.
I get that for people who have "done" the dungeon forty-zillion times, it's easy.
Those parts of the game I have done forty-zillion times (Kenarthi's Roost, the first 3 Mage's Guide quest areas and for some weird reason Spindleclutch 1) are easy for me.
But much of the higher, weirder mechanics I don't easily "get" and too much of the "advice" given in forums is more abuse and superiority rather than helpful in any way.
If the "learning process" is equivalent to hazing...I have no desire to bother. Yeah, I'll try any given dungeon with friends on occasion, and maybe someday parts will "click".
Till then there are plenty of other things I enjoyTenesi Faryon of Telvanni - Dunmer Sorceress who deliberately sought sacrifice into Cold Harbor to rescue her beloved.
Hisa Ni Caemaire - Altmer Sorceress, member of the Order Draconis and Adept of the House of Dibella.
Broken Branch Toothmaul - goblin (for my goblin characters, I use either orsimer or bosmer templates) Templar, member of the Order Draconis and persistently unskilled pickpocket
Mol gro Durga - Orsimer Socerer/Battlemage who died the first time when the Nibenay Valley chapterhouse of the Order Draconis was destroyed, then went back to Cold Harbor to rescue his second/partner who was still captive. He overestimated his resistance to the hopelessness of Oblivion, about to give up, and looked up to see the golden glow of atherius surrounding a beautiful young woman who extended her hand to him and said "I can help you". He carried Fianna Kingsley out of Cold Harbor on his shoulder. He carried Alvard Stower under one arm. He also irritated the Prophet who had intended the portal for only Mol and Lyris.***Order Draconis - well c'mon there has to be some explanation for all those dragon tattoos.
House of Dibella - If you have ever seen or read "Memoirs of a Geisha" that's just the beginning...
Nibenay Valley Chapterhouse - Where now stands only desolate ground and a dolmen there once was a thriving community supporting one of the major chapterhouses of the Order Draconis0 -
newtinmpls✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭The answer is simple, people don't like WGT because it requires effort. Fulfilling your role, paying attention, following mechanics and communicating with your teammates - all the things ESO pugs do NOT like doing.
I think that you will find that many ESO Pugs will do well, when encouraged, warned and educated as if they were intelligent, but lacking data and plans. Oh - and experience. So given someone relatively new, each complex fight may take 2-3 run-throughs.
When what they generally get is abuse, "get gud" and insta-kicks... well why both playing with unkind folks? It's not worth it.Tenesi Faryon of Telvanni - Dunmer Sorceress who deliberately sought sacrifice into Cold Harbor to rescue her beloved.
Hisa Ni Caemaire - Altmer Sorceress, member of the Order Draconis and Adept of the House of Dibella.
Broken Branch Toothmaul - goblin (for my goblin characters, I use either orsimer or bosmer templates) Templar, member of the Order Draconis and persistently unskilled pickpocket
Mol gro Durga - Orsimer Socerer/Battlemage who died the first time when the Nibenay Valley chapterhouse of the Order Draconis was destroyed, then went back to Cold Harbor to rescue his second/partner who was still captive. He overestimated his resistance to the hopelessness of Oblivion, about to give up, and looked up to see the golden glow of atherius surrounding a beautiful young woman who extended her hand to him and said "I can help you". He carried Fianna Kingsley out of Cold Harbor on his shoulder. He carried Alvard Stower under one arm. He also irritated the Prophet who had intended the portal for only Mol and Lyris.***Order Draconis - well c'mon there has to be some explanation for all those dragon tattoos.
House of Dibella - If you have ever seen or read "Memoirs of a Geisha" that's just the beginning...
Nibenay Valley Chapterhouse - Where now stands only desolate ground and a dolmen there once was a thriving community supporting one of the major chapterhouses of the Order Draconis1 -
newtinmpls✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭Here is my question.
How many of you have been wanting to do WGT, and then gone in zone chat and offered to patiently teach it?
Maybe it wouldn't work...I'd imagine it would depend on if anyone was interested, or luck of the draw.
But have you ever tried that?Tenesi Faryon of Telvanni - Dunmer Sorceress who deliberately sought sacrifice into Cold Harbor to rescue her beloved.
Hisa Ni Caemaire - Altmer Sorceress, member of the Order Draconis and Adept of the House of Dibella.
