Why does everybody hate or avoid vet white gold tower

Kihamai

I personally love this dungeon, but the most frustrating issue is newbies not understanding the mechanics of the Planar Inhibitor fight. Or when there's someone else in the group insisting the tank holds until blue phase, and the group doesn't have the DPS or possibly even heals to do that lol.

Mureel

Kneighbors wrote: »

Peekachu99 wrote: »

People can’t grasp the pinion mechanics and/ or tanks aren’t capable of solo holding it till she’s blue-flame. Oh, and some half-wit usually misses like all the portals when it’s their turn and hasn’t spoken up when asked: “Is anyone new?”

Your "exp player" disguise is broken. You don't know all the Planar Inhibitor debuffs. If tank is holding her whole time till blue-flame his problem start after the blue flame. He will struggle to survive over 4k per seconds Heat Stroke debuff without healer support.

He can actually make it without healer, but.. seriously, do you think I'm going to reallocate CP, change skills and gear to survive that alone as a tank only to be able to watch low DPSers performing their "devastation 15k dps" rotation on the boss while I'm working hard to fight the debuff?

Just for your info, I realize you never seen that happen, but if you go with maxed out team you get Inhibitor down before she reaches blue flame state. With a team like that I have no problem to keep the agro of the boss alone and use resources and gear for team buffs and not survival.

I have a tank build which can survive also the blue phase of the boss alone, but it's in no way optimal build for that dungeon (or any other).

@Peekachu99 @BlanketFort Read more on the mechanics of the boss. The biggest problem there are the people who think they know it and they actually don't know it.

Hiya! other than slow-ish groups, this is not a problem. But then we can explain the thing in that case.

Mureel

Calysis wrote: »

I personally love this dungeon, but the most frustrating issue is newbies not understanding the mechanics of the Planar Inhibitor fight. Or when there's someone else in the group insisting the tank holds until blue phase, and the group doesn't have the DPS or possibly even heals to do that lol.

Yes this! There's one thing with certain groups, and with other groups you have to follow the mechanic - but that's really everything in ESO.

coop500

Because it's annoying, hard and even more annoying when people don't think or respond when I ask if they know the drill or not.

Edit: Oddly enough, if I get it as a random I'll stick around, but I likely won't volenteer

WuffyCerulei

Once you know the mechanics, it isn't hard. It's usually people don't know mechanics and don't ask about em, stand in stupid too long, don't attack the boss but rather one add, don't do reasonable dps (standing 20 feet from the boss doing bow light attacks and snipe isn't good dps for WGT), or the tank doesn't listen to their group members and only aggros an add, constantly loses aggro, or doesn't care to face the boss away from the group. I can carry the other dps thru most vet dungeons, but WGT is too much of a hassle to do that in.

Bobby_V_Rockit

Planar Inhibitor. Thats why.

Inhuman003

It's not just White Gold Tower it's all the new DLC dungeons that's why when you see in zone chat when people say anybody for non-DLC pledge's now you know

Morgul667

Take too long to complete the new DLC dungeons

I dont do it on a daily basis

FloppyTouch

Morgul667 wrote: »

Take too long to complete the new DLC dungeons

I dont do it on a daily basis

This, I also only pug. My friends and most of my guilds are only active at night time I play very early mornings(not many people on)

I only have maybe an hour or 2 to play I'm not spending half my gamin time doing WGT. This is one of the most annoying dungeons to pug. It's takes way to long tons of wipes and people don't use mic(XB1) so it's very annoying trying to explain it.

When I do do this dungeons with my friends it's very fast and no wipes and we joke and play around like we are not even doing a DLC vet dungeon.

So it's more about time, I'll do daily non-dlc vet dungeons I can carry people threw the might take 20-30mins that still leaves me plenty of time for writs and some pvp.

ccfeeling

Time is money .
COS , ROM , WGT , rofl ...

THWIP71

Did you try leaving the area? Maybe it's you.

Olupajmibanan

Puging can bring some good groups as well.

Here is my story with PuGs:
I logged through DF to vet WGT as DD magicka DK. Didn't want the HM, just went for some divines SPC pieces.
Another DD was also a magicka DK and tank was a Warden. Healer was a magicka sorc with no Resto Staff nor Twilight Matriarch, just another DD in fact.
I really feared for our progress because the only heals I was getting were my own Power Lashes, Burning Embers and Warden's tree ultimate.
When we fighted the first boss, I got caught in the cage. I wasn't getting any heals so all I could do was spamming harness magicka. But I hadn't to do so for long because boss died surprisingly quickly.
The second boss, this was a real piece of cake because we burned Otho from 100 to 0 in matter of seconds. The same with Micella and Cordius.
When we got to planar inhibitor, I asked sorc to slot Twilight Matriarch to have at least some emergency heal. He refused, just called out the tactic: "tank hold still the boss, others do not kill portals nor take pinions, just burn the boss". For the sake of challenge, I accepted that. And guess what, our group dps was more than 115k. The boss really died before anything could happen.
I don't even have to explain how easy Molag Kena was with this dps. We did it on HM and I haven't even come for that.

Banana

I don't like hard. Makes me swear

Khenarthi

Unless it's both the day's pledge, and I really really absolutely need something from a DLC dungeon, I'm not going to volunteer for what is potentially more than one hour (or two) of pain. While I'm sorry you were unable to run the dungeon you wanted, I can relate to the people who did not volunteer to help.

Flameheart

WGT in a PUG in a few words ?

-> group disbanding at the Planar Inhibitor at the latest while ignore lists will be boosted with a lot of new names.

Cherryblossom

I have to agree, once you know the mechanics its a really easy dungeon.

But it would appear that most players are actually useless and have no idea what they are doing.
I've actually been running it on Normal for a few weeks to get Spell Power Cure pieces, had groups that couldn't get past the first boss on Normal, I don't die just watch the boss reset when I get put in prison because the fools with me just don't understand that standing in red circles means death, others don't know how to pick locks!

The problem with this game is that the normal content is far to easy, so most players don't ever get challenged until they go into one of the DLC dungeons. Bring back Doshia

IwakuraLain42

In general the same problem that all DLC dungeons have: they require active communication (or a group that know the dungeon inside-out).
For WGT in specific: Planar Inhibitor, one of the worst designed encounters in the whole game with mechanics that completely violate everything you learned before, are totally unexplained (pinion). All the nerfs in the world can't fix that mess. Then add Kena, one of the most stamina-unfriendly fights in the game, esp. after Morrowinds nerfs to regen.

Jade1986

SquareSausage wrote: »

Peekachu99 wrote: »

or tanks aren’t capable of solo holding it till she’s blue-flame.

Sorry, I'm vamp.

being a vamp is probably not the best choice for a tank....

I did wgt yesterday on normal ( i know not as hard, don't state the obvious ) as a lvl 13 tank with a lvl 12 dps, lvl 14 healer and lvl 22 dps. It was actually fun because everyone was understanding and willing to learn. If you go into a vwgt and happen not to have done it on normal ( because it is damn near impossible to get sometimes as a dps ) and even MENTION you havent done it, you get kicked, harassed, insulted, etc . Imo its not the people that havent done it, or who aren't cp 660 that are the problem, it is these super elitst people that expect EVRYONE to have 35k + dps and have a super optimized build and expect everyone to be capable of speed running everything. That is the cancer of this game. Elitism.

paulsimonps

laced wrote: »

SquareSausage wrote: »

Peekachu99 wrote: »

or tanks aren’t capable of solo holding it till she’s blue-flame.

Sorry, I'm vamp.

being a vamp is probably not the best choice for a tank....

I did wgt yesterday on normal ( i know not as hard, don't state the obvious ) as a lvl 13 tank with a lvl 12 dps, lvl 14 healer and lvl 22 dps. It was actually fun because everyone was understanding and willing to learn. If you go into a vwgt and happen not to have done it on normal ( because it is damn near impossible to get sometimes as a dps ) and even MENTION you havent done it, you get kicked, harassed, insulted, etc . Imo its not the people that havent done it, or who aren't cp 660 that are the problem, it is these super elitst people that expect EVRYONE to have 35k + dps and have a super optimized build and expect everyone to be capable of speed running everything. That is the cancer of this game. Elitism.

being vamp is probably the best choice for a tank....

The extra bit of damage a Tank takes from vampire fire vulnerability is next to nothing. Proper Tanks take very little damage, but to be able to do that strat properly you need to have high DPS in your group or else you are leaving the Tank out to dry(or get roasted more like). Some strong self heals on the tank and a watchful healer does not hurt though. A healer must be able to keep healing even if they have portals, and with the change that there will always be 2 people having portals that should be even easier to do. Sadly most healers fail in this.

Tasear

People don't read the patch notes. Remind them it was adjusted..aka nerfed recently. It's truly reasonable now.

IwakuraLain42

Tasear wrote: »

People don't read the patch notes. Remind them it was adjusted..aka nerfed recently. It's truly reasonable now.

All the nerfs won't help you if you don't understand or follow the pinion mechanics. That's what causes virtually all problems.

teladoy

Because is a waste of time if players dont have 500CP+

paulsimonps

teladoy wrote: »

Because is a waste of time if players dont have 500CP+

Wrong. Understanding of Mechanics>High CP. I will pick a smart player over a bad grinder everyday. There are plenty of High CP players that can't do vWGT cause they don't understand it.