Broken Branch Toothmaul - goblin (for my goblin characters, I use either orsimer or bosmer templates) Templar, member of the Order Draconis and persistently unskilled pickpocket
Mol gro Durga - Orsimer Socerer/Battlemage who died the first time when the Nibenay Valley chapterhouse of the Order Draconis was destroyed, then went back to Cold Harbor to rescue his second/partner who was still captive. He overestimated his resistance to the hopelessness of Oblivion, about to give up, and looked up to see the golden glow of atherius surrounding a beautiful young woman who extended her hand to him and said "I can help you". He carried Fianna Kingsley out of Cold Harbor on his shoulder. He carried Alvard Stower under one arm. He also irritated the Prophet who had intended the portal for only Mol and Lyris.***Order Draconis - well c'mon there has to be some explanation for all those dragon tattoos.
House of Dibella - If you have ever seen or read "Memoirs of a Geisha" that's just the beginning...
Nibenay Valley Chapterhouse - Where now stands only desolate ground and a dolmen there once was a thriving community supporting one of the major chapterhouses of the Order Draconis0 -
Jeremy✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Kneighbors wrote: »paulsimonps wrote: »SquareSausage wrote: »Peekachu99 wrote: »or tanks aren’t capable of solo holding it till she’s blue-flame.
Sorry, I'm vamp.
being a vamp is probably not the best choice for a tank....
I did wgt yesterday on normal ( i know not as hard, don't state the obvious ) as a lvl 13 tank with a lvl 12 dps, lvl 14 healer and lvl 22 dps. It was actually fun because everyone was understanding and willing to learn. If you go into a vwgt and happen not to have done it on normal ( because it is damn near impossible to get sometimes as a dps ) and even MENTION you havent done it, you get kicked, harassed, insulted, etc . Imo its not the people that havent done it, or who aren't cp 660 that are the problem, it is these super elitst people that expect EVRYONE to have 35k + dps and have a super optimized build and expect everyone to be capable of speed running everything. That is the cancer of this game. Elitism.
being vamp is probably the best choice for a tank....
The extra bit of damage a Tank takes from vampire fire vulnerability is next to nothing. Proper Tanks take very little damage, but to be able to do that strat properly you need to have high DPS in your group or else you are leaving the Tank out to dry(or get roasted more like). Some strong self heals on the tank and a watchful healer does not hurt though. A healer must be able to keep healing even if they have portals, and with the change that there will always be 2 people having portals that should be even easier to do. Sadly most healers fail in this.
I have never seen one of these proper tanks that take very little damage, especially on that veteran planar inhibitor fight. On the contrary - they always seem to take massive damage and require almost a constant stream of healing.
As far as Vampire goes... I believe it is important to make a distinction between a player just starting off and then one later on in his or her career. Because unless you have a lot of CP or gear to mitigate the fire damage penalty it can have deadly consequences - especially in a place like White Gold Tower.
Look up the information about Heat Stroke debuff. When tank holds agro whole red phase the debuff ticks for 4k+ damage every second for 30 seconds while the blue phase lasts. It's possible to adjust your build for that specific boss by reallocating CP but it is simply not reasonable to do so. Tank sharpens out his build for hardest content, not for one specific boss who deals only magicka damage. That's why it is important to make exchange on the pinion. But if you go with maxed out team it is possible to kill the boss even before she is reaching blue phase. In this case there's no reason to exchange the pinion. The debuff becomes a problem after the red phase, not during.
Unfortunately most groups I end up with don't bother with exchanging the pinion whether they are maxed out or not - which means the tank is going to be literally melting before my eyes. Adding to this misery is the fact everyone is running around like a chicken without its head making this easily one of the more annoying fights.
Molag Kena (or what ever her name is) - while not an easy fight - is a lot more enjoyable. It's a fun challenging fight instead of an annoying episode of frustration built around some cheesy mechanic.Edited by Jeremy on October 10, 2017 7:03AM0 -
Jeremy✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭LadyNalcarya wrote: »Kneighbors wrote: »paulsimonps wrote: »SquareSausage wrote: »Peekachu99 wrote: »or tanks aren’t capable of solo holding it till she’s blue-flame.
Sorry, I'm vamp.
being a vamp is probably not the best choice for a tank....
I did wgt yesterday on normal ( i know not as hard, don't state the obvious ) as a lvl 13 tank with a lvl 12 dps, lvl 14 healer and lvl 22 dps. It was actually fun because everyone was understanding and willing to learn. If you go into a vwgt and happen not to have done it on normal ( because it is damn near impossible to get sometimes as a dps ) and even MENTION you havent done it, you get kicked, harassed, insulted, etc . Imo its not the people that havent done it, or who aren't cp 660 that are the problem, it is these super elitst people that expect EVRYONE to have 35k + dps and have a super optimized build and expect everyone to be capable of speed running everything. That is the cancer of this game. Elitism.
being vamp is probably the best choice for a tank....
The extra bit of damage a Tank takes from vampire fire vulnerability is next to nothing. Proper Tanks take very little damage, but to be able to do that strat properly you need to have high DPS in your group or else you are leaving the Tank out to dry(or get roasted more like). Some strong self heals on the tank and a watchful healer does not hurt though. A healer must be able to keep healing even if they have portals, and with the change that there will always be 2 people having portals that should be even easier to do. Sadly most healers fail in this.
I have never seen one of these proper tanks that take very little damage, especially on that veteran planar inhibitor fight. On the contrary - they always seem to take massive damage and require almost a constant stream of healing.
As far as Vampire goes... I believe it is important to make a distinction between a player just starting off and then one later on in his or her career. Because unless you have a lot of CP or gear to mitigate the fire damage penalty it can have deadly consequences - especially in a place like White Gold Tower.
Look up the information about Heat Stroke debuff. When tank holds agro whole red phase the debuff ticks for 4k+ damage every second for 30 seconds while the blue phase lasts. It's possible to adjust your build for that specific boss by reallocating CP but it is simply not reasonable to do so. Tank sharpens out his build for hardest content, not for one specific boss who deals only magicka damage. That's why it is important to make exchange on the pinion. But if you go with maxed out team it is possible to kill the boss even before she is reaching blue phase. In this case there's no reason to exchange the pinion. The debuff becomes a problem after the red phase, not during.
The strategy when tank is the only one holding boss' aggro only works for those "maxed teams" anyway. For this tactic, the group must have enough dps to kill the boss before she reaches blue flame phase, thats the point.
Trying to burn the boss when theres obviusly not enough dps only leads to being rekt by damage over time and ogrims. The problem is, many pug players overestimate their dps and refuse to do this fight in a safe way (closing portals and swapping pinion), trying to burn the boss and making it much more difficult than its supposed to be.
P.S. Fire damage is very common in all pve content, so yeah, a good tank should be able to deal with it. Not to mention that putting cps into elemental defender is important for any role, even if you're not a vampire.
It may be important for any role - but for a vampire it's pretty much required unless you want to end up a corpse.Edited by Jeremy on October 10, 2017 7:02AM0 -
Pele✭✭✭✭✭Because it requires everyone to work well together and be effective in their role. vWGT is one of those dungeons where you can't afford to have any deadweight.0 -
greylox✭✭✭✭✭Planar inhibitor just plain sucks, how they could have such a good boss fight with Kena and such a horrendously bad one with pointless mechanics on inhibitor I don't know.
I thought I'd try and pug it this weekend gone and normal is obviously a walk in the park but vet was painful. Even with 2 people on portals we still had adds and every single tank ran with the boss and died super quick.
In the end I just slotted streak to get away from her blue phase and ended up finishing her solo which was easier.PC EU
House of the Black Lotus
*{Smokes-in-the-Shade }* (Mag pet Sorc Argonian, prolific thief, willing participant of the dark arts, gardener of exotic...herbs)
{Lugdum The Mechanist} (Hybrid Orc Templar, collector of ancient Ayleid smoking pipes)
{Rantoul} (Dark Elf Magknight, likes an ale between boss fights, has been known to offer daedric princes out in a fist fight)
{Red, The Wanderer} (Bosmer stam sorc and hunter extraordinaire)
{Shoots-For-Stars} (Argonian Mag pet Sorc Ice mage Healer)
*{Jinny the spark }* (Sassy Imperial Stamplar)
{Crezzi the Drifter} (Magblade khajiit burglar, available for questionable operations)
{Grif the Despised} (StamKnight Tank Nord, Eastmarch Master Drinker and spinner of tall yarns)
{Geraldine Stone-Heart} (High Elf MagSorc Ice Tank, Mystic, practitioner of the ancient arts)
*{Anawinn}* (Stam pet Ward Redguard, Mother to a bear and an unruly Hunger,Librarian, field medic and natures fist)
{*}Mains
{ CP 900+ }
Caretaker of Battle Island (Grand Topal), the holiday destination for the discerning warrior
Residing in Stay-Moist Mansion-Shadowfen - The Smoking Den (as of 6th feb 2017)1 -
newtinmpls✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭Because it requires everyone to work well together and be effective in their role. vWGT is one of those dungeons where you can't afford to have any deadweight.
Aaannnd apparently understand the mechanics. Which don't appear to be all that intuitive.