LadyNalcarya

People just dont pug dlc dungeons. I wouldnt, at least (unless I already finished 2 other pledges with that group and it was above average). Average group wont have enough dps to ignore mechanics and there's too many snowflakes that get mad if you try to explain them how to kill Planar Inhibitor.

SquareSausage wrote: »

Peekachu99 wrote: »

or tanks aren’t capable of solo holding it till she’s blue-flame.

Sorry, I'm vamp.

Many tanks are vamps these days... The magicka regen is just too good to pass.
Its still possible to tank anything as a vamp (even vHoF).

Jeremy

BlanketFort wrote: »

Most runs usually go smoothly until a PUG reaches Planar Inhibitor, either normal (which is really sad) or veteran... things start going downhill.

-People not closing portals
-Tanks not being able to keep her still while on red pinions
-No switching of pinions during blue phase
-Tanks insisting on taking the boss for a merry trip around the whole arena the whole time, while being squishy and wasting everyone's resources and will argue you to death that this is the most efficient way to do it, despite the countless wipes.

Could be that they may not have known mechanics, but then again, no one usually says a peep when the question "anyone new to this dungeon?" is passed around. It's frustrating.

This is what makes that fight a pain in many of the pugs I do.

A lot of players don't understand just how much more difficult it makes a fight when everyone scatters and runs all over the place.

Jeremy

paulsimonps wrote: »

laced wrote: »

SquareSausage wrote: »

Peekachu99 wrote: »

or tanks aren’t capable of solo holding it till she’s blue-flame.

Sorry, I'm vamp.

being a vamp is probably not the best choice for a tank....

I did wgt yesterday on normal ( i know not as hard, don't state the obvious ) as a lvl 13 tank with a lvl 12 dps, lvl 14 healer and lvl 22 dps. It was actually fun because everyone was understanding and willing to learn. If you go into a vwgt and happen not to have done it on normal ( because it is damn near impossible to get sometimes as a dps ) and even MENTION you havent done it, you get kicked, harassed, insulted, etc . Imo its not the people that havent done it, or who aren't cp 660 that are the problem, it is these super elitst people that expect EVRYONE to have 35k + dps and have a super optimized build and expect everyone to be capable of speed running everything. That is the cancer of this game. Elitism.

being vamp is probably the best choice for a tank....

The extra bit of damage a Tank takes from vampire fire vulnerability is next to nothing. Proper Tanks take very little damage, but to be able to do that strat properly you need to have high DPS in your group or else you are leaving the Tank out to dry(or get roasted more like). Some strong self heals on the tank and a watchful healer does not hurt though. A healer must be able to keep healing even if they have portals, and with the change that there will always be 2 people having portals that should be even easier to do. Sadly most healers fail in this.

I have never seen one of these proper tanks that take very little damage, especially on that veteran planar inhibitor fight. On the contrary - they always seem to take massive damage and require almost a constant stream of healing.

As far as Vampire goes... I believe it is important to make a distinction between a player just starting off and then one later on in his or her career. Because unless you have a lot of CP or gear to mitigate the fire damage penalty it can have deadly consequences - especially in a place like White Gold Tower.

Kneighbors

Jeremy wrote: »

paulsimonps wrote: »

laced wrote: »

SquareSausage wrote: »

Peekachu99 wrote: »

or tanks aren’t capable of solo holding it till she’s blue-flame.

Sorry, I'm vamp.

being a vamp is probably not the best choice for a tank....

I did wgt yesterday on normal ( i know not as hard, don't state the obvious ) as a lvl 13 tank with a lvl 12 dps, lvl 14 healer and lvl 22 dps. It was actually fun because everyone was understanding and willing to learn. If you go into a vwgt and happen not to have done it on normal ( because it is damn near impossible to get sometimes as a dps ) and even MENTION you havent done it, you get kicked, harassed, insulted, etc . Imo its not the people that havent done it, or who aren't cp 660 that are the problem, it is these super elitst people that expect EVRYONE to have 35k + dps and have a super optimized build and expect everyone to be capable of speed running everything. That is the cancer of this game. Elitism.

being vamp is probably the best choice for a tank....

The extra bit of damage a Tank takes from vampire fire vulnerability is next to nothing. Proper Tanks take very little damage, but to be able to do that strat properly you need to have high DPS in your group or else you are leaving the Tank out to dry(or get roasted more like). Some strong self heals on the tank and a watchful healer does not hurt though. A healer must be able to keep healing even if they have portals, and with the change that there will always be 2 people having portals that should be even easier to do. Sadly most healers fail in this.