Anyone good at teaching it?
Tenesi Faryon of Telvanni - Dunmer Sorceress who deliberately sought sacrifice into Cold Harbor to rescue her beloved.
Hisa Ni Caemaire - Altmer Sorceress, member of the Order Draconis and Adept of the House of Dibella.
Broken Branch Toothmaul - goblin (for my goblin characters, I use either orsimer or bosmer templates) Templar, member of the Order Draconis and persistently unskilled pickpocket
Mol gro Durga - Orsimer Socerer/Battlemage who died the first time when the Nibenay Valley chapterhouse of the Order Draconis was destroyed, then went back to Cold Harbor to rescue his second/partner who was still captive. He overestimated his resistance to the hopelessness of Oblivion, about to give up, and looked up to see the golden glow of atherius surrounding a beautiful young woman who extended her hand to him and said "I can help you". He carried Fianna Kingsley out of Cold Harbor on his shoulder. He carried Alvard Stower under one arm. He also irritated the Prophet who had intended the portal for only Mol and Lyris.***Order Draconis - well c'mon there has to be some explanation for all those dragon tattoos.
House of Dibella - If you have ever seen or read "Memoirs of a Geisha" that's just the beginning...
Nibenay Valley Chapterhouse - Where now stands only desolate ground and a dolmen there once was a thriving community supporting one of the major chapterhouses of the Order Draconis0 -
Apherius✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭I avoid this dungeon because this one is well to easy ... it's what we can call " pity " for the boss inside , when i enter in i'm like " hey healer ! can you heal the boss or do something please ? "
0 -
Teridaxus✭✭✭✭✭
✭Also another thing about the fire atro boss is the sheer amount of disinformations floating around which is why i still don't fully understand the pinion and phase mechanics and very often you see how two people fight each other what the right approach is.0 -
Kneighbors✭✭✭✭✭Kneighbors wrote: »paulsimonps wrote: »SquareSausage wrote: »Peekachu99 wrote: »or tanks aren’t capable of solo holding it till she’s blue-flame.
Sorry, I'm vamp.
being a vamp is probably not the best choice for a tank....
I did wgt yesterday on normal ( i know not as hard, don't state the obvious ) as a lvl 13 tank with a lvl 12 dps, lvl 14 healer and lvl 22 dps. It was actually fun because everyone was understanding and willing to learn. If you go into a vwgt and happen not to have done it on normal ( because it is damn near impossible to get sometimes as a dps ) and even MENTION you havent done it, you get kicked, harassed, insulted, etc . Imo its not the people that havent done it, or who aren't cp 660 that are the problem, it is these super elitst people that expect EVRYONE to have 35k + dps and have a super optimized build and expect everyone to be capable of speed running everything. That is the cancer of this game. Elitism.
being vamp is probably the best choice for a tank....
The extra bit of damage a Tank takes from vampire fire vulnerability is next to nothing. Proper Tanks take very little damage, but to be able to do that strat properly you need to have high DPS in your group or else you are leaving the Tank out to dry(or get roasted more like). Some strong self heals on the tank and a watchful healer does not hurt though. A healer must be able to keep healing even if they have portals, and with the change that there will always be 2 people having portals that should be even easier to do. Sadly most healers fail in this.
I have never seen one of these proper tanks that take very little damage, especially on that veteran planar inhibitor fight. On the contrary - they always seem to take massive damage and require almost a constant stream of healing.
As far as Vampire goes... I believe it is important to make a distinction between a player just starting off and then one later on in his or her career. Because unless you have a lot of CP or gear to mitigate the fire damage penalty it can have deadly consequences - especially in a place like White Gold Tower.
Look up the information about Heat Stroke debuff. When tank holds agro whole red phase the debuff ticks for 4k+ damage every second for 30 seconds while the blue phase lasts. It's possible to adjust your build for that specific boss by reallocating CP but it is simply not reasonable to do so. Tank sharpens out his build for hardest content, not for one specific boss who deals only magicka damage. That's why it is important to make exchange on the pinion. But if you go with maxed out team it is possible to kill the boss even before she is reaching blue phase. In this case there's no reason to exchange the pinion. The debuff becomes a problem after the red phase, not during.
Unfortunately most groups I end up with don't bother with exchanging the pinion whether they are maxed out or not - which means the tank is going to be literally melting before my eyes. Adding to this misery is the fact everyone is running around like a chicken without its head making this easily one of the more annoying fights.