I have never seen one of these proper tanks that take very little damage, especially on that veteran planar inhibitor fight. On the contrary - they always seem to take massive damage and require almost a constant stream of healing.

As far as Vampire goes... I believe it is important to make a distinction between a player just starting off and then one later on in his or her career. Because unless you have a lot of CP or gear to mitigate the fire damage penalty it can have deadly consequences - especially in a place like White Gold Tower.

Look up the information about Heat Stroke debuff. When tank holds agro whole red phase the debuff ticks for 4k+ damage every second for 30 seconds while the blue phase lasts. It's possible to adjust your build for that specific boss by reallocating CP but it is simply not reasonable to do so. Tank sharpens out his build for hardest content, not for one specific boss who deals only magicka damage. That's why it is important to make exchange on the pinion. But if you go with maxed out team it is possible to kill the boss even before she is reaching blue phase. In this case there's no reason to exchange the pinion. The debuff becomes a problem after the red phase, not during.

ssewallb14_ESO

It's the portal mechanic during the Inhibitor fight, all four players need to be able to execute it properly. If just one player in the group isn't ready for vet content, the entire group fails, and the dungeon can't be completed. Mechanics like this put vWGT on most people's do not pug list.

LadyNalcarya

Kneighbors wrote: »

Jeremy wrote: »

paulsimonps wrote: »

laced wrote: »

SquareSausage wrote: »

Peekachu99 wrote: »

or tanks aren’t capable of solo holding it till she’s blue-flame.

Sorry, I'm vamp.

being a vamp is probably not the best choice for a tank....

I did wgt yesterday on normal ( i know not as hard, don't state the obvious ) as a lvl 13 tank with a lvl 12 dps, lvl 14 healer and lvl 22 dps. It was actually fun because everyone was understanding and willing to learn. If you go into a vwgt and happen not to have done it on normal ( because it is damn near impossible to get sometimes as a dps ) and even MENTION you havent done it, you get kicked, harassed, insulted, etc . Imo its not the people that havent done it, or who aren't cp 660 that are the problem, it is these super elitst people that expect EVRYONE to have 35k + dps and have a super optimized build and expect everyone to be capable of speed running everything. That is the cancer of this game. Elitism.

being vamp is probably the best choice for a tank....

The extra bit of damage a Tank takes from vampire fire vulnerability is next to nothing. Proper Tanks take very little damage, but to be able to do that strat properly you need to have high DPS in your group or else you are leaving the Tank out to dry(or get roasted more like). Some strong self heals on the tank and a watchful healer does not hurt though. A healer must be able to keep healing even if they have portals, and with the change that there will always be 2 people having portals that should be even easier to do. Sadly most healers fail in this.

I have never seen one of these proper tanks that take very little damage, especially on that veteran planar inhibitor fight. On the contrary - they always seem to take massive damage and require almost a constant stream of healing.

As far as Vampire goes... I believe it is important to make a distinction between a player just starting off and then one later on in his or her career. Because unless you have a lot of CP or gear to mitigate the fire damage penalty it can have deadly consequences - especially in a place like White Gold Tower.

Look up the information about Heat Stroke debuff. When tank holds agro whole red phase the debuff ticks for 4k+ damage every second for 30 seconds while the blue phase lasts. It's possible to adjust your build for that specific boss by reallocating CP but it is simply not reasonable to do so. Tank sharpens out his build for hardest content, not for one specific boss who deals only magicka damage. That's why it is important to make exchange on the pinion. But if you go with maxed out team it is possible to kill the boss even before she is reaching blue phase. In this case there's no reason to exchange the pinion. The debuff becomes a problem after the red phase, not during.

The strategy when tank is the only one holding boss' aggro only works for those "maxed teams" anyway. For this tactic, the group must have enough dps to kill the boss before she reaches blue flame phase, thats the point.
Trying to burn the boss when theres obviusly not enough dps only leads to being rekt by damage over time and ogrims. The problem is, many pug players overestimate their dps and refuse to do this fight in a safe way (closing portals and swapping pinion), trying to burn the boss and making it much more difficult than its supposed to be.

P.S. Fire damage is very common in all pve content, so yeah, a good tank should be able to deal with it. Not to mention that putting cps into elemental defender is important for any role, even if you're not a vampire.

KrazyKooter

People avoid Vet WGT mainly because:

• It requires a group with people who actually understand and can fulfill their roles. (And are Vet dungeon capable. Fungal Grotto doesn't count)
• A group with people who can actually communicate / coordinate with one another
• If you aren't after SPC or Kena then why put yourself through the hassle of going through there? Seriously.