Molag Kena (or what ever her name is) - while not an easy fight - is a lot more enjoyable. It's a fun challenging fight instead of an annoying episode of frustration built around some cheesy mechanic.
You can see it even in this thread. Many replying people who think they know it well got no idea about Heat Stroke debuff. While this debuff and blue flame are the only things that can kill a tank and make the fight really go bad.
Most people think, that the primary mechanic of boss is portals, while if you look by importance this will be the only 3rd priority. Blue flame is first, Heat Stroke second, and only then the portals.1 -
Kneighbors✭✭✭✭✭LadyNalcarya wrote: »Kneighbors wrote: »paulsimonps wrote: »SquareSausage wrote: »Peekachu99 wrote: »or tanks aren’t capable of solo holding it till she’s blue-flame.
Sorry, I'm vamp.
being a vamp is probably not the best choice for a tank....
I did wgt yesterday on normal ( i know not as hard, don't state the obvious ) as a lvl 13 tank with a lvl 12 dps, lvl 14 healer and lvl 22 dps. It was actually fun because everyone was understanding and willing to learn. If you go into a vwgt and happen not to have done it on normal ( because it is damn near impossible to get sometimes as a dps ) and even MENTION you havent done it, you get kicked, harassed, insulted, etc . Imo its not the people that havent done it, or who aren't cp 660 that are the problem, it is these super elitst people that expect EVRYONE to have 35k + dps and have a super optimized build and expect everyone to be capable of speed running everything. That is the cancer of this game. Elitism.
being vamp is probably the best choice for a tank....
The extra bit of damage a Tank takes from vampire fire vulnerability is next to nothing. Proper Tanks take very little damage, but to be able to do that strat properly you need to have high DPS in your group or else you are leaving the Tank out to dry(or get roasted more like). Some strong self heals on the tank and a watchful healer does not hurt though. A healer must be able to keep healing even if they have portals, and with the change that there will always be 2 people having portals that should be even easier to do. Sadly most healers fail in this.
I have never seen one of these proper tanks that take very little damage, especially on that veteran planar inhibitor fight. On the contrary - they always seem to take massive damage and require almost a constant stream of healing.
As far as Vampire goes... I believe it is important to make a distinction between a player just starting off and then one later on in his or her career. Because unless you have a lot of CP or gear to mitigate the fire damage penalty it can have deadly consequences - especially in a place like White Gold Tower.
Look up the information about Heat Stroke debuff. When tank holds agro whole red phase the debuff ticks for 4k+ damage every second for 30 seconds while the blue phase lasts. It's possible to adjust your build for that specific boss by reallocating CP but it is simply not reasonable to do so. Tank sharpens out his build for hardest content, not for one specific boss who deals only magicka damage. That's why it is important to make exchange on the pinion. But if you go with maxed out team it is possible to kill the boss even before she is reaching blue phase. In this case there's no reason to exchange the pinion. The debuff becomes a problem after the red phase, not during.
The strategy when tank is the only one holding boss' aggro only works for those "maxed teams" anyway. For this tactic, the group must have enough dps to kill the boss before she reaches blue flame phase, thats the point.
Trying to burn the boss when theres obviusly not enough dps only leads to being rekt by damage over time and ogrims. The problem is, many pug players overestimate their dps and refuse to do this fight in a safe way (closing portals and swapping pinion), trying to burn the boss and making it much more difficult than its supposed to be.
P.S. Fire damage is very common in all pve content, so yeah, a good tank should be able to deal with it. Not to mention that putting cps into elemental defender is important for any role, even if you're not a vampire.
Nothing to do with information you give. You won't even know how to alter your character to survive that boss on your own as a tank. It requires much more understanding in damage mitigation than "putting cps into elemental defender".0 -
newtinmpls✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭Okay, can somebody give a step by step?Tenesi Faryon of Telvanni - Dunmer Sorceress who deliberately sought sacrifice into Cold Harbor to rescue her beloved.
Hisa Ni Caemaire - Altmer Sorceress, member of the Order Draconis and Adept of the House of Dibella.
Broken Branch Toothmaul - goblin (for my goblin characters, I use either orsimer or bosmer templates) Templar, member of the Order Draconis and persistently unskilled pickpocket
Mol gro Durga - Orsimer Socerer/Battlemage who died the first time when the Nibenay Valley chapterhouse of the Order Draconis was destroyed, then went back to Cold Harbor to rescue his second/partner who was still captive. He overestimated his resistance to the hopelessness of Oblivion, about to give up, and looked up to see the golden glow of atherius surrounding a beautiful young woman who extended her hand to him and said "I can help you". He carried Fianna Kingsley out of Cold Harbor on his shoulder. He carried Alvard Stower under one arm. He also irritated the Prophet who had intended the portal for only Mol and Lyris.***Order Draconis - well c'mon there has to be some explanation for all those dragon tattoos.
House of Dibella - If you have ever seen or read "Memoirs of a Geisha" that's just the beginning...
Nibenay Valley Chapterhouse - Where now stands only desolate ground and a dolmen there once was a thriving community supporting one of the major chapterhouses of the Order Draconis0 -
LadyNalcarya✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭#1 reason:
Pinion fight. You HAVE to be on voice comms for that to coordinate who's taking pinion and who's got portals. You don't have time to stop and type.
In regular, 2 people can do pinion the whole fight.
No, you dont have to use voice chat, you just need to pay attention.
The person who's on the portal duty has a grey-ish halo around their head.Because is a waste of time if players dont have 500CP+
Absurd. People have done this back when we all had like 200-300 cp at most(coincidentally that was also BEFORE last couple of WGT nerfs so back when it was even harder). Hell people have speedrun no death hm'd and/or 3 manned it back then too. I think two of my friends have 2 manned it back at ~300 cp as well. Your success or failure there has nothing to do with extra few hundred cp but mostly with your ability to follow mechanics.
Not just that... Cp160 gear was super expensive (even the basic Willpower rings costed 200k-ish) and many BiS set didnt exist (Julianos, for example, was introduced in Orsinium patch, a few months after IC release). Not to mention stuff like OP stamina dps and destro ulti.LadyNalcarya wrote: »Kneighbors wrote: »paulsimonps wrote: »SquareSausage wrote: »Peekachu99 wrote: »or tanks aren’t capable of solo holding it till she’s blue-flame.
Sorry, I'm vamp.
being a vamp is probably not the best choice for a tank....
I did wgt yesterday on normal ( i know not as hard, don't state the obvious ) as a lvl 13 tank with a lvl 12 dps, lvl 14 healer and lvl 22 dps. It was actually fun because everyone was understanding and willing to learn. If you go into a vwgt and happen not to have done it on normal ( because it is damn near impossible to get sometimes as a dps ) and even MENTION you havent done it, you get kicked, harassed, insulted, etc . Imo its not the people that havent done it, or who aren't cp 660 that are the problem, it is these super elitst people that expect EVRYONE to have 35k + dps and have a super optimized build and expect everyone to be capable of speed running everything. That is the cancer of this game. Elitism.
being vamp is probably the best choice for a tank....
The extra bit of damage a Tank takes from vampire fire vulnerability is next to nothing. Proper Tanks take very little damage, but to be able to do that strat properly you need to have high DPS in your group or else you are leaving the Tank out to dry(or get roasted more like). Some strong self heals on the tank and a watchful healer does not hurt though. A healer must be able to keep healing even if they have portals, and with the change that there will always be 2 people having portals that should be even easier to do. Sadly most healers fail in this.
I have never seen one of these proper tanks that take very little damage, especially on that veteran planar inhibitor fight. On the contrary - they always seem to take massive damage and require almost a constant stream of healing.
As far as Vampire goes... I believe it is important to make a distinction between a player just starting off and then one later on in his or her career. Because unless you have a lot of CP or gear to mitigate the fire damage penalty it can have deadly consequences - especially in a place like White Gold Tower.
Look up the information about Heat Stroke debuff. When tank holds agro whole red phase the debuff ticks for 4k+ damage every second for 30 seconds while the blue phase lasts. It's possible to adjust your build for that specific boss by reallocating CP but it is simply not reasonable to do so. Tank sharpens out his build for hardest content, not for one specific boss who deals only magicka damage. That's why it is important to make exchange on the pinion. But if you go with maxed out team it is possible to kill the boss even before she is reaching blue phase. In this case there's no reason to exchange the pinion. The debuff becomes a problem after the red phase, not during.
The strategy when tank is the only one holding boss' aggro only works for those "maxed teams" anyway. For this tactic, the group must have enough dps to kill the boss before she reaches blue flame phase, thats the point.
Trying to burn the boss when theres obviusly not enough dps only leads to being rekt by damage over time and ogrims. The problem is, many pug players overestimate their dps and refuse to do this fight in a safe way (closing portals and swapping pinion), trying to burn the boss and making it much more difficult than its supposed to be.
P.S. Fire damage is very common in all pve content, so yeah, a good tank should be able to deal with it. Not to mention that putting cps into elemental defender is important for any role, even if you're not a vampire.
It may be important for any role - but for a vampire it's pretty much required unless you want to end up a corpse.
Well, vampirism is supposed to be a tradeoff, right? You're getting extra recovery and damage mitigation (while at low hp), but your health regen is greatly reduced and you take more fire damage. If fire damage becomes an issue in certain fights, you can just drink some Double Bloody Mara to reduce vampirism stage. At stage 2, you'll only take 10% extra fire damage instead of 25%. For certain fights you can even reduce it to stage one, which disables the passives AND fire debuff.
P.S. I still cant imagine a viable tank build without elemental defenses, unless its something like a shield-based magsorc with inner fire.Dro-m'Athra Destroyer | Divayth Fyr's Coadjutor | Voice of Reason
PC/EU0 -
Jade1986✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭paulsimonps wrote: »SquareSausage wrote: »Peekachu99 wrote: »or tanks aren’t capable of solo holding it till she’s blue-flame.
Sorry, I'm vamp.
being a vamp is probably not the best choice for a tank....
I did wgt yesterday on normal ( i know not as hard, don't state the obvious ) as a lvl 13 tank with a lvl 12 dps, lvl 14 healer and lvl 22 dps. It was actually fun because everyone was understanding and willing to learn. If you go into a vwgt and happen not to have done it on normal ( because it is damn near impossible to get sometimes as a dps ) and even MENTION you havent done it, you get kicked, harassed, insulted, etc . Imo its not the people that havent done it, or who aren't cp 660 that are the problem, it is these super elitst people that expect EVRYONE to have 35k + dps and have a super optimized build and expect everyone to be capable of speed running everything. That is the cancer of this game. Elitism.
being vamp is probably the best choice for a tank....
The extra bit of damage a Tank takes from vampire fire vulnerability is next to nothing. Proper Tanks take very little damage, but to be able to do that strat properly you need to have high DPS in your group or else you are leaving the Tank out to dry(or get roasted more like). Some strong self heals on the tank and a watchful healer does not hurt though. A healer must be able to keep healing even if they have portals, and with the change that there will always be 2 people having portals that should be even easier to do. Sadly most healers fail in this.
I noticed a lot o fhealers dont slot enough healing abilities....strangly enough xD.0 -
Jade1986✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭IwakuraLain42 wrote: »
That takes a whole 5 minutes to explain. Our group everyone in it never did wgt, yet we got through it because we all sat back, relaxed and discussed the tactics, which we figured out ourselves after dying twice. Honestly, people are too caught up in doing things light speed in this game.0 -
Jade1986✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭LadyNalcarya wrote: »People just dont pug dlc dungeons. I wouldnt, at least (unless I already finished 2 other pledges with that group and it was above average). Average group wont have enough dps to ignore mechanics and there's too many snowflakes that get mad if you try to explain them how to kill Planar Inhibitor.SquareSausage wrote: »Peekachu99 wrote: »or tanks aren’t capable of solo holding it till she’s blue-flame.
Sorry, I'm vamp.
Many tanks are vamps these days...
The magicka regen is just too good to pass.
Its still possible to tank anything as a vamp (even vHoF).
I dont think I have ever seen someone get mad if someone explains the tactics to them. Just don't be an ass about it. And you shouldn't be able to ignore mechanics, lol. Usually it is everyone is in too much of a rush to explain anything, and boot anyone that doesn't have it down to a T. Again, cancer of this game is elitism, not curiosity and a willingness to learn. There are some people that are allergic to learning, that is true. Had some, must of been 5 year olds, in my group before and they just were un teachable.0 -
LadyNalcarya✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭LadyNalcarya wrote: »People just dont pug dlc dungeons. I wouldnt, at least (unless I already finished 2 other pledges with that group and it was above average). Average group wont have enough dps to ignore mechanics and there's too many snowflakes that get mad if you try to explain them how to kill Planar Inhibitor.SquareSausage wrote: »Peekachu99 wrote: »or tanks aren’t capable of solo holding it till she’s blue-flame.
Sorry, I'm vamp.
Many tanks are vamps these days... The magicka regen is just too good to pass.
Its still possible to tank anything as a vamp (even vHoF).
I dont think I have ever seen someone get mad if someone explains the tactics to them. Just don't be an ass about it. And you shouldn't be able to ignore mechanics, lol. Usually it is everyone is in too much of a rush to explain anything, and boot anyone that doesn't have it down to a T. Again, cancer of this game is elitism, not curiosity and a willingness to learn. There are some people that are allergic to learning, that is true. Had some, must of been 5 year olds, in my group before and they just were un teachable.
Curiosity and willingness to learn are awesome, but they seem to be very rare.
And I wouldnt call the people who just blindly rush "elitist", theyre usually just bad players who expect others to carry them, thats why they expect everyone to know the tactic. Those players are not willing to follow the mechanic or take any advices (even if you're super polite), they just try to burn the boss and get angry if they cant... And of course, its never their fault, and trying to follow the mechanic is never an option.
Those are the types I was talking about.
And yeah, being able to skip mechanics isnt intended, it just happens because IC is an old dlc and it was designed back when all those OP sets and builds didnt exist.Dro-m'Athra Destroyer | Divayth Fyr's Coadjutor | Voice of Reason
PC/EU1 -
tommalmm✭✭✭To be honest, recently I had a very good stroke and was getting decent teams for vWGT via finder (I'm playing all mag/stam DD, tank and healer). Even in a seemingly worst team I've had (35k total DPS on Inhibitor I was tanking to blue) we were able to get through blue phase with healer exchanging pinion with me and trying to close as many portals as possible. Quite often we were able to kill it before blue (~70k dps) or just after turning blue, sacrificing tank (~60kdps). I hate this fight on DD though as many tanks insist on running with the attro all over the place in red phase, and even if DDs would be able to burn it otherwise, they can't because they have to reapply ground dots all the time. I like tanking it, though (it's fun, as long as at least one other person knows the mechanics).
BTW. I'm on PC/EU and late in the night I often meet very experienced low level (~cp200) players in vWGT that can storm through it (it's morning in Australia and evening in America, so either of these two I guess?). So vWGT doesn't really require cp300/400+ as others suggest. If 200cp with 500ms ping can do that, everyone can.
But if I'm getting it on a third toon in a row for a random, I (in)politely decline and leave group while cursing at ZOS XD.
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Kneighbors✭✭✭✭✭You can pass it on any CP if you follow all the mechanics.
1) Exchange pinion. Close pinion every time it's open, keep boss in place in red phase. This way you mitigate Heat Stroke debuff.
2) Always close portals, 1-2 mobs isn't a problem.
3) During blue phase player with pinion runs away from boss, 1 player closes portals, 2 players wait in the middle next to the pinion, take it as soon as it is open and run away.
4) Repeat.
I'm 100% positive it can be done with 4 cp10 players.1 -
EvilCroc✭✭✭✭✭
✭I do not hate it. It is an nice dungeon with interesting design and good mechanics.
I just do not believe in people and their ability to deal with Planar Inhibitor.1 -
pkuronen✭✭✭I 100% don't sign this. Instead I really dislike Ruins of Mazzatun. The mechanics are awful and the whole feeling is like a junk/backyard fight. It is not one or two times I left group because of this dungeon in random finder. Sorry for that.0
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Jeremy✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Planar inhibitor just plain sucks, how they could have such a good boss fight with Kena and such a horrendously bad one with pointless mechanics on inhibitor I don't know.
I thought I'd try and pug it this weekend gone and normal is obviously a walk in the park but vet was painful. Even with 2 people on portals we still had adds and every single tank ran with the boss and died super quick.
In the end I just slotted streak to get away from her blue phase and ended up finishing her solo which was easier.
Agreed. That one fight often ruins what would otherwise be an enjoyable dungeon.0 -
Jeremy✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭I 100% don't sign this. Instead I really dislike Ruins of Mazzatun. The mechanics are awful and the whole feeling is like a junk/backyard fight. It is not one or two times I left group because of this dungeon in random finder. Sorry for that.
Unless you attempt the hard mode at the end (which is sadistic) I've always considered this one of the easier DLC dungeons.
Some of the mechanics are annoying and that turtle hits hard. But I usually manage this one in most of my randoms. It might be because there is less fire damage or something though. Because those fire breathing Daedra in White Gold Tower (not even a boss mind you) was melting my HP faster than anything in the Ruins of Mazzatun did.Edited by Jeremy on October 10, 2017 10:14PM0 -
Nestor✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭In my experience, vWGT needs to be done with a group that can talk to each other. Not a Pug with Text Chat. If I don't have that, I don't go. Fortunately, I don't use the Dungeon Finder for Vet dungeons anymore (4 vCoA II in a row followed by a mix of vWGT, vICP, vMazzutan and vCoS will do that to you)Enjoy the game, life is what you really want to be worried about.
PakKat "Everything was going well, until I died"
Gary Gravestink "I am glad you died, I needed the help"0